NationStates Jolt Archive

Who cares, why are people such pussies to the Native Americans, sure it kind of sucks that they lost their land, but its not like this is different from any other war around that time, the Romans, Germans, so many different nations fought to gain land, and everybody is so sympothetic to the American Indians, IT WAS THEIR OWN FAULT FOR NOT FIGHTING HARD ENOUGH. I feel worse for nations that lost everything and lost the battle, but maybe if the Indians werent so busy fighting each other they could have worked together earlier and won.

That might have been a little extreme but I will listen to any comments.

Wow.

Trying to make amends is hardly being a pussy. In fact people are interested in the culture now.

"but its not like this is different from any other war around that time, the Romans, Germans, so many different nations fought to gain land, and everybody is so sympothetic to the American Indians."

Well the Romans and the Germans tried to include conquered lands into the fold. The Romans made treaties and tried to honor them most of the time.

We tried to exterminate them with various methods such as the military, bounties, small pox and taking the youth and "educating" them.

The US made a few hundread treaties with the natives and broke everyone of them.

"IT WAS THEIR OWN FAULT FOR NOT FIGHTING HARD ENOUGH."

Are you kidding? It was said that of the Sioux(I think it was them), they are the finest light horse calvery in the world.

If they didn't fight hard enough, then how did they become the boogie man of the times?

I am sure Custer will tell you they didn't fight hard enough as well! ;)

whats your point?

Who cares, why are people such pussies to the Native Americans, sure it kind of sucks that they lost their land, but its not like this is different from any other war around that time,
I think the term "massacre" would apply here. Have you seen the places modern day Native Americans live in now? They're pretty poor.

the Romans, Germans, so many different nations fought to gain land, and everybody is so sympothetic to the American Indians, IT WAS THEIR OWN FAULT FOR NOT FIGHTING HARD ENOUGH.The Native Americans were vastly outnumbered, outmanned, and lacked technological achievements. Anything that they could use to even out the fight they bought from Americans and Europeans.

I feel worse for nations that lost everything and lost the battle, but maybe if the Indians werent so busy fighting each other they could have worked together earlier and won..
Native Americans had been fighting for centuries. They always assumed that they were completely different from each other. Europe was still fighting with itself at the time, and it probably would if some superpower came in and tried to decimate it.

Amends should have been made long ago. Now it is just welfare. Live next to a Reservation for while, I grantee your opinion will change about Indians.

Amends should have been made long ago. Now it is just welfare. Live next to a Reservation for while, I grantee your opinion will change about Indians.

Been to a few myself. Some ok and a few crap holes.

I once found a code talker in one of the crap holes.

Just isn't right.

I do think war reparations should be given to the natives. We stole their land and killed many of them - the ones that weren't killed were forced into reservations (basically prisions without walls)!

I am part native - though you could never tell (look more Irish than anything). I don't want the government's money, but I think those who are direct decendents of the Tribes should be give aid (and more than welfare).

Speaking of welfare, it just puts people in bondage to a system.

Who cares, why are people such pussies to the Native Americans, sure it kind of sucks that they lost their land, but its not like this is different from any other war around that time, the Romans, Germans, so many different nations fought to gain land, and everybody is so sympothetic to the American Indians, IT WAS THEIR OWN FAULT FOR NOT FIGHTING HARD ENOUGH. I feel worse for nations that lost everything and lost the battle, but maybe if the Indians werent so busy fighting each other they could have worked together earlier and won.

That might have been a little extreme but I will listen to any comments.

shut up

The American empire is built on violence.

Been to a few myself. Some ok and a few crap holes.

I once found a code talker in one of the crap holes.

Just isn't right.
No, it isn't. But at the same time, some measure of self-reliance must come into play. I have seen Native Americans receive large payouts when they turn 18, and the vast majority that I have known spend it on cars, or their family siphons it off. This is money that could be used for school, or to start a business, or put into savings. Mostly it is blown in a year though.

The American empire is built on violence.
So was every country that ever existed.

Who cares, why are people such pussies to the Native Americans, sure it kind of sucks that they lost their land, but its not like this is different from any other war around that time, the Romans, Germans, so many different nations fought to gain land, and everybody is so sympothetic to the American Indians, IT WAS THEIR OWN FAULT FOR NOT FIGHTING HARD ENOUGH. I feel worse for nations that lost everything and lost the battle, but maybe if the Indians werent so busy fighting each other they could have worked together earlier and won.

That might have been a little extreme but I will listen to any comments.

The Injuns lost 'their' land.. now making it ours.
End of story, it's OURS now
We shouldn't give them a dime, let alone reservations..
If anything.. they owe us for the Jamestown Massacre... which started the hatred between the two civilizations..
But, I forgive... It happened over 200 years ago and it was something their grandparents grandparents had no part of...
I wish most people thought this way.. :rolleyes:

The American empire is built on violence.

I was just thinking that myself, my friend.

The Injuns lost 'their' land.. now making it ours.
End of story, it's OURS now
We shouldn't give them a dime, let alone reservations..
If anything.. they owe us for the Jamestown Massacre... which started the hatred between the two civilizations..
But, I forgive... It happened over 200 years ago and it was something their grandparents grandparents had no part of...
I wish most people thought this way.. :rolleyes:
Oh, Native Americans owe white people reparations now? :p

So was every country that ever existed.

not Buhtan

HA! got you in a corner there ay bitch!! (jk) :D

Oh, Native Americans owe white people reparations now? :p

Beh.. they started it... if you know history...

But I wouldn't expect decent tax-payers to bare the burden of what happened over 200 years ago...
The indians need to grow up and stop looking for freebies.

And besides.. does the fact that Indian reservations have the highest homeless rate in the country say anything about their 'ideological mindset'.. they've dug themselves in a hole.

i dont think y'all understand sqat about indians and sovereignty and treaty rights.

native americans dont have to BEG For anything anymore. they go to court and get what they are ENTITLED to under the laws of the united states. they take their casino money and BUY land back that was stolen from them. they take legal settlements and invest them into businesses that will help keep them going for years.

the federal government is being sued over money OWED to various tribes that has been mismanaged by the bureau of indian affairs. its only a matter of time before those suits are settled in the tribes favor

as indians get more money and more education there is going to be more and more of this sort of thing. they have legal recourse based on the treaties signed by the united states.

if you think a typical indian is the pathetic drunk on the street corner, you are in for a big surprise. education and prosperity is changing the relationship between indian nations and the US government.

And I am glad for it! This should have been done many years ago.

if you think a typical indian is the pathetic drunk on the street corner, you are in for a big surprise. education and prosperity is changing the relationship between indian nations and the US government.

Injun cheif no likum fire water?

So much for my plans about selling them rifles.

:p

Beh.. they started it... if you know history...

But I wouldn't expect decent tax-payers to bare the burden of what happened over 200 years ago...
The indians need to grow up and stop looking for freebies.

And besides.. does the fact that Indian reservations have the highest homeless rate in the country say anything about their 'ideological mindset'.. they've dug themselves in a hole.

hey now wait a sec, the natives were at the bottom of society long before the black slaves came right up until today, they have been kept down by whites and the government, they have been shoved onto infertile wastlands by the white people.. and they can't work themselves up the ladder atall cuz the USA's welfare system is a disgrace.. plus the societly is getting better umong the natives because of their own work.. you should have seen Flagstaff 20 years ago compared to today!

Beh.. they started it... if you know history...
History is written by the winners. You can't keep pretending the European settlers and conquerors were blameless.

But I wouldn't expect decent tax-payers to bare the burden of what happened over 200 years ago...
The indians need to grow up and stop looking for freebies.
This I agree with. Reparations of any form are stupid.

And besides.. does the fact that Indian reservations have the highest homeless rate in the country say anything about their 'ideological mindset'.. they've dug themselves in a hole.
Reservations are shitholes. This may be due in part to what lands the US government set aside (basically, the shitholes).

In any case, the idea of reservations should be appalling to anyone involved. Regardless of past history, all the various ethnic groups in America should have no problem living with each other...splintering off is a bad idea. I grew up in Hawaii, I know a bit about the sovereignty/separatist movement, and I'm always the one saying, "Why can't we all just live together?"

Reservations are shitholes. This may be due in part to what lands the US government set aside (basically, the shitholes).

There in that shape because the Native Americans refuse to do any upkeep. New housing is built for them, and they destroy it in a matter of months, and then complain because they have substandard housing.

not Buhtan

HA! got you in a corner there ay bitch!! (jk) :D
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Bhutan#Civil_wars

:headbang: I cant belive some of the things I just read. How can Americans hate themselves like that. I think that natives should recieve some kind of compenastion, not big mind you, but some. If you disagree, just think of it as what they wouldve got from the land we took from them if we had bought it. American Natives fought very hard, and were portrayed as savages for fighting back. The South American/Mexico native, didnt even have a chance to fight with the small pox killing them. The big deal to me is that when pilgrims first arrived, natives greeted em with corn and what not and everything was good aka Thanksgiving. Later post-revouloution from britain was when colonial people started really going after the natives, trading with them during the day only to return at night and raid the place, or giving them blankets with disease in them that the natives didnt have any immunity to.
the Romans, Germans, so many different nations fought to gain land
Romans thought themselves to be civilized, and they were for the time, but now after many things have gone down like renessance and what not that brought about new government policies and ideas we see that they were a civilization based on violence, take the gladiators for example. Their empire is no longer in power, so they cant pay to the countries they conquered.
German? are you referring to WWII germans that Forced millions of jews into concentration camps because they were "causing germany's problems"?
The American empire is built on violence.
So was every country that ever existed.
Not Canada, they had a little fighting when they were first formed along the east coast, but that was mainly between french and britain troops trying to maintain a hold for themselves. When westward expansion came about in canada the natives were not forced out/killed for there land, they either sold it, or moved farther west. there was virtually no native blood shed in canada compared to american native. granted there were less natives in canada due to the colder climate, but americans could have done a better job than what they did.

Personally Id love to live on an open range eating what I found and hunting and what not, but sadly there arnt any places like this today. I wish I was born a long time ago, so that there were still unexplored places on earth that I could go exploring.