NationStates Jolt Archive

http://www.zetatalk.com/poleshft/p60.htm

what's the deal with these people?

The most dramatic sign will be a slowing rotation. Where at the present time, this rate is enough to cause an occasional fraction of a second, per year, of adjustment to the world clock, this will soon change. This increasing slowdown will get diminishing press coverage, as clocks are quietly adjusted behind the scenes and the public allowed to believe their clocks must be running fast. But there will be a point in time, a few days ahead of when rotation stops, when this will get blatantly obvious. When one wakes up in the morning, finding it to be dark outside rather than a breaking dawn, yet the clocks in the house and the entire neighborhood confirm that it is indeed the morning hour - this is a countdown sign. Rotation will completely stop in a day or so, with such a dawn followed by an evening where the Sun seems reluctant to set, setting hours later than usual, and then rotation stops completely

the earth has been slowing its rotation since the moon was formed. there used to be 496 days in a year as evidenced by ancient coral growths. the tidal lock won't occur for a couple million years and the days are getting like 2 seconds longer every thousand years or something like that. by the time the earth settles into tidal lock, the sun will be ready to swallow it and the moon... this isn't going to happen for a long time and furthremore, the rotation is not going to stop, barring some huge impact which would liquify the earth's surface and even then we'd probably only end up with a slow rotation at most, like venus, the tidal lock will give us days that are 52 current days long (if i remember correctly)

so these guys think they're foretelling the demise of the earth.

http://www.zetatalk.com/poleshft/p60.htm

what's the deal with these people?



the earth has been slowing its rotation since the moon was formed. there used to be 496 days in a year as evidenced by ancient coral growths. the tidal lock won't occur for a couple million years and the days are getting like 2 seconds longer every thousand years or something like that. by the time the earth settles into tidal lock, the sun will be ready to swallow it and the moon... this isn't going to happen for a long time and furthremore, the rotation is not going to stop, barring some huge impact which would liquify the earth's surface and even then we'd probably only end up with a slow rotation at most, like venus, the tidal lock will give us days that are 52 current days long (if i remember correctly)

so these guys think they're foretelling the demise of the earth.

I understand that the moon is slowly moving away from Earth. Not only will it affect the tides, but the moon holds the way our Earth is tilted. Without it our planet will spin wildly and cause VERY cold and VERY hot weather. We'll all be long dead though. HA!

I remember reading in some scientific journal somewhere or other that it's been calculated the Earth would stop rotating (and lose gravitational control of the moon, presumably to the Sun) in a few hundred billion years.

Fortunately the Sun will have turned into a Red Giant by then and toasted the Earth to a crisp anyway, so it won't much matter.

I remember reading in some scientific journal somewhere or other that it's been calculated the Earth would stop rotating (and lose gravitational control of the moon, presumably to the Sun) in a few hundred billion years.
that's not going to happen. which journal was that?
the most i've heard about slowed rotation is tidal lock, the earth will be rotating at 52 times longer... but it'll still spin and the moon will still be there.

Fortunately the Sun will have turned into a Red Giant by then and toasted the Earth to a crisp anyway, so it won't much matter.
pretty much.

but the moon holds the way our Earth is tilted. Without it our planet will spin wildly and cause VERY cold and VERY hot weather.

No. Just NO.

that's not going to happen. which journal was that?
the most i've heard about slowed rotation is tidal lock, the earth will be rotating at 52 times longer... but it'll still spin and the moon will still be there.


It was very half-remembered, so you're probably right with your statement there.

that's not going to happen. which journal was that?
the most i've heard about slowed rotation is tidal lock, the earth will be rotating at 52 times longer... but it'll still spin and the moon will still be there.




Well, it'll probably stop rotating in a couple billion years because the sun will swallow it up. That'll interrupt a planet's rotation pretty nicely.

There is a theory that claims the Earth might move of it's axis and change poles one day.

Well, it'll probably stop rotating in a couple billion years because the sun will swallow it up. That'll interrupt a planet's rotation pretty nicely.
yeah, but then there's no planet, so it doesn't really matter if it's rotating.

yeah, but then there's no planet, so it doesn't really matter if it's rotating.

Right, so technically it'll stop rotating.

There is a theory that claims the Earth might move of it's axis and change poles one day.
the earth has changed poles a number of times in its existence, it'll happen again.

and the earth does wobble on its axis. it used to be that there was another star that was the north star though its name escapes me.

Right, so technically it'll stop rotating.
well, it'll cease to exist. so yeah, it won't be rotating.

No. Just NO.
actually they're right. the earth's tilt only goes from 21-24 degrees as compared to say mars which has a 30 degree difference. the moon does have a stabilizing effect on the angle the rotation axis is at due to its size compared to the earth.

i woudl guess that it would have less of an effect as the moon moves further away (which it's doing) but i'm not sure how much of an effect it would have.

I remember reading in some scientific journal somewhere or other that it's been calculated the Earth would stop rotating (and lose gravitational control of the moon, presumably to the Sun) in a few hundred billion years.

Fortunately the Sun will have turned into a Red Giant by then and toasted the Earth to a crisp anyway, so it won't much matter.
And considering that the heat death of the universe is in about 20 billion years, it really won't matter. Things tend not to matter when the universe no longer exists.

And considering that the heat death of the universe is in about 20 billion years, it really won't matter. Things tend not to matter when the universe no longer exists.
i've never heard that one...

where'd you hear the universe is done for in 20 billion years? that almost makes it middle aged.

Ah, we'll all be long gone after the Giant Space Aardvark eats Earth in 20,000 years.

the earth has changed poles a number of times in its existence, it'll happen again.

and the earth does wobble on its axis. it used to be that there was another star that was the north star though its name escapes me.

I'm not too clear, but wasn't Ursa Major the North Star once, but now it's Polaris? Or maybe it's the other way around.

Like I said, I'm not too clear.

I don't think the Earth can spontaneously cease rotating, though, unless there's some other external force at play. I took a look through their stuff, and it seems they're basing their writing at least in part on Velikovsky. Velikovsky had some whiz-bangers of ideas, but he was on about things like Venus having been born within recorded human history - although he was sure it was a captured comet, and asserting that the effect of these celestial happenings on Earth was memorable enough that many cultures wrote it all down, and managed to work these events into popular mythology.

Neat stuff, but you've got to take it with more than one grain of salt. I think the best thing that Velikovsky did was to bring new life to the idea that stellar evolution need not follow the gradualist model - a disk of gases swirls and coalesces into a solar system, just add time and hey! presto - instead, he advanced the idea that the solar system could have been formed in fits and spurts of violent planetary birth.

I think the danger lies in assuming he was totally right.

Well, as someone who's studied physics for quite a while, and specialized in astrophysics, yeah, the earth does wobble, but /extremely/ slowly. I'm not going to look up or work out the exact numbers right now, but it was about 4000 years ago that we had a different north star (by about 5º). We're slowing down in rotation due partially to drag and partially to tidal lock. Eventually (in a few billion years) we might end up with significantly longer days due to tidal lock, but we'll keep slowing down from drag (drag is way oversimplifying, but screw it, it's late), but it will be almost imperceptable as the moon will actually be helping keep us at a fairly stable rotation rate by that time.

In either case, as was noted, it's really a moot point as there'll be no discernable difference (maybe a few more minutes a day? Interesting problem to give to a senior physics class probably ... hahaha!) by the time the earth is swallowed or burnt by the sun going red-giant when it uses all the nuclear material up.

i've never heard that one...

where'd you hear the universe is done for in 20 billion years? that almost makes it middle aged.
A newpaper called the Science Times, or something like that. It traced out the future of the universe. I might be a bit low with 20 billion years, but I'm pretty sure that's what the article said.

So it's not within our lifetime right?

Bah. nothing to worry about! Let the future worry over themselves! :D

Yes, the earth changes its axis very often (geologically) aproximatly every 1000 years it happens. It happened last year, got very little media coverage. All that happened was electric appliances faltered for a few moments, and magnets switched polarity:

North on a magnet became south and vice versa. In short, the earth switchin its axis is not a major event.

It's more likely that the earth's magnetic polarity will reverse - it's happened several times before and it's overdue - and the North Pole will become the South Pole - and all the penguins will have to move. :D

and the polar bears...

Yes, the earth changes its axis very often (geologically) aproximatly every 1000 years it happens. It happened last year, got very little media coverage. All that happened was electric appliances faltered for a few moments, and magnets switched polarity:

North on a magnet became south and vice versa. In short, the earth switchin its axis is not a major event.

This happened last year, eh? All the magnets on earth switched polarity? How about electromagnets? They create their own north and south magnetic poles based on electric field flow. Did the electric field suddenly switch the direction it moves at the same time all the magnets on earth apparently did? Because my electric compass and my magnetic compass still point the same direction.

The earth didn't switch poles last year, and even if it did, it would be the earth itself that switches poles, not ever piece of iron and magnetic material /on/ the earth ... the earth's magnetic field isn't strong enough to change the polarity of natural magnets. A little geology: natural magnets are formed by layering of liquid polar materials, which then solidify. The magnetic field of the earth is strong enough to affect the direction a magnetic particle in a liquid will point (magnetize a needle and float it on a leaf in water ... it'll point north / south). When they solidify, you'd have to reliquify every natural magnet on earth to allow enough of an effect to switch poles in these materials, and somehow, I don't recall all the iron and natural magnets turning to liquid last year.

You act like this switching polarity thing is huge. It's really not. Animals migrating, electromagnits and compasses screwing up. What happens with the magnets is a complete switch of sorts that ends up with the same stuff going on as before. You compass may have gone crazy for a few minutes, but after that, it will still point north.

You act like this switching polarity thing is huge. It's really not. Animals migrating, electromagnits and compasses screwing up. What happens with the magnets is a complete switch of sorts that ends up with the same stuff going on as before. You compass may have gone crazy for a few minutes, but after that, it will still point north.

You're talking about the poles switching instantly, which is impossible, that's what I'm saying. The poles may switch and /are/ drifting, but it's and /extremely/ slow process (the pole is moving at 10 miles per year and might switch completely in a couple thousand years). This has been going on for a long, long time.

First, how is it impossible? Let me try to explain again. You seem to think that it's a "complete switch of sorts that ends up with the same stuff going on as before." In order for that to happen, you have to reverse the polarization of magnetic particles in every magnetic material on earth! You /also/ have to manage to reverse electric field flow so that electromagnets now create a "north" in the opposite direction. You're talking about restructuring the universe there. Lastly, for the magnetic poles to switch direction, under current understanding, the molten material in the core would simply have to stop spinning in its current direction and completely reverse its rotation. Now, you may love the movie CORE, but it's science fiction at its worst ... utterly impossible.

http://www.antarcticconnection.com/antarctic/news/2002/041802mag_flip.shtml
http://www.rense.com/general26/poles.htm

It didn't get much media attention because it didn't happen.

the earth has changed poles a number of times in its existence, it'll happen again.

and the earth does wobble on its axis. it used to be that there was another star that was the north star though its name escapes me.
i believe in the book contact it was said vayga(sp)

Now, you may love the movie CORE, but it's science fiction at its worst ... utterly impossible.
I've never seen, nor heard of the movie CORE.

I've never seen, nor heard of the movie CORE.

Good. It was a terrible movie suggesting nearly what you are, except in this case, human scientific research managed to stop the core of the earth from spinning at all, and armageddon ensues. They had to tunnel to the core to restart it. Bleh. Sorry, it was called "The Core" I believe, not just CORE.

"The Core" I believe, not just CORE.
Oh! That Movie! Just kidding. Still haven't heard of it or seen it.

Oh! That Movie! Just kidding. Still haven't heard of it or seen it.

Ok. That's great that you haven't seen the movie, how about getting back to the discussion? Do you have anything other than that movie that backs up the reversal of the poles happening last year or backing up that it wouldn't be a big deal and would manage to switch all the natural and electro magnets at the same time? I only brought up the movie because it was the only thing published recently that I could think of that shared your views.

Well, my Mom works at NASA and my Dad works at NOAA.

It's more likely that the earth's magnetic polarity will reverse - it's happened several times before and it's overdue - and the North Pole will become the South Pole - and all the penguins will have to move. :D
I now have this image in my mind of a long line of fat little penguins waddling past my front door heading north (south?)ward and a line of polar bears heading the opposite direction. I guess then I'll know for sure that the polarities have switched.

Troubled Times believes that a world-wide cataclysm, of massive proportions, will strike the Earth in 2003 or shortly thereafter.

Well, it's almost 2005 now.

Starting in 1997 the earth's warming trend, steming from her core, will be noticed and is a general topic of conversation. This is when you should prepare for self sufficiency in a safe location.

Starting in 2000, three years prior to the cataclysms, a period of crop shortages will be so severe that alternative food production needs to be begun and practiced in earnest. This is when you should become practiced at self sufficiency.

Sometime after May 15, 2003, the earth's rotation will slow within days and stop for several days just prior to the pole shift. This is when you and your loved ones should be situated at your safe location.


I think this must be an old website.

Well, my Mom works at NASA and my Dad works at NOAA.

Well, if they're working as scientists and not as janitors, then go ask them if the magnetic poles are going to reverse themselves instantly. I printed this thread because I thought I'd show my mentor (remember, I'm going for my PhD in physics) at university the idea of having our first year physics students figure out how long a pole reversal would take ... to put it politely, he laughed at the idea of the north and south poles switching instantly and no one noticing.

Well, if they're working as scientists and not as janitors, then go ask them if the magnetic poles are going to reverse themselves instantly. I printed this thread because I thought I'd show my mentor (remember, I'm going for my PhD in physics) at university the idea of having our first year physics students figure out how long a pole reversal would take ... to put it politely, he laughed at the idea of the north and south poles switching instantly and no one noticing.
My Mom helps program satellites and my Dad gathers the information they send back and graphs it with other data, I'll call them tomorrow and ask them about the poles.

My Mom helps program satellites and my Dad gathers the information they send back and graphs it with other data, I'll call them tomorrow and ask them about the poles.

Better yet, since it sounds like your folks are computer scientists or electrical engineers of one type or another and not physicists, why don't you just post some proofs for what you've been told? (that would be a lot better than "my folks said so"). Something like those articles I linked for you.