NationStates Jolt Archive

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?

That's funny.

I've never been told I'm going there so bluntly, but the recomondation has been made.

I've already condemmed myself to hell. Several times. Sort of to prep me up so I'm not surprised.

what? did you miss it in the commandments, its right next you not covetting the neighbors ass.... which im SURE you dont do.. thou shalt not believe in evolution.

its your own freaking fault, dont blame the messenger

let's put it this way: I'm a leader in Christian youthmovement, but every single leader in that movement would go to hell for not believing in god.

I've been told I'm going to hell plenty of times. Don't let it get you down.

We are all going to hell...

takes long drag from ciggerette...

I wouldn't worry too much, she doesn't get to decide that... besides, she might be right there next to you whereever you end up (now that could mean that then it is really hellish)

Let's take an objective look at the situation: if everyone but the religious freaks is going to hell, it can't really be all that bad, can it?

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?
I'm Gay. We can go to hell together :)

because I believe in evolution.
Let me join you there, then

I'm Gay. We can go to hell together :)

Thats funny.
:D

Let's take an objective look at the situation: if everyone but the religious freaks is going to hell, it can't really be all that bad, can it?


Another time today I was told by some kid that I was going to "The bad part of hell" for a comment I made about someone.

Let's take an objective look at the situation: if everyone but the religious freaks is going to hell, it can't really be all that bad, can it?

Ah, but each group of "religious freaks" are going to hell according to different groups of "religious freaks"

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?
Heck, they are sending me the brochures already!
Anyway, if she is sure you are going to hell, then so is she. Because only God is supposed to know that, and that would mean she is comparing herself to God. And that's no little sin like believing in evolution, that's pride, a deadly sin.

I think if anyone says that you're going to hell, an appropriate reply is: "So I'm never going to see people like you again for the rest of time, and that's a bad thing?"

I'm not worried -- if I go, I'll know so many of the people there! If I spend eternity in the non-smoking section, I may not know many people, and those who recognize me will wonder why I'm there!

Without faith and salvation, everybody's headed to hell-- even the little religious girl. With it, everybody's fine. I wouldn't worry too hard about what she says.

Let's take an objective look at the situation: if everyone but the religious freaks is going to hell, it can't really be all that bad, can it?
That made my day. :p

In fact, I think I'd much rather spend the afterlife with you fine people rather than the bible-thumpers. :D

Without faith and salvation, everybody's headed to hell-- even the little religious girl. With it, everybody's fine. I wouldn't worry too hard about what she says.

She's already said she wants all the gays to be lined up and shot. and that 20% of the worlds population needs to be killed.

No worries, i get it all the time :D.

Hell can't be that bad if were all going there, can it ?

Don't worry, Baptist and Prostant people tell me I'm going to Hell just because I'm Catholic.

I got told I was going to burn in hell by someone on these forums. I think that's what they said, anyway... the posts didn't really make sense. I think the guy was too busy touch-typing with one hand whilst thumbing through his Bible to check what his opinions were. (Oooooh, JERRY! JERRY! JERRY! :D)

My sister was once told, when she was a child, that she wasn't a real person because she hadn't been christened/conformed, which really upset her. So my Dad took her to see all the churches for the different christian sects in our local area and then asked her if she wanted to be a christian. She promptly said that she didn't.

She's already said she wants all the gays to be lined up and shot. and that 20% of the worlds population needs to be killed.
well with a christian attitude like THAT she is sure to get into heaven!

My sister was once told, when she was a child, that she wasn't a real person because she hadn't been christened/conformed, which really upset her. So my Dad took her to see all the churches for the different christian sects in our local area and then asked her if she wanted to be a christian. She promptly said that she didn't.

Thats what all parents should do.

I believe in evolution as well. I have also come up with several arguements (good ones) that can also help you out wit them.

"If we came from two people with absolutely no changes at all (evolution is basically adapting to your surroundings) how are there different races? Also, wouldn't we have some universal language?"

And...

"Do you get used to cold or warm air? After a while, you can get used to different tempratures, and this is adapting to our environment. Short term evolution to be precise."

And here is one more fun thing...

"You say I will go to hell, so when your judgement condemns you too, I will see you there."

well with a christian attitude like THAT she is sure to get into heaven!


"But thats what they bible says."

(Thats an actual quote about something else regarding politics)

Trying to understand God is like a single celled organism trying to understand anything beyond eating. All you can do is try your best in whatever way you see fit to handle your own spiritual life, be it through an established faith or otherwise. Everybody else can do as they want but in the end you know what you really believe.

I've been condemned to hell many times, it's quite exciting really. Apart from the fact I've never been baptised, I lived under a roof that sheltered the sinful bliss of my mother and her partners, am an atheist and even dared to call the Bible's stories myths...

Though surely it's a dream come true, being a pyromaniac and all :D

Another thing that I hate about Christianity is that no matter what you do as long as you do not believe in god, you go to hell. Even if you save 4,000,000 human lives during a war, you still go to hell because of one simple belief.

And gays will go to hell to, because of a hormonal imbalance. Also Bisexauls.

It is kind of depresingly retarded when you think about it.

Any way, the christians should be mad at themselves and the catholics. The catholics eat "the flesh of Christ: and drink the "Blood of Christ" and worship the thing he died upon... seems kind of evil to me :rolleyes:

You're saved by faith, and not by works. So you can be gay and go to Heaven, you can be Catholic and go to Heaven (I'm Baptist), you can believe in evolution and go to Heaven. I think the girl is either stupid or very, very confused.

You're saved by faith, and not by works. So you can be gay and go to Heaven, you can be Catholic and go to Heaven (I'm Baptist), you can believe in evolution and go to Heaven. I think the girl is either stupid or very, very confused.

Thank you for your clarification, I was hoping a christian would come here.

I'm a heathen pagan, so I guess I'll be in Hell with Kahta, Letila, Gigatron, et al ... hey ... I've been in worse company.

Let's start a club.

I was condemned once...and that I was going to burn with the rest of the unbelievers in hell. Hey, all you can eat barbeque!

Perfect response:

"Well, if Heaven's going to be full of homophobes, bigots, and fundamentalist kill-joys such as yourself, I'm glad I'm going to Hell."

i usually say im gonig to hell everytime i laugh at something making fun of jesus or christianity

needless to say i say it enough

I don't think hell would be that bad... I mean no religious freaks for one... and probably filled with sin and debauchery. And if it is the fire and brimstone hell preached by some, well that might still be good. I figure there would at least be variety in the torture.

In my opinion heaven would be boring and dull...

Oh and here's an interesting argument I heard for evolution.

How many people as of late (considering you're younger) do you know that have had to get their wisdom teeth removed? I heard that our bodies are beginning to phase out the teeth based on our diets, which consist of softer, processed food and what have you. Therefore in time wisdom teeth may just be a thing of the past.

Evolution in action!

-Note: Terribly sorry I'm not the best with words... hope it makes sense at least. If not, research it yourself...

id personally rather be a ghost or sumtin cuz itd be more fun

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?

Don't worry, I'll save you a seat.

I don't think hell would be that bad... I mean no religious freaks for one... and probably filled with sin and debauchery. And if it is the fire and brimstone hell preached by some, well that might still be good. I figure there would at least be variety in the torture.

In my opinion heaven would be boring and dull...

Oh and here's an interesting argument I heard for evolution.

How many people as of late (considering you're younger) do you know that have had to get their wisdom teeth removed? I heard that our bodies are beginning to phase out the teeth based on our diets, which consist of softer, processed food and what have you. Therefore in time wisdom teeth may just be a thing of the past.

Evolution in action!

-Note: Terribly sorry I'm not the best with words... hope it makes sense at least. If not, research it yourself...
Hell is a lake of fire, that's it. You burn in darkness forever and ever, surrounded by screams of people you can't see.

And wisdom teeth being phased out is microevolution, everyone believes in that.

I don't think hell would be that bad... I mean no religious freaks for one

Pfft! I bet even in Hell, Jehovah's Witlesses would still bring the Watchtower to your door.

Any way, the christians should be mad at themselves and the catholics. The catholics eat "the flesh of Christ: and drink the "Blood of Christ" and worship the thing he died upon... seems kind of evil to me :rolleyes:
Distinctly satanic if you ask me.

Any way, the christians should be mad at themselves and the catholics. The catholics eat "the flesh of Christ: and drink the "Blood of Christ" and worship the thing he died upon... seems kind of evil to me :rolleyes:

For the love of.... Have you EVER been to Mass? They explain the whole Eating the Flesh of Christ (unleaven bread) and the Blood of Christ (Wine) Every Sunday (Saturday for me) at Mass. Try reaserching these religions before you make bullshit statement. As for the cross, same response, do some fuckin reaserch.

Well not believing in a heaven or hell, I won't be going there, religious types who preach to others about sins and going to hell cause they have sex and drink and all that other bullshit need to learn how to mind their own business.

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?

Liberals tell me all the time. :(

i get condemned to hell on at least a weekly basis. no big deal.

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?
I'm sorry but your not fit for hell. Please take my dearest apologizes,
Bastardsword.

For the love of.... Have you EVER been to Mass? They explain the whole Eating the Flesh of Christ (unleaven bread) and the Blood of Christ (Wine) Every Sunday (Saturday for me) at Mass. Try reaserching these religions before you make bullshit statement. As for the cross, same response, do some fuckin reaserch.
I was raised Catholic and went to Catholic mass weekly until I moved out.

I still think the whole transfiguration thing is unnecesarily creepy. And don't Protestants like crosses too?

Anyhow, I've since moved on to cheerful atheism. Can't wait to meet you excellent people in Hell. :D

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?
When I was 9 years old my teacher, a nun, told me I was going to hell. I was very upset at first (just the year before I wanted to be the first American pope) then my parents were outraged but my gramps nailed it for me when he said casually, "I don't much care if I go to heaven or hell. I have friends in both places."

Of course this religious zealot (aka Nut Job) will be judged by the judgement wherewith she has judged others. I know because her bible says so. It also says she is a child of Satan (no offense Big Jim, etal.) since she has attempted to usurp God's place. Her bible tells her, "Judgement is mine saith the lord, I will repay."

I suggest the next time some lameass wannabe self appointed saint throws that crap your way give them a gramps followed by a dose of their own dogma. Then throw in a, "Get thee behind me Satan." and walk away with a smile on your face.

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?

i have been told to go to hell because:
-i'm bisexual
-i'm a female who does not intend to have children (and apparently that's a hell-worthy offense...?)
-i'm not a Christian
-i've done drugs and consumed alcohol
-i have had sex out of wedlock

those are the only reasons that i have specifically been given by people who have told me i will be going to hell. all i can say is that if heaven is full of straight, celebate, sober, Christian people with children then it is a damn good idea for them to keep me out of that place...i would WRECK the joint.

Let's take an objective look at the situation: if everyone but the religious freaks is going to hell, it can't really be all that bad, can it?
He deeply sniffs, wipes a tear from the corner of his eye then says,"That was beautiful man! Ya gave me new hope!

i have been told to go to hell because:
-i'm bisexual
-i'm a female who does not intend to have children (and apparently that's a hell-worthy offense...?)
-i'm not a Christian
-i've done drugs and consumed alcohol
-i have had sex out of wedlock

those are the only reasons that i have specifically been given by people who have told me i will be going to hell. all i can say is that if heaven is full of straight, celebate, sober, Christian people with children then it is a damn good idea for them to keep me out of that place...i would WRECK the joint.
I think it can basically be summed up: Hell is more fun than Heaven. :p

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?

No one deserves to be told that they're going to New Jersey for believing in evolution. No one.

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?

"I'd rather laugh with the sinners than cry with the saints. The sinners have much more fun." -Billy Joel 'Only The Good Die Young'

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?

Nah, I hold conversations with God sometimes via my thoughts. He says you are headed for purgatory for your sins. Relax, you got it made, provided you can wait 1000 years to be purged of your sins. By the way, he says he really created life via Intelligent Design, and that Evolution is a false religion created by Darwin after using too many illegal drugs. He says, you, like many others, were mislead and cannot be held accountable to be sent to Hell for that. Oh, by the way, he says to quit playing with yourself or you'll go blind, and that if you do, the sores will heal up by themselves in a few months and go away. :rolleyes:

I believe in evolution as well. I have also come up with several arguements (good ones) that can also help you out wit them.

"If we came from two people with absolutely no changes at all (evolution is basically adapting to your surroundings) how are there different races? Also, wouldn't we have some universal language?"

And...

"Do you get used to cold or warm air? After a while, you can get used to different tempratures, and this is adapting to our environment. Short term evolution to be precise."

And here is one more fun thing...

"You say I will go to hell, so when your judgement condemns you too, I will see you there."


I'll add, "They will yak up the Tower of Babel. Remind them that was before Noah so if we all later desended from Noah & Co. they need to find a new cause because they were all of the same language and pigmentation.

now its getting out of hand...ahhhhhhhhh! enemies!!duck!! :sniper: :mp5: :gundge: ahhhhhhhhhhh :eek:

You're saved by faith, and not by works. So you can be gay and go to Heaven, you can be Catholic and go to Heaven (I'm Baptist), you can believe in evolution and go to Heaven. I think the girl is either stupid or very, very confused.
". . . and that not of yourself, lest any man boast. It is the gift of God." Kinda like a cosmic lottery, eh?

No one deserves to be told that they're going to New Jersey for believing in evolution. No one.
Wouldn't that be funny if we were all actually living in Hell right now, we just didn't know it? :p

:headbang: :mp5: get me out!

:eek: :gundge: feed me

:fluffle: :sniper: u idiot

:D :mp5: i'll smash ur teeth

:cool: :sniper: let me smash those glasses

Pfft! I bet even in Hell, Jehovah's Witlesses would still bring the Watchtower to your door.
LMAO! Given they believe that only 144,000 will make the cut and there have been millions of them I'd have to say you are probably right. It would be your hell to have them come to your door and their to have to deal with you screaming curses at them.

sorry - too much Rod Serling as a child.

If she says ur goin 2 hell duznt that sound kinda mean? lyk if she's christian (lyk me) then surely she learnt that god luvs evry1 and so u shud be nice 2 other ppl (luv ur neighbour as urself) so mayb u shud be askin her whether she actually believes...

For the love of.... Have you EVER been to Mass? They explain the whole Eating the Flesh of Christ (unleaven bread) and the Blood of Christ (Wine) Every Sunday (Saturday for me) at Mass. Try reaserching these religions before you make bullshit statement. As for the cross, same response, do some fuckin reaserch.
Had the indoctrination, got the T shirt, burned it, then pissed on it.

But that's just me.

Wouldn't that be funny if we were all actually living in Hell right now, we just didn't know it? :p
Can't be so. I live east of the Hudson.

Another time today I was told by some kid that I was going to "The bad part of hell" for a comment I made about someone.

That's the part without the whips and demonesses. :D

im saved, a Baptist, NOT A BIBLE THUMPER, and have been told im going to hell cause i belive in some of the facts that were used to wright "the da vinci code" by dan brown like the fact that in da vinci's "last supper" painting there are soposed to be 12 decipals and Christ and one cup AKA the holy grail, but there are 11 decipals, Christ, and one woman(at the right hand of christ(look at the shape that thay make.....its an "M" and that soposidly stands for mary magdalen(who is said to be his wife(long story just read the book above)))), and twelve cups(hard to see) hears a picture

http://images.fbrtech.com/dnew/Italy2001/Postcards/Milan1.jpg

what is your thalts and (most likely) shit load of questions also can you find the dager in the picture (yes there is one) BTW im glad to find a pagen on N.S. also di vinci was a pagen and leader of the "priory of sion"

Evolution..hell why not? :D

Hopefully by the time i get to hell i have enough power to overthrow Satan and become king of all evil.

Mwahahahaha!

What a dumbass. I wouldn't be offended by anyone that idiotic. It appears there are very few Christians or any other religious group who have tolerance and don't go about spreading bs. I believe in evolution and God. God created the creatures and they evolved. It doesn't go against the bible and it keeps scientists happy.

Okay I have to say this, because I live in Southern Virginia, and there are Bible-beaters EVERYWHERE (I live ten minutes away from Pat Robertson)

First off, I have been told I'm going to hell on two different occasions. The first one was from a friend of mine who was upset that I didn't believe in Christianity anymore. The second one was a really fat bitch at a movie theater who overheard me talking to a friend about gay marriage (according to her, I'm also gay, hedonistic, perverted, and unworthy of Jesus's love.)

Anyway, these people who condemn others are NOT CHRISTIANS. They are hard-hearted pagans who cannot realize that their Savior preached TOLERANCE with sinners and other people. If any of you are confronted by these kind of people, remind yourself that these are the kind of people that start genocides, mass slavery, and religious war, all in the name of a Holy God from above, who says Thou Shalt Not Kill but for some reason, likes it when we kill mass amounts of people. Now, just because you're religious doesn't mean you're bad. Some of my closest friends are devout Catholics. If you use it as a reason to hate other people and make yourself holier-than-thou, you are just as bad as the shitheads who start jihads or Crusades. So will you all join me in giving these assholes the bird?

I declare Jihad on him :mp5:

Ok, back to the point, If you are going to hell, so are the people that condemn you. So what? There are probably more nice people in hell then in heaven, just because they did not believe in god. If there is a hell...

I am irritated by the people who start "Holy War" and what not just because of different beliefs. Is it that hard to accept them for who they are?

:) :mp5:
The attacker represents the person who said you are going to hell, and the smiley represents you. Which one goes to hell?

I've been told I'm going to hell on a number of different occasions. I don't personally believe in hell (or heaven, for that matter), so it has no effect upon me.

Best argument I've ever seen against the literal interpretations of heaven and hell, right here...
Calvin: Do you think tigers go to the same heaven that people go to? I mean, in heaven, everyone is supposed to be HAPPY, right? But people wouldn't be happy if they were always in danger of being eaten by tigers!

Calvin: On the other hand, heaven wouldn't be very nice WITHOUT tigers, either. I wouldn't be happy if there weren't any tigers. I'd miss them. Maybe tigers just don't eat people in heaven.

Hobbes: But then WE wouldn't be happy.

In any case, I'm a musician, so it's pretty much a given that I'm going to hell.

I would just like to add one thing, though...I find myself rather disgusted with those who call themselves Christians, and believe, out of nothing but fear of hell. The religion is supposed to be about reciprocal love between one and their creator, not an authoritarian servitude based on fear. These, most commonly, are the people who will go around condemning people.

And anyway, as someone said earlier, even the religious freaks are told they're going to hell by other religious freaks. If what other people thought had any bearing on it whatsoever, nobody would ever go anywhere but hell.

id personally rather be a ghost or sumtin cuz itd be more fun

What a perfect statement
you'd get to terrorize everyone who has made your life miserable

Religeon had it's time, but it's not now. what we need now, is to understand our surroundings better, if not for the catholic church limiting scientific research, we could be far more advanced in this current time

Hell is where all the cool people go.

I'd rather serve in hell than rule in Heaven. I got more respect for my fellow man than any diety has for me.

im saved, a Baptist, NOT A BIBLE THUMPER,

No. If you are convinced you are saved you are going to hell. Only God knows who's saved and who isn't, you see. So, you are comparing yourself to God. Pride and all that.

Sorry, I don't make the rules. Don't worry, I'll save you a place.

Had the indoctrination, got the T shirt, burned it, then pissed on it.

But that's just me.

In the words of Richard Nixon's head (Futurama) Thats it buddy, you just made my list.

No. If you are convinced you are saved you are going to hell. Only God knows who's saved and who isn't, you see. So, you are comparing yourself to God. Pride and all that.

Sorry, I don't make the rules. Don't worry, I'll save you a place.

That's making the assumption of predestination, one of the problematic kinks in Christian theology.

The real fault which everyone is guilty of, no matter how hard they try, is being their own God. That is why "Through the acception of God's salvation alone, blah blah blah blah."
That's why Hitler could get into heaven while Mother Teresa might not. After all, I'm sure that the latter had a much larger ego at the time of their death.

Here's a test so you know just what part of hell you're going to. I like to be prepared myself :D http://www.4degreez.com/misc/dante-inferno-test.mv

This should have been a poll: Where are you going, heaven or hell? :p

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?

*sigh* Doesn't this ever get old for you people? I mean, doing quotable quotes from x religious extremist just to "prove" the obvious superiority of your anti-religious worldview?

I'm not going to try to explain the Christian theology of hell here, but suffice to say you are not "condemned" to hell, you choose it. You aren't going to hell because you believe in evolution, Christians can believe it and they are still saved.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?

Of course. There are people who haven't? Mind you I've been threatened with it for a fairly wide range of reasons:
Role playing in the '80s. Enough said, really.
Using naturopathic medicines.
Being a masseur.
Having a first aid certificate. (Hmm, it's expired. I wonder if she thinks my soul's now been saved?)
Praying for the sick (this one surprised me no end, as you can imagine).
Talking to a pair of girls on a bus.
For not Speaking in Tongues.
For Speaking in Tongues.
For threatening to curse a guy's cat (He'd really irritated me, and was convinced that I was a sorcerer, so I figured I'd play along to see how stupid he actually was. The answer was - very).

Don't worry about it. Hell, Jesus was accused of being a sorcerer and using the power of demons, so like we're going to escape being slandered.
Besides, it gets funny after a while.

Having a first aid certificate.


WTF?

I no god hates me :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
i love the idea of hell

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?

My mother was told by some local-area nuns that I'd grow up to be crippled, blind, retarded and a chronic masturbator because I had not been baptized.

Well, they might've been right about that last one, but I blame the old department store catalogues for that.

I believe in evolution as well. I have also come up with several arguements (good ones) that can also help you out wit them.

"If we came from two people with absolutely no changes at all (evolution is basically adapting to your surroundings) how are there different races? Also, wouldn't we have some universal language?"

And...

"Do you get used to cold or warm air? After a while, you can get used to different tempratures, and this is adapting to our environment. Short term evolution to be precise."

And here is one more fun thing...

"You say I will go to hell, so when your judgement condemns you too, I will see you there."

For your first point, I must say, that one had me stumped for a while. This article sums it up decently, though. http://www.answersingenesis.org/docs/3811.asp

2nd point... How does that disprove a divine creator? Couldn't He have made us to have certain adaptive qualities in our gene pool?

I'm not quite sure what you are trying to say in your last statement, but "judging", according to the Bible, is not sinful. Condemnation is. If you are willing to be held to the same standard you hold them to, feel free to judge. It's called constructive criticism. Although, what that "religious" girl said does seem rather condemning, just in the way it was presented. But, to say to someone, "according to the bible, you will go to hell if you don't believe in him" is perfectly acceptable, though something I don't recommend doing.

You have to understand, some Christians aren't hypocritical and actually just want you to go to heaven. They're not all like in the movie "saved". You can accept it or not, but to criticize someone who tactfully and respectfully (unlike that girl) presents it to you is discriminatory in my eyes.

Now, on to some of the flaws of evolution, while we're on the subject.
1.)If bats evolved from mice, wouldn't the "mutating stages" between arms and wings be inadequate for productive life, and therefore be eliminated by natural selection?
2.)Suppose a fish evolves lungs... what happens? It drowns.
3.)Orans are irreducibly complex, they can't function AT ALL until completely formed. It's like a mouse trap, just the board or springs will not catch mice until it becomes better and catches more mice, it won't catch mice until it is assembled.
4.)Mutations are NEGATIVE gene disorders. Missing information in DNA. Many years of mutating fruit flies has only created disfigured fruit flies, no beneficial changes, no new species, just freaks of nature.
5.)The probability (even if all conditions were perfect, like the primordial soup) of non-living organisms being acted upon to create living organisms is the same as that of a tornado passing through a junkyard and assembling a 747. (Sir Frederick Hoyle)
6.)How did the universe come to be? The perfect balance of sustained life and the equilibrium of orbits and planetary systems should be enough to disprove the big bang theory. This doesn't necessarily prove anything, it's just something to think about.

Both sides have to assume some things, considering it's impossible to study the origins of life to the fullest extent. What I'm saying is evolutionists have to assume A LOT more. I wish random chance was as beneficial to me as it supposedly has been for nature.

WTF?
Yep. This middle aged woman thought that it meant that I didn't trust God to heal people. I think she considered christian scientists 'softies'. [shrugs] Ah well, meeting people like this makes the concept of Original Sin so much easier to believe - you couldn't get this warped through your own efforts.

Oh, the Dante test sent me to Purgatory. Has anyone else done themselves out of an eternal supply of adulteresses?

Why mind hell? It's a tad hot, but all your favorite people are there.

"Hey Stalin baby! Looking sharp!"

"King Tut, how's it hanging?"

"Edgar Allen Poe! How many goths did you have kiss your feet today? Really, well can I be the eighth?"

I've been told I'm going to hell about 3 times in the past year, that were people making a serious accusation/threat. I care not for any of them.

I'd rather laugh with the sinners than cry with the saints

Now, on to some of the flaws of evolution, while we're on the subject.
1.)If bats evolved from mice, wouldn't the "mutating stages" between arms and wings be inadequate for productive life, and therefore be eliminated by natural selection?
2.)Suppose a fish evolves lungs... what happens? It drowns.
3.)Orans are irreducibly complex, they can't function AT ALL until completely formed. It's like a mouse trap, just the board or springs will not catch mice until it becomes better and catches more mice, it won't catch mice until it is assembled.
4.)Mutations are NEGATIVE gene disorders. Missing information in DNA. Many years of mutating fruit flies has only created disfigured fruit flies, no beneficial changes, no new species, just freaks of nature.
5.)The probability (even if all conditions were perfect, like the primordial soup) of non-living organisms being acted upon to create living organisms is the same as that of a tornado passing through a junkyard and assembling a 747. (Sir Frederick Hoyle)
6.)How did the universe come to be? The perfect balance of sustained life and the equilibrium of orbits and planetary systems should be enough to disprove the big bang theory. This doesn't necessarily prove anything, it's just something to think about.

Both sides have to assume some things, considering it's impossible to study the origins of life to the fullest extent. What I'm saying is evolutionists have to assume A LOT more. I wish random chance was as beneficial to me as it supposedly has been for nature.

I do not mind people being evangelical, don't mind people not believing in evolution. It is frankly not my business and discriminating against someone on that basis is stupid. However when someone goes out of their way to post the same canned, stupid antievolution arguments, I feel compelled to respond.

1. Darwinian evolution is outdated. While it may be correct in certain cases, academica has accepted Stephen Jay Gould's theory of punctuated equilibrium as superior and put together cases where it appears to have happened. A simple example, based off of yours:

There are some rodents. They eat a variety of things, including insects. For some reason, let's say an extra rainy period, all food sources except insects die out in a certain area. Because of this, the rodents there evolve very rapidly in a short period of time a mechanism to detect insects to eat. For many thousands of years these new, improved rodents are doing fine. Then, all of a sudden, tectonic action totally changes their habitat, splitting one rodent colony apart on a separate island. Because now there are not enough ground insects to eat, the rodents change very rapidly again, acquiring the necessary mechanisms for wings, so that they can fly and get at the airborn insects as well as spread beyond the island. In this way you go from a rat to a bat, in just a few million years.

Now sure, evolution has problems: we really are not sure how the stress activates such rapid genetic change, or how population splinters can mutate so totally. But looking at all the accumualted data, punctuated equilibrium explains the lack of fossil record, the incomplete filling of niches, the strange similarity between animals in far-apart areas, and such little doozies as the genetic study of cheetahs which demonstrated that all cheetahs can be traced to two female descendants.

2. The fish are swimming in a lake. Everything's fine. Suddenly, the lake begins to dry up because of a drought. Now because the fish is spending much of its time in a low-water, more muddy environment, it rapidly changes and acquires a lung-like organ. Gentle refinement leads to more sophisticated lungs, even as it maintains the gills. There is an organism called the lungfish, you know, which can breath air and water.

3. Yes, organs are very complex. Heck, cell organelles are complex. DNA evidence suggests however that the organelles were originally individual microscopic organisms that eventually came to live together in a form of symbiosis. Because what a cell does and what its purpose is revolves entirely upon the organelle composition, it is not such a leap to imagine then cells with different amounts of each organelle slowly developing into organs. Especially because you can watch the gradual refinement of organs from sponges through the more complex animals up to mammals.

4. Mutations are not a loss of DNA every time. Yes, a mutation can result in losing DNA, or gaining it, or simply changing base pairs. And even if DNA is lost, a positive result could take place because a different amino acid would then be part of that enzyme. Unlikely, yes, but possible. As for the fruit flies, why should randomly exposing flies to radiation cause any beneficial mutation? That isn't how it happens in nature.

5. That is currently the best point against evolution. The hardest part to believe about the whole thing is any form of life forming in the first place, at all. Evolutionists just believe that it happened, and look for the answer.

6. The orbits of the planets are not "perfect" by any means -- they result from gravity. The Big Bang created dust. Dust concentrated into clouds which collected more dust due to gravity, and so on, until really dense dust became stars and planets. We can watch it happen through the Hubble Space Telescope. Now how the Big Bang happened at all, we do not know. But we're still trying.

To believe evolution, you have to assume that somehow the Big Bang happened and that somehow that first tiny organism formed. Everything from there on has been documented or explained.

To believe against evolution, you have to assume that an unknown power whose existance there is no evidence of, except for hundreds of conflicted accounts in ancient books, all written by humans, is actively altering things in a way we cannot detect and has been for ever.

Your choice, but I'd rather assume a few isolated issues than a grand overarching theme.

also I happen to believe that evolution is proof of the existence of a universal intelligence at work. I just cant be bothered to explain how because it will take too long.

2.)Suppose a fish evolves lungs... what happens? It drowns.

Amphibian...

Actually, it's been suggested that land life is that which simply could not compete in the oceans.

3.)Orans are irreducibly complex, they can't function AT ALL until completely formed. It's like a mouse trap, just the board or springs will not catch mice until it becomes better and catches more mice, it won't catch mice until it is assembled.

Depends on the organ really. Your liver acts as a pouris filter, and you can donate part of it and it will still preform the same task, maybe not just up to 100%.

Also, if you discount evolution, why are there the leftovers of the appendix (Which at one point digested cellulose, which we no longer can) and female mock vas deferens (behind their ovaries, they are 100% functionless).

4.)Mutations are NEGATIVE gene disorders. Missing information in DNA. Many years of mutating fruit flies has only created disfigured fruit flies, no beneficial changes, no new species, just freaks of nature.

The term mutation, despite what the X-Men have taught you, refers to any change in the genetics of a species through enviroment. During the industrial revolutions, certain white moths in England began to show up brown and black, and it was later discovered that their wing cells had adopted that pigment because white moths were eaten (for they were easily spotted) in the soot filled air.

5.)The probability (even if all conditions were perfect, like the primordial soup) of non-living organisms being acted upon to create living organisms is the same as that of a tornado passing through a junkyard and assembling a 747. (Sir Frederick Hoyle)

A 747 has about a million different parts, your most basic lifeforms are made of fair less different types of amino acids. It would be more like the tornado creating a piled mess that weighed between 3.5 and 3.8 tons. Yes, it's possible, and after enough millions of attempts in millions of years, it will happen.

6.)How did the universe come to be? The perfect balance of sustained life and the equilibrium of orbits and planetary systems should be enough to disprove the big bang theory. This doesn't necessarily prove anything, it's just something to think about.

If orbits were in perfect balance, pluto would not be the 8th planet on rare ocassion, and the moon's surface would not be pockmarked with millions of miscalculated orbits.

It's a tad like saying that after an atomic bobm goes off, you shouldn't find any two atoms of Uranium still close to each other, since the chaos should have scattered them all.

Another time today I was told by some kid that I was going to "The bad part of hell" for a comment I made about someone.

Does that mean there's a good part of hell?

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?

Judge not lest ye be judged thyself. Remember that.

I love how fanatics are so quick to tell people they are going to Hell, and they so forgetfully leave out the above passage from the Bible.

In fact, she's breaking the moral code of alot of major religions by telling you you're going to Hell: love your neighbor (as you would yourself).

Ah, the irony.....

I've been told i'm going to hell. Also Hades, Svartheim, the Place Behind the Toilet. You name it, I probably have reserve seating there. Maybe it has to do with the 'deflowering' of a Reverend's daughter? Man, she was nuts.

I've been told i'm going to hell. Also Hades, Svartheim, the Place Behind the Toilet. You name it, I probably have reserve seating there. Maybe it has to do with the 'deflowering' of a Reverend's daughter? Man, she was nuts.
No, that still doesn't make it a safe thing. Some translations put the commandment as saying "Do not commit adultery", which is clearly different to not having sex.

If you want to lock your place in hell, maybe sending pictures to the forum will help? Just a friendly suggestion.

Well, let's do a thought experiment. People don't necessarily -evolve- within their own lifetimes, they just happen to have certain uniquities that end up favored or disfavored. The ones that get favored lead to evolution.

But they -adapt-.

And what that has to do with heaven and hell?

One starts as perpetual happiness or something.

The other starts as perpetual torment or something.

But remember, we adapt. So it's a pretty safe bet we'd build up a tolerance to either one.

And eventually, we're BORED OF HEAVEN (or Hell, as the case seems to be around here.)

So the question really is the people.

And demons are better conversationalists.

But angels are cuter.

Hell is a lake of fire, that's it. You burn in darkness forever and ever, surrounded by screams of people you can't see.
What, youve been there or something?

I would think, it being a lake of fire and all, that there wouldn't be much darkness. Fire casts light as well as heat. Or maybe i'm just being nit-picky about my damnation?

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?
only in forums like this one. never IRL.
i laught about this freaks. there is no hell i could go to, so they just proove again how idiotic they are.

I'm Gay. We can go to hell together :)
im ernst?

on the dante's test i got sent to the fifth level, and i'm only 17, damn, four more to go to get to cocytus

Hmmm, I cannot recall ever having been condemend to Hell (in that manner, I've asked to go there and told I should go there, but not condemned to Hell). If, however, the price of Heaven is the abandondoment of independant thought, then better to be free in Hell than enslaved in Heaven (no apologies to Milton). Given what people have reported being condemend to Hell for, I must say that I am sure that Hell is the preferable destination for me and that eternity in Heaven would be pure torture to me, given the apparent constraints upon those admited to Heaven.

I have difficulty imagining that a Creator would distingush man from beast by the facility of reason and then prohibit man for using that reason to examine creation, but the ways of divinity are not the ways of man. I wonder then if Heaven requires faith without reason and a rejection of reason, if that Heaven is not therefore the place for those who refuse to use the facilites granted man to distingush man from beast, a holding area for those who reject the nature of man.

Just some semi random thoughts the thread brought to me.

Hmm... The test said I'm going to Purgatory, which I was already aware of. I was hoping the test would be more specific, like the actual layer I'd make it to. It said I was "high" for limbo and the wrathful layer.

I have difficulty imagining that a Creator would distingush man from beast by the facility of reason and then prohibit man for using that reason to examine creation, but the ways of divinity are not the ways of man. I wonder then if Heaven requires faith without reason and a rejection of reason, if that Heaven is not therefore the place for those who refuse to use the facilites granted man to distingush man from beast, a holding area for those who reject the nature of man.



Galilleo made a similar arguement after he proclaimed the Earth went around the Sun. He claimed to be a good Christian, regardless of the fact that he was a man of science.

Here's a test so you know just what part of hell you're going to. I like to be prepared myself :D http://www.4degreez.com/misc/dante-inferno-test.mv
The sweet light no longer strikes against your eyes. Your shade has been banished to... the Sixth Level of Hell - The City of Dis

Galilleo made a similar arguement after he proclaimed the Earth went around the Sun. He claimed to be a good Christian, regardless of the fact that he was a man of science.The first sentence is similar to that position, the second my own.

The first sentence is similar to that position, the second my own.

Works for me! :D

Religions are constantly saying that if you believe in another religion you go to hell, therefore everyone goes to hell. I read this from some essay I found somewhere...

But anyway, I havn't been told directly that I'm going to hell, but it's been implied.

Religions are constantly saying that if you believe in another religion you go to hell, therefore everyone goes to hell. I read this from some essay I found somewhere...

But anyway, I havn't been told directly that I'm going to hell, but it's been implied.

I'm not so sure about that. I seriously doubt Buddists tell people they're going to hell. At most, you'll have to put up with a few more lifetimes.

As for Catholicism, it is a fact of the Church that no human is capable of ever judging another human being - only actions can be judged as "good" or "bad". If a Catholic says someone's going to hell, they're automatically designating themselves as bad Catholics. The real pity is that 90% of 'em act that way, and ignorance is really the only thing in the way.

I'm not so sure about that. I seriously doubt Buddists tell people they're going to hell. At most, you'll have to put up with a few more lifetimes.



All you need are two religions saying you're a sinner if you don't believe in us and then suddenly everyone is a sinner.

Well, I'm gay and I've broken 9 of the ten commandments. Hmmm... if I believed in god instead of reincarnation, I'd say I'm most definately going to hell. :D

All you need are two religions saying you're a sinner if you don't believe in us and then suddenly everyone is a sinner.

You really think those people are right in damning all of humankind? That they're the ones who have it all figured out?

I'm not directing this in any way at you, but it just seems like atheiests believe in hell more than Christians do. It's easy to say all religion is hateful and therefore worthless. It makes a lot of sense if you're able to look past the opinions of dumbasses and the narrow-minded.

im saved, a Baptist, NOT A BIBLE THUMPER, and have been told im going to hell cause i belive in some of the facts that were used to wright "the da vinci code" by dan brown like the fact that in da vinci's "last supper" painting there are soposed to be 12 decipals and Christ and one cup AKA the holy grail, but there are 11 decipals, Christ, and one woman(at the right hand of christ(look at the shape that thay make.....its an "M" and that soposidly stands for mary magdalen(who is said to be his wife(long story just read the book above)))), and twelve cups(hard to see) hears a picture

http://images.fbrtech.com/dnew/Italy2001/Postcards/Milan1.jpg

what is your thalts and (most likely) shit load of questions also can you find the dager in the picture (yes there is one) BTW im glad to find a pagen on N.S. also di vinci was a pagen and leader of the "priory of sion"
Hell, I'm no spelling nazi (formatting perhaps, but not spelling) but I was just about able to decrypt your English. What you have encoded in no doubt a code within a code.

Well, I'm gay and I've broken 9 of the ten commandments. Hmmm... if I believed in god instead of reincarnation, I'd say I'm most definately going to hell. :D

Same here, just by being gay, I've probably broken many comandments in many religions.

What a dumbass. I wouldn't be offended by anyone that idiotic. It appears there are very few Christians or any other religious group who have tolerance and don't go about spreading bs. I believe in evolution and God. God created the creatures and they evolved. It doesn't go against the bible and it keeps scientists happy.
. . . and it could conceivably satisfy the agnostic crowd.

But just possibly. :D

Religions are constantly saying that if you believe in another religion you go to hell, therefore everyone goes to hell. I read this from some essay I found somewhere...

But anyway, I havn't been told directly that I'm going to hell, but it's been implied.
You are going to hell for free thinking and other thought crimes you sick, sick evil, ah, er, puppy you!


Welcome to the club! Have a cigar!

I'm not so sure about that. I seriously doubt Buddists tell people they're going to hell. At most, you'll have to put up with a few more lifetimes.

As for Catholicism, it is a fact of the Church that no human is capable of ever judging another human being - only actions can be judged as "good" or "bad". If a Catholic says someone's going to hell, they're automatically designating themselves as bad Catholics. The real pity is that 90% of 'em act that way, and ignorance is really the only thing in the way.
Just for that slap and lack of slap at Buddhists will cause your karmic cycle to spiral out of control causing you to go back to life one and start over.

Just look around you and decide who is going to hell and who is going to heaven.........

I know where I wanna go !

Well, I'm gay and I've broken 9 of the ten commandments. Hmmm... if I believed in god instead of reincarnation, I'd say I'm most definately going to hell. :D
Inquiring minds want to know, was it the sabbath day thing you kept? :D

Just for that slap and lack of slap at Buddhists will cause your karmic cycle to spiral out of control causing you to go back to life one and start over.

That sounds like a personal opinion. Enlightenment for Buddists requires a lifetime or more of meditation and contemplation. You're telling me all the work I may have done in life is undone in moment? Bull. Even if I suffer in a karmic sense of the word over my previous statement, I have the rest of my life to make it up to myself. You're being overcritical.

OK All, gotta go off to work now. There is a world waiting to be further corrupted out there.

I'll keep an eye out for you all.

Yes, a boss of mine told me that once. He was nice enough about it, he just thought he should let me know I was going to HELL :) So about a month later, on Halloween, I showed up wearing all red, with horns, tail and pitchfork. His expression when he saw that was simply priceless... :)

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat.
Don't worry, it's a myth, like the rest of the religion thing.

"Through me the way into the suffering city,
Through me the way to the eternal pain,
Through me the way that runs among the lost.
Justice urged on my high artificer;
My maker was divine authority,
The highest wisdom, and the primal love.
Before me nothing but eternal things were made,
And I endure eternally.
Abandon every hope, ye who enter here."

First I suggest that everybody take the Dante's Inferno test, because it's kind of fun to see what circle of hell you'd go to if the Divine Comedy is accurate.

http://www.4degreez. com/misc/dante-inferno-test.mv

I'm going to Dis, the 6th circle for heretics. Ah, the questions I would ask the likes of Nostradamus, Galileo... But anyways, onto business.

Not only do I get told I'm going to hell, but also am asked if I worship the devil. Now personally, I have no beliefs whatsoever, but I find religion absolutely fascinating. I don't believe in god and have no problem being obscenely blasphemous. (god is a c*nt) I don't believe in heaven, but I also don't believe in the devil or in hell, so I neither seek penitence nor fear hellfire. Secretly though, I hope these things exist, because I look forward to the apocolypse, look forward to asking god for an explanation then telling him to shove it.

If you ask me, religion's what's wrong with this world.

Also, if any of you know who Douglas Adams is, they peiced together a book (The Salmon of Doubt) of writings the found on his computer posthumously. There were a few interesting peices about his thoughts on religion and god. He was a self-proclaimed "radical athiest," with an interesting way of putting things in a different perspective. I'll try to see if there's an excerpt anywhere on the web.

Oh, and on another note: do we really need to spell like "lyke" just to be cool? Also, who ever decided punctuation was optional?

A future english teacher.

Did she explain why all Democrats are going to Hell?

Personally I'm with Mark Twain on this one:
Go to Heaven for the climate, Hell for the company.
He had some other great quotes about Heaven/Hell but I don't know if you's be interested.







Just kidding:
The secret source of humour itself is not joy, but sorrow. There is no humour in heaven.
Let us swear while we may, for in Heaven it will not be allowed.
The inventor of their heaven empties into it all the nations of the earth, in one common jumble. All are on an equality absolute, no one of them ranking another; they have to be "brothers"; they have to mix together, pray together, harp together, hosannah together--whites, niggers, Jews, everybody--there's no distinction. Here in the earth all nations hate each other, and every one of them hates the Jew. Yet every pious person adores that heaven and wants to get into it. He really does. And when he is in a holy rapture he thinks he thinks that if he were only there he would take all the populace to his heart, and hug, and hug, and hug!

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?

At least now you know you can stop worrying about it and stop trying to put it right. Now you can be bad because you know what's going down anyway!

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?
And she's allowed to operate a moving vehicle? Yikes!

The latest National Geographic has a hell of a series of articles entitled "Was Darwin Wrong?" Trust me, they're not defending Intelligent Design. And on a personal note, while I have indeed been condemned to hell, more than once, it's been for sins far more carnal than a belief in evolution. :D

I've been told I'm going to hell many times. Firstly when I said I didn't believe we went to Heaven or Hell when we died, otherwise what is the purpose of resurrection. Then lately when I started writing my essay "God is Evil".

But as a side note on DeVinci's Last Supper has anyone noticed the black diciple on the far right?

For the love of.... Have you EVER been to Mass? They explain the whole Eating the Flesh of Christ (unleaven bread) and the Blood of Christ (Wine) Every Sunday (Saturday for me) at Mass. Try reaserching these religions before you make bullshit statement. As for the cross, same response, do some fuckin reaserch.

OK, this is easy as I have relatives who are priests. The process is called Communion. The repentant believers kneel before the altar and consume the flesh and blood of Christ. This is not metaphor or ritual according to Catholic doctrine. A miracle called Transmutation occurs at the moment the priest places the wafer or wine in your mouth. It is no longer a piece of bread or grape juice, but actually becomes Jesus' flesh and blood. This is so central to Catholicism that priests are encouraged to keep the fingers that hold the wafer from doing anything profane. This means that if they go chop some wood, they should wear a glove over that hand. I don't know for certain that this part about protecting these fingers from the profane is actual doctrine, but the bit about consuming flesh and blood is definitely doctrine.

Just in case you would like to know which circle of hell you are going to, there's a quiz:

http://www.4degreez.com/misc/dante-inferno-test.mv

N.B. The Infernal geography is based on Dante Alighieri's classic 'Inferno'

I get told I'm going to Hell on a daily basis, and I tell each person the same thing: "When I get down there I'll save you a seat".

Hell probably won't be so bad if this is the company I'll be in, though. :D

Pfft! I bet even in Hell, Jehovah's Witlesses would still bring the Watchtower to your door.
Watchtower? Does it exist in America and the UK or are you just Dutch?

A quote, but forgotten from who:
"What if this was hell of an other planet?"

Watchtower is like bacteria, it multiplies wherever one falls in remotely favourable conditions (i.e. no religious people nearby)

Awwright!
I get to go to the 2nd level of hell for the lustful, and hang out with Cleopatra and Helen of Troy!
Cool, thanks for the link, guys!
:D

I'm going all the way to the 6th level. But, then again I don't believe in God, so not only is this the reason I would go to the city of Dis, it is also the reason I am not going. Paradoxical or what!

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?
I am Christian Guy.
I absolve you of her curse...
Going to hell with all the other Dems-wow.
Christians who cower in the dark fearing science do us all a diservice.
And everybody knows its the Green Party who is going to hell for election spoiling. :rolleyes:

O.K. . . .
The Bible suggests very strongly that eternity is binary, i.e., two options. The "kingdom of God" (or "kingdom of heaven" in Matthew's Gospel) is better translated "rule of God", the bits of creation that are ruled by God. People can be in the kingdom of God if they want to, by recognizing that Jesus is the Son of God, and asking God to transform them into the men and women He wants them to be. It's optional for us, because of free will, but the option is only open to us because of the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus.
If you don't want anything to do with God, then God will grant your wish and create permanent separation between you and Him. This is hell.
Hell is described in the Bible using three different metaphors; torment, being-cast-out, and death. I don't know how the three metaphors combine, but whatever it's like, it doesn't sound pleasant, or fun.

All this means that someone saying "You're going to hell!" is, at best, unclear. If they say, "You will go to hell!", that is claiming a knowledge of the future that none of us can rightly claim.
If they say "You are going TOWARDS hell!", that may be accurate, just as someone driving with their car towards a cliff edge is heading TOWARDS the edge, and will go over it if they continue in their present course of action. However, they may stop the car, or change course so as to avoid the cliff.

The Biblical word for changing the course of your life so that you stop heading towards hell and start heading towards heaven is "repentance". When Jesus preached, He said "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand" (Matthew 4:17), so He was talking to people heading towards hell, knowing that they could change course and follow Him to heaven.

Don't worry, it's a myth, like the rest of the religion thing.


Like I have said before
“God is my favorite fictional character”

I was told that I was speaking for the devil by the people at my last church (Evolution! Heresy! Woman as elders! Blasphemer!).

I feel that I should throw a few more Bible quotes in here, just for the sake of it- people have already picked up on "Judge not lest you be judged" (Luke 6:37, Matthew 7:1 etc), but those of you railing aginst religious freaks can take comfort in "How terrible for you, Teachers of the Law and Pharisees! You hypocrites! You lock the door to the Kingdom of Heaven in people's faces, and you yourselves don't go in, nor do you allow in those who are trying to enter!" (Matthew 23:13). I can't find the teaching that I was looking for; it's most irritating. That one "Not everyone who calls me Lord, Lord will be saved...I will say get away from me, you wicked people!".

Although I must protest against this view that Heaven will be boring, when there are so many cases of Jesus having a sense of humour. Take forever, the teaching "How can you say to your brother that he has a speck of sawdust in your eye when you have a plank in your own eye?": if the idea of someone staggering around with a plank stuck in their eye isn't amusing, I can't imagine what is. Likewise, in the book of Philemon, Paul is clearly trying some desperate puns with the word 'useful': the slave that Paul is referring to is called 'Onesimus', meaning 'useful' in Greek: "At one time he was of no use to you, but now he is useful both to you and to me".
Maybe it doesn't translate well, and was better in the original Hebrew...they were trying to be funny, at least.

Christian doctrine at its most basic level teaches that all people, including Christians, deserve to go to Hell; we are saved 'by the Blood of the Lamb': not by works but by faith. However, most Christians that you speak to don't take a direct 'fire and brimstones' view of Hell (although some do, like the people at my last church). I personally take the view that it is the absence of God (although who goes, I can't say). The reason that Heaven is pink and fluffy is because God is there, and you get to worship God for eternity (Another reason for all you atheists to start blaspheming quickly! Save yourself while you can! Sin, sin I tell you! God is just! You'll have to sing hymns and things if you don't! Aaaargh!!!!). Hell isn't, because God is there. I've heard one theory that Hell is like Earth. During the Day of Judgement, everyone experienced the presence of God and so, when it was removed, the contrast was like they were all in fire and brimstones. But then I don't even believe in the Devil.

But then I could just be speaking for the Devil again...*hides behind a tree from the crazy fundamentalists at her last church*

I feel that I should throw a few more Bible quotes in here, just for the sake of it- people have already picked up on "Judge not lest you be judged" (Luke 6:37, Matthew 7:1 etc), but those of you railing aginst religious freaks can take comfort in "How terrible for you, Teachers of the Law and Pharisees! You hypocrites! You lock the door to the Kingdom of Heaven in people's faces, and you yourselves don't go in, nor do you allow in those who are trying to enter!" (Matthew 23:13). I can't find the teaching that I was looking for; it's most irritating. That one "Not everyone who calls me Lord, Lord will be saved...I will say get away from me, you wicked people!".

"Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?' And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you who practice lawlessness.'" (Matthew 7:21-23, New American Standard Bible).

I think that's the one you were looking for. It's near the end of the Sermon on the Mount (usually quoted by people as their favourite Bible passage, if they have one, though I suspect that most people who say that have never actually read it). The bit that starts "Depart from me . . ." is a quotation from Psalm 6, verse 8.

Watchtower? Does it exist in America and the UK or are you just Dutch?

A quote, but forgotten from who:
"What if this was hell of an other planet?"Dude, the Jehovah's Witnesses originated in the US--Pennsylvania to be exact. I know because I was one for the first 26 years of my life. I've been gone for ten years, and I'm still in recovery. On a happier note, however, it's given me a lot to write about, and that got me the Fellowship I'm currently enjoying. :D

I have been cursed thus lo many times.

The curses were fulfilled.

I live in the US under DUmbya.

I have been cursed thus lo many times.

The curses were fulfilled.

I live in the US under DUmbya.


Um here is where someone is supposed to say “Not yet but under Kerry it will be complete”

But yeah um I don’t really care lol (oh btw great job bringing politics into the debate … we really needed another one of those)

I wa sonce told by a magic 8 ball i was going to hell
btw: my old chemestry teacher is the devil

So I'll be meeting most of you in hell then?

I wa sonce told by a magic 8 ball i was going to hell
btw: my old chemestry teacher is the devil

Oracle of the 8 Ball is a heretical thing anyway, looking to that instead of God I believe it is. So, looks like your hellbound anyway! See you in hell!




From heaven.

In any case, I'm a musician, so it's pretty much a given that I'm going to hell.


Hey im a christian musician... i don think im goin 2 hell... :(

Hey im a christian musician... i don think im goin 2 hell... :(

Well, if you're a Christian, you stand a much greater chance of going to Hell in any event...it's dualism at its' best, the whole Heaven/Hell crapshoot, but you've gotta pay to play, remember...it's strictly for subscribers only.

I've got bigger fish to fry in my afterlife.

Hey im a christian musician... i don think im goin 2 hell... :(Are you kidding? Playing christian music puts you on the Hell Express, right there with the guy who shot the Pope. That's a crime against humanity. :D

GOD HATES ME
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
The hell express

I've been told I'm going to hell many times, I said once that I didn't like Bush, because I don't beleive in war, and needless conflict, or the lies, and this chick just told me I was going to hell for it. Wow. I didn't think that loving war, and lies was a prerequisite for heaven. Religion pisses me off.

In the words of Richard Nixon's head (Futurama) Thats it buddy, you just made my list.
**shrug** I don't keep lists and I don't kiss ass. From my point of view, you are entitled to believe whatever you want. I don't insist you agree or try to change your mind. I don't advocate physically trashing the Vatican. But I was raised Catholic, in a Catholic school, in a Catholic parish. That entitles me to hold the view I do and to shamlessly state my case.

If you wish to make and maintain lists why not pursue those who helped me form the opinions I did at 10 years of age?

Hmm... The test said I'm going to Purgatory, which I was already aware of. I was hoping the test would be more specific, like the actual layer I'd make it to. It said I was "high" for limbo and the wrathful layer.
You must not be trying very hard. here is mine:

Seventh Level of Hell

Guarded by the Minotaur, who snarls in fury, and encircled within the river Phlegethon, filled with boiling blood, is the Seventh Level of Hell. The violent, the assasins, the tyrants, and the war-mongers lament their pitiless mischiefs in the river, while centaurs armed with bows and arrows shoot those who try to escape their punishment. The stench here is overpowering. This level is also home to the wood of the suicides- stunted and gnarled trees with twisting branches and poisoned fruit. At the time of final judgement, their bodies will hang from their branches. In those branches the Harpies, foul birdlike creatures with human faces, make their nests. Beyond the wood is scorching sand where those who committed violence against God and nature are showered with flakes of fire that rain down against their naked bodies. Blasphemers and sodomites writhe in pain, their tongues more loosed to lamentation, and out of their eyes gushes forth their woe. Usurers, who followed neither nature nor art, also share company in the Seventh Level.

That sounds like a personal opinion. Enlightenment for Buddists requires a lifetime or more of meditation and contemplation. You're telling me all the work I may have done in life is undone in moment? Bull. Even if I suffer in a karmic sense of the word over my previous statement, I have the rest of my life to make it up to myself. You're being overcritical.
No, I was being facetious. Not at you but at the whole concept of judging another person as condemned based on a lack of adhereance to a dogma.

In short, I was joking.

So I'll be meeting most of you in hell then?
Nah, it appears I've done myself out of my eternity's supply of adulteresses - according to the test I'm headed for purgatory. [thinks] Now, granted purgatory doesn't exist (I do like showing catholics the bit in Augustine's "city of God" where he says only Heaven and Hell exist) but if it did, this would mean I'd have to hike across the place to get to heaven. So, if the more technically orientated folks going to Hell could set up an internet there, I could lay cable on my way up to Heaven and we could continue these discussions indefintely. And I'm sure Hell would be a great supplier of porn - just what Heaven needs.

Nah, it appears I've done myself out of my eternity's supply of adulteresses - according to the test I'm headed for purgatory. [thinks] Now, granted purgatory doesn't exist (I do like showing catholics the bit in Augustine's "city of God" where he says only Heaven and Hell exist) but if it did, this would mean I'd have to hike across the place to get to heaven. So, if the more technically orientated folks going to Hell could set up an internet there, I could lay cable on my way up to Heaven and we could continue these discussions indefintely. And I'm sure Hell would be a great supplier of porn - just what Heaven needs.


Well I am a comp network admin and a graduate with a masters in network security modeling and simulation

I would love to work on the return of the biggest network of them all!

evolution doesnt conflict with religion in any way send me telegram and ill tell u y

:) We welcome all newcomers.

With open arms.

Displayed and ready for use.

how come when ever anyone has a near death experience they always claim to see a bright light and jesus comforting them? At least one stoned out 80s rocker must have wiped out on his motorcylce and seen Satan rocking out in hell.

LOL too funny, I did that Dante Test and I'm heading for the 7th level. Should I be packing? :p

You must not be trying very hard. here is mine:

Seventh Level of Hell

Guarded by the Minotaur, who snarls in fury, and encircled within the river Phlegethon, filled with boiling blood, is the Seventh Level of Hell. The violent, the assasins, the tyrants, and the war-mongers lament their pitiless mischiefs in the river, while centaurs armed with bows and arrows shoot those who try to escape their punishment. The stench here is overpowering. This level is also home to the wood of the suicides- stunted and gnarled trees with twisting branches and poisoned fruit. At the time of final judgement, their bodies will hang from their branches. In those branches the Harpies, foul birdlike creatures with human faces, make their nests. Beyond the wood is scorching sand where those who committed violence against God and nature are showered with flakes of fire that rain down against their naked bodies. Blasphemers and sodomites writhe in pain, their tongues more loosed to lamentation, and out of their eyes gushes forth their woe. Usurers, who followed neither nature nor art, also share company in the Seventh Level.

OK, not a reply to the post (just the bolded bit).

So very, very sick of the whole "Omg, suicide = shitty horrible people who deserve to suffer even more! Yay for 'compassion'"

Bah, and people wonder why suicide statistics just keep rising - mayhaps it has to do with the fact that anyone who is considering suicide is told that they suck and are cowards and... bah.

Sorry, will stop ranting off-topically. (wait, it was in reply to a quote... is it still off-topic?)

how come when ever anyone has a near death experience they always claim to see a bright light and jesus comforting them? At least one stoned out 80s rocker must have wiped out on his motorcylce and seen Satan rocking out in hell.
The 'bright light' and 'tunnel of light' effects are caused by cell death etc in the eyes - so if you ever see that, you're still alive.
Not all of the near death experiences are of heaven/Jesus etc. I've read of several which involved being in hell.

Well I am a comp network admin and a graduate with a masters in network security modeling and simulation

I would love to work on the return of the biggest network of them all!
Bewdy. Just made sure there's someone to design and build the components! And then we can finally fulfill the advice of Sluggy Freelance and span satan!

I saw this loser at the university I go to saying, among other things, that anybody that went to a football (I'm absolutely sure American, as I live in the US) game is going to hell. I'm screwed then. I've been to plenty of gridiron games, including a few that I have worked at for the university. I just dismissed it as some crackpot who didn't know wtf he was talking about.

So very, very sick of the whole "Omg, suicide = shitty horrible people who deserve to suffer even more! Yay for 'compassion'"

Bah, and people wonder why suicide statistics just keep rising - mayhaps it has to do with the fact that anyone who is considering suicide is told that they suck and are cowards and... bah.

As people are not being told this as much any more, maybe the rising suicide rates are because people aren't getting this message?
You're confusing prevention and treatment. Sure, compassion and understanding are necessary to cure someone who is suicidal, but a good yelling can often stall plans to suicide long enough to allow professional treatment. You really don't want people being 'supportive' and 'understanding' of a suicide attempt - you have to stop the attempt!
And yes, I have had to deal with several suicidal individuals. They're all alive, so I'll stick with a winning strategy.

As people are not being told this as much any more, maybe the rising suicide rates are because people aren't getting this message?
You're confusing prevention and treatment. Sure, compassion and understanding are necessary to cure someone who is suicidal, but a good yelling can often stall plans to suicide long enough to allow professional treatment. You really don't want people being 'supportive' and 'understanding' of a suicide attempt - you have to stop the attempt!
And yes, I have had to deal with several suicidal individuals. They're all alive, so I'll stick with a winning strategy.

Edit: Though I'd put in a more direct response, since my points weren't very... direct?

I disagree that people aren't being told that much anymore. I've come across it very frequently, from friends and complete strangers. People confuse self-harm with suicide attempts, and they aren't in the least shy about showing complete contempt. No one has yet tried to 'prevent' the perceived 'suicide'; they just make harsh comments occasionally and then drop it.

I agree that keeping up a dialogue of any sort is a good idea if it's occuring while seeking help if a suicide attempt seems imminent, and that attacks on the idea of suicide may work well, but that's not what I was addressing. I was talking about people who dwell on suicide for long periods of time, who are, I firmly believe, very adversly affected by being cast as 'cowards' by people around them.

/Edit
---------

Well, I've been suicidal myself, and I can honestly state that coming across statements that cast me as a coward do not in fact help at all. Considering most of my issues come from almost zero self-esteem, I may not be the standard case. But I know that I personally use accusations like that to fuel self-hate.

And I also believe that any condemnation of suicide is a bad thing. It pushes it into the background, so only people who can scrape together the courage to reach out for help can get it, while the rest seek out other suicidal people and tend to reaffirm the wish to die. Of course, you can't encourage suicide either, or you end up with honour and group suicides like those happening in Japan.

I guess it's just a very fine line to have to walk. Pity so many health systems around the world are barely funded enough to deal with serious physical issues, let alone the psychological ones...

"Here we may reign secure; and in my choice
To reign is worth ambition, though in hell:
Better to reign in hell than serve in heaven." John Milton, Paradise Lost

I don't subscribe to that particular belief; I don't believe in heaven or hell either. But I do know that someone who takes and twists the words of an ancient holy text like the Bible to their own devices is worthy of the label Heretic.

Edit: Though I'd put in a more direct response, since my points weren't very... direct?

I disagree that people aren't being told that much anymore. I've come across it very frequently, from friends and complete strangers. People confuse self-harm with suicide attempts, and they aren't in the least shy about showing complete contempt. No one has yet tried to 'prevent' the perceived 'suicide'; they just make harsh comments occasionally and then drop it.
Then they're vermin. You're worth twenty of them. That you've kept going marks you as a champion - while they've (cowardly) run away from your problems you've faced those problems and defeated them.

And yes, defeated them - you're stil alive, despite the suicidal impulses. Every heartbeat is a victory. Any time that you've been able to enjoy a sunset, a conversation with friends, a good meal - is a victory, snatching life from the jaws of death; is as impressive as a firefighter or surgeon saving a life. Be proud.


I agree that keeping up a dialogue of any sort is a good idea if it's occuring while seeking help if a suicide attempt seems imminent, and that attacks on the idea of suicide may work well, but that's not what I was addressing. I was talking about people who dwell on suicide for long periods of time, who are, I firmly believe, very adversly affected by being cast as 'cowards' by people around them.
Yep. You sum up the problem perfectly below.

Well, I've been suicidal myself, and I can honestly state that coming across statements that cast me as a coward do not in fact help at all. Considering most of my issues come from almost zero self-esteem, I may not be the standard case. But I know that I personally use accusations like that to fuel self-hate.
Granted. (And although every individual is different, your complete lack of self-esteem is normal when suicidial). The thing is that while in the depths of despair, most people won't respond to any attempt to build up their self-esteem - on the other hand, they will immediately accept any statement that destroys it: so giving a put-down reason to stay alive (eg "you're abandoning your friends and family") is a solid way to keep you alive.
It's pretty much the same as the medieval cauterising of wounds - doing even more damage in a desperate attempt to keep the patient alive.
Actually mental health at the moment is in the 'burning pitch and leeches' stage. I imagine that a century from now, people will be horrified to learn how bad our techniques are.
And I also believe that any condemnation of suicide is a bad thing. It pushes it into the background, so only people who can scrape together the courage to reach out for help can get it, while the rest seek out other suicidal people and tend to reaffirm the wish to die. Of course, you can't encourage suicide either, or you end up with honour and group suicides like those happening in Japan.
That's right. Nice sum up. We still had similar concepts in the West as late as 19th Century - thanks to stoic philosophy.

I guess it's just a very fine line to have to walk. Pity so many health systems around the world are barely funded enough to deal with serious physical issues, let alone the psychological ones...
That's right.
However -
has it occurred to you that having been through this, you are 'trained' in dealing with this - better than most professionals? The 'school of hard knocks' turns out effective graduates. If you can continue to deal with this - and by talking about it, you are dealing with it - you will be able to help many other people! And there's something very special about watching someone smile again, after they've been broken for so long. That alone is well worth living for.
If you'd like to talk, send a telgram to my nation, and we can natter! If you're interested, remember to add The Holy Palatinate to your dossier - you don't want to have to go looking through the forums when you're out of it!

Hell is a lake of fire, that's it. You burn in darkness forever and ever, surrounded by screams of people you can't see.

hell actually sounds ideal compared to the city...warm,dark, and after a while those screams would become your zen sound.you could do worse. :)

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?


I just know I'm goin. I need to go down there to overthrow satan a.k.a Cheney, so I took out a hit on zell miler and his family.

bah....i was certain i was going to hell, until i found the Inferno online test and it told me i was nice enough to be let off the hook despite my evil heretical manners. Now i don't have any afterlife to look forwards to! :( (don't worry, hell dosn't exist, so you'll have a hard time getting there)

Some religious girl today told me that I'm going to be going to hell with John Kerry, Michael Jackson, and every other democrat. My reason for hell is because I believe in evolution.

Has anyone else here been condemmed to hell?

You know what they say, "Go to Heaven for the climate, Hell for the people."

bah....i was certain i was going to hell, until i found the Inferno online test and it told me i was nice enough to be let off the hook despite my evil heretical manners. Now i don't have any afterlife to look forwards to! :( (don't worry, hell dosn't exist, so you'll have a hard time getting there)

I took the infrno test, apparently, Judas will be removed from cocytus so that satan can chew on me, not him.

Now i don't have any afterlife to look forwards to! :( (don't worry, hell dosn't exist, so you'll have a hard time getting there)
oh, Hell exists all right. Humans are very good at creating Hells for ourselves. The number of living Hells we've created on this planet should assure people that if we continue to exist after death, then Hell(s) await.