NationStates Jolt Archive

I've noticed that there are couple of slightly offensive threads that have popped up that basically have belittling comments about us. I think we ought to ban together and counter the enemy with out witty wisdom.

We are not whores, and just because we are liberated doesn't mean we are feminists. We are humans too; we were all created equal.

j/k
*Nods to luna*

I thought you were all 14 yr old prey for us 50 yr old sweaty guys.

j/k

Really: women are just another hated group here. So are *add you hate list here*

*Sad smile*

Think of it this way: women are treated badly because men are afraid of them.

It's all linked to penis size...uh...somehow.

So the more they're mysogonistic...the smaller...um...

...yeah, let's just end that right now.

Agreed.
Which threads?
I for one have tried to discern, and thus discredit, certain statements by certain nations as being, lets say "moronic" and so pay no heed. There's enough matter here worthy of response that I refuse to even acknowledge sophmoric statements with so much as a smack on the back of their brittle little skulls.

I've been busy fighting my little Quixotic fight. I'm sure that if all the women in the world withheld sex for one day, though, that there would be an awful lot of frustrated men with entitlement issues running around.

It warms me heart to fantasize about it.

Why the disrespect? (http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=366604)

This is the main one.

Think of it this way: women are treated badly because men are afraid of them.

It's all linked to penis size...uh...somehow.

So the more they're mysogonistic...the smaller...um...

...yeah, let's just end that right now.

About half-right: men fear women becauase you do indeed have power over us. Some "men" might like to call it "sex" *I am being VERY nice now. but ultimately it id(is) fear of the one thing that does have power over us.

*smilie*

Heh. It's funny, Jim, because that's the kind of talk that gets men laid on a regular basis, whether they mean it or not. Oh the irony. ;)

Heh. It's funny, Jim, because that's the kind of talk that gets men laid on a regular basis, whether they mean it or not. Oh the irony. ;)

Being myself also gets me married to a *shuuder* woman.

I can play the mysogonist game, I just know where the power is planted. *read that one*

I personally love women.

They're mostly sweet, caring, wonderful and squishy in interesting places.

"Never met a wise man, if so it's a woman" - Kurt Cobain

About half-right: men fear women becauase you do indeed have power over us. Some "men" might like to call it "sex" *I am being VERY nice now. but ultimately it id(is) fear of the one thing that does have power over us.

*smilie*

Uh...I'm a guy xD

And yes, it is true, women hold the keys to sex. And many frustrated guys don't like that too much :p

I'm not a militant, "all men are potential rapists" feminist, but when I hear all this business about whores who don't know their place, I get angry. I don't hate men, by any stretch of the imagination, but I don't like them getting too uppity....*cough*

I'm not a militant, "all men are potential rapists" feminist, but when I hear all this business about whores who don't know their place, I get angry.
I agree.

Is it possible to be a male feminist? Is that a contradiction of terms/self-degrading?

I'm not a militant, "all men are potential rapists" feminist, but when I hear all this business about whores who don't know their place, I get angry. I don't hate men, by any stretch of the imagination, but I don't like them getting too uppity....*cough*

Meh. Some of us are *Nice guys* We are a dying breed. I try to be a gentleman and hold a door for you, what will be your response?

Meh. Some of us are *Nice guys* We are a dying breed. I try to be a gentleman and hold a door for you, what will be your response?
Angry stares and the occaisional kick in the groin.

Apparently being nice and being male are mutually exclusive...

Meh. Some of us are *Nice guys* We are a dying breed. I try to be a gentleman and hold a door for you, what will be your response?

To smile and say "thank you", of course, but then, I'd be just as likely to hold the door for you, because I think it's a nice touch of common courtesy.

To smile and say "thank you", of course, but then, I'd be just as likely to hold the door for you, because I think it's a nice touch of common courtesy.
Common courtesy is dying too. *grumbles about personal issue*

Oh, I know it. I try to do things for people, just common courtesy, like having a pot of coffee ready for the morning shift....and they get to expect it, to take it for granted. Not that I want a pat on the back or anything, but I'd like to see people appreciate things. "Thank you" and "please" are dying phrases.

To smile and say "thank you", of course, but then, I'd be just as likely to hold the door for you, because I think it's a nice touch of common courtesy.

*full sarcasm* Very good little woman */sarcasm*

My politeness is intended as being polite to you. Not your gender, appearance, age etc: YOU.

If I can claim myself as the most important person in my pantheon, then can I not recognize you? Take the complement and respect given, Girls/women.

Meh. Some of us are *Nice guys* We are a dying breed. I try to be a gentleman and hold a door for you, what will be your response?

Yes, but unfortunatly-and it may just be me having horrid luck with women-but from what I've seen most girls want a guy who isn't nice so they can change him.

And then he doesn't change.

And then she goes to her friend to complain.

And he doesn't want to say "Bloody hell, why not try going for a NICE guy?!"


I agree.

Is it possible to be a male feminist? Is that a contradiction of terms/self-degrading?

Not at all. There's me, for example :p

There's just a lot of people who want to feel superior to others, or don't want to feel inferior, which is more understandable...and the ones who have to feel superior, who have a complex, tend to get their stripe painted on people who aren't like that, who aren't guilty, haven't got a power trip, and are nice enough people.

I've noticed that there are couple of slightly offensive threads that have popped up that basically have belittling comments about us. I think we ought to ban together and counter the enemy with out witty wisdom.

We are not whores, and just because we are liberated doesn't mean we are feminists. We are humans too; we were all created equal.

What's wrong with being a feminist?

Not at all. There's me, for example :p
Oh good!

I think in part it has to do with age - teenage boys letting out their frustrations and such...
And I really don't know why feminism gets such a bad rap... Women still have it worse than men- so feminism is a good, positive thing. And not all feminists are man-haters! :eek: (I'd say most aren't...)

And I know men who're passionate about feminism- so yeah, it does happen!

If women have free will and can enter into relationships in good faith, with knowledge of their expected role, then we have no conflict whatsoever. The conflict between traditionalism and feminism is not one that requires the dissolution of one or the other philosophies...

there's nothing wrong with being a feminist, and yes, men can be feminists too.

(but not lesbian separatist feminists ;)

there's nothing wrong with being a feminist, and yes, men can be feminists too.

(but not lesbian separatist feminists ;)
I'm a straight guy, does this make my inner woman/feminine side a lesbian?

What is the all fuss about? IMHO gender-related issues are no longer an important topic. If there is a gender-related conversation, it is usually about biology, not sociology. I find no differences between women and men in the modern world, at least in Nordic states. Of course I hate how muslims and african negrotribes treat women, but there is nothing I can do about it. Perhaps they will find out sooner or later that it is not wise to keep ~50% of your population out from work-life.

To sum up, there are no differences in the professional life between genders and all the conversations about is out-dated. Still in personal life gender diffrences are an ever green topic and it always makes you laugh.

PS. Single men should have the same rights to adopt children like single women have!

What is the all fuss about? IMHO gender-related issues are no longer an important topic. If there is a gender-related conversation, it is usually about biology, not sociology. I find no differences between women and men in the modern world, at least in Nordic states. Of course I hate how muslims and african negrotribes treat women, but there is nothing I can do about it. Perhaps they will find out sooner or later that it is not wise to keep ~50% of your population out from work-life.

To sum up, there are no differences in the professional life between genders and all the conversations about is out-dated. Still in personal life gender diffrences are an ever green topic and it always makes you laugh.

PS. Single men should have the same rights to adopt children like single women have!

Um, are you aware that in Western countries women in the same job as a man only earn 2/3 what the man does? Take a look at this site for more information on inequality.

http://www.geocities.com/Paris/2159/anrfem.html

Maybe there is less of this stuff in Nordic countries, but it's definitely still around.

And "negrotribes"? Verrry offensive to Africans...

Why the disrespect? (http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=366604)

This is the main one.
So much for paying no heed to morons.
Thanks for dragging me into that mathematically challenged, Bible mis-interpreting, Actuarial *ahem* scientist's world.

there's nothing wrong with being a feminist, and yes, men can be feminists too.

(but not lesbian separatist feminists ;)

I maintain that I am a lesbian trapped in a man's body.

If women have free will and can enter into relationships in good faith, with knowledge of their expected role, then we have no conflict whatsoever. The conflict between traditionalism and feminism is not one that requires the dissolution of one or the other philosophies...
Again I wonder from where you get this notion of "traditionalism."
So if my husband entered into our relationship in good faith, knowing I was the intellectually superior of the two, and that I bring more money into the household yet still tend to 90% of the child-rearing and household duties, then we should have no conflict whatsoever when I tell him to shut his piehole and go back to sleep the next time he peeks his head around the corner and tells me it's time I go to bed?
Are you in agreement?

Um, are you aware that in Western countries women in the same job as a man only earn 2/3 what the man does? Take a look at this site for more information on inequality.

http://www.geocities.com/Paris/2159/anrfem.html

Does this perceived lower wage take into account the fact that women often work fewer hours than men? I did not look at your provided link (for one, I'm going to bed soon, and for another, I despise Geocities sites and don't want to deal with one tonight, heh) so if that takes note of this then please feel free to tell me so.

I'm pretty sure it does, because there was recently a scandal involving several large companies, including Merrill Lynch and sexism. Women were routinely harassed and are only paid roughly 2/3... This story was in the Sydney Morning Herald if you want to look into it. I'm assuming this took hours into account, and anyway, in full time professional jobs men and women generally work the same hours.

It's also worth taking a look at the list comparing the jobs women did in the past, and do today. There isn't much difference! Women are still trapped in this role created by society.

Can someone post some links to a few of the demeaning posts in question?

I'm intrigued by this but not looking forward to the muck wading to find supporting posts. It's odd, you are a mod on a forum for a while and immediately you either want to see all the ill behavior ever brought up, or want to completely forget people like that exist.

If it is what I'm thinking (which is a general disrepectful tone when talking about women), my preset advice to victims of disrepectful name-calling is:

You have to assume that any individual you "meet" on the internet has not attained the mental maturity required for such a complex task as...making a logical hop...much less a leap. So they will gladly perpetuate their idiocy whether or not they are proven wrong.

If they think like children and act like children, treat them like children. They probably are and if they are not, they deserve it. Keeping a calm tone while speaking is the easiest way to unnerve an opponent, it shows control. Text is no different. Showing no sign of an emotional reaction (this is no frantic questions, no all-caps typing, no exclamation marks), makes an aggressor feel impotent. They'll likely attack more savagely but their pride is hurt and that is where the battle lies. The more viciously they attack and the more disrepectful they become, the more in need of affirmation they are.

Gotta be really careful though, everyone speaks a different version of any given language so often definitions and ideas do not line up perfectly from person to person and good intentions are overlooked by those who are actively seeking a problem. Don't sacrifice an innocent to fabricate your own demons when there are plenty causing trouble already.

I wish you gals well.

I hope what I put down is useful, if not...well let's just say it isn't the first time I've typed up a heart-felt flop. :p

I've debated with racists, sexists, and homophobes enough by now to notice something.

One of their central arguments is that blacks/women/gays are trying to be better than whites/men/straights.

They have difficulty understanding the concept of equality.

Um, are you aware that in Western countries women in the same job as a man only earn 2/3 what the man does? Take a look at this site for more information on inequality.

http://www.geocities.com/Paris/2159/anrfem.html

Maybe there is less of this stuff in Nordic countries, but it's definitely still around.

And "negrotribes"? Verrry offensive to Africans...
Yep, here in Nordic paradise we earn 3/4 what the men do, in the same job of course.

I've debated with racists, sexists, and homophobes enough by now to notice something.

One of their central arguments is that blacks/women/gays are trying to be better than whites/men/straights.

They have difficulty understanding the concept of equality.

True, but just because you are paranoid doesn't mean no one is out to get you.

Gotta err on the side of caution before throwing labels out as well. As the ornery impatient humans we are, we like to label people quickly and discount everything they say...that's pretty dangerous business.

And some people have difficulty understanding that we are all people and people share the same feelings, thus we are all capable of feeling superior or inferior to another person or group of people for completely baseless reasons and attempting to take action based on those feelings.

When there are crazy people on all sides...equality is a difficult term to define, indeed.

I've debated with racists, sexists, and homophobes enough by now to notice something.

One of their central arguments is that blacks/women/gays are trying to be better than whites/men/straights.

They have difficulty understanding the concept of equality.
True, but just because you are paranoid doesn't mean no one is out to get you.

Gotta err on the side of caution before throwing labels out as well. As the ornery impatient humans we are, we like to label people quickly and discount everything they say...that's pretty dangerous business.

And some people have difficulty understanding that we are all people and people share the same feelings, thus we are all capable of feeling superior or inferior to another person or group of people for completely baseless reasons and attempting to take action based on those feelings.

When there are crazy people on all sides...equality is a difficult term to define, indeed.

Here's an example:

misogyny is a buzzword used to silence any who want women to act feminine, much like "racist" is a buzzword used to silence any who don't want black on white crime being the epidemic that it is. "xenophobe" is the buzzword to any who won't hand their nation over to the boat people. "Homophobe" is the word used to silence any who won't bend over for the gay parade.

Maybe you've seen this person's other posts...

Maybe you've seen this person's other posts...

Not a grand number of them, I'd be more interested in seeing his reasoning for the way he thinks. What ends up on electronic paper means nothing until you know a person's motivations.

Truth be told those words are used a bit more often than they should be, I know I've seen it. Occasionally they are abused much in the manner he described. I myself have been called a racist, and a sexist at odd times during my life. They are each really convenient labels with a well established stigma for those who do not wish to become graphic with their insults and are having trouble hammering their point of view home.

I'm not saying that you are incorrect with your assumptions, just that I have not made up my mind as I don't have enough information to throw a label on this fellow and I feel it would be a great injustice to myself to get trigger happy. So naturally I only advise to be careful...that's all I can do with a clear concience. Just try not to let what you want a person to be affect who you think the person is. It's always easier to jump blindly onto a bandwagon than to inspect 'em for potential hazards.

Occasionally they are abused much in the manner he described.
Absolutely, but considering this was what the person complaining about being so labled had posted
"liberated women" are nothing more than abnormal whores who have either too much testosterone or too little estrogen,
I dont think that the label was being misused on this particular occasion... ;)

Heh. It's funny, Jim, because that's the kind of talk that gets men laid on a regular basis, whether they mean it or not. Oh the irony. ;)

It does?!?

*writes in book*

:D

I've debated with racists, sexists, and homophobes enough by now to notice something.

One of their central arguments is that blacks/women/gays are trying to be better than whites/men/straights.

They have difficulty understanding the concept of equality.

Sorry to throw a spanner in the works but figuratively speaking everyone is a sexist/homo(or hetero)phobe/racist simply because of the idea of perception and sterotypes...

As for doors, I try to always let women go first etc... it's just the way I've been brought up. Also, holding them is just normal and polite I find... but then again i've had a few I'm going to kill you stares in my time... fortunately my fiance thinks it's rather a 'cute' habit...

Also, gals bear in mind many of your sex actually let you down by conforming to stereotypes and/or just going after rich husbands so they don't have to do sod all in their lives... etc. As they say everybody remebers the bad things and nobody remebers the good... :)

Incidentaly, i've debated enough times on enough topics to realise most people debate on the basis of societical/personal morality, and they try and apply that morality to the environment around them. Thus creating conflict, which is good and nessacary :)

If women have free will and can enter into relationships in good faith, with knowledge of their expected role, then we have no conflict whatsoever. The conflict between traditionalism and feminism is not one that requires the dissolution of one or the other philosophies...

Free will means that people can choose to follow their own paths and define thier own roles. Equality means that there are no "expected roles" for people based on factors such as gender or ethnicity.

B U M P.

Just because I am amused.

Why the disrespect? (http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=366604)

This is the main one.

i made that one to target all the threads that were going on at the time, there was one about highschool or something where apparantly every girl in public schools is a whore, there was an abortion thread where any woman who doesn't want to get pregnant but has sex anyways is a whore et c.

then my thread became a lightening rod for all that shit. :(

What's wrong with being a feminist?
Nothing. I just trying to explain that not all women are feminists - hell, I am a moderate one; I just don't call myself one. I just believe in equal rights. ^_^

Meh. Some of us are *Nice guys* We are a dying breed. I try to be a gentleman and hold a door for you, what will be your response?

say thank you and then get the inner door for you since usually there are two of them.

and also: to be a feminist means that you believe in equality of the sexes, it doesn't mean that you believe women are better.

As for doors, I try to always let women go first etc... it's just the way I've been brought up. Also, holding them is just normal and polite I find... but then again i've had a few I'm going to kill you stares in my time... fortunately my fiance thinks it's rather a 'cute' habit...
I'm picking this to comment on because it is a good point.

I don't think there is a problem with men holding doors for women, until they believe that you are assuming that they aren't equal. I can cite two examples here... When my ex held the door for me, he would deliberately step ahead of me and do it, whereas my current boyfriend - who's a mega sweetie and I won't trade in - will only do it if I haven't already got the door. If it's a mutual thing, it's not such a big deal.

Holding the door in general is a respectful thing to do. But, I think if a guy does it when he pointedly moves ahead of the female, I think it is taken the otherway by the female...

and also: to be a feminist means that you believe in equality of the sexes, it doesn't mean that you believe women are better.

Generally that's the case. I'm a feminist too, BTW. A male who's willing to say he's a feminist.

Although interestingly there are radical feminist groups out there who think women should rule over men, or just disenfranchise men for a while so they can see how it feels.

say thank you and then get the inner door for you since usually there are two of them.

and also: to be a feminist means that you believe in equality of the sexes, it doesn't mean that you believe women are better.

*at the risk of being "cute" there are usually Two. Me and my other half.

I appreciate women for all that they are. Strong, weak, wanting and giving..

Everything that you may be and are.

Someday I will have a daughter, and will smile and cry when she gets married.

The truth of the matter is (at least my theory of it) is you will usually notice that the adult men don't belittle the women/girls on this forum, it's the punk ass teenagers and no, not all of them. But you can't really blame them too much, they wouldn't know what to do with a woman if their life depended on it. So it's like throwing a snowball.. they don't know how to express their feelings and emotions yet, being just kids and all, so they act like jerks. Of course this is not true of all teenage boys, I know some on this site that are quite nice. Then of course you will always have your Ape Alpha male who is strong like bull and smart like tractor!

I've noticed that there are couple of slightly offensive threads that have popped up that basically have belittling comments about us.

Where?? Want me to "take out" the posters for ya? I'll go get "Guido" and we'll do the job right! Mwahahahahaha! :D

Steph:

The definition of Adult Male is that he realizes that a woman is somewhat different, hence the attraction.

*not hitting on you, just learning this new married thing*

*smile*

I've debated with racists, sexists, and homophobes enough by now to notice something.

One of their central arguments is that blacks/women/gays are trying to be better than whites/men/straights.

They have difficulty understanding the concept of equality.

Hem.

"A woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle."

Find me one single (straight) man who thinks women serve absolutely no purpose at all.

I'm not saying any particular person or group of people feel this way; I'm just saying there's a reason people think they want something more than equality.

The truth of the matter is (at least my theory of it) is you will usually notice that the adult men don't belittle the women/girls on this forum, it's the punk ass teenagers and no, not all of them. But you can't really blame them too much, they wouldn't know what to do with a woman if their life depended on it. So it's like throwing a snowball.. they don't know how to express their feelings and emotions yet, being just kids and all, so they act like jerks. Of course this is not true of all teenage boys, I know some on this site that are quite nice. Then of course you will always have your Ape Alpha male who is strong like bull and smart like tractor!

You'll also find that the vast majority of radical feminists who give equal rights a bad name are punk ass teenage girls. Generally we all grow up and learn to be nice to one another.

You'll also find that the vast majority of radical feminists who give equal rights a bad name are punk ass teenage girls. Generally we all grow up and learn to be nice to one another.

I wouldn't disagree per se with this.. although girls do tend to be a little different in their teen years then boys. My feeling is that men and women are equal but different. Both genders have their pros and cons.. however teenage boys are not quite the same as teenage girls. However there are exceptions to every rule.

I'm picking this to comment on because it is a good point.

I don't think there is a problem with men holding doors for women, until they believe that you are assuming that they aren't equal. I can cite two examples here... When my ex held the door for me, he would deliberately step ahead of me and do it, whereas my current boyfriend - who's a mega sweetie and I won't trade in - will only do it if I haven't already got the door. If it's a mutual thing, it's not such a big deal.

Holding the door in general is a respectful thing to do. But, I think if a guy does it when he pointedly moves ahead of the female, I think it is taken the otherway by the female...

What if you're a guy who walks a bit ahead to hold the door open for everyone, not just girls?

Teenage boys: too much testosterone *sp?*

girls: estrogen.

Hmm hormones.

Thats why there are males and females.

Bah, "nice guys" are not a dying breed. Metrosexuals anyone? They're breeding like goddam bacteria.

(This was relevant to the thread. Really.)

Bah, "nice guys" are not a dying breed. Metrosexuals anyone? They're breeding like goddam bacteria.

(This was relevant to the thread. Really.)

Metrosexuals =/= nice by default.

I've met some really nasty ones...but then again, as I've stated before, I have bad luck when it comes to meeting people :p

I didn't mean nice, I meant "nice." "Metrosexuals" are "nice."

I didn't mean nice, I meant "nice." "Metrosexuals" are "nice."

.....

You so lost me.

I tried to breed nice guys.
But I ended up with Orcs.
So much for taking Sauron's advice...

Hem.

"A woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle."

Find me one single (straight) man who thinks women serve absolutely no purpose at all.

I'm not saying any particular person or group of people feel this way; I'm just saying there's a reason people think they want something more than equality.

well, women don't necessarily need men any more than men need women. the thing is if you've ever read a teen girl magazine, they're usually about how to get a guy, how to keep a guy et c. women are taught from a young age to need men. however, we can be prefectly alright on our own. in fact, i think everyone should be on their own for a while before engaging in a lifelong commitment... if only to get to know themselves better, what they are capable of as an individual, that they don't need another person to help them get by in life. that they can do it all on their own.

this doesn't mean that things aren't better when you have someone to share your time/life with. far from it.

I'm sure that if all the women in the world withheld sex for one day, though, that there would be an awful lot of frustrated men with entitlement issues running around.

You are Lysistrata (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysistrata), and I claim my five pounds.

You are Lysistrata (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysistrata), and I claim my five pounds.

Brekekex koax koax.
Koax koax koax.
We think that Aristophanes
Is a very good laugh indeed.
A lyrical clown
To bring Euripides down.
Although he's a bit hard at times.

Brekekex koax koax.
Koax koax koax.


Hush now, little froggy, and back to the matter at hand.

Hush now, little froggy, and back to the matter at hand.

Alright then.
I am a liberal masculinist; I believe that men and women are equal but different.
I also think that 'feminism' means the belief that women are superior and as such associate it with whacked out lesbians (not all lesbians, just the whacked out ones) and that women who just believe men and women are equal are simply being sensible.

Can I have an apricot?

Alright then.
I am a liberal masculinist; I believe that men and women are equal but different.
I also think that 'feminism' means the belief that women are superior and as such associate it with whacked out lesbians (not all lesbians, just the whacked out ones) and that women who just believe men and women are equal are simply being sensible.

So, by your definitions, to be a 'masculinist' is to believe in equality, but difference, whereas to be a 'feminist' is to believe in superiority?

Can I have an apricot?

No.
Buzz off.
:p

Two Aristophanes references in as many posts.
:D

So, by your definitions, to be a 'masculinist' is to believe in equality, but difference, whereas to be a 'feminist' is to believe in superiority?

Nah, I don't label things like that.
It was just combining two of my favourite sayings on 'feminism' into one post.
I agree it didn't appear to make sense, but I generally use them seperately and couldn't be bothered to this time.

We are not whores, and just because we are liberated doesn't mean we are feminists. We are humans too; we were all created equal.
*agrees*

I see nothing wrong with men and women being equals.


Do you think feminism could be summed up with this quote (which I kinda paraphrased):
"All are created equal but some are more equal" <- (which makes no sense)

*agrees*

I see nothing wrong with men and women being equals.


Do you think feminism could be summed up with this quote (which I kinda paraphrased):
"All are created equal but some are more equal" <- (which makes no sense)

You can't be more or less equal.
'Equal but different' makes most sense.
Not to be confused with 'equal but seperate', which means and relates to something entirely different.

You can't be more or less equal.
I know; I just felt like using a quote from Animal Farm

You are Lysistrata (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysistrata), and I claim my five pounds.

HAH! Someone got the reference! Way to go with the classical education. :)

Actually, I like that play, and I think it holds some relelvance to the way things are today.

HAH! Someone got the reference! Way to go with the classical education. :)

Actually, I like that play, and I think it holds some relelvance to the way things are today.

Where's my accolade for also knowing about Aristophanes?
:mad:

Just remember boys and girls.. the hand that rocks the cradle does indeed rule the world. :cool:

Where's my accolade for also knowing about Aristophanes?
:mad:

Okay, have a pres-Socratic cookie. It may be somewhat stale.

Okay, have a pres-Socratic cookie. It may be somewhat stale.

Damn straight.
In the words of Plato, 'all I ever had, is Redemption Songs'.

Where's my accolade for also knowing about Aristophanes?
:mad:

Ok, so I quoted Bodies Without Organs, but I meant everyone who got it. You get a gold star, my friend. ;)

Ok, so I quoted Bodies Without Organs, but I meant everyone who got it. You get a gold star, my friend. ;)

Woohoo, gold star.
:D

In the words of Plato, 'all I ever had, is Redemption Songs'.

Ah, yes, but was it not Heraclitus that said 'No Woman, No Cry'?

I've noticed that there are couple of slightly offensive threads that have popped up that basically have belittling comments about us. I think we ought to ban together and counter the enemy with out witty wisdom.

We are not whores, and just because we are liberated doesn't mean we are feminists. We are humans too; we were all created equal.


Yeah, all feminazis want is to:

1) Become useless soccer moms that just go on and on about your little special adhd kid and how great he is. Marry a lawyer and get plastic surgery.
Then become a bitchy old woman, with bad implants, and a disgusting face-lift.

2) Become a whore, marry a dozen times. Preach "family values,"(much like Rush Limbaugh.) Become a Christian, and bug the hell out of everyone. Then have a bunch of little basterds, that we have to pay for.

3) Become a "career woman." Sue your boss for sexual harrassment or discrimination,(which he didn't actually do) and become a rich little cubicle slut.

Ah, yes, but was it not Heraclitus that said 'No Woman, No Cry'?

Yes, but Aeschylus stated 'every day we pay the price with a little sacrifice, jamming till the jam is through.'

Yeah, all feminazis want is to:

1) Become useless soccer moms that just go on and on about your little special adhd kid and how great he is. Marry a lawyer and get plastic surgery.
Then become a bitchy old woman, with bad implants, and a disgusting face-lift.

2) Become a whore, marry a dozen times. Preach "family values,"(much like Rush Limbaugh.) Become a Christian, and bug the hell out of everyone. Then have a bunch of little basterds, that we have to pay for.

3) Become a "career woman." Sue your boss for sexual harrassment or discrimination,(which he didn't actually do) and become a rich little cubicle slut.

you really are an idiot, aren't you?

I've debated with racists, sexists, and homophobes enough by now to notice something.

One of their central arguments is that blacks/women/gays are trying to be better than whites/men/straights.Mmmm, projection. Though with blacks it tends to be more a charge that they're trying to take advantage of whites. Now with antisemitism, there are some raging inferiority complexes.

Yeah, all feminazis want is to:

1) Become useless soccer moms that just go on and on about your little special adhd kid and how great he is. Marry a lawyer and get plastic surgery.
Then become a bitchy old woman, with bad implants, and a disgusting face-lift.

2) Become a whore, marry a dozen times. Preach "family values,"(much like Rush Limbaugh.) Become a Christian, and bug the hell out of everyone. Then have a bunch of little basterds, that we have to pay for.

3) Become a "career woman." Sue your boss for sexual harrassment or discrimination,(which he didn't actually do) and become a rich little cubicle slut.

Which category does your mother fit into?

Yeah, all feminazis want is to:

1) Become useless soccer moms that just go on and on about your little special adhd kid and how great he is. Marry a lawyer and get plastic surgery.
Then become a bitchy old woman, with bad implants, and a disgusting face-lift.

2) Become a whore, marry a dozen times. Preach "family values,"(much like Rush Limbaugh.) Become a Christian, and bug the hell out of everyone. Then have a bunch of little basterds, that we have to pay for.

3) Become a "career woman." Sue your boss for sexual harrassment or discrimination,(which he didn't actually do) and become a rich little cubicle slut.

Wow, someone was turned down a bit much in the younger years, eh? Bitter much?

Wow, someone was turned down a bit much in the younger years, eh? Bitter much?

You know, I'd respect this Alansyists chap a bit more if he actually bothered to go and do some research - is hunting down a copy of the SCUM Manifesto too much to ask?

Wow, someone was turned down a bit much in the younger years, eh? Bitter much?

Uh, I'm 13. Their hasn't been much time for me to be "turned-down"

Uh, I'm 13. Their hasn't been much time for me to be "turned-down"

Wow. What's a 13 year old doing using the words "whore" and "rich little cubicle slut"? *sigh* The young these days... :(

you know what we need? Threads that are offensive to scumy teenagers.
:)

I DO NOT HATE WOMEN! So read this:

Why is it you want equal treatment but if a woman offends a man and the man hits her like he would if a man offended him, why is it known as woman beating?! Equal treatment you want. I'm not saying it's right, but come on, it seems woman get special treatment still.

Why won't you pay for dinner?

Why is it that a man that does dirty jokes with men and then does one to a woman, it's considered sexual harrassment?

Now, I don't hate woman, but the day that a woman pays for dinner on a date and we can allowed to hit a woman as a joke (you know manly jokes of hitting each other, no woman beating) that is when we are truly equal. Until then, women will be using the whip to control men.

(You can tell I haven't read the thread. Yes this might be flamebait, but I am tired of the special treatment women get. Equal treatment my ass, more like special treatment.)

Flame avay!

you know what we need? Threads that are offensive to scumy teenagers.
:)

Maybe us elders should get together and start telling them about how we all saw their favourite bands back in the late 80s and early 90s before they started to suck.

Which category does your mother fit into?

I'm curious as to the answer to this question.

I DO NOT HATE WOMEN! So read this:

Why is it you want equal treatment but if a woman offends a man and the man hits her like he would if a man offended him, why is it known as woman beating?! Equal treatment you want. I'm not saying it's right, but come on, it seems woman get special treatment still.

Why won't you pay for dinner?

Why is it that a man that does dirty jokes with men and then does one to a woman, it's considered sexual harrassment?

Now, I don't hate woman, but the day that a woman pays for dinner on a date and we can allowed to hit a woman as a joke (you know manly jokes of hitting each other, no woman beating) that is when we are truly equal. Until then, women will be using the whip to control men.

(You can tell I haven't read the thread. Yes this might be flamebait, but I am tired of the special treatment women get. Equal treatment my ass, more like special treatment.)

Flame avay!

First off, who the hell hits someone because they are offended? It's called conflict resolution, buddy. It's wrong to hit somebody be it male or female. The only good time to hit someone is in self-defense, and yes I, as a woman, think it's okay to defend yourself against a woman who is hitting you.

Next, paying for dinner is the polite thing for a guy to do. Same with opening a door. It's just polite. Chill. Girls gotta be polite, too.

Finally, dirty jokes. Again, it's called being polite in "mixed company", though, personally, I believe anything a friend of mine can say to a guy friend, he can say to me, too. That's more of a "how easily offended are you?" thing. Don't tell a sex joke to a fogey who'd get offended by it, 'cause then, technically, it is sexual harrasment. But if you tell a raunchy joke to a chick after she'd been tellin' 'em herself, she's got no room to complain.

That being said, where's the special treatment? Of course, this may just be my own little world, and were you live, there still is special treatment going on with woman. I don't know what your country / culture / world is like.

Maybe it's because I'm not on as often, and because people rarely respond to my posts (no bitterness here, just observing) but I do not see much for threads that belittle women, save the 'women slaves' one that still creeps me out. Sure, there's some nastiness on occasion, but not as much as the topic starter seems to think.

Seriously, a lot of the people on here impress me, both male and female. I've been on many forums, but this one is, as a whole, one of the most intelligent groups of people I've dealt with. Even this topic itself...with some of it's harsh arguments, is still pretty coherent.

- Asylum Nova

PS: Yes, I am female.

I like in the polictically correct world of the U.S. of A.

And sorry for the spouting, I'm very bitter... so let me summarize.

When women are treated like men, that's when we have true equal treatment.

Also, special treatment:

In a rape case, the women is usually listened too, not the man. I mean, maybe the women is lying?

Divorce, the women usually gets more out of it.

I will be honest, maybe it a hallucination of mine. Who knows, either way, I'm nuts. Bah...

((Now people will think I'm a womanbeating whore. Oy... or worse, a Republican, *shrug*))

Either way.... women these days have more advantages over men IMO. And I apologize for the I acted, I just don't want to be accused of anything in advance >_> <_<

I will now leave this thread, for I hate General and I like to read more then post here... bye! And God bless!

lol. I'd respond, but he's left, so there's no point. :rolleyes:

Actually, since someone brought it up, on the subject of paying for the meal: I usually pay regardless of who my company is, because I have a job, and thus can afford it :p. But, if she wants to, then buy all means we'll split it.

As for holding the door open...I do that for everyone, so I don't think people'll get too pissy towards me :p

Ah...the difference between women and men...

Women are cunning, men are generally stupid and will do anything for the possibility of getting laid.

Women are emotional, men are horny bastards (mostly).

Womens' only weakness is men.

Stupid cycle isn't it?
And for all you "All y'all women should be in the kitchen baking and popping out babies" shut up and go hide in the corner of the circle.

Also, stop dissing us emotional, hormonal, insane teens! You know it was the best time of your life... :D

Actually, since someone brought it up, on the subject of paying for the meal: I usually pay regardless of who my company is, because I have a job, and thus can afford it :p. But, if she wants to, then buy all means we'll split it.

As for holding the door open...I do that for everyone, so I don't think people'll get too pissy towards me :p

lol. I can remember the first time someone opened a door for me. He was a stranger leaving a resteraunt and I was going in and he held it open for me. I was so surprised I just stood there for a second. Then I realized what he was doing and said thank you very heartfully and walked in.

I've been holding doors open ever since.

My boyfriend was the first boyfriend I had who would open doors for me. He prefers to be the one who opens the door, or if I do, he'll take over so I walk in before him. It's taken a while to get used to, but it's not a bad thing.

It's like being complimented - a gesture of kindness and respect. I don't understand why some women would glare or get upset about it. I think that stranger at the resteraunt restored my faith in humanity. (He had to have had some impact on me since I remember him still after all these years. lol)

Wow. What's a 13 year old doing using the words "whore" and "rich little cubicle slut"? *sigh* The young these days... :(


We aren't living in "Leave it to Beaver." My god children have never been "pure" or "clean." We've always been flithy little basterds. So don't go preaching JERRRY FALWELL. I knew it was you. You and the insidous Ku Klux Klan. ;)

We aren't living in "Leave it to Beaver." My god children have never been "pure" or "clean." We've always been flithy little basterds. So don't go preaching JERRRY FALWELL. I knew it was you. You and the insidous Ku Klux Klan. ;)

Dude, I'm older than you and my mouth is cleaner than yours. When I was 13, God... Shit, damn, these were all filthy, filthy words. I think I had a heart attack the first time I heard my friend say "fuck". And only the incredibly immature kids of middle school ever used curse words on a regular basis, and that only made them sound stupider and more immature.

Dude, I'm older than you and my mouth is cleaner than yours. When I was 13, God... Shit, damn, these were all filthy, filthy words. I think I had a heart attack the first time I heard my friend say "fuck". And only the incredibly immature kids of middle school ever used curse words on a regular basis, and that only made them sound stupider and more immature.


Where do you live? The midwest? Children I've known started swearing in grade five. Eitheir that or you're homeschooled.

And I suppose you're going to say that you didn't learn about sex until you were 43? And you didn't have sex until you were married?

Please, you "Christian Conservatives" are the flithest sex-maniacs I've ever met.

Haven't you ever played a sport in your life? Or been in the gym locker-room? I don't believe a single hypocritical word you said.

Don't pretend your "clean." Becuase you aren't.

lol. I'd respond, but he's left, so there's no point. :rolleyes:

Actually, I'm still here. I just hate debates :)

Analysists: No flaming!

Where do you live? The midwest? Children I've known started swearing in grade five. Eitheir that or you're homeschooled.

And I suppose you're going to say that you didn't learn about sex until you were 43? And you didn't have sex until you were married?

Please, you "Christian Conservatives" are the flithest sex-maniacs I've ever met.

Haven't you ever played a sport in your life? Or been in the gym locker-room? I don't believe a single hypocritical word you said.

Don't pretend your "clean." Becuase you aren't.

Wow, I don't even know where half of that came from. Who said anything about being a "christian conservative?"


I actually don't curse much at all, flat out. I actually usually ONLY curse here :p. The only other time I'll let a word go out is at work, but since I AM the pizza bitch, it's more then allowed :p

Where do you live? The midwest? Children I've known started swearing in grade five.

I had heard all of the common curse words by the time I was in 2nd Grade. And I'm 20. Hell, I've heard 3 year olds using those terms.

Maybe things were actually pretty good if the earliest you had experieced that was 5th grade.

Yes, but unfortunatly-and it may just be me having horrid luck with women-but from what I've seen most girls want a guy who isn't nice so they can change him.

And then he doesn't change.

And then she goes to her friend to complain.

And he doesn't want to say "Bloody hell, why not try going for a NICE guy?!"




Not at all. There's me, for example :p
well, goed, there IS a certain type of woman who only likes bad boys. these tend to be the women who are addicted to DRAMA. they love the emotional highs and lows associated with being with men who abuse them.

these women will make your life hell. avoid them.

there are plenty of nice calm women out there who like a man who treats them right. don't waste yourself trying to attract women who dont want a good man.

well, goed, there IS a certain type of woman who only likes bad boys. these tend to be the women who are addicted to DRAMA. they love the emotional highs and lows associated with being with men who abuse them.

these women will make your life hell. avoid them.

there are plenty of nice calm women out there who like a man who treats them right. don't waste yourself trying to attract women who dont want a good man.

Yeah, but see, I have nasty, evil luck. I'm positive women like that are out there-I just never meet them :p

Yeah, but see, I have nasty, evil luck. I'm positive women like that are out there-I just never meet them :p
she's the quiet one who it takes a while to notice.

Yeah, but see, I have nasty, evil luck. I'm positive women like that are out there-I just never meet them :p

Maybe because you're too busy staring at boobs.

Just kidding.

By the way what is it with men and boobs? Jesus, they're just BOOBS. In most cultures they aren't regarded in a sexual way at all, they're just like any other part of one's body.

Why is it you want equal treatment but if a woman offends a man and the man hits her like he would if a man offended him, why is it known as woman beating?! Equal treatment you want. I'm not saying it's right, but come on, it seems woman get special treatment still.

Why won't you pay for dinner?

Why is it that a man that does dirty jokes with men and then does one to a woman, it's considered sexual harrassment?

Now, I don't hate woman, but the day that a woman pays for dinner on a date and we can allowed to hit a woman as a joke (you know manly jokes of hitting each other, no woman beating) that is when we are truly equal. Until then, women will be using the whip to control men.

(You can tell I haven't read the thread. Yes this might be flamebait, but I am tired of the special treatment women get. Equal treatment my ass, more like special treatment.)

Flame avay!

1) What you are talking about is assault. Whether you're a guy or a girl, you have zero right to slap or punch someone except in self defense. Frustration is not self defense, and a woman who slugs a guy deserves to have her butt handed to her as much as a guy hitting a woman deserves to have his butt handed to him.

2) I do pay for dinner, half of the time. It's called being in a relationship. You share things.

3) One ought not to tell dirty jokes unless one is VERY sure of the company; it's best to leave them for bars and friends and not in places of business.

Maybe because you're too busy staring at boobs.

Just kidding.

By the way what is it with men and boobs? Jesus, they're just BOOBS. In most cultures they aren't regarded in a sexual way at all, they're just like any other part of one's body.

You just made that comment to the wrong guy :p

Honestly, if there's one thing I pay more attention to then anything else, it's the face.

Please, I couldn't care less about breast size.



As for guys and boobs...hell, I dunno. I've heard plenty of girls talk on and on about guys' chests in this dreamy voice, so it goes both ways :p

she's the quiet one who it takes a while to notice.
You mean the one that either a) has a boyfriend or b) completely and totally ignores everything and everyone around her-including me? :p

You mean the one that either a) has a boyfriend or b) completely and totally ignores everything and everyone around her-including me? :p
thats the one!

Where do you live? The midwest?
Florida, but I've spent my childhood in Maine, California, Michigan, Florida, and Italy.

Children I've known started swearing in grade five. Eitheir that or you're homeschooled.
Public schooling since kindergarten.

And I suppose you're going to say that you didn't learn about sex until you were 43? And you didn't have sex until you were married?
That's none of your business, lol.

Please, you "Christian Conservatives" are the flithest sex-maniacs I've ever met.
I'm atheist.

Haven't you ever played a sport in your life?
Softball. Flag football. A little basketball but I hated it. And a litte archery.

Or been in the gym locker-room?
All three years of middle school and two years in high school.

I don't believe a single hypocritical word you said.
It's not hypocritical.

Don't pretend your "clean." Becuase you aren't.
Oh, well, that's good that you know me. You know, since you've never seen my face before. I needed someone to tell me about myself for a long time now.

I do curse, but not a lot. I keep it to a minimum and don't make it a major section of my language. And I've used the word "slut" once this whole year. I can atest to that.

You're pretty snotty for a 13 year old.

What if you're a guy who walks a bit ahead to hold the door open for everyone, not just girls?I do that. I've never noticed any glares, but that may have more to do with my general state of obliviousness than any lack thereof.

We aren't living in "Leave it to Beaver." My god children have never been "pure" or "clean."Using "fuck" as punctuation is merely silly and lame. But using slurs like "whore" or "slut", that's not cool. I use profanity on occasion myself, but never "whore" or "slut". I am very much opposed to denigrating people because they (presumably) have sex.

You're pretty snotty for a 13 year old.

...13 year olds ARE snotty. They might be nice, they might not curse, but SOMEHOW, they're still snotty. Always :p.

Look, I like to inject profanity in internet forums just to tick off conservatives.
I love to see them so angry. Banging away at their little keyboard, becuase they got it in the ass by their priest. Hahahahaha. Conservatives are the biggest perverts around. So are the "moralists."

**** Jerry Falwell, and his little nazi butt-buddies.

Look, I like to inject profanity in internet forums just to tick off conservatives.

What you have failed to grasp is the difference between profanity (frex - fuck), and demeaning language (frex - slut).

Okay, I guess I'll reply then...

I like in the polictically correct world of the U.S. of A.
Me too, so we're talking about the same culture and government.
And sorry for the spouting, I'm very bitter... so let me summarize.

When women are treated like men, that's when we have true equal treatment.

Also, special treatment:

In a rape case, the women is usually listened too, not the man. I mean, maybe the women is lying?
It's not just taking the woman's word over the man's. When a woman is raped she had to go to the hopital right away. They have rape kits and stuff that can discern wether or not she was raped. Don't ask me how, I'm not a doctor. But they can find physical proof and stuff.
Divorce, the women usually gets more out of it.
This may have been the truth several years ago, but I feel the trend is changing, if not already changed.
I will be honest, maybe it a hallucination of mine. Who knows, either way, I'm nuts. Bah...

((Now people will think I'm a womanbeating whore. Oy... or worse, a Republican, *shrug*))

Either way.... women these days have more advantages over men IMO. And I apologize for the I acted, I just don't want to be accused of anything in advance >_> <_<

I will now leave this thread, for I hate General and I like to read more then post here... bye! And God bless!
I'd say the only way that women have it 'better' than men is in the case of affirmative action, which I find offensive to all minorities. If I get a job, or get accepted into college, or get anything like that, I want it to be on my own merit, not because of the circumstances I was born into, be it gender, race, or what ever.

I recognize your argument, but feel that it is better suited for the nineties. I feel it no longer applies to the present. I also maintain the idea of "equal but different." It's okay to be polite to a girl because she's a girl, but that doesn't mean she'd not still equal. Like, you shake a girl's hand differently, those sorts of things. Equal - you shake everyone's hand - but different - it's gentler for the girl, and you hold the hand differently.

Those are my views and opinions.

Look, I like to inject profanity in internet forums just to tick off conservatives.
I love to see them so angry. Banging away at their little keyboard, becuase they got it in the ass by their priest. Hahahahaha. Conservatives are the biggest perverts around. So are the "moralists."

**** Jerry Falwell, and his little nazi butt-buddies.

You have been warned before for your flaming twice before. Knock it off, because there will not be another warning. Once more, and there will be a ban.

...13 year olds ARE snotty. They might be nice, they might not curse, but SOMEHOW, they're still snotty. Always :p.

lol Makes me want to apologize to my parents. :D

What you have failed to grasp is the difference between profanity (frex - fuck), and demeaning language (frex - slut).

Thank you.

And Alansyists, I was never trying to insult you, if you took anything that I said personally. You just need to chill, and stop with the foul language. Like so many others have said, it's demeaning, and it's just plain silly and pointless. Chill, dude.

women were made to clean and cook. thats all. there is no other purpose for them except for sex. women just want the penis. thats why they wanted the rights to begin with. penis envy. so shut up and make a man a sandwich you penis-less, floor-washing maidens!

women were made to clean and cook. thats all. there is no other purpose for them except for sex. women just want the penis. thats why they wanted the rights to begin with. penis envy. so shut up and make a man a sandwich you penis-less, floor-washing maidens!

You kidding?

If I was female, I'd be such a lesbian.

Honestly, the clitorious is far superior then the penis.

I think you've just got a small one and are afraid of women laughing at you :D

women were made to clean and cook. thats all. there is no other purpose for them except for sex. women just want the penis. thats why they wanted the rights to begin with. penis envy. so shut up and make a man a sandwich you penis-less, floor-washing maidens!

Yes, I crave that wobbly ugly thing that can't control itself between your legs.

You kidding?

If I was female, I'd be such a lesbian.

Honestly, the clitorious is far superior then the penis.

I think you've just got a small one and are afraid of women laughing at you :D

I WISH I were a lesbian. That way I wouldn't have to deal with all this man crap.

women were made to clean and cook. thats all. there is no other purpose for them except for sex. women just want the penis. thats why they wanted the rights to begin with. penis envy. so shut up and make a man a sandwich you penis-less, floor-washing maidens!

I think he's just playing the devil's advocate. :confused:

Honestly, the clitorious is far superior then the penis.


What is this 'clitorious' of which you speak?

I DO NOT HATE WOMEN! So read this:

Why is it you want equal treatment but if a woman offends a man and the man hits her like he would if a man offended him, why is it known as woman beating?! Equal treatment you want. I'm not saying it's right, but come on, it seems woman get special treatment still.

Why won't you pay for dinner?

Why is it that a man that does dirty jokes with men and then does one to a woman, it's considered sexual harrassment?

Now, I don't hate woman, but the day that a woman pays for dinner on a date and we can allowed to hit a woman as a joke (you know manly jokes of hitting each other, no woman beating) that is when we are truly equal. Until then, women will be using the whip to control men.

(You can tell I haven't read the thread. Yes this might be flamebait, but I am tired of the special treatment women get. Equal treatment my ass, more like special treatment.)

Flame avay!


umm... well, i always offer to pay for dinner unless i'm flat broke and it's specefied beforehand that it's his treat. i've hit and been hit in return, playful punches of course, and uh yeah... the dirtier the joke the better.

what's your point?

What is this 'clitorious' of which you speak?

Bloody hell, I can't spell for crap, ok? :p

What is this 'clitorious' of which you speak?
i think thats how it SHOULD be spelled
makes it so much more like GLORIOUS which is (would be) an extremely appropriate rhyme.

Bloody hell, I can't spell for crap, ok? :p

Isn't "bloody" the english equivalent to "fuck" or "fucking" so that you're actually saying, "Fucking hell, I can't spell for crap, ok?"

(Darn English curse words and slang words... lol)

Isn't "bloody" the english equivalent to "fuck" or "fucking" so that you're actually saying, "Fucking hell, I can't spell for crap, ok?"

(Darn English curse words and slang words... lol)

Pretty much, but I perfer "bloody" over "fucking" :p. Plus, most people don't know it's the equivilant to fuck, and I usually don't like to curse much, so it all fits :p

Pretty much, but I perfer "bloody" over "fucking" :p. Plus, most people don't know it's the equivilant to fuck, and I usually don't like to curse much, so it all fits :p

Oh. Okay. ^_^ I prefer silly ones, like fudgemonkies, or mother of a monkey! But I havn't used those in years. Are you English or European?

Oh. Okay. ^_^ I prefer silly ones, like fudgemonkies, or mother of a monkey! But I havn't used those in years. Are you English or European?

America, but I spell grey with an 'e' (because it just looks like an ugly word with an a) and use "bloody." Still, I'm a born and raised Californian, though I might be able to go to London for a semester next fall or spring.

America, but I spell grey with an 'e' (because it just looks like an ugly word with an a) and use "bloody." Still, I'm a born and raised Californian, though I might be able to go to London for a semester next fall or spring.

lol I have no clue how to spell gray. I always say gray 'cause that's what HTML recognizes. But my mom's last name is Grey or Gray, I can't remember... Bah, it confuses me so bad...

Good luck on the London thing. That'd rock. Makes sense, now, everyone not knowing what "bloody" is.

women were made to clean and cook. thats all. there is no other purpose for them except for sex. women just want the penis. thats why they wanted the rights to begin with. penis envy. so shut up and make a man a sandwich you penis-less, floor-washing maidens!

Not a wise statement to make on a forum where a fair number of the moderation staff with the power the delete you happen to be "penis-less, floor-washing maidens".

See, if women were only meant for sex, we wouldn't have these things called "brains" or "sentience". If we all "just want the penis", there wouldn't be those of us with no interest whatsoever in your silly dangly man-thing. (Which, for the record, makes a VERY useful target when dealing with boorish guys like you.)

From a psychological standpoint, I would have to conclude that you are terrified of women, and so try to compensate for this fear by brandishing an over-the-top macho man act. You talk big online behind a thin veil, but probably don't have the balls to approach a woman in real life and make a similiar statement, because we scare you, we intimidate you, we make you feel like your manhood is miniscule. You want control, and you fear anything that jeopardizes this, including strong-willed women. Thus you attempt (and largely fail) to brow-beat what frightens you into submission, a juvenille tactic that usually ceases to impress anyone older than 13.

~Evil Empress Rep Prod

women just want the penis. thats why they wanted the rights to begin with. penis envy.



Question: if all the women did actually 'want the penis' and got them, exactly what would they do with them?

Now, when you're talking about the phallus (or indeed the phallic symbol, which only represents the possibility of possessing the phallus), that's a whole 'nother kettle of fish.

women were made to clean and cook. thats all. there is no other purpose for them except for sex. women just want the penis. thats why they wanted the rights to begin with. penis envy. so shut up and make a man a sandwich you penis-less, floor-washing maidens!


.....I need my floor washed. Is Thursday convenient for you?

BTW make that a honey ham and white american cheese, lettuce, tomato, on multigrain with a smear of deli mustard.

women were made to clean and cook. thats all. there is no other purpose for them except for sex. women just want the penis. thats why they wanted the rights to begin with. penis envy. so shut up and make a man a sandwich you penis-less, floor-washing maidens!

Why I'm responding to a troll, I don't know, but here goes...

You forgot to mention that women are made to be available for sex on demand and making and caring for babies...ass.

As for wanting to have a penis, I don't mind having one living in my house, although I'd never call him that, because it's not how I think of him, I don't want one attached to me permenently. I like my seperate reproductive and urinary systems, not to mention functioning breasts and nipples. It makes more sense. It's functional, the pinnacle of design and aesthetics. Admit it, women look better naked, and not nearly as ridiculous naked and running, which would only make you look like more of a fool.

why want a penis when you have a clitoris?


twice as many nerve endings crammed into a tiny, little, wonderful organ.

let's not forget multiple orgasms without anal entry, a g-spot and the ability to go again right after you've already finished having sex... oh yeah.

why want a penis when you have a clitoris?


twice as many nerve endings crammed into a tiny, little, wonderful organ.

let's not forget multiple orgasms without anal entry, a g-spot and the ability to go again right after you've already finished having sex... oh yeah.

Hey, I forgot all about the male g-spot being located up his ass. As it happens, Garkle's brains are in there with it.

(a quiet sorry to my fiancee, who is wonderful and not to be grouped in with the misogynists or assholes)

women were made to clean and cook. thats all. there is no other purpose for them except for sex. women just want the penis. thats why they wanted the rights to begin with. penis envy. so shut up and make a man a sandwich you penis-less, floor-washing maidens!
I pity your mother. I can't believe you fell out of her. Too bad she had to go get drunk that night she had sex with your father. Oh, the world would be a much better place if she had been sobre that night.

But, seriously? I wouldn't want a penis. I mean, shit, that's too much work to clean, and it just looks so uncomfortable to have hanging between your legs. And those erections in public? How embarassing.

Not a wise statement to make on a forum where a fair number of the moderation staff with the power the delete you happen to be "penis-less, floor-washing maidens".

All repeat after me... this is what is called PWNED! :cool:

So much to talk about....

Firsty, I hold doors open for other people at random instances. People rarely hold them open for me, so I aspire to lead by example. However at uni there are a lot of people, and I have things to do, so I just make sure Im let a few people through, otherwise id never do anything. Im not a gentleman in the traditional sense. BUt I like to think I treat all people with the respect they want. This is rarely observed, so I can understand why the gentleman breed is dying out. Treating a woman with respect is not as effective as getting her drunk and throwing yourself at her until she is too drunk to care and gives in. Nothing comes of it, bar the guys who actually like whatever woman it is getting no where.

A lot of us guys dont know the difference between women and sex dolls. But equality and all. Its a two way thing and there are plenty of equally shallow women there too.

Okay, women and men should be equal. We have roughly equal rights, but men AND women are holding women back in careers. Its not just the men who discriminate. Oh no. I think with time this will change, all that is needed is that we check we arent moving backwards and things will fix over time. I dont think you can force things without them messing up.

Next up. Im single and bitter and dont get laid, dont give us losers a bad name. I have respect for women, for instance, My housemate is more intellegent, and talented than me, and better looking. She has a good sexual ethic and her only weakness is her self confessed tendancy to go for wierdos and jerks, shes loyal and will hopefully suceed in her career, shes gooing to get a first anyway. A lot of us losers arent that bad, so dont give teenage scumbags a bad name. Its just the really scummy ones.

As for the role of women, I'd like to think any future relationships i have (snigger.. me?) would be democratic, but truth be told unless I get a really quiet and laid back partner in my next realtionship, I'm likely to be number 2. I have no trouble admitting this, Im happy to be directed around provided its done in a friendly and patient way, and for my own good.

Finnally, from 11 I was raised by my dad. Its been a battle for him to get things and my mother has had many rights and things she shouldnt have had. In legal matters, the woman is still innocent and the man evil. Hopefully as attitudes change to women in other aspects, so should they here.

Ok, have you guys ever heard of equallity of the sexes? I mean come on. You guys serioulsy need to get over yourselves. If you think us women are envious of your "Manhood", think again. And if you think we were born to clean house, spend our days picking up after you, then you're in for one very rude awakening! We are most definately equal to... if not better then you males. We're smart, reliable, dependable. The only reason you guys run so much, is because women are never given teh opportunities we deserve. But don't worry. On eday, our time will come. You will understand that women are alot stronger then you think.
You think all that, well let me inform you, YOU'RE NOT!!!!

The truth of the matter is (at least my theory of it) is you will usually notice that the adult men don't belittle the women/girls on this forum, it's the punk ass teenagers and no, not all of them. But you can't really blame them too much, they wouldn't know what to do with a woman if their life depended on it.
I object to your use of the term "punk" in such a derogatory way!

I know many punks and most of them are wonderful happy people.

Sure there are a few people who spoil things for everyone and give punks a bad name but aren't there people like this in every group? These people are usually disliked by the rest of the group.

Punks are sometimes viewed as outcasts, but this is hardly the case either. There is a whole punk culture, being part of it doesn't mean you have to become a social outcast, if anything it's the complete opposite.

Please think twice before using a social stereo-type as an offensive term in future, you'll most likely offend people you didn't mean to.

I object to your use of the term "punk" in such a derogatory way!

I know many punks and most of them are wonderful happy people.

Sure there are a few people who spoil things for everyone and give punks a bad name but aren't there people like this in every group? These people are usually disliked by the rest of the group.

Punks are sometimes viewed as outcasts, but this is hardly the case either. There is a whole punk culture, being part of it doesn't mean you have to become a social outcast, if anything it's the complete opposite.

Please think twice before using a social stereo-type as an offensive term in future, you'll most likely offend people you didn't mean to.

I would hope any one with an IQ over 40 knew what I was talking about.. it wasn't music..lol :rolleyes:

I would hope any one with an IQ over 40 knew what I was talking about.. it wasn't music..lol :rolleyes:
There's more to punk culture than just music. Sure that's where it started but it's evolved, as things tend to do.

I still don't like the association you were making.

But, seriously? I wouldn't want a penis. I mean, shit, that's too much work to clean, and it just looks so uncomfortable to have hanging between your legs. And those erections in public? How embarassing.

Damn straight. And you forgot the teenage phenominon (or just a problem with guys who dont "vent" enough) of wet dreams.

Testicular cancer? Having your whatever they are called tubes over your kidney supply veins (which is why ball hitting hurts... so ladies please dont do it to people who are playing around or to friends, as you relocate their internal organs... thanks) ..... could explain more.

Though it isnt too uncomfortable hanging there, lets face it, when its not in use, its not exactly a huge bast**d is it?

Dont have to give birth if we want children of our own, and dont have periods, which, judging by what they do to one or two people I know, aren't pleasant. Oh and we can grow beards! yay! :D

I object to your use of the term "punk" in such a derogatory way!

I know many punks and most of them are wonderful happy people.

Sure there are a few people who spoil things for everyone and give punks a bad name but aren't there people like this in every group? These people are usually disliked by the rest of the group.

Punks are sometimes viewed as outcasts, but this is hardly the case either. There is a whole punk culture, being part of it doesn't mean you have to become a social outcast, if anything it's the complete opposite.

Please think twice before using a social stereo-type as an offensive term in future, you'll most likely offend people you didn't mean to.

Totally wrong reference for punk...

Punk according to Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punk)

See definition two and the original meaning of the word. It was an offensive term. It's only recently that punk has been used to define a musical subculture in our society. And recent is the last thirty years.

There's more to punk culture than just music. Sure that's where it started but it's evolved, as things tend to do.

I still don't like the association you were making.

Get over it!

Totally wrong reference for punk...

Punk according to Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punk)

See definition two and the original meaning of the word. It was an offensive term. It's only recently that punk has been used to define a musical subculture in our society. And recent is the last thirty years.
Yeah... and?

30 years is easily long enough.

It's just like how many homosexuals use the word "Queer" rappers using the word "******" as a positive term for themselves.

There's nothing wrong with being a punk and anyone who thinks so is just as bad as a homophobe or rascist.

Yeah... and?

30 years is easily long enough..

I'm over 30.. deal with it! :rolleyes:

I'm over 30.. deal with it! :rolleyes:
How's that working out for you?

How's that working out for you?

Someone else here who is over 30 and both (a) a punk, and (b) able to see clearly the point that Stephistan was making.

How's that working out for you?

Fabulous, as most people on these forums who know me can tell you.. I have a happy life, a handsome, intelligent husband, two wonderful children.. I look 25 according to most.. (maybe they just tell me that because I'm a mod though) I have a great job, as does my husband. We have money and we both have an excellent education. We care about people. Yes, we're filthy liberals. ;)

Hows life working for you?

Someone else here who is over 30 and both (a) a punk, and (b) able to see clearly the point that Stephistan was making.
Oh I can see the point she was making, I just think that it was possibly a tad misdirected.

Most of the people that I know who view women as lesser are the same kind of people who view punks as dirt. In contrast, most of the punks I know view everyone as equal.

Hows life working for you?
Life for me is rather confusing.

But I shant bore you with why except to say I'm an angsty teenager.

But thanks for asking :) .

Oh I can see the point she was making, I just think that it was possibly a tad misdirected.

Most of the people that I know who view women as lesser are the same kind of people who view punks as dirt. In contrast, most of the punks I know view everyone as equal.

Yes, but she wasn't using that sense of the word, any more than she would have been refering to a type of music or a youth culture if she had said "Lead is a heavy metal".

Yes, but she wasn't using that sense of the word, any more than she would have been refering to a type of music or a youth culture if she had said "Lead is a heavy metal".

Thanks BWO.. that is exactly what I was saying :)

Why do women like punk so much anyways?
Isn't that for scrawny little 13 year old losers that are pissed at their parents?

Yes, but she wasn't using that sense of the word, any more than she would have been refering to a type of music or a youth culture if she had said "Lead is a heavy metal".
Oh really?
it's the punk ass teenagers

Why do women like punk so much anyways?


Possibly because it is a youth culture that tends to judge people on their actions and beliefs rather than the assumptions which run throughout mainstream scoiety.

Oh really?

Yes. "Punk ass" here is used as an adjective in the same sense that it appears here:

http://www.extraugly.com/shirt.php?design=0022

..which, I'm sure you will agree, has very little to do with punk rock.

Isn't that for scrawny little 13 year old losers that are pissed at their parents?
Scrawny: Sometimes
13 year old: Not often
Losers: It's not a requirement, no.
Pissed at their parents: Umm... see above. Punk (music) is usually more political than anti-parents. Maybe you're thinking of grunge?

Possibly because it is a youth culture that tends to judge people on their actions and beliefs rather than the assumptions which run throughout mainstream scoiety.

Beh, yeah.. but life ain't that simple.
Only some feminist nut-case would feel the vibe of a squealin punk from new york yacking on about nonsense.

Beh, yeah.. but life ain't that simple.

Ain't it?

Only some feminist nut-case would feel the vibe of a squealin punk from new york yacking on about nonsense.

Call me stupid, but I don't see what point you are trying to make here, care to elucidate?

Yes. "Punk ass" here is used as an adjective in the same sense that it appears here:

http://www.extraugly.com/shirt.php?design=0022

..which, I'm sure you will agree, has very little to do with punk rock.
I do agree.

So you're saying it was being used in the word to describe things of a rotten nature?

I can agree with that.

Only some feminist nut-case would feel the vibe of a squealin punk from new york yacking on about nonsense.
Was that a joke? I don't get it.

Why is it you want equal treatment but if a woman offends a man and the man hits her like he would if a man offended him, why is it known as woman beating?! Equal treatment you want. I'm not saying it's right, but come on, it seems woman get special treatment still.
Actually men should not be hitting men who 'offend' them...the right to freedom from physical assault is not gender-based...
Evidently equal does not mean identical, if I allow two people to access a building in the identical way, and that way is by using stairs, but one of those people is in a wheel chair and cant walk, whilst the other has full use of their legs, the two people despite being treated identically are not being treated equally, they have identical but not equal access to the building.

Why won't you pay for dinner?
This is an individual matter, I know some women who expect to have dinner paid for by a man, and I know some men who get offended if a woman doesnt allow him to pay for dinner, but most people I know dont consider 'who pays for what' to be determined by something as arbitary as gender.

Why is it that a man that does dirty jokes with men and then does one to a woman, it's considered sexual harrassment?
It's not. Sexual harrassment is unwanted sexual attention. Whether or not telling a dirty joke is sexual harrassment is entirely circumstantial.

Now, I don't hate woman, but the day that a woman pays for dinner on a date and we can allowed to hit a woman as a joke (you know manly jokes of hitting each other, no woman beating) that is when we are truly equal. Until then, women will be using the whip to control men.
Many women pay for dinner on dates. It has been going on for years now. Many men do not hit each other for a joke, and would not tolerate someone hitting them for a joke. To suggest that women should be subject to physical violence if they dont wish to be treated as inferior is absolute stupidity. In fact your assumption appears to be that women must be 'as men' if men and women are to be equal. That is a contradictory premise, since men can be as per their inclination, for women to be equal, they too must be allowed to be as per their inclination. To expect women to not conform to their inclination while men can conform to their inclination creates an immediate inequality. That which creates inequality cannot possibly be a necessary ingrediant of equality.

When women are treated like men, that's when we have true equal treatment.
No, that would not be equality. It is not equality to remove tampon dispensers from female toilets and replace them with urinals anymore than it would be equality to remove urinals from male toilets and replace them with tampon dispensers. One size does not fit all.

Also, special treatment:

In a rape case, the women is usually listened too, not the man. I mean, maybe the women is lying?
If you expect this to be taken as anything other than unfounded opinion, provide a factual basis for it.

Divorce, the women usually gets more out of it.
and again provide the factual basis...

Either way.... women these days have more advantages over men IMO.
and again factual basis pleas.

women just want the penis.
The whole 'penis envy' theory is ironic, because I know plenty of guys (and even a few males mature enough to be classed as men) who swear that they'd love to have breasts and would stay home fondling themselves all day if they did, yet I dont recall ever having heard a girl or woman wishing they had a penis...

Some people here belive the generalization that all men are lazy bums.

Some people here belive the generalization that all women are sluts.

Some belive both. :eek:

I think all of them are idiots.

The fact is: "All generalizations except this one have exceptions", and in this case, the "exceptions" make up a large majority.

Sure, there are women who are sluts, and there are men who are lazy bums, but neither makes up a majority of men or women. I am a firm beliver that "All of a group shouldn't be judged on the actions of a few."

I belive that women who think all men are condesending and lazy and deserve to be punished are just as bad as men who think that women are inferior, I.E.: Very bad.

And honestly, I don't belive that men and women will ever be equal, not to say that wouldn't be good, just to say that reverse-discrimination will always go over the equality line, leading to reverse-reverse-discrimination, which leads to reverse-reverse-reverse-discrimination, etc., etc..

There's more to punk culture than just music. Sure that's where it started but it's evolved, as things tend to do.

I still don't like the association you were making.

Boy are you young. Hoo boy! That's really something. Now you're standing up for the rights and feelings of an imaginary, manufactured subculture. You're not just a bit ingenuous, TV baby.

You couldn't possibly know any punks. The moment had passed by the mid-eighties. You're too young, so are they. You might know some...I dunno..."neo-punks"? "mall punks"? whatever. It's just a bunch of retarded teenagers playing dress-up without any street cred whatsoever. God help them if they ever ran into the real thing. They'd get eaten alive.

You couldn't possibly know any punks. The moment had passed by the mid-eighties. You're too young, so are they. You might know some...I dunno..."neo-punks"? "mall punks"? whatever. It's just a bunch of retarded teenagers playing dress-up without any street cred whatsoever. God help them if they ever ran into the real thing. They'd get eaten alive.

The punk/hardcore scene is still quite alive and well these days where I am: although there is something of a division between the teen skaterkids and the crustier elders, but hey, we manage to lure a couple of the young bloods in to the global underground every now and again.

There's not much of that here, never was. Just the kids transitioning from skater to neo-punk via 25 year old bands they've only just discovered. All they listen to is the standard stuff, too. They listen to the Sex Pistols or maybe some Clash. It drives me nuts. I won't mention any of the lesser known punk bands, lest a mall-punk grabs the name and runs with it to attempt a jump in teeny-bopper street cred.

When I was in London, there were more of the old-school punks, people who'd been there when it was happening, and right in the middle of it. I just hate 13 year olds trying to tell me about punk.

I just hate 13 year olds trying to tell me about punk.


I don't mind it: it is a chance to tell them "listen to this, and this and this, and have you heard this?" When I was a still a pup 'old' people who still had fire in their belly about music were one of the coolest things in the world. Consider it a way of returning the favour. A teenager weened off Blink 182 and onto Discharge or Born Against or Rudimentary Peni or ... well ... pretty much anything counts as a victory.

Yeah, fine, if it's a kid I don't mind being around, one who was born cool anyway. I have a little brother like that, but then you get these little fakers who try to convince you how cool they are, and I haven't got time for them. I'm not going to waste my breath trying to tell them anything, because they're not listening, except to add to their whole phony repertoire.

**walks in**

So uh...if I like bands like AFI, but I also like bands like AC/DC, where does that put me?


...DreamTheater?


(j/k, I love DreamTheater :p)

**walks in**

So uh...if I like bands like AFI, but I also like bands like AC/DC, where does that put me?


...DreamTheater?


(j/k, I love DreamTheater :p)

Hey, I don't care what bands you like, actually. Whatever turns you on is fine, it's just when kids try to put on a phony persona, because they don't have a personality of their own, and their preferences are dictated by pop culture. Everything about most teenagers is so fake and two-dimensional, usually.

For instance, a teenager wouldn't admit to liking something like Dr. Hook. I like Dr. Hook, and I don't give a damn if my friends like Dr. Hook. They don't have to listen to it if they don't want to. Teenagers, though, they don't think for themselves. They might believe they do, but really, most of them are going on cues from their peers as to what is cool.

Actually, since someone brought it up, on the subject of paying for the meal: I usually pay regardless of who my company is, because I have a job, and thus can afford it :p. But, if she wants to, then buy all means we'll split it.

As for holding the door open...I do that for everyone, so I don't think people'll get too pissy towards me :p

And conversely, regardless of my company, I will never pay for a meal. :D

Some threads on this forum grow just sooooo fast... :confused:

It seems that Legless Pirates and The Refused Party Program are the major players nowadays... keep it up guys!

Wow, did this topic ever go off course..

Back on topic please!

Stephanie
Game Moderator

ok... ok...

Some women can be sensitive... but I know that most of what is said on NS is just good clean fun.

Wow, did this topic ever go off course..

Back on topic please!

Stephanie
Game Moderator

Yes, I think the women of NS should get back on topic. Viva la Revolucion!

Meh. Some of us are *Nice guys* We are a dying breed. I try to be a gentleman and hold a door for you, what will be your response?
[postreferringtopostonthefirstpage]
I'd walk through it - it's a door being held open for me so I don't need to make the effort :D Anyway I personally hold the door for anyone coming behind me (male or female) - I just see it as politeness.

I saw the "Why the disrespect?" thread (in all its thirty-page mindbending glory), so now I have a start for my lists of who to laugh at (Pepe Dominguez and Kelhptopia - laughing is better than anger where blood pressure and stress are concerned!) and who is cool (Goed, Slap Happy Lunatic, and all the girls in that thread, particularly Dakini and Sheilanagig (sp?)) - Note this is off the top of my head and I don't know anyone yet, so I'm sure both lists are incomplete.
[/talkingaboutoldnewsfrompagesago!]

[QUOTE[I'd walk through it - it's a door being held open for me so I don't need to make the effort Anyway I personally hold the door for anyone coming behind me (male or female) - I just see it as politeness.[/QUOTE]

I agree. I get annoyed when people just let the door slam in my face, especially if I have an armful of books or something else. It's not a gender issue- it's just politeness.

It's the same kind of thing with me and my boyfriend when it comes to paying- it's not based on gender or whatever. In reality it's based on who has the money at the time, and if we both do we generally split things.

And I'm cool! :p :D

Hey, I don't care what bands you like, actually. Whatever turns you on is fine, it's just when kids try to put on a phony persona, because they don't have a personality of their own, and their preferences are dictated by pop culture. Everything about most teenagers is so fake and two-dimensional, usually.

For instance, a teenager wouldn't admit to liking something like Dr. Hook. I like Dr. Hook, and I don't give a damn if my friends like Dr. Hook. They don't have to listen to it if they don't want to. Teenagers, though, they don't think for themselves. They might believe they do, but really, most of them are going on cues from their peers as to what is cool.
Yes but contrary to what most teenagers and twenty somethings believe they have cemented who "THEY THEMSELVES" are yet.
They are still seeking out what it is they like, where they stand on issues, they are still children. You are not at fifteen who you will be when you are twenty,
and not at twenty who you will be at thirty.
We assmeble our personalities slowly, give teens a break, they are works in progress.


I agree. I get annoyed when people just let the door slam in my face, especially if I have an armful of books or something else. It's not a gender issue- it's just politeness.
It's the same kind of thing with me and my boyfriend when it comes to paying- it's not based on gender or whatever. In reality it's based on who has the money at the time, and if we both do we generally split things.
And I'm cool! :p :D
I hold the door for people, I am sexist or a mysoginist or whatever label you want ot put on it.
FOr a man(my age or younger), I hold the door long enough for him to see I have slowed the doors closing for his benefit, then I let it go in time for him to catch it if he moves his ass.
For all females(I count the word woman to mean adult) Ihold the door until they pass through it.
For the elderly/infirm(reguardless of gender) I hold the door until they pass through it.
I have already told my daughters to never hold the door for a man(unless he specifically says'Help me') this rule applies to myself, they are not allowed to hold the door for me--unless a man is some how burdened he should not expect or receive that courtesy from a female(with the elderly/infirm being the exception).
I realize this is not equal treatment, however I live in the real world, with real people, equality does not exist except in the cemetary.

You all realise, as I just have, the futility of the topic.

Maybe theres a few guys who mean well but havent quite got it right, you might be able to better educate them (us perhaps, Im not sure how good I am at not being sexist) but otherwise, you are preaching to the converted, who understand this already, or morons who cant undertsnd you because they are too busy giving us men a bad name to learn to read.

As for real life problems, well, hopefully thins will even out in the future, but it isnt just men holding you back. Women are often biased against women in work. Its a power thing Im sure, or thats what my friend said on it, and shes a psychologist who should get a first in her degree. So I trust her on this.

Anyway, point being, your either preaching to the converted or being ignored by those who dont deserve to be called "men" anyway.

Um, I hold the door too...
It's just that I believe equality should exist, so I hold the door for everybody... So what if equality is not widespread in the world, doesn that mean we should foster inequality? I think not...

I am curious as to why a little special treatment is not welcomed?
Someone raised to show extra respect to women was not taught that he is undermining some Idea of equality, he was taught to be extra courteous to women.
I do my best not to use profanity around women.
I dont spit around women.
I stand up when a women enters or leaves a room.
I pull out a woman's chair for her(not because she cant, because that is what I am suppsoed to do)
I understand equal pay, and all that.
However the courtesy a man pays to a women is as much for him as it is for her.
We enjoy the effort of trying to be "Gentlemen", I enjoy hearing a women say I am well mannered--I am not--which is why I enjoy hearing it.
I also enjoy making a women feel like a "Lady", there is no rule that says a woman can not be Liberated and a Lady.
I dont know, I suppose I am old fashion.
As far as equality goes, I guess I dont believe it means the same thing you mean.
Men and Women are not the same, so I dont think they should be treated the same.
I dont believe one is superior--I think that is simpleminded to belive that just because two things are diffrent one must be superior to the other.
Ahhh, I dont know.
Like I said, old fashioned I guess.

I am curious as to why a little special treatment is not welcomed?
Someone raised to show extra respect to women was not taught that he is undermining some Idea of equality, he was taught to be extra courteous to women.
I do my best not to use profanity around women.
I dont spit around women.
I stand up when a women enters or leaves a room.
I pull out a woman's chair for her(not because she cant, because that is what I am suppsoed to do)
I understand equal pay, and all that.
However the courtesy a man pays to a women is as much for him as it is for her.
We enjoy the effort of trying to be "Gentlemen", I enjoy hearing a women say I am well mannered--I am not--which is why I enjoy hearing it.
I also enjoy making a women feel like a "Lady", there is no rule that says a woman can not be Liberated and a Lady.
I dont know, I suppose I am old fashion.
As far as equality goes, I guess I dont believe it means the same thing you mean.
Men and Women are not the same, so I dont think they should be treated the same.
I dont believe one is superior--I think that is simpleminded to belive that just because two things are diffrent one must be superior to the other.
Ahhh, I dont know.
Like I said, old fashioned I guess.

Excuse me, you seem to be writing in my style.
I would thank you to use prose like everyone else on the forum.
:mad: :p

I don't do all of what you do but I do the door thing and a few others.
Especially at uni where the doors in the classics department are new and very heavy so some of the girls actually have trouble opening them.

Yes but contrary to what most teenagers and twenty somethings believe they have cemented who "THEY THEMSELVES" are yet.
They are still seeking out what it is they like, where they stand on issues, they are still children. You are not at fifteen who you will be when you are twenty,
and not at twenty who you will be at thirty.
We assmeble our personalities slowly, give teens a break, they are works in progress.

I'm more apt to do that when they don't shove it in my face. I would rather they find themselves by themselves, and stay out of my space while they're doing it. It's like the rolling disco thing. I don't like someone rolling up to my car blasting Limp Bizkit like it's cool, or like I'm going to appreciate the free concert. That's bad manners, full stop.



I hold the door for people, I am sexist or a mysoginist or whatever label you want ot put on it.
FOr a man(my age or younger), I hold the door long enough for him to see I have slowed the doors closing for his benefit, then I let it go in time for him to catch it if he moves his ass.
For all females(I count the word woman to mean adult) Ihold the door until they pass through it.
For the elderly/infirm(reguardless of gender) I hold the door until they pass through it.
I have already told my daughters to never hold the door for a man(unless he specifically says'Help me') this rule applies to myself, they are not allowed to hold the door for me--unless a man is some how burdened he should not expect or receive that courtesy from a female(with the elderly/infirm being the exception).
I realize this is not equal treatment, however I live in the real world, with real people, equality does not exist except in the cemetary.

It's not sexist if the spirit you're doing it in is egalitarian. Me, I'm a woman, and I hold doors for people. It's just polite. I'd LIKE to see more men give up seats on the subway for the elderly, or pregnant women, whatever the case may be. I don't mind holding the door for men, either, if they happen to be coming along close behind me, or I see them coming toward it on my way out.

If by style you mean: poorly.
Then yes I am. :rolleyes:

Anyway, point being, your either preaching to the converted or being ignored by those who dont deserve to be called "men" anyway.

Bravo. Good point. I like your style. :)

It's not sexist if the spirit you're doing it in is egalitarian. Me, I'm a woman, and I hold doors for people. It's just polite. I'd LIKE to see more men give up seats on the subway for the elderly, or pregnant women, whatever the case may be. I don't mind holding the door for men, either, if they happen to be coming along close behind me, or I see them coming toward it on my way out.
Thats exactly what I was trying to say, only expressed more clearly! :p

What do you think of the 'don't target women or children' rule?

What do you think of the 'don't target women or children' rule?

You mean in war? I'd say that it needs to be rephrased as 'noncombatants'. Of course, that's usually women or children, but in the name of equality, it should include the elderly and infirm as well as men who don't participate.

That rule does not apply if they are holding guns.
It would not matter in this issue.
A soldier will most assuradly kill a woman with a rifle, or a child.
A fourteen year old girl with an AK-47 will kill you just as dead as a man with one.

What do you think of the 'don't target women or children' rule?

I prefer "dont target people"

I would only hurt another human being if it were accidental, or a very desparate situation. ie Life or death, or my friends in danger, In which case, it wouldnt matter if they were a 90 year old pygmy woman holding a baby, a threat to my friends or a threat to me (a serious one) is the only thing that would stir me to violence proper (as opposed to sending my little brothers flying with a pillow). And in that case I wouldnt care.

How many of you 3 are men?

Super Dad here.

Reason I ask is because this shows the other side of equality.
Often men think that women are not targettable because they are weaker, whereas like it has been said, a woman with a gun is just as deadly as a man.
I don't like it on the news when it says '30 dead, including women and children' because the men who didn't want to fight are just as dead as the others.
That hardly seems equal to me.

*resists making silly comment*

Me, Im a man/boy/big hairy thing.

Of course you may not have been talking to me as there are infact 4 possible men that you could be talking to.

Id like to add, it's always a case of minimum force. Unless they actaully hurt someone. Im not so sure Id be able to control myself then. But even then Id try.

Well that idea stems from the fact that women and children are generally non-combatants. But yeah, I do agree- it should be a general rule that noncombatants aren't targetted in conflict, male, female, adult or child.

I'm a woman btw.

Well that idea stems from the fact that women and children are generally non-combatants. But yeah, I do agree- it should be a general rule that noncombatants aren't targetted in conflict, male, female, adult or child.

I'm a woman btw.

So in fact we have consensus from men and women that noncombatant men are just as invalid targets as noncombatant women.

On the subject of women and children and war, what do you think about women on the battlefield? Sure, women are allowed in the army, but they aren't allowed in fighting jobs, like infantry.

The reason for this is supposedly a study determined that the men can't handle seeing a woman die in combat. If they see a man die or get injured, they move on. If they see a woman die or get injured, they'll all bunch around her and try to play the hero. They won't leave her.

That's just what I've been told. I don't have any sources for that study.

What do you think about it? Guys, how true is do you feel it is?

On the subject of women and children and war, what do you think about women on the battlefield? Sure, women are allowed in the army, but they aren't allowed in fighting jobs, like infantry.


Actually that depends on which nation you are talking about. I know several women in the infantry in Canada.

On the subject of women and children and war, what do you think about women on the battlefield? Sure, women are allowed in the army, but they aren't allowed in fighting jobs, like infantry.

The reason for this is supposedly a study determined that the men can't handle seeing a woman die in combat. If they see a man die or get injured, they move on. If they see a woman die or get injured, they'll all bunch around her and try to play the hero. They won't leave her.

That's just what I've been told. I don't have any sources for that study.

What do you think about it? Guys, how true is do you feel it is?

I believe Israel has mandatory conscription for a few years, men and women, in active infantry. I may be mistaken.

Actually that depends on which nation you are talking about. I know several women in the infantry in Canada.

lol. I'm sorry, I keep forgetting this is all worlds. My bad. :p

Yeah, I'm talking about America. I didn't know women would fight infantry in Canada. How does that work out for you guys?

Well, you get all kinds of people enlisting. I'm not personally in the infantry, my roomate used to be. There were several women in his unit. Some he praised, some he spoke of quite vituperatively. But to be fair, he was pretty vituperative about some of the guys as well.

I'm not actually sure how many of them have been on active duty on the front lines, but they were members of the unit, they trained with the unit - it would seem a complete waste to recruit and train them if they weren't going to use them in active duty.

If you want to see some actual stats, I can do some googling.

Sure, if you don't mind.

...Canada has an infanty? :eek:

j/k ;)


Now, I'll flat out admit it. I'm more polite around girls I don't know. While I don't curse often, I'll *never* curse around them. Or tell horrile jokes (which is pretty much all of them :D). Or any of that stuff.

Now, if your female, and you're my friend...well, ok, I'll still be more polite :p. But not as much.

**shrugs** But then again, that's just me.

Oh, and I'm a guy :p

On the subject of women and children and war, what do you think about women on the battlefield? Sure, women are allowed in the army, but they aren't allowed in fighting jobs, like infantry.

The reason for this is supposedly a study determined that the men can't handle seeing a woman die in combat. If they see a man die or get injured, they move on. If they see a woman die or get injured, they'll all bunch around her and try to play the hero. They won't leave her.

That's just what I've been told. I don't have any sources for that study.

What do you think about it? Guys, how true is do you feel it is?

That's probably true enough. Most guys are like that even without a dying or injured woman.

On the subject of women and children and war, what do you think about women on the battlefield? Sure, women are allowed in the army, but they aren't allowed in fighting jobs, like infantry.

The reason for this is supposedly a study determined that the men can't handle seeing a woman die in combat. If they see a man die or get injured, they move on. If they see a woman die or get injured, they'll all bunch around her and try to play the hero. They won't leave her.

That's just what I've been told. I don't have any sources for that study.

What do you think about it? Guys, how true is do you feel it is?

Women have been warriors since the beginning of recorded history (see Herodotus' writings about the Sarmatian women). During WWII Soviet women fought as snipers, partisans, bombers, and fighter pilots. The 588th Night Bombers (commonly called the Night Witches) was composed entirely of female pilots, navigators, and mechanics. Liliia Litviak, an Ace fighter pilot who won her nation's highest award - the Hero of the Soviet Union, was the first woman in history to shoot down an enemy aircraft. She registered 11 personal kills and three group kills before she herself was shot down and killed at the age of 22.

For more check out Reina Pennington's two volume Amazons to Fighter Pilots: A Biographical Dictionary of Military Women.

Oh, by the way, of course men can be feminists. A feminist is simply someone who believes men and women should have equal opportunities. I would hope that we all are feminists in this day and age.

Well, you get all kinds of people enlisting. I'm not personally in the infantry, my roomate used to be. There were several women in his unit. Some he praised, some he spoke of quite vituperatively. But to be fair, he was pretty vituperative about some of the guys as well.

I'm not actually sure how many of them have been on active duty on the front lines, but they were members of the unit, they trained with the unit - it would seem a complete waste to recruit and train them if they weren't going to use them in active duty.

If you want to see some actual stats, I can do some googling.



Stats on women in the armed forces in Australia, Canada, Italy, Netherlands, Sweden, and the UK: http://www.forces.gc.ca/site/Minister/eng/benchmark/bench_intro_e.htm

Apparently, in the Netherlands, women are involved in every unit of the armed forces except the marines and submarines. They can be infantry personnel, fighter pilots, tank operators, etc.

Women serve in the Swedish armed forces without restriction, although unlike the men, they are not subject to conscription.

I'll look around for more.

Although frankly, given that men and women on active duty in the Service battalion frequently find their lives endangered (especially when fighting an enemy using guerrilla tactics), I don't think the argument "that the men can't handle seeing a woman die in combat" is a legitimate reason to bar women from combat services. After all, if you are fighting for your life to protect the convoy of food or fuel you were delivering, you are in combat. Does the fact that a woman is fighting next to a man in that situation prevent him from doing his duty? Does it prevent her?

I think not.

Thank you, Equus. And you bring up a very good point. So why, then, aren't women allowed in the US military. I suddenly feel disfranchised. :(

So why, then, aren't women allowed in the US military. I suddenly feel disfranchised. :(

...they are allowed in the US military.

*at the risk of being "cute" there are usually Two. Me and my other half.

I appreciate women for all that they are. Strong, weak, wanting and giving..

Everything that you may be and are.

Someday I will have a daughter, and will smile and cry when she gets married.
awwww me too! how much do I LOVE you?

but seriously guys, I think Steph is right, its mostly the immature guys/girls that are doing the gender bashing here, it seems to be a thing with some people, belittle others so that I can feel better about myself. Probably some freudian castration or oedipus complex issues involved as well, I wouldn't be surprised.

yup. some of us just get lucky and find the good ones :) :fluffle:

awwww me too! how much do I LOVE you?

but seriously guys, I think Steph is right, its mostly the immature guys/girls that are doing the gender bashing here, it seems to be a thing with some people, belittle others so that I can feel better about myself. Probably some freudian castration or oedipus complex issues involved as well, I wouldn't be surprised.

yup. some of us just get lucky and find the good ones :) :fluffle:

As the token lonely teen, I feel obligated to make rude comments, feel angsty, and spit out of bitterness o_O :p

lol Goed, you go right ahead, no skin off my nose! I remember those days :hobbles around like a geezer) and we mostly bashed eachother in good fun. I dont see what all the fuss is about really? oh well

As the token lonely teen, I feel obligated to make rude comments, feel angsty, and spit out of bitterness o_O :p

Feel enough that way and you could follow my lead.

Swear off both sexes altogether and become a borish recluse in order to save society from the horrors of you and your progeny while countless friends of your and your opposite gender torment you, attempting to reinstate you as a potential node for procreation.

As the token lonely teen, I feel obligated to make rude comments, feel angsty, and spit out of bitterness o_O :p

Personally, even though we can be a bit irrational, teens are more accepting and open to opinions while a lot of old geezers are so stuck in their ways they refuse to listen to opinions. But, I could be completely wrong...

And if it is mostly teens gender bashing it's probably because their acne has left them a social recluse and lonely and confused and such.

WHATEVUH! As the great Kurt Cobain once said "With the lights out, it's less dangerous, here we are now entertain us"

...they are allowed in the US military.

I meant in combat. My bad.

Feel enough that way and you could follow my lead.

Swear off both sexes altogether and become a borish recluse in order to save society from the horrors of you and your progeny while countless friends of your and your opposite gender torment you, attempting to reinstate you as a potential node for procreation.

Meh, I said I felt obligated to do it, not that I wanted to :p. I can't imagine myself completely giving up to that level. I've joked about it, but eventually the eyes see somthing and tell the brain "Hey, shut up, we don't hate girls, got it?"

Teens get a bad rap, yes, but...I'm sorry, but most of them are stupid. Maybe it was the ones I knew. But teenagers are some of the most idiotic things I've ever met.


I swear, I went from age 14 to 22, and now I'm just catching up biologically :p

Think of it this way: women are treated badly because men are afraid of them.

It's all linked to penis size...uh...somehow.

So the more they're mysogonistic...the smaller...um...

...yeah, let's just end that right now.

Feminist Camille Paglia says that men are afraid of the mysterious forces that lurk inside of the woman's vagina. Unlike the penis, which sticks out (regardless of its size), the vagina is shapeless, dark inside and cave-like. A number of Freudians say that every man subconciously wishes to crawl back into his mother's womb, but that any woman will do. That is probably why there might be some correlation between penis size and misogyny. A man with a larger penis will get closer to that wish, while a man with a small penis will not get very far.

Uh, I'm 13
That explains it. You're just ignorant.

Feminist Camille Paglia says that men are afraid of the mysterious forces that lurk inside of the woman's vagina. Unlike the penis, which sticks out (regardless of its size), the vagina is shapeless, dark inside and cave-like.

Is it jsut me or does Paglia remain at heart a Lacanian?

That explains it. You're just ignorant.

Oh. It seems you stand up against woman-bashing, but do nothing, even participate in child-bashing.

Sure, Alan is ignorant, but it's not because of his age. It's because he's a "hypocrit" ;)

And you're a hypocrite too, so don't think that you're not.

I belive that EVERYONE should be considered equal, regardless of gender, age (EVEN those younger than 18), race, or any other discriminating factor.

I treat people based on their personality, not on appearance. I'll hate a rude black woman just as much as I'll hate a rude white man, not bacause she's black or a woman, but because she's rude. If she calls me a sexist or a racist, I'll probably hate her even more.

BTW: Why is it people never reply to me in the general fourm?

I like how this is going. ^_^ it's nice to see this thread is free of morons and arseholes for the most part. This is very productive.

I posted this because I was curious as to what everyone thought on this.

I go to school in a predominantly male environment - let's just say, the ratio of guys to girls is something in the ballpark of 15:1. Yes ladies, it's good pickings - although they are computer nerds, and haven't seen the light of day in a long time...

Anyway... I do go to school in an equal opportunity environment, which I am grateful for. I just hope the rest of the world that still thinks backwards, can catch up to this progressive path of rights.

WwooHoo! ther are wimmin here. *Drools*

LMFAO

WwooHoo! ther are wimmin here. *Drools*

LMFAO
O_o;; Whaaa~~? What say the man? What the bloody hell? Ooooookkkkkk.... What the hell is "wimmin"??

What the hell is "wimmin"??

A term for 'women' adopted by radical feminists in the 70s so that it no longer conveyed the idea that the females were just an alteration of a primal male identity. Both 'women' and 'female' are, obviously, just the result of adding modifying suffixes to the roots of 'men' and 'male'. The new coining was an attempt to destroy the power relations inherent in everyday language - a kind of piece of guerilla structuralism, if you will. See also 'womyn' for another variant spelling.

wimmin=wwomaan.Joke

wimmin=wwomaan.Joke


Women, Womyn, Wimmin (http://research.umbc.edu/~korenman/wmst/womyn.html)

I don't care what you call us, whether it's wimmin or womyn or women. Frankly, it's no better at describing a group of us than any other generalization is. I mean, when you think of "men", as a man, you might relate on a superficial level, but there's more to your identity as a person than that. It's that way for "black", "white", "women", "American", "British", you see what I'm getting at? They all might accurately describe what you are, but not who you are.

That's maybe why I hate hearing generalizations about people, because if, for instance, it's a generalization about women, then it's a generalization being made of a generalization. It's so far removed from any individual woman that it no longer describes any of us.

Such labels do describe us to some extent however. That I am "British" tells you I consider my home to be England. Its where I came from. It doesnt tell you any more than that though.

Oh and seriously it was a throwaway comment.

And as for us all being puter nerds. lol. Not quite.

And for your reference Zadd, you could just be a nice guy. Then you are safe from sex. Trust me here, actually treating a woman as an equal will not get you anywhere. You get respect and friends, but its perfect if you want to avoid any form of relationship.

And for your reference Zadd, you could just be a nice guy. Then you are safe from sex. Trust me here, actually treating a woman as an equal will not get you anywhere. You get respect and friends, but its perfect if you want to avoid any form of relationship.

If this were true it would explain everything! :D

Women and men deserve equal moral, political and social considerations and opportunities. There is absolutely no reason why this shouldn't be the case. Fin.

"women dont go for nice guys until they want someone to settle down with"

The words of one of my female friends. She's sh*t hot at psychology too.

I does explain everything.

Women and men deserve equal moral, political and social considerations and opportunities. There is absolutely no reason why this shouldn't be the case. Fin.

yay.

it might take a while to filter through as you cant just remove the subconcious programming of nature and society in one go. That would be naive. Both women and men hold women back in career spheres for instance. In interviews both men and women will favour men. This is wrong. But it happens.

Can I just go back to being bitter now?

Um, I fell in love with my partner without any particular expectations about settling down. I wasn't "looking" for anyone or anything. It just happened. And yeah, he is a nice guy (although he does do all those things that lots of you gentlemen won't, like swearing and telling rude jokes in front of me :p ) and yeah, we are looking forward to a long life together...

But it wasn't planned!!!

Women and men deserve equal moral, political and social considerations and opportunities. There is absolutely no reason why this shouldn't be the case. Fin.
I like your style. :)

But there wasnt a point in your relationship where you thought "hmm I know at some point Im going to get bored of this... lets continue on anyway as I can still wrong something out of this" as it appears there are people who think like that. Sometimes from the start.

I don't quite understand what you're getting at, but no, neither of us thought like that. It's sad that people do really.

yay.

it might take a while to filter through as you cant just remove the subconcious programming of nature and society in one go. That would be naive. Both women and men hold women back in career spheres for instance. In interviews both men and women will favour men. This is wrong. But it happens.

Can I just go back to being bitter now?

Yeah, I know. I realise there is still much to be done... recent studies in Britain have shown that in some professions (such as accountancy) the pay gap between men and women can be as much as 40-odd percent. Fucking hell.

People also need to realise what feminism actually means. Me and my girlfriend have come accross so many people who don't consider themselves feminists...and it always confuses me. It is because the word "feminism" has gained negative connotations that imply extremism, which is factually not true of the ideology. It [usually] only means equal considerations and opportunities. Why wouldn't anyone want this?

And for your reference Zadd, you could just be a nice guy. Then you are safe from sex. Trust me here, actually treating a woman as an equal will not get you anywhere. You get respect and friends, but its perfect if you want to avoid any form of relationship.

I'll consider this as a joke, rather than an accurate comment on your view of the world, okay?

Its ridiculous! I want to retire and be a bum as early as possible, preferably with a partner. It's in my best interests that she is paid better as I wont have to save as long.

Despite being a man I see such things as being against my life objective.

And yes I know it seems narrow and selfish. I just wanted an example of how inequality hurts the one who is the top end.

Anyway equal pay for equal work etc. Its disgusting any other way.