NationStates Jolt Archive

I think that some Catholics are way to obsessive about their religion. It's not fair that they often try and force their religious views on other people. Also if anyone says anything about them they instantly disapprove without thinking anything through rationally. I'm not saying that every Catholic is like this, just every Catholic I've ever met.

Just on the subject of Catholic ppl . . .

I have a Catholic friend who's older brother is named Joe.

While we don't talk about religion, if it ever gets brought up and she mentions her Catholocism, I just really want to say to her 'Well, I always thought your brother was Joeish!'

ruuuuun!!!

I thought the issue was Pedophile Priests! :eek:

I thought the issue was Pedophile Priests!


...why?

I think that some Catholics are way to obsessive about their religion. It's not fair that they often try and force their religious views on other people. Also if anyone says anything about them they instantly disapprove without thinking anything through rationally. I'm not saying that every Catholic is like this, just every Catholic I've ever met.

well, the bible kinda does say its your duty as a Catholic to try to presuade as many people as posible to come over to the faith

I thought the issue was Pedophile Priests! :eek:
why would it be?
the theology of the catholic church is utterly seperate of the actions of certain priests and the officials who shielded them.

if all those men when to jail (as they should) the church would remain the same.

well, the bible kinda does say its your duty as a Catholic to try to presuade as many people as posible to come over to the faith
doesn't it also say you should "do onto others as..." ... Don't convince them of something they don't want to hear about. sounds fair to me :)

doesn't it also say you should "do onto others as..." ... Don't convince them of something they don't want to hear about. sounds fair to me :)

but its something you have to hear about

do you really think I wanted to sit through drivers ed before I could get behind the wheel?

but its something you have to hear about

do you really think I wanted to sit through drivers ed before I could get behind the wheel?
good point. but then, you wanted to drive, so you accepted suffering through drivers ed (and your lucky you live in america, over here it takes a looot longer). I never chose to have anyone "convince" me of christianity.

Every Catholic I've ever met has always been humble about the religion and have never pushed it onto anyone else. At least the Catholic Church depends on people's faith rather than giant football staduim "churches".

I was born into a Catholic family and ever since I remember I've been told what to believe, how i should behave, my education was also infected with this ridiculous idea that I should follow the bible and love Jesus.

When i admitted that i actually disagreed with tuns of the Catholic ways of life i got really severely told off. Apparently I'm being sinful and betraying - which i find unreasonable. People should be entitled to their own opinions and not forced to accept someone else’s.

I was born into a Catholic family and ever since I remember I've been told what to believe, how i should behave, my education was also infected with this ridiculous idea that I should follow the bible and love Jesus.

When i admitted that i actually disagreed with tuns of the Catholic ways of life i got really severely told off. Apparently I'm being sinful and betraying - which i find unreasonable. People should be entitled to their own opinions and not forced to accept someone else’s.

Your parents weren't any good at bringing you up (no offense to you). Usually children follow their parents in religion.
The Bible does not have any things that a normal reading person would consider bad, I don't think. Yes, it is idealist, but humanity should strive to be ideal (although it never will be).

I find that many Christians of all denominations can be just as onboxious, Catholics, Protestants, and Mormons.

Your parents weren't any good at bringing you up (no offense to you). Usually children follow their parents in religion.

i got to defend them here - i love them to bits - anyway it wasn't just them it was my grandparents mainly. (i love them to bits too)

The Bible does not have any things that a normal reading person would consider bad, I don't think. Yes, it is idealist, but humanity should strive to be ideal (although it never will be).

Have you ever read the bible? Jesus is some rude power-mad dictator that for some reason everyone loves. The rules are way to strict and unreasonable to follow. It's far from ideal in my opinion.

"Dear God. I'm an atheist/agnostic, and I feel some people are way too obsessive about their religion". p.s. god... this isn't a stupid thread...

i got to defend them here - i love them to bits - anyway it wasn't just them it was my grandparents mainly. (i love them to bits too)
OK, I assumed from your being "strongly told off" that you weren't in good relations with your parents; cleared now.

Have you ever read the bible? Jesus is some rude power-mad dictator that for some reason everyone loves. The rules are way to strict and unreasonable to follow. It's far from ideal in my opinion.
Not really; but I still know that you are exaggerating.
Ideal=strict, in my humble opinion. Like you would rather have everyone speak politely (the ideal situation), but you think that it should not be enforced (the real situation).
And I am not proposing for you to love God from the way you look at it.

why would it be?
the theology of the catholic church is utterly seperate of the actions of certain priests and the officials who shielded them.

if all those men when to jail (as they should) the church would remain the same.

The theology of the church has been seperated from the church since constantine for christs sake. (Pardon really bad pun).
I can't stand any religious people, or for that matter athiests like myself who push their beliefs on others. We should all feel free to celebrate our beliefs openly, and equally, just without mind numbing propoganda aimed at conversion, and as with most religions Catholics haved been notoriously bad with this, and with the ever growing conservative trend is only going to get worse.

Everything I know about Catholicism comes from Trigun and various news reports and atheist rants, so I really can't pass judgement on it.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/rcc.htm

To the anti-Catholics here: many of my very good friends are Catholic - I don't see anything wrong with them.

I find that many Christians of all denominations can be just as onboxious, Catholics, Protestants, and Mormons.
Its nice that you can consider "Mormons" Latterday Saints as Christians. A couple Christians don't I've heard them say.

But yes there are miniroities in every religion with over zealous peoople. Even the apostles that traveled with Jesus had one or two, the brothers if Thunder, are the example. Nickname of two of them (I forget which at moment)
But just because the minoeity is broadcast doesn't mean you should sterotype them all. Remember labels can be misleading.

I think that some Catholics are way to obsessive about their religion. It's not fair that they often try and force their religious views on other people. Also if anyone says anything about them they instantly disapprove without thinking anything through rationally. I'm not saying that every Catholic is like this, just every Catholic I've ever met.

First off, I'm Catholic and 20 years old, just so you know where I'm coming from.

I can't speak for all Catholics but virtually all the Catholics I know are very polite and not pushy at all when it comes to sharing our religion with others. I've always been taught that actions speak louder than words and that living a good life(being a good example) is just as good or better than preaching verbally. However, if people ask me something about my religion, I'll do the best that I can to answer their question. That's not to say that I'm against all evangalizing of any kind. However, I think that a Catholic or any other member of a relgious group should only do it when they feel that like their advances are not unwanted.

Other than that, all I can say is that I'm sorry you've had bad experiences with Catholics you've met. We all know that noone is perfect and that includes Catholics. Just try to rest assure that we are not all overly pushy. Also, even the pushy ones are only that way because they are trying to help people (whether or not you agree with the fact that they are helpful, it's something that they believe.) Also, remember you can always just tell them you aren't interested and walk away.

But just because the minoeity is broadcast doesn't mean you should sterotype them all. Remember labels can be misleading.

I thought i made it clear at the start that I was not anti-Catholic. If I came across as someone trying to stereotype them then i apologize as that was not my intention.

I come from a Catholic family, never go to church, and an not even sure if god even exists. I am under the impression that god is simply an answer to questions people otherwise can't answer rationally or scientifically.
However personaly, I couldn't care less about anyone's personal beliefs at all, as long as they dont push their beliefs on other people making them mad.

here is my scientific(but hardly scienificly at all) definition of Religion: Religion Is the escape from the realitys of death and dying, which gives a person comfort at hard times,when a family member is dead or dieing.
so in other words they do it for comfort, though hope i dont piss someone off, though i could be partially wrong

the Catholic CHurch is huge, there could be a million different kinds of people there. it's unwise and inaccurate to generalize.

you know would you rather be praising allah?

the catholic church is quiet breach-able and I find that people on here who where once christain where child hood catholics serousily is there a single convetred protestan mormon any one else.

here is my scientific(but hardly scienificly at all) definition of Religion: Religion Is the escape from the realitys of death and dying, which gives a person comfort at hard times,when a family member is dead or dieing.
so in other words they do it for comfort, though hope i dont piss someone off, though i could be partially wrong

here is my definition of atheism: atheism is the escape from the reality that somethings are beyond human explination, people try to ignore these things rather than dealing with them

here is my scientific(but hardly scienificly at all) definition of Religion: Religion Is the escape from the realitys of death and dying, which gives a person comfort at hard times,when a family member is dead or dieing.
so in other words they do it for comfort, though hope i dont piss someone off, though i could be partially wrong
oh I have a word for people like you liers and slime balls also comes moron idiot and brainwashed.

here is my definition of atheism: atheism is the escape from the reality that somethings are beyond human explination, people try to ignore these things rather than dealing with them
that is extremely acurte :rolleyes:

the Catholic CHurch is huge, there could be a million different kinds of people there. it's unwise and inaccurate to generalize.

at last count we had over a billion people

I come from a Catholic family, never go to church, and an not even sure if god even exists. I am under the impression that god is simply an answer to questions people otherwise can't answer rationally or scientifically.
However personaly, I couldn't care less about anyone's personal beliefs at all, as long as they dont push their beliefs on other people making them mad.
try going to a chruch of christ I assure you we are very convincing and not very oushy (unless you end up talking to some of the younger kids) also how would you explain the begining of the universe how did a self contained universe manage to suddenly pop up into existance how did the big bang accure all logical looks say what could possibley create such a thing, the only olution an outside source the result the big bang is a flawed threoy.

at last count we had over a billion people

So out of a billion, if you had groups of 100 or so who were more or less alike, which might happen, you'd still have millions of kinds of people, right?

here is my definition of atheism: atheism is the escape from the reality that somethings are beyond human explination, people try to ignore these things rather than dealing with them

Funny, that's my definition of organized religion. :p

but its something you have to hear about

do you really think I wanted to sit through drivers ed before I could get behind the wheel?

that is bull, i dont need to hear jack from any religious zelouts especialy the high and mighty catholics but you do need to be trained to drive vehicles. I think there is a huge difference there

oh I have a word for people like you liers and slime balls also comes moron idiot and brainwashed.

I will have a word for a person who believes name-calling is appropriate behavior -- that word will be warned.

Express your opinion without resorting to insults.

I find that many Christians of all denominations can be just as onboxious, Catholics, Protestants, and Mormons.
Same could be said of members of any other religions, including athiests and agnostics.

Oh, and to the person who mentioned pediophile priests: do a little research. There are also a shit load of pediophile rabbis and other religious leaders. Oh. And pop stars, teachers, etc, etc, etc.

I have a question for Catholics, why do you follow the Papacy the way you do, hold them up in such high esteem? Makes no sense to me, but this is from someone who has an ancestor in the late 1800's that was excommunicated.....

well we just have to wait to die and see who's correct :rolleyes:

I think that some Catholics are way to obsessive about their religion. It's not fair that they often try and force their religious views on other people. Also if anyone says anything about them they instantly disapprove without thinking anything through rationally. I'm not saying that every Catholic is like this, just every Catholic I've ever met.

The fact that you said that Catholics try to force their religion on others is a statement that I would like to argue. Now, I'm Jewish and I get those "Jews for Jesus" missionary guys bugging me all the time. They are of course, not Catholic. In fact, most Catholics are pretty against missionary organizations. It's those protestant and born-again Christians that try to force their beliefs on others.

I will have a word for a person who believes name-calling is appropriate behavior -- that word will be warned.

Express your opinion without resorting to insults.
piff I've been on the reciving more times then I can count and every last one of them involved my support of bush and MK its not like people hound him for saying capitalists are not realy people :rolleyes: but hey I can change to saying that about comunist if you prefer.

try going to a chruch of christ I assure you we are very convincing and not very oushy (unless you end up talking to some of the younger kids) also how would you explain the begining of the universe how did a self contained universe manage to suddenly pop up into existance how did the big bang accure all logical looks say what could possibley create such a thing, the only olution an outside source the result the big bang is a flawed threoy.

religion is the biggest flawed theory there is. and unlike religion the whole point of science is to question everything not anwer everything with the same dumb answer (god) over and over again, just because science hasnt answered every single question doesnt mean it wont and unlike religion its answers will be correct and true to everyone, and as far as your signature goes us atheists will stay in the ground and rot we wont be in hell or heaven but either will you or any one else ever

I have a question for Catholics, why do you follow the Papacy the way you do, hold them up in such high esteem? Makes no sense to me, but this is from someone who has an ancestor in the late 1800's that was excommunicated.....Because he is the direct successor to Peter, the first pope. Peter was directly appointed by Jesus to head the Church.

The fact that you said that Catholics try to force their religion on others is a statement that I would like to argue. Now, I'm Jewish and I get those "Jews for Jesus" missionary guys bugging me all the time. They are of course, not Catholic. In fact, most Catholics are pretty against missionary organizations. It's those protestant and born-again Christians that try to force their beliefs on others.

catholism was spread by the sword just like islam its proven time and time again that it was forced upon ppl, do you think every one chooses to feel guilty about being human?

religion is the biggest flawed theory there is. and unlike religion the whole point of science is to question everything not anwer everything with the same dumb answer (god) over and over again, just because science hasnt answered every single question doesnt mean it wont and unlike religion its answers will be correct and true to everyone, and as far as your signature goes us atheists will stay in the ground and rot we wont be in hell or heaven but either will you or any one else ever
the only thing that makes you is more lacking in prove them I am, becasue their were no real points just a change of tone to outright insults its like saying "not all christans are idiots" it certaniely is true but that could mean "but most chriastains are" who know that was THE WORST attempt at convincing me yet, how would a singularindivual alone universe be triggerd to activate how would 2 cell organism evolve from 1 cell organisms it doesn't make sense at least are logic is blunt God created all things thus their is no need for a 1 cell organism to turn itno a 2 cell organism/

I'm sick of it being politically incorrect to be Catholic. I'm sick of non-Catholics telling me what it is is like to be Catholic or how Catholics act. I am Catholic, though pretty close to Atheist. I grew up Catholic and know what it is like. Catholics are liberal and open to other religions. With Catholicism, you don't see the type of nepotism you see with Judaism or the religious zealotism you see with Islam or many protesant religions. Stop telling me how Catholics are, because you don't have a fucking clue. Go to Christ.

Because he is the direct successor to Peter, the first pope. Peter was directly appointed by Jesus to head the Church.
do you think I'm damned to hell becasue I'm not a catholic? just wondering becasue some catholics here do.

the only thing that makes you is more lacking in prove them I am, becasue their were no real points just a change of tone to outright insults its like saying "not all christans are idiots" it certaniely is true but that could mean "but most chriastains are" who know that was THE WORST attempt at convincing me yet, how would a singularindivual alone universe be triggerd to activate how would 2 cell organism evolve from 1 cell organisms it doesn't make sense at least are logic is blunt God created all things thus their is no need for a 1 cell organism to turn itno a 2 cell organism/

Off topic. This thread is about Catholicism, not the theory of evolution.

I'm sick of it being politically incorrect to be Catholic. I'm sick of non-Catholics telling me what it is is like to be Catholic or how Catholics act. I am Catholic, though pretty close to Atheist. I grew up Catholic and know what it is like. Catholics are liberal and open to other religions. With Catholicism, you don't see the type of nepotism you see with Judaism or the religious zealotism you see with Islam or many protesant religions. Stop telling me how Catholics are, because you don't have a fucking clue. Go to Christ. do you think the crusades weren't a display of christain zealotism,

catholism was spread by the sword just like islam its proven time and time again that it was forced upon ppl, do you think every one chooses to feel guilty about being human?

Well, this may be a shock to you, but your wrong! Catholicism was spread in SOME parts through war, but for instance, in my country, it was spread through a frickin slave, commonly known as St. Patrick. And thats just one example, I got a few more as well....

Its nice that you can consider "Mormons" Latterday Saints as Christians. A couple Christians don't I've heard them say.

But yes there are miniroities in every religion with over zealous peoople. Even the apostles that traveled with Jesus had one or two, the brothers if Thunder, are the example. Nickname of two of them (I forget which at moment)
But just because the minoeity is broadcast doesn't mean you should sterotype them all. Remember labels can be misleading.
I hate to be critical but its sons of thunder.

Its nice that you can consider "Mormons" Latterday Saints as Christians. A couple Christians don't I've heard them say.

But yes there are miniroities in every religion with over zealous peoople. Even the apostles that traveled with Jesus had one or two, the brothers if Thunder, are the example. Nickname of two of them (I forget which at moment)
But just because the minoeity is broadcast doesn't mean you should sterotype them all. Remember labels can be misleading.

mormons SUCK, they are not christian in any sense of the word they are a CULT led by a guy that thinks he is the messiah when he had a bad acid trip and seen god thats the truth about them!

do you think the crusades weren't a display of christain zealotism,

Nope, the Crusades are another example of why I'm confused about the Catholic respect of the Papacy. The Crusades were just the Pope trying to gain wealth and power by exploiting his follower's beliefs.

Off topic. This thread is about Catholicism, not the theory of evolution.
frankly any insult to religon in general is a direct insult to my religon so of course I had to get up and bear arms, its what I'm supposed to do "Faith Without Works is Dead." and I don't want to be damned in hell personaly.

do you think the crusades weren't a display of christain zealotism

That took place long before the Protesant Reformation and therefore did was not committed by Catholics but by Christians. Do you understand the words I am speaking?

mormons SUCK, they are not christian in any sense of the word they are a CULT led by a guy that thinks he is the messiah when he had a bad acid trip and seen god thats the truth about them!
bashing isn't wise you know (the ultimante hipcrosy)

do you think I'm damned to hell becasue I'm not a catholic? just wondering becasue some catholics here do.Not necessarily. If you live a good life, helping others, etc. and really try to do your best to live your life well, you will probably be in 'a state of grace' - not really with God as Catholics would be, but quite a bit better than hell.

So no, Catholics do not believe you will automatically go to hell if you are a different religion.

That took place long before the Protesant Reformation and therefore did was not committed by Catholics but by Christians. Do you understand the words I am speaking?
and here I thought it was the roman catholic chruch.

Well, this may be a shock to you, but your wrong! Catholicism was spread in SOME parts through war, but for instance, in my country, it was spread through a frickin slave, commonly known as St. Patrick. And thats just one example, I got a few more as well....

no im not wrong its the majority anyways and what happened to your native religion the druids? and catholism was spread by the roman army that conquered every where your at too, and do you really believe there were snakes b4, an atheist wants to know.

Not necessarily. If you live a good life, helping others, etc. and really try to do your best to live your life well, you will probably be in 'a state of grace' - not really with God as Catholics would be, but quite a bit better than hell.

So no, Catholics do not believe you will automatically go to hell if you are a different religion.
I'm a christain here I typicaly except catholics as the same religon as me (church of christ incase your wondering)

bashing isn't wise you know (the ultimante hipcrosy)

its not really bashing if its true and it is and they suck because they call themselves christians and write their own sequels to the bible

oh and I belive the reasons why the catholics think that peter was the first pope is one verse "your name is peter and apon this rock I shall build my chruch"

its not really bashing if its true and it is and they suck because they call themselves christians and write their own sequels to the bible
one mans false belife does not stop redempition thru christ.

no im not wrong its the majority anyways and what happened to your native religion the druids? and catholism was spread by the roman army that conquered every where your at too, and do you really believe there were snakes b4, an atheist wants to know.

Ayeesh, the Romans never set foot on my nation's soil, (just to clarify it, I'm Irish :D)

The druids and such? Weren't killed, they were converted, its really long story really, but to cut it short, Patrick converted the Kings of Ireland, and soon after, the people quickly followed in their leaders footsteps, because back then everyone would follow their leader to hell and back if they had to...Patrick converted peacefully, simply by preaching Catholicism to the masses in Ireland.

btw, the "snakes" refer to the pagan religions. Patrick "chased away the snakes" by converting Ireland to Catholicism from the pagan religions such as the Druids you mentioned. But there was never a military campaign to convert in my country, except by the British, but that was trying to convert them to Protestant....

Look, the Crusades were bad, but so was slavery: which took place much more recently. The Church has changed over the last 1,000 years, so stop bringing up the fucking past. I don't bitch at every American I meet about slavery or trying to invade my country in 1812. Give it up already. Are you going to blame the native Americans for wiping out the Mammoth? Your logic is ludicrous.

I'm a christain here I typicaly except catholics as the same religon as me (church of christ incase your wondering)
they are similar but have differences that matter now while your alive and afterwards and if your laughing at any one from the afterlife your not being a very good christian you should be weeping for these poor souls that YOU failed to convert over to your side

The Crusades were barely even a religious campaign in the first place, sure some of those common folk, peasants and such were in it for religion perhaps, but the Kings, nobles, the Papacy, they were in it for the power, land, and wealth they could get from it. Religion was yet again, a simple excuse used by those in power to get at what they wanted.

Look, the Crusades were bad, but so was slavery: which took place much more recently. The Church has changed over the last 1,000 years, so stop bringing up the fucking past. I don't bitch at every American I meet about slavery or trying to invade my country in 1812. Give it up already. Are you going to blame the native Americans for wiping out the Mammoth? Your logic is ludicrous.
Slavery during the civil war you seprated child from parent, you are allowed to wip and beat your slaves
Old slavery basicly indetured servatude you could not sperate familys

Look, the Crusades were bad, but so was slavery: which took place much more recently. The Church has changed over the last 1,000 years, so stop bringing up the fucking past. I don't bitch at every American I meet about slavery or trying to invade my country in 1812. Give it up already. Are you going to blame the native Americans for wiping out the Mammoth? Your logic is ludicrous.

the church cant really change, its a dinosuar doomed for extinction, so if your gonna look forward and forgive and forget the past you need to forget organised religion as well

they are similar but have differences that matter now while your alive and afterwards and if your laughing at any one from the afterlife your not being a very good christian you should be weeping for these poor souls that YOU failed to convert over to your side
dude my sig isn't serious man I honestly belife I will be weeping but right now while I'm not perfect I realy do get pissed with their logic. and realy sometimes want to see them in hell like romans says "for all have fallen short of the grace and glory of god."

The Crusades were barely even a religious campaign in the first place, sure some of those common folk, peasants and such were in it for religion perhaps, but the Kings, nobles, the Papacy, they were in it for the power, land, and wealth they could get from it. Religion was yet again, a simple excuse used by those in power to get at what they wanted.

AGREED but look what it did for the church making it one of if not THE most dominant religion on the planet

the church cant really change, its a dinosuar doomed for extinction, so if your gonna look forward and forgive and forget the past you need to forget organised religion as well

Had you read my first post, you would have read that I am nearly Atheist. I consider myself Catholic because I grew up Catholic, just like many non-practicing Jews consider themselves Jewish. I personally believe in complete and total secularism. Religion causes more problems than it is worth.

do you think the crusades weren't a display of christain zealotism,

All christians are not catholic, but all catholics are christians. You need to get your facts straight when making inane statements.

AGREED but look what it did for the church making it one of if not THE most dominant religion on the planet
yeah by murdering the oppsition rember what you said about my signature

the church cant really change, its a dinosuar doomed for extinction, so if your gonna look forward and forgive and forget the past you need to forget organised religion as well

Religion changes constantly as the times change, have you taken courses in world history before? A really big one was the Protestant Reformation, which began with Martin Luther who was the first to really question the Papacy and had even taken a list of a bunch of things wrong with the Papacy and put it on the door of a monastery....

Had you read my first post, you would have read that I am nearly Atheist. I consider myself Catholic because I grew up Catholic, just like many non-practicing Jews consider themselves Jewish. I personally believe in complete and total secularism. Religion causes more problems than it is worth.
thats not very christain of you.

I consider myself Christian but I'm against the Papacy...bunch of traitors....

All christians are not catholic, but all catholics are christians. You need to get your facts straight when making inane statements.
dude catholics are still christains thus it is a display of christain zealotism.

I consider myself Christian but I'm against the Papacy
that is what your post should have looked like.

Ayeesh, the Romans never set foot on my nation's soil, (just to clarify it, I'm Irish :D)

The druids and such? Weren't killed, they were converted, its really long story really, but to cut it short, Patrick converted the Kings of Ireland, and soon after, the people quickly followed in their leaders footsteps, because back then everyone would follow their leader to hell and back if they had to...Patrick converted peacefully, simply by preaching Catholicism to the masses in Ireland.

btw, the "snakes" refer to the pagan religions. Patrick "chased away the snakes" by converting Ireland to Catholicism from the pagan religions such as the Druids you mentioned. But there was never a military campaign to convert in my country, except by the British, but that was trying to convert them to Protestant....
so your saying patty used propaganda "snakes" joking, honestly i dont know enough about that particular region to argue about it

I think I can word it easier, short and sweet: Patrick basically preached to King, who converted, then Patrick traveled around, stood on a hills and such, preached to any who would listen, and eventually total conversion happened....

It amazes me how badly most people here (with the exception of Fistasia) misunderstand Catholicism. You really don't understand the beauty of it, the whole community, and the sheer numbers: Catholics make up about 1/6th of the world's population, and half of all Christians - more than a billion people.

First of all some background information: I was born Catholic, baptised Catholic, raised Catholic. And, unlike some, I have had my questions of faith. I consider it a thoughtful gift from God that I still retain my faith, however (long story short: He answered my prayer - word for word). I'm 16 years old, and a practising Catholic - I attend Mass every week, sometimes twice.

We do not push our faith onto others. Faith is not faith unless it is truly accepted by the believer. Only Protestants and evangelists enagage in this sort of activity - no offence intended. In fact, the worst people for this sort of activity are atheists - not any type of Christian, even if theirs is more of an "anti-faith".

The truth is, Catholicism is merely being attacked because secular fundamentalists (yes, believe me, I meant that) see it as a threat to their ideas. The Catholic Church is enormous and imposing, and people think it is perfectly alright to slander it on these grounds. It is not. It is bigotry, nothing less. Take The Da Vinci Code, for example - a perfect example of anti-Catholic propaganda, which is completely unfounded: take this (http://www.catholic.com/library/cracking_da_vinci_code.asp).

Mormons aren't Christians. Plain and simple.

The Crusades were not about exploiting belief: they were an attempt, at least at first, to stop infighting among the Christian nations of Europe by pitting them against a common enemy.

Religion changes constantly as the times change, have you taken courses in world history before? A really big one was the Protestant Reformation, which began with Martin Luther who was the first to really question the Papacy and had even taken a list of a bunch of things wrong with the Papacy and put it on the door of a monastery....Actually, it was what was wrong with the corruption in the Church, not the beliefs of it (or the practice of those beliefs).

thats not very christain of you.

I lost my faith when I lost my virginity to a priest.

Actually, it was what was wrong with the corruption in the Church, not the beliefs of it (or the practice of those beliefs).

Right, thanks for that, I got the two mixed up....

The Crusades were not about exploiting belief: they were an attempt, at least at first, to stop infighting among the Christian nations of Europe by pitting them against a common enemy.
actually they were an attempt to free the holy lands, and the most disgusting crusade of all was the child crusade, no I'm not going into detail.

I lost my faith when I lost my virginity to a priest.
okaaayy

It amazes me how badly most people here (with the exception of Fistasia) misunderstand Catholicism. You really don't understand the beauty of it, the whole community, and the sheer numbers: Catholics make up about 1/6th of the world's population, and half of all Christians - more than a billion people.

First of all some background information: I was born Catholic, baptised Catholic, raised Catholic. And, unlike some, I have had my questions of faith. I consider it a thoughtful gift from God that I still retain my faith, however (long story short: He answered my prayer - word for word). I'm 16 years old, and a practising Catholic - I attend Mass every week, sometimes twice.

We do not push our faith onto others. Faith is not faith unless it is truly accepted by the believer. Only Protestants and evangelists enagage in this sort of activity - no offence intended. In fact, the worst people for this sort of activity are atheists - not any type of Christian, even if theirs is more of an "anti-faith".

The truth is, Catholicism is merely being attacked because secular fundamentalists (yes, believe me, I meant that) see it as a threat to their ideas. The Catholic Church is enormous and imposing, and people think it is perfectly alright to slander it on these grounds. It is not. It is bigotry, nothing less. Take The Da Vinci Code, for example - a perfect example of anti-Catholic propaganda, which is completely unfounded: take this (http://www.catholic.com/library/cracking_da_vinci_code.asp).

Mormons aren't Christians. Plain and simple.

The Crusades were not about exploiting belief: they were an attempt, at least at first, to stop infighting among the Christian nations of Europe by pitting them against a common enemy.Good points. I do hope I'm on your list of people that understand Catholic teaching though. :D

It amazes me how badly most people here (with the exception of Fistasia) misunderstand Catholicism.

My sentiments exactly. I am not a very religious person, but it offends me when people spread misinformation about the Catholic religion. The Pope is probably more open to other religions than any other religious leader in the world.

Religion changes constantly as the times change, have you taken courses in world history before? A really big one was the Protestant Reformation, which began with Martin Luther who was the first to really question the Papacy and had even taken a list of a bunch of things wrong with the Papacy and put it on the door of a monastery....
sure if you consider splintering but jews dont think jesus was the messiah yet

to all people about mormons
The formal principle of christanity is to except reddempiton thru him and to belive that he is gods one and only begotten son.

to all people about mormons
The formal principle of christanity is to except reddempiton thru him and to belive that he is gods one and only begotten son.

yeah excactly not some acid trippin fruit

yeah excactly not some acid trippin fruit
yes and all mormons do these acid trips, and whos their curant leader any way.

The problems I have with the catholic church:
They speak a lot. In Theological governments, such as those in the middle east, the church does the talking, as well as rules the state. As such, when a priest or cardinal says something along the lines of "God Damns those who don't support Isreal", the middle east takes it as a personal insult, because they are used to the church being the head. (You will notice that we usually ignore the middle eastern church heads when they speak cause usually they don't have much of a say in government in the USA).
This causes an uprising of hate which partially fueled Osama Bin Laden's rise to terrorist power. This lead to 3,000 American lives dead in only a few minutes, and a pointless war on Iraq.
The next problem I have is their Facism. I understand that many feel that gay's and Lesbian's shouldn't get married, but your crushing a lot of good people's hopes. Imagine if the Church said straight people couldn't get married. It never will, but the feeling is the same. The Bible is several thousand years old and I feel that it must change at least slightly to accept the times at hand.

Furthermore, according to the bible, if a non-believer died, they would go to purgatory (ghosthood). From what I understand, that isn't fun. On top of that, each layer of hell is devoted to a nature human emotion. This makes me feel that the Church's goal is to suppress yourself and embrace something else. I don't know about you, but I think of the mind as a temple, enter it and I'm declaring war. If they try to push me out of my mind, I'm not letting them in.
My biggest problem with the whole God thing is that he is very much of the "worship me and do what I decree, or eat eternal suffering." If any political leader tried to do that, he would be considered and international enemy, and undoubtedly a rogue state. (Take Mr. Hussien for example).

yes and all mormons do these acid trips, and whos their curant leader any way.
THEIR FOUNDER did and was when he wrote their scipture and they try to convert worse than any other now days, i dont know their most recent high preist of their cult nor did i say they ALL are trippin they just follow one and if i really cared i could look up his name again on the net :sniper:

My biggest problem with the whole God thing is that he is very much of the "worship me and do what I decree, or eat eternal suffering." If any political leader tried to do that, he would be considered and international enemy, and undoubtedly a rogue state. (Take Mr. Hussien for example).
I don't think god is the ideological bigot as you seem to think, He was not the one who created sin he created purity and satan wanting to have the power to control what purity was decied what can I do I'll rebel against the pure guy and then be able to control the boundrys of purity when he failed he create sin to get around it resulting in sin its not so freedom of will struggle its the fact that god is just to nice to smite most people, so he created the flood started over and then we screwd up again so we need jesus and now I don't know what happens next I'll just do what god ask of me.

The problems I have with the catholic church:
They speak a lot. In Theological governments, such as those in the middle east, the church does the talking, as well as rules the state. As such, when a priest or cardinal says something along the lines of "God Damns those who don't support Isreal", the middle east takes it as a personal insult, because they are used to the church being the head. (You will notice that we usually ignore the middle eastern church heads when they speak cause usually they don't have much of a say in government in the USA).
This causes an uprising of hate which partially fueled Osama Bin Laden's rise to terrorist power. This lead to 3,000 American lives dead in only a few minutes, and a pointless war on Iraq.
The next problem I have is their Facism. I understand that many feel that gay's and Lesbian's shouldn't get married, but your crushing a lot of good people's hopes. Imagine if the Church said straight people couldn't get married. It never will, but the feeling is the same. The Bible is several thousand years old and I feel that it must change at least slightly to accept the times at hand.

Furthermore, according to the bible, if a non-believer died, they would go to purgatory (ghosthood). From what I understand, that isn't fun. On top of that, each layer of hell is devoted to a nature human emotion. This makes me feel that the Church's goal is to suppress yourself and embrace something else. I don't know about you, but I think of the mind as a temple, enter it and I'm declaring war. If they try to push me out of my mind, I'm not letting them in.
My biggest problem with the whole God thing is that he is very much of the "worship me and do what I decree, or eat eternal suffering." If any political leader tried to do that, he would be considered and international enemy, and undoubtedly a rogue state. (Take Mr. Hussien for example).

perfectly put and flawless, i would vote for you, simply one the smartest peeps on here, complete agreement with every word :)

The important thing in the catholic/protestant debate is *not* what vile actions catholics and protestants have done in the past.

They've both been lousy gangs of bastards and they are *even.*


What matters is the dignity of the catholic church as compared to the vast array of protestant 'denominations' and even moreso the beautiful magnificent buildings and art that catholics have left the world.


A mass in a foreign language in a beautiful cathedral is truly an amazing thing, and tips the scales in favor of the catholics.

Anglicans are wonderful too, but they're practically catholic :)

THEIR FOUNDER did and was when he wrote their scipture and they try to convert worse than any other now days, i dont know their most recent high preist of their cult nor did i say they ALL are trippin they just follow one and if i really cared i could look up his name again on the net :sniper:
I think it was some kind of smith, aside If they still request jesus forgives them he will wether or not we like it, and supposedly the writer of their "scirptures" was some eypytains warroir preist.

perfectly put and flawless, i would vote for you, simply one the smartest peeps on here, complete agreement with every word :)
even the god is an idiotic dictator part.

I don't think god is the ideological bigot as you seem to think, He was not the one who created sin he created purity and satan wanting to have the power to control what purity was decied what can I do I'll rebel against the pure guy and then be able to control the boundrys of purity when he failed he create sin to get around it resulting in sin its not so freedom of will struggle its the fact that god is just to nice to smite most people, so he created the flood started over and then we screwd up again so we need jesus and now I don't know what happens next I'll just do what god ask of me.

yeah he created woman to bear the sins wich is totally sexist

ATTN: people making enquiries into mormonism, there is a website with a wealth of info on the subject:

http://www.livejournal.com/users/morma

I don't think god is the ideological bigot as you seem to think, He was not the one who created sin he created purity and satan wanting to have the power to control what purity was decied what can I do I'll rebel against the pure guy and then be able to control the boundrys of purity when he failed he create sin to get around it resulting in sin its not so freedom of will struggle its the fact that god is just to nice to smite most people, so he created the flood started over and then we screwd up again so we need jesus and now I don't know what happens next I'll just do what god ask of me.

So wait.. Someone rebeled, creating sin. God, being too nice to smite anyone, replies by drowning most of the world? Which I might add is a painful way to go. This would mean that god is no better then any other terrorist, but just has more power. God, ever merciful, omnipotent, yet he messed up twice (which is hard for an omnipotent being to do) and then mercifully drowned the world, damning them to hell. This guy just keeps getting nicer!

The next problem I have is their Facism. I understand that many feel that gay's and Lesbian's shouldn't get married, but your crushing a lot of good people's hopes. Imagine if the Church said straight people couldn't get married. It never will, but the feeling is the same. The Bible is several thousand years old and I feel that it must change at least slightly to accept the times at hand..
well if they said that I say"go ahead say what you like I don't need the government or you to tell me what marriage is."

even the god is an idiotic dictator part.

well being atheist i am forced to say especially that

The problems I have with the catholic church:
They speak a lot. In Theological governments, such as those in the middle east, the church does the talking, as well as rules the state. As such, when a priest or cardinal says something along the lines of "God Damns those who don't support Isreal", the middle east takes it as a personal insult, because they are used to the church being the head. (You will notice that we usually ignore the middle eastern church heads when they speak cause usually they don't have much of a say in government in the USA).
This causes an uprising of hate which partially fueled Osama Bin Laden's rise to terrorist power. This lead to 3,000 American lives dead in only a few minutes, and a pointless war on Iraq.I don't think any priest or cardinal has said that. Seeing as how they cannot create doctrine, it doesn't really matter anyway. Only the pope can create doctrine.

The next problem I have is their Facism. I understand that many feel that gay's and Lesbian's shouldn't get married, but your crushing a lot of good people's hopes. Imagine if the Church said straight people couldn't get married. It never will, but the feeling is the same. The Bible is several thousand years old and I feel that it must change at least slightly to accept the times at hand.I don't know where you get fascism from. The interpretation of the Bible has indeed changed since it was first written. I don't, and anyone else calling themselves Catholic, think that gays/lesbians are evil or whatever. However, the sexual acts they may have together are against doctrine and Bible, so I cannot just ignore my church's teaching on the subject.


Furthermore, according to the bible, if a non-believer died, they would go to purgatory (ghosthood). From what I understand, that isn't fun. I would much rather go to purgatory than hell, you know. It may not be fun, but at least it's not forever. I would consider myself quite fortunate to be in purgatory.


On top of that, each layer of hell is devoted to a nature human emotion. This makes me feel that the Church's goal is to suppress yourself and embrace something else. I don't know about you, but I think of the mind as a temple, enter it and I'm declaring war. If they try to push me out of my mind, I'm not letting them in.What? Hell is Hell. Layers? Where's that from?

The rest of it comes across as "I'm not listening, don't try to change my mind [on what you say is wrong].". Is that what you were trying to say?

My biggest problem with the whole God thing is that he is very much of the "worship me and do what I decree, or eat eternal suffering." If any political leader tried to do that, he would be considered and international enemy, and undoubtedly a rogue state. (Take Mr. Hussien for example).Actually, God is not really doing anything to you - the eternal suffering part is when you refuse to listen to what God tells you and the you don't get to be in His presence. Your rejection leads to God leaving you totally, absolutely alone, forever (the real punishment of Hell) - which is exactly what you wanted, right?

So wait.. Someone rebeled, creating sin. God, being too nice to smite anyone, replies by drowning most of the world? Which I might add is a painful way to go. This would mean that god is no better then any other terrorist, but just has more power. God, ever merciful, omnipotent, yet he messed up twice (which is hard for an omnipotent being to do) and then mercifully drowned the world, damning them to hell. This guy just keeps getting nicer!
the unconveratble rabis are an example some people will not listen even when a man brings a guy back from the dead, the first mess up was becasue he instilled freewill in his subjects gasp I almost feel sorry for all of us until then he hadn't thought my people will want my power but that was most likely right after he created them and too nice to smite his new group of at the moment perfect people.. the people from before the flood were as unconvertable as the rabis, unless my interpation of the bible is wrong they mocked him even whe it started to rain for the first time in their life times.
so its all just God is too nice to kill hitler in his crib.

well being atheist i am forced to say especially that
well mister I will answer questions to catholics my self pealse :mp5: your self

[QUOTE=Cartaka]


hey man im with you 100% look at them trying to pick apart your masterpiece LOL

God is a cruel bastard...

*drags on ciggerette...*

well mister I will answer questions to catholics my self pealse :mp5: your self

I agreed with his statement i did not steal a catholic question

God is a cruel bastard...

*drags on ciggerette...*
boxs and sends to terrorist every where (so technically I won't have to kill you)

I don't think any priest or cardinal has said that. Seeing as how they cannot create doctrine, it doesn't really matter anyway. Only the pope can create doctrine.

Doctrine or not, when a religious leader say something, they take it personally.

I don't know where you get fascism from. The interpretation of the Bible has indeed changed since it was first written. I don't, and anyone else calling themselves Catholic, think that gays/lesbians are evil or whatever. However, the sexual acts they may have together are against doctrine and Bible, so I cannot just ignore my church's teaching on the subject.

Ok, how about if the bible said that straight acts of sexuality were sinful? Then what? How would you feel?

I would much rather go to purgatory than hell, you know. It may not be fun, but at least it's not forever. I would consider myself quite fortunate to be in purgatory.

This is true, but it still requires you to be a perfect catholic without the god part. You don't repent when your not a catholic so any sin you do is counted against you.

What? Hell is Hell. Layers? Where's that from?

Don't you pay attention to the other side of the scale? If you were smart you'd read the Satanic bible and get their side of the story before jumping to a conclusion.

The rest of it comes across as "I'm not listening, don't try to change my mind [on what you say is wrong].". Is that what you were trying to say?

I'm trying to say that they shouldn't make me put what defines me as myself away and become a drone of god.

Actually, God is not really doing anything to you - the eternal suffering part is when you refuse to listen to what God tells you and the you don't get to be in His presence. Your rejection leads to God leaving you totally, absolutely alone, forever (the real punishment of Hell) - which is exactly what you wanted, right?

Then whats this eternal suffering thing? You'd be insane after a month, you're mind would create its own world, and poof, welcome back to your own twisted version of earth.

I agreed with his statement i did not steal a catholic question
I belive I was talking about my first question or did I phrase that to you ah heck, I don't care any more this threads died it about to begin to burn so bye.

the unconveratble rabis are an example some people will not listen even when a man brings a guy back from the dead, the first mess up was becasue he instilled freewill in his subjects gasp I almost feel sorry for all of us until then he hadn't thought my people will want my power but that was most likely right after he created them and too nice to smite his new group of at the moment perfect people.. the people from before the flood were as unconvertable as the rabis, unless my interpation of the bible is wrong they mocked him even whe it started to rain for the first time in their life times.
so its all just God is too nice to kill hitler in his crib.

If your son mocked you and sinned a lot would you drown him? I don't think so. Where did this guys compassion go?

Then whats this eternal suffering thing? You'd be insane after a month, you're mind would create its own world, and poof, welcome back to your own twisted version of earth.
gasp but on a plane of eternal suffering you brain whould be very preoccupide.

I think it was some kind of smith, aside If they still request jesus forgives them he will wether or not we like it, and supposedly the writer of their "scirptures" was some eypytains warroir preist.

JOE SMITH, I believe

If your son mocked you and sinned a lot would you drown him? I don't think so. Where did this guys compassion go?
hoh yes the factor that he sending them to hell early is so horrible :rolleyes:

boxs and sends to terrorist every where (so technically I won't have to kill you)

oh what now? I'm gonna be boxed and sent to terrorists??? :confused:

gasp but on a plane of eternal suffering you brain whould be very preoccupide.

So.. he is interfering...
But thats beside the point, the loneliness and pain would drive you mad. Trust me. Its a natural human instict. Things aren't working out so you start living in the world within your mind, cause the one on the outside is painful and lonely. The one within is happy and there are people. Unless you want to go to the middle of nowhere and have someone torture you for eternity to find out for yourself.

I think that some Catholics are way to obsessive about their religion. It's not fair that they often try and force their religious views on other people. Also if anyone says anything about them they instantly disapprove without thinking anything through rationally. I'm not saying that every Catholic is like this, just every Catholic I've ever met.


The same could be said for anyone of any beleif system. There are extreme Protestants, extreme Mormons, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, pagans, and so on. Some people take their beliefs deadly serious. And some are content to sit back with a beer and chill. Its not just one group though.

hoh yes the factor that he sending them to hell early is so horrible :rolleyes:

So if someone steals a dollar from you and doesnt regret it, killing them is Okay? I don't see your logic here. Its still a life, never the less.

[QUOTE=Cartaka]
Ok, how about if the bible said that straight acts of sexuality were sinful? Then what? How would you feel?QUOTE]

SO i guess you can be gay and catholic as long as you dont have gay sex? wich the preists have a proplem with

So.. he is interfering...
But thats beside the point, the loneliness and pain would drive you mad. Trust me. Its a natural human instict. Things aren't working out so you start living in the world within your mind, cause the one on the outside is painful and lonely. The one within is happy and there are people. Unless you want to go to the middle of nowhere and have someone torture you for eternity to find out for yourself.
I assure you hell won't let your mind run away eternal means everlasting meaning theres no way put of pain.

So if someone steals a dollar from you and doesnt regret it, killing them is Okay? I don't see your logic here. Its still a life, never the less.

<shrug> people die. Get used to it. It happens a lot.

So.. he is interfering...
But thats beside the point, the loneliness and pain would drive you mad. Trust me. Its a natural human instict. Things aren't working out so you start living in the world within your mind, cause the one on the outside is painful and lonely. The one within is happy and there are people. Unless you want to go to the middle of nowhere and have someone torture you for eternity to find out for yourself.

this is why i am my own god!

So if someone steals a dollar from you and doesnt regret it, killing them is Okay? I don't see your logic here. Its still a life, never the less.
its also like saying lets give them time to convert our children thru their wives

<shrug> people die. Get used to it. It happens a lot.

I understand this. But from the catholic bible, this is a terrible sin. And from most moral views, its terrible.

Doctrine or not, when a religious leader say something, they take it personally.If they do so, it is not the fault of the leader; it is the misunderstanding of different cultures. It has nothing really to do with the Church.



Ok, how about if the bible said that straight acts of sexuality were sinful? Then what? How would you feel?It doesn't. It never would. How else would the race be able to continue? That argument is not really that good.

This is true, but it still requires you to be a perfect catholic without the god part. You don't repent when your not a catholic so any sin you do is counted against you.Do you know any Catholic doctrine? It says "if you don't know something is wrong, you cannot really be held responsible for doing it" - which is eminently reasonable.


Don't you pay attention to the other side of the scale? If you were smart you'd read the Satanic bible and get their side of the story before jumping to a conclusion.I do know about people believing in 7 hells from mythology. I thought we were talking about the 'Catholic hell' in this instance.


I'm trying to say that they shouldn't make me put what defines me as myself away and become a drone of god.If you think what defines you as a person is dependent on ignoring input from other people, go ahead. It won't lead you anywhere fast though...



Then whats this eternal suffering thing? You'd be insane after a month, you're mind would create its own world, and poof, welcome back to your own twisted version of earth.I doubt you would have enough time away from the ultimate remorse at having rejected God to play mind games.

I assure you hell won't let your mind run away eternal means everlasting meaning theres no way put of pain.

Who made this plane? A being of God's creation or god himself? You cannot call yourself omnipotent let alone 'God Almighty' unless you can control your creations and keep them from torturing people and rampaging. He doesn't have the guts to smite people, if he was so merciful he would be "everyone in to heaven!". He thinks smiting one person is worse then millions of people dying, in Hitler's case. If he does exist, he has some TWISTED morals.

Who made this plane? A being of God's creation or god himself? You cannot call yourself omnipotent let alone 'God Almighty' unless you can control your creations and keep them from torturing people and rampaging. He doesn't have the guts to smite people, if he was so merciful he would be "everyone in to heaven!". He thinks smiting one person is worse then millions of people dying, in Hitler's case. If he does exist, he has some TWISTED morals.
see hell is like prison it sucks but you still want it to exist, hitler was a comparrison to the devil while still innocent he could have killed him but since he was still innoccent god could not bring himself to do such a thing. got all mighty has three parts typical god The judge, Jesus the forgiving and of course the holy spirt the helper

If they do so, it is not the fault of the leader; it is the misunderstanding of different cultures. It has nothing really to do with the Church.
the church is still POLITICAL

It doesn't. It never would. How else would the race be able to continue? That argument is not really that good.
gay is not a choice so it is a good arguement

Do you know any Catholic doctrine? It says "if you don't know something is wrong, you cannot really be held responsible for doing it" - which is eminently reasonable. so why do the unbaptised babies have their own purgatory

I do know about people believing in 7 hells from mythology. I thought we were talking about the 'Catholic hell' in this instance.

If you think what defines you as a person is dependent on ignoring input from other people, go ahead. It won't lead you anywhere fast though...
keep you out of trouble though!


I doubt you would have enough time away from the ultimate remorse at having rejected God to play mind games.god can suck my dick now or later makes no difference

oh and I'm leaving and not coming back

If they do so, it is not the fault of the leader; it is the misunderstanding of different cultures. It has nothing really to do with the Church.

Then why are they attacking us? Why don't they just stop talking? Why must they put millions at risk?

It doesn't. It never would. How else would the race be able to continue? That argument is not really that good.

I was looking for empathy. If you can't understand the point of view others are coming from, then you are blind.

Do you know any Catholic doctrine? It says "if you don't know something is wrong, you cannot really be held responsible for doing it" - which is eminently reasonable.

You know adultrey is wrong, for example. You get around while married, but you don't repent cause your atheist. Hello Hell.

I do know about people believing in 7 hells from mythology. I thought we were talking about the 'Catholic hell' in this instance.


Never the less, you still need to see both sides of the story before making your conclusions. Have you read the Satanic Bible? Did you notice that the Penagram is a Pentacle flipped upside down? Do you know what a Pentacle is?

If you think what defines you as a person is dependent on ignoring input from other people, go ahead. It won't lead you anywhere fast though...

Believe me, I hear input. I also, however, ignore people who tell me to be a mindless drone.

I doubt you would have enough time away from the ultimate remorse at having rejected God to play mind games.

2 things. Firstly, wouldn't remorse require me to care in the first place? Secondly, Its insanity not mind games. If you have the pressure required to become insane, you can't stop it by being remorseful. It actually speeds up the process.

god can suck my dick now or later makes no difference

Um...Kentonya.... No offense but your not helping anyones arguement...

Cartaka RULES, he owns you all! ROTFLMFAO :D

Cartaka RULES, he owns you all! ROTFLMFAO :D

Funny thing is: The Allied States of Cartaka is a tiny curropt Corporate Police State. I'm pretty good at debate for a dictator, eh?

sorry that was my reply to feeling remorse for god

Funny thing is: The Allied States of Cartaka is a tiny curropt Corporate Police State. I'm pretty good at debate for a dictator, eh?
indeed, well spoken, if you lighten up on your peeps you slide to a father knows best state lol mine is a corrupt dict aswell

the church is still POLITICAL The Church is not a political entity.

gay is not a choice so it is a good arguement
That's your opinion; many people think differently.

so why do the unbaptised babies have their own purgatoryUnbaptized babies that die while still in childhood always go directly to heaven. They have no sins at all (save original), and that was not their choice. God isn't into punishing people for no reason.

keep you out of trouble though!In some circumstances that would be true, but in most not.

--------------
Then why are they attacking us? Why don't they just stop talking? Why must they put millions at risk?Why is it that they *must* attack us as soon as we say something that is not exactly in line with what they want? They don't have to. We are not responsible for the actions of fanatics. We are simply teaching our faith.

I was looking for empathy. If you can't understand the point of view others are coming from, then you are blind. I can see your point of view, but I cannot change my mind about this. That would be going against the the pope, who on this matter is infallible, and that would be heresy.



You know adultrey is wrong, for example. You get around while married, but you don't repent cause your atheist. Hello Hell.Even if you're atheist, you could repent, just not directly to God. The argument that God hates anyone who does not worship mindlessly does not hold up.

Believe me, I hear input. I also, however, ignore people who tell me to be a mindless drone.I didn't tell you to be a mindless drone - far from it! You can be quite a person and still be Catholic. You seem to think they are mutually exclusive, which is wrong.


2 things. Firstly, wouldn't remorse require me to care in the first place? Secondly, Its insanity not mind games. If you have the pressure required to become insane, you can't stop it by being remorseful. It actually speeds up the process.1, I'd think you'd know if God were around or not. As for caring, you would. There would be nothing other than yourself alone forever. I think you'd be feeling it pretty quick.
2, you assume that the same conditions hold in eternity that are valid here. I don't think you are subject to insanity while bodiless...

Why is it that they *must* attack us as soon as we say something that is not exactly in line with what they want? They don't have to. We are not responsible for the actions of fanatics. We are simply teaching our faith.

If teaching your faith endangers people, and endangering people isn't what god wants, then isnt your whole teaching going against god?

I can see your point of view, but I cannot change my mind about this. That would be going against the the pope, who on this matter is infallible, and that would be heresy.

The second you start talking about people as being infallible, is the second you start shooting yourself in the foot. I don't pay enough attention to the pope to know exactly how you are, but omnipotent and infallible are very dangerous words.

Even if you're atheist, you could repent, just not directly to God. The argument that God hates anyone who does not worship mindlessly does not hold up.

Then why do 'virtuous non-beliviers' go to purgatory? They should go to heaven, but they didn't worship and be sheep.

I didn't tell you to be a mindless drone - far from it! You can be quite a person and still be Catholic. You seem to think they are mutually exclusive, which is wrong.

If you did everything the bible told you to do, to the word, you would be. But since they make mistakes and repent, or whatever, you aren't. Since their ideal is a mindless drone, then it puts the whole thing in question.

1, I'd think you'd know if God were around or not. As for caring, you would. There would be nothing other than yourself alone forever. I think you'd be feeling it pretty quick.

You speak as if you know me. Which I doubt you do.

2, you assume that the same conditions hold in eternity that are valid here. I don't think you are subject to insanity while bodiless...

Insanity is of the mind, not the body. Unless they strip you of personality and the mind, then yes, you will become insane. Otherwise, well, without personality or mind, and no body, you don't exactly exist enough to care...

If teaching your faith endangers people, and endangering people isn't what god wants, then isnt your whole teaching going against god?It isn't my faith that endangers people. It is other's intolerance. Suppose I say murder is wrong. Someone decides to take issue with that and kill some people. Was I the one responsible for them killing people? No. They decided to do evil on their own. I did not do it for them.

The second you start talking about people as being infallible, is the second you start shooting yourself in the foot. I don't pay enough attention to the pope to know exactly how you are, but omnipotent and infallible are very dangerous words.I didn't use it lightly. I meant exactly what I said. The pope is infallible when teaching on matters of faith and morals in his official capacity as head of the Church. He can have his own opinions too, but they are not doctrine just because he thinks them.

Then why do 'virtuous non-beliviers' go to purgatory? They should go to heaven, but they didn't worship and be sheep.Purgatory? They go to a state of grace. Not quite as good as if you were a Catholic, but a sight better than the other 'options', heh. :)

If you did everything the bible told you to do, to the word, you would be. But since they make mistakes and repent, or whatever, you aren't. Since their ideal is a mindless drone, then it puts the whole thing in question.I've said before, taking everthing in the Bible literally is not the way to go about it. Many things in it are metaphors, and taking them literally seems silly. There's no becoming a 'mindless drone' about it. Obviously I have a mind; I am quite skeptical of most everything. If you think Catholicism (or organized religion in general) makes you just another drone, then you need to learn more about it. Or do you just read your 'Satanist's Bible'?

You speak as if you know me. Which I doubt you do.So you'd love to be with yourself alone forever? That's quite egocentric.

Insanity is of the mind, not the body. Unless they strip you of personality and the mind, then yes, you will become insane. Otherwise, well, without personality or mind, and no body, you don't exactly exist enough to care...I don't see taking away the ability to become insane as removing someone's personality.