NationStates Jolt Archive

Do you plan to vote for Tony Blair? It seems to me that most people in England don't care for Bush's lap-dog any more than many Americans do for Bush.

Do you plan to vote for Tony Blair? It seems to me that most people in England don't care for Bush's lap-dog any more than many Americans do for Bush.
No, I'm still deciding to vote at all.

However I only know one outright supporter of Blair, and a few "better then the Tories" types and those that like their Labour constituency MP.

Bush's lap dog is a very much international phrase, wonder what the average American knows about the U.K's domestic politics, how's this:

I will be voting for Tony Blair because:

We have a booming ecomony that survived a worldwide recession,
We have better schools,
We have better hospitals,
We have more police officers on the streets than ever before,
Because I personally respect and like the guy,
Because there is no serious alternative.

P.S: I think Iraq was a mistake but won't hold it against him.

ok, I'm too young to vote, but if I could, I wouldn't. Tony Blair, from what I know ain't done such a great job. don't know about everyone else

Tony Blair is a muppet, why? because he supports the EU constitution, the Euro and he leads a party that make the most ridiculous illogical laws that give the crinimals more rights than the victims, he has no commonsense.
So i am voting for Michael Howard and the conservative party who will have accountability and commonsense if they get elected to govern Great Britain.

Next year, people will either not be voting at all, or for the Liberal Democrats, or for the various Nazis.

Those who do not like the above three choices will the the ones who vote Labour. Not for what it stands, because no-one is under any illusions these days. Rather, because the three alternatives above will not appeal to some.

Tony Blair is a muppet, why? because he supports the EU constitution, the Euro and he leads a party that make the most ridiculous illogical laws that give the crinimals more rights than the victims, he has no commonsense.
So i am voting for Michael Howard and the conservative party who will have accountability and commonsense if they get elected to govern Great Britain.
Do you have any proof to this?

I'm not voting for 'Bush's lap-dog' but I don't want to see 'Mr. Poll Tax' get his way either. :sniper:

I will be voting for Tony Blair because:

We have a booming ecomony that survived a worldwide recession,
We have better schools,
We have better hospitals,
We have more police officers on the streets than ever before,
Because I personally respect and like the guy,
Because there is no serious alternative.

P.S: I think Iraq was a mistake but won't hold it against him.

Firstly, I have to say that I will not be voting for Tony Blair. My vote will most likely be with the Conservatives. However, I would prefer if Michael Howard was not leader, and we had someone like Ken Clark, Oliver Letwin or Portillo (soon retiring from frontline politics) as leader of the Conservatives.

Anway, to answer some of Genaia's points:

We have a booming economy because Gordon Brown is an excellent chancellor, not because of Tony Blair.

School results are better because the exams are easier. The modules eg. Pure Maths 1,2,3, etc. are thinner with less content so the teachers can actually fit them in since the A2 system was introduced.

Hospitals are not improving. Waiting lists are still huge. More money is being put into hospitals, however, the managers are investing it the correct way...i.e. to much burocracy instead of management...doctors should be running hospitals, not burocrats who haven't got a clue about medicine.

As for Iraq, our intelligence was poor...and Geoff Hoon, forgot to tell Blair about 45 minutes referring to Battlefield weapons.

The labour governemnt who mislead the nation on too many things.

When your leader lies his ass off every time he opens his gob there's something wrong. Plus his heart's about to explode, it's time he had a break. Poor guy. Oh come on, he has to put up with Cherie as well as running the country. uugghh (shudder)

You don't vote for Blair, you vote for whoever is your local Labour MP.

School results are better because the exams are easier. The modules eg. Pure Maths 1,2,3, etc. are thinner with less content so the teachers can actually fit them in since the A2 system was introduced.

Sorry but they're not. Exams don't get easiers, since grade boundries depend on the distribution of marks. So if people get very high marks on a paper then the grade boundries go up. Plus if you think A2s are easy try A2 Chemistry....

I won't be voting Labour, I'll vote Liberal Democrats. Simply to stop the Tories getitng into opposition (I reckon Labour will win the next election...just). The race will be too tight to vote for a smaller party, so I'm throwing my hat in with the most left wing party. God help us if the Tories get in...

no, because Labour dont stand in Northern Ireland. neither do any of the big parties. which i think is very undemocratic, it basically means Northern Ireland has no say in who forms a government

We have a booming ecomony that survived a worldwide recession,
We have better schools,
We have better hospitals,
We have more police officers on the streets than ever before,
Because I personally respect and like the guy,

P.S: I think Iraq was a mistake but won't hold it against him.I agree with all these, except your view of Iraq. Quite frankly, I think that politicians should be held accountable for their mistakes. And while I do honestly believe that for Blair, it was a mistake rather than some massive conspiracy, I can't vote for someone who made a mistake that large, and who might do it again in the future.

I don't want it to be like anyone can get off the political hook by going "Oops!"

Tony Blair won't be standing for the Old Bexley & Sidcup constituency (which is where I'm registered to vote) so I couldn't vote for him if I wanted to. :p

I intend to vote for the Liberal Democrats, anyway.

I should be just old enough to vote by the next election (depending on when its held) and chances are that if I vote it will be for Blair since the only real alternative is worse, to be honest I wish he would step down and be replaced by someone like Brown or Cook.

no, because Labour dont stand in Northern Ireland. neither do any of the big parties.


Actually, the Conservative Party do stand in a couple of electoral regions here - North Down being the only one that springs to mind right now. I wouldn't vote for them or the Labour Party anyhow, even if I were given the chance.

Well, this has certainly been enlightening. Now to google all the British political parties so I know just what the hell all of you are talking about...

I should be just old enough to vote by the next election (depending on when its held) and chances are that if I vote it will be for Blair since the only real alternative is worse, to be honest I wish he would step down and be replaced by someone like Brown or Cook.

You want your PM to be an unintelligible ginger pixie?? Nah Robin Cook's alright really. At least he had the stones to take action in regard to Iraq.

The alternative is worse? What can you possibly have against Mr Smug Smiling Gitfeatures? Don't know about Brown, or Kennedy for that matter. I don't know, there's just something unnerving about the thought of having a Scot in control. Please don't take offence at that you Scots out there. Be realistic; if you were Scottish and you had control of England what would you do?!?

How does the british system work? Do you vote once for a candidate in your area, or twice, once for a candidate and another party vote like we do?

I'm only 12 so I can't vote but if I could I would'nt. I mean you've got Howard who's just in it for the party and not Brittain or you've got Tony "Bush's Lapdog" Blair who's scared to make the big decisions. Maybe we should get Gordon Brown in and see what his policies are?

Depending on the time of the election, I will be entitled to vote. As things stand, I have no doubt that I will be voting lib dem - it's the lesser of three evils. Mind you, I have been studying the history of English politics for the last year, so I guess I'm kinda biased. :rolleyes:

I won't be voting for Blair/Labour - partly because of how they have made things so hard for university students and for what is going to happen to tuition fees etc.

One thing is certain though, I WILL be voting. People in our country in the past have fought so hard for our right to vote that by not voting it is like saying that we don't care and that none of that mattered. We take voting for granted but can you imagine what this country would be like if we couldn't vote? We'd be even more expendable than we already are.

How does the british system work? Do you vote once for a candidate in your area, or twice, once for a candidate and another party vote like we do?

As far as I'm aware, with my scant grasp of politics, you vote once for a candidate in your constituency. Each constituency represents a seat in the house of commons.

The Prime Minister isn't elected by popular vote. The Queen appoints the member of parliament with majority support in the commons (Usually the leader of the party with the most seats, but if there's no clear majority - i.e. the opposition could be more powerful than the government, then there might have to be a coalition), and invites them to form a cabinet. The next largest party in the commons becomes her majesty's opposition or something, and forms a shadow cabinet, which sounds far cooler than it actually is.

I'd vote Tory coz their policies make sense.. except i cant bring myself to like a party with such a vile immigration policy. i've lost all trust in labour (who i voted for last year) and i'm not sure what the Lib. Dems stand for, exactly.

I would vote Labour BUT i might vote Lib Dem tactically to oust my local Tory MP. I think more people would vote for labour if Gordon Brown was leader. I've been thinking about joining the party to influence the leadership election whenever that is to stop that evil Blairite Alan Milburn getting in.

This General Election will be my first as a member of the electorate. I'll be voting Liberal Democrats because Tony Blair is a traitor to the Labour Party. He's turned it into Tories MkII. He pushed them to get rid of Clause IV, the most sacrosanct article of the Labour Party, and no Labour leader would be so hypocritical as to use Public-Private Partnerships, let alone claim they are a middle ground between Nationalisation and Privatisation, they're just Privatisation under a different name.
Also, I disagree with the Labour Party's constant flat fines as punishments. It just means rich people can buy their way around having to keep to the law.
I am pro-Euro, pro-Europe, anti-Bush, socialist, and pissed off at Blair's neo-Toryism.
His fox-hunting bill, however, I do agree with; see if you can follow me on this. Blair wants to ban fox-hunting with dogs, and punish those who break this law with a fine. Now, it tends to be the upper-class who partake in fox-hunting, and I agree that fox-hunting is better than the farmer's trapping the foxes in their holes and gassing them to death; at least the hunted fox has a chance to get away. So basically, the government will simply end up charging the upper-class to hunt foxes.... and taking money from the rich to ass to the government coffers is something I'm not going to argue against.

In summary, I don't want to vote Tory, so that puts out the Conservatives and Labour; I don't want to vote for UKIP 'cause I'm pro-Europe; we don't have a truly socialist party to vote for (i.e. SWP are idiots, RCP are idiots, BCP/CPoB are both not my cup of socialist tea); and there's no chance in hell the British Nazi Party will get my vote. The Liberal Democrats are the closest I can get to left-wing libertarianism, and they have a chance of getting into power.... plus, they'll abolish student tuition fees :D .... get in there!

Tony Blair is a muppet, why? because he supports the EU constitution, the Euro and he leads a party that make the most ridiculous illogical laws that give the crinimals more rights than the victims, he has no commonsense.
So i am voting for Michael Howard and the conservative party who will have accountability and commonsense if they get elected to govern Great Britain.


You are obviously too young to remember the last Tory government! Two of them landed in gaol, and one was caught taking bribes! Howard himself was responsible for the Poll Tax! Learn some history my young friend!

If the tories get in, we'll be straight back to the eighties before you can blink.

Tony Blair is a muppet, why? because he supports the EU constitution, the Euro and he leads a party that make the most ridiculous illogical laws that give the crinimals more rights than the victims, he has no commonsense.
So i am voting for Michael Howard and the conservative party who will have accountability and commonsense if they get elected to govern Great Britain.

Woah! For a minute there I thought I was reading a Tory campaign pamphlet. :D

I'll probably be able to vote by the time of the next general election, plus I've just recently been put on the electoral register anyway, so my vote will go to the Lib Dems.
As regards the people who don't vote (who can), they lose their right to complain about politics, as they have had their chance to make a difference, even if it were to ruin their ballot paper.

Do you plan to vote for Tony Blair? It seems to me that most people in England don't care for Bush's lap-dog any more than many Americans do for Bush.

BUSHES LAP DOG?! THIS IS WHOLLY OFFENSIVE TO BRITIAN!
IF YOU THINK ENGLAND IS BOWING DOWN TO AMERICA IN ANY WAY...
grr
We help bush because we feel responsible for america.

Even so I probly wont vote for him

I'm too young to vote. So I don't care. Well I do, but hey.

BUSHES LAP DOG?! THIS IS WHOLLY OFFENSIVE TO BRITIAN!
IF YOU THINK ENGLAND IS BOWING DOWN TO AMERICA IN ANY WAY...
grr
We help bush because we feel responsible for america.

The 'lap-dog' comment is offensive only to Blair, not the entire of Britain.

I'm voting for the lib Dems myself.

BUSHES LAP DOG?! THIS IS WHOLLY OFFENSIVE TO BRITIAN!
IF YOU THINK ENGLAND IS BOWING DOWN TO AMERICA IN ANY WAY...
grr
We help bush because we feel responsible for america.

I find your post offensive.

You state that the post is offensive to 'Britain' and then refer to 'england' bowing down, Britain does not = england.

I'm too young to vote but if I could I would. Who else do you put in charge? Michael frickin Howard? I don't like the way blair sucks up to bush but we need a leader who can keep us on the up on home soil and lets face it Labour's the only party that appears capable of doing so at the moment.
But i really hope that those who voted (wisely imo) for UKIP in local elections vote lib dem in the general election - the look on michael howard if Lib Dems beat the tories into third would be priceless!

I will be voting for the Labour Party in the next election because they have given Wales a National Assembly, they have done a lot to improve the NHS and Education after years of Tory underfunding. They also introduced the mininum Wage, the New Deal and Child tax credits.

The Conservetive Party has plans to undermime and privatise the NHS with their so called "Paitent Passports" and the plan to abolish waiting times so therefore give Paitents the prospect of an unlimated wait. Last time the Tories where in Power they Wrecked the railways by their poorly planned privatisation, they reduced the number of police officers on the street.
Who saids they be accountible? Their "timetable for action" is nothing more then a stunt, they wont be able to do anything on it by the time they claim they will be able too. The Tories also when they were last in power wrecked the ecomony of Wales and Scotland, and don't have any MPs in Wales and only 1 in Scotland They have lost all support in inner cities, The Tories are on the run and are struggling to find out what their Party stands for and as a result The Tories are moving more and more right wing and can only be a disaster for Britain is they are elected, drag Britain back into the problems of Tatcherite Britain.

BTW the UK is not jsut blooming england, it is made up of WALES, SCOTLAND and NORTHERN IRELAND aswell.

If the Torys get in, then our country will be wreaked by the next election. If Blair gets in, then he'll continue sucking up to Bush and this country will keep going downhill, Brown wouldn't be so bad. The only option is the Lib Dems really.

not voting tory: cus there a bit to right wing to do anything positive for me ( im a student-- sorry)
not voting labour: cus they lied to us about that place in the middle east which i cant spell at this time
not voting lib dem: cus they promice the earth and will be just as bad, if not worse then labour.
not voting anything with 'socilist' in the title... in my experience they are all alchoholics with big egos.

ill vote green party - theyl never get into power but they will work with the party that dose to help things a bit.

I will be voting for the Labour Party. They also introduced the mininum Wage, the New Deal and Child tax credits.

The Conservetive Party has plans to undermime and privatise the NHS with their so called "Paitent Passports" and the plan to abolish waiting times so therefore give Paitents the prospect of an unlimated wait. Last time the Tories where in Power they Wrecked the railways by their poorly planned privatisation. Who saids they be accountible? The Tories are moving more and more right wing and can only be a disaster for Britain is they are elected, drag Britain back into the problems of Tatcherite Britain.

BTW the UK is not jsut blooming england, it is made up of WALES, SCOTLAND and NORTHERN IRELAND aswell.

That my friends is a watertight argument to not vote Tory (sorry, not to vote for the Conservative Party). If Red Wales is now of voting age that would probably mean he/she was largely at school while the Conservatives were last in power and therefore in charge of education. I feel Red Wales has been shamefully let down by the Conservative education system.

I think we should use the States' voting system: whoever gets less votes wins

If I vote at all, it won't be for Blair or any of the major parties.

But definitely not Blair. It is his fault that we are now the second most despised country in the world.

But i really hope that those who voted (wisely imo) for UKIP in local elections vote lib dem in the general election - the look on michael howard if Lib Dems beat the tories into third would be priceless!

Never happen, the only reason to vote for ukip (wrongly imo) is the anti-europe vote, therefore they'll never vote for Lib Dems who are not euro-skeptics.

As far as I can see it theres 2 ways at looking at how you vote.

Firstly you could vote for a party with a set of policies you genuinly affiliate with. That is under the assumption that the party actualy affiliates with them aswell. This means you should look into what you think a party represents yourself not base your decision on media coverage as it will nearly always will have an angle.

Secondly you can make your vote based on the bigger picture. As in voting for a party because it is better than the alternatives. I believe having a new labour goverment is preferable to having a conservative one. This doesn't mean vote for one because you dont like the other. You should know who you are voting for. I could go into a rant about what I think of different parties policies but this post is long enough already.

As for making a vote based on tony blair and him being George bushes puppet.
Whoever is in power is going to be influenced by multi nationals. besides George W is just as much of a puppet as Tony.

Look into who your voting for and why, Its important for your own integrity if nothing else

The alternative is worse? What can you possibly have against Mr Smug Smiling Gitfeatures? Don't know about Brown, or Kennedy for that matter. I don't know, there's just something unnerving about the thought of having a Scot in control. Please don't take offence at that you Scots out there. Be realistic; if you were Scottish and you had control of England what would you do?!?

You pretty much summed up what I have against Howard, although really the one I hate more is Oliver Letwin who would be in the cabinet. I support the ban on fox hunting which wouldn't be passed under the conservatives, the conservatives havn't quite got to grips with simple maths in that you can't raise spending by decreasing revenue and i'm aware how much the sucessive Tory governments before 1997 managed to screw up.

Hm… Lib Dems, because they seem to be better than the others:

Labour - confused, slightly arrogant, Iraq
Tories - no mathematical budget ability, anti-foreigner/asylum seeker
UKIP - I actually judge Europe on its values.
BNP - this is getting rather silly.

You pretty much summed up what I have against Howard, although really the one I hate more is Oliver Letwin who would be in the cabinet. I support the ban on fox hunting which wouldn't be passed under the conservatives, the conservatives haven't quite got to grips with simple maths in that you can't raise spending by decreasing revenue and i'm aware how much the successive Tory governments before 1997 managed to screw up.

Poor little Olly Letwin (blatantly next Tory Prime Minister). What can you have against him, seriously this time? Apart from the generic Lying Politician problem. That's kind of standard these days. That's why I reckon Alistair Campbell would be a great PM. You know for sure that whatever he says is total crap.

Fox Hunting. Troops getting killed in illegal war. Which is more important? Passing the Fox Hunting thing was just so little Tony could recover some support by hitting the upper classes.

Solution: Less speed cameras, more dead foxes. Simple

Only reason the Lib Dems are doing so well in the polls at the moment is because they have no political baggage since they haven't been in power in the last 80 years. They're really something of a franchise movement - as long as they've got the name "Lib Dem" they can do what they like, on the national level they complain about council taxes but on the local level moreoften that not they're the ones who're increasing local spending, they talk about raising fuel taxes on the national level but fight tooth and claw to keep them down on the local one. They have no control over their party, look at all the fuss the orange book has made, talk about an identity crisis.

They get a lot of "anti-war" votes - anyone remember any stirring anti-war speeches by a Lib Dem before the war started, I can't remember a single one. It was all, "hmmmm maybe, we'd better wait and see for a bit". Not to mention the fact that them being "the sole party of opposition to the war" is the only thing they can ever talk about.

It's a sad day when the British public are so cynical to the point of naivety that they're willing to vote for a disorganised gaggle of populists, led by an alcoholic, intent on pushing some totally deferential, politically correct agenda.

The 'lap-dog' comment is offensive only to Blair, not the entire of Britain.


The guy who made the comment has read too many cartoons.

I take it if Blair hadn't gone into Iraq he'd be the poodle of the UN, France, Germany, Saddam Hussein etc...

You want your PM to be an unintelligible ginger pixie?? Nah Robin Cook's alright really. At least he had the stones to take action in regard to Iraq.

The alternative is worse? What can you possibly have against Mr Smug Smiling Gitfeatures? Don't know about Brown, or Kennedy for that matter. I don't know, there's just something unnerving about the thought of having a Scot in control. Please don't take offence at that you Scots out there. Be realistic; if you were Scottish and you had control of England what would you do?!?


Can i just point out to you that tony blair is scottish...

I'll just give a list of the parties that stood in my constituency (South Belfast - I believe it may also be Nadkor's one as well) in the 2001 general election: see how many names of political parties you can even recognise here.

Ulster Unionist Party
Social Democratic and Labour Party
NI Womens' Coalition
Sinn Fein
Alliance Party NI
Progressive Unionist Party
Workers Party
Vote 4 Yourself Party

Can i just point out to you that tony blair is scottish...
Or claims to be at any rate.

If I had the right to vote, which at the moment I don't as I am too young I would not vote for Blair and the labour party. For a few reasons; firstly he and his party are single handedly managing to airbrush out British Heritage via the pointless "Mickey-Mouse" ban on fox Hunting and his planned assault on our OBE system and to add insult to injury his support for europe and the introduction of the euro which I detest. Labours pathetic stance on immigration and asylum seekers also means that British community's are becoming less and less British, illegal immigrants can infiltrate our borders and just turn up and claim entitlement to benefits.

I am strongly against the ban on fox hunting, it is not only a waste of public money but a waste of time as it is impossible to enforce this law on British families that have been hunting for generations, they are hardely likely to go along with it now are they? Foxes are a common pest on farming land and if they were not culled through fox hunting farmers would dispense with them in far more "cruel" ways.

Blair has made NO noticable improvements on education or the NHS (he introduced massive tuition fees and seems to think that every one should go to university).

I especially dislike David Blunkett's policies on the police force, insted of employing more actual officers we are employing "plastic policemen" who wear a police uniform but have no actual powers have no equipment and are there to "assure" the public we don't want assuring we want protecting. Is that what you would describe as a "good" police force? taking into account that we pay these "plastic policemen" £15,000 a year what a waste of public money.

Under Labour Bureaucracy, political correctness and the amount of red tape massing around our society has rapidly increased. It has got to the stage that last year christmas cards started saying "Happy christmas" instead of the traditional "merry christmas", as labour thought that "merry christmas" promoted drunken behaviour over the christmas period not only that but the depictions of nativity scenes were "dummed-down" as they were said to offend members of other religions! Britain is a christian nation I do not see other religions doing the same, do you know why? because Blair is to afraid of upsetting them.

When the Terrorism Act 2000 was passed in parliament the police came under scrutiny for stopping an increased number of asian people, what do they expect after all we are looking for middle eastern muslim extremist terrorists! labour has also suggested that in schools sports day be scrapped and "team problem solving" excersises take place instead so that no child loses how idiotic is that.

When it comes to Iraq I feel that weapon inspectors should have been given more time and that a plan for the reformation of Iraq after the war should have been created if it was the last resort to go to war.Instead its the classic Bush in his office large bottle of Jack Daniels in his hand world map strewn across the table, "Oh look theres oil in that there country lets invade, my troops need blood, maybe Tone will lend a hand YEEE-HAAH cowboy ", of course Blair agrees. Incoming warfare heralded by U.S Navy belting out power ballads such as "War" and "we will Rock you" with big shiny banners. An that is why I wouldn't vote for Blair and the new "Labrador" party. I would also not vote the Liberal democrats because if your going to vote for them you might as well vote labour because there is no Difference. I would most likely vote for UKIP or the conservative party.

I'm not getting into any details for any parties, as you may notice. I'm not putting this post up for debate, any attempts to argue with me shall simply be ignored. So there's little reason wasting time on the details. I'll just put up my general opinion of each party.

Conservatives: I agree with most of what they're saying they would do, but we all know that what politicians say and what politicians do are two completely different things. And so far as politicians go, Howard is one I really do not trust... well, he's second on the list anyway. Blair has a track record of telling rather large porkies and going back on his word. And I'm not just referring to the War on Oil Pric... I mean, Terror, either. But just watch Howard closely next time he speaks... there's something going on with him...

Liberal Democrats: Their policies cannot work. There are various reasons for the various policies I am referring to, but I won't go into them here.

Labour: Let's just say this: if Labour gets in again, I'm moving to Canada while I still have some money, dignity and culture to call my own.

UK Independence Party: I want to get out of Europe, or at least less involved in Europe, but I don't want to have to live in a yurt to do it.

BNP: If you like running down anyone who's not white, go ahead. I don't think there's any need to explain why I won't be voting for the BNP. Even if they are not actually a racist party, as they seem to claim these days, the fact that they inspire so much racism in their supporters is reason enough. That, and like the Lib Dems, most of their policies wouldn't work.

The rest: Um... no.

Looks like the Lunatics get my vote again.

To be honest, if i can cast my vote if i am home when the election takes place, i'm gonna be voting for the Lib Dems, mainly caus

A) UKIP - I'm pro europe, so that cuts them out, and besides i am not voting for anyone who has the racist prick that is Kilroy-Silk :mp5: in their party.

B) Conservatives :mp5: - No bloody chance, simple fact that i am old enough to remember what they did last time...

C) Labour - Split party, old socialists (old left) and new labour (centre right) mixed together (chalk and cheese anyone?!). I don't like a PM who ignores 1/60th of the population who marched past his front door protesting against the war and the rest who couldn't make it...Also they introduced Top Up Fees then expect everyone to go to uni....not giving a chance to those who are bright enough to attend the best unis because they haven't got the money....morons :headbang: no wonder the smart ones go to the states on scholarships...still have not done a bad job and in the euros i voted for this lot with my extra votes to keep the tories out

D) BNP :mp5: - I went to uni in Bradford and met a few of this lot in the pubs on the other side of town.....frankly we should be arresting this lot for inciting racial hatred rather than a few muslim youths who some bored policeman thinks are terrorists....

E) Green - I an ideal world i would vote but its not so.....

as a brit in spain, i honestly don't see myself voting in the UK elections.

Traditionaly i'd consider myself a tory. really don't care which party gets in, as long as it benefits britain. What this means, needs to sort out the hospitals and schools. Not just throw money at them, but actually cut down on the bureaucracy, pay teachers better, nurses, etc... (i know easier said then done!)
Take more of an interest in the EU. The UK should be a major player within this group, sort itself out and become an important voice.
Univeristies, keep on the same track, follow the american model more. Sorry boys and girls.

Bush's lap dog is a very much international phrase, wonder what the average American knows about the U.K's domestic politics, how's this:

I will be voting for Tony Blair because:

We have a booming ecomony that survived a worldwide recession,
We have better schools,
We have better hospitals,
We have more police officers on the streets than ever before,
Because I personally respect and like the guy,
Because there is no serious alternative.

P.S: I think Iraq was a mistake but won't hold it against him.
Point one hmm don't know if this was anything to do with two faced Tony.
2. No we do not, we have a huge top heavy way of measuring schools, not better schools.
3. And here I can say without question that we do not.
4. We do not have more police on the street, we have more police but more and more are stuck paper pushing so that some needle necked politician can pull a bundle of figures from his arse when it suits him! We have more untrained police support on the street, with no more powers than you or I and little more training.
5. I cannot respect a proven liar. No I could if he had the balls to turn around and admit it once in a while.
6. Point conceeded but no one would be better than him.
No before you start I'm not right wing, I like a mixture of policies and refuse to be pigeon holed.
NB Excuse spelling I'm off on one.

I'll be voting libdem if it won't invite a tory win. I was thrilled when blair got in, and gutted within about three months. Still at least they don't want use unemployment to create a low-wage low-rights economy like Thatcher's mob did. And Howard is one of Thatcher's mob.

And he's a pull-the-ladder-up anti-immigration immigrant.

i think many of us were glad when Blair got it...should have known better not to trust what a politician tells us....

No, i'm not going to vote for Blair. not that my vote will actually affect whether he becomes prime minister again; also the area that i live in is VERY Labour and will return a Labour MP regardless of what i do.

but i think he's a joke and i have not much respect for him and i'll probably vote Lib-Dem. Or go all out and vote SNP :-)

lap-dog

Every time I see this phrase, I think of "lap dance".
Usually I get very bad images of foreign officials and Bush. What can I do to stop this problem?

Sincerely,
Strip bar customer in Saipea

i think many of us were glad when Blair got in...

I was glad only to the extent that it wasn't the goddamn Tories again after 18 years.

I was glad only to the extent that it wasn't the goddamn Tories again after 18 years.

My sentiments exactly.

Every time I see this phrase, I think of "lap dance".
Usually I get very bad images of foreign officials and Bush. What can I do to stop this problem?

I believe there is a dutch term for lap dogs which due to them being kept by lonely old women without partners calls them 'c*nt-lickers'. I hope that helps.

Every time I see this phrase, I think of "lap dance".
Usually I get very bad images of foreign officials and Bush. What can I do to stop this problem?

Sincerely,
Strip bar customer in Saipea

Lapdance...Bush...I don't know, maybe it's just me but these seem to go together?

I was glad only to the extent that it wasn't the goddamn Tories again after 18 years.


that was the point i was trying to make....lesser of two evils anyone...hmmmm...lets see...where have i heard that recently...ahem...another thread for that topic me thinks :)

I'm gonna vote Labour (can't vote for Tony, don't live in Sedgefield).
On a national level our economy is better under Labour than it was under 18 years of Tory rule (well done Mr. Brown).
On a local level, the Tories down here kept closing down all the old peoples homes, and forcing schools to spend less money. They then used this saved money to allow free parking on Sundays and reopened a open-air swimming pool which needed £millions spent on it and can only be used in summer!
Let's be honest here, the choices are:
Conservative: Moving ever more right-wing and attempting to play the anti-EU card as they lose more ground roots support to UKIP.
Lib-Dems: Haven't really been in front-line politics for almost 80 yrs (as both Liberals and Lib-Dems), but a few years as the major opposition would be good for them.
UKIP: I'm pro-EU and Euro (I don't care whether I'm paid in £'s or €'s as long as I'm paid!)

Also, I've been to Uni after the introduction of fees and loans instead of grants. Though I can't say I'm entirely happy with the cost of uni the loans I was given gave me more money than the grants my brother had been receiving only a few years previous.
I also can't forgive the Tories for the 18yrs they had to ruin the Country, placing us in the shit we were in in 1997 and are still trying to get out of!

Hands up for letting Goldie Looking Chain run the country

While the vote is for local candidates and thus parties and thus only (supposedly) indirectly for the Prime Minister, I'm not unhappy with Blair as PM, given the look of the rest of the crop that might be in that spot, but I have a few ideas.

Screaming Lord Such isn't on the ballots (by dint of being unfortunately deceased), but I think I'd vote for him if I could. Failing that, I've got an even more mischievous streak that wonders what Boris Johnson would be like in the Prime Minesterial role... :) (He should appoint Paul Merton and Ian Hislop as advisors... :)

The only other MP I've got any affinity to is Lembit Öpik, and that's on reputation.

As to the party I'll be voting for... I actually have an important cabinet-member as my local MP and I'm not unhappy with the way he's doing things (it could be done better, but it could always be done better, so the "grass is greener" argument can't be used). In fact, he's been shown to be a bit more human than we all realised, fairly recently, so he's either going to be voted out by a whole lot of outraged local people without the foresight to see that it's just a part of being human or he's going to stay in regardless. My little vote won't count either way, either way.

Poor little Olly Letwin (blatantly next Tory Prime Minister). What can you have against him, seriously this time? Apart from the generic Lying Politician problem. That's kind of standard these days. That's why I reckon Alistair Campbell would be a great PM. You know for sure that whatever he says is total crap.

Fox Hunting. Troops getting killed in illegal war. Which is more important? Passing the Fox Hunting thing was just so little Tony could recover some support by hitting the upper classes.

Solution: Less speed cameras, more dead foxes. Simple

I dislike Letwin because of the way I've seen him speak in interviews, while I know that this may well be what he's been told to say but what he says and the way he says it comes across to me as elitist and slightly arrogant (but that might just be me).

With the fox hunting vs troops being killed in illegal war issue. The illegal war would have still happened under the tories (I'm not sure, but weren't the majority of the votes which got the proposal through parliament from the tories?) and therefore it is not really appropriate to replace a warmongering government with one even worse for it. At least Labour is doing something that I support (incidently something he made an election promise out of in 1997).

I'll just give a list of the parties that stood in my constituency (South Belfast - I believe it may also be Nadkor's one as well) in the 2001 general election: see how many names of political parties you can even recognise here.

Ulster Unionist Party
Social Democratic and Labour Party
NI Womens' Coalition
Sinn Fein
Alliance Party NI
Progressive Unionist Party
Workers Party
Vote 4 Yourself Party
yup thats my constituency.

Student grants, not loans, were still in effect whilst I was a student. That's something I have to thank the Conservatives for.

Now, as a bit of background, I come from a Tory household and I studied Government and Politics in my student days (albeit a few years ago now).

In response to earlier comments, we operate a 'First past the post' system. This means that to form a government (through obtaining more constituencies), a candidate must obtain a 'plurality of votes' i.e. get more votes than any other candidate. Once that candidate has achieved this, he 'wins' the constituency (generalising a bit here, don't go on about councils, wards etc please). The party with the most constituencies forms the government.

When I was doing G&P, we were given a copy of the election promises for each of the Big Three going back 50 years.

My lecturer highlighted to us the many instances where one party had 'Policy A' whilst being in opposition and where they immediately dropped it when forming a government.

Now this isn't that surprising is it? We all know that politicians lie.

The surprising thing is that another party invariably picked up the policy and adopted it as their own for their period of being in opposition. Again, if they made it to the big seat, they would drop the policy to be fielded by another party. The most notorious of these policies was the Voting Reform one.

I think they are all as bad as each other. None of them make good on their election promises in full. Even if they do, they either drop it behind smoke and mirrors or they find another way to get you whilst grinning and shouting "Look at us! Aren't we great!"

For instance, Labour has been stating over the last few years that unemployment statistics are down. Quite true. They are down. However, what they don't tell you is that their statistics rely solely on people receiving a certain type of 'unemployment benefit'. However, the true number of unemployed people is rising as a large number of people are receiving benefits that are not part of the official government statistics. This is called 'massaging the stats'. All governments do it, they always have done it and they always will do it. Like death and taxes... it's unavoidable.

Taxes aren't that unavoidable. :D

Taxes aren't that unavoidable. :D
I just need to work on death now.

I just need to work on death now.



well if you ever find a solution share it won't you!

I wouldn't vote for Tony, but I have voted for Labour in the past (but only because they had the better chance of keeping the Tories out in my constituency). I think they've managed domestic issues quite well (that's quite well - for example they've done well for primary education, but secondary is still a mess).

However they do often lie - "we will not introduce top-up fees in this parliament" - but that was okay because although they voted for it in this parliament, it won't be enforced until the next one - hmm, that makes sense.

On the Tories, I would consider voting for them now, and that really is saying something. If they really can decentralise the government a bit and remove control from Whitehall then I'm all for that - the Labour premiership is far too control-freakish.

Lib-Dems - of all main parties I'd most likely vote for these, as I agree with most of their policies - and I know a lot of people do agree with them - why do people say "there's no point voting for them because they won't get in" - of course they won't get in if you don't vote for them. If we do give them a bigger share, at least we might get some proportional representation in the voting system.

UKIP - the less said the better, but many party member's attitudes towards ethnic minorities is questionable at best. Isolationism gets you nowhere.

But I'll vote for my favourite candidate in my constituency - there's no point voting in a tosser to fuck up local issues just to get someone you like into downing street.

I'll just give a list of the parties that stood in my constituency (South Belfast - I believe it may also be Nadkor's one as well) in the 2001 general election: see how many names of political parties you can even recognise here.

Ulster Unionist Party
Social Democratic and Labour Party
NI Womens' Coalition
Sinn Fein
Alliance Party NI
Progressive Unionist Party
Workers Party
Vote 4 Yourself Party

Recognise all but the 'Vote 4 Yourself Party', being as I am in the constituency of South Antrim :) It's good to know that other Northern Irelanders play NS!

Recognise all but the 'Vote 4 Yourself Party', being as I am in the constituency of South Antrim :) It's good to know that other Northern Irelanders play NS!

Sounds interesting. Do they have a website?

What is the alternative the Tories are for the Rich and the Liberals ..........I am trying to think......Oh anyone who is willing to listen to them Maybe Blair is the wrong man to lead our country but Labour is the only party at this present time to vote for. But Iraq was a big mistake and will always haunt the Labour party if they lose the next election.

The Tories aren't actually for the rich - at least, they don't generally make policies for that purpose (they'd be an extremely small party were that the case).

It's always been the case that the Tories are a tax-cutting party, but that's because they generally take the stance that people know how to spend their own money. Because of this, the rich are likely to support them because they have more taxable income/property, but compare that with the Labour Party.

Historically, Labour have always been a tax and spend party, they judge their performance on how much they spend, not on what they do with it (slightly less the case these days but they still take that approach). And this hasn't just hurt the rich. With the house price boom, Labour have made a mint out of ordinary people through inheritance tax and stamp duty - suddenly people are paying a vast amount more into the exchequer's pocket, not because they are any better off, but their property is suddenly worth a lot more.

The way things stand with these two taxes, and the way Labour throw money at every problem, I know which of the two approaches I'd prefer. (That doesn't mean I'm voting Tory at the next election, though - but I'm certainly not voting Labour)

Oh, and the Lib Dems - income-based council tax? That's a lot fairer than anything anyone else has come up with. They have sensible policies if you actually listen to them, but people won't vote for them for two simple reasons - they don't think they'll win, and they've never been in power before (not in their current form, anyway). Of course they're not going to win if you don't vote for them! And how are they going to do any worse than the other two, whose performances domestically have mostly been mediocre at best for the last fifteen years.

You smug people who jumped for joy when Labour came to power. Laughed as the Tories limped out of government. Cheered your new leader into power.
NOT SO SMUG NOW ARE YOU?

You smug people who jumped for joy when Labour came to power. Laughed as the Tories limped out of government. Cheered your new leader into power.
NOT SO SMUG NOW ARE YOU?


still very happy that the tories couldn't organise a booze up in a brewery and have all the intellectual capacity of a deceased frog "Ladies and Gentlemen....please be upstanding for Mr Boris Johnson" :D and we are in a better position now than the tories would have put us in. but i'm still not voting labour hehe

I live in Scotland, so I have the joy of a bastardised PR voting system. So i can vote Lib Dem twice. Once for the constituency MSP and once for the PR party list. So at least a bit of my vote counts. I have -never- voted Labour. Was just too young in 1997, and haven't trusted a word any of them have said since. Except maybe Robin Cook towards the end. To anyone who thinks Charles Kennedy cannot speak, please go to Hansard online and see the impassioned speeches he has been making to the House of Commons reagarding Iraq. Labour have lost my respect and my trust. The Tories have never had it. The Lib Dems (for all the constant harping at the party being too soft, too stupid, too desperate) have had a consistent voice over the last year or so, have made some tremendous electoral success (I'm sorry, but a swing of around 20% in four separate by-elections is astonishing) and look as though we might seriously challange the Tories in the next election. I don't think we have a hope of pushing Labour out but to get into opposition would be incredible.

All in all : Labour - discredited and arrogant.
Conservative - out-of-touch and arrogant.
Lib Dems - Consistent, thought-provoking and none of the above.

I'm ignoring the other parties because they're nationalist. Nationalism is so petty and 19th century. In Westminster they are a decided minority. Or in the case of the BNP, rabid, ignorant, xenophobic, homophobic scum who would never have been born in a better world.

With the house price boom, Labour have made a mint out of ordinary people through inheritance tax and stamp duty - suddenly people are paying a vast amount more into the exchequer's pocket, not because they are any better off, but their property is suddenly worth a lot more.


Even so, how many people are actually required to pay inheritence tax? Very little.

Don't equate this to Labour support, because it isn't. :D

Actually, loads of people now have to pay inheritance tax, because their houses have suddenly shot up in value and pushed them over the threshold. As I said in my post.

Actually, loads of people now have to pay inheritance tax, because their houses have suddenly shot up in value and pushed them over the threshold. As I said in my post.

So? They not likely to stay up forever now, are they?

So you think it's fair that a large number of people will lose massive amounts of money, they that can't afford, through council tax, inheritance tax and stamp duty, because it won't be like that forever?

And yes, house prices are quite likely to stay up - we're a small, overpopulated island, with a growing population - there may be a small crash in the short term, but in the longer term, property prices will continue to grow faster than inflation.

So you think it's fair that a large number of people will lose massive amounts of money, they that can't afford, through council tax, inheritance tax and stamp duty, because it won't be like that forever?

And yes, house prices are quite likely to stay up - we're a small, overpopulated island, with a growing population - there may be a small crash in the short term, but in the longer term, property prices will continue to grow faster than inflation.

No, I don't think it is fair. I was just questioning how many people it will really affect. You say house prices shot up suddenly. Why?

Lots.

My family isn't particularly well off, but suddenly my grandparents are having to play the system and give relatives "gifts" to stop the taxman getting his hands on it when he dies - all because they own property that has shot up in value.

Most people now have to pay stamp duty when they buy a house (stamp duty was intended only for people buying very large houses/land).

I don't think I need to say much about council tax.

It's not just on petrol and fags that this government have been raking in more taxes. I question whether the increase in taxes has been met with an equivalent improvement in public services (although, these have, no doubt, improved under Labour - they still leave a lot to be desired).

On your point of "sudden" house price increases - I'm not saying people woke up one morning and their house had trebled in value, but it has been a very sharp increase in property over the last 8 or 9 years, and particularly in the last 4 or 5.

On your point of "sudden" house price increases - I'm not saying people woke up one morning and their house had trebled in value, but it has been a very sharp increase in property over the last 8 or 9 years, and particularly in the last 4 or 5.

Try 'a sharp increase starting in the mid to late 80s when the Yuppie boom hit London and broom closets were being sold as multi-hundred pound flats'. Of course, in quaint old Northern Ireland the prices didn't start rising until some time after the first ceasefire in '94.

However, the point is that these things come and go in cycles - thus the great fuss over negative equity in the early 90s as the boom slowed down somewhat and some prices reached a more realistic level.

Lots.

My family isn't particularly well off, but suddenly my grandparents are having to play the system and give relatives "gifts" to stop the taxman getting his hands on it when he dies - all because they own property that has shot up in value.

Most people now have to pay stamp duty when they buy a house (stamp duty was intended only for people buying very large houses/land).

I don't think I need to say much about council tax.

It's not just on petrol and fags that this government have been raking in more taxes. I question whether the increase in taxes has been met with an equivalent improvement in public services (although, these have, no doubt, improved under Labour - they still leave a lot to be desired).

Well, I love numbers so I'd like to see some figures.

As for the increases on petrol and tobacco tax, damn right! Be taxed until you bleed! Mwahahahaha! :D

Although, considering all of the press coverage of "binge-culture", alcohol tax has stayed at the same level (more or less).

On whisky, erm, I mean, spirits, it's hardly changed at all - less than beer and other alcoholic beverages. (hmmm...scottish chancellor, I wonder...)

I don't have exact figures, I'm afraid, but when my sister and her boyfriend were buying their first house in North Yorkshire (not exactly a hotbed for high house price rises), they were having to haggle purely for the sake of getting the house under the £60000 threshold for stamp duty (and if you go over the threshold, you pay stamp duty on everything, not just the amount you go over by).

I agree with you on the fags, but I'm afraid I live in a fairly rural area, so there's little alternative to the petrol car - I'd be quite happy to see very expensive petrol if there was an alternative form of transport - something at which this government, like all others, have been abysmal.

still very happy that the tories couldn't organise a booze up in a brewery and have all the intellectual capacity of a deceased frog "Ladies and Gentlemen....please be upstanding for Mr Boris Johnson" :D and we are in a better position now than the tories would have put us in. but i'm still not voting labour hehe

In the interests of the law I would like to point out that it is actually illegal to organise a booze-up in a brewery. Any party that tried to do this would just be disliked more then before. Or is rock-bottom public affection as low as it goes? Poor little conservative twats.

EXCEPT Boris 'um' Johnson. Intellectual capacity? Hmm... doesn't Boris have a degree from Cambridge or similar?

Sadly it does kind of degenerate into choosing between:

The lying, cheating twats;
The useless, twats (could be lying too. MI6 haven't proved it yet. Give it 45 minutes...);
The twats who would be so shocked to be voted in as to be in a catatonic state for about three months;
or UKIP. Who.. are a bunch of twats.

I'm emigrating (hmm florida's nice....)

I will not be voting for Tony Blair. His governement has been wasteful - The NHS are upgrading their computer systems. This could cost the tax payer 31 billion pounds. This will be paid for buy the many stealth taxes that he has imposed.

[QUOTE=Schnappslant]

EXCEPT Boris 'um' Johnson. Intellectual capacity? Hmm... doesn't Boris have a degree from Cambridge or similar?



QUOTE]



yeah boris johnson does have a high class degree from Cambridge (i think its from there anyhow)...however the ability to learn facts does not always translate to common sense and general knowledge...example of this, i have a very good friend who studied at Oxford Uni but who thought that:

A) The Ryder cup is a football (soccer) competition played at the Millenium Stadium in Cardiff. :headbang:
B) That Bill Gates plays for Manchester United. :headbang:
C) Thought New York was on the west coast of america. :headbang:

so, just caus you have a degree from the one of the two toff unis does not mean in anyway that you are intelligent in a worldy sense, just that you are good at learning facts and opinions on your specific subject...

[QUOTE=Schnappslant]

EXCEPT Boris 'um' Johnson. Intellectual capacity? Hmm... doesn't Boris have a degree from Cambridge or similar?



QUOTE]



yeah boris johnson does have a high class degree from Cambridge (i think its from there anyhow)...however the ability to learn facts does not always translate to common sense and general knowledge...example of this, i have a very good friend who studied at Oxford Uni but who thought that:

A) The Ryder cup is a football (soccer) competition played at the Millenium Stadium in Cardiff. :headbang:
B) That Bill Gates plays for Manchester United. :headbang:
C) Thought New York was on the west coast of america. :headbang:

so, just caus you have a degree from the one of the two toff unis does not mean in anyway that you are intelligent in a worldy sense, just that you are good at learning facts and opinions on your specific subject...


Actually, you just demonstrated that he has an inability to learn facts - from his degree, however, he will have learnt more analytical skills, which are almost certainly far more useful in his job than knowing who Bill Gates is.

Having said that, however, yes, that is very poor general knowledge.

Actually, you just demonstrated that he has an inability to learn facts - from his degree, however, he will have learnt more analytical skills, which are almost certainly far more useful in his job than knowing who Bill Gates is.

Having said that, however, yes, that is very poor general knowledge.


fair point, and to be honest he is a pretty intelligent guy, still tho, his ability, or lack of, to put his opinion across in any convincing manner, which is just as important as analytical skills when you are an M.P. really lets him down. After seeing him being thrown to the lions (Paul Merton and Ian Hislop in this case) on more than one occasion and get torn apart, as compared, dare i say it to William Hague( who was actually FUNNY :eek: :eek: :eek: ) then he should really concentrate on a path away from politics IMHO for he does the torys no favours.

No, I'm still deciding to vote at all..

same as!

Tony Blair is a fucking joke. Anyone who has ever voted, supported or especially continues to vote and support the man should be thoroughly, thoroughly ASHAMED and undoubtedly requires an un-anaesthetised lobotomy done with Brillo pads.

[QUOTE=Schnappslant]

EXCEPT Boris 'um' Johnson. Intellectual capacity? Hmm... doesn't Boris have a degree from Cambridge or similar?



QUOTE]



yeah boris johnson does have a high class degree from Cambridge (i think its from there anyhow)...however the ability to learn facts does not always translate to common sense and general knowledge...example of this, i have a very good friend who studied at Oxford Uni but who thought that:

A) The Ryder cup is a football (soccer) competition played at the Millenium Stadium in Cardiff. :headbang:
B) That Bill Gates plays for Manchester United. :headbang:
C) Thought New York was on the west coast of america. :headbang:

so, just caus you have a degree from the one of the two toff unis does not mean in anyway that you are intelligent in a worldy sense, just that you are good at learning facts and opinions on your specific subject...

I don't honestly think you could talk to the man and come to the conclusion that he isn't very intelligent.

I will be voting for Tony Blair because:

We have a booming ecomony that survived a worldwide recession,
We have better schools,
We have better hospitals,
We have more police officers on the streets than ever before,
Because I personally respect and like the guy,
Because there is no serious alternative.

P.S: I think Iraq was a mistake but won't hold it against him.

Why can't anyone else can see these outcomes? Are these like the invisible side-effects of tax-rises like a "life saving" drug with only mental side-effects?

I'll probably be able to vote by the time of the next general election, plus I've just recently been put on the electoral register anyway, so my vote will go to the Lib Dems.
As regards the people who don't vote (who can), they lose their right to complain about politics, as they have had their chance to make a difference, even if it were to ruin their ballot paper.

When ever I have voted and not agreed with any of the parties I have spoilt my ballot paper. That way i dont waste my vote which was fought to the death for.

I don't honestly think you could talk to the man and come to the conclusion that he isn't very intelligent.


yeah, thats what i said later on....

yeah, thats what i said later on....

Absolutely. I was replying to the other one, not you. :)


Breaking news: Vote Lib Dem! Legalise prostitution and ban the sale of goldfish!

By my standards, Boris Johnson = dumb arrogant egotistical bastard.

Absolutely. I was replying to the other one, not you. :)


Breaking news: Vote Lib Dem! Legalise prostitution and ban the sale of goldfish!
ban the sale of goldfish?????

Absolutely. I was replying to the other one, not you. :)


Breaking news: Vote Lib Dem! Legalise prostitution and ban the sale of goldfish!

apologies, i am really not awake atm

ban the sale of goldfish?????

Best ask Mr. Kennedy about that one, not me.

apologies, i am really not awake atm

It's alright. I'm a bit confused myself whether I was replying to you or not now. Err.. hmm, yes. Ah forget it.

It's alright. I'm a bit confused myself whether I was replying to you or not now. Err.. hmm, yes. Ah forget it.

fair enough :D

By my standards, Boris Johnson = dumb arrogant egotistical bastard.

By my standards Tony Blair, John Prescott, Gordon Brown, David Blunkett, Jack Straw, Patricia Hewitt (*hiss*) and the rest of the lying goons are dumb, arrogant, patronising, egotistical bastards.

As for Boris being any of the above, I have never witnessed such a case.

Well I could never vote for a man who allowed arms to be sold to Indonesia when all that east timor thing was going on. It's like selling arms to Northern Ireland in the thick of the troubles. My vote will be for the lib dems, Labour and Conservatives have had a go and been crap so why not give them a go. After watching things like The Mark Thomas comedy product (like michael moore but abit like bill hicks too) I really don't like blair.

By my standards, Boris Johnson = dumb arrogant egotistical bastard.Yeah, but at least he's nice about it... :)

Univeristies, keep on the same track, follow the american model more. Sorry boys and girls.
Do you realize just how much debt students are getting in just to attain an education? I myself will be at least twentyfive thousand in debt by the time I graduate and thats IF I graduate.

By my standards Tony Blair, John Prescott, Gordon Brown, David Blunkett, Jack Straw, Patricia Hewitt (*hiss*) and the rest of the lying goons are dumb, arrogant, patronising, egotistical bastards.

As for Boris being any of the above, I have never witnessed such a case.

Yes, they are. All politicians are liars.

I'm going to go ahead and assume you've never met Boris Johnson then? When I did, I felt like punching his face just to get him to shut up. Eventually I got bored and walked away while he was in mid-idiotic rant.

Do you realize just how much debt students are getting in just to attain an education? I myself will be at least twentyfive thousand in debt by the time I graduate and thats IF I graduate.
I think that was the idea to prod 'students' into doing subjects that would actually lead to a job, instead of 5 years dossing at tax payers expense learning adventure tourism. ;)

I have been a true Blue Tory all my life and always vote conservative.

Labour have made a big mess, just like they did the last time they were in power, they suffer from too many chiefs and not enough indians.

We were right to go to war with Iraq and follow Bush, thats the only thing Blair has to his credit. When you all retire and cant get an old age pension because good old Gordon milked the fund of your ancesters to pay for jobs for the boys, you will be able to sit there and think, "I wish I had voted Tory back in 2004"

Well I could never vote for a man who allowed arms to be sold to Indonesia when all that east timor thing was going on. It's like selling arms to Northern Ireland in the thick of the troubles. My vote will be for the lib dems, Labour and Conservatives have had a go and been crap so why not give them a go. After watching things like The Mark Thomas comedy product (like michael moore but abit like bill hicks too) I really don't like blair.

What exactly do all of you think that Lib Dems will be good at any better than Labour or the Tories?

Rising taxes? In Charles Kennedy's tax reforms he would be paid less than a regular cabinet member in the house of Lords. At the moment the Prime Minister earns over £80,000 more than cabinet members in the Lords. Why is it no surprise that the lib dem website have no clear cut article on their tax policy though they have one solely on "Gypsies and other travellers"?

Handing over more of Britain's powers to Brussels? More so than Tony Bliar and Peter Mandelson will do together? Probably. Why? Good Lord only knows.

Abolish good schools and hospitals? By getting rid of Church schools, grammar schools, they'd also like to scrap private schools. Sex education for 7 year olds can't be a bad thing, can it? What about scrapping the A level system entirely? Healthwise, introducing even more regional beauracrats to mess with our NHS and intimidate private hospitals. Sounds great.

What else could you want?

I think that was the idea to prod 'students' into doing subjects that would actually lead to a job, instead of 5 years dossing at tax payers expense learning adventure tourism. ;)

Thats all very well but if the job are not availible in this country when you graduate then most people will end up stuck working in Sainsburys as counter clerk. I know I will have to move to another country when I graduate as the jobs just are not in thick supply here.

Oh, now this is going to open a can of worms:

Tony Blair is entirely screwing up the univerisities. I am all for state school entry in Oxbridge and the like, but by improving the ratio with quotas is not helping, it's a crass attempt at social engineering. We have to improve the state schools before we can think of throwing them into Oxbridge (before I get flamed, I believe that many of the intelligent people in the country are from state schools, but is it fair to reject someone just because they had the chance to go to a better funded school?)

His plans for finance are also horrific. He plans to discriminate against the middle classes, by making them pay for their education. The upper classes will still be able to afford it, the lower classes will get help - I'll be screwed six ways from Sunday. It may cost more for the taxpayer, but I am a great believer in education for ability for free: no tuition fees, with more aid, if just in managing money. Also, I think 50% in HE is ludicrous: do we really need that high a percentage? Apprenticeships and the like would be far more valuable than a course in 'Golf Course Management' or 'Peace Studies'.

And Tony Blair is a fool - most of the country were against the war, but he followed Bush in like the loyal cretin he is. He has never apologised, and never will, because, in an entirely undemocratic way, he thinks he knows better than the populace. He is more concerned with a place in the history books than with home.

.

When you all retire and cant get an old age pension because good old Gordon milked the fund of your ancesters to pay for jobs for the boys, you will be able to sit there and think, "I wish I had voted Tory back in 2004"

The scandalous pension schemes from Thatcher's reign of terror has no significance, then?

I will most likely vote labour or lib dem.

Primarily- labour just to keep the tories from wrecking my country again. Like Maggie.

I would rather be Americas lap dog than Germany and France's.

Just so you can all hate me I will probably vote BNP, why?

Because I am a working tax payer sick of being taken the piss out off.
I have nothing against people of different races just don't think we have the space or resources to cater for them.

So will it begin now either the student rants or the your not worth replying to?

Remember its a democracy, people are allowed free speech and the freedom to think for themselves.

Oh, now this is going to open a can of worms:

Tony Blair is entirely screwing up the univerisities. I am all for state school entry in Oxbridge and the like, but by improving the ratio with quotas is not helping, it's a crass attempt at social engineering. We have to improve the state schools before we can think of throwing them into Oxbridge (before I get flamed, I believe that many of the intelligent people in the country are from state schools, but is it fair to reject someone just because they had the chance to go to a better funded school?)

His plans for finance are also horrific. He plans to discriminate against the middle classes, by making them pay for their education. The upper classes will still be able to afford it, the lower classes will get help - I'll be screwed six ways from Sunday. It may cost more for the taxpayer, but I am a great believer in education for ability for free: no tuition fees, with more aid, if just in managing money. Also, I think 50% in HE is ludicrous: do we really need that high a percentage? Apprenticeships and the like would be far more valuable than a course in 'Golf Course Management' or 'Peace Studies'.

And Tony Blair is a fool - most of the country were against the war, but he followed Bush in like the loyal cretin he is. He has never apologised, and never will, because, in an entirely undemocratic way, he thinks he knows better than the populace. He is more concerned with a place in the history books than with home.

apprenticeships are a much better way to go, i've got a mate workin for a big chemical conglomerate, who are paying him to work as well as training him in a variety of skills and funding his degree...and now he is loaded, where as i am stuck with debt from uni, and he is just as well, if not better qualified than i am....crap.... :headbang:
but i think the old system of student grants, although more costly to the tax payer, at least allowed students to start away from university with a fairly clean slate, where as now we are so saddled with debt, dragging our way out is going to be hell, and they also want us to save for our pensions privately...to be honest, i would rather pay the tax....

Thats all very well but if the job are not availible in this country when you graduate then most people will end up stuck working in Sainsburys as counter clerk. I know I will have to move to another country when I graduate as the jobs just are not in thick supply here.
Then you choose a subject where jobs are available! :confused:

I have nothing against people of different races just don't think we have the space or resources to cater for them.


Wrong.

What percentage of this population do you think are immigrants (assuming that's what you're on about)?

Then you choose a subject where jobs are available! :confused:


not always that simple tho... i mean you go on an engineering course etc, you will have major competition for places at the top unis, and if you can't afford it but are smart enough, what kind of a system is that!

Then you choose a subject where jobs are available! :confused:
I choose what I'm good at.

Hairdressing?

Ill vote for labour if gordon brown is leader otherwise conservative. I cant stand anyone that is trying to sell us out to europe.

I'm planning to sell my vote on Ebay.

You should all check out this thread I did a while ago on British Politics, which includes a poll. The results are suprising!

http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=352971

The country would be ruled by the lib dems if the country was dominated by teenage computer game nerds.

I intend to vote for the Liberal Democrats, anyway.
Same here - they're the only party to come down on the right side of the fence and condem our involvement in Iraq without UN sanction.

i'm only voting for blair because under labour it is much easier to get a hospital bed because then it was under the tories. I have diabetes and it is much easier for me to get treated now then it was 10 years ago.

i'm only voting for blair because under labour it is much easier to get a hospital bed because then it was under the tories. I have diabetes and it is much easier for me to get treated now then it was 10 years ago.
Could that not just be because of advances in diabetic research, ease of producing insulin etc? I don't know. As for hospital beds (I only read the Daily Mail, the best source of information since Alisdair Campbell) Isn't it generally accepted that there are less of them around, and any that are there are left in corridors unattended for hours?

Personally I've never had any trouble with the NHS.
Broken bone: half hour in casualty, sling (collarbone), painkillers and gone
Ingrowing toenail (nice, not): appointment for the next week, hours worth on op table (including free oxygen/nitrous oxide mix. They had to take it away from me!!), a dressing and gone.

But there are quite a few who have. Result of Tories? (that arguments getting a bit thin after 8 years but still possible) or Labour?

The NHS is far from perfect but under Labour they have made massive, massive improvements. It's the one thing they have to be proud of.

The NHS is far from perfect but under Labour they have made massive, massive improvements. It's the one thing they have to be proud of.
yes and I pay sheds loads of tax and NI so (rightly) those who cannot afford it can get free treatment, then have to pay again for eye sight tests, and any drugs I may need if I were ever ill.
either it's free (althought it isn't if you work) for every one or let's have the ability to opt out and go fully private!

Could that not just be because of advances in diabetic research, ease of producing insulin etc? I don't know. As for hospital beds (I only read the Daily Mail, the best source of information since Alisdair Campbell) Isn't it generally accepted that there are less of them around, and any that are there are left in corridors unattended for hours?


It might be generally accepted by the Daily Mail, but then the Daily Mail generally accepts that anyone attempting to immigrate into the UK is an evil scavenger.

go lib dems!

go lib dems!

Go...

...WEST?

I meant i will be voting for the Liberal Democrats party

It might be generally accepted by the Daily Mail, but then the Daily Mail generally accepts that anyone attempting to immigrate into the UK is an evil scavenger.
Is that not right? You mean.. the Daily Mail's written by a... bunch of idiot fascists? Yeah that must be pretty close. Plus they usually give West Brom a whole inch of text. Bastards. I WANT RATIONAL INDEPENDANT OPINIONS BASED ON FACT!! Sod it, I'll go get the Sun instead

In Britain, people don't vote for a Prime Minister, they can only vote for or against the party that Prime Minister or Candidate for Prime Minister is a member of.

I won't vote Labour, because their policies are conservative, including harassing unemployed people half to death. To cut a long story short, because of this policy and employment discrimination I was illegally evicted, which nearly resulted in my death. I only moved into that place because they were disrupting my flat hunting with a slave labour scheme.

I'll vote Liberal Democrat (Lib Dem), because they voted at their party conference to stop harassing unemployed people and in Scotland where they're part of the Scottish Parliament ruling coalition they've been abolishing Thatcherism. They also said that current treatment of unemployed people is similar to The Poor Law of 1834, which I then looked up and I agree. I don't care if me voting Lib Dem means that the Conservatives will win, because their policies are about the same as Labour. I'll soon visit my MP Glenda Jackson (Labour) and tell her I'm voting against her. Just an 11.2% swing to the Lib Dems will get rid of her and I wasn't even living in her Constituency in 2001 when we had the last General Election.

BTW, I think that the war against Iraq is one of the best things Tony Blair did, about the only good thing George W Bush did, and that all Muslim countries should be bombed to smithereens.

I'm underage, but still - I'd vote for him, only because the alternatives are awful. Michael Howard as PM? Please... and don't even get me started on Charles Kennedy...

Could that not just be because of advances in diabetic research, ease of producing insulin etc? I don't know. As for hospital beds (I only read the Daily Mail, the best source of information since Alisdair Campbell) Isn't it generally accepted that there are less of them around, and any that are there are left in corridors unattended for hours?

Personally I've never had any trouble with the NHS.
Broken bone: half hour in casualty, sling (collarbone), painkillers and gone
Ingrowing toenail (nice, not): appointment for the next week, hours worth on op table (including free oxygen/nitrous oxide mix. They had to take it away from me!!), a dressing and gone.

But there are quite a few who have. Result of Tories? (that arguments getting a bit thin after 8 years but still possible) or Labour?

they've had ways of making artifical insulin for a while. it isn't because of advancments in research. It's because there is almost always more beds then patients at my local hospital.

they've had ways of making artifical insulin for a while. it isn't because of advancements in research. It's because there are almost always more beds then patients at my local hospital.
Well that's always a good thing. I hope you don't start getting harangued by the Labour politicians when they use your hospital as an example. Should have kept it quiet!!

Tony will probably stand in his Sedgefield (sp?) constituency, not in Eastwood where I live, so I can't vote for him.

I won't be voting labour either though, either Lib Dem or Tory, probably Lib Dem.

I'll be voting Liberal Democrats because Tony Blair is a traitor to the Labour Party. He's turned it into Tories MkII. He pushed them to get rid of Clause IV, the most sacrosanct article of the Labour Party, I am pro-Euro, pro-Europe, anti-Bush, socialist, and pissed off at Blair's neo-Toryism.
...we don't have a truly socialist party to vote for (i.e. SWP are idiots, RCP are idiots, BCP/CPoB are both not my cup of socialist tea); and there's no chance in hell the British Nazi Party will get my vote. The Liberal Democrats are the closest I can get to left-wing libertarianism, and they have a chance of getting into power.... plus, they'll abolish student tuition fees :D

Here here! My sentiments exactly!:D

The Labour party abolished claused IV because the commitment to re-nationalising all industry was naive, idealistic, unpopular with the electorate and belonged to a class of beliefs that were on the losing side of the cold war. Instead they chose to combine market forces and aspects of the private sector with state services - you may argue that they have no achieved a balancing act just yet or that they have moved too far to the right, but given the perils of total privatisation or nationalisation it is a system and thus a party that would get my vote anyday.

I hope to God that Tony Blair doesn't get in because I don't think Britain can take much more of him and his party.
Much of what New (ha, they are still as socialist as ever) Labour has achieved is simply the fruits from the Thatcher years. She planted the seeds but Blair takes the glory. The mistakes of Mr. Blair are so many that any honest and decent British politician would have resigned by now. But wait Blair isnt an honest and decent politician is he? He's a cheap, manipulative, devious, over top madman! I don't think we should apply the high standards of previous British premiers to him.
What are his mistakes and faults, I hear you cry? Well...

a) The New Labour Manifesto stated in 2001 election that tutition fees would (under no circumstances) be allowed. Lo and behold, 3 years later and tutition fees are being introduced. Now isn't that called lying...

b) Iraq. Iraq. Iraq. Don't get me wrong, I think we were right to go in. It has always been the role of the British to free oppressed peoples. However that wasn't the reason given by the Dear Leader. Apparently we were all under threat from WMDs within 45 minutes! That was a preposterous lie based on flawed evidence and he has only gotten away with it because those damned Law Lords used white wash. There was Lord Hutton who blamed it all on the BBC (even the Labour Party didn't expect that!) and then there was Lord Butler who blamed it on...nobody in particular. And even after most cabinet ministers have admitted it was a lie, Mr. Blair still can't get over his ego and apologise.

c) Mr. "Education, Education, Education" Blair has screwed up the school system. He has dimsantled grammar schools, places of opportunity for all and replaced them with "city academies" focusing on 'vocational subjects': in other words a ploy to get exam marks up. And lets not forget that little gaff Mr. Blair made when his Education Secretary decided to get invloved with the exam crisis that his AS level scheme started. Many deserving people were unjustly marked down on their papers because of Mr. Blair trying to get examniation results lower in order to please the media.

d) His fiddling with the office of Lord Chancellor and the constitution. So now we have the faceless Department for Constitutional Affairs instead. Mr. Blair has total arrogance. He interferes with a position that is 1000 years old as if he were medling with a child's toy. Fortunately the House of Lords saw through this naked arrogance and have put a stop to the absurd scheme.

e) Europe. Thanks to dear Mr. Blair, we will soon be the State of Britain, part of the United European States. Thanks Mr. Blair for flushing 1000 years of independence and the efforts of countless wars down the toilet.

f) Inheritance tax, another direct attack on the middle classes to satisfy his socialist backbenchers.

g) The PC brigade marches on. Under Fuhrer Blair, we can no longer call black coffee 'black' (its coffee without milk from now on children), we can no longer place images of the Virgin Mary in shop windows at Christmas (should we offend Jews or Muslims) and we have to dismantle town statues (in one town there was a statue of a pig which had to be dismantled in case it caused offence to Muslims). Soon we are going to need a new word for 'black'.

h) He's attempting to shove Gibralatar undemocratically into the hands of the Spaninish despite the vast majority of its citiznes wishing to remain British!. Well there's democracy at work for you...

i) At the Queen Mother's funeral, he desperately tried to black mail Black Rod into getting him a position at the funeral, despite the fact that no politician has any right to be! This is coupled with the general contempt that he and his spin doctors show for the Royal Family.

j) His immigration polices are a laughing stock. His government has allowed in virtually anyone despite claims that only useful immigrants are allowed. Ha! This year a Romanian roofer was allowed in. What's wrong with that, I hear you clamour? Roofers are useful. Well this roofer only had one leg! There was also the electrician with only one hand. Hmmmm....

k) If his tongue goes any further up Mr. Bush's arse, he is in danger of getting lodged there.

Yes its one hell of a list and I am sure there are many more. I can assure you that I will be voting Conservative because unlike the other parties they know how to run a government. The Lib Dems? This is an outline of their policies...

1) Abolish council tax
2) Make all drugs legal
3) All citizens must buy Charles Kennedy a bottle of brandy each
4) 50 million immigrants need to be brought in
5)......
6) um
7) that's it

The Conservative Party are far, far from dead. They are still second in all the polls, they were the biggest winners in this years Council elections. They have a good leader and good policies. Its going to take more than a suntanned, racist TV host and his crackpot party to destroy them. Or a drunken Scot whose only achievment in life is to host Have I Got News For You once in awhile.

Much of what New (ha, they are still as socialist as ever) Labour has achieved is simply the fruits from the Thatcher years.Don't mind me, but I think it's humorous that you (who, I think I'm right, have a tendency to lean towards the right, which is Ok) consider Tony to be as Socialist as ever, yet others (who have recognisable left-leanings, which is still Ok in my book) consider Tony to be the new Thatcher.

Looks like nobody wants him on their side of the fence (I've yet to hear what the Lib-Dems think!)

I think Tony is essentially the product of a Labour party that found itself totally under the thumb of of the Tories in the Thatcher years. They tried setting up their stall the other side of road, jumping up and down waving their arms saying "We are an alternative!". They even moved their stall onto the verge, but there were some people saying "You're too far tho the left, we won't vote for you" and still others saying "You're not far enough to the left, we're not voting for you" (often voting for the Lib-Dem or even Tory candidates as a 'protest' against Labour, even the "not far enough" ones, and I know this from what people have personally told me, who then couldn't understand why I laughed at their 'logic').

So, after having not a little trouble attracting voters from the other side of the road (or even the central reservation), they (as a hive mind, I doubt if individual intelligence counts in any political party) tried another tactic, and Tony came to the fore and upped the stall and moved it, bit by bit, over to the other side of the road to be where the crowd appeared to be, gaining a lot of that crowd, but all the time alienating those few supporters who had stuck by them on the left-hand curb (plus giving room for the ones over the hedge in the field to encroach on the verge, pavement and possibly even curb) and annoying some of the traditional right-hand crowd who didn't like where the stall was coming from (and that they'd pinched a couple of products from the Conservative stall when they couldn't cart some of the left-side street-furniture across to the new side of the road).

Meanwhile, the Lib-Dems are standing in a small group by the bollard on the central reservation, being amused by the whole thing, the UKIP party are a couple of hundred yards up or down the road (depending on your POV) at a junction waving their arms and shouting "NO! This is the road you should be on, that one only leads to the Channel Tunnel!", the BNP have erected a barricade and impromptu passport control, the Green Party is trying to get the drivers on the road to use bicycles instead, Plaid Cymru and the Welsh Liberal Democrats are fighting over the "Croeso y Cymru" sign, the SNP is tearing down the "Welcome to England" sign on the other side if their border (it's a very complicated piece of geography, this road :)) the Natural Law Party are Yogic-Flying across hither and thither (miraculously avoiding being run over), the Pensioner's party are campainging for traffic-calming methods, the Official Monster Raving Loony Party doesn't really care where it stands as long as its tie clashes (even with itself, if necessary) and they get to put whitewash down someone else's trousers and the Legalise Cannabis Alliance didn't turn up, they still being in bed/on the couch in their (or someone else's) flat, stoned out of their heads.

(Edit: Ahem, 'scuse me. And apologies if I missed your favourite party out of the equation, but they're all in there somewhere, except the Irish parties who are down in O'Mc'Branahanranahara's Theme Pub, arguing about whether the stuff on the shelves is genuinely Irish, insults the Irish or was plundered from the Irish or shows how the Irish are very much like the English but with a clover drawn in the head of their pints.)

I suppose i'm voting in the next election, so...

Labour:

+ Pro European
+ Better enviromental policies
- The whole fox hunting thing
- Tuition Fees
- The continued existence of David Blunkett

Conservatives

-Anti Europe
-Ridiculous Immigration Policies
-Knee Jerk reaction to anything Labour does, v. embarrassing
-Stupid NIMBYist Enviromental Policies

Liberal Democrats

+"Better than the Tories"
-What do they actually stand for???

UKIP

-Small Protest Party
-Anti European for the sake of it
-Robert Kilroy Silk always reminds me of the flu, due to the fact thats the only time I ever watched his talk show.

BNP

-Neo Facist
-'Nuff said really :sniper:

Green

- Small Party

Not really much choice for me then...

Labour:

+ Pro European
+ Better enviromental policies
- The whole fox hunting thing
- Tuition Fees
- The continued existence of David Blunkett
You missed out the limited skirmish in the middle east. And Cherie Blair.

Much of what New (ha, they are still as socialist as ever) Labour has achieved is simply the fruits from the Thatcher years.

That's wrong on so many levels, I can only assume you've not taken your medicine or something. If Labour have achieved them ' cause of The wicked witch of Grantham why couldn't the Major goverment?

I'll vote Labour, but I wouldn't vote for Blair if we could directly elect him. He lead the country to war for reasons which were false. He should have resigned (or called fresh elections) when that became apparent.

It's not great policy (and I'm not proud of it) but after watching powerless what the Tories did to this country in the 1980's and early 1990's I would vote for whoever or whatever would stop them.

Maybe if the Tories moved into the centre and made a case for a more "strong liberal goverment" close to what Portillio was suggesting I would be more inclined to listen to their arguments. Wouldn't vote for them but wouldn't dismiss their arguments out of hand.

The Conservative Party are far, far from dead.

Looking at the average age of members of the Tory party I think we can see that actually they're pretty close. Hence this fixation with inheritence tax.

As far as I'm aware, with my scant grasp of politics, you vote once for a candidate in your constituency. Each constituency represents a seat in the house of commons.

The Prime Minister isn't elected by popular vote. The Queen appoints the member of parliament with majority support in the commons (Usually the leader of the party with the most seats, but if there's no clear majority - i.e. the opposition could be more powerful than the government, then there might have to be a coalition), and invites them to form a cabinet. The next largest party in the commons becomes her majesty's opposition or something, and forms a shadow cabinet, which sounds far cooler than it actually is.


yeah you know how you have all those movies where overweight men in buisness suits sit in dark rooms and smoke cigars talking about overthrowing the current government and puting themselves in power well thats kinda what the shadow cabinet is only we dont let the tories smoke in the building any more

me i would have to vote third party i have found one that i like the policys of (MRL) and i dont want us to turn into something like the US where you simply have to vote for one of two evils lots of little parties forming coalitions better represents the interests of the people without becoming a tyrany of the majority

Everyone seems to refer to Blair (and indeed any leader who helps America in war) as Americas lap dog. What about being instead Americas guide dog. In the one war where British forces were not involved (Vietnam) the Americans lost, bigtime. There has never been any war in the twentityth century (or so far the twenty first) where America has won without British help.

Looking at the average age of members of the Tory party I think we can see that actually they're pretty close. Hence this fixation with inheritence tax.

The Tories have been down before. Historically speaking, its not unusual. In 1846 to 1874 they were not in power and many considered them dead. In 1906 to 1925 they were not in power (although they did play some part in the coalition government). I would actually be more worried if the Tory Party didn't go through this period of failure every once in awhile. As we all know history repeats itself, so a Tory revivial will happen. To think that the Lib Dems will become the opposition is foolish because even if the Conservatives are destroyed, do you really think former Conservative voters are the type of people who vote Lib Dem? You would probably see a daramtic rise in UKIP, BNP and Labour votes but not in Lib Dem.

Inheritance tax is just plain madness. New Labour's nanny state has reached new levels of idiocy with this tax. You are even taxed when you are dead and now inheritance isn't a last gift: its a curse on the family because they have to sort out this idiotic tax. If I had worked hard all my life and wanted to give my family something, I definitely wouldn't appreciate the government helping themselves to my money once I was dead. This cowardly and deceitful tax is just an attack on the wealthy middle classes who work hard all their lives to earn their fortunes rather than sit on their arses getting the dole.

To think that the Lib Dems will become the opposition is foolish because even if the Conservatives are destroyed, do you really think former Conservative voters are the type of people who vote Lib Dem?

You are completly right here, but your missing an important point (which I admit, I mentioned flippently) is that the Tory party is an aging party. Many of its members are dying and not being replaced by new members. The Liberal Democrats are seen as a young party and are more successful at attracting this younger vote. If the Tories don't reverse this trend then they will all but die out.

Also the election system Hague introduced is dragging it further to the right as the members (who by there very nature are more extreme then the public; this is true of all political parties) have reacted in a hostile manner to more central leaders. The "cornination" of Howard was all but a admittance of this.

I work, come from a successful middle class background and stand to lose a significant amount from the estate when my parents die. But saying that, I think if we are to live in a meritocracy where everyone gets an equal chance than inheritance tax is important part of the tax structure. The tax has also taken away the estates of the aristocracy which you must admit were fundamentaly unfair (Just 'cause your great great great great grandfather was a successfull general doesn't mean you should own half of Susex).

So, I personally agree with inheritance tax, and it was in place through out the Thatcher and Major goverments, house prices mean it affect more people now, the question is should we raise the threashold? (I think no, but that though is a much longer discussion).

If living in a nanny state means a state which looks after the ill, the unfortunate, the handicapped and the old then I would welcome it.