NationStates Jolt Archive

I lost the link for this but North Korea has announced that it successfully tested a nuclear device near the chinese border.
The North Korean government says the nukes are necessary deterrent to US imperialism.
Will post link when I find it again.

http://cnn.netscape.cnn.com/news/story.jsp?idq=/ff/story/0001%2F20040928%2F0515512476.htm&sc=1104&flok=NW_5-L2&floc=NW_1-T

Now they are saying they intend to test a new long range missile

North Korea has walked out of talks between the US, China, Russia and South Korea and has made certain demands before talks can resume.
NK is indirectly accusing the US of providing SK with nuclear weapons.

North Korea has accused the US of "Washington is deploying sophisticated war equipment targeting North Korea."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6117858/

The North Korean government says the nukes are necessary deterrent to US imperialism.What took them so long?

What took them so long?
They already had nukes. They are signs since the end of the 90s. But why should they publicy announce that.
Israel for example is conducting a policy of nuclear ambigouity up until today. Though there is little ambigiouity there about it actually.

They already had nukes. They are signs since the end of the 90s. But why should they publicy announce that.
Israel for example is conducting a policy of nuclear ambigouity up until today. Though there is little ambigiouity there about it actually.
It isn't an effective detterant if no one knows about it. To be honest with you, I don't know why Israel is keeping quiet about their nukes, or why South Africa did when they had them.
Anyhow, this leaves me more convinced that Kim Jong-Il is a nutcase that eventually needs to go.

I lost the link for this but North Korea has announced that it successfully tested a nuclear device near the chinese border.
The North Korean government says the nukes are necessary deterrent to US imperialism.
Will post link when I find it again.
:rolleyes: those North Koreans say the darndest things!

(geez, and Bush has been hesitant on a country ANNOUNCING IT HAS NUKES why?!?!?)

:rolleyes: those North Koreans say the darndest things!

(geez, and Bush has been hesitant on a country ANNOUNCING IT HAS NUKES why?!?!?)
Let me put it this way...when a country can turn five or so of your cities (or that of your allies) to slag, you tend not to piss them off.

Japan and South Korea could both go nuclear quickly, I wonder if they will now that North Korea's made it official...

Let me put it this way...when a country can turn five or so of your cities (or that of your allies) to slag, you tend not to piss them off.
However, if it is a rogue state who can do that, one must take some sort of action to avert the crisis.

Japan and South Korea could both go nuclear quickly, I wonder if they will now that North Korea's made it official...
Both have signed the NPT, that would be a death blow if they break it. (I think)

However, if it is a rogue state who can do that, one must take some sort of action to avert the crisis.
The NKers might be rogue, but they aren't stupid. They want to stay in power, and they wouldn't do something immensely stupid like fire off a few nukes for the hell of it, because that would destroy them.

Both have signed the NPT, that would be a death blow if they break it. (I think)
They just have to give 90 days warning and nothing bad can happen, I think.

They just have to give 90 days warning and nothing bad can happen, I think.
No, its for good

"Article II

Each non-nuclear-weapon State Party to the Treaty undertakes not to receive the transfer from any transferor whatsoever of nuclear weapons or other nuclear explosive devices or of control over such weapons or explosive devices directly, or indirectly; not to manufacture or otherwise acquire nuclear weapons or other nuclear explosive devices; and not to seek or receive any assistance in the manufacture of nuclear weapons or other nuclear explosive devices. "

It isn't an effective detterant if no one knows about it. To be honest with you, I don't know why Israel is keeping quiet about their nukes, or why South Africa did when they had them.

South Africa, I believe, wanted to keep a low profile, and would have declared their nuclear weapons only if they'd been threatened by Soviet expansion.

South Africa, I believe, wanted to keep a low profile, and would have declared their nuclear weapons only if they'd been threatened by Soviet expansion.
So they were threatened by it? I bet it had something to do with neighboring Angola, which had a regime backed by the Cubans and Soviets.

So, call me crazy, but would any of you like to see an invasion of North Korea in a year or two? I've written a thread on it, btw.

(geez, and Bush has been hesitant on a country ANNOUNCING IT HAS NUKES why?!?!?)

Because the chance to deal with North Korea passed when it became reasonably apparent that they already had nuclear weapons. From that point onward, multilateral talks were the best chance of getting North Korea to disarm.

So they were threatened by it? I bet it had something to do with neighboring Angola, which had a regime backed by the Cubans and Soviets.

I don't remember the details that well, but by the time South Africa announced its nuclear program, hadn't it already dismantled its weapons?

I don't remember the details that well, but by the time South Africa announced its nuclear program, hadn't it already dismantled its weapons?
Yeah. I think Nelson Mandela decided to break the ice on the program.

So they were threatened by it? I bet it had something to do with neighboring Angola, which had a regime backed by the Cubans and Soviets.

The soviets actively conducted no-fly zones over South Africa and we may have thought some air and naval battles against them. We were also allied against them during war in Korea with the US flying at our sides.

All 9 of our nuclear weapons have been dismantled. We dont need them anymore now that the government is too corrupt to fund a decent military.

No, its for good

"Article II

Each non-nuclear-weapon State Party to the Treaty undertakes not to receive the transfer from any transferor whatsoever of nuclear weapons or other nuclear explosive devices or of control over such weapons or explosive devices directly, or indirectly; not to manufacture or otherwise acquire nuclear weapons or other nuclear explosive devices; and not to seek or receive any assistance in the manufacture of nuclear weapons or other nuclear explosive devices. "
Read Article X Part 1,
"Each party shall in exercising its national sovereignty have the right to withdraw from the Treaty..."

who didnt see this coming


"uhh that big cloud you saw? yeah it was a uhhh forrest fire, yeah thats it forrest fire. why is there a big hole in the ground? uhh, the forrest fire was caused by a tree spontaneously combusting, yup thats right."

and for anyone on the pacific coast or hawaii, heres a refresher course

http://www.ebaumsworld.com/dac.shtml

Read Article X Part 1,
"Each party shall in exercising its national sovereignty have the right to withdraw from the Treaty..."
Someone needs to tell the Iranian President... :D

I think China would intervene if North Korea got to be too big of a risk.

I think China would intervene if North Korea got to be too big of a risk.For Beijing....NK is a strategic piece....

Think about it as a Chess game... China is using NK to keep USA and Japan off-balance...

For Beijing....NK is a strategic piece....

Think about it as a Chess game... China is using NK to keep USA and Japan off-balance...

But if North Korea got so out of control that the US contemplated an invasion, then I imagine China would just move in to stop that. I don't think China would be comfortable with the US right on it's borders if they did invade North Korea.

Yeah. I think Nelson Mandela decided to break the ice on the program.

Actually, iirc, they were dismantled by the last apartheid government, because they couldn't stand the thought of blacks with nukes - this is possibly the only time in history that racism has had a positive effect

But if North Korea got so out of control that the US contemplated an invasion, ....the US is not contemplating an invasion, the US has too much to lose...and basicaly nothing to gain...

Why exactly is it that many of you seem to think that North Korea having nuclear weapons means the U.S should invade? I mean, Canada isn't freaking out because the U.S (a rogue state by its own definition, re: Chomsky) has nukes, and yes, although we are allies, you end up treating us like a red-headed step-child most of the time. Frankly, I'm more worried about all the weapons-grade plutonium that has gone missing since the collapse of the Soviet Union, only to be rerouted into the hands of the Russian mafia or breakaway republics. Things are much more unstable on that side than in N. Korea. I'm nervous about ANYONE having nukes...but I certainly wouldn't consider INVADING a country that has the power to bomb me back to the middle ages!!!!!!! Let's not start MAD again, please.

the US is not contemplating an invasion, the US has too much to lose...and basicaly nothing to gain...

Oh, I know. But if the situation got so bad that the US contemplated invasion, I think China would do it for us to keep us away from them.

and that is what i call "wishfull thinking"

ok, first of all.
There is not going to be a war.
And if China were to invade North korea, the US might end up defending North korea from Chinese aggression.