NationStates Jolt Archive

Usually i read fantasy books to relax or kill time, but lately ive decided i need a break from this and to change to something different for a while, otherwise it just gets stale. Ive get more than enough factual reading to do for various different reasons, so was looking towards any good sci-fi books. Ive heard Asimov(sp?) and Arthur.C.Clarke are generally considered best, whats your opinion on these, or any other, authors for me to start out with??

Cheers

Both Asimov and Clarke are great, as is Ray Bradbury (The Martian Chronicles).
But the one you really need to read is Philip K. Dick.
You've probably seen movie adaptations of his work already, as Blade Runner, Total Recall, and Minority Report are all based on short stories of his.
"The Man in the High Castle" is excellent, but his short stories are where he really shines. Get a collection of them; I don't think you'll regret it.

Douglas Adams.

Watch Mobile Suit Gundam - lot's of sci-fi and philosophy

Asimov is amazing. Also, try Dan Simmons' Hyperion series. It's quite good.

Frank Herbert: Dune is a classic.

Dan Simmons : Hyperion, Peter Hamilton Nightdawn' trilogy are some of my favorite.

Well blade runner is one of my favourite movies so thats certainly a welcome suggestion, FutureExistence. On the same note when i saw Dune the movie i wasnt that impressed so is it really worth reading the novel? I know film makers sometimes take liberties when converting books to film, but if the movie was an accurate conversation i think ill give it a miss.

robert heinlein. the big fat ones. the skinny ones are Ok but dont miss "stranger in a strange land"

phillip k dick is great for ideas but he wasnt much of a writer

im very partial to david brin. hes a good writer and very good at creating a believable world. the uplift books are very good. my favorite of his is glory season.

connie willis is excellent. she has a habit of tossing in annoying characters just to have more conflict in the book but her work really moves me. who else could come up with the idea that when you die, you dont go to heaven, you go to the titanic? (passages) my son has read one of her books, "to say nothing of the dog" a dozen times.

sherri tepper is excellent. she is only partially science fiction in my opinion since all of her books contain some element of magic. "a plague of angels" changed my whole opinion of space travel.

gee ive read science fiction my whole life, you would think i could come up with more names. my son loves robert jordans wheel of time series. he tells me that the last few books havent been worth bothering with though

oh yeah, dont skip the hitch hikers guide to the galaxy, all well read people should have it on their shelves.

norman spinrad's "the iron dream"

Well blade runner is one of my favourite movies so thats certainly a welcome suggestion, FutureExistence. On the same note when i saw Dune the movie i wasnt that impressed so is it really worth reading the novel? I know film makers sometimes take liberties when converting books to film, but if the movie was an accurate conversation i think ill give it a miss.
oohh dune is SOOO Much better than the movie
its so well written you feel like you have been IN that universe.

the farther along you go in the series the more herberts writing style starts to bug you but you wont regret spending your hard earned reading time on it.

I've always been partial to Blade Runner.

Without a doubt Douglas Adam's Hitch Hiker's guide to the Galaxy. There really is nothing more science fictiony and hilarious that this trilogy of 5.

If you're looking for good action-oriented, character-driven sci-fi I would read Starship Troopers by Robert Heinlein (NOT the novelization of the shitty movie) and A Hymn Before Battle by John Ringo.

If you're looking for good philosophical stuff, read anything by Heinlein other than the Glory Road.

I've always been partial to Blade Runner.
based on philip k. dick's "do androids dream of electric sheep" the novel is very different from the movie, but pkd is always a worthwhile if strange and sometimes confusing read.

If you're looking for good action-oriented, character-driven sci-fi I would read Starship Troopers by Robert Heinlein (NOT the novelization of the shitty movie) and A Hymn Before Battle by John Ringo.

If you're looking for good philosophical stuff, read anything by Heinlein other than the Glory Road.
heinlein's 50s juveniles are always interesting, try "star beast", "citizen of the galaxy", and "a tunnel in the sky" as well for that period. for his more adult work i recommend,"the moon is a harsh mistress". skip anything he wrote from the early 70s on unless you are a huge fan. my own personal opinion is he got senile around then and they just kept publishing his increasing aweful crap out of respect for his legend.

If you think you could like military sci-fi try David Weber's "Honor Harrington"-Series. The last books are more about the interstellar politics than about battles but not bad at all. Especially the first books are real space-opera (and if you like the books you'll need time, there are still more HH books to be written and published).

norman spinrad's "the iron dream"

ITYM Adolf Hitler's Lord Of The Swastika.

Usually i read fantasy books to relax or kill time, but lately ive decided i need a break from this and to change to something different for a while, otherwise it just gets stale. Ive get more than enough factual reading to do for various different reasons, so was looking towards any good sci-fi books. Ive heard Asimov(sp?) and Arthur.C.Clarke are generally considered best, whats your opinion on these, or any other, authors for me to start out with??

Cheers
Read I,Robot by Isaac Asimov.

If you're looking for good action-oriented, character-driven sci-fi I would read Starship Troopers by Robert Heinlein (NOT the novelization of the shitty movie) heinlein's 50s juveniles are always interesting, try "star beast", "citizen of the galaxy", and "a tunnel in the sky" as well for that period. for his more adult work i recommend,"the moon is a harsh mistress".

Anybody know why they changed the central character's race when they made the film of Starship Troopers? In the novel he is a Filipino (and I'll just note in passing that the central character in Tunnel In The Sky* is black, despite often being protrayed on covers as a white guy...)

Similar to Starship Troopers is Haldeman's The Forever War - something of a response to Heinlein's vision of warfare written by someone who actually served at the frontlines. It also features the same kind of mobile combat suits.



* Sometimes also refered to in discussion as TitS.

norman spinrad's "the iron dream"

A very strange, but rather wonderful, tome.

William Gibson for a blast. Ian/Ian M Banks for fun.

A very strange, but rather wonderful, tome.

William Gibson for a blast. Ian/Ian M Banks for fun.

The Iron Dream is a brilliant book, though why someone named "Nationalist Valhalla" would be a fan I have trouble seeing, it seemed to me to be an interesting window into Hitler's insanity, though maybe you have a different perspective, or maybe I'm just judging by names alone and talking bullshit...
Anyhow, Ian M. Banks and Gibson are both brilliant, try the Nights Dawn trilogy by Peter F. Hamilton if you've got time to kill, a sweepingly intricate tale...Most stuff by Larry Niven is brilliant, the Ringworld books especially, but then his collaborations with Jerry Pournelle on The Mote in God's Eye and The Mote Around Murcheson's Eye really are something special...I would reiterate Ashmoria's point not to miss Heinlein's Stranger In Strange Land, but The Moon is a Harsh Mistress is also brilliant...Poul Anderson has written some god books, inculding possibly my favourite book ever A Midsummer Tempest, thugh it's not Sci-Fi, and Ursula LeGuin is brilliant, though more of her books are Fantasy...

Asimov is overated and dated...

Orson Scott Card is an awesome author. I would recommend reading the Ender series. Ender's Game is one of the best sci-fi books I have ever read. Micheal Crichton is also a good author, but I'm not sure if his books would be considered sci-fi, probably not.

The Iron Dream is a brilliant book, though why someone named "Nationalist Valhalla" would be a fan I have trouble seeing

Think about it.

Most stuff by Larry Niven is brilliant, the Ringworld books especially, but then his collaborations with Jerry Pournelle on The Mote in God's Eye and The Mote Around Murcheson's Eye really are something special...

There was a very serious drop-off in quality from Niven sometime in the early 80s, and he has never recovered from it, but yes, his earlier works are definitely worth a look.


Asimov is overated and dated...

And writes with all the flair and panache of a VCR technical manual.


******

Ive heard Asimov(sp?) and Arthur.C.Clarke are generally considered best, whats your opinion on these, or any other, authors for me to start out with??

ACC is definitely worth reading, although his characters can be somewhat wooden. Rendezvous With Rama is probably his most entertaining novel. Avoid any and all of the sharecropped novels which appear under the name [i]Arthur C Clarke & Gentry Lee[/quote] - ACC has just provided the plotoutline and Lee has then done the actual writing. They are turgid and unpleasent.

***
Would a nation called 'Aryan Supremacy' have their opinion of Asimov and Clarke affected in any way if they knew that one was of Jewish descent and the other homosexual?

I'd like to say, before you read recent SF, you have to read a few of Edgar Rice Burrough (http://www.literature.org/authors/burroughs-edgar-rice/)'s Barsoom stories. They're referenced much more than you think. Starts with "A Princess of Mars." There were a dozen total, 5 are free there.

Asimov I've always enjoyed. Get an anthology of his short stories. The Robot Novels (The Eliah Bailey Trilogy) are only good if you're attached to his universe, and the Foundation Trilogy (actually 5 books) is epic, but not written in the enthralling manner of the other greats. He generally has one amazing idea per story, be it book or short.

Clarke I never got into. Nothing happens in his stories, they're not particularly well written, and the ideas have become stock since he made them up. He sculpted the field, and he writes characters well, but nothing else is amazing.

Heinlein is the greatest author of modern times. There's not even a debate. Anyone who says otherwise is simply ignorant or an unclean brute.
His "Have Spacesuit, Will Travel" is surprisingly deep & funny, even though you could enjoy it with just a quick glance over. If you're looking for a quick read, go for it.
Otherwise, my favorite's his "Job: A Comedy of Justice." As always, it has the last twist you would expect, but it makes perfect sense.
If you read Stranger, make sure it's a version which says on the jacket "unabridged." It loses the funniest scenes & most of the drama otherwise, though it adds a few hours.
If you need more proof than my word that he's cool- RAH graduated Annapolis & he owned a silver mine.

Also, Theodore Sturgeon's the most underrated author currently dead. If you can find one of his anthologies (Esp. "A Saucer of Loneliness," the seventh one), you've found more than the average career. The title story is one of the two that're recognized as making SF recognized as a "serious" field of writing, and is the one story that I hand-typed in its entirety and think it was worth it.
Also, Sturgeon wrote "Asimov's" Three Laws of Robotics, & The Prime Directive for Star Trek.
Granted, he would have starved without publishing that great story if it weren't for Heinlein, and SF/Fantasy'd of lost 20 years of respect, but hey.

Andre Norton wrote one story about 50 different times, but he wrote it best as "Star Guard," which was recently expanded into "Star Soldier."

Orson Scott Card wrote one good SF Novel- "A Planet Called Treason." It's got plot-holes galore, it's internally inconsistent, it's obvious he likes his characters more than is good for the story & it reads like something I wrote back in Junior High, but it's just FUN. Unfortunately, no-one carries it off Amazon.

Orson Scott Card. Asimov. Herbert.

Here's a name that may sound familiar: Piers Anthony.

He blends sci-fi and fantasy together in one particular collection of novels called 'The Apprentice Adept' series. Excellent books. 'Split Infinity' is the first book of the series.

The quick synopsis of the book is that in involves a character named Stile who discovers that his world, the technological world called Proton has a sister world called Phase where magic exists. It turns out that he is critical to the survival of both worlds.

For Card, read the Ender Series and the Ender's Shadow series. I don't know which I prefer. They both rock. Bean rocks. Ender Rocks. *nod*

In my opinion, Asimov (especially his Foundation Trilogy) is an exceptional author, and, strangely, the only male author to make it in to my top five science-fiction writers.

1) As Ashmoria pointed out Sherri S Tepper is a fantastic writer... some of her work is a bit 'odd', or has an ending that doesn't always sit right with the reader, but her use of language is divine. Some of her stuff is harder sci-fi (like Fresco), some of it almost Fantasy (like the True Game trilogies), but it is all exceptionally well written. "Raising the Stones" and "The Gate to Women's Country" are my personal favourites.

2) Julian May has been writing quality sci-fi for about 25 years now... the high point being the Saga of the Exiles books: "The Manycoloured Land", "The Golden Torc", "The Nonborn King" and "The Adversary". Think of Tolkein writing a science-fiction version of the Lord of the Rings...

3) Anne MacCaffrey is another long-standing contributor to the field of sci-fi. Most famous for her "Pern" books (of which "Moreta" is a favourite), she has also written an eclectic collection of other science-fiction works: the "Doona" books, Restoree, the "Crystal Singer" trilogy, and some excellent near-future metapsychic stories... (the "Pegasus" books).

4) Andre Norton: Another prolific writer... maybe lacking some of the poetic literature of the other 3, but with an excellent technical ability, and fantastic characterisation. My absolute favourite Norton book being "The Zero Stone", which, unfortunately is now almost impossible to find.

5) Asimov. Coming in at 5th behind 4 extraordinarily talented female writers, has written some classic works (although he often wanders off into 'silly' territory as series' progress... example: the core books of the Foundation Trilogy, which are among the greatest sci-fi ever written, expanded into (I think) about 9 novels now, of varying quality... some just as good as the originals, some kind of 'meh'. Everthing you know about robots comes from Asimov.

There are a host of others just below the 5th place there:
Heinlein: "Stranger in a Strange Land", "Friday" and "I Will Fear No Evil"
Niven: "Ringworld", "Ringworld Engineers" and "The Ringworld Throne", and the connected book "Protector".
Sharon Shinn: A series of slightly sci-fi stories about 'angels'
Philip K Dick: In real-life, a schizophrenic, prone to (as he termed them) "nervous breakdowns" and finally dying of a combined effect of repeated strokes and a heart failure - Dick wrote darkly paranoid distopian sci-fi. "Screamers", "Imposter", "Blade Runner", "Minority Report" and "Paycheck" are all based on his twisted prohecies.

James Blish, Poul Anderson, Brian Aldiss, Ray Bradbury...

For my money, Octavia Butler is the world's best living author. Parable Of The Sower should be required reading in America's schools.

If you normally read fantasy, much of Jack L. Chalker's writing could provide a bridge to science fiction for you. Both the Soul Rider and Well Of Souls series' are solid SF/Fantasy reading.

Also, as mentioned by other posters, Heinlein and Asimov are "must-read" authors from SF's Golden Age, and Orson Scott Card is an excellent author as well (Speaker For The Dead may be the single most moral piece of work that I've ever read).

The Iron Dream is a brilliant book, though why someone named "Nationalist Valhalla" would be a fan I have trouble seeing, it seemed to me to be an interesting window into Hitler's insanity, though maybe you have a different perspective, or maybe I'm just judging by names alone and talking bullshit...
Anyhow, Ian M. Banks and Gibson are both brilliant, try the Nights Dawn trilogy by Peter F. Hamilton if you've got time to kill, a sweepingly intricate tale...Most stuff by Larry Niven is brilliant, the Ringworld books especially, but then his collaborations with Jerry Pournelle on The Mote in God's Eye and The Mote Around Murcheson's Eye really are something special...I would reiterate Ashmoria's point not to miss Heinlein's Stranger In Strange Land, but The Moon is a Harsh Mistress is also brilliant...Poul Anderson has written some god books, inculding possibly my favourite book ever A Midsummer Tempest, thugh it's not Sci-Fi, and Ursula LeGuin is brilliant, though more of her books are Fantasy...

Asimov is overated and dated...

i've read pf hamilton's fallen dragon and pandora's star, both quite good. niven and pournelle were brilliant with "mote". poul anderson has his moments(robert silverberg is an excellent writer of that period on sorta pre new wave science fiction, especially "dying inside"). ursula le guin may well be the greatest writer in the genre.

also try: james tiptree(aka alice sheldon)

cordwainer smith (aka dr. paul linebarger)

clifford simik

jack williamson

harlan ellison

george rr martin

roger zelazany

cl moore

samuel delaney(tough going at times)

david brin

gregory benford

marion zimmer bradley

china mieville(science fantasy very original)

micheal moorecock(probably better know for his fantasy)

connie willis

fred saberhagen

i'm sure i'll think of more as soon as i post but this should be a good start, and yes i know their are several jews, some left leaning feminists and a gay black man in the list.

I'm more of a fantasy reader than sci-fi, but there is one series I would recommend:

The Gap series by Stephen Donaldson.

It can be pretty heavy going, and gets pretty nasty in places, but one of the best series I had read in a long time...

If you normally read fantasy, much of Jack L. Chalker's writing could provide a bridge to science fiction for you. Both the Soul Rider and Well Of Souls series' are solid SF/Fantasy reading.



i like chalker and the well of souls series is worth a read, but basically once he got the formula down he just wrote the same series again and again with moderately different settings and characters and minor plot variations. also his weird obsession with humiliatingly physically transforming his female protagonists gets a bit creepy and pathological after awhile.

I'm more of a fantasy reader than sci-fi, but there is one series I would recommend:

The Gap series by Stephen Donaldson.

It can be pretty heavy going, and gets pretty nasty in places, but one of the best series I had read in a long time...
maybe its just the protagonist of the thomas covenant novels, but donaldson always rubbed me the wrong way.

Is a hack. Go read Ursula K. LeGuin, whom he got ALL of his ideas from.

Some classics:
Inherit the Stars (Hogan) - Set the stage for lots of other sci-fi. Is noted as being the book Lunk returns to his friend's father in an episode of Robotech.

A Canticle for Leibowitz (Miller) - The rise, fall, and rise of man.

The Amber Series (Zelazny) - Family vs. reality... literally! Zelazny's writing isn't the best, but it *is* catchy.

his weird obsession with humiliatingly physically transforming his female protagonists gets a bit creepy and pathological after awhile.

Hey, Chalker doesn't do it only to his female characters. I admit that he is pretty sick, though (not necessarily a bad thing in an author).

Is a hack. Go read Ursula K. LeGuin, whom he got ALL of his ideas from.

Some classics:
Inherit the Stars (Hogan) - Set the stage for lots of other sci-fi. Is noted as being the book Lunk returns to his friend's father in an episode of Robotech.

A Canticle for Leibowitz (Miller) - The rise, fall, and rise of man.

The Amber Series (Zelazny) - Family vs. reality... literally! Zelazny's writing isn't the best, but it *is* catchy.
the amber series is my least favorite zelazny read lord of light and his short fiction especially a rose for ecclesiastes

canticle is a true classic even if it is a fixup novel, but i've never read anything else by him.

actually card also stole the idea for his first novel treason from cordwainer smith, but i do generally enjoy his work.

samuel delaney(tough going at times)
Have you read Hogg or the equally bizarre Equinox (AKA Tides of Lust)?

actually card also stole the idea for his first novel treason from cordwainer smith, but i do generally enjoy his work..

There are certainly worse places to steal from. I never thought that Cordwainer's Smiths novels held up as well as his shorter pieces though.

the amber series is my least favorite zelazny read lord of light and his short fiction especially a rose for ecclesiastes

canticle is a true classic even if it is a fixup novel, but i've never read anything else by him.

actually card also stole the idea for his first novel treason from cordwainer smith, but i do generally enjoy his work.

I found LoL a little too much like Hesse's "Siddartha"... which I use to cure insomnia. I just didn't care for it. I did like some of his other (shorter) stuff, like A Night in the Lonesome October and Unicorn Variations...

Well, we do agree that Card is a thief. :)

Have you read Hogg?



There are certainly worse places to steal from. I never thought that Cordwainer's Smiths novels held up as well as his shorter pieces though.
no forget the novels until you've read the short stories, they barely serve to fill out sections of a brilliant future history(card's novel was originally titled "a planet called treason" even the title was stolen from the smith source "a planet named shayol") as a further note cs friedman's "this alien shore" and a number of other works steal their ideas of the dangers and countermeasure of ftl travel from smith's wonderful "the game of rat and dragon"

of couse smith himself owes a debt to "the island of dr. moreau" for his underpeople, which david brin brilliantly turns on it head in his uplift series.
also starship troopers inspired haldeman's antiwar retelling in "the forever war" which card then sythesized into a middle path inthis ender books. everone's a theif in literature and science fiction more than most.

also starship troopers inspired haldeman's antiwar retelling in "the forever war" which ...

...Harry Harrison then pastiches in his Bill, the Galactic Hero novels.

...Harry Harrison then pastiches in his Bill, the Galactic Hero novels.

now harrison is an out and out plagerist, his "stainless steel rat gets drafted" completely lifts the classic novella "and then there were none" by eric frank russell for its second half. its exactly the same, its like he used russell's work to make a fixup.

If you're looking for the classics, you can't go wrong with Philip K. Dick. Personally, I am a huge fan of Edgar Rice Burrough's the Martian Tales.

For modern SF, Neal Stephenson's "Snow Crash" and "Diamond Age", and Richard K. Morgan's "Altered Carbon" and "Broken Angels" will not let you down.

now harrison is an out and out plagerist, his "stainless steel rat gets drafted" completely lifts the classic novella "and then there were none" by eric frank russell for its second half. its exactly the same, its like he used russell's work to make a fixup.

I don't really rate the Stainless Steel Rat books highly - they were entertaining enough when I read them as a 10 year old or whatever, and a lot of Harrison's stuff is just dull writing by numbers, but he has produced some pretty good novels - A Transatlantic Tunnel, Hurrah! (AKA A Tunnel Through The Deeps), Make Room! Make Room!, and Captive Universe all being examples of his better work. As far as his pastiches and humourous writing goes I think the only one I have read which stands up quite well is Star Smashers Of The Galaxy Rangers - his take on E.E. 'Doc' Smith's and Jack Williamson's space operas.

I don't really rate the Stainless Steel Rat books highly - they were entertaining enough when I read them as a 10 year old or whatever, and a lot of Harrison's stuff is just dull writing by numbers, but he has produced some pretty good novels - A Transatlantic Tunnel, Hurrah! (AKA A Tunnel Through The Deeps), Make Room! Make Room!, and Captive Universe all being examples of his better work. As far as his pastiches and humourous writing goes I think the only one I have read which stands up quite well is Star Smashers Of The Galaxy Rangers - his take on E.E. 'Doc' Smith's and Jack Williamson's space operas.
it just annoys me about "and then there were none" its a true classic of anarcho libertarian utopia fiction, and harrison just rips it off for a hack series and no one seems to notice.

it just annoys me about "and then there were none" its a true classic of anarcho libertarian utopia fiction, and harrison just rips it off for a hack series and no one seems to notice.
okay i've now fallen completely out of character(nazis should not be offended by the misuse of anarcho libertarian classics)

okay i've now fallen completely out of character(nazis should not be offended by the misuse of anarcho libertarian classics)

Unless they see it as a trojan horse method of sneaking clearly unacceptable ideas into the public's consciousness?

Douglas Adams.

Yeah. Adams is deadly funny. Definently my favorite sci-fi writer. Although he's not for everyone. If you want serious stuff, or you don't like Monty Python, I'd stay away from him. He's a silly person.

maybe its just the protagonist of the thomas covenant novels, but donaldson always rubbed me the wrong way.
I'm glad to see I'm not the only one. I read the first Covenant series and just couldn't stand the whinning, annoying rapist. He spends the whole time whinging and complaining and saying "I can't do anything!". Annoyed the hell out of me. I only read them to please my girlfriend at the time who thought they were fantastic. What men'll do for a women, eh?
<Rant over>

I enjoyed Ian M Banks 'Culture' series, as he always goes beyond the average SF thinking, like having ships measured in km, not metres. Some of them can be very clever.
Neal Stephenson is also good to read. His Cryptomonicon series is very good.
Phillip K Dick is trippy and he has amazing concepts and ideas. He always wanders off on a tangent though (thanks LSD!).
One author I particularly enjoy is Jack Vance. His novels are lightweight, but I always found them very enjoyable. Wonderful use of wordplay in them. Good for the wet weekend, as they can be comfortably finished in a day or two. I know I'll be considered a Heretic for saying this, but I prefer his 'Lyonese' trilogy over LOTR. It's not as ponderous or as seriously written and has some very cool ideas.

Well blade runner is one of my favourite movies so thats certainly a welcome suggestion, FutureExistence.

If you liked Blade Runner, in addition to Philip K Dick, you should also check out William Gibson, Bruce Sterling, John Varley, John Shirley, Rudy Rucker, and George Alec Effinger.

ooooh, i forgot a great one, cj cherryh. her union/alliance future history is amazing. she really delves into the psychology and practicalities of people living their entire lives on spaceships and space stations.

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one. I read the first Covenant series and just couldn't stand the whinning, annoying rapist. He spends the whole time whinging and complaining and saying "I can't do anything!". Annoyed the hell out of me. I only read them to please my girlfriend at the time who thought they were fantastic. What men'll do for a women, eh?
<Rant over>




yeah people regarded him to be some great science fiction antihero. travis bickle is an antihero, moorecock's elric is an antihero; thomas covenant is just a vile pathetic excuse for a human being who is just to annoying to stand. better the world fall to lord foul, oh wait it basically does(maybe not, i can remember and i never read the second series).

Orson Scott Card Is a hack. Go read Ursula K. LeGuin, whom he got ALL of his ideas from.
...
A Canticle for Leibowitz (Miller) - The rise, fall, and rise of man.

Have I ever said I love you?

I stayed up all last Wensday to finish reading A Canticle For Leibowitz, so I could give it to my ex for his 21st. I almost didn't give it up, even though I'd read it three times total. The only problem is, you can only find it at large chain bookstores near large public universities. And anywhere in Utah, of course, because there's some irony left in the world.

And while Card got ideas from others (as has been noted)... LeGuin's Hainish series does rule.

yeah people regarded him to be some great science fiction antihero. travis bickle is an antihero, moorecock's elric is an antihero; thomas covenant is just a vile pathetic excuse for a human being who is just to annoying to stand. better the world fall to lord foul, oh wait it basically does(maybe not, i can remember and i never read the second series).

While we're on sf anti-heroes lets not forget Gully Foyle from Tyger! Tyger! (AKA The Stars My Destination) - murderer, thief, rapist, terrorist, the works.

Orson scott card rocks!

Or at least the Ender series' rock. I haven't read the others so for all I know he could've borrowed from Ursula (who also rocks) but I don't really care :P

Heinlein has a good writing style, I've only read Job so I can't comment on his other plots.

Douglas Adams is the messiah of humorous science fiction. It's a pity the fifth hitch-hiker book was so depressing. Although of course it's a bigger pity that he died half way through the sixth one. Or, well, it's a pity that he died, s my general point.

Isaac Asimov is pretty good, I haven't read most of his series' cos my library sucks.

As a one off I reccommend Incompetence by Rob Grant - it is the funniest futuristic political you could ever, possibly, EVER read. He's the one who co-wrote the Red Dwarf books, which are also very good.

My library is also sadly lacking in Harrison, I read one Stainless Steel rat book which was a present, and it seemed pretty consistently not-bad. I'd be willing to bet the series has no "OMG THAT BOOK SUCKS SOOOO MUCH!!" anti-fans, because while it isn't brilliant like some of the above, there isn't really anything to complain about. Good for a read once or twice.

Has Robert Silverberg been mentioned? Only he's pretty cool. Roma Eterna is ever so freaky, although the last bit is kind of wonkatated, maybe if he'd stuck to the theme of all the changes one historic event can cause instead of going into historical imperative and other hard-to-credit things it's be better. But some of his other books are really really good, especially dying Inside - it's on my library's YA section, but I think adults would like it too. It is excellent. And very sad.

To the person who started this topic and has read a lot of fantasy - I presume you have read Terry Pratchett's stuff? If you haven't, go back to fantasy and read it! <-- my favourite. I guess I'm more a fantasy person than sciffy - you have to credit all these assumptions in SF to make the future-tech work in your head.

While we're on sf anti-heroes lets not forget Gully Foyle from Tyger! Tyger! (AKA The Stars My Destination) - murderer, thief, rapist, terrorist, the works.
never read it, is it actually worth reading?

Douglas Adams is the messiah of humorous science fiction.

If Douglas Adams is the messiah of humourous science-fiction, then Robert Sheckley is the Moses, Abraham and John the Baptist of the sub-genre all rolled into one.

James P Hogan has excellent scientific basis in most of his books. I like him but his characters were a bit cookie cutter. He has original ideas about writing about old standby topics(parallel worlds, armageddon, time travel)

I am currently reading alot of Robert J Sawyer. His neaderthal series is a great bit of social analysis. He creates a timeline in which neaderthals became dominant and an accident bridges our worlds.

Footfall was good. I am trying to recall who wrote that one. It was a couple of authors as I recall. A very good alien invasion story.

Footfall was good. I am trying to recall who wrote that one. It was a couple of authors as I recall. A very good alien invasion story.

that was larry niven and jerry pournelle, not their best but a fun read.

It might take some effort to find it, but the "Riverworld" series by Phillip Jose Farmer is well worth the effort. The cast of characters is litterally every person who ever lived. Gauranteed once you start, you won't want to put it down.

If you like "realistic" science fiction, I highly suggest Tomorrow and Tomorrow. It's essentially about a guy who cryogenically freezes himself and manages to live through the entire development of the human race. It's a very interesting read if you like to think about human evolution.

It might take some effort to find it, but the "Riverworld" series by Phillip Jose Farmer is well worth the effort. The cast of characters is litterally every person who ever lived. Gauranteed once you start, you won't want to put it down.

The quality decreases sharply with every book though: the first volume if very good, the second pretty good.... the fifth and thankfully last is just an abomination.

Timothy Zahn put out an excellent trilogy of Star Wars books (Heir to the Empire, Dark Force Rising, and The Last Command).

The Blood of Kerensky is another good trilogy, this time in the BattleTech universe.

The quality decreases sharply with every book though: the first volume if very good, the second pretty good.... the fifth and thankfully last is just an abomination.Abomination is pretty harsh, but yah I did think he got pressured to finish the series in a certain time frame and thus it suffered. The end was a little unsatisfying.

Abomination is pretty harsh, but yah I did think he got pressured to finish the series in a certain time frame and thus it suffered. The end was a little unsatisfying.

I think we might be talking about different books - the last of the original four The Magic Labyrinth was moderately passable on a slow day, but the fifth Gods Of Riverworld was just a pointless exercise in blackened pages.

The quality decreases sharply with every book though: the first volume if very good, the second pretty good.... the fifth and thankfully last is just an abomination.
To be perfectly honest I found the first 2 to be much of an abomination - never bothered even picking up the rest. The whole concept just lacked any kind of crerdibility, and ... and ... oh, wtf , It's too early and I can't be fagged to give such trash the benefit of an argument.

For good sci-fi, try Ken McCleod, Peter F Hamilton, or Neal Asher, to name a few (not directed at yoiu BWO, I know we've had this conversation before).

Oh, and re Donaldson, Yeah, Thomas Covenant was a pain in the arse (and yes I did slog through the second series - and it was a hell of a slog!) but I thought they (the first lot anyway) were a pretty impressive read. However for Donaldson at his best, I highly recommond th "Gap" series. Intense, complex and riveting.

based on philip k. dick's "do androids dream of electric sheep" the novel is very different from the movie, but pkd is always a worthwhile if strange and sometimes confusing read.

For once the movie is better than the novel. The movie improves on the novel's story rattling storyline, the main character is less flat, etc.
As much creativity went into the script as went into the novel. A bold statement, this, I realize.

A good introduction to Dick would be
http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/0575075813/qid=1096276938/sr=1-2/ref=sr_1_11_2/202-9692445-4758243

Do keep in mind these novels were written in the sixties. SF standards simply weren't as high then as they are now both plot and languagewise, whether you like that or not. It's amazing though how well they still perform in the line of ideas. I'm not only talking about Dick now.

In that aspect I see a lot of older stuff is recommended here. As often happens to the classics they tend to get a bit overrated and disappoint because of high expectations. Give these guys a break. They created the genre.

For more up to date authors maybe have a look at the Dozois collections of short stories:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/search-handle-form/202-9692445-4758243

The "Year's best" series always contains an informative preface summing up the most intersting publications of the past year.

By the way: is there ANYONE out there who read "Jennifer Government" ???

Usually i read fantasy books to relax or kill time, but lately ive decided i need a break from this and to change to something different for a while, otherwise it just gets stale. Ive get more than enough factual reading to do for various different reasons, so was looking towards any good sci-fi books. Ive heard Asimov(sp?) and Arthur.C.Clarke are generally considered best, whats your opinion on these, or any other, authors for me to start out with??

Cheers

they are great. Also worth looking into Frank Herbert (dune series) and Iain Banks (player of games, consider pheblas, excession,etc)

Did anyone ever finish The Amtrak Wars? I got to about book 4 or so and was thoroughly bored...

they are great. Also worth looking into Frank Herbert (dune series) and Iain Banks (player of games, consider pheblas, excession,etc)

*girlish-sigh* Frank Herbert.... *pets photo of Frank Herbert in wallet, in a creepy way*

The first three Dune books are much better if you know what they're about. I'll spare you the whole rant, but spice = oil. The books really make you think when you can compare them to world politics.

Douglas Adams (hitchikers guide to the galaxy) is a funny read.

A good sci-fi read in Mary Shelley's "Frankenstein".

If you want a more modern sci-fi book try Peter F. Hamiltons "Night's Dawn Triology

nearly forgot!!!

HG WELLS

Usually i read fantasy books to relax or kill time, but lately ive decided i need a break from this and to change to something different for a while, otherwise it just gets stale. Ive get more than enough factual reading to do for various different reasons, so was looking towards any good sci-fi books. Ive heard Asimov(sp?) and Arthur.C.Clarke are generally considered best, whats your opinion on these, or any other, authors for me to start out with??

Cheers

It's all down to personal taste, I like Asimov but can't stand Arthur C Clarke or Heinlein. I'd also recommend Harry Harrison's Deathworld and Stainless Steel Rat series for good tongue in cheek sci fi. The Orson Scott Card stuff is brilliant and Stephen Donaldson's Gap series is also good if somewhat confusing.

Malc

*girlish-sigh* Frank Herbert.... *pets photo of Frank Herbert in wallet, in a creepy way*

The first three Dune books are much better if you know what they're about. I'll spare you the whole rant, but spice = oil. The books really make you think when you can compare them to world politics.

Loved of 6 books. Hydrolic despotism baby!!!

Peter F. Hamilton - Fallen Dragon

I know there are better written books, with better stories out there, but this book really lets you visualise the worlds he is talking about, and the characters in the story are very well developed, i.e. you can empathise with them more or les, but you understand them and their core beliefs.


as for Philip K. Dick, although nowadays people have built on his ideas, and some of his story lines weren't always brilliant, they are all classics (nearly), my fav is Do Androids Dream of electroinc sheep, purely because i think blade runner (directors cut) rocks.....

I haven't read this thread so apologies if someone already said this, but "The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress" by Robert A Heinlein (of starship troopers fame) is one of my favourite books.

*girlish-sigh* Frank Herbert.... *pets photo of Frank Herbert in wallet, in a creepy way*

The first three Dune books are much better if you know what they're about. I'll spare you the whole rant, but spice = oil. The books really make you think when you can compare them to world politics.
There's so much more to it than that though: http://tim.oreilly.com/sci-fi/herbert/

I think I Am Legend by Richard Matheson is worth reading. So is the War of the Worlds by H. G. Wells. A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess.

I have to say I really don't recommend any of the 'fat books' by Heinlein. OK, well, maybe you should read them just so you can say, "I've read them," but I really disliked them. Hear No Evil was possibly the worst.

There's so much more to it than that though: http://tim.oreilly.com/sci-fi/herbert/

I think I Am Legend by Richard Matheson is worth reading. So is the War of the Worlds by H. G. Wells. A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess.

I have to say I really don't recommend any of the 'fat books' by Heinlein. OK, well, maybe you should read them just so you can say, "I've read them," but I really disliked them. Hear No Evil was possibly the worst.

are those newer dune books any good? when i saw they were not written fully by Frank Herbert i lost a bit of interest. talking same level of interest and detail?

are those newer dune books any good? when i saw they were not written fully by Frank Herbert i lost a bit of interest. talking same level of interest and detail?
I haven't read any of the ones by his son (Brian Herbert). I may have a look at the last one, but judging by his other writings, I don't think his son will really live up to the prior works.

I have to say I really don't recommend any of the 'fat books' by Heinlein. OK, well, maybe you should read them just so you can say, "I've read them," but I really disliked them. Hear No Evil was possibly the worst.

It depends upon which of the "fat books" you're speaking of. I found Stranger In A Strange Land and The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress to be wonderful, The Number Of The Beast and The Cat Who Walks Through Walls to be barely-readable, self-indulgent drivel, and the others to be at varying levels in between the two extremes.

It depends upon which of the "fat books" you're speaking of. I found Stranger In A Strange Land and The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress to be wonderful, The Number Of The Beast and The Cat Who Walks Through Walls to be barely-readable, self-indulgent drivel, and the others to be at varying levels in between the two extremes.
i personally hated "time enough for love" and "number of the beast" intensely, bloated tomes of incest fetishism and 40 page digressions about the proper power structure on a three man space craft ishhh. friday was the only tolerable late heinlien i've read and even it had sadism and rape in intense detail and a rather questionable take on the issues.

maybe its just the protagonist of the thomas covenant novels, but donaldson always rubbed me the wrong way.

I've yet to meet anyone that actually LIKED the protagonist of the Thomas Covenant arc. I only managed half of the first book, between the 'poor fellow' whining about how hard his life was, and 'not being able to stop himself' from raping someone.

Maybe I'm just too picky, but I want my story-book heroes (or even my flawed-heroes) to be something I would want to aspire towards in some way. The covenant stuff just alternately bored me, and made me sick.

I don't really rate the Stainless Steel Rat books highly - they were entertaining enough when I read them as a 10 year old or whatever, and a lot of Harrison's stuff is just dull writing by numbers, but he has produced some pretty good novels - A Transatlantic Tunnel, Hurrah! (AKA A Tunnel Through The Deeps), Make Room! Make Room!, and Captive Universe all being examples of his better work. As far as his pastiches and humourous writing goes I think the only one I have read which stands up quite well is Star Smashers Of The Galaxy Rangers - his take on E.E. 'Doc' Smith's and Jack Williamson's space operas.

On subject of Harry Harrison, although much of his work is, unfortunately, basically pulp - there have been a few gems, as pointed out.

Some of the more political stuff, "Make room! Make room!", as mentioned above, and one I think was called "We Ate the Whole Thing"... are very good, and he created two trilogy arcs that are well written and with good characters... "The Deathworld Trilogy" and the "To The Stars" trilogy. (Both of which have subtle subtexts, if you are willing to look for them).

Larry Niven's Known Space series is excellent, some of the best SF I've ever read. He's won several Hugo awards for short stories, and his stories are fantastic in a space opera sort of way, while grounded in reality and true science. Check them out.

Known Space books:

Tales of Known Space,
Neutron Star,
N-Space,
Ringworld,
Ringworld Engineers,
Ringworld Throne.

Check em out, they're excellent.

Larry Niven's Known Space series is excellent, some of the best SF I've ever read. He's won several Hugo awards for short stories, and his stories are fantastic in a space opera sort of way, while grounded in reality and true science. Check them out.

Known Space books:

Tales of Known Space,
Neutron Star,
N-Space,
Ringworld,
Ringworld Engineers,
Ringworld Throne.

Check em out, they're excellent.

also known space novels,
protector(very good)
a gift from earth(good)
world of the ptavvs(good)

also known space novels,
protector(very good)
a gift from earth(good)
world of the ptavvs(good)

Right, right, right! I forgot those!

Right, right, right! I forgot those!
and i forgot'
Crashlander(haven't read it)
and Flatlander/the Collected Tales of Gil "the Arm" Hamilton(i've read the earlier collection : "The Long Arm of Gil Hamilton" which doesn't include "Patchwork Girl" or "The Woman in Del Rey Crater"

Stay away from the Dune prequels. Brian Herbert's name on this is mainly to give them legitimacy. They're mainly written by Kevin J. "I can't come up with an original idea to save my life" Anderson. Anderson's a major franchise novel writer, who pumps out Star Wars novels like welfare moms pump out kids.

Plus, while Dune is one of my favorite novels of all time, the series began an exponential decline from that point forward. Books written after Children of Dune were pretty much worthless, except for the general amusement you get by watching Herbert slowly slip into insanity and perversion. Kinda like Arthur C. Clarke's later novels. The Rama sequels, anyone?

Also, if you're real big into SF, consider purchasing a subscription to Asimov's Science Fiction Magazine or another anthology magazine. Short stories, novellas, novelettes, and even a few novels published as serials. Good stuff.

the shorter forms have generally been the true heart of science fiction.

I see a lot of good authors on this thread, but I don't think anyone's mentioned James H. Schmitz yet. I highly reccomend any of his work, especially the Federation of the Hub series and the Agent of Vega stories....
And The Witches of Karres, of course; I think it's his only full-length novel.

I see a lot of good authors on this thread, but I don't think anyone's mentioned James H. Schmitz yet. I highly reccomend any of his work, especially the Federation of the Hub series and the Agent of Vega stories....
And The Witches of Karres, of course; I think it's his only full-length novel.
i just reread that a couple of months ago(twok), that's such a wonderful semi juvenile classic, never read anything else by him though(unless something in an anthology i've forgotten)

There's so much more to it than that though: http://tim.oreilly.com/sci-fi/herbert/

I think I Am Legend by Richard Matheson is worth reading. So is the War of the Worlds by H. G. Wells. A Clockwork Orange by Anthony Burgess.

I have to say I really don't recommend any of the 'fat books' by Heinlein. OK, well, maybe you should read them just so you can say, "I've read them," but I really disliked them. Hear No Evil was possibly the worst.

Dude, I clearly said that I wasn't going to explain it all. Spice = oil was just an easily understood example.

Novels:
The Forever War by Joe Haldeman
Stranger in a Strange Land by Robert Heinlein
Starship Troopers by Robert Heinlein
The Stars My Destination by Alfred Bester
The Demolished Man by Alfred Bester
Ship of Fools by Richard Paul Russo
Black Milk by Robert Reed
Marrow by Robert Reed
Nor Crystal Tears by Alan Dean Foster(the only good book he's written)
The Dispossessed by Ursula K. LeGuin
The Left Hand of Darkness by Ursula K. LeGuin

Anthologies:
The Dragons of Springplace by Robert Reed
Sandkings by George R. R. Martin
Nightflyers by George R. R. Martin
Tuff Voyaging by George R. R. Martin

Shared Universe:
The Wild Card Series Edited by George R. R. Martin

Don't bother with anything by Orson Scott Card, he is possibly the most overrated sci-fi author of all time. His stories are a combination of cliched plotlines, male chauvanism, and pretentious psuedo-intellectualism.

Stay away from the Dune prequels. Brian Herbert's name on this is mainly to give them legitimacy. They're mainly written by Kevin J. "I can't come up with an original idea to save my life" Anderson. Anderson's a major franchise novel writer, who pumps out Star Wars novels like welfare moms pump out kids.


Agreed. Those Brian Herbert prequels are to the Dune series what the new Star Wars prequels are to the original trilogy.

wow popular thread
anyway I am gonna come in as another supporter of Ursula Le Guin, I love all her books but 'Four Ways to Forgiveness' has got to be my favourite
I like asimov too, I read 'The gods themselves' recentally which is a book that I enjoyed alot.

Don't bother with anything by Orson Scott Card, he is possibly the most overrated sci-fi author of all time. His stories are a combination of cliched plotlines, male chauvanism, and pretentious psuedo-intellectualism.

and Mormonism.

I don't know enough about Mormonism to be offended by any hints of it in Orson Scott Card's works.

Ender's Game is a great book. The two sequels I've read are also good, worth reading, but not quite in the same 'classic' greatness.

I don't know enough about Mormonism to be offended by any hints of it in Orson Scott Card's works.

I believe he has a habit of laying it on more thickly in his earlier short stories.

Ender's Game is a great book.

The original novellette/novella was entertaining enough, but I certainly wasn't driven to seek out the expanded version or start reading other OSC work, other than finishing the collection it was in - Maps In The Mirror IIRC.

Anything by Isaac Asimov, Poul Anderson, and Arthur C. Clarke is worth it,

Novels:
Don't bother with anything by Orson Scott Card, he is possibly the most overrated sci-fi author of all time. His stories are a combination of cliched plotlines, male chauvanism, and pretentious psuedo-intellectualism.

I couldn't have said it better myself.

www.schlockmercenary.com , Great sci fi, updated daily

If you want to see some names of the newer good writers checkout the two major SF award sites. For the Hugo (fan based voting) go to http://worldcon.org/hugos.html. For the Nebula (SF writer based voting) go to http://www.sfwa.org/awards/archive/pastwin.htm.

Authors who I think have written well in the last few years include Lois McMaster Bujold, Ted Chiang, Neal Gaiman, Joe Haldeman, Kim Stanley Robinson, Bruce Sterling, Vernor Vinge, and Connie Willis.

I realize I'm in the minority, but I found plenty enjoyable about Time Enough For Love. Granted, most of the shorts are just odd, but you get in the ($8.00) book the entirety of "The Notebooks of Lazarus Long," a novella they now sell separately ($11.95). The between sequences are only tolerable if you're in love with LL, but there's always the "mayor of the outpost town" one, a sweet little story that's still better than 90% of what's out there.

I'm currently trying to find a copy of Ice by Anna Kavan.

Unfortunately I cannot find it in any shops. I'm thinking about Amazon though.

Anyone read it?

But nearly anything by Philip K Dick is good (I say nearly, because he wrote a few turkeys, imo)

Iain M. Banks.

and Mormonism.
and Mormonism . . . I guess . . .

I'm currently trying to find a copy of Ice by Anna Kavan.

Unfortunately I cannot find it in any shops. I'm thinking about Amazon though.

Anyone read it?

Yup - following Brian Aldiss's recomendations. I'm not as fulsome in my praise as he was, but nonetheless it remains interesting and worth reading. Definitely is worth tracking down. A strange disjointed, bizarrely unsettling work.

Classics:

The Strange Case of Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde, by Robert Louis Stevenson;
The War of the Worlds and The Time Machine, by H G Wells;
Brave New World, by Aldous Huxley;
1984, by George Orwell;
and even arguably Gulliver's Travels by Jonathan Swift.

Contemporary stuff that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere else so far:

Vacuum Flowers, Griffin's Egg and In the Drift, by Michael Swanwick;
Permutation City and Diaspora, by Greg Egan;
Space, and any collection of short stories or novels from the Xeelee sequence, e.g. Timelike Infinity, by Stephen Baxter (and if you like H G Wells' The Time Machine, Baxter has written a fairly decent sequel called The Time Ships);
Revelation Space, Chasm City, Redemption Ark and Absolution Gap, by Alastair Reynolds (although there is a slight tendency for these books to swell as the series continues).

And finally I'll just put in some more good words for Iain M Banks, Ken MacLeod, Bruce Sterling, Neal Stephenson, William Gibson, Brian Aldiss, and Jack Vance.

Did anyone ever finish The Amtrak Wars? I got to about book 4 or so and was thoroughly bored...

I haven't read books 2 or 5, but I liked what I read. Other scifi/fantasy authors I like are:
Carl Sagan
Robert Jordan
Margaret Weis
Tamora Pierce
Frank Herbert
H.G. Wells
K.A. Applegate (may be for kids, but I've liked the Animorphs series since I was a kid)
Michael Crichton

I read some of Iain M. Banks' work, but I didn't like it all that much.

I haven't read books 2 or 5, but I liked what I read. Other scifi/fantasy authors I like are:
Carl Sagan
Robert Jordan
Margaret Weis
Tamora Pierce
Frank Herbert
H.G. Wells
K.A. Applegate (may be for kids, but I've liked the Animorphs series since I was a kid)
Michael Crichton

I read some of Iain M. Banks' work, but I didn't like it all that much.

wha?
Iain M Banks' scifi is not only great scifi, it is also literature.

i personally hated "time enough for love" and "number of the beast" intensely, bloated tomes of incest fetishism and 40 page digressions about the proper power structure on a three man space craft ishhh. friday was the only tolerable late heinlien i've read and even it had sadism and rape in intense detail and a rather questionable take on the issues.

Yes me too. I read first two you mentioned several years ago and felt somewhat sick afterwards. It's completely put me off anything by Heinlein ever since.

I've yet to meet anyone that actually LIKED the protagonist of the Thomas Covenant arc. I only managed half of the first book, between the 'poor fellow' whining about how hard his life was, and 'not being able to stop himself' from raping someone.

Maybe I'm just too picky, but I want my story-book heroes (or even my flawed-heroes) to be something I would want to aspire towards in some way. The covenant stuff just alternately bored me, and made me sick.

When I first read the books I thought it was quite good to have such a flawed hero but now I basically find them boring.

Yes me too. I read first two you mentioned several years ago and felt somewhat sick afterwards. It's completely put me off anything by Heinlein ever since.

It is worth going back and trying his early novels - I was in the same position as you a few years ago, having read Friday and about half of Number Of The Beast when I was about 14 and then not going near the man for about 20 years as a result. I then happened to try one of the shorter early novels - The Puppet Masters or The Door Into Summer, and finally understood what the fuss was about. An extreme case of lack of quality control took over towards the end of Heinlein's writing life - what the denizens of the rec.arts.sf.written newsgroup call the 'brain-eater'.

Go and track down one of the earlier novels with a small page count or a collection of early short stories and you will see for yourself just how dramatic Heinlein's fall from grace was.




____________
Endnotes: I over simplified my story there, I also read Starship Troopers as a teen and thought it entertaining enough, but not fantastic, and Stranger In A Strange Land somewhere after giving up on Heinlein - once again it was moderately entertaining, but it certainly didn't make me feel that I had to read more of the man.

Endnotes: I over simplified my story there, I also read Starship Troopers as a teen and thought it entertaining enough, but not fantastic, and Stranger In A Strange Land somewhere after giving up on Heinlein - once again it was moderately entertaining, but it certainly didn't make me feel that I had to read more of the man.


Stranger in a Strange Land was probably radical in 1960. Free Love wasn't a massive issue then so it probably blew a lot of people's minds. It's quite a nice book but i expect it has lost a lot of its power.

Yup - following Brian Aldiss's recomendations. I'm not as fulsome in my praise as he was, but nonetheless it remains interesting and worth reading. Definitely is worth tracking down. A strange disjointed, bizarrely unsettling work.
Did you find his recommendation in "Trillion Year Spree"?

Just that I am reading that at the the moment at tht moment and that is where I read about it.

Is it worth just under 10 pounds (the least I have found it for)?

Orson Scott Card, best known for Ender's Game and its sequels. He has written a couple of other series though.

Well, I hear the USA is trying to bring some new Sci-Fi to our screens, a big budget offering titled " Son of Star Wars " ... problem is almost no-one likes the casting, and the CGI is said to be a little dodgy at best ... plus the plot, don't get me started, its your basic, " when things blow up " ...

;)

* That aside, I always liked Peter F. Hamilton for Sci-Fic ... no matter what if the Sci-Fi tech is a bit wank, it is Sci-Fic after all ... :)

Wow! I disappeared off the boards for a few days and it seems my thread grew out of control... :)

I cant reply to everything written so far, but will say thanks for the input from all involved.

It seems that Heinlein, Le Guin, Banks and Clarke are the generally best liked authors around here, so ill have a look out for some of their work. Although ive never read any of her books before, ive often notied Le Guins books in the fantasy section, so how much of a sci-fi author is she?

I like fantasy instead of the hard stuff.

John Brunner, Michael Moorcock, Jack Vance, Sheri S. Tepper, Garth Nix in addition to LeGuin.

Tolkein of course, and other classics: C.S. Lewis, George MacDonald, William Morris, Lord Dunsany, James Branch Cabell and the early H.P. Lovecraft.

Urban fantasy too, such as Charles deLint and Emma Bull.

Other women: Robin McKinley, Patricia Wrede, CH Cherryh, Joy Chant, Elizabeth Scarborough, Patricia A. McKillip, Jane Yolen, and children's author E. Nesbit she is funny as hell.

Magical realism: Robert Holdstock, John Crowley, Gabriel Garcia Marquez.

Dante.
Nasruddin.
The Bel Shem Tov.
etc.

Wow! I disappeared off the boards for a few days and it seems my thread grew out of control... :)

I cant reply to everything written so far, but will say thanks for the input from all involved.

It seems that Heinlein, Le Guin, Banks and Clarke are the generally best liked authors around here, so ill have a look out for some of their work. Although ive never read any of her books before, ive often notied Le Guins books in the fantasy section, so how much of a sci-fi author is she?

LeGuin writes many kinds of fiction. Her best is, I think, a kind of unique sort of fiction which deals more with philosophy and social science than with "science", such the "The Dispossessed", "The Word for World is Forest", and "The Lathe of Heaven".

She also invented a space-and-time spanning communication device called the "ansible", which set up many painful situations in which beings could communicate across the gulf of space instantly but could only travel by using up a whole lifetime on the trip (living things could not be transported).

She set up a world of oscillating genders in "Left Hand of Darkness" and sequels, and did not expolit the idea for sensationalism but developed it sensitively and with some scientific realism.

She writes realistic fantasy these days, in the manner of Joyce Carol Oates.

"The Beginning Place" was a myth, pure and simple.

The "Earthsea" series is wizardly for-young-readers stuff but it has a hard inner core of social philosophy as well.

So there you are.

H G Wells. I've read 'War of the Worlds' about 50 times:D 'Men Like Gods' is a good book too but I dont think it counts as science fiction. Worth a look though.

If you go to live365.com you can find radio streams of old time radio sci fi, which can play some quaility stuff (my favorites are Knotted Note Radio and Ultimate SciFi.com, though the later repeats pretty heavily.) There is even a stream that is nothing but The Shadow, which is pretty cool.

There is some good fiction amongst some of the cheese. Between episodes of Yours Truly, Johnny Dollar (the adventures of an insurance investigator told through his expense report) you get stories like the one where a guy asks to be dropped off alone on a planet after they make faster-than-light ships only to have his planet landed by a ship that was sent out 100 years ago as a generation ship. The people on that ship believe he's a native and won't listen to him. It's one of the best anti-colonialism satires I've heard.