NationStates Jolt Archive

state um like it is I am a typical moderate right winger.

Libertarian.....but I could NEVER accept John Kerry as President.

Libertarian.....but I could NEVER accept John Kerry as President.
yeah I know about you guys, my uncle's a libertarain which helps my poltical debates casue I know about you people.

yeah I know about you guys, my uncle's a libertarain which helps my poltical debates casue I know about you people.

Yeah....we can be a vocal bunch. ;)

social liberal, fiscal conservative. the exact opposite of my damn president. :headbang:

Libertarian, with some variations.

Hey, all you fascists... Join The Fascist Haven.

Im a librarian

Hey, all you fascists... Join The Fascist Haven.

So you endorse the killing everyone who is not like you?

Green pacifist anarcho-communist.

Libertarian and Constitutional minded conservative

I am an extreme Leftist Marxist. However, I am not an idealist. I have also debated with libertarians. They are a pretty easy crowd to figure out. Just say "fundamental rights" and they are appeased. Or say "social..." and they start screaming.

oh, and I'm a pacifist by disposition, not by choice. That's why I love the idea of armed revolution, but know I couldn't bear to blow off Bush's head :(

bump

moderate-conservative, constitutionalist, anti-socalist /communist

Crazy crackpot conspiracy theorist, radical right-wing nutjob, etc. :p

Hey, all you Fascists... Join The Fascist Haven Region Now!!!

social liberal, fiscal conservative. the exact opposite of my damn president. :headbang:

And the exact opposite of Kerry

I'm a Right wing arch conservative, with one or two moderate views

moderate-conservative, constitutionalist, anti-socalist /communist


well fuck you too! Anti communist, pfft. Interesting, how we are the only ones who stand for bringing you higher wages and making sure you can't get layed off just because your boss wants some more profit!

Monarchist... democracy is corrupt and anarchy could never work along side human nature... the Top Dog syndrome

well fuck you too! Anti communist, pfft. Interesting, how we are the only ones who stand for bringing you higher wages and making sure you can't get layed off just because your boss wants some more profit!

Yeah by sacrificing our entire constitution. An unlike some people i do not care about being rich i just am glad i have a job.

Monarchist... democracy is corrupt and anarchy could never work along side human nature... the Top Dog syndrome

I actually kinda agree with you

well bleep you too! Anti communist, pfft. Interesting, how we are the only ones who stand for bringing you higher wages and making sure you can't get layed off just because your boss wants some more profit!

Higher wages at the expense of anothers work. Boss and his profits happen because he is the boss of his company. Work hard and become a boss of a company at the expense of the sweat off you're own back. That is America and that is why I love it. No free hand outs (well we are working on doing away with those) to make you expect something for nothing.

Yeah by sacrificing our entire constitution. An unlike some people i do not care about being rich i just am glad i have a job.


Is that your only complaint though? I love our constitution too, but if something better comes along, we sure better use it!

Higher wages at the expense of anothers work. Boss and his profits happen because he is the boss of his company. Work hard and become a boss of a company at the expense of the sweat off you're own back. That is America and that is why I love it. No free hand outs (well we are working on doing away with those) to make you expect something for nothing.

Amen brother

Is that your only complaint though? I love our constitution too, but if something better comes along, we sure better use it!

It don't get no better than that. :)

I am pure Stalinist. Stalinism is the only way.

Stalinism? Ok... mass genocide inciting fear as a way to control the masses... sounds like religion
Sorry... off topic, couldn't help it
But communism... again, top dog syndrome and corruption

Behavioural Libertarian.

I have also debated with libertarians. They are a pretty easy crowd to figure out. Just say "fundamental rights" and they are appeased. Or say "social..." and they start screaming.

Umm, either you debated some piss-poor Libertarians, or you're clueless. I'd sway towards clueless, as you've apparently not taken the minimal steps needed to establish a supportable opinion. The vast majority of actual Libertarians are more socially laissez-faire than the Democrats, and FAR more socially liberal than anything communist =P

I am pure Stalinist. Stalinism is the only way.

No it ain't

Higher wages at the expense of anothers work. Boss and his profits happen because he is the boss of his company. Work hard and become a boss of a company at the expense of the sweat off you're own back. That is America and that is why I love it. No free hand outs (well we are working on doing away with those) to make you expect something for nothing.


How is his hard work even an issue? Sure, he may manage a company, but the work that he does will not be so much more difficult that he deserves to make 4x-20x what his worker's make! Wages for workers are exploitation, because they are producing more value than they are recieving. Why is that just the accepted reality? I honestly have no idea. But I can guarantee that you would like it better if we had some form of democratic communism. At least then, you would really get to make what you earned.

People think that Communism rewards laziness, but in reality, the work that you do automatically becomes the profit you make. If you work harder, you make more. If you work lazily, you make less. Plus, everything you make goes directly back to benefit you.

Yeah for the high ups in the communist party

Behavioural Libertarian.



Umm, either you debated some piss-poor Libertarians, or you're clueless. I'd sway towards clueless, as you've apparently not taken the minimal steps needed to establish a supportable opinion. The vast majority of actual Libertarians are more socially laissez-faire than the Democrats, and FAR more socially liberal than anything communist =P


That I am aware of, I find myself constantly agreeing with them as far as civil rights go. But what I was alluding to was socialization. Of healthcare, education, anything like that. You just mis-interpreted me.

Yeah for the high ups in the communist party


Communism is the democratic sharing of industry and the means of production. The Party was created solely by Lenin, and both Stalinism and Leninism are psuedo-marxism. A watered down, perverted version of the origional.

Higher wages at the expense of anothers work. Boss and his profits happen because he is the boss of his company. Work hard and become a boss of a company at the expense of the sweat off you're own back. That is America and that is why I love it. No free hand outs (well we are working on doing away with those) to make you expect something for nothing.

Stop complaining about dictators and work hard so you can stage a coup and become one.

How is his hard work even an issue? Sure, he may manage a company, but the work that he does will not be so much more difficult that he deserves to make 4x-20x what his worker's make! Wages for workers are exploitation, because they are producing more value than they are recieving. Why is that just the accepted reality? I honestly have no idea. But I can guarantee that you would like it better if we had some form of democratic communism. At least then, you would really get to make what you earned.
People think that Communism rewards laziness, but in reality, the work that you do automatically becomes the profit you make. If you work harder, you make more. If you work lazily, you make less. Plus, everything you make goes directly back to benefit you.

You come up with an idea for a company then you reap the rewards for that idea. Without the bosses Idea you do not have a job. He/she provides you that means to make a living. I like the idea that you earn what you make happen. Not whatever society makes is what you have earned.

Behavioural Libertarian.



Umm, either you debated some piss-poor Libertarians, or you're clueless. I'd sway towards clueless, as you've apparently not taken the minimal steps needed to establish a supportable opinion. The vast majority of actual Libertarians are more socially laissez-faire than the Democrats, and FAR more socially liberal than anything communist =P


You haven't met any good communists then. I guess what I would be is an Anarcho-marxist. Because I am just about as socially liberal as is humanly possible. People should be able to do whatever they want, whenever they want (although it can't involve the exploitation of others. Crime, business ownership, and holding political office are some of those things)

You come up with an idea for a company then you reap the rewards for that idea. Without the bosses Idea you do not have a job. He/she provides you that means to make a living. I like the idea that you earn what you make happen. Not whatever society makes is what you have earned.

I agree that innovation is worth more, but I also have to say that much of the time, innovation starts ad-hoc with the workers. Finding a better or faster way to do something for example. Thus, we can simply throw out the idea that the founder should reap all the benefits, because the innovation that keeps him in business is more often than not, a direct result of his workers.

A watered down, perverted version of the origional.

You say perverted as though it were a bad thing. Maybe the USSR could have used a few perverts to advocate legalized porno or something.

Stop complaining about dictators and work hard so you can stage a coup and become one.


I'd rather overthrow the system, then hand the people democracy. If the overthrow is executed correctly, then the only option may be democracy anyway! :D

You say perverted as though it were a bad thing. Maybe the USSR could have used a few perverts to advocate legalized porno or something.

Perversion is a twisting of somthing that was once pure. Stalininism, Leninism, and Maoism are all perversions of Communism, and because of the way they were perverted, they created the same problems that Communism was trying to destroy.

Sheer middle-ground common sense and compromise.

Sheer middle-ground common sense and compromise.


Sounds good to me!

I agree that innovation is worth more, but I also have to say that much of the time, innovation starts ad-hoc with the workers. Finding a better or faster way to do something for example. Thus, we can simply throw out the idea that the founder should reap all the benefits, because the innovation that keeps him in business is more often than not, a direct result of his workers.

When the innovation is happening due to a worker or workers they are the ones that are provided with promotions(rewards). Finding a better or faster way of doing something is when and why those workers are rewarded. The founder does not ever reap all the benifits. The entire company reaps the benifits accordingly to who's and what hands had a part in that success(even still they give a reward to everyone in the company) .

You simply can not understand why the person that brought the idea to the table reaps the most from that idea. I simply do not understand why anyone should reap more from the idea than those that brought the idea into play.

When the innovation is happening due to a worker or workers they are the ones that are provided with promotions(rewards). Finding a better or faster way of doing something is when and why those workers are rewarded. The founder does not ever reap all the benifits. The entire company reaps the benifits accordingly to who's and what hands had a part in that success(even still they give a reward to everyone in the company) .

You simply can not understand why the person that brought the idea to the table reaps the most from that idea. I simply do not understand why anyone should reap more from the idea than those that brought the idea into play.



Fair argument, I'll give you that. But what I am trying to get at, is that so many more benefits are available if wages are no longer given, that is, if the person reaps the benefit of what they produce. I am OK with the owner skimming a little off of everyone's profits, after all, it was his idea. But with my system, everyone benefits directly from their own productivity. Sound good? A capitalist would love this idea, but interestingly, it is a communist idea.

Fair argument, I'll give you that. But what I am trying to get at, is that so many more benefits are available if wages are no longer given, that is, if the person reaps the benefit of what they produce. I am OK with the owner skimming a little off of everyone's profits, after all, it was his idea. But with my system, everyone benefits directly from their own productivity. Sound good? A capitalist would love this idea, but interestingly, it is a communist idea.

Fair enough also. The only thing I would add is the workers then would need to pay back for the expenses the Boss put into the means of production. Meaning you pay for that machine you are using, you lease your space you are allowed to work in. You pay for you're cost of that production. Hey we already have something similiar to this, unions. Only they use it under the guise of dues. In return they spend you're dues on whatever the union heads political beliefs are. I could find a gripe about anything. As I believe you could also. Lets not get together ever or we may never stop debating lol. :)

Perversion is a twisting of somthing that was once pure. Stalininism, Leninism, and Maoism are all perversions of Communism, and because of the way they were perverted, they created the same problems that Communism was trying to destroy.

I'd rather overthrow the system, then hand the people democracy. If the overthrow is executed correctly, then the only option may be democracy anyway.

Those were both jokes, actually.

Green Christian Socialist

Fair enough also. The only thing I would add is the workers then would need to pay back for the expenses the Boss put into the means of production. Meaning you pay for that machine you are using, you lease your space you are allowed to work in. You pay for you're cost of the that production. Hey we already have something similiar to this, unions. Only they use it under the guise of dues. In return they spend you're dues on whatever the union heads political beliefs are. I could find a gripe about anything. As I believe you could also. Lets not get together ever or we may never stop debating lol. :)


Yeah, that actually sounds like a workable system right there. Let's call it Capunnism!

I think that will be a good thing though. We should debate on a private chat or something. As long as we both come to some form of conclusions, which we already seem to have done. :D

Those were both jokes, actually.


Sorry, my mind isn't susceptible to jokes right now. Any form of humor is unable to permeate and impact anything. This always happens when I debate in Nation States, unless the joke is really obvious.

Sorry, my mind isn't susceptible to jokes right now. Any form of humor is unable to permeate and impact anything. This always happens when I debate in Nation States, unless the joke is really obvious.
It seems a lot of NS people are that way. No worries.