NationStates Jolt Archive

Well, I was reading the other day that Queen Isabella I of Castile (husband of King Ferdinand, Mother of Catherine of Aragon) is very close to becoming a saint?!

I don't know how true this is but apparently she was first nominated for sainthood in the 1950's by General Franco and she has been beatified...again don't know how true this is.

I was quite surprised when I read this considering that she started the Spanish Inquisition and many other murderous things.

Do you think she should become a saint?

Nobody wanna discuss this?

Does sainthood really mean anything to anyone nowadays? I remember that when I was a boy in catholic school the nuns and priests were all abuzz about a dead nun who worked in our dioces being proposed for sainthood. Nobody who wasn't a member of the clergy seemed to care.

Does sainthood really mean anything to anyone nowadays? I remember that when I was a boy in catholic school the nuns and priests were all abuzz about a dead nun who worked in our dioces being proposed for sainthood. Nobody who wasn't a member of the clergy seemed to care.

But what does it symbolise if she were to become a saint?

She did do good things. But she also financed the voyage to the new world by taking the valuables of Jews and Muslems in their land.

Remember the story of Isabella selling her gold to finance the trip? A lie. The people who were not Catholic had to either leave or stay and 'repent' and become Catholic. If you left then the Crown got all of your goods. And that is what they used to finance the voyage to the new world.

She did do good things. But she also financed the voyage to the new world by taking the valuables of Jews and Muslems in their land.

Remember the story of Isabella selling her gold to finance the trip? A lie. The people who were not Catholic had to either leave or stay and 'repent' and become Catholic. If you left then the Crown got all of your goods. And that is what they used to finance the voyage to the new world.

So, what would you think of her becoming a saint?

Who, Isabella? I guess it symbolizes Spain's identity as a catholic country. Perhaps it symbolizes the victory of the catholics over the muslims in spain. Wasn't she queen when the muslims were forced out completely in 1492? I don't think it matters much to most people though. Europe is becomming increasingly less christian and more secular.

I don't know how true this is but apparently she was first nominated for sainthood in the 1950's by General Franco and she has been beatified...again don't know how true this is.

As far as I know, she was nominated for beatification in 1957. I still don't know whether she got beatified or not...

Who, Isabella? I guess it symbolizes Spain's identity as a catholic country. Perhaps it symbolizes the victory of the catholics over the muslims in spain. Wasn't she queen when the muslims were forced out completely in 1492? I don't think it matters much to most people though. Europe is becomming increasingly less christian and more secular.

Yes, she was the Queen who got rid off the Moors.

So, it doesn't smbolize someone who set up an institution which killed literally millions of people.

Does america have a patron saint? Or is it one of the only christian countrys not to have one?

Who, Isabella? I guess it symbolizes Spain's identity as a catholic country.
Ahem. We are not a catholic country. At least since there's a democratic government and a Constitution over here. True, most of us Spanish are baptised as catholic, but I'd say it's more out of habit than of real belief.

Perhaps it symbolizes the victory of the catholics over the muslims in spain. Wasn't she queen when the muslims were forced out completely in 1492?
Not really. True, there were no more Muslim Taifa Kingdoms in Spain since the conquest of Granada in 1492, but the Moors were not forced out Spain until Philip II, Isabella's grandson, decided so as a response of some Muslim rebellions.

I don't think it matters much to most people though. Europe is becomming increasingly less christian and more secular.
Agreed. But at least the Jew and Muslim communities were not happy to hear Isabella was going to be beatified...

But what does it symbolise if she were to become a saint?

It symbolises that the Catholic Church hasn't canonised anyone for a while and is worried people might forget it exists. The regular "Stating of the Obvious" by the Pope during wars and crises is already desperate enough.

Do you think she should become a saint?

Pfft... Most saints either didn't exist, or didn't do the things they are said to have done, or were thugs in the service of the Catholic Church, anyway; so I don't see why she shouldn't be canonized, it's not like most people care about that nowadays.

It would help the Catholic Church to reinforce itself in Spain, same reason why they rushed to canoniza Juan Diego in Mexico.

It would help the Catholic Church to reinforce itself in Spain
You know what? I don't think so. That's just the usual group of catholics feeling like they should do something for the church... In Spain, usually 'fervorous catholicism' is -unfortunately- associated with strong right-wind ideas, so if Generalísimo Franco wanted Isabella to be a Saint, he should be right, didn't he? Go for it, then! :rolleyes:

It symbolises that the Catholic Church hasn't canonised anyone for a while and is worried people might forget it exists. The regular "Stating of the Obvious" by the Pope during wars and crises is already desperate enough.
Pope John Paul II has canonized more people than have all the popes before him combined.

Ahem. We are not a catholic country. At least since there's a democratic government and a Constitution over here. True, most of us Spanish are baptised as catholic, but I'd say it's more out of habit than of real belief.

I think you'll find that their is a lot more real Catholic belief in Spain than in other Catholic countries (such as France).

Ahem. We are not a catholic country. At least since there's a democratic government and a Constitution over here. True, most of us Spanish are baptised as catholic, but I'd say it's more out of habit than of real belief.

With all due respect, do people stay away from Catholicism because of the bad feelings over Franco (and I understand, he definitely did commit abuses), or genuine disbelief?

Does america have a patron saint? Or is it one of the only christian countrys not to have one?
George Bush.

I think its nice. And yeah so she more or less broought about the Spanish Inquisition.....needs must and desperate times call for desperate measures. Jesus used to enjoy a bottle of wine or three. Does that make him unsuitable cos hes an alky??
If i had my way id canonise Lucretia Borgia as well...................

High Priestess & Mother Superior
The Catholic Girls

Well, I was reading the other day that Queen Isabella I of Castile (husband of King Ferdinand, Mother of Catherine of Aragon) is very close to becoming a saint?!

I don't know how true this is but apparently she was first nominated for sainthood in the 1950's by General Franco and she has been beatified...again don't know how true this is.

I was quite surprised when I read this considering that she started the Spanish Inquisition and many other murderous things.

Do you think she should become a saint?

did'nt they make Joan of Arc a saint?