NationStates Jolt Archive

Now that Russia has turned to a doctrine of preemptive strikes, what shall the appeasement left say? Should Russia turn Chechnya over to Islamic radicals who will install an oppressive government? Would that stop Islamic terrorism in Russia, or would the Islamic radicals turn to "liberating" the next Russian state? What is the benchmark for freedom, anyway? If a group with some kind of tie to a geographicaly location wants freedom from a national government, is that justification enough to let the group and that land go? Because the Republic of Texas (http://www.republic-of-texas.net/) wants the same thing.

Has anyone who thought we should have invaded Saudi Arabia after 9/11 considered that that may have been what Osama bin Laden wanted? that he orchestrated the attack so all of the 9/11 hijackers would be Saudis to try to goad us into attacking the House of Saud so he could come into the quagmire and try to take over the kingdom of Mecca? That has been one of his life's purposes in the first place. ~ Michael.

If a group with some kind of tie to a geographicaly location wants freedom from a national government, is that justification enough to let the group and that land go? Because the Republic of Texas (http://www.republic-of-texas.net/) wants the same thing.
Oh gods yes! That would be the answer to my prayers!

Now that Russia has turned to a doctrine of preemptive strikes, what shall the appeasement left say? Should Russia turn Chechnya over to Islamic radicals who will install an oppressive government? Would that stop Islamic terrorism in Russia, or would the Islamic radicals turn to "liberating" the next Russian state? What is the benchmark for freedom, anyway? If a group with some kind of tie to a geographicaly location wants freedom from a national government, is that justification enough to let the group and that land go? Because the Republic of Texas (http://www.republic-of-texas.net/) wants the same thing.

no, russia should go back in time and not commit attrocities against chechens and kill off all the moderates and push people to accept aid from the radical islamists. russia acted absolutely retardedly with chechnya, it was bound to bite them in the ass eventually.

people have a right to self-determination. if enough texans want to be the republic of texas again, than let them. why try to keep people as part of your country if they don't want to be?

people have a right to self-determination. if enough texans want to be the republic of texas again, than let them. why try to keep people as part of your country if they don't want to be?But what if more of the people in a certain locale want to remain part of the status quo, but extremists intimidate and/or drive them off their land and/or kill them so that it seems only the vocal minority who want separatism drown out those who do not? ~ Michael.

Now that Russia has turned to a doctrine of preemptive strikes, what shall the appeasement left say? Should Russia turn Chechnya over to Islamic radicals who will install an oppressive government? Would that stop Islamic terrorism in Russia, or would the Islamic radicals turn to "liberating" the next Russian state? What is the benchmark for freedom, anyway? If a group with some kind of tie to a geographicaly location wants freedom from a national government, is that justification enough to let the group and that land go?

Russia is not in a very good situation, I'm afraid, it's rather stuck. I guess it would give the Chechens the freedome they want so much. But it will only do it after many more people will die.

But what if more of the people in a certain locale want to remain part of the status quo, but extremists intimidate and/or drive them off their land and/or kill them so that it seems only the vocal minority who want separatism drown out those who do not? ~ Michael.

are you claiming this is the case in chechnya? or is it a general question of theory? east timor dealt with the reverse situation, but with peace-keeping forces around to ensure a free and fair vote on the subject they were able to get a pretty accurate poll of the opinions of people.

are you claiming this is the case in chechnya? or is it a general question of theory? east timor dealt with the reverse situation, but with peace-keeping forces around to ensure a free and fair vote on the subject they were able to get a pretty accurate poll of the opinions of people.Oh, yeah...East Timor's "peace-keeping forces" were a joke. I remember that fiasco. When Indonesian fighters stormed into the tiny new nation, the UN peacekeepers high-tailed it out of there, and the Timorese had to head for the hills. Yes, it all was resolved in the end, but I have no faith in UN peacekeepers. ~ Michael.

are you claiming this is the case in chechnya? or is it a general question of theory? This is just a general question of theory. I do not know the history of the Chechen struggle. ~ Michael.

Russia is not in a very good situation, I'm afraid, it's rather stuck. I guess it would give the Chechens the freedome they want so much. But it will only do it after many more people will die.

maybe they'll just deport them all to kazakhstan like they did before.

maybe they'll just deport them all to kazakhstan like they did before.

People use the word "deport" very loosely. Deporting an entire nation is not really all that easy.

Now that Russia has turned to a doctrine of preemptive strikes, what shall the appeasement left say?
Although I'm not qualified to offer the specifics, generally I would suspect that whatever they have to say is no less sensible than the warmongering right if your post is any indication...what has the warmongers got to say now that Russia has turned to calling their usual activities 'preemptive strikes' in the belief that the US conduct with regards to Iraq has legitimised such a stance? Who do the warmongers think will be next to go 'preemptive' and who will the 'threat' be? China against Taiwan, the Nth Koreans against, well anyone.....?

Should Russia turn Chechnya over to Islamic radicals who will install an oppressive government
Or should they turn the Chechnya over to the majority of citizens who are not radical and simply want to be free from the current regime of oppression?

Would that stop Islamic terrorism in Russia, or would the Islamic radicals turn to "liberating" the next Russian state?
I doubt it.

What is the benchmark for freedom,
Apparently that depends on how powerful you are...

If a group with some kind of tie to a geographicaly location wants freedom from a national government, is that justification enough to let the group and that land go?
That would depend on a large number of factors.

Has anyone who thought we should have invaded Saudi Arabia after 9/11 considered that that may have been what Osama bin Laden wanted?
Has anyone who thought invading Iraq was a good or even acceptable line of action considered that that was what Osama bin Laden wanted?

that he orchestrated the attack so all of the 9/11 hijackers would be Saudis to try to goad us into attacking the House of Saud so he could come into the quagmire and try to take over the kingdom of Mecca?
that he orchestrated the attack so that the US would hysterically lash out at a target in the M.E., thus making years worth of propaganda retoric appear entirely true, whilst at the same time alienating the US from the UN, stretching US military forces, causing a drag on the economy through the interruption of fuel (while driving profit into the hands of alternative suppliers, including those Saudi's who back and finance Osama'a activities), and due the resouce requirements of the war....etc.....

But what if more of the people in a certain locale want to remain part of the status quo, but extremists intimidate and/or drive them off their land and/or kill them so that it seems only the vocal minority who want separatism drown out those who do not?
This question is relevent to the Chechyn situation how exactly?

people have a right to self-determination. if enough texans want to be the republic of texas again, than let them. why try to keep people as part of your country if they don't want to be?
One Texan would be enough. No man should be forced to join a political association if he does not wish to, nor should that association have any jurisdiction over his property. All they may do is force him to respect the person and property of others.