NationStates Jolt Archive

I was on the http://www.politicalcompass.org site reacently, and I noticed something:

In the lower right hand corner (the 'libertarian quadrant' by my definition) there were no politicians. Has there never been a practical application of even moderate libertarianism, or were the results completely un-newsworthy?

And how do you post links? They changed the bloody syntax!

we had libertarianism, in the US in the 1800's to early 1900's. i am a libertarian myself, but believe there is a necessity for government and social programs to alleviate suffering of the handicap, elderly, and uh, unproductive. that's really why america went away from liberatarianism, for instance, the robber barons and boom-bust economy erspecially during the depression hurt too many people, i think libertarians have a political place and role in this age of way too taxed populaces and overgenerous social programs....balance things out. but i have yet to see a popular libetarian candidate, more's the pity.

we had libertarianism, in the US in the 1800's to early 1900's. i am a libertarian myself, but believe there is a necessity for government and social programs to alleviate suffering of the handicap, elderly, and uh, unproductive. that's really why america went away from liberatarianism, for instance, the robber barons and boom-bust economy erspecially during the depression hurt too many people, i think libertarians have a political place and role in this age of way too taxed populaces and overgenerous social programs....balance things out. but i have yet to see a popular libetarian candidate, more's the pity.

Well, by the stadards of the day the US was libertarian, but by modern standards, they were conservative (since much social progress was yet to be made). I guess it depends of how you look at it.

I think Libertarians are the anarchists, people that want their nation out of foreign affairs and the government out of the people's affairs. People like that probably wouldn't run, or at least be sucessful running for a government position

Correct me if I'm wrong (and it's likely that I am), but weren't there also fairly restrictive tariffs and immigration laws during that time period?

The example I hear most often from other libertarians is Hong Kong, and if it's an accurate example, then it says all kinds of good things about libertarianism.

:) That compass?

I don't know of anybody who has not come out as a Libertarian....

i am for a more libertarian spirit in this society (US)....and to answer your question, almost all government revenue was based on tariffs in the 1800's, but immigration laws weren;t tightened until the early 1900's (just watched a discovery channel expose on american immigration. yes, i am a dork). frankly, maybe i am not making clear my defniition of libertarianism....utilitarian in its' individualism, civil rights and social policies, inward looking rather than outward looking foreign policy.....does anyone else see it differently?

I don't know the answer, but I'd be interested in hearing it as well.
I think Libertarians are the anarchists, people that want their nation out of foreign affairs and the government out of the people's affairs. People like that probably wouldn't run, or at least be sucessful running for a government positionAnarchists think there should be no government, but libertarians think the government should let them do as they wish. Libertarians do run for government, and do hold positions in government (I'm not sure how high positions, however).

Hmmm... (http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Asian_Economy/EG10Dk01.html)

but immigration laws weren;t tightened until the early 1900's (just watched a discovery channel expose on american immigration. yes, i am a dork).

Correct. For example, all those guys who got off the boat from Ireland and were "drafted" for the army during the civil war.

I think Libertarians are the anarchists, people that want their nation out of foreign affairs and the government out of the people's affairs. People like that probably wouldn't run, or at least be sucessful running for a government position

Not entirely accurate, but it reminds me of a funny story. A year or two ago, we had a libertarian run for Commissioner of Agriculture, on the promise that if elected he would eliminate the position and resign.

Where are the right-wing social libertarians on the international chart ?

It's a good question, and we'd like to include some, but we haven't found any among the biggest internationally-known players. It 's important to remember, though, that within each quadrant there are still very sizeable variables. Some figures on the right of the chart are only of a modest authoritarian tendency.


Thought you might like to know. (I don't really blame you, the site FAQ is not all that easy to get to.)

We have a libertarian party, the Progressive Democrats, in power in my country. I live in Ireland. Their leader is Mary Harney, see their website

http://www.progressivedemocrats.ie/

I think Libertarians are the anarchists, people that want their nation out of foreign affairs and the government out of the people's affairs. People like that probably wouldn't run, or at least be sucessful running for a government position
Anarchists are libertarians but libertarians aren't Anarchists. I have seen the 'left' and 'right' being placed before Libertarian to differenciate between Anarchists and what are usually thought of as Libertarian.

Anarchists think there should be no government, but libertarians think the government should let them do as they wish. Libertarians do run for government, and do hold positions in government (I'm not sure how high positions, however).


Not quite, although some Libertarians would accept a 'Shadow-state' or Night Watchman state (to use Nozick's [iirc] term), not all do. The Anarcho-Capitalists being the primary example of right Libertarians not wanting a state or thinking a state as unnessasary

I think Libertarians are the anarchists, people that want their nation out of foreign affairs and the government out of the people's affairs. People like that probably wouldn't run, or at least be sucessful running for a government position

I'm a social libertarian, and I AM NOT ANARCHIST!!!!

I believe in staying out of the personal lives of one's citizens, however in foregin affaris, one should know when to help and when to stay out of it - not intervene willy-nilly but not be isolationist.

Economic-wise, I am a moderate conservative. I want to keep the market as free as possible, however I am aware that I must put standards in place so I can prevent corporate corruption

Ron Paul (http://www.house.gov/paul/) is one of the more promenent libertarians in the US today, even though he currently a Republican congressman.

Ron Paul is also a member of the Libertarian party and even ran for president on the Libertarian ticket. There are probably some Libertarians buried deep on the back benches of the UK conservative party too. The thing is, most Libertarians would be sickened to hold a govt position, it'd be like Marx running Microsoft. Most would rather get out into the world and do something constructive.

Here is a list of famous Libertarian or Libertarian leaning celebrities.

http://www.self-gov.org/celebrities.html

It includes: Clint Eastwood, Tom Selleck, 5 nobel prize winners (real ones, none of this pishy "literature"), Richard Branson and Frank Zappa, amongst many others.

Ron Paul is also a member of the Libertarian party and even ran for president on the Libertarian ticket. There are probably some Libertarians buried deep on the back benches of the UK conservative party too. The thing is, most Libertarians would be sickened to hold a govt position, it'd be like Marx running Microsoft. Most would rather get out into the world and do something constructive.

Here is a list of famous Libertarian or Libertarian leaning celebrities.

http://www.self-gov.org/celebrities.html

It includes: Clint Eastwood, Tom Selleck, 5 nobel prize winners (real ones, none of this pishy "literature"), Richard Branson and Frank Zappa, amongst many others.
Three Cheers for Dr. Demento!

I'm an extreme social libertarian and an extreme Marxist. Pretty radical, I must admit, I am. Actually, I have some friends who are true libertarians, and they tell me that they actually have been doing some things politically. In my state, Oregon, they're pretty active. Remember that whole incident with our school year being 21 days shorter because we didn't have the budget? Yeah, our libertarians pushed for that. Also, the Libertarian party actually had 20,000 Libertarians move to New Hampshire for a social experiment. They have been doing some things over there. They are more successful than the socialists anyway. They are actually pretty active. From what I've seen, they're pretty effective.

Ron paul of texas (house member) is a libertarian-conservative but thats the best we got really he ran for president in 1988.

There are lots of guys on the smaller positions but thats it

Yes that project is free state project check it out online- pretty cool!

The party is very active it even has a a presidential candidate who is behind nader but hey! I think last time they pulled 2% or less of the vote.

Idaho's party (my state) needs to update its website badly. They are alive but not as much as they previously were. IN 2002 we had alot of reform here and the libertarians one several seats and ran for many seats. Not so much this year. I am in touch with them particularly the head of the party ted dunlap and have attended some events and may well be helping them out to win but I dislike the parties stance on abortion though not all libertarians agree on that issue

I gotta say, I'm a Poli Sci major, and I'm pretty impressed by what you guys have done. Politically anyway. You are a far smaller minority than even us extreme leftists, but you have done more. It could be that Americans are predisposed to Capitalism, which I believe to be true. Our culture supports it for some odd reason. If only people would get over their blind idealism and realize that not everyone can make it! Even if you have ambition and work hard, the system is too elitist for you to become anything! That's my philosophy anyway. I root for your guys' advocacy groups, like the ACLU, but dear god, please, I know you guys want to change the system and lower taxes, but if you are going to try that, AT LEAST CHANGE THE SYTEM FIRST! Under the current way of doing things, we do need higher taxes to serve our people. So until that changes, you guys shouldn't vote for tax cuts, because they really kicked the shit out of my poor state.

Now, granted, I'll be pushing to make the system as Marxist as possible, but I don't care if you guys are going to try to push back. I guess it is just gonna depend on who's stronger : p

Libertarians have only been succesful at the state level, I think there is something like 100 or so throughout the entire country workling as a state legislature's, senators and coucil members....but wasn't jessie ventura a libertairian or something? not sure but I think he was and I dont think it worked out well.

Ron paul of texas (house member) is a libertarian-conservative but thats the best we got really he ran for president in 1988. There are lots of guys on the smaller positions but thats it"

I like Ron Paul, he never votes on any issue unless it has a Constitutional purpose. A far cry from Bush or Kerry since he never flip flops....

Not quite, although some Libertarians would accept a 'Shadow-state' or Night Watchman state (to use Nozick's [iirc] term), not all do. The Anarcho-Capitalists being the primary example of right Libertarians not wanting a state or thinking a state as unnessasaryThe definition of anarchist is an advocate of anarchism, which is a political theory favoring the abolition of governments.
The definition of libertarian is someone who believes the doctrine of free will, which is the power of making free choices unconstrained by external agencies.
(The above definitions from Webster's Online Dictionary The Rosetta Edition™.)
Also, the Libertarian party actually had 20,000 Libertarians move to New Hampshire for a social experiment. They have been doing some things over there.This is not correct.
Q: Is the FSP part of the Libertarian Party?

A: We are not in any way affiliated with the Libertarian Party. However, many FSP members are also LP members, as there is some natural overlap in the goals of both organizations. We also do some recruiting and publicity at LP events for the same reason.
The Free State Project is a plan in which 20,000 or more liberty-oriented people will move to New Hampshire, where they may work within the political system to reduce the size and scope of government.(Emphasis mine)
There are 6,029 participants in the project as of September 2, 2004, only 300 of which are in New Hampshire.