NationStates Jolt Archive

hi
right, i'm a satanist and i was wondering what christians think of me, and your opinion of satanism in general.
cool

I'm not a christian, but I am curious about one aspect of satanism. Do you really beleive that a satanic ceremony can bring you the object of your desires or punish those that have wronged you?

i guess some of us do, but you could ask a christian the equivalent. what i mean is we're not all extremists, the way i take it is the opposite of christians, instead turning the other cheek, i believe in vengence, and instead of resisting temptation, indulge in it. cool isn't it

could you explain more about satanism? I'm a christian and don't have an opinion on it as I don't know much about it.

it's basically the opposite of christianity, its portrayed as we do ceremonies and kill people, but thats not really what we actually do, we don't usually carve pentagrams into us, that'd hurt. its trying our best to benfit us, as individuals, but that doesn't necesarily make us selfish, i try as hard as i can to make my life easy etc, but i still care way more about some people i love than myself, and wouldnt hurt them to make it better for me, thats basically it.

Well there's always two sides to every story ... :cool:

Well, 'Satanism' can mean many things. What kind of Satanist are you?

Are you the kind that worships the Christian devil? (ie. the angsty-teen-goth-rebel type)

Are you the 'Inanimate Satan' kind? (ie. the kind that views 'Satan' as the source of all mystical and spiritual energy, but not as an intelligent, aware entity)

Are you the 'Demon Satan' kind? (ie. the kind that chooses to worship Satan as an intelligent, aware entity as one of many 'demons' who are also open to worship)

Are you the 'modern Satanist' kind? (ie. the kind that worships themselves as the overriding power in their own spiritual lives, and use 'Satan' as a symbol for spiritual independence and rebellion)

Or are you a kind that I've missed?

Oops, it seems you basically answered my question before I had the chance to post it! Oh well... I type too slowly!

I'm not a christian, but I am curious about one aspect of satanism. Do you really beleive that a satanic ceremony can bring you the object of your desires or punish those that have wronged you?

That's a belief held by a number of religions that use 'magic' to accomplish an end. A ritualized ceremony is a way of helping direct and focus your energy to help something happen the way you want it to.

It's a similar concept to prayer, only the final outcome isn't typically left in the hands of an intangible, so to speak. You believe that by doing the ritual, you will accomplish what you want and you do. It's not relying on the whim of a god to attain what you want.

eggplants clever, satanisms cool, i dunno what kind i am, i think satan creats all things that are fun ie. drugs, but all that he creates have harsher consequences than 'gods' creations i used the ''s not cos i don't believe in god but to represent whatever god you choose

Well, as I said, 'Satanist' can mean many, many things depending on who is applying and who is wearing the label. It's rather an interesting topic once you start getting into the history of it all.

lol @ satanism

Doesn't someone have to be a christian to be a satanist?

or are you just following Anton Lavey in his mockery of organised religion?

lol @ satanism

Doesn't someone have to be a christian to be a satanist?

or are you just following Anton Lavey in his mockery of organised religion?
No, some satanists use the name satan as a symbol for freedom and control over one's destiny. It has nothing to do with the biblical satan.

joeys cool to, the biblical satans only cool in the films, in reality, hes scary, unless your some sort of super hero, like spiderman

i guess some of us do, but you could ask a christian the equivalent. what i mean is we're not all extremists, the way i take it is the opposite of christians, instead turning the other cheek, i believe in vengence, and instead of resisting temptation, indulge in it. cool isn't it

Just so you know. vengeance and "turn the other cheek" are not actually opposites. "Turn the other cheek" as Christ taught it was a form of standing up for yourself - it has just gotten misinterpreted over the yeras. =)

As for what I think of Satanists, if you're not hurting anyone - I don't really care what religion you are - that's you're right. In fact, I think it would be fun to sit down with a Satanist one day and have a theological discussion.

joeys cool to, the biblical satans only cool in the films, in reality, hes scary, unless your some sort of super hero, like spiderman
You just lost every ounce of respect I may have ever held for you.
Tell me, can you and your boogeymonster put a hex on me?
What if I'm one of the Ninja Turtles?
Honestly, I thought that I'd seen the limit when we had a Nazi frenzy going on, but you are just beyond absurd.

lol

You just lost every ounce of respect I may have ever held for you.
Tell me, can you and your boogeymonster put a hex on me?
What if I'm one of the Ninja Turtles?
Honestly, I thought that I'd seen the limit when we had a Nazi frenzy going on, but you are just beyond absurd.


but could a nazi supervillian with satanic powers and a tesla death ray take on the teenage mutant ninja turtles. i say yes cuz the turtles are unnatural species mixing degenerates.

You just lost every ounce of respect I may have ever held for you.
Tell me, can you and your boogeymonster put a hex on me?
What if I'm one of the Ninja Turtles?
Honestly, I thought that I'd seen the limit when we had a Nazi frenzy going on, but you are just beyond absurd.

:D

y'no i'm joking, you take everything way to seriously

but could a nazi supervillian with satanic powers and a tesla death ray take on the teenage mutant ninja turtles. i say yes cuz the turtles are unnatural species mixing degenerates.
You still have yet to keep up with the promised caning.

Anyway, anything you do, a ferret can do worse.

You still have yet to keep up with the promised caning.

Anyway, anything you do, a ferret can do worse.


there's an old joke about a sadist and a masochist.
the masochist says,"hurt me, hurt me."
and the sadist says,"no."


:p

y'no i'm joking, you take everything way to seriously
Organized religion just bites me in a way ferrets can't manage, and satanists are worse than the other purveyors of god(s) and fine brainwashing.
Especially after the fifth time they've run naked through the parking lot. I have a lot of places to go at midnight, and none of them are appreciably improved by naked people running around the parking lot screaming.
Even if it does appease the Lord of Darkness, it still is annoying.

There are alot of variables. If you simply believe that you are the center of the universe I think to use the term Satanist is really inappropriate since Satan is the Direct anagonist in the Christain panthoen. If you really do worship Satan I would wonder about your sanity. In Christianity Satan is a cast out who will make you suffer if you join him. All of this is comming from a Thesist agnostic, so I'm not comming from a Christains biast possition. It just seem illogical to me.
If you don't truely believe in Satan as the fallen angel then your not a religion your a philosophy of selfishness.

Exactly.Normally I'd launch into a huge rant,but I just don't have the eneregy right now.They'res way to many religions that call themselves Satanism and to many religions that are like those and to many religions with a figure called Satan..........you gotta clarafiy........I'm so lazy today/...............

Satanism is bullshit.

screw all that. I'm joining the temple of set.

Terra - Domina, you have a very limited knowledge of Satanism. If you don't know anything about it, don't post.


ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

Yes that's right, aren't you late for something, like the short bus?

Yes that's right, aren't you late for something, like the short bus?

:D lol

maybe

:D lol

maybe
Now wrong along, 'lest you miss the next one too.

RuneBlade, just because it's written in the Bible doesn't mean it is the absolute truth. Satanists of all kinds don't view Lucifer as the Christians do, they view him as good and Jehova as 'evil', we don't worship an evil deity, we don't worship Satan at all, we follow his teachings
ARENTSTHO

So what book or whose teachings do a benevolent approach to Lucifer come from? I understand the arguement that the victor writes the history books. So I can see that arguement being used. If thats the case then what benevolent qualities does Lucifer posses, and what is your perspective on the after life?

Hajekistan, any Spiritual Satanist will be able to in time. I'm not sure about Modern Satanists, they're useless. Anyone who is running around parking lots at night is not a Satanist, they're just some self-indulgent retard who calls himself a Satanist to seem 'cool'.
Weeell then, let this be an open challenge to all Spiritual Satanists, HEX ME!!!!
Tell your friends, tell your relatives, tell the Gods of the Underworld!
Keep and non-lethal (and so I can still type) and I'll keep you up to date if it works.
Further, I don't quite think you understand, it isn't just the fact that they are running in the parking lot, they are doing it naked thats just wrong.

Finally a chance to ask a question I've been thinking about a lot.

In Christianity: How did Satan come to be? Was he always there? Did God create him? Was he an angel? Was he a demon son of Adam (he had several children with *something not human, I don't know what*, but all those children were demons. God decided to create Eve for them to procreate and inhabit the earth)? What is he? Is he a God? What?

Phew, that feels good

Finally a chance to ask a question I've been thinking about a lot.

In Christianity: How did Satan come to be? Was he always there? Did God create him? Was he an angel? Was he a demon son of Adam (he had several children with *something not human, I don't know what*, but all those children were demons. God decided to create Eve for them to procreate and inhabit the earth)? What is he? Is he a God? What?

Phew, that feels good
Satan was originally lucifer, the bearer of light. God's favorite angel. Lucifer got uppity and god kicked him out.

Well that depends what you call benevolent. Lucifer teaches indulgence with balance, to stand up for yourself offensively and for Spiritual Satanists, become Gods through meditation to advance and empower the soul and to become independant of aid from the demons. In general it is to live life to the fullest we possibly can. Lucifer and the demons are wise and knowledgeable, they teach us how to empower our souls - which everyone can do - the knowledge of how to do so was locked away by the Church. There are several writings of Satanic Bibles LaVey's and two others who's names I can't spell (ancient), none of them are like the Xtian Bible, they aren't 'history', they're the outlining of the Satanist moral code. As for the history, read this: The Annunaki (http://www.geocities.com/darkistrein666/anun.html).
As to the afterlife. Christian souls go to Heaven, where they are destroyed and turned into pure energy for the Angels to devour. Satanic souls go to Hell, where they await reincarnation. Just to tell you it is not a place of fire, torment etc. it is paradise, where we can indulge endlessly without fear of damage to ourselves from over-indulgence.

I'm not sure it is possible to do a hex over the internet, my friend could ask a demon to do it, but I doubt that any demon would do so, find one in your neighborhood.
You're right, that is wrong.


lol

and you arent christian how?

Satan was originally lucifer, the bearer of light. God's favorite angel. Lucifer got uppity and god kicked him out.
What did he do as bearer of the light? And why did God kick him out (he's supposed to be all-forgiving)?

PS what a bunch of crap about those astronauts

hi
right, i'm a satanist and i was wondering what christians think of me, and your opinion of satanism in general.
cool

As a Christian, I just feel sorry for you. I believe you're greatly misguided.
I also have a question for you: Does worshipping the devil make you happy?

As a Christian, I just feel sorry for you. I believe you're greatly misguided.
I also have a question for you: Does worshipping the devil make you happy?
Why else would he be a satanist? I guess he's not a fool. Humans are animals of pleasure and lazyness

Wasn't 'Lucifer' also referred to as being a heathen/pagan sun god at one point? His name meaning "Lightbringer" and all? I've heard a number of times that the Christian 'Lucifer' was simply a peversion of this pagan concept, and the idea of his being cast out of heaven was a metaphor for Christians conquering certain pagan groups.

Sort of like St. George slaying the dragon. The dragon was the tribal symbol for a pagan group, and basically ol' George just killed a bunch of people.

Or did I make that all up and just not know it? o.O

Uh, personally I don't think that any of this spiritual stuff is real. I don't think God/Angels/Heaven or Satan/Lucifer/Hell exist. It's a load of hooey. U know, the entire reason that we are inclined to believe in religion is because humans as a species are unsure of certain things i.e. what happens when we die. Which is where the whole thing about God and heaven and hell came from. I don't think there are demons who can give you power. There is only your "self", your conciousness (or you can call it a spirit). The average person just doesn't want to accept that they are the only person that can help themselves, they want something to empower (demons, faith, whatever) them, people have created such things out of being unsure of themselves.

Soooo, enuf ranting, that's just my opinion about the whole religion thing, I am not pretending to know the answers, this is just what I think.

:sniper:

How is that being Christian? Both are completely different. While both hold a few things as being similar, like Angels, Demons, Jehova and Lucifer, the dynamics of each are completely different.

Jebustan, following the teachings of Satan, one does become happy.

what you are arguing is the same as someone saying that worshiping Zeus is a differant religion than Worshiping Hades.

Its the same mythology

As a Christian, I just feel sorry for you. I believe you're greatly misguided.
I also have a question for you: Does worshipping the devil make you happy?

As a non-believer, I just feel sorry for you. I believe you're greatly misguided,jebustan.

:D As a non-believer, I just feel sorry for you. I believe you're greatly misguided,jebustan.

I laugh at you!!!

This message has been deleted by Arenestho. Reason: You people are narrow-minded, so I'll stop

Awww, don't be like that Arenstho. I, for one, am actually genuinely curious about your concept of spirituality. I really like to learn all I can about different people's faiths. If you don't want to discuss it in a public forum, how 'bout throwing a telegram my way?

Oops quoted the wrong thing, sorry Glasgae!
:confused:
I laugh at Jebustan. :D

What did he do as bearer of the light? And why did God kick him out (he's supposed to be all-forgiving)?

PS what a bunch of crap about those astronauts
Don't ask me to justify the story. I'm an atheist. I was just telling you the story.

Originally Posted by Arenstho
This message has been deleted by Arenestho. Reason: You people are narrow-minded, so I'll stop


Haha.. this is just a really childlike thing to do. I read stuff on the link and I think it's crap. I don't believe that as you don't believe in the existence of God an think THAT is utter crap. If you don't like my thinking it's crap, well tough luck. Don't be a baby

Don't ask me to justify the story. I'm an atheist. I was just telling you the story.
I didn't ask you personally. I ask in general.

Why was Satan/Lucifer kicked out of Heaven?

I didn't ask you personally. I ask in general.

Why was Satan/Lucifer kicked out of Heaven?
Depends on who you ask. Either he sought to userp god's power, or he refused to lower himself to serve man. I've heard two versions from different but related religions.

[QUOTE Why was Satan/Lucifer kicked out of Heaven?[/QUOTE]

Because he got his wish? He believed it would be better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven (to quote Milton)

I didn't ask you personally. I ask in general.

Why was Satan/Lucifer kicked out of Heaven?

The story is that Lucifer became full of pride and felt that he could become God himself. So he got a whole bunch of the rest of the angels together and tried to start a revolt. There was a big fight and then God banished Lucifer.

Of course, Anne Rice has an interesting take on that whole story if you read Memnoch the Devil.

I think that you worship the very reason that a man long ago died on a cross in agony to save humanity. And if what you describe (and I've read previously), really is Satanism, then you've got 80% of America as ready converts. That really worries me.

May God be with you and bless you anyway,

-R. S. of UC

Because he got his wish? He believed it would be better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven (to quote Milton)
Was Hell already there?

I don't know if Hell was there or not. I don't think we were meant to understand everything and we cannot apply logic to religious ideas. If we could what would be the point of faith?

I compare having faith to love (I am ot talking about lust here). You can neither fully understand them. One cannot use logic to reason why you feel how you feel, or believe how you believe. And it is not something you caan see touch or taste...but you can feel it inside. It just is. And, I think, the more you try to understand either one of them, the more you realize it cannot be understood. That is what makes both of them so wonderful.

I was an atheist for a while, but then I found it was a religion in and of itself. It is still subjecting yourself to a defined belief system...even if that belief system is the antithesis of more popularized ideologies.

i find that religion has taken on a whole new meaning to some. To some it's the only way to live and i suppose you can call them fanatics, and then there are some that try very hard to live to their code of ethics or morals, the moderates I would call them, and then there are the people who are out for themselves and don't give a hoot about anyone else, i say they would be called the selfish ones.

Every one has their own beliefs. We should all be able to see what a person does or acts towards his or her's fellow man/woman, etc. I have friends who come from different countries and different religions. To me their my friends, I respect and love them for who they are, not their religion, race, ethnic background or their politics.

I think if everyone believed the way I do, there would be no 9/11 or ethnic cleansing wars.

Not all satanists follow the satan thing from the bible, some, like me jsut believe that there is an all powerful being in the world, but instead of the christian view of god as good, he is evil, leading him to being satan. We don't do all those 'hexes' and 'rituals' that everyone goes on about satanists doing(okay, the occasionally 6ft pentagram in a childs playground in greece is a bit of a ritual) But other than that theres not too much sinister about it, unless you look at it the wrong way. I'll probally get flamed for saying this but it's basically an alternate christianity in the main views. eg. Big God- Christians see him as good Satanists evil

Sleda

Satan and Lucifer aren't even the same person.

In Christianity Satan is a cast out who will make you suffer if you join him.

of course, what you fail to mention is the source of THIS information is the christian propaganda text commonly known as the bible. under stalin, everything the USSR published said he was a gooc, compasionate guy and all capitalists were evil bogey men coming to snatch your babies.

an interesting article, that is worth reading, called in praise of the devil, can be found at lucifer.com (http://www.lucifer.com/lucifer.html)

Why was Satan/Lucifer kicked out of Heaven?

Dempublicents said- The story is that Lucifer became full of pride and felt that he could become God himself. So he got a whole bunch of the rest of the angels together and tried to start a revolt. There was a big fight and then God banished Lucifer.

Joey P said-

from "In praise of the devil" (see above link)
'Lucifer' means 'light-bringer' and this should begin to clue us in to his symbolic importance. The story is that God threw Lucifer out of Heaven because Lucifer had started to question God and was spreading dissension among the angels. We must remember that this story is told from the point of view of the Godists (if I may coin a term) and not from that of the Luciferians (I will use this term to distinguish us from the official Satanists with whom I have fundamental differences). The truth may just as easily be that Lucifer resigned from heaven.

God, being the well-documented sadist that he is, no doubt wanted to keep Lucifer around so that he could punish him and try to get him back under his (God's) power. Probably what really happened was that Lucifer came to hate God's kingdom, his sadism, his demand for slavish conformity and obedience, his psychotic rage at any display of independent thinking and behavior. Lucifer realized that he could never fully think for himself and could certainly not act on his independent thinking so long as he was under God's control. Therefore he left Heaven, that terrible spiritual-State ruled by the cosmic sadist Jehovah, and was accompanied by some of the angels who had had enough courage to question God's authority and his value-perspective.

[quote]Wasn't 'Lucifer' also referred to as being a heathen/pagan sun god at one point? His name meaning "Lightbringer" and all? I've heard a number of times that the Christian 'Lucifer' was simply a peversion of this pagan concept, and the idea of his being cast out of heaven was a metaphor for Christians conquering certain pagan groups.


I don't know if he was a god. the term lucifer is only used ONE time throughout the entire bible. it is not actually discussing a fallen angel, but a babylonian king or prince. the line that mentions lucifer is isaiah 14:12 which reads: "How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! [how] art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!" which taken in this context one could easily perceive it to mean satan. let's read from isaiah 14:3 through to 14:22 for the proper context however: 3When the LORD has given you rest from your pain and turmoil and the hard service with which you were made to serve, 4you will take up this taunt against the king of Babylon: How the oppressor has ceased! How his insolence has ceased! 5The LORD has broken the staff of the wicked, the scepter of rulers, 6that struck down the peoples in wrath with unceasing blows, that ruled the nations in anger with unrelenting persecution. 7The whole earth is at rest and quiet; they break forth into singing. 8The cypresses exult over you, the cedars of Lebanon, saying, "Since you were laid low, no one comes to cut us down."
9Sheol (the grave (http://www.wordonly.com/CI05.html)) beneath is stirred up to meet you when you come; it rouses the shades to greet you, all who were leaders of the earth; it raises from their throne all who were kings of the nations. 10All of them will speak and say to you: "You too have become as weak as we! You have become like us!" 11Your pomp is brought down to Sheol , and the sound of your harps; maggots are the bed beneath you, and worms are your covering. 12How you are fallen from heaven, O lucifer, son of morning! How you are cut down to the ground, you who laid the nations low! 13thou said in your heart, "I will ascend to heaven; I will raise my throne above the stars of God; I will sit on the mount of assembly on the heights of Zaphon; 14I will ascend to the tops of the clouds, I will make myself like the Most High." 15But you are brought down to Sheol, to the depths of the Pit. 16Those who see you will stare at you, and ponder over you: "Is this the man who made the earth tremble, who shook kingdoms,17who made the world like a desert and overthrew its cities, who would not let his prisoners go home?" 18All the kings of the nations lie in glory, each in his own tomb; 19but you are cast out, away from your grave, like loathsome carrion, clothed with the dead, those pierced by the sword, who go down to the stones of the Pit, like a corpse trampled underfoot. 20You will not be joined with them in burial, because you have destroyed your land, you have killed your people. May the descendants of evildoers nevermore be named! 21Prepare slaughter for his sons because of the guilt of their father. Let them never rise to possess the earth or cover the face of the world with cities. 22I will rise up against them, says the LORD of hosts, and will cut off from Babylon name and remnant, offspring and posterity, says the LORD. 23And I will make it a possession of the hedgehog, and pools of water, and I will sweep it with the broom of destruction, says the LORD of hosts.


lucifer is the latin term for venus as the morning star. it DOES mean light bearer (root word is luciferum) from the catholic encyclopedia (http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/09410a.htm): The name Lucifer originally denotes the planet Venus, emphasizing its brilliance. The Vulgate employs the word also for "the light of the morning" (Job 11:17), "the signs of the zodiac" (Job 38:32), and "the aurora" (Psalm 109:3). Metaphorically, the word is applied to the King of Babylon (Isaiah 14:12 "lucifer" ) as preeminent among the princes of his time.

in at least one form of satanism however, there is a "being" known as lucifer. he is one of four "crown princes of satan" (the other three being leviathan (west) belial (north) and satan (south)) information on this aspect can be found at: http://www.dpjs.co.uk/lucifer.html and satanism in general at: http://www.dpjs.co.uk.

I hope this clears up some confusion.

Ansuz- I was just about to mention the fact that the whole story of Satan's fall is not particularly well-founded in Scripture, but you've saved me the task- thanks!
My personal feeling as a Christian is that Satan as a tempter is a metaphor for the 'little voice' in the back of our heads telling us to sin. However, even if he is some tangible entity, it doesn't really matter either way, his role is the same.

As for Satanism itself, I'm not really interested in it. Anyone actually worshipping the Biblical Satan is, as I believe has already been said above, a bit of an idiot. The idea of worshipping oneself seems extremely bizarre to me, and I'd say it sounds like a load of bollocks, but then so does Christianity to the ill-informed...

You just lost every ounce of respect I may have ever held for you.
Tell me, can you and your boogeymonster put a hex on me?
What if I'm one of the Ninja Turtles?
Honestly, I thought that I'd seen the limit when we had a Nazi frenzy going on, but you are just beyond absurd.

Nazis and Satanists? Oh my! Reminds me of someone.... ;)

Nazis and Satanists? Oh my! Reminds me of someone.... ;)

What about anti-Nazi Satanists? One engeged to a Christian no less. LOL

Hail Satan!
Jim

What about anti-Nazi Satanists? One engeged to a Christian no less. LOL

Hail Satan!
Jim

Hehehee! :D

hi
right, i'm a satanist and i was wondering what christians think of me, and your opinion of satanism in general.
cool

To be perfectly honest, I don't really have the patience to read the whole thread. But I love you. You ever see Equilibrium? You know when the trained killer is looking at the cutest puppy in the whole world, and you know the puppy is thinking "but I loooovvveveee you......"?

Yeah. I'm the puppy.

so you're not entirely opposed to christians parra, good cuz i'll still trying to hook you up with confederate glory and i think he might lean a bit toward the xtian indentity side of the whole wp/ns/ racialist thingie.

so you're not entirely opposed to christians parra, good cuz i'll still trying to hook you up with confederate glory and i think he might lean a bit toward the xtian indentity side of the whole wp/ns/ racialist thingie.

Trying to hook me up?

No, I'm not that against Christians...just particular individuals who I've met (Fundies mainly).

Trying to hook me up?

No, I'm not that against Christians...just particular individuals who I've met (Fundies mainly).

what are your gay friends for, if not to play matchmaker(or the ooc secretly married ones)

what are your gay friends for, if not to play matchmaker(or the ooc secretly married ones)


Lol, you are so funny Ernst Rohm... I can't help but like you. ;)

confed's one of my three favorite internet nazis(aside from you)
the other two i've lost contact with:

natlig was from kansas and also a pretty nice guy, but i lost track of him.

disciple was probably my favorite nazi but he wouldn't be a good match for you. a cranky old 40 something football hooligan and ex squaddy from manchester with a long term girlfriend an ex wife and two kids one of whom i think is a teenager. i actually had to stop exchanging e-mails with him cuz he always seemed to win our political arguments and that started to scare me.

confed's one of my three favorite internet nazis(aside from you)
the other two i've lost contact with:

natlig was from kansas and also a pretty nice guy, but i lost track of him.

disciple was probably my favorite nazi but he wouldn't be a good match for you. a cranky old 40 something football hooligan and ex squaddy from manchester with a long term girlfriend an ex wife and two kids one of whom i think is a teenager. i actually had to stop exchanging e-mails with him cuz he always seemed to win our political arguments and that started to scare me.

And I am expected to respect this? If you wish to say word(s), you damn sure better live by them. Each child is Your Childe. Nazis will not admit to thier children?

*pure hatred*

Jim

And I am expected to respect this? If you wish to say word(s), you damn sure better live by them. Each child is Your Childe. Nazis will not admit to thier children?

*pure hatred*

Jim


you've got me confused jim.

disciple paid support, and i think he said his oldest had decided to come and live with him in one of the last e-mails i got from him. he and his wife had been divorsed for a number of years. it wasn't particularly amiable from what i understood but he tried to stay as close to his kids as he could. i know cuz he'd get drunk and send me football scores and pictures of his kids and occasional tirades against his ex, i'm not sure he was the world's greatest dad but he tried.