NationStates Jolt Archive

Scroll down past the first article and you shall find "Forgotten Black Voices"

http://www.amren.com/939issue/939issue.html#cover




Forgotten Black Voices

American slaves had surprisingly positive things to say about slavery.

by Gedahlia Braun

In the June and July cover story in AR on black claims for reparations because of slavery, there was a discussion about slaves and the conditions in which they lived. Your readers may be interested to know that during the Depression someone had the idea of sending people to the South to interview the last remaining blacks who had been slaves–all then in their 80s and 90s. Someone named George P. Rawick has compiled these narratives into a 19-volume collection called The American Slave: A Composite Autobiography, which is published by Greenwood Press.

Several books have been based on these interviews, and a few years ago I read one called Before Freedom: 48 Oral Histories of Former North and South Carolina Slaves. It was edited by Belinda Hurmence, and published by Mentor (Penguin) in 1990. I recall that of these 48 interviews only two could be called hostile to former masters, slavery, or whites. Some were more or less neutral, but certainly the largest number expressed a positive attitude toward former owners and to slavery. Here are some excerpts:

Patsy Mitchner, age 84 when interviewed on July 2, 1937:


"Before two years had passed after the surrender, there was two out of every three slaves who wished they was back with their marsters. The marsters' kindness to the ****** after the war is the cause of the ****** having things today. There was a lot of love between marster and slave, and there is few of us that don't love the white folks today. . . .
"Slavery was better for us than things is now, in some cases. Niggers then didn't have no responsibility; just work, obey, and eat."


Betty Cofer, age 81:


"The rest of the family was all fine folks and good to me, but I loved Miss Ella better'n anyone or anything else in the world. She was the best friend I ever had. If I ever wanted for anything, I just asked her and she give it to me or got it for me somehow. . . . I done lived to see three generations of my white folks come and go and they're the finest folks on earth."

Adeline Johnson, age 93:


"That was a happy time, with happy days. . . . I'll be satisfied to see my Savior that my old marster worshiped and my husband preach about. I wants to be in heaven with all my white folks, just to wait on them and love them, and serve them, sorta like I did in slavery time. That will be enough heaven for Adeline."

It's true that many slaves had an extremely good relationship with their masters. However, this doesn't mean that other owners didn't abuse their slaves, particularly the ones that owned plantations.

Yeah... I guess that's why numerous slave rebellions, um, never happened?

The problem with this is, it was completely up to the owners. They could be nice or not as they liked. It's not a system that could ever be part of modern civilized society.

Hey, plenty of First Nations have good things to say about being put into Residential Schools too...but many more remember the sexual and physical abuse, the destruction of language and culture and the terrible effects it had on our families. People having good things to say about slavery or residential schools happens because people become so used to a certain system, or that system is all they know, that when it is changed, it is painful. As well, when slavery was abolished, racism was not abolished with it, nor was a system set up to fully integrate freed slaves into society as equals (ex: good education, job training etc). I'm sure there were good masters, and there were many priests in the residential schools who didn't abuse the children...but that doesn't change the fact that slavery, and cultural destruction are wrong.

If there was affection by slaves towards their masters, it was never fully reciprocated. While a slave ownder might often express appreciation for a particularly hard-working or honest slave, it was never praise for an equal, but praise akin to that you would give a particularly sturdy table or a well-trained dog. Someone who was born into slavery and lived their entire lives in it would become as dependent on their master as our pets are on us. Why then is it surprising that they might express some fondness for their masters? It doesn't make slavery any less unjust, nor its abolition any less necessary.

Wow, a small sample of people from the same area. How completely scientific.

Yeah... I guess that's why numerous slave rebellions, um, never happened?
Numerous? How should I break it to you? No. There were very few, actually, compared to the working classes in other countries.

It's true that many slaves had an extremely good relationship with their masters. However, this doesn't mean that other owners didn't abuse their slaves, particularly the ones that owned plantations.

Many? From a convineince sample of 48 the majority said they had a good realtionship with their masters. There is no proof in said "data". So therefore it is impossible to know how many slaves liked their masters and how many didn't based solely on the above information.

Hey, plenty of First Nations have good things to say about being put into Residential Schools too...but many more remember the sexual and physical abuse, the destruction of language and culture and the terrible effects it had on our families. People having good things to say about slavery or residential schools happens because people become so used to a certain system, or that system is all they know, that when it is changed, it is painful. As well, when slavery was abolished, racism was not abolished with it, nor was a system set up to fully integrate freed slaves into society as equals (ex: good education, job training etc). I'm sure there were good masters, and there were many priests in the residential schools who didn't abuse the children...but that doesn't change the fact that slavery, and cultural destruction are wrong.
What are Residential Schools?

Many? From a convineince sample of 48 the majority said they had a good realtionship with their masters. There is no proof in said "data". So therefore it is impossible to know how many slaves liked their masters and how many didn't based solely on the above information.

The fact is that many masters did not abuse their slaves, but it was not out of kindness but out of a sense of economics. A damaged slave is worth less on the market and is less capable of labor, so each beating actually cost the ownder of the slave money, meaning that it was usually not in their best interests to do so. Therefore, it was best to keep abuse to the bare minimum needed to insure obedience, and threats were usually adequate for that.

The fact is that many masters did not abuse their slaves, but it was not out of kindness but out of a sense of economics. A damaged slave is worth less on the market and is less capable of labor, so each beating actually cost the ownder of the slave money, meaning that it was usually not in their best interests to do so. Therefore, it was best to keep abuse to the bare minimum needed to insure obedience, and threats were usually adequate for that.
I wasn't generalizing. I said based on the above stated data you can not make any inference. So I dunno why your quoting me of all people.

What are Residential Schools?

Residential schools were set up to "educate" First Nations people in Canada by both Anglican and Roman Catholic churches. The idea was that Natives were savages who had to learn English and forget their culture. There was a lot of sexual and physical abuse and some schools were only shut down a few years ago. Here's a good link to find out more: http://www.schoolnet.ca/aboriginal/issues/schools-e.html

Most workers, even those who have lost their jobs, love capitalism even though it denies them freedom. They simply haven't realized it yet. It's the same with slavery.

Residential schools were set up to "educate" First Nations people in Canada by both Anglican and Roman Catholic churches. The idea was that Natives were savages who had to learn English and forget their culture. There was a lot of sexual and physical abuse and some schools were only shut down a few years ago. Here's a good link to find out more: http://www.schoolnet.ca/aboriginal/issues/schools-e.html
Sorry I'm not keen on Canadian history.

stockholm syndrome anyone?

well, and the fact that conditions became objectively materially worse for many former slaves - especially after reconstruction was ended. setting people free but leaving them in a position of utter powerlessness and economic hardship does not and cannot work out well.

I wasn't generalizing. I said based on the above stated data you can not make any inference. So I dunno why your quoting me of all people.

Sorry, I was just trying to have some sort of basis for my comments, instead of just posting them without people being very clear as to what I was refering to.

Most likely they were born into it and that is all they knew.

Does not make it right.....

stockholm syndrome anyone?

well, and the fact that conditions became objectively materially worse for many former slaves - especially after reconstruction was ended. setting people free but leaving them in a position of utter powerlessness and economic hardship does not and cannot work out well.
Both of those are very good points.

Its worth noting here, as you can tell if you check his posting record, than VoteEarly is a revisionist neo-nazi, and so anything he says should be taken with a pinch of salt.