NationStates Jolt Archive

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/americas/08/15/venezuela.recall.ap/index.html

I agree Bush has done enough thing badly to be kicked out of office

And go against everything the constitution says? How about we just burn the constitution and take up a Dictatorship? Get real.

You people are out of your minds. Try reading Article II of the US Constitution. The main power of the president is to defend the country from all enemies foreign and domestic, among other powers. If he had not acted, then he should be impeached, he chose to act as required by the Constitution. Try some reading and government study before you post open-ended unbacked opinions.

Second, you messed up when you said you agree with Venezuela. If you want to like in a country like that, then move there.

Did you read the site!!!!

Did you read the site!!!!

Nope, I don't think they did. Which is why they think a recall is unconstitutional.

yeah, we probably wouldn't even have to forge the majority of the signatures needed

well at least we wont have to prove they're idiots

Second, you messed up when you said you agree with Venezuela. If you want to like in a country like that, then move there.

Just cause he agrees with something there doing doesn't mean he wants to live there.

It has long been established that pinko politics turn first world countries into third world hellholes. This, however, is the first instance I have come across of a pinko directly stating that this is what they want.

More typically, this road to squalor is mentioned only in well intentioned platitudes. Equality and similar foolishness.

You are showing your ignorance because recalling the president is not mentioned in the Constitution. You can only impeach a president. So get all the signitures you want, it will do no good. Plus, a president must commit "high crimes and misdemeanors." Removing Saddam Husein to protect the US does not fit in this category.

at least he read the thing this time

I read the article also and my reply was based on my impression after reading the article. Venezuela shouldn't ever be looked at to help re-make any of our governing laws. The Impeachment process works well enough, and I don't think anyone but the insane Democrats think he should be Impeached for his actions. Just because I don't agree with the Presidents decesions doesn't mean I can take him out of power. The USA elected the president for 4 years, they can't change their minds because they dont like his decisions. If you want to, try starting a revolt like Venezuela had a year ago. i doubt you will get very far. Stop trying to change a world power countires constitution based on a third world country.

The USA elected the president for 4 years, they can't change their minds because they dont like his decisions.

why the hell not?

Venezuela should neve be held up as some shining example of democratic behavior.

it was a CIA lead coup. Chavez was taken away in an American helicopter.
I cant prove what I say. But an Irish documentary who where there to see the unique way he ran his country replying to the poor peoples letters and such documented the coup.

The USA elected the president for 4 years, they can't change their minds because they dont like his decisions.


That's one of the sickest things I've ever heard.

Um guys... did I miss the whole Florida voting scandal getting fixed? Because if it didn't, then Bush never really was elected into office. I also find the tone of a lot of these posts extremely offensive... and arrogant...which is unfortunately the image that the United States has managed to project throughout the world. You toss around words like "Third World" as though the majority of people on this earth (Yeah, the Majority live in "Third World" countries) are nothing but garbage. Well, all empires fall, and I'm happily awaiting the fall of this one. Hopefully it is the reasonable, truly democratic members of your nation that shake off the disgusting racism, censorship, and callous disregard for the rest of the planet that seems to be embodied in your current (unelected) administration. If you think a recall is somehow working against democracy, you obviously do not understand that it is about the most democratic tool out there... the PEOPLE choosing to keep or remove a leader. (I'm not sure how your impeachment laws work...would it be a referendum like in Venezuala? Or would members of Congress do all the voting?)

Um guys... did I miss the whole Florida voting scandal getting fixed?
Yeah it did, by the Supreme Court.

Yeah it did, by the Supreme Court.

What did they say about it? Was it okay that so many people just never made it onto the voter rolls?

What did they say about it? Was it okay that so many people just never made it onto the voter rolls?
Oh, that wasn't brought up to the Supreme Court by Al Gore's team, but rather in a separate NAACP lawsuit, in which there was a settlement. There was no ruling either way. Makes you wonder why Al Gore - who tried just about every avenue to change the vote in his favor - wouldn't pick up this one that seems to be the smoking gun of liberals today. Probably because its not as solid as it seems.

Oh, that wasn't brought up to the Supreme Court by Al Gore's team, but rather in a separate NAACP lawsuit, in which there was a settlement. There was no ruling either way. Makes you wonder why Al Gore - who tried just about every avenue to change the vote in his favor - wouldn't pick up this one that seems to be the smoking gun of liberals today. Probably because its not as solid as it seems.

What do you think about it? Do you think there should have been a revote? Also...if enough people in your country wanted Bush out, why not have a referendum? (I mean, it's kind of moot now with an election coming up, but I mean earlier)

What do you think about it? Do you think there should have been a revote? Also...if enough people in your country wanted Bush out, why not have a referendum? (I mean, it's kind of moot now with an election coming up, but I mean earlier)
Well I don't think there should have been a revote, because by that time it had been established that both Nader (and to a smaller number of people, Buchanon) didn't get their 5%, so votes would have changed en masse away from smaller parties towards the two big ones. We can't have a referendum because its not in place in the US Constitution. If the President breached the law by say committing perjury, the US Congress could try to impeach him, but they can't impeach him just because they don't like him. Obviously in Venezuela its in their constitution so they can have a referendum. If the American public in most of the states felt that they needed the ability to recall the President, then the long task of getting a Constitutional Amendment would have to go underway...

Um guys... did I miss the whole Florida voting scandal getting fixed? Because if it didn't, then Bush never really was elected into office. I also find the tone of a lot of these posts extremely offensive... and arrogant...which is unfortunately the image that the United States has managed to project throughout the world. You toss around words like "Third World" as though the majority of people on this earth (Yeah, the Majority live in "Third World" countries) are nothing but garbage. Well, all empires fall, and I'm happily awaiting the fall of this one. Hopefully it is the reasonable, truly democratic members of your nation that shake off the disgusting racism, censorship, and callous disregard for the rest of the planet that seems to be embodied in your current (unelected) administration. If you think a recall is somehow working against democracy, you obviously do not understand that it is about the most democratic tool out there... the PEOPLE choosing to keep or remove a leader. (I'm not sure how your impeachment laws work...would it be a referendum like in Venezuala? Or would members of Congress do all the voting?)

YOU are an arrogant, condescenting, apparantly foreign idiot who thinks he can run the country better than our own Constitution. All recounts, including one conducted by the New York Times, an avid Bush opponent, claim that Bush won the election fair and square. I agree that these posts are offensive. They're offensive to every American service member who swore to defend the Constitution. You're basically saying that the Constitution is wrong for giving every elected President free reign, short of a crime, for four years. Well, what do you know? Do you have any idea what kind of civil unrest would happen in this country if we could just throw out the president every time he did something we didn't like. It would be mob rule and bordering on anarchy. As for the third world, many of them are doing fine, buy I don't see any third world countries that really serve as any kind of good example for America as far as the government structure goes. You insult our president, spit upon our constitution, claim that we have a skewed, racist view of the third world, and then call US offensive? It's laughable and insulting and something the French would do. As for the way we run our country, how would YOU do it, so high and mighty foriener who knows our politics so much better than we do? Tell us, oh mighty guru of national policy.

BTW, Congress and the courts handle impeachment.
I would rather die than see the actions of this country dictated by foreigners. This is our country, and if you want a say in what we do, you have to live here for five years, then take a test, got it?

Voting Scandel? The democrats wanted to keep counting votes/ invalidating republican votes until they won. In three states the democrats kept polls open in "democratic" areas hours after they were supposed to be closed, and a court order had to be issued to shut them down. Bush won every recount, and the Supreme Court decided the issue before it and that is it. Was there disinfranchisement concerning votes? They decided no. So all this stealing the vote, not elected crap is just that. Some of you people must not realize that we have an institution called the electorial college which protects every state. That is the law. If you are not smart enough to correctly fill out a ballot, you should not be voting anyway. All polling places offer help if you require it. Furthermore, you call us arrogant? You are the one getting involved in our politics when you obviously do not live here. Mind your own business. My suggestion to some of you is to stop listening to 5 minutes (if that) of ABC news. If you want to be informed, watch several channels, read the internet, and make your own informed opinion. Stop reciting the ridiculous democratic party line or stuff from Michael Moore's movie because you sound stupid, without the actual facts.

YOU are an arrogant, condescenting, apparantly foreign idiot who thinks he can run the country better than our own Constitution. All recounts, including one conducted by the New York Times, an avid Bush opponent, claim that Bush won the election fair and square. I agree that these posts are offensive. They're offensive to every American service member who swore to defend the Constitution. You're basically saying that the Constitution is wrong for giving every elected President free reign, short of a crime, for four years. Well, what do you know? Do you have any idea what kind of civil unrest would happen in this country if we could just throw out the president every time he did something we didn't like. It would be mob rule and bordering on anarchy. As for the third world, many of them are doing fine, buy I don't see any third world countries that really serve as any kind of good example for America as far as the government structure goes. You insult our president, spit upon our constitution, claim that we have a skewed, racist view of the third world, and then call US offensive? It's laughable and insulting and something the French would do. As for the way we run our country, how would YOU do it, so high and mighty foriener who knows our politics so much better than we do? Tell us, oh mighty guru of national policy.

BTW, Congress and the courts handle impeachment.
I would rather die than see the actions of this country dictated by foreigners. This is our country, and if you want a say in what we do, you have to live here for five years, then take a test, got it?


Thanks for reinforcing the global stereotype of a reactionist citizen of the United States....(by the way, I don't have a copy of your constitution to spit on...can you mail me one?) The point of my post was less about your constitution and more about your mean-spirited description of Venezuala (where I'm sure you've never been as you sound like someone who is decidedly insular). It's amusing that you find my opinion about US politics so offensive, based on the fact that I am "obviously" a foreigner...what do you say to your fellow citizens that are even more robustly vociferous in their disgust with the current administration? That they should be kicked out of the country for not agreeing with you? Please. You seem to think you are qualified to make any sort of offensive statements you want about another country (nice snipe at the French by the way....those stinky frog bastards didn't support you, poor boy), yet just about bust a vein getting angry at someone else saying anything about YOUR government that you don't like. Well. Too bad. In your country, freedom of speech is guaranteed in your constitution...but apparently to you that's only valid for flag-waving reactionaries IN the U.S.

Thank you Karreina, said perfectly.

How about we just burn the constitution and take up a Dictatorship?

Okay!



_________________
FASCISM FORWARD!

So where are you from anyway Mr. Anti-US Sinuhue?

According to your profile somewhere in South America. Wow, you guys are a model to live by. (sarcastic) Please explain why your citizens leave in droves to come to our country. Obviously they know a good thing when they see it.

YOU ARE AN A**HOLE and you probably know nothing about venezuela so he doesnt know your crappy constiution do YOU know anyone else!!!

I don't really care what any other country is doing right now. We have enough problems of our own to deal with and we're not doing very well at all.
This thread is a perfect example of why. This isn't a civilized discussion of opposing ideas. It's an ungracious, small, narrow minded bashing of anyone who doesn't share the individuals' opinions. Nearly everone posting on this thread is so in love with their own voice that they can't hear what anyone else has to say. Maybe it's time to start looking for the common ground...but maybe that's too much of a strain. It's much easier to just strike out at one another.

According to your profile somewhere in South America. Wow, you guys are a model to live by. (sarcastic) Please explain why your citizens leave in droves to come to our country. Obviously they know a good thing when they see it.
That's right. Judge someone by the nature of their country. Possibly a country that has suffered from a murderous regime propped up by US money and influence. Or one that has suffered from unjust economic and political sanctions delivered by, amongst others, the US.

Come on, stop being aggressive. It's lazy and ill becomes you.

Well I'm happy they're trying to get rid of Chavez; he led Venezuela to total disaster

Well I'm happy they're trying to get rid of Chavez; he led Venezuela to total disaster
I don't believe that's the case. At any rate, the alternatives to him are pretty ghastly. How many more elections does he have to win?

As mentioned earlier, the coup attempt last year was a disgrace, all the more so because the media disseminated outright lies and doctored images in order to give the impression that Chavez was sanctioning the sniping of protestors. The Irish documentary of the events is extraordinary and horrifying. Thankfully, Chavez's supporters ensured that the coup was short-lived.

Yes u saw it two do you know if it has a website cause I saw it about a year ago and forget the name of it
So where are you from anyway Mr. Anti-US Sinuhue?
If anti- your opinions is 'anti-american' then I think you'll find most of the world is 'anti-us'

Yes u saw it two do you know if it has a website cause I saw it about a year ago and forget the name of it

Sorry, I saw the documentary on BBC2 (UK) last year but I don't have a link at the moment. I'll have a look, it's worth finding.