NationStates Jolt Archive


The power of the truth

Endgate
13-08-2004, 01:40
Since coming to this forum, I have seen many people make a very big deal about how the United States unilaterally attacked Iraq. Humans rights violations, weapons of mass destruction, and dictators have clogged this General forum since I came here.

I want to know why the entire world is so focused on two nations. There is much more going on outside of Iraq, the United States, and western Europe.

My own nation is considered by many on these boards to be a threat to world peace. The man who leads my nation has been ridiculed as a dictator. He actively pursues and funds weapons of mass destruction. My homeland's allies have encouraged the proliferation of nuclear devices, even brokering poorly-concealed deals with middle eastern nations to transport nuclear missiles halfway around the world.

Human rights violations are widespread, though the government tries to put a good face on things. The government has taken and held prisoners in internment camps without benefit of trial or due process. Religious fanatics have waged a race-driven campaign of terrorism for more than half a century, and the government has done little to stop it. The terrorists have even been pardoned and released without punishment by a judicial system that looks the other way.

Why isn't anyone doing something about our rights? Why are our lives and our freedom less important than America, the UN, and Saddam Hussein?
Siljhouettes
13-08-2004, 01:45
I agree with you. Let me guess, do you live in Pakistan?

Recently I started a thread to highlight the atrocities of the Russian Army/Government in Chechnya, but people weren't very interested.

I often do get sick of hearing about Bush, Kerry, Iraq, liberals, Democrats, Republicans and neo-cons. But I suppose it's inevitable when something like 70% of the posters are American.
Opal Isle
13-08-2004, 01:45
...what country?
BastardSword
13-08-2004, 01:52
Since coming to this forum, I have seen many people make a very big deal about how the United States unilaterally attacked Iraq. Humans rights violations, weapons of mass destruction, and dictators have clogged this General forum since I came here.

I want to know why the entire world is so focused on two nations. There is much more going on outside of Iraq, the United States, and western Europe.

My own nation is considered by many on these boards to be a threat to world peace. The man who leads my nation has been ridiculed as a dictator. He actively pursues and funds weapons of mass destruction. My homeland's allies have encouraged the proliferation of nuclear devices, even brokering poorly-concealed deals with middle eastern nations to transport nuclear missiles halfway around the world.

Human rights violations are widespread, though the government tries to put a good face on things. The government has taken and held prisoners in internment camps without benefit of trial or due process. Religious fanatics have waged a race-driven campaign of terrorism for more than half a century, and the government has done little to stop it. The terrorists have even been pardoned and released without punishment by a judicial system that looks the other way.

Why isn't anyone doing something about our rights? Why are our lives and our freedom less important than America, the UN, and Saddam Hussein?

You live in America don't you?
Bush has been ridiculed to be a dictator...
He actively pursues and funds WMDs.
Bush is seen as a threat to World Peace...
The government has taken and held prisoners in internment camps without benefit of trial or due process.
Religious fanatics have waged a race-driven campaign of terrorism for more than half a century, and the government has done little to stop it.

The parallels are scary!
Endgate
13-08-2004, 01:52
I agree with you. Let me guess, do you live in Pakistan?

Recently I started a thread to highlight the atrocities of the Russian Army/Government in Chechnya, but people weren't very interested.


Things have been bad in Pakistan for a long time. The cold war between America and the Soviets did little more than grind the region between two giants. I'm not old enough to remember the Cold War first hand, but my father has told me many tragic stories about what happened.
Endgate
13-08-2004, 02:54
So, it is true. The world only cares about America and the West.
Chess Squares
13-08-2004, 03:18
So, it is true. The world only cares about America and the West.
bingo, if its not america, no one cares, especially not america
Siljhouettes
16-08-2004, 02:28
Things have been bad in Pakistan for a long time.
So, do you live there?
Zeppistan
16-08-2004, 02:40
The problem is... despite supporting (and recogniing) the Taliban and Al qaeda, despite handing out nuclear technology like party favours, despite it's human rights issues, Pakistan is now a "Valued Ally on the War on Terror".

Which is to say, that you are the local buddy of US foreign policy just like the Shah of Iran was and Just as Hussein was. That means that as far as official Washington is concerned, the sun shines out of Musharraf's ass and nobody notices anything.

However, that is simply the position of Official Washington. Many of us here HAVE ridiculed this policy as we feel that Pakistan should be more of a target than an ally in the war against international terrorism, and that it should be being pressured into political changes. Clearly there have been some outward changes as it has started to do more to help arrest members of al qaeda. But the fact that they pardoned the man handing out nuclear technology and this went unchallenged, and the fact that more pressure has not been brought to help eliminate Pakistan's support for Islamic extremist groups has not been forthcoming.

It would be nice if I could hope that this would happen, however I am not terribly hopeful right now.
Purly Euclid
16-08-2004, 02:40
I do sympathize with you. Pakistan has been a US ally, but at the same time, it's been a kingpin of nuclear proliferation. However, I think Musharraf is one of the better dictators. Mussharaf is a little more liberal than many dictators. He's also democratizing. That may sound strange to you, but the CIA now thinks that a civil war in Pakistan is likely between pro democracy forces (which Musharraf is helping to create, even if unintended), and the military, that doesn't want change.
It's in a difficult position right now. Despite my praise for Mussharaf, he's no F.W. de Klerk. What I'd hope for the most if I lived in that country is not for some military force to liberate me. There's a global wave of liberalism going around, and I think it should reach Pakistan, sooner or later. It's slowly recieving a free market, and it's too populous of a country for Pakistan NOT to.
*Edit* I know this sounds harsh, but if Pakistan weren't our supporters, al-Qaeda may have a safe haven, and perhaps more 9/11s would happen. I agree we should pressure Musharraf more, but I'm afraid that the US can't do much more without endangering Americans.
Niccolo Medici
16-08-2004, 10:11
I guess this brings up the old subject, just how much does the US WANT to intervene to help its neighbors allieviate their suffering? How much trouble is the US willing to get into to fix all that's wrong with the world? Just how naive is the US? Do they believe that the could, in fact, go about righting wrongs and doing justice, and promoting democracy...actively?

Everyone wants the dictators out...or do they?
Everyone wants human rights to be recognized throughout the world...right?
How easy is it to "set up" a democracy?
Is a democracy always better than a dictator?
Is a theocracy always backward? Or is it only when its a non-christian theocracy?
Is the US morally obligated to use its power to assist Pakistan?

What about the Dafur region in Sudan? The Sudanese government says it will use military force on any "crusader" army that tries to stop their militas who are commiting genocide. What to do there? Do we invade, stop the killing, and overthrow the government that encouraged it? If not, then what?
Endgate
19-08-2004, 01:26
Bump... no one's yet given a satisfactory answer.