NationStates Jolt Archive

so the republican national convention is coming up... is everybody going to be joining the absolutely massive protests against this band of mad imperialist corporate goons?

http://www.rncnotwelcome.org/

http://www.infoshop.org/graphics/webvotebush84.jpg

so the republican national convention is coming up... is everybody going to be joining the absolutely massive protests against this band of mad imperialist corporate goons?

http://www.rncnotwelcome.org/

http://www.infoshop.org/graphics/webvotebush84.jpg

Why? It's not like anybody will see the protests... I understand that the official 'protest zone' is in an unlit bathroom on the fifth floor of a walk-up in the Bronx. ;)

so the republican national convention is coming up... is everybody going to be joining the absolutely massive protests against this band of mad imperialist corporate goons?

http://www.rncnotwelcome.org/

http://www.infoshop.org/graphics/webvotebush84.jpg
and here is most likely a democratic clone of the protest warriors

The protest issue is a bit worrisome for Republicans. If such massive turnouts do occur, it's a win for the Democrats, even if some of the organizers don't want Kery to win.

and here is most likely a democratic clone of the protest warriors
God forbid if the radical cheerleaders show up again...

Where does a man get an outfit like that!

Hey, I think it will be just fine if you guys protest. I for one will be watching the RNC intently. Its not like there are going to be no protesters. Anarchists show up at every political convention. Those guys have nothing better to do than complain about the government. They were at the DNC as well. Now that I have digressed into a riff about the anarchists, I will get back on topic. Protests are a good thing, not a bad thing. Protesting is exactly going to stop the RNC, and it won't do anything to Bush's poll numbers either. Protesting is just showing your right to do so these days. Maybe if you guys could get one message you would have more of an impact. I see a poster saying "legalize marijuana" amid the crowd of anti-Bush banners in every protest I have seen. It doesn't give a good clear message. But hey, you guys have fun out there. If I was still doing my Confessions of a Member of the Vast Right-Wing Conspiracy thread, I would certainly give the guy who started this thread a mention. Whew, can you say wacko?

Anarchists show up at every political convention. Those guys have nothing better to do than complain about the government.

well, other than all the other shit we do.

God forbid if the radical cheerleaders show up again...

heh, too late.

CALL TO ACTION For Radical Cheerleaders WORLDWIDE!
2004-08-04
Confirmations already received from Buffalo Radicatz, Chicago, Florida, Syracuse
CALL TO ACTION:

Radical Cheerleaders, Anti-Authoritarians, and all others who are bothered by the state of our supposed democracy:
Join us on Sunday August 29th in New York City to tell President Bush to protest the RNC.

What: We are calling for a large red and black presence of radical activists to participate in a mobile cheer bloc as part of the larger United for Peace and Justice March. Like for the March for Women’s Lives, we want everyone to learn the cheers before they come to the march so we can have a huge, unified voice. Bring noise-makers, uniforms, pom-poms and whatever else you may want. Please send in all your cheers to info@nycradicalcheerleaders.org for us to post them on the website. We will be posting cheers in lyrical, audio, and/or video form if you send it to us that way. We will be having a cheerleader feeder march to the UFPJ march with location and TBA.

Why: As President Bush and the Republican Party come to New York for the Convention we will tell them that we have had enough. The issues that have inspired us to make this call include:

1) Iraq: The US government is systemically recruiting urban, low-income, people of color to go overseas to kill other low-income people of color. We will not tolerate the bloodshed of innocent Iraqis or of misled American GIs. We call for the immediate withdrawal of American troops from the sovereign state of Iraq and for the world to respect the autonomy of the people in the region. We demand that the money that is being spent to kill, be spent on things that will save lives. This includes ending homelessness and feeding the hungry, fighting the AIDS epidemic abroad, creating jobs, and protecting the Earth and our non-human animal friends from destruction so that we all may live for generations to come.
2) 9/11: The Bush administration is using the fear created by the horrific attacks on September 11th, to rally blind patriotism and support for unjustified war.
3) Human rights and dignity for all:
a. LGBT Rights: The right to express your love for another through marriage if you choose to do so. In addition, the right not to be defined by the societal constraints of gender or sexuality.
b. Women’s Rights: The right to do with one’s body as one pleases and not to have government intervention in the womb. Also, we demand equal pay for equal work.
c. Rights for People of Color: Here at home we recognize continued racism through our targeted military recruiting, our racist criminal justice, and the attacks on the affirmative action system. At home and abroad, we see our government aiding in the systematic destruction of indigenous autonomous cultures for financial gains.

For all these reasons, we feel the need to stand up. We believe that radical cheerleaders are unique in our ability to convey a message, because we do not accept that just voting will make a difference in this world. It is our duty to let the Bush Administration know that we are fed up and we won’t stop until our demands are met. Join us on September 29th as we take the streets and rise up!

If you wish to endorse our call to action, to send us cheers, or for any information, please e-mail us at info@nycradicalcheerleaders.org


Solidarity,

The New York City Radical Cheerleaders
www.nycradicalcheerleaders.org

I'm going to be watching with eager eyes to count how many times Bush misprounces "nuclear."

Jesus, why can't the GOP just have its damn convention in Washington D.C.

I don't look forward to the OMG UBERSECURITY!!!! traffic jams, and oh yes, TARGET FOR TERRORISM this little elite party puts on my city.

POLITICIANS GO HOME!!!

I'm going to be watching with eager eyes to count how many times Bush misprounces "nuclear."
Probably less than the number of times John Kerry tries to act like an average guy and war hero and fails miserably.

I'm going to be watching with eager eyes to count how many times Bush misprounces "nuclear."

Don't misunderestimate him, he might say it right. ;)

so the republican national convention is coming up... is everybody going to be joining the absolutely massive protests against this band of mad imperialist corporate goons?

http://www.rncnotwelcome.org/

http://www.infoshop.org/graphics/webvotebush84.jpg


you wouldn't be a free soviet if it wasn't for the RNC. you wouldn't be having the economic problems you have if it wasn't for the DNC.

The DNC always has more protester because some of the protesters actually think the polticians inside of the building give a damn about thier cause.

Ah so people who protest the DNC are just right-wing wackos who don't deserve to have their voice heard, and people who protest the RNC are political activists and good people :rolleyes: nice spin on things.

Personally I say, let the protestors come their message(s) don't have much ground to gain on and eh well noone but the people supporting the protestors cares.

heh, too late.
Wait...they are going to tell Bush to protest the RNC.

Anyone else see something wrong with that?

you wouldn't be a free soviet if it wasn't for the RNC. you wouldn't be having the economic problems you have if it wasn't for the DNC.

¿que? what does the fact that my nationstates nation is based around a federation of free councils have to do with anything?

i hope these protestors you are speaking of dont hurt my dad ( an nyc cop) like the anti-war protestors did. How ironic that the anti-war protestors got so violant. I guess the ones at the republican convention will be just as hypocritical and agitated. I just hope my dad makes it out ok.

you wouldn't be a free soviet if it wasn't for the RNC. you wouldn't be having the economic problems you have if it wasn't for the DNC.
Ah, the good ol' "Reagan defeated the 0mfgz c0mm13z" and "Clinton caused the 2001 crash" lies...

even gorbachev's own aids admit it was reagan's policies that led to the demise of the soviet union. and the recession started in january of 2001. we were still under mr. clinton's policies and budgets until 6 months later. so if anyone is blamed for the recession, it should be mr. clinton's policies and leadership.

You don't think Reagan had anything to do with the Soviet Crash? And if Clinton gets all the acclamation for a good economy during his time, doesn't he also take the blame for the stock market faltering in Spring of 2001?

I guess the ones at the republican convention will be just as hypocritical and agitated. I just hope my dad makes it out ok.

ain't no hypocrisy in defending yourself from being attacked by cops who have spent months/years being indoctrinated to fear and hate you.

It's funny, I don't think I heard any violence coming from the DNC Protestors? But it will be the same protestors who egged the President's Limo, and the Anti-War Protestors who beat up a Pro-Life Protestor, that shows up at the RNC, so why shouldn't the police fear them if there's an obvious pattern of violence?

You don't think Reagan had anything to do with the Soviet Crash? And if Clinton gets all the acclamation for a good economy during his time, doesn't he also take the blame for the stock market faltering in Spring of 2001?
I don't give him any.

even gorbachev's own aids admit it was reagan's policies that led to the demise of the soviet union. and the recession started in january of 2001. we were still under mr. clinton's policies and budgets until 6 months later. so if anyone is blamed for the recession, it should be mr. clinton's policies and leadership.
See above, and no, it was the reforms that killed the USSR, at least directly, and saying that Reagan destroyed the USSR is like saying that Truman won WWII.

ain't no hypocrisy in defending yourself from being attacked by cops who have spent months/years being indoctrinated to fear and hate you.
I know my dad well and i know the nyc police well as i have constantly been around them since i was born. My dad has been in nypd since 1987 and most of his associates even longer. they are regular guys. they dont hate the protestors as you would like to think. they just want to keep order on their shift and go home to their families and own homes. they havent been indoctrinated. they dont hate you. you might want or expect them to but they dont. and they are trained never to start a fight. so it sounds to be you have had left wing propaganda told to you about the nyc police. Believe me , i know them, and they are not the right wing "pigs" people on the far left make them out to be. they are regular people doing a hard job and trying to keep the peace and safety of the city. please do not make statements like the one you made until you know them as well as I. what a shame.

Protestors generally annoy me but we have to give them the right to do what they want, unfortunately I wouldn't be surprised if violence does occur. There's no point in blaming either Bush or Clinton for the recession, it was neither of their faults, though I do believe that had Gore won in 2000 we would be in worse shape (we would see a tax hike). Lastly; yes, Reagan's policies did have a large role in defeating communism in the USSR. He was just following JFK's lead.

See above, and no, it was the reforms that killed the USSR, at least directly, and saying that Reagan destroyed the USSR is like saying that Truman won WWII.

dont draw a false analogy and i would tend to believe the soviets themselves rather then theoritical hindsight speculation.

dont draw a false analogy and i would tend to believe the soviets themselves rather then theoritical hindsight speculation.
It isn't a false analogy, it is a very valid one, and it isn't 'theoritical' hindsight, it is rather well established fact. Besides, there are other soviets saying that the collapse was hastened by Reagan's moves by two weeks at most.

comparing the slow and gradual collapse of soviet russia in the 1980's is an extremelty false analogy to the dropping of atomic bombs in japan. the anology is warped and false.

I wonder if the protestors at the RNC will be prohibitted from bringing hard fruits (such as apples, peaches, and pineapples) as people were at the DNC? I wonder if protesters will be forced to stand in a "cage"? I wonder if CNN and MSNBC will devote as much coverage to the RNC as they did to the DNC? I wonder if the RNC will contain as much ridiculous pagentry (the whole swift boat arrival thing was an embarrasment to all involved) as the DNC did? I wonder if the entire subway system will be shutdown during the RNC as it was during the DNC? I wonder why the party of the people seem so much more likely to shout out "Sieg heil" than the party of the imperialist rat bastards?

comparing the slow and gradual collapse of soviet russia in the 1980's is an extremelty false analogy to the dropping of atomic bombs in japan. the anology is warped and false.
I'm sorry, did you just say slow and gradual? As in more then one presidential administration?

I wonder if the protestors at the RNC will be prohibitted from bringing hard fruits (such as apples, peaches, and pineapples) as people were at the DNC? I wonder if protesters will be forced to stand in a "cage"? I wonder if CNN and MSNBC will devote as much coverage to the RNC as they did to the DNC? I wonder if the RNC will contain as much ridiculous pagentry (the whole swift boat arrival thing was an embarrasment to all involved) as the DNC did? I wonder if the entire subway system will be shutdown during the RNC as it was during the DNC? I wonder why the party of the people seem so much more likely to shout out "Sieg heil" than the party of the imperialist rat bastards?

who knows but.......
who shouted "sieg heil"?
can you name one imperialist action of the united states in the last 100 years?
i'm going to reserve my reaction to the rat bastards comment.

I'm sorry, did you just say slow and gradual? As in more then one presidential administration?

no as in 1982-1991

death of brezhnev to the failed coup of 91

also, lets get back on topic as we can't possibly end up agreeing with each other. the protests, the convention, i am more interested in that as it will be effecting me personaly in coming weeks.

who shouted "sieg heil"?
can you name one imperialist action of the united states in the last 100 years?
i'm going to reserve my reaction to the rat bastards comment.

Ever hear of the wars down in Central America? Cuba?

no as in 1982-1991

death of brezhnev to the failed coup of 91

also, lets get back on topic as we can't possibly end up agreeing with each other. the protests, the convention, i am more interested in that as it will be effecting me personaly in coming weeks.
The USSR was declining long before '82...

imperialism:The policy, practice, or advocacy of seeking, or acquiescing in, the extension of the control, dominion, or empire of a nation, as by the acquirement of new, esp. distant, territory or dependencies, or by the closer union of parts more or less independent of each other for operations of war, copyright, internal commerce, etc.

now doesnt the south american war thing sound a little rediculous and we recieved control of cuba in 1898 and gave them freedom in 1902 ( thats not in my 100 year range.) so you have one example that does not fit the definition and one example that is too far removed from current events to even matter. so.......who shouted seig heil?

imperialism:The policy, practice, or advocacy of seeking, or acquiescing in, the extension of the control, dominion, or empire of a nation, as by the acquirement of new, esp. distant, territory or dependencies, or by the closer union of parts more or less independent of each other for operations of war, copyright, internal commerce, etc.

now doesnt the south american war thing sound a little rediculous and we recieved control of cuba in 1898 and gave them freedom in 1902 ( thats not in my 100 year range.) so you have one example that does not fit the definition and one example that is too far removed from current events to even matter. so.......who shouted seig heil?
Yes...freedom. Sure.

You are aware of the Philippians, Hawaii, Guam, Midway, etc?

philipeans:attained in 1898 ( since set free) never exploited
hawaii:attained in 1897 ( since made into a state)
guam : 1898 never exploited
midway: tactic battle area with no natives to care

pretty weak imperialism if it can even be considered. again i said 100 years ago. what on earth does that have to do with now?
also who yelled "seig heil"?

all well i think the person who said that bull is gone now.Hajekistan . cant answer simple questions. relys on csw to answer instead. makes outragous unsubstantiated claims. all well. at east csw has a brain of facts.

I know my dad well and i know the nyc police well as i have constantly been around them since i was born. My dad has been in nypd since 1987 and most of his associates even longer. they are regular guys. they dont hate the protestors as you would like to think. they just want to keep order on their shift and go home to their families and own homes. they havent been indoctrinated. they dont hate you. you might want or expect them to but they dont. and they are trained never to start a fight. so it sounds to be you have had left wing propaganda told to you about the nyc police. Believe me , i know them, and they are not the right wing "pigs" people on the far left make them out to be. they are regular people doing a hard job and trying to keep the peace and safety of the city. please do not make statements like the one you made until you know them as well as I. what a shame.

we have copies of their training videos and the public statements that their bosses put out, and they clearly show a pattern of demonization and indoctrination against people such as myself. those facts don't change no matter how many cops you know. and then there is the little fact of the huge number of cop riots throughout history - hell, the cops almost universally throw the first punch in protest situations. are you unaware of the various investigations into police misconduct during the ftaa protests started because of complaints from the unions and amnesty international. the cops attacked people at the seattle wto protest hours before the black bloc even showed up. we win lawsuits against the police department in every city where we have a major global justice protest, because without fail they will be ordered to violate their own written proceedures - not to mention significant sections of the constitution - and will gladly do it in their enthusiasm to get at us.

the policy of using the police against progressives and radicals by training them to fear and hate them has a history stretching back as far as the history of police goes. it is part of what being a cop is about and always has been. the same shit happened in the labor movement of one hundred and twenty years ago as happens today. they've barely even updated the demonized stereotypes they use against us.

philipeans:attained in 1898 ( since set free) never exploited

well that conviniently ignores the bloody suppression of filipino independence movements...

1893 – Hawaii (Liliuokalani; monarchist): success (OF)

1912 – China (Piyu; monarchist): success (OF)

1918 – Panama (Arias; center-right): success (SE)

1919 – Hungary (Kun; communist): success (CO)

1920 – USSR (Lenin; communist): failure (OF)

1924 – Honduras (Carias; nationalist): success (SE)

1934 – United States (Roosevelt; liberal): failure (CO)

1945 – Japan (Higashikuni; rightist): success (OF)

1946 – Thailand (Pridi; conservative): success (CO)

1946 – Argentina (Peron; military/centrist): failure (SE)

1947 – France (*; communist): success (SE)

1947 – Philippines (*; center-left): success (SE)

1947 – Romania (Gheorghiu-Dej; stalinist): failure (CO)

1948 – Italy (*, communist): success (SE)

1948 – Colombia (Gaitan; populist/leftist): success (SE)

1948 – Peru (Bustamante; left/centrist): success (CO)

1949 – Syria (Kuwatli; neutralist/Pan-Arabist): success (CO)

1949 – China (Mao; communist): failure (CO)

1950 – Albania (Hoxha; communist): failure (CO)

1951 – Bolivia (Paz; center/neutralist): success (CO)

1951 – DPRK (Kim; stalinist): failure (OF)

1951 – Poland (Cyrankiewicz; stalinist): failure (CO)

1951 – Thailand (Phibun; conservative): success (CO)

1952 – Egypt (Farouk; monarchist): success (CO)

1952 – Cuba (Prio; reform/populist): success (CO)

1952 – Lebanon (*; left/populist): success: (SE)

1953 – British Guyana (*; left/populist): success (CO)

1953 – Iran (Mossadegh; liberal nationalist): success (CO)

1953 – Costa Rica (Figueres; reform liberal): failure (CO)

1953 – Philippines (*; center-left): success (SE)

1954 – Guatemala (Arbenz; liberal nationalist): success (OF)

1955 – Costa Rica (Figueres; reform liberal): failure (CO)

1955 – India (Nehru; neutralist/socialist): failure (CO)

1955 – Argentina (Peron; military/centrist): success (CO)

1955 – China (Zhou; communist): failure (CO)

1955 – Vietnam (Ho; communist): success (SE)

1956 – Hungary (Hegedus; communist): success (CO)

1957 – Egypt (Nasser; military/nationalist): failure (CO)

1957 – Haiti (Sylvain; left/populist): success (CO)

1957 – Syria (Kuwatli; neutralist/Pan-Arabist): failure (CO)

1958 – Japan (*; left-center): success (SE)

1958 – Chile (*; leftists): success (SE)

1958 – Iraq (Feisal; monarchist): success (CO)

1958 – Laos (Phouma; nationalist): success (CO)

1958 – Sudan (Sovereignty Council; nationalist): success (CO)

1958 – Lebanon (*; leftist): success (SE)

1958 – Syria (Kuwatli; neutralist/Pan-Arabist): failure (CO)

1958 – Indonesia (Sukarno; militarist/neutralist): failure (SE)

1959 – Laos (Phouma; nationalist): success (CO)

1959 – Nepal (*; left-centrist): success (SE)

1959 – Cambodia (Sihanouk; moderate/neutralist): failure (CO)

1960 – Ecuador (Ponce; left/populist): success (CO)

1960 – Laos (Phouma; nationalist): success (CO)

1960 – Iraq (Qassem; rightist /militarist): failure (CO)

1960 – S. Korea (Syngman; rightist): success (CO)

1960 – Turkey (Menderes; liberal): success (CO)

1961 – Haiti (Duvalier; rightist/militarist): success (CO)

1961 – Cuba (Castro; communist): failure (CO)

1961 – Congo (Lumumba; leftist/pan-Africanist): success (CO)

1961 – Dominican Republic (Trujillo; rightwing/military): success (CO)

1962 – Brazil (Goulart; liberal/neutralist): failure (SE)

1962 – Dominican Republic (*; left/populist): success (SE)

1962 – Indonesia (Sukarno; militarist/neutralist): failure (CO)

1963 – Dominican Republic (Bosch; social democrat): success (CO)

1963 – Honduras (Montes; left/populist): success (CO)

1963 – Iraq (Qassem; militarist/rightist): success (CO)

1963 – S. Vietnam (Diem; rightist): success (CO)

1963 – Cambodia (Sihanouk; moderate/neutralist): failure (CO)

1963 – Guatemala (Ygidoras; rightist/reform): success (CO)

1963 – Ecuador (Velasco; reform militarist): success (CO)

1963 – United States (Kennedy; liberal): success (CO)

1964 – Guyana (Jagan; populist/reformist): success (CO)

1964 – Bolivia (Paz; centrist/neutralist): success (CO)

1964 – Brazil (Goulart; liberal/neutralist): success (CO)

1964 – Chile (Allende; social democrat/marxist): success (SE)

1965 – Indonesia (Sukarno; militarist/neutralist): success (CO)

1966 – Ghana (Nkrumah; leftist/pan-Africanist): success (CO)

1966 – Bolivia (*; leftist): success (SE)

1966 – France (de Gaulle; centrist): failure (CO)

1967 – Greece (Papandreou; social democrat): success (CO)

1968 – Iraq (Arif; rightist): success (CO)

1969 – Panama (Torrijos; military/reform populist): failure (CO)

1969 – Libya (Idris; monarchist): success (CO)

1970 – Bolivia (Ovando; reform nationalist): success (CO)

1970 – Cambodia (Sihanouk; moderate/neutralist): success (CO)

1970 – Chile (Allende; social democrat/Marxist): failure (SE)

1971 – Bolivia (Torres; nationalist/neutralist): success (CO)

1971 – Costa Rica (Figueres; reform liberal): failure (CO)

1971 – Liberia (Tubman; rightist): success (CO)

1971 – Turkey (Demirel; center-right): success (CO)

1971 – Uruguay (Frente Amplio; leftist): success (SE)

1972 – El Salvador (*; leftist): success (SE)

1972 – Australia (Whitlam; liberal/labor): failure (SE)

1973 – Chile (Allende; social democrat/Marxist): success (CO)

1974 – United States (Nixon; centrist): success (CO)

1975 – Australia (Whitlam; liberal/labor): success (CO)

1975 – Congo (Mobutu; military/rightist): failure (CO)

1975 – Bangladesh (Mujib; nationalist): success (CO)

1976 – Jamaica (Manley; social democrat): failure (SE)

1976 – Portugal (JNS; military/leftist): success (SE)

1976 – Nigeria (Mohammed; military/nationalist): success (CO)

1976 – Thailand (*; rightist): success (CO)

1976 – Uruguay (Bordaberry; center-right): success (CO)

1977 – Pakistan (Bhutto: center/nationalist): success (CO)

1978 – Dominican Republic (Balaguer; center): success (SE)

1979 – S. Korea (Park; rightist): success (CO)

1979 – Nicaragua (Sandinistas; leftist): failure (CO)

1980 – Bolivia (Siles; centrist/reform): success (CO)

1980 – Iran (Khomeini; Islamic nationalist): failure (CO)

1980 – Italy (*; leftist): success (SE)

1980 – Liberia (Tolbert; rightist): success (CO)

1980 – Jamaica (Manley; social democrat): success (SE)

1980 – Dominica (Seraphin; leftist): success (SE)

1980 – Turkey (Demirel; center-right): success (CO)

1981 – Seychelles (René; socialist): failure (CO)

1981 – Spain (Suarez; rightist/neutralist): failure (CO)

1981 – Panama (Torrijos; military/reform populist); success (CO)

1981 – Zambia (Kaunda; reform nationalist): failure (CO)

1982 – Mauritius (*; center-left): failure (SE)

1982 – Spain (Suarez; rightist/neutralist): success (SE)

1982 – Iran (Khomeini; Islamic nationalist): failure (CO)

1982 – Chad (Oueddei; Islamic nationalist): success (CO)

1983 – Mozambique (Machel; socialist): failure (CO)

1983 – Grenada (Bishop; socialist): success (OF)

1984 – Panama (*; reform/centrist): success (SE)

1984 – Nicaragua (Sandinistas; leftist): failure (SE)

1984 – Surinam (Bouterse; left/reformist/neutralist): success (CO)

1984 – India (Gandhi; nationalist): success (CO)

1986 – Libya (Qaddafi; Islamic nationalist): failure (OF)

1987 – Fiji (Bavrada; liberal): success (CO)

1989 – Panama (Noriega; military/reform populist): success (OF)

1990 – Haiti (Aristide; liberal reform): failure (SE)

1990 – Nicaragua (Ortega; Christian socialist): success (SE)

1991 – Albania (Alia; communist): success (SE)

1991 – Haiti (Aristide; liberal reform): success (CO)

1991 – Iraq (Hussein; military/rightist): failure (OF)

1991 – Bulgaria (BSP; communist): success (SE)

1992 – Afghanistan (Najibullah; communist): success (CO)

1993 – Somalia (Aidid; right/militarist): failure (OF)

1993 – Cambodia (Han Sen/CPP; leftist): failure (SE)

1993 – Burundi (Ndadaye; conservative): success (CO)

1994 – El Salvador (*; leftist): success (SE)

1994 – Rwanda (Habyarimana; conservative): success (CO)

1994 – Ukraine (Kravchuk; center-left): success (SE)

1996 – Bosnia (Karadzic; centrist): success (CO)

1996 – Russia (Zyuganov; communist): success (SE)

1996 – Congo (Mobutu; military/rightist): success (CO)

1996 – Mongolia (*; center-left): success (SE)

1998 – Congo (Kabila; rightist/military): success (CO)

1998 – United States (Clinton; conservative): failure (CO)

1998 – Indonesia (Suharto; military/rightist): success (CO)

1999 – Yugoslavia (Milosevic; left/nationalist): success (SE)

2000 – United States (Gore; conservative): success (SE)

2000 – Ecuador (NSC; leftist): success: (CO)

2001 – Afghanistan (Omar; rightist/Islamist): success (OF)

2001 – Belarus (Lukashenko; leftist): failure (SE)

2001 – Nicaragua (Ortega; Christian socialist): success (SE)

2001 – Nepal (Birendra; nationalist/monarchist): success (CO)

2002 – Venezuela (Chavez; reform-populist): failure (CO)

2002 – Bolivia (Morales; leftist/MAS): success (SE)

2002 – Brazil (Lula; center-left): failure (SE)

There is a nice list of interventions

In an off-topic thingie: I was watching the daily show and John Stewart/Ed Helms (I think) were talking about the RNC. Helms was in NYC at strip clubs and the clubs were saying that reservations had gone up with the arrival of the RNC. After all the Republican talk about values, it makes you wonder. :rolleyes:

anyway, that's all.

All quotes are from Undecidedterritory

who shouted "sieg heil"?
It's the nazi victory salute.

can you name one imperialist action of the united states in the last 100 years?
i'm going to reserve my reaction to the rat bastards comment.
Imperialist was just an adjective I have seen used for republicans and nazis, the reference to the party of the "imperialist rat bastards" was an attempt at satire and humorous exageration (what is the word for it, its on the tip of my finger). I apparently failed in that regard as i am now having to explain it.

imperialism:The policy, practice, or advocacy of seeking, or acquiescing in, the extension of the control, dominion, or empire of a nation, as by the acquirement of new, esp. distant, territory or dependencies, or by the closer union of parts more or less independent of each other for operations of war, copyright, internal commerce, etc.
Once again, imperialist was a bad word for it and elitist would have fit better.

all well i think the person who said that bull is gone now.Hajekistan . cant answer simple questions. relys on csw to answer instead. makes outragous unsubstantiated claims. all well. at east csw has a brain of facts.
I am sorry, Oh Greatest of Lords Undecidedterritory that I took all of a whole 30-45 minutes to reply to you. That was obviously my greatest of sins, even beyond the sin of asking questions. From now on I shall follow you always, that I may devour the inrapturing pearls of wisdom that deign descend from your celestial lips upon us dull, mundane mortals below, or (in csw's case) to the "east." I only hope that one day, I too may be granted the highest and most great of all honors in the universe, to be said that I have "a brain of facts".
If I may make the slightest of request of your illustrious and wise self. Would you take pity upon my plight and not treat punctuation like a game of pin the tail on the donkey! Please Lord, Please I beg of you! Think of the poor periods, held to the whims of your most holy keyboard.

There is a nice list of interventions
Seems like a pretty questionable list to me, seeing as how both Gore and Clinton are listed as having failed interventions against them. What does it count as intervention? It seems like every government we've ever said we don't like or have taken any sort of action, no matter how small or unimportant, it counts as an intervention.

Seems like a pretty questionable list to me, seeing as how both Gore and Clinton are listed as having failed interventions against them. What does it count as intervention? It seems like every government we've ever said we don't like or have taken any sort of action, no matter how small or unimportant, it counts as an intervention.
Of course it is, its just a rough list that I pulled out to prove a point. We are imperialists.

1893 – Hawaii (Liliuokalani; monarchist): success (OF)

1912 – China (Piyu; monarchist): success (OF)

1918 – Panama (Arias; center-right): success (SE)

<Long list>

<More list>

<Even more list>

<The list is almost over>

2002 – Venezuela (Chavez; reform-populist): failure (CO)

2002 – Bolivia (Morales; leftist/MAS): success (SE)

2002 – Brazil (Lula; center-left): failure (SE)
All that because I made a flippant comment about the repubican party. Not the interventions of course (I'm sure that most of them had almost nothing to do with me), but the big fugging list.

I'll have to say it again:

Wow

that

is

a

long

list.

:eek:

salon has an interesting article on the whole situation. take a look:
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2004/08/11/rnc_protest/index.html

http://www.rncnotwelcome.org/downloads/webshallnot.jpg

From a flyer reproduced on rncnotwelcome's website:

"The Freakshow Party

After the film, party with:
Leftover Crack
DJ Powwow from Blakkat
Meneguar
DJ Noskilz
DJ Chrome
Beatbox Ent.
And much, much more"

Well, we can see where their true priorities lay. Not in political issues, but in partying. Children of hippies who long for a return to the "good old days", were never disciplined as children, and are just looking for an excuse to cause trouble. My advice: put down the bong and the crackpipe, pick up your books, get to studying, and stop wasting your parents' money.

And, jeez, is EVERYONE in NYC a freaking "DJ"???

Well, we can see where their true priorities lay. Not in political issues, but in partying.

yes, because we should all devote ourselves exclusively writing long winded analyses of political theory and policy and praxis. and we should all spend our free time quietly reading other people's long winded analyses of theory, policy, and praxis.

Coolest riot scene ever.

Play Sublime's Miami and start throwing Molotov Cocktails at cars.

Hey, don't knock Leftover Crack, man.

yes, because we should all devote ourselves exclusively writing long winded analyses of political theory and policy and praxis. and we should all spend our free time quietly reading other people's long winded analyses of theory, policy, and praxis.
The point of Galtania's post, as I read it, is simple: Who should you listen to, the crack addicted, empty headed, moron who actually listens to someone called "Leftover Crack?" Or perhaps the studious person who actually knows more about the world at large then where the best party can be found?

progressives

A liberal by any other name would still smell the same. Instead of protesting, get a job and take a shower. If you would disrupt my usage of a public road, you would be creamed. If you protestors cause any disruption, the police should have the right to "knock" some sense into you.

How many protestors does it take to grease your car?

One if you hit them right.

If you would disrupt my usage of a public road, you would be creamed. If you protestors cause any disruption, the police should have the right to "knock" some sense into you.

yes, because your 'right' to travel without hassel vastly outweighs the right to protest...

The point of Galtania's post, as I read it, is simple: Who should you listen to, the crack addicted, empty headed, moron who actually listens to someone called "Leftover Crack?" Or perhaps the studious person who actually knows more about the world at large then where the best party can be found?

so you can judge a person's intelligence and knowledge based on the name of one of the bands they might like? i think your reading of his post makes him sound even sillier.

Politcians = 14M3

yes, because your 'right' to travel without hassel vastly outweighs the right to protest...


Yes my right to travel is more important then you are, as it is my personal right. My rights trump any one else's. Also my families rights trumps anyone else's rights. I guess I am just selfish. Oh well.

PS Why do some protestors always wear masks? They should be proud of what they do. Anyone wearing masks should get hit by some rubber bullets.

Hi, I'm relatively new to posting, so I don't know if I'll get this 'quotation' business done properly, but:

Originally Posted by Hajekistan

The point of Galtania's post, as I read it, is simple: Who should you listen to, the crack addicted, empty headed, moron who actually listens to someone called "Leftover Crack?" Or perhaps the studious person who actually knows more about the world at large then where the best party can be found?

Who says a 'studious' person knows more about the world at large? I would assume a studious person would know more about studying than the world at large. And knowing where the best parties are to be found is hardly something to scoff at. It's a talent!

Dobbs Town.

I wonder if there will actually be hot chicks doing the Radical Cheerleading, or ugly old fat men. ;)

Well, there you go. I didn't get that 'quotation' business figured out after all. But now I notice the tiny print over to the bottom right...

Dobbs Town.

I think it'd be way more cool if it were ugly old men...

even gorbachev's own aids admit it was reagan's policies that led to the demise of the soviet union. and the recession started in january of 2001. we were still under mr. clinton's policies and budgets until 6 months later. so if anyone is blamed for the recession, it should be mr. clinton's policies and leadership.

The recession was at the hands of Alan Greenspan and the Treasuries manipulation of the market.

Yes my right to travel is more important then you are, as it is my personal right. My rights trump any one else's. Also my families rights trumps anyone else's rights. I guess I am just selfish. Oh well.

PS Why do some protestors always wear masks? They should be proud of what they do. Anyone wearing masks should get hit by some rubber bullets.

you don't seriously think that you have rights that trump everyone elses in any real sense, do you? you can't have that poor of a grasp of the enlightment ideas that we claim to be based on.

as for masks, when we choose to wear them we do so as a sign of solidarity, as a way to make ourselves collectively visible, and for protection from police surveillance and attacks.

Hit Bush with foul eggs and tomatos, better yet, assassinate him + Cheney. Boo the republicans and show them how much you hate them. Best of luck from Germany. May they have their imperialist, facist convention be destroyed.

as for masks, when we choose to wear them we do so as a sign of solidarity, as a way to make ourselves collectively visible, and for protection from police surveillance and attacks.

Get a life, you paranoid idiot.

P.S. Your nation name is about as ironic as it gets. LOL!


Hit Bush with foul eggs and tomatos, better yet, assassinate him + Cheney. Boo the republicans and show them how much you hate them. Best of luck from Germany. May they have their imperialist, facist convention be destroyed.

Democratic indeed.

Get a life, you paranoid idiot.

P.S. Your nation name is about as ironic as it gets. LOL!

Good point!

you don't seriously think that you have rights that trump everyone elses in any real sense, do you? you can't have that poor of a grasp of the enlightment ideas that we claim to be based on.

as for masks, when we choose to wear them we do so as a sign of solidarity, as a way to make ourselves collectively visible, and for protection from police surveillance and attacks.


Hey as long as I have my rights, I don't care what happens to you dirty, dirty hippies. You have the right to express yourself, but don't be mad if there is a backlash.

As for solidarity, try wearing the same colored shirts, or a nice Member's Only jacket. Hey if you are out in public, you can't think you have a right to privacy. Masks offer protection from attacks? If I see a masked man holding me up in traffic, I'm standing on it! Either leap over my vehicle or get splattered, it's your choice.

P.S. Your nation name is about as ironic as it gets. LOL!

here is neither the time nor the place for us to discuss the fact that you haven't the foggiest idea what a soviet is.

If I see a masked man holding me up in traffic, I'm standing on it! Either leap over my vehicle or get splattered, it's your choice.

and here we see into the mind of the right - protest bad, manslaughter good.

and here we see into the mind of the right - protest bad, manslaughter good.

Thank you I am right! Believe it or not there are quite a few people who would do the same as I. Luckily instead of being charged with manslaughter, I carry a little throw away piece for just such occasions, and would say they were trying to shoot some fellow citizen.Throwing feces, eggs, rocks, and other objects do not make you look better in the eyes of the people. Plus instead of busing protestors in, bus em into car washes and hose em down. It is kind of funny, you know you have way too much time on your hands if you can spend a week protesting.

This is why I say that the USA needs 3, 4, 5 major parties.

It's basically a "yes" or "no" choice in USA politics because you only have 2 choices. It is true that there are other parties in the USA, but they are not even blips on the politic radar screen.

You're stuck with either Democratic or Republican Presidents and Senators. It'd take drastic measures to give the other parties a chance, such as killing the entire Democratic and Republican party leadership... or framing both parties in the biggest scandal ever... like having a prominent Republican or Democrat leader marry someone in Osama Bin Laden's family. Simply framing the Democrats and Republicans for things so vile and despicable that the USA people will shun these 2 parties in favor of a multi-party system.

Again, this is merely a hypothetical solution. I know these are extreme, but sometimes extremes are the only way to topple monopolies on power.

I have yet to see a modern Independent or non-democratic and non-republican Senator or President. (The Whigs in 1800's don't count).

Can't wait to see all the left wing nuts in New York. What's there to protest? Protest John Kerry getting all his money from his (insert derogatory comment here) wife Teresa Heinz-Kerry, who's father's company outsources thousands of jobs overseas which JK claims he's going to eliminate once he's elected. Why don't you protest your own "war hero" John Kerry, afterall he shot dead soldiers, left his command boat and got war medals for it. That is if you've woken up from his run of the mill, put-me-to-sleep acceptance speech at the DNC Convention in July. And if you even try to apply Michael Moore's lies from Fahrenheit 9/11, check out this site, it's quite a good read:

http://www.davekopel.org/terror/59Deceits.pdf

Viva la re-election, as my bumper sticker reads. Four more years of success, money in my wallet, and the pride of being an American.

Can't wait to see all the left wing nuts in New York. What's there to protest? Protest John Kerry getting all his money from his (insert derogatory comment here) wife Teresa Heinz-Kerry, who's father's company outsources thousands of jobs overseas which JK claims he's going to eliminate once he's elected. Why don't you protest your own "war hero" John Kerry, afterall he shot dead soldiers, left his command boat and got war medals for it. That is if you've woken up from his run of the mill, put-me-to-sleep acceptance speech at the DNC Convention in July. And if you even try to apply Michael Moore's lies from Fahrenheit 9/11, check out this site, it's quite a good read:

http://www.davekopel.org/terror/59Deceits.pdf

Viva la re-election, as my bumper sticker reads. Four more years of success, money in my wallet, and the pride of being an American.

Wow, someone doesn't know anything.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/kerry/service.asp
http://www.snopes.com/politics/kerry/heinz.asp

Surely getting that angry about people who think and act differently is more towards the republican side of things anyway. Maybe these protestors should sign up to the republican party.

I for one hope, if tear gas is used with no good reason, that the wind is good that day. It would be nice to get the RNC locked into their convention center and hotels because of all the gas. :D

I know my dad well and i know the nyc police well as i have constantly been around them since i was born. My dad has been in nypd since 1987 and most of his associates even longer. they are regular guys. they dont hate the protestors as you would like to think. they just want to keep order on their shift and go home to their families and own homes. they havent been indoctrinated. they dont hate you. you might want or expect them to but they dont. and they are trained never to start a fight. so it sounds to be you have had left wing propaganda told to you about the nyc police. Believe me , i know them, and they are not the right wing "pigs" people on the far left make them out to be. they are regular people doing a hard job and trying to keep the peace and safety of the city. please do not make statements like the one you made until you know them as well as I. what a shame.
It's the rookies you should be afraid of. They may come from outside the city borders and probably have little experience in crowded areas.

Hey, I think it will be just fine if you guys protest. I for one will be watching the RNC intently. Its not like there are going to be no protesters. Anarchists show up at every political convention. Those guys have nothing better to do than complain about the government. They were at the DNC as well. Now that I have digressed into a riff about the anarchists, I will get back on topic. Protests are a good thing, not a bad thing. Protesting is exactly going to stop the RNC, and it won't do anything to Bush's poll numbers either. Protesting is just showing your right to do so these days. Maybe if you guys could get one message you would have more of an impact. I see a poster saying "legalize marijuana" amid the crowd of anti-Bush banners in every protest I have seen. It doesn't give a good clear message. But hey, you guys have fun out there. If I was still doing my Confessions of a Member of the Vast Right-Wing Conspiracy thread, I would certainly give the guy who started this thread a mention. Whew, can you say wacko?Here's a good, clear message...

We would like George W. Bush to vacate his current residence, in order that John Kerry can move in.

signed
A Democrate for Democratic Government

Surely getting that angry about people who think and act differently is more towards the republican side of things anyway. Maybe these protestors should sign up to the republican party.

getting angry about people thinking and acting different is putting it a bit mild. we have a government that has attempted to justify and actively engaged in torture, indefinite detention without a trial or a right to see a lawyer or even being charged with a crime, mass round ups of immigrants, the vast expansion of government surveillance, and the reduction of oversight of the same. plus they launched at least one full-scale war of agression. and that's ignoring the buddy-buddy relationship they have with all sorts of corporate criminals and war profiteers, and the placing of fundamentalist nut-jobs into long term positions of authority, and all the other sketchy shit they've pulled.

at what point does it become morally right to actually fight against an out-of-control illegitimate authoritarian government? especially one with so little regard for the constitution they are sworn to uphold that they want to claim that significant portions of it can be abandoned purely through executive order - amendments 1, 4, 5, 6, 8, 9, and 10, for example.

if you aren't angry enough to throw things, you aren't paying attention.

Jesus, why can't the GOP just have its damn convention in Washington D.C.

I don't look forward to the OMG UBERSECURITY!!!! traffic jams, and oh yes, TARGET FOR TERRORISM this little elite party puts on my city.

POLITICIANS GO HOME!!!

I know Im pissed too. I think they chose NYC because they could call the protests a "security risk" and put them on the west side highway. Also as a feeble attempt to capitalize on 9/11.

Thay are mistaken though, people wont stick to "free speech zones" thousands of people will just converge on Times square with no permit, and fill central park. Hopefully the Republicans will realize that New York doesn't like them, and that they shouldn;t come back. This shite doen't make any sense, the DNC happens in Kerry's home state, the RNC happens in the center of the largest and densest collection of people who don't like Bush in the world, in a state he is sure to lose. What gives?

RNC DONT COME BACK! US NEW YORKERS DON'T LIKE YOU!

It's the rookies you should be afraid of. They may come from outside the city borders and probably have little experience in crowded areas.

This is absolutly right. I heard an interview with an NYPD rookie who had just recieved anti-terror training, (The training involved entering a train station that was filled with actors, acting like a disater had happened, screaming etc. They cops didn't notice an attache case with wires sticking out, and got "blown up" ie they failed the training scenario, make sense, right?)

But this rookie said "Its a good thing Im recieving this training in time for the RNC protests, because I have never faced such hostile people before" (referring to the protesters)

So here we havea rookie learning anti-terror techniques, and she thinks she is learing how to deal with protesters. This is the problem with the NYPD. They are regular people, and that is the reason they need to be watched, perfectly regular people can do some terrible things, one of my best friends was just awarded $20,000 from the city for being thrown through a plate glass window by police.

Omni Conglomerates-
You may not hear about it, but police brutality is a MAJOR problem in NYC, being the child of cop you probobly aren't exposed to the realities of what cops have done to people. (Trampling old men with horses, etc. )

so the republican national convention is coming up... is everybody going to be joining the absolutely massive protests against this band of mad imperialist corporate goons?

http://www.rncnotwelcome.org/

http://www.infoshop.org/graphics/webvotebush84.jpgWhoa, no prejudice there [/sarcasm]

C'mon, man, we have the right to assemble, too! We didn't do anything to the DNC, why should you to the RNC? I've heard news about how several groups are going to try to create as many false alarms as possible for the police, in turn making it easier for the real terrorists to attack. They plan to go to shooting ranges so they smell like gunpowder, plant the fertilizer used by Timothy McVeigh and the first WTC bombing... I personally think that if an attack really does happen, that should make every last one of them accessories to murder. It's bullshit.

Surely getting that angry about people who think and act differently is more towards the republican side of things anyway. Maybe these protestors should sign up to the republican party.How long have you been posting here, anyway? The left is FAR more hostile to the right. I have seen people say that the president should be assasinated, for chrisakes! Nothing on that scale from the right. After all, if the republicans are so hostile, where were the bloated protests at the DNC? Only the democrats are doing this.

if you aren't angry enough to throw things, you aren't paying attention.

Translation: If you don't agree with me, then you are ignorant. Don't you know that my opinions are superior?

Whoa, no prejudice there [/sarcasm]

C'mon, man, we have the right to assemble, too! We didn't do anything to the DNC, why should you to the RNC?

There were protests at the DNC, members of some of the same groups that will protest the RNC. It not "Us vs. Them" the protesters are not afilliated with the democratic party. This whole "us and them" mentality is just pathetic, you might entertain the possibility that things are more complicated than just black and white. that competative mentaility is what divides the world, and justifies intellectual laziness.


I've heard news about how several groups are going to try to create as many false alarms as possible for the police, in turn making it easier for the real terrorists to attack. They plan to go to shooting ranges so they smell like gunpowder, plant the fertilizer used by Timothy McVeigh and the first WTC bombing..

This is a bullshit story on FOX News, the source for it is just "chatter on the internet" its a bunch of bullshit. The story did not refernce "several groups" it just said "anarchists." The story is pure unmitigated bullshit, don't believe anything you hear on FOX unless you see it on a real news source.

Whoa, no prejudice there [/sarcasm]

C'mon, man, we have the right to assemble, too! We didn't do anything to the DNC, why should you to the RNC? I've heard news about how several groups are going to try to create as many false alarms as possible for the police, in turn making it easier for the real terrorists to attack. They plan to go to shooting ranges so they smell like gunpowder, plant the fertilizer used by Timothy McVeigh and the first WTC bombing... I personally think that if an attack really does happen, that should make every last one of them accessories to murder. It's bullshit.

Agreed. These criminals even have training camps to teach them how to commit mischief. Why do you think they wear masks? One of them is called the Ruckus Group, or something like that. Check out their website.

I don't know about NY, but where I live, causing false alarms and obstructing police from performing their duties, are crimes. (And before you anarchists bring up the Patriot Act, these have been crimes since long before the Patriot Act existed.) Anyone caught doing this should be locked up.

How long have you been posting here, anyway? The left is FAR more hostile to the right. I have seen people say that the president should be assasinated, for chrisakes! Nothing on that scale from the right. After all, if the republicans are so hostile, where were the bloated protests at the DNC? Only the democrats are doing this.

AGAIN! THE PROTESTERS ARE IN NO WAY AFILLIATED WITH THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY!! I have heard lots of outlandish things from the right, like "lets kill the families of suicide bombers" or "anybody who criticizes the president is a terrorist sympathizer" so don;t try and tell me that the right is all sweetness and light.

Th reason the protests will be larger at the RNC than the DNC is because the Republicans have pissed more people off.

Translation: If you don't agree with me, then you are ignorant. Don't you know that my opinions are superior?

this government has instituted a policy of torture. torture. they have given prisoners over to nations with a current and notorious history of torture and human rights abuses for 'questioning'. they have instituted policies of 'softening up' people in their own prisons and detention centers.

yes, i think that if you don't agree with me that torture is an unmitigated bad thing that everyone should do everything in their power to stop, then you are either ignorant or evil. care to disagree?

I know who will be at the protests. www.protestwarrior.com

I want to find out what happens with that.

http://www.visualresistance.org/posters/thumbnails/I_NY.jpg

http://www.guardian.co.uk/salon/story/0,14752,1280907,00.html

New York lockdown

While anti-Bush activists in New York are adopting new techniques to try and disrupt the Republican party convention later this month, the police have got some new strategies of their own, writes Michelle Goldberg

Wednesday August 11, 2004

If you're a delegate attending the Republican national convention at Madison Square Garden later this month, Jamie Moran knows where you're staying. He knows where you're eating and what Broadway musical you plan on seeing. For the past nine months, Moran has been living off savings earned as an office manager at a nonprofit and working full-time to disrupt the RNC.

His small anarchist collective, RNCNotWelcome.org, runs a snitch line and an email account where disgruntled employees of New York hotels, the Garden and the Republican party itself can pass on information about conventioneers. So far, the collective has received dozens of phone calls and hundreds of emails with inside dirt on GOP activities.

Recently, a woman with a polished, middle-aged sounding voice left a message saying, "For some God-unknown reason I'm on the Republican mailing list, and they sent me what they call a list of their inner-circle events." The events hadn't been publicised elsewhere, she said, and she wanted to fax the list to Moran.

Moran feeds information like this to a cadre of activists desperate to unleash four years' worth of anger at the Bush administration. By dogging the delegates wherever they go, RNC Not Welcome hopes to make the Republicans' lives hell for as long as they're in New York.

"We want to make their stay here as miserable as possible," says Moran, who has sandy hair, a snub nose and a goatee. The son of a retired Queens cop, he's 30 but looks younger. "I'd like to see all the Republican events - teas, backslapping lunches - disrupted. I'd like to see people from other states following their delegates, letting them know what they think about Republican policies. I'd like to see impromptu street parties and marches. I'd like to see corporations involved in the Iraq reconstruction get targeted - anything from occupation to property destruction."

...

I believe in protest and am no fan of the RNC, bu I'm not so crazy about that plan (the giving out info and following them around.) I understand the need in this media age to create a nusance in order to be heard, but I think we might be creeping up on a line. I can make the arguments for it, but that doesn't mean I'm crazy about it. Saddened deeply, perhaps.

I believe in protest and am no fan of the RNC, bu I'm not so crazy about that plan (the giving out info and following them around.) I understand the need in this media age to create a nusance in order to be heard, but I think we might be creeping up on a line. I can make the arguments for it, but that doesn't mean I'm crazy about it. Saddened deeply, perhaps.

i don't know, the republican party is using their time in power to launch wars of aggression, torture people, lock people up indefinitely without trial, rig elections, etc. its crypto-fascism that skipped the street gang part of the road to power. if you ask me, we're being down right nice to them compared to what they deserve.

DISTRIBUTE WIDELY - DISTRIBUTE WIDELY - DISTRIBUTE WIDELY

ECD - ALL HACKERS OUT TO DISRUPT THE RNC - BATTLE LOGISTICS ENCLOSED

Contact: CrimethInc Black Hat Hacker's Bloc Campaign Website: http://phil.ist-backup.de/rncelectronic/ Email: rainbowskies@graffiti.net

Hackers are organizing for a massive electronic civil disobedience campaign against the Republican party to coincide with the massive protests in New York City for the Republican National Convention. This document contains logistical information on how people can participate in this campaign.

We won't stand idly by while the Republican Party exploits the democratic city of New York to further their agenda of endless war, attacks on our freedoms and and breaks for corporations. We demand an end to the so-called "war on terrorism", which is nothing more than a pretext for empire and the erosion of our civil rights. As long as Amerikkka continues to further their war on the poor for the benefit of the rich, we will use all weapons at our disposal to disrupt the RNC - on the streets, and on the net.

All are encouraged to help out this campaign in any way they can. Deface websites, flood email servers, cause financial disruption, change electronic billboards. Turn the system over and put the people on top. Hacktivists of the world, unite!

What will be happening?

August 22nd - Day of online direct action a week before the convention begins. All are encouraged to attack as many right-wing, corporate, government or military sites as possible. Web defacements, email attacks, financial disruption, anything and everything. These attacks will be used to stir discussion of the RNC, encourage people to participate in the protests in NYC itself, and to build for the mainstream electronic sit-in on the 29th.

August 29 - September 2nd - Mainstream electronic sit-in while the RNC is in session. The actions will commence on noon of each day. The protests will utilize a wide diversity of tactics including email, web, fax and phone disruption. The logistical details of this campaign are included in this document below.

Who are we flooding? The email addresses, fax numbers, and phone numbers listed below are various contacts of the Republican National Committee and the official George W. Bush re-election staff.

Isn't this cyber terrorism? It is important to make a distinction between electronic civil disobedience and terrorism. Civil disobedience is a fundamental part of the democratic process which our country was founded upon. Like Henry David Thoreau and our revolutionary forefathers who shot up the pigs at Lexington and Concord, electronic civil disobedience is the logical continuation of these theories applied towards the internet as a medium for disruption. ECD is a legitimate protest act.

Terrorism tries to instill fear into people through violence and destruction. Terrorism is not an act of liberation or unity but of division fear and conquer. A bitter act of desperation that solves no problems, makes no statement, and disempowers many. Electronic civil disobedience causes no harm to people or property. Instead of disempowering, ECD tries to bring people together to realize and exercise their power over oppressive governments and corporations using hacking as a means of fighting for social justice.

Who are we? There is no 'us'. This is a decentralized campaign - there are no leaders or orders or hierarchy. Most of us don't know the other people working on this project. None of us know what sorts of attacks are being planned. This is an autonomous call out, anyone who agrees with what we've said and wants to participate in this campaign is welcome to resist the RNC in any way they can.

This call out is issued by the CrimethInc Black Hat Hacker's Bloc. We are not participating in any of the actions or any illegal activities ourselves. We recognize the political significance of the RNC and realize that one way or another there is going to be some sort of cyber attack. We are simply serving as a press tool to communicate with the media about different electronic methods people are employing to protest the RNC.

Contact Us: CrimethInc Black Hat Hacker's Bloc Campaign Website: http://phil.ist-backup.de/rncelectronic/ Email: rainbowskies@graffiti.net

DISCLAIMER: This is an autonomous call out for electronic direct action against the RNC. This document contains a number of resources that can help people who choose to participate in such actions. If you decide to help out, you do so on your own terms and accept responsibility for what might happen. However, there is safety in numbers and there are a number of people who plan on a number of actions and there is a very low risk. So hack on!

If you participate... Let us know what you're up to! We are communicating with the media on this project and we want to post on our website what sorts of attacks are being made. Feel free to rip bits of text from our website, this document, or any other press release we have made and use it in your messages. Make sure to link to our page!

Fellow citizens, PARTICIPATE! ----------------------------- You do not need to be an experienced hacker to help this campaign: we've made it easy for people to help out through a variety of different ways. The mainstream electronic sit-in is composed of several methods of disruption: flooding RNC websites, email addresses, fax and phone numbers. Listed below are the targets and explanations / tools you can use to help this campaign.

WEB SITE FLOODING ----------------- We are asking people to use all tools at their disposal to bombard the given servers with so much traffic that it will become unable to serve any more web requests. People can participate in the actions by using the given floodnet scripts on the campaign website or by launching your own distributed denial of service attacks.

The Republican National Convention: http://www.2004nycgop.org/ The Republican National Committee: http://www.rnc.org/ George W. Bush official re-election site: http://www.georgewbush.com/

You can help flood these servers by going to our website and running the FloodNet tools on our website. There is a web-based tool and several perl scripts that you can use to flood the targets. You can also download and run several denial of service applications on your home machine and point them to the above servers.

A list of good denial of service tools for the Mac is available at Freaky's Mac Archive and Underground Mac

A list of good denial of service tools for Windows is available at elitehackers.com

... but denial of service attacks isn't hacking!

DoS attacks are seen as somewhat lame in the hacking community because it does not require any actual skills to perform such attacks - any script kiddie can simply download a few tools and launch attacks against major servers. It can hardly be considered hacking. But it is a method of electronic disruption that can bring the enemy's servers to it's knees. No reason to overlook tools at our disposal.

E-MAIL BOMBING -------------- E-mail bomb attacks are done by sending tens of thousands of emails to the enemy's contact addresses. This can make it painful to send and receive emails while simultaneously consuming server resources, possibly slowing or shutting it down. There are numerous tools that one can use to perform such attacks.

There are a number of Windows email bombers available for download at Elitehackers.com.

A number of good email bombers for the mac are available at Underground Mac.

Targets: webmaster@gop.com Info@gop.com RNCommunications@gop.com MemberRelations@gop.com Administration@gop.com Counsel@gop.com Chairman@gop.com Political@gop.com Finance@gop.com NOS@gop.com BushCheney04@GeorgeWBush.com Blog@GeorgeWBush.com

FAX BOMBING ----------- Fax bombing is a method of electronic disruption that clogs the enemy's fax communications and wastes their paper and toner resources. Tape together a few sheets of black construction paper and start faxing to the following targets. When the first page goes through, roll it back and tape it to the other end of your sheet to form an infinite loop of black construction paper. Then sit back and watch the mayhem begin. Use any and all fax machines at your availability - the more the merrier!

Targets: 703.647.2993 202.863.8820 202-863-8774 202-863-8609 202-863-8773 202-863-8654 202-863-8808 202-863-8851 202-863-8851

PHONE BOMBING ------------- Phone bombing is another method of disrupting their communication systems by preventing them from making / receiving calls. You can either call these numbers and tell them what you think about the Bush agenda, or you can beige box into someone else's line and set up auto-dialing scripts to flood their lines.

Targets: 703.647.2700 202.863.8500 202-863-8700 202-863-8545 202-863-8560 202-863-8614 202-863-8638 202-863-8743 202-863-8720 202-863-8600 202-863-8670 202-863-8888

That's all for today, kids. Stay out of trouble, and don't get caught!

DISTRIBUTE WIDELY - DISTRIBUTE WIDELY - DISTRIBUTE WIDELY

ECD - ALL HACKERS OUT TO DISRUPT THE RNC - BATTLE LOGISTICS ENCLOSED

Contact: CrimethInc Black Hat Hacker's Bloc Campaign Website: http://phil.ist-backup.de/rncelectronic/ Email: rainbowskies@graffiti.net

Hackers are organizing for a massive electronic civil disobedience campaign against the Republican party to coincide with the massive protests in New York City for the Republican National Convention. This document contains logistical information on how people can participate in this campaign.

We won't stand idly by while the Republican Party exploits the democratic city of New York to further their agenda of endless war, attacks on our freedoms and and breaks for corporations. We demand an end to the so-called "war on terrorism", which is nothing more than a pretext for empire and the erosion of our civil rights. As long as Amerikkka continues to further their war on the poor for the benefit of the rich, we will use all weapons at our disposal to disrupt the RNC - on the streets, and on the net.

All are encouraged to help out this campaign in any way they can. Deface websites, flood email servers, cause financial disruption, change electronic billboards. Turn the system over and put the people on top. Hacktivists of the world, unite!

What will be happening?

August 22nd - Day of online direct action a week before the convention begins. All are encouraged to attack as many right-wing, corporate, government or military sites as possible. Web defacements, email attacks, financial disruption, anything and everything. These attacks will be used to stir discussion of the RNC, encourage people to participate in the protests in NYC itself, and to build for the mainstream electronic sit-in on the 29th.

August 29 - September 2nd - Mainstream electronic sit-in while the RNC is in session. The actions will commence on noon of each day. The protests will utilize a wide diversity of tactics including email, web, fax and phone disruption. The logistical details of this campaign are included in this document below.

Who are we flooding? The email addresses, fax numbers, and phone numbers listed below are various contacts of the Republican National Committee and the official George W. Bush re-election staff.

Isn't this cyber terrorism? It is important to make a distinction between electronic civil disobedience and terrorism. Civil disobedience is a fundamental part of the democratic process which our country was founded upon. Like Henry David Thoreau and our revolutionary forefathers who shot up the pigs at Lexington and Concord, electronic civil disobedience is the logical continuation of these theories applied towards the internet as a medium for disruption. ECD is a legitimate protest act.

Terrorism tries to instill fear into people through violence and destruction. Terrorism is not an act of liberation or unity but of division fear and conquer. A bitter act of desperation that solves no problems, makes no statement, and disempowers many. Electronic civil disobedience causes no harm to people or property. Instead of disempowering, ECD tries to bring people together to realize and exercise their power over oppressive governments and corporations using hacking as a means of fighting for social justice.

Who are we? There is no 'us'. This is a decentralized campaign - there are no leaders or orders or hierarchy. Most of us don't know the other people working on this project. None of us know what sorts of attacks are being planned. This is an autonomous call out, anyone who agrees with what we've said and wants to participate in this campaign is welcome to resist the RNC in any way they can.

This call out is issued by the CrimethInc Black Hat Hacker's Bloc. We are not participating in any of the actions or any illegal activities ourselves. We recognize the political significance of the RNC and realize that one way or another there is going to be some sort of cyber attack. We are simply serving as a press tool to communicate with the media about different electronic methods people are employing to protest the RNC.

Contact Us: CrimethInc Black Hat Hacker's Bloc Campaign Website: http://phil.ist-backup.de/rncelectronic/ Email: rainbowskies@graffiti.net

DISCLAIMER: This is an autonomous call out for electronic direct action against the RNC. This document contains a number of resources that can help people who choose to participate in such actions. If you decide to help out, you do so on your own terms and accept responsibility for what might happen. However, there is safety in numbers and there are a number of people who plan on a number of actions and there is a very low risk. So hack on!

If you participate... Let us know what you're up to! We are communicating with the media on this project and we want to post on our website what sorts of attacks are being made. Feel free to rip bits of text from our website, this document, or any other press release we have made and use it in your messages. Make sure to link to our page!

Fellow citizens, PARTICIPATE! ----------------------------- You do not need to be an experienced hacker to help this campaign: we've made it easy for people to help out through a variety of different ways. The mainstream electronic sit-in is composed of several methods of disruption: flooding RNC websites, email addresses, fax and phone numbers. Listed below are the targets and explanations / tools you can use to help this campaign.

WEB SITE FLOODING ----------------- We are asking people to use all tools at their disposal to bombard the given servers with so much traffic that it will become unable to serve any more web requests. People can participate in the actions by using the given floodnet scripts on the campaign website or by launching your own distributed denial of service attacks.

The Republican National Convention: http://www.2004nycgop.org/ The Republican National Committee: http://www.rnc.org/ George W. Bush official re-election site: http://www.georgewbush.com/

You can help flood these servers by going to our website and running the FloodNet tools on our website. There is a web-based tool and several perl scripts that you can use to flood the targets. You can also download and run several denial of service applications on your home machine and point them to the above servers.

A list of good denial of service tools for the Mac is available at Freaky's Mac Archive and Underground Mac

A list of good denial of service tools for Windows is available at elitehackers.com

... but denial of service attacks isn't hacking!

DoS attacks are seen as somewhat lame in the hacking community because it does not require any actual skills to perform such attacks - any script kiddie can simply download a few tools and launch attacks against major servers. It can hardly be considered hacking. But it is a method of electronic disruption that can bring the enemy's servers to it's knees. No reason to overlook tools at our disposal.

E-MAIL BOMBING -------------- E-mail bomb attacks are done by sending tens of thousands of emails to the enemy's contact addresses. This can make it painful to send and receive emails while simultaneously consuming server resources, possibly slowing or shutting it down. There are numerous tools that one can use to perform such attacks.

There are a number of Windows email bombers available for download at Elitehackers.com.

A number of good email bombers for the mac are available at Underground Mac.

Targets: webmaster@gop.com Info@gop.com RNCommunications@gop.com MemberRelations@gop.com Administration@gop.com Counsel@gop.com Chairman@gop.com Political@gop.com Finance@gop.com NOS@gop.com BushCheney04@GeorgeWBush.com Blog@GeorgeWBush.com

FAX BOMBING ----------- Fax bombing is a method of electronic disruption that clogs the enemy's fax communications and wastes their paper and toner resources. Tape together a few sheets of black construction paper and start faxing to the following targets. When the first page goes through, roll it back and tape it to the other end of your sheet to form an infinite loop of black construction paper. Then sit back and watch the mayhem begin. Use any and all fax machines at your availability - the more the merrier!

Targets: 703.647.2993 202.863.8820 202-863-8774 202-863-8609 202-863-8773 202-863-8654 202-863-8808 202-863-8851 202-863-8851

PHONE BOMBING ------------- Phone bombing is another method of disrupting their communication systems by preventing them from making / receiving calls. You can either call these numbers and tell them what you think about the Bush agenda, or you can beige box into someone else's line and set up auto-dialing scripts to flood their lines.

Targets: 703.647.2700 202.863.8500 202-863-8700 202-863-8545 202-863-8560 202-863-8614 202-863-8638 202-863-8743 202-863-8720 202-863-8600 202-863-8670 202-863-8888

That's all for today, kids. Stay out of trouble, and don't get caught!
people must do everything in their power to make life unliveable for republicans until they stop oppressing the american people and if Bush dirty bombs his way into another term then the whole country must do everything in its power to resist and destroy everything this traitrous scum seeks to accomplish including refusing to serve in anymore wars or goin to Iraq

comparing the slow and gradual collapse of soviet russia in the 1980's is an extremelty false analogy to the dropping of atomic bombs in japan. the anology is warped and false.The attacks on Hiroshima and Nagasaki are falsely stated as the only reason why Japan surrendered to the Allies. There are a multitude. Remember, the entrance of the Soviet Union into the Pacific war was weighed more heavily by the Japanese than the destruction of the two cities.

Pieing 101

For more information on the art of pieing see the Biotic Baking Brigade site (http://www.bioticbakingbrigade.org/).


http://www.rncnotwelcome.org/images/bbblogo.jpg


Step One
Choose a worthy target. Any pompous evil-doer will do for a glouping. Agent Apple, who mashed a lucious coconut cream pie on self-inflated economist Milton Friedman's face, said afterwards, "His generation is selling our future down the drain. They offer us pie in the sky, but being a down-to-earth guy, I brought that pie and gave it back to him."

Next, plan your pan
You might plot to pie someone for months. Then again, you might spontaneously decide to pitch one morning after eating your favorite whipped yum and hearing about a potential victim's appearance. Reporters during live media events are becoming favored targets.

Dress the part
It doesn't take an economist or computer hack to figure out that if you try to access a meeting of the pretentious and portentious dreadlocked, barefoot, and with pie-stains on your t-shirt,you may not be admitted. Shave, put on a suit (without necktie), wear an American flag pin, and keep your hair short. (You'll be able to go anywhere!) You can put your pie in a paper bag, wear it under your coat, carry it in a bowling ball bag, or place it in a container with a plastic lid and carry it in a non-descript, standard-size briefcase.

Don't forget to fortify yourself. Blend in with the crowd. Smile! Say hello to people and maintain a pleasant demeanor. If someone offers you a glass of nice red wine, do what Apple did and accept it graciously. It might help with the pre-pie-ing jitters.

The Merangue is the Message
The success of any splooging is a record of the act. It's good to have friends with cameras taking pictures, focusing on the target and from many angles. The impact is heightened if other media are there, particularly when the event is live coverage.

Launch
Some pie assassins work in teams. When L’Entarteur creamed Bill Gates in Paris, the operation involved 32 persons carrying twenty-five pies in roaming groups of three, many of whom were carrying tarts hidden in camera bags or under their coats, while they waited for the Microsoft chairman in the street. "The secret is to have precise information," Godin has said. "Our friends in Paris knew how the visit was planned and gave us all the details the day before." Godin and his pastry partners try to confuse their intended victim, the police, and any bodyguards by appearing as ridiculous as possible. They paste exaggerated smiles on their faces, utter nonsense poetry and chant "gloup, gloup, gloup" (an expression that derives from Godin’s pseudonym Georges le Gloupier) before descending on their target with whip cream tarts.

When it comes to airborne pies, less isn’t more. A crossfire has a higher success rate of splatting the intended target. For example, the Biotic Baking Brigade, with a dozen or more successful pie-ings, splatted San Francisco mayor Brown in a cross-fire of cherry, tofu, and pumpkin pies.

Pie-ing is poetic
As you toss the creamy delight into the face of your prey, a quick quip can highlight your action. When Apple pied Freeman, he casually said to him, "Mr. Friedman, It's a good day to pie." "It was nothing personal, just business," claims Apple.

After Pie
Expect shock and chaos. People will be aghast at what has just transpired and might react in many ways. People might scream, someone may throw something at you, enraged people will try to grab you. You might be detained and arrested.Once you're reunited with colleagues, it's critical to celebrate. Drink a toast at the expense of the splooged. Have some pie!

Probation or Prison?
While pie-throwing is a mainstay of political theater, the pie-ed party may file charges against her or his assailant. Secretary of Agriculture Dan Glickman was gooped by a PETA member who was charged with assault, which carries a recommended penalty of up to a year imprisonment. The three members of the Biotic Baking Brigade who hit Mayor Brown were arrested and charged with assault and battery. A jury found the trio not guilty of assault, but guilty of battery. The prosecution had recommended a term of three-years probation, which the threesome rejected, saying probation would prevent them from further protests. Instead, they were sentenced to six months in county jail. Prior to the Biotic Baking Brigade’s trial last year, no pie-throwing case had gone to trial in America in 20 years.

Start Baking
Godin prefers tarts over letters. "I’ve always been a partisan of the insulting letter, in the Dadaist and surrealist tradition, sent by intellectuals to challenge famous people’s pretensions," Godin has said. "But if I sent a letter to Bill Gates, only he would see it. Instead, I communicate via tarts, in a sort of visual Esperanto."

Practice
Set up a pie toss gallery to practice at home. Practice tossing and splooging pies at targets. Experiment with different weights of pies. Invite friends over for pie-toss parties.

Appendix: How to Prepare a Tofu Cream Pie

Karin’s Incredible Chocolate Pie
1-1/4 lbs soft tofu
3/4 c. semisweet dairy-free chocolate chips, melted
Sliced kiwi, strawberries, or raspberries
1 9-inch unbaked Chocolate Cookie Crust, chilled (recipe follows)

1. In a blender, purée the tofu to a smooth paste.
2. Add the melted chocolate and blend thoroughly.
3. Pour into the pie crust and chill for at least 2 hours.
4. Garnish with the sliced fruit before serving.
Makes 6 to 8 servings.

Chocolate Cookie Crust
25 vegan chocolate sandwich cookies
1/3 c. margarine, melted

1. Break up the cookies by hand, then grind into crumbs in a blender or food processor.
2. Pour the crumbs into a mixing bowl, add the melted margarine, and stir.
3. Press the mixture into a 9-inch pie plate.
4. Refrigerate