NationStates Jolt Archive

after reading, contributing, and laughing through the "Shaving thread", I see that a question has been raised by at least one or two conservative members of these forums.

inspiration thread (http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=346530)

is Oral moral?
any other thoughts about the topic are welcome.

Please don't just quote the bible at me, because if it's out of context you WILL be called on it.

I honestly can't see anything immoral about it whatsoever. The only possible thing that could be immoral is if someone is getting a significantly higher than average share. Otherwise...

Can't see how it's immoral when between two consenting adults.

its simple

some people believe that sex for pleasure is unpure because sex is a sin. You say don't use the bible, but it is the single influence toward this ideology.

If one may only copulate for procreation, oral gratification would be a "sin", since it is sex for only pleasure.

OR

Maybe its a issue of the proper use of the mouth ;)

maybe there are some places the mouth shouldnt go...

since it is sex for only pleasure.
Damn straight.

OR

Maybe its a issue of the proper use of the mouth ;)

maybe there are some places the mouth shouldnt go...
What reason is there that it shouldn't be... there.

If sex naturally feels good than it's perfectly fine.

I can safely say, that oral sex is not immoral, it actually kicks lots of ass and Jesus would love you do it (not necessarily on him)

Here's some food for thought.

According to this rabbi: http://judaism.about.com/library/2_sex/bl_boteach_d.htm

what about oral sex?

Rabbi_Boteach says:
Now you're getting controversial. I got into a lot of trouble on that one. Basically, the Torah prohibits intentional destruction of seed. But, I contend that oral sex does not constitute this since the couple is not looking to frustrate the impregnation process but rather simply to do something new so that their sex doesn't become boring. The most important thing is always to have a healthy sex life with your spouse.

I struggle to comprehend that anyone would find oral sex offensive. Clearly only an issue for those that havent tried it.

Enh, I see nothing immoral about it... as long as it's with the one person you intend on spending the rest of your life with... (eternity if you believe in some form of "life" after death)

Enh, I see nothing immoral about it... as long as it's with the one person you intend on spending the rest of your life with... (eternity if you believe in some form of "life" after death)

Believe me it's very enjoyable even if you don't intend to spend the rest of your life with them!

OHhhhhhhhhh it feels SO good!

The problem people complain about is that it demeans women or devalues them. Shouldn't it be the same the other way around then, I mean, for men to perform oral on women? Who knows.

I think that (almost) anything that can reduce the risk of unplanned pregnancy is a good thing.

Here's some food for thought.

According to this rabbi: http://judaism.about.com/library/2_sex/bl_boteach_d.htm

A couple preparing for a religious conversion meets with the orthodox rabbi for their final session.

The rabbi asks if they have any final questions.

The man asks, 'Is it true that men and women don't dance together?'

'Yes,' says the rabbi, 'For modesty reasons, men and women dance separately.'

'So I can't dance with my own wife?'

'No.'

'Well, okay,' says the man, 'But what about sex?'

'Fine,' says the rabbi. 'A mitzvah within the marriage!'

'What about different positions?' the man asks.

'No problem,' says the rabbi.

'Woman on top?' the man asks.

'Why not?' replies the rabbi.

'How about doggie-style?'

'Of course!'

'Well, what about standing up?'

'NO!' says the rabbi....

'Why Not???' asks the man.

'Could lead to dancing!'

The problem people complain about is that it demeans women or devalues them. Shouldn't it be the same the other way around then, I mean, for men to perform oral on women? Who knows.

The arguement is that it removes a woman from her "proper" role, lets her become a sexual "object" without the obvious "rewards." In other words, most people who claim that oral sex demeans or devalues women tend to think of women soley in terms of potential baby incubaters - which is a far more demeaning and devaluing view, in my opinion.

As to the original question - consenting adults engaged in activities that harm none and provide pleasure to those involved. That is perfectly moral on many levels.

The arguement is that it removes a woman from her "proper" role, lets her become a sexual "object" without the obvious "rewards." In other words, most people who claim that oral sex demeans or devalues women tend to think of women soley in terms of potential baby incubaters - which is a far more demeaning and devaluing view, in my opinion.

As to the original question - consenting adults engaged in activities that harm none and provide pleasure to those involved. That is perfectly moral on many levels.

Well, that, and some guys don't want to kiss a girl that just had dick in her mouth. Even if it was their dick.

What is with the crazy religious idea that if it feels good it must be a sin?

What a partners do between themselves is no business of the church and they shouldn't have anything to say about it.

I honestly can't see anything immoral about it whatsoever. The only possible thing that could be immoral is if someone is getting a significantly higher than average share. Otherwise...

Hhehehehe...I like that response :-)

*Shrug*

Just make sure it goes both ways. If the Lady sucks, the Gentleman must not refuse to eat. In liberal usage of the two words, of course.

The arguement is that it removes a woman from her "proper" role, lets her become a sexual "object" without the obvious "rewards." In other words, most people who claim that oral sex demeans or devalues women tend to think of women soley in terms of potential baby incubaters - which is a far more demeaning and devaluing view, in my opinion.

As to the original question - consenting adults engaged in activities that harm none and provide pleasure to those involved. That is perfectly moral on many levels.

i didnt read anything in the question about it being women performing on men

how utterly male-centered of you to assume that oral sex automatically means blowjobs only

why would anyone give if they dont receive?

The problem people complain about is that it demeans women or devalues them. Shouldn't it be the same the other way around then, I mean, for men to perform oral on women? Who knows.
NO!!!!!
I mean....no....it doesn't devalue men...I promise... :D :fluffle: :cool:

It's only immoral if semen gets spit or spilled onto the ground... so learn to swallow, good Christian ladies ;)

...also if there is any male discharge or any menstrual blood, all who touch it or who touch those who have touched it and have not washed are unclean until they have bathed and the subsequent sunset has come.

Yep... a biblical position :p

It's only immoral if semen gets spit or spilled onto the ground... so learn to swallow, good Christian ladies ;)

...also if there is any male discharge or any menstrual blood, all who touch it or who touch those who have touched it and have not washed are unclean until they have bathed and the subsequent sunset has come.

Yep... a biblical position :p
well if all the "male discharge" goes right into the female's mouth and she swallows...is she still unclean?
If so...why does this matter
and if she waits until the next day to bathe
will she be unclean until the day after that still?
And then won't she have to bathe anyway, since it's been a day since she last bathed (by today's standards...not back then)
come to think of it....no wonder a woman was considered so "unclean" when she was menstruating...I can't even imagine how awful that must've been back then....geeze....

So...it's ok if you swallow...but you'll be unclean...however, if you spill the seed, god will immediately smite you....right?

Sex for pleasure is immoral, and may God Strike Me Down were it to be otherwise!!!

*is hit by a bolt of lightning and obliterated in the blink of an eye*

^_^

well if all the "male discharge" goes right into the female's mouth and she swallows...is she still unclean?
If so...why does this matter
and if she waits until the next day to bathe
will she be unclean until the day after that still?
And then won't she have to bathe anyway, since it's been a day since she last bathed (by today's standards...not back then)
come to think of it....no wonder a woman was considered so "unclean" when she was menstruating...I can't even imagine how awful that must've been back then....geeze....

So...it's ok if you swallow...but you'll be unclean...however, if you spill the seed, god will immediately smite you....right?

No... actually I have been looking for a scripture forbidding male seed falling on the ground, but I may have been confusing it with the proverb about how it is better to spill one's seed in the belly of a harlot than upon the ground... but I couldn't find that one either... :confused:

Sometimes I feel that He is playing tricks on me... changing the book around when I'm not looking.

For centuries people believed that the sin of Onan was inherent in letting his semen fall upon the ground, and this was what was believed in Luther's time. However it should be clear to the reader that, like his dead brother Er, Onan's sin was in disobeying God's direct decree to make a son with Tamar. And since Tamar eventually had to play the harlot to trick Judah into siring that child, perhaps that is where my lost proverb comes from.

So God will not smite you for swollowing, unless He has specifically commanded you to make a child.

Being unclean is not a sin, only defiling the holy by coming in contact with it while unclean is. And yes the bath is needed before the dusk, or you wait another whole day. And the Hebrews lived in the desert, so no they certainly did not do anything as wasteful as bathing every day...

a side note: poetry

SONG TO ONAN'S COMPLAINING HAND

I am the passion of the condemned.
Not the bedroom game that makes lives.
I am the lover of those who don't love.
I am the wife of les miserables.
I am the moment before suicide.
Only of love, but never alone;
limited by skin, I pull out people...
My fingers fill me with angels,
fill me with untouched passion.
It seems to me to be the silence of heroes.
I don't work solely with flesh:
It goes more with the digit of my office.
In my labor there is a higher worker,
A Quixote who drowns himself between my fingers,
a lover that I never hold.
I am hardly a violent middleman,
because there's also verse in these earthquakes,
smiles that curdle to my touch,
holy masses that melt without churches,
failed discourses that rebound,
kisses that descend from head to finger,
all the land smooth in an instant.
It's my flesh that flies from my flesh;
horizons that exude from a drop,
a drop that joins all the rivers in my skin,
a drunken trickle that brings
all the waters of a dark hurricane;
all the veins that leave prison behind
and rise with a wind of spirits
to immolate themselves in the abyss of each fingernail,
to take from me the life of my death.

Manuel del Cabral
[República Dominicana, 1907]
--- Translated by Carlos Amantea

I just found this and was awestruck. Who knew masturbation could be so beautiful?

No... actually I have been looking for a scripture forbidding male seed falling on the ground, but I may have been confusing it with the proverb about how it is better to spill one's seed in the belly of a harlot than upon the ground... but I couldn't find that one either... :confused:

Sometimes I feel that He is playing tricks on me... changing the book around when I'm not looking.

For centuries people believed that the sin of Onan was inherent in letting his semen fall upon the ground, and this was what was believed in Luther's time. However it should be clear to the reader that, like his dead brother Er, Onan's sin was in disobeying God's direct decree to make a son with Tamar. And since Tamar eventually had to play the harlot to trick Judah into siring that child, perhaps that is where my lost proverb comes from.

So God will not smite you for swollowing, unless He has specifically commanded you to make a child.

Being unclean is not a sin, only defiling the holy by coming in contact with it while unclean is. And yes the bath is needed before the dusk, or you wait another whole day. And the Hebrews lived in the desert, so no they certainly did not do anything as wasteful as bathing every day...

Yeah, I've read that far in the bible....I was very confused when I heard that people took that to mean "don't masturbate" when it clearly had nothing to do with that.
and obviously, they don't bathe every day, which is why I said by today's standards. It seems pointless to me to ask what they shoulkd do then rather than what we should do now.

Meh .... cut out the middle man .... have it sucked in church.

Here's some food for thought.

According to this rabbi: http://judaism.about.com/library/2_sex/bl_boteach_d.htm

A progressive Jewish Rabbi.....cool!! :)

Although I am not Jewish, I cannot disagree.......

Goed said,
Well, that, and some guys don't want to kiss a girl that just had dick in her mouth. Even if it was their dick.

And those guys should never, ever, ever get head!

A progressive Jewish Rabbi

Most of them are.

A couple preparing for a religious conversion meets with the orthodox rabbi for their final session.

The rabbi asks if they have any final questions.

The man asks, 'Is it true that men and women don't dance together?'

'Yes,' says the rabbi, 'For modesty reasons, men and women dance separately.'

'So I can't dance with my own wife?'

'No.'

'Well, okay,' says the man, 'But what about sex?'

'Fine,' says the rabbi. 'A mitzvah within the marriage!'

'What about different positions?' the man asks.

'No problem,' says the rabbi.

'Woman on top?' the man asks.

'Why not?' replies the rabbi.

'How about doggie-style?'

'Of course!'

'Well, what about standing up?'

'NO!' says the rabbi....

'Why Not???' asks the man.

'Could lead to dancing!'LOL!!

A progressive Jewish Rabbi.....cool!! :)

Although I am not Jewish, I cannot disagree.......

Actually, this guy's Orthodox. Progressive on some issues, though (although he has, for instance, come out against pornography).

Most of them are.

Meh. Depends on the issue. ;) A lot of the ones you hear about certainly are.