NationStates Jolt Archive

Does not matter if you are a democrat or in GOP.

I think it is Jimmy. But he is a great ex-president probiley the best ever.

I think it is Jimmy. But he is a great ex-president probiley the best ever.

He wasn't well liked, but he was still a good one. People didn't like him because he made unpopular decisions. Like saving oil by reducing the speed limit to 55. He improved the relations with China as well.

Hm, I can't think of other things ATM. I dont' have the memory for it.

Was Harding a Democrat?

Jackson.

Can we say "Asshole Tyrant?"

Was Harding a Democrat?

No, he was a Republican.

I think the worst Democratic President (and worst President, period) is FDR, followed very closely by Woodrow Wilson (tied with Abe Lincoln, even though he ain't a Democrat), followed very, very, very closely by Truman-G.W. Bush.

Unbelievable! Nobody else voted for FDR!? :eek:

Jackson.

Can we say "Asshole Tyrant?"

"Asshole Tyrant."

Who the hec voted for FDR?

Who the hec voted for FDR?

I did! :D

Are you stupid or what?

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Are you stupid or what?

What the hell does stupidity have to do with not liking FDR?

Why don't you like FDR?

Why don't you like FDR?

One moment, please. I'll return with a list of recommended books.

R-B, even Reagan liked FDR. He was, hands down, the best President of the last hundred years. It's not even close.

For worst, I'd probably go with someone like Millard Fillmore or James Buchanan--people who let the divide between the north and south fester, ignoring it until it finally exploded in open warfare.

Jimmy Carter Enough said!

Wall Street and F.D.R. by Antony C. Sutton (New Rochelle, NY: Arlington House, 1975) ;

"Hearings, House of Representatives, Select Committee to Investigate Certain
Statements of Dr. William Wirt," 73rd Congress, 2nd Session, April 10 and 17,
1934 (Washington: Government Printing Office, 1934);

The Web of Subversion by James Burnham (Boston: Western Islands, 1965);

Red Scare or Red Menace? American Communism and Anticommunism in the Cold War Era by John E. Haynes (Chicago: Ivan R. Dee, 1996);

Infamy: Pearl Harbor and Its Aftermath by John Toland (Garden City, NY: Doubleday, 1982);

Perpetual War For Perpetual Peace, Harry Elmer Barnes, ed. (Caldwell, ID: Caxton, 1953);

Back Door to War, The Roosevelt Foreign Policy, 1933-1941 by Charles Callan Tansill (Chicago: Henry Regnery, 1952);

The Roosevelt Myth by John Flynn;

A Man Called Intrepid by William Stevenson;

Day of Deceit: The Truth about FDR and Pearl Harbor by Robert B. Stinnett;

The New Dealer’s War by Thomas Fleming;

FDR’s Folly: How Roosevelt and his New Deal Prolonged the Great Depression by Jim Powell;

The Final Secret of Pearl Harbor by Rear Admiral Robert O. Theobald (Old Greenwich, Connecticut: Devin-Adair, 1954)

R-B, even Reagan liked FDR. He was, hands down, the best President of the last hundred years. It's not even close.

For worst, I'd probably go with someone like Millard Fillmore or James Buchanan--people who let the divide between the north and south fester, ignoring it until it finally exploded in open warfare.

Incertonia, you are by far one of my favorite posters in NS. Not once have I seen you flame before. When you disagree, you do intelligently and courteously. Thanks.

Unbelievable! Nobody else voted for FDR!? :eek:
No, because most other people seem to think that saving the country is a GOOD thing. Go figure.

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No, because most other people seem to think that saving the country is a GOOD thing. Go figure.

Well, thanks for at least disagreeing without flaming. (Wish I could say the same for myself sometimes...:headbang: )

bump.

It's amazing that some people can rip on FDR for getting the US into a war while simultaneously praising GW Bush for doing just the same.

Roach are you a republican?

It's amazing that some people can rip on FDR for getting the US into a war while simultaneously praising GW Bush for doing just the same.

I never praised Bush.

Roach are you a republican?

Absolutely not.

(Please don't call me Roach)

One of the many differences between FDR and Bush Jr. is that FDR declared war on the people that actually attack us.

What are you and what do I call you then?

I also voted for FDR. Saving the country. Ha. He prolonged the Depression for 10 years with his huge expansions of Government, his short-sighted job creation (if you call the CCC creating real jobs), his ending of the gold standard and subsequent devaluing of the US Dollar, his unconstitutional (as ruled by the Supreme Court in 1937) National Recovery Act, his "bank holidays", his creation of Social Security, the biggest pyramid scheme in US history, and the list goes on and on...

I think the worst Democratic President (and worst President, period) is FDR, followed very closely by Woodrow Wilson (tied with Abe Lincoln, even though he ain't a Democrat)
How could you consider Lincoln a bad president?! The man held the country together and liberated the slaves (even though that was really more of an inevitable consequence of the Abolitionist movement). He was a great man.

What are you and what do I call you then?

You can call me RB or Roach-Busters, if you'd like. I don't really belong to any political party.

I'd have to say Andrew Johnson, Lincoln's successor, but Jimmy Carter made a mess of things, LBJ gave us his Great Society, and FDR had a good foreign policy but created the welfare monster. Bill Clinton gutted the military and acted generally liberal.

How could you consider Lincoln a bad president?! The man held the country together and liberated the slaves (even though that was really more of an inevitable consequence of the Abolitionist movement). He was a great man.

First of all, you have my absolute thanks for disagreeing without flaming. Thanks! (Admittedly, though, I flame from time to time, but that's only because I sometimes have a short fuse)

However, far from holding the country together, he literally tore it apart. And the only reason he freed the slaves was to economically cripple the South (note that the Emancipation Proclamation only applied to states that had seceded from the Union).

But as I said, everyone is entitled to their opinion, and I respect all opinions, particularly when they are presented respectfully, as yours was. Thanks again.

I never praised Bush.

I didn't say you in particular do. But alot of people do what I said.

I didn't say you in particular do. But alot of people do what I said.

I know you didn't, I was just clarifying that for anyone else who might have implied I did.

This is probably the shittiest thread I've ever seen in any forum.

RB why do you think FDR was a bad President? Correct me if I am wrong but weren't we a more ecomically and millitarly (I know I screwed that up I think) off when he left then when he went in. Also didn't we come out a world power?

I also voted for FDR. Saving the country. Ha. He prolonged the Depression for 10 years with his huge expansions of Government...
Right, because the best way to handle the Depression is to roll back Government and do nothing in the hope that things will eventually sort themselves out. Sure. That makes perfect sense. :rolleyes:

Right, because the best way to handle the Depression is to roll back Government and do nothing in the hope things will eventually sort themselves out. Sure. That makes perfect sense. :rolleyes:
Point: CRA. Well-said. ;)

I'm going to defend a couple of people getting some grief on this poll here.

Andrew Johnson was put into an impossible situation. He was a southern Democrat who ascended to the Presidency with a hostile Republican congress that was bent on exacting a pound of flesh from the recently defeated south. He did what he could to continue Lincoln's policies, but was hammered at every turn by a Congress that considered him illegitimate. He wasn't incompetent so much as he was just in an impossible situation.

Carter was in much the same boat as far as having a situation out of his control. The economy was what sunk Carter, but the biggest part of what afflicted the economy was beyond Carter's control. The oil embargo by OPEC was what did Carter in. Think about this for a second: in today's dollars, oil prices in the late 70s were around $80 a barrel. We're having shitfits now because oil is over $40 a barrel--just imagine if you were paying $4.00 a gallon for gas today. How much spending money would you have after filling up your car to go to work--and remember, this was in the days where economy cars were rare. Carter instituted conservation programs and CAFE standards in order to help combat our dependence on foreign oil. OPEC ended the embargo right around the time Reagan took over, oil proces plummeted, and all of a sudden people had money to spend again. The economy took off, and Carter got the blame for the previous stagnation.

RB why do you think FDR was a bad President? Correct me if I am wrong but weren't we a more ecomically and millitarly (I know I screwed that up I think) off when he left then when he went in. Also didn't we come out a world power?

If I'm not mistaken, we became a world power at the time the Spanish-American War ended. I think FDR was a bad President because, whether he meant to or not, he may have actually prolonged the Depression, rather than alleviated it. His gestapo-like internment of the Japanese-Americans bothers me also. Not to mention his deliberate provokation of the Japanese so they would attack Pearl Harbor and force us into the war. His cuddly relationship with Stalin, and his betrayal of Poland, China, etc. The enormous military and economic aid which he gave to the USSR, helping it become a world superpower. His refusal to aid anti-Hitler Germans, instead only accepting 'unconditional surrender' (which drastically prolonged the war), etc.

FDR's spending 10 billion when revenues were only 3 billion is a bit much, don't you think? The thing is expanding the government didn't exactly cure the country from Depression (World War II and the huge demand for new goods did). With a more lassiez-faire attitude, we would have been out of it much quicker.

I'm going to defend a couple of people getting some grief on this poll here.

Andrew Johnson was put into an impossible situation. He was a southern Democrat who ascended to the Presidency with a hostile Republican congress that was bent on exacting a pound of flesh from the recently defeated south. He did what he could to continue Lincoln's policies, but was hammered at every turn by a Congress that considered him illegitimate. He wasn't incompetent so much as he was just in an impossible situation.

Carter was in much the same boat as far as having a situation out of his control. The economy was what sunk Carter, but the biggest part of what afflicted the economy was beyond Carter's control. The oil embargo by OPEC was what did Carter in. Think about this for a second: in today's dollars, oil prices in the late 70s were around $80 a barrel. We're having shitfits now because oil is over $40 a barrel--just imagine if you were paying $4.00 a gallon for gas today. How much spending money would you have after filling up your car to go to work--and remember, this was in the days where economy cars were rare. Carter instituted conservation programs and CAFE standards in order to help combat our dependence on foreign oil. OPEC ended the embargo right around the time Reagan took over, oil proces plummeted, and all of a sudden people had money to spend again. The economy took off, and Carter got the blame for the previous stagnation.

Again, good points! :)

Either Jackson or Johnson.

Jackson because he defiled the american governmental system by refusing to obey the Supreme Court and its ruling that allowed the Cherokees to stay in Georgia, or Johnson because he destroyed Reconstruction.

I believe that Martin VanBuren was the worst president. He was the 8th president, and didn't do anything about a horrible economy, and juggled with practically everything.

You know some things you just can't stop and the depression was one. He could only try to make it easier.

Yep Jimmy carter for sure. Bill clinton and most of these guys suck(ed) though so heh. Grover rules hehe

Yep Jimmy carter for sure. Bill clinton and most of these guys suck(ed) though so heh. Grover rules hehe

Agreed! :D

definatly the worst of the modern presidents but also the worst democrat president at least since james buchanan who ushered in the civil war and was not present in the poll. He let the southern states leave the union and did not take military action. He shovled the problem on to president lincoln. even so, we have yet to have a president since carter who hasnt had to deal with multiple things that he screwed up.....

I voted for Carter... he was a much better foreign relations man than world leader. He did more not being President than he did being it.

Worst: Andrew Johnson. His horrific mis-handling of reconstruction resulted in the worsening of race problems in the US. Instead of healing the nation, reconstruction, as carried out by Johnson, and the southern reaction, deepened the racial and regional rifts and set the stage for another century of racism and a cycle of black poverty that is still a major disruptive force in US society today. I won't pretend that Lincoln's reconstruction would have been perfect (the man was certainly a racist), but it almost certainly would not have caused the backlash that Johnson's did. Much of the enmity could have been avoided or lessened if a slower, less radical, and less vindictive policy of reconstruction had been carried out.

Second Worst: James Buchanan. His poor handling aggrivated and inflamed seccessionists and abolitionists, and his inaction when states began to secceed was nothing short of criminal neglect and led directly to the civil war.

Third and Fourth Worst: a toss up between Lyndon Johnson and Franklin Roosevelt. FDR's New Deal and monitary policy not only prolonged the Great Depression, but set up unconstitutional (http://members.tripod.com/~GOPcapitalist/constitution.html) social welfare. As for Johnson, aside from his mismanagement of Vietnam, his Great Society program solidified the destructive welfare trap.

Ranking Our Presidents (http://216.239.57.104/search?q=cache:7D-NVmbehhoJ:ragz-international.com/pres.pdf+%22worst+presidents%22+list+buchanan+johnson+historians&hl=en) An interesting article on the worst fro, Washington to Clinton

I'd have to say Jackson, but that's just me not liking what they guy did in office.

Jackson gets my vote. His dealings with native americans makes me twitch. I also find no redeeming quality in him. I label him a monster.
FDR did a similar thing with japanese american internment, but I admire many of the redeeming(in my opinion) things he did or tried to do. Ultimately I think we're better off for having him so i cant say he was near the worst. He's the sort of diabolical and manipulative self serving entity I refer to as a politician. The more you know, the more you hate. The more you get, the more you forgive.

in my own lifetime i would have to say linden bane of the bar b q johnson was the worst and most dissappointing of
democrats, though he did give college students food stamps
and actualy made it possible for people who had been out
of work for a long time to get back into decent jobs. but
for the most part he was twiddle de dee to his identical
twiddle de dum republican berry goldwater he ran against
doing pretty much just exactly what goldwater said he was
going to do and got defeated for saying. no i wouldn't have
wanted to have seen goldwater instead. would have been
mostly the exact same thing. twiddle de dee and twiddle de
dum. johnson could have brought rationality and morality
to the situation we'd gotten draged into in viet nam but he
didn't and exerbated the problem instead.

where andrew jackson or harry trueman democrats?

andrew jackson certainly led a war of the rich against the
poor much as raygun did only domesticly much bloodier
but i didn't think the democratic party at that time as yet
existed, jackson led what was basicly a hitler like
holocaust against indiginous americans. a detail domestic
gradeschool history books have generaly tended to gloss over
but i don't see how he could have been a democrat if the
democratic party didn't exist yet which as far as i've ever
heard that i can recall it didn't yet. and don't forget
tyler and a bunch of others, even grant were in on that game

there were some rather unpleasant types claiming democratic
affiliation in the old segrigated south from the end of
the civil war right up to the time kennidy sent in the
troups. but i don't think the republicans during that time
have all that much better of a track record there either.

also i've always thought that give em hell buck stops here
truman was a republican and the only one elected
(as u.s. president) who was worth a dam.

jimi carter was the only u.s. president in my lifetime
so far to NOT make me ashaimed to call mayself an american

JFK was my man, even if i was too young to vote when he was
nominated.

and FDR's 'socialism' was the only thing that saved
capotilism's ass

(FDR and Truman were both before my time.)

well there was good and bad about every last one of them.
there was at least some good along with a lot of bad to
most of the republicans as well
even raygun stopped the mentaly challanged from being
treated like criminals, though he was otherwise a trator
and a tyrannt and the prototype for mr shrubbery in whome
i've yet to find any redeaming good what so ever

=^^=
.../\...

I think the worst Democratic President (and worst President, period) is FDR

How can you say that? im not american but FDR created the modern US. If it wasn't for him the USA would be no where near the levels of power it has today, he brought the US out of isolationism and artificially stimulated the economy by subsidisng the growth of grain and then dumping it into the sea (common practice today) and brought the us to such a degree of manufacturing power that it dominated the post-WW2 economy and is only now being effectivly challenged.