NationStates Jolt Archive

I think that a lot of Americans have this idea that different countries in Europe (not going to name names) dislike the American people.

I'm a little confused because I have heard a lot of different things...
Is it that many of you dislike the American people? or the American Government?

I think the people are some of the greatest but the goverment is one of the worst.

I like both.

I think that the reson we think that is because a blanket term is used … people don’t differentiate between government and people … we hear just a lot of negative “amercanism”

Gets us defensive some I think :) specially us younger folk who are just like “I am 14 … there is not a hell of a lot I can do about it right now” lol (I am older now but not too far from youth)

Americans are fine, the government ... george isnt the Brighest around. I especially hate him for his comment in Turkye "I think the EU should give you a date ..."

I think that a lot of Americans have this idea that different countries in Europe (not going to name names) dislike the American people.

I'm a little confused because I have heard a lot of different things...
Is it that many of you dislike the American people? or the American Government?
I hate America's president and administration + the PNAC + the people of America who are too lazy to inform themselves about what is going on in the world.

I hate America's president and administration + the PNAC + the people of America who are too lazy to inform themselves about what is going on in the world.

Not going to flame...but isn't that a tad bit stereotypical, which would mean that you've fallen into the same trap you are accusing all Americans of doing?

I hate European government and European people...

I hate European government and European people...
I hate racists and I hate you.

Im no racist, but Euros tend to hate Americans so it is only natural for me to hate them back.

Im no racist, but Euros tend to hate Americans so it is only natural for me to hate them back.
They hate Americans because of the government.

They hate Americans because of the government.

No, I think they hate just about anything American in general.

Not long ago the French spat on Lance Armstrong in the Tour de France, and I expect Europeans to boo American atheletes in the Olympics as well.

I believe he was responding to the person that sadi he hated Lazy Americans who don't inform themsleves about the world.

No, I think they hate just about anything American in general.

Not long ago the French spat on Lance Armstrong in the Tour de France, and I expect Europeans to boo American atheletes in the Olympics as well.
Freedom fries, anyone?! That's all I'm going to say...

Im no racist, but Euros tend to hate Americans so it is only natural for me to hate them back.

I wish I could find this hatred. Paris doesn't count! ;)

Most Europeans (A Euro is money) I have come across are rather pleasent.

There are political debates and some have gotten heated but hate? Nahh sorry....

I think the media plays a strong role. They only show what they want to show... Think about it.

Ah, it doesn't matter which forums you visit, there is always a thread about Americans wondering why people hate you. The simple answer is, we don't, you just think we do.

I can't speak for Europe as a whole as we're a very diverse conglomeration of cultures.

Up here in the north of Europe at least, I don't think there's any hate towards the US at all.

Right now I think a lot of people are uncomfortable or amused by the foreign policy of the current US administration. This is a temporary phenomenon, I believe, and when US policies go back to more moderate ones, this will change back to normal. By and large I think the US is still perceived to be the good guys over here. ;)

And here we go again...

A#1:" Do you Europeans hate americans?"
E#1:" Not especially. Some of us think your president sucks a tad bit though"
A#2:" My friends aunt saw a poll showing you are anti-american, besides, hate our president and you hate us all"
E#2:"It's not only the president, neo-cons are to blame. Besides, americans are arrogant and their press misleads them."
A#3:" I hate all europeans cos they hate all of us!"
.
.
(why don't i just save you some time and tell you how this thread is going to end...)
.
.
A22ish:" We saved your asses twice! Show some gratitude!!!"
E22ish:" The French, Dutch, you name it helped you to gain your independence in the 1st place!!"
.
.
A#n:" You Euro-trash biatches, we could invade your puny continent with one strike"
E#n:" Yea, well, FY too! Go ahead, try!"

This seems to be the standard sandbox-debate pattern.

(To answer the initial question: I would guess most Europeans have other things in mind than all-consuming hate towards americans. Well, at least that's the case in my immediate surroundings.)

I think that if most people are true to themselves, then they will acknowledge that they dislike America as an entity- the policies of the Government are incredibly unpopular, and so there is a backlash against the people, because they voted these politicians into power! The endless stories of corporate America abusing just about everyone they can set many people's teeth on edge- yet probably 1% of the American nation has any influence over this.

However, it is interesting, that in a BBC program last year, where 1000 people from 20 countries were interviewed about all aspects of America, every single country asked thought that America was a greater threat to World Peace than Al-Qaeda, China or North Korea( and one of the countries participating was South Korea!). When Americans consistently elect uncharismatic and unthinking leaders (why do people claim Clinton had charisma?! All he had was an appetite for interns!), who tell Turkey that they think that they should be admitted to the EU, then people are bound to be angered by this.

Hatred of America is not hatred of the people, it is hatred of those who have the power, in a, frankly, highly undemocratic country (hence America being a republic, rather than a democracy). Even a written constitution means that America is less democratic (I would explain why, but hopefully you all understand anyway, and it would probably take me a few hours to type out the full reasoning).

And here we go again...

*SNIP*



You Euro-trash biatches, we could invade your puny continent with one strike!

:p

You Euro-trash biatches, we could invade your puny continent with one strike!

:p
Yeah, well, FY! Go ahead, try!

*ahem* ;)

More seriously, though... I'm one European that's almost ready to become an American... (my American fiancee is anxiously waiting for me).

Saying you hate Europeans because they hate you is like saying you hate food because that one burger you once ate made you sick. There's a couple hundred million Europeans out here who can't be bothered to even spare the US a thought, let alone waste their time hating Americans for whatever reason. Yeah, so some a**holes spat on mr. Armstrong... you don't think a lot of other Europeans feel a bit of shame about that?

Do not confuse the people with the state... because, well, hey... Europe isn't a country, it's a bunch of countries. There's enough hate among us already. (Holland vs germany, for example, and I still want my grandfather's bike back, dammit!)

There has existed anti-americanism in europe for more than a century. Americans are often portrayed as caricatures, a simple and stupid folk. Americans are stupid, americans don't know anything about the world outside the US, amricans don't give a shit about the world. These are common exclamaitions among in certain environments, and mostly among socialists.

However, if you ask a person the direct question, you will almost always get the answer. No, I don't hate americans, it's just the government. And it's just because of the way you act in Iraq, or it was the Kyoto agreement. Before it was the Vietnam. There was always a good reason, and there always will be. Because there is an anti-americanism deeply embedded in European culture. The only thing that changes is the current excuse use for expressing the hatred.

Personally I neither hate nor love the USA or its people.

I'll admit I was a bit out of line when I said I hated all Europeans, I mainly just don't like the French...

Kryozerkia, I hope you aren't implying that the French hate Americans because of Freedom Fries? The French hate fast food so I would think they would take it as a compliment that we took their name off of a fast food product.

Anyway, that was just in good fun, the American "hatred" of the French people was mainly in good fun, however American hatred in France is a sport.

While Americans may make remarks about French military accomplishments they don't go as far as the Frenchies do.

The French spit on American athletes, wear "I hate America" shirts, hang "Wanted" signs of President Bush with the words "war criminal" below them, and do all they can to demean the American people.

For Americans French hating is just the popular thing to do, in France, American hating is a passion.

It isn't because Bush is president, hatred of America has been a sport for years in France, and it doesn't look like things will change.

And yes, we did save them in two world wars....

And yes, we did save them in two world wars....



Euh... never heard about the real war on the easteren fronnt where complete army groups fought instead off the luxury western front? ;)

US only came in because the war was allready fought by the Russians and the Commonwealth. Withouth the US, the USSR would have reached the Atlantic coast in late '45. Typical Urban myth and overestimating of the US role in both wars (in 1918, they really were a tourist attraction on the front in France, they were so few...).

Thanks to Brits that held out allone until Pearl and even after it..

Euh... never heard about the real war on the easteren fronnt where complete army groups fought instead off the luxury western front? ;)

US only came in because the war was allready fought by the Russians and the Commonwealth. Withouth the US, the USSR would have reached the Atlantic coast in late '45. Typical Urban myth and overestimating of the US role in both wars (in 1918, they really were a tourist attraction on the front in France, they were so few...).

Thanks to Brits that held out allone until Pearl and even after it..

1. Yes, the Eastern Front held most of the German divisions, but without Lend Lease the Russians would have never made it that far.

In case you didn't know what all the US did in WWII, allow me to explain.

The US gave the USSR:

Ships- 595 ships, including 28 frigates, 105 submarines, 77 trawlers, 22 torpedo boats, 140 anti-submarine vessels and others

Planes- 4,952 Aerocobras, 2,410 Kingcobra fighter planes, 2,700 A-20 and 861 B-25 bomber planes.

Tanks- 7,056 tanks of all types.

Anti-aircraft guns[/i- 8,218 anti-aircraft emplacements

[i]Guns- 131,600 machine guns and other arms

During the WWII years, the USA delivered defense technology in the sum of $46 billion to the countries of the anti-Hitler coalition.

The costs made up 13 percent of America's defense spending. Keep in mind that we gave $30.3 billion to England, enough to keep their war effort going.

The Soviet Union received defense technology in the sum of $9.8 billion, France $1,4 billion and China $631 million. In total, the USA supplied arms to 42 countries.

By the way, the US shipped 3 million tons of steel to the USSR during the WWII years, enough to produce 70,000 T-34 tanks.

With the possible exception of the USSR the US did more to win WWII than any other country, keep in mind we lost over 400,000 soldiers too, while also maintaining our own war effort.

2. The US in WWI was a tourist attraction? Check your history, US bodies made the difference in WWI.

You said the US sent in very few troops? Well obviously they sent in enough for the Marines to be nicknamed the Teufelhunde, or Devil Dogs by the Germans. They also won the respect of the French people and their bravery was well known by the Germans.

Keep in mind that the US lost over 100,000 soldiers in WWI.

Have you forgotten the reception the US soldiers got in Paris when Pershing strolled threw in 1918?

Yes, the US saved the French twice, the British didnt have the resources.

Now back on topic....as I have proven the US war effort and that the US saved France twice, why are the French, Brits, and Ruskies so ungrateful?

Uhm. No. I don't hate America.

(FYI im dutch)

When I think of American people, I do think that they think that America is best. Oh yeah, they are proud of their country because everything there is bigger and better. Their government is quite arrogant, too. I see America as Big and bossy, though I do have signifant respect for it. Oh yeah :) they really deserve to be respected... Americans somehow are not the extreme one or other, though somehow I tend to see them as corrupt capitalists (not that I like communism) though they should not be so warlike!!! Stop the wars and keep your nose out of buissnesses not your own! That is my adivse to all Americans ;)

And maybe... care a bit much foor the poorer ones around you, eh? :D

As a Briton, I'm really supposed to float in the middle of the Atlantic somewhere and support both Europe and America (prepare for numerous attacks on Tony Blair, Britain's foreign policy, Britain following America's every wish etc from the European left...), but I have to say that I'm not a huge fan of the United States. Having visited many, many times, I've found the people to be rude, aggressive, selfish and ignorant. While I'm aware that this is also the case in some of Europe (note London and Paris), it seems to be nation-wide in the United States. I do realise that I'm generalising and I'm likely going to be shouted down for having said that, but it's simply my own personal experience. As for the Government, a people who don't bother to try to enforce democracy in the ‘shining example of democracy’ and allow for an undemocratic idiot-president to take charge, don't seem to have any political high-ground over anyone in Europe and, indeed, many countries throughout the world. America is an undemocratic (see above comments on written constitution etc), conservative (note: no capital 'c') and unsympathetic country driven solely by national self-interest without a care or interest in the beliefs, opinions and attitudes of the rest of the world.

With regards to the ‘we saved you in the wars’ comment, I'm glad other people realise that America did bugger all in the First World War and, after dithering about the true evil intentions of Herr Hitler and his Gang, tried to push their weight about in Europe and Asia while selling her allies to the dogs (note America’s betrayal of Britain over, for example, atomic weaponry). It was Britain, the British Empire and France who won the First World War; America decided to join in for the victory celebrations at the end and it was Britain, the Empire (and sacrifice thereof) and the U.S.S.R. who won the Second World War. Granted, America helped more in the Second World War but they did not save us, nor the French, nor the Dutch, nor the Germans, nor the Italians.

Having said all of that, though, I still believe strongly in the ‘Special Relationship’ between my own nation and America, and our ‘other special relationship’ with all them funny Europeans and their funny little ways. Long my Great Britain straddle the Atlantic. I mean, if it weren’t for Great Britain, the Frogs and Yanks (French and Americans) would never speak to one another again.

We don't hate you: We have a serious dislike for your leaders (I hold Blair in only slightly higher regard, by way of comparison) and the characateurs (sp?) of arrogance and ignorance. By and large most Europeans couldn't give a toss about you either way until you do or say something stupid.

Hell, Europeans are busy disliking each other.

No, I think they hate just about anything American in general.

Not long ago the French spat on Lance Armstrong in the Tour de France, and I expect Europeans to boo American atheletes in the Olympics as well.Don't go slandering the French like that. It was some Germans who spat on Armstrong.

As a Briton, I'm really supposed to float in the middle of the Atlantic somewhere and support both Europe and America (prepare for numerous attacks on Tony Blair, Britain's foreign policy, Britain following America's every wish etc from the European left...), but I have to say that I'm not a huge fan of the United States. Having visited many, many times, I've found the people to be rude, aggressive, selfish and ignorant. While I'm aware that this is also the case in some of Europe (note London and Paris), it seems to be nation-wide in the United States. I do realise that I'm generalising and I'm likely going to be shouted down for having said that, but it's simply my own personal experience. As for the Government, a people who don't bother to try to enforce democracy in the ‘shining example of democracy’ and allow for an undemocratic idiot-president to take charge, don't seem to have any political high-ground over anyone in Europe and, indeed, many countries throughout the world. America is an undemocratic (see above comments on written constitution etc), conservative (note: no capital 'c') and unsympathetic country driven solely by national self-interest without a care or interest in the beliefs, opinions and attitudes of the rest of the world.

With regards to the ‘we saved you in the wars’ comment, I'm glad other people realise that America did bugger all in the First World War and, after dithering about the true evil intentions of Herr Hitler and his Gang, tried to push their weight about in Europe and Asia while selling her allies to the dogs (note America’s betrayal of Britain over, for example, atomic weaponry). It was Britain, the British Empire and France who won the First World War; America decided to join in for the victory celebrations at the end and it was Britain, the Empire (and sacrifice thereof) and the U.S.S.R. who won the Second World War. Granted, America helped more in the Second World War but they did not save us, nor the French, nor the Dutch, nor the Germans, nor the Italians.

Having said all of that, though, I still believe strongly in the ‘Special Relationship’ between my own nation and America, and our ‘other special relationship’ with all them funny Europeans and their funny little ways. Long my Great Britain straddle the Atlantic. I mean, if it weren’t for Great Britain, the Frogs and Yanks (French and Americans) would never speak to one another again.


Ok, let's see what you posted here....

1. We're aggressive, selfish, and ignorant? I agree Americans meet that description, but then again every nation that was the most powerful at one time was aggressive, selfish, and ignorant.

I'm sure the British people were aggressive, selfish, and ignorant at the height of their power? France isn't even that strong but they are aggressive, selfish, and ignorant for crying out loud....

As for the Government, a people who don't bother to try to enforce democracy in the ‘shining example of democracy’ and allow for an undemocratic idiot-president to take charge, don't seem to have any political high-ground over anyone in Europe and, indeed, many countries throughout the world.

2. Thank you for proving my point. In one of my posts I said that French fliers with cruel words about Mr. Bush were posted all over Paris, and now you confirm that by calling him an idiot.

To date I havent seen an Anti-Chirac flier, and I don't think I have seen an American call Blair an "idiot". I don't mind you saying you didn't like him, but calling him an "idiot", just wasn't necessary.

Keep in mind that an idiot is someone with an IQ lower than 30, do you really believe Bush is that stupid?

Also, he didn't "take charge", he was voted in by the people of the US, a perfect example of democracy.

Next.

America is an undemocratic (see above comments on written constitution etc), conservative (note: no capital 'c') and unsympathetic country driven solely by national self-interest without a care or interest in the beliefs, opinions and attitudes of the rest of the world.

3. Yes, and Britain is a monachary of people with bad teeth and funny accents. Your use of name calling is quickly discredting your post.

It was Britain, the British Empire and France who won the First World War;...

4. After four years of war Britain and France hadn't gained anything, then America joined and the war was over within months.

Quincidence right?

America decided to join in for the victory celebrations at the end...

LoL, cute.

the Empire (and sacrifice thereof) and the U.S.S.R. who won the Second World War. Granted, America helped more in the Second World War but they did not save us, nor the French, nor the Dutch, nor the Germans, nor the Italians.

5. Did you even read my post? Look at the numbers that the US provided the Soviets in WWII in my above post and tell me how well the USSR would've done without US support.

You seem to believe that the Brits did a lot in WWII, no offense to British vets but other than helping out America early on, they really didn't accomplish much.

But then again, the Supreme Allied Commander wasn't British was he? Tell me, if the Brits did so much in WWII why didn't they, instead of the US, emerge as the most powerful nation in the world?

I mean, if it weren’t for Great Britain, the Frogs and Yanks (French and Americans) would never speak to one another again

LoL, whatever makes you happy.

And yes, the Brits could have never freed France, that was a Yankee effort.

Uhm. No. I don't hate America.

(FYI im dutch)

When I think of American people, I do think that they think that America is best. Oh yeah, they are proud of their country because everything there is bigger and better. Their government is quite arrogant, too. I see America as Big and bossy, though I do have signifant respect for it. Oh yeah :) they really deserve to be respected... Americans somehow are not the extreme one or other, though somehow I tend to see them as corrupt capitalists (not that I like communism) though they should not be so warlike!!! Stop the wars and keep your nose out of buissnesses not your own! That is my adivse to all Americans ;)

And maybe... care a bit much foor the poorer ones around you, eh? :D

You know, if I had to pick a favorite cultural group in Europe, it would have to be the Dutch, you guys are just so darn nice.

However, we Americans like to think of ourselves as the international police force, so it is our job to keep our noses in other peoples business.

Without us being nosey, South Korea would be communist, Japan would rule the Pacific, Afghanistan would be run by the Taliban, and Saddam would be having his fun torturing his people in Iraq.

It is our job to be nosey you know. ;)

Don't go slandering the French like that. It was some Germans who spat on Armstrong.

Oh come on, everyone knows Germans are capable of being that mean! ;)

I'll admit I was a bit out of line when I said I hated all Europeans, I mainly just don't like the French...

Kryozerkia, I hope you aren't implying that the French hate Americans because of Freedom Fries? The French hate fast food so I would think they would take it as a compliment that we took their name off of a fast food product.

Anyway, that was just in good fun, the American "hatred" of the French people was mainly in good fun, however American hatred in France is a sport.

While Americans may make remarks about French military accomplishments they don't go as far as the Frenchies do.

The French spit on American athletes, wear "I hate America" shirts, hang "Wanted" signs of President Bush with the words "war criminal" below them, and do all they can to demean the American people.

For Americans French hating is just the popular thing to do, in France, American hating is a passion.

It isn't because Bush is president, hatred of America has been a sport for years in France, and it doesn't look like things will change.

And yes, we did save them in two world wars....
Europeans hate Americans? That's not true. Most of us fear/don't think much of Bush though. Maybe if you are a Bush supporter you think that Bush=America.

OK, so all French people (not just a crazy little minority, right?) hate all Americans. They hate fast food (which is why McDonalds is successful in France). I have never seen anyone, French or otherwise, wearing an "I hate America" t-shirt.

Have you ever even been to France?

All this lecturing about Europeans hating America is pretty rich coming from a place where the US government officially disparaged Europeans for not supporting the war in Iraq. I didn't hear anything about the French government adopting a position of hating America.

Europeans hate Americans? That's not true. Most of us fear/don't think much of Bush though. Maybe if you are a Bush supporter you think that Bush=America.

OK, so all French people (not just a crazy little minority, right?) hate all Americans. They hate fast food (which is why McDonalds is successful in France). I have never seen anyone, French or otherwise, wearing an "I hate America" t-shirt.

Have you ever even been to France?

All this lecturing about Europeans hating America is pretty rich coming from a place where the US government officially disparaged Europeans for not supporting the war in Iraq. I didn't hear anything about the French government adopting a position of hating America.

No, I don't believe that Bush=America, threw the Clinton years I remained a staunch American nationalist.

As I said earlier, the French have opposed just about anything, they don't just hate Bush you know.

In June 2000, during President Clinton's last year in office, France was the only one of 107 countries to refuse to sign a U.S. initiative aimed at encouraging democracy around the world.

France hates the US, plain and simple, why? The world may never know...

Ok, let's see what you posted here....

1. We're aggressive, selfish, and ignorant? I agree Americans meet that description, but then again every nation that was the most powerful at one time was aggressive, selfish, and ignorant.

I'm sure the British people were aggressive, selfish, and ignorant at the height of their power? France isn't even that strong but they are aggressive, selfish, and ignorant for crying out loud....

As for the Government, a people who don't bother to try to enforce democracy in the ‘shining example of democracy’ and allow for an undemocratic idiot-president to take charge, don't seem to have any political high-ground over anyone in Europe and, indeed, many countries throughout the world.

2. Thank you for proving my point. In one of my posts I said that French fliers with cruel words about Mr. Bush were posted all over Paris, and now you confirm that by calling him an idiot.

To date I havent seen an Anti-Chirac flier, and I don't think I have seen an American call Blair an "idiot". I don't mind you saying you didn't like him, but calling him an "idiot", just wasn't necessary.

Keep in mind that an idiot is someone with an IQ lower than 30, do you really believe Bush is that stupid?

Also, he didn't "take charge", he was voted in by the people of the US, a perfect example of democracy.

Next.

America is an undemocratic (see above comments on written constitution etc), conservative (note: no capital 'c') and unsympathetic country driven solely by national self-interest without a care or interest in the beliefs, opinions and attitudes of the rest of the world.

3. Yes, and Britain is a monachary of people with bad teeth and funny accents. Your use of name calling is quickly discredting your post.

It was Britain, the British Empire and France who won the First World War;...

4. After four years of war Britain and France hadn't gained anything, then America joined and the war was over within months.

Quincidence right?

America decided to join in for the victory celebrations at the end...

LoL, cute.

the Empire (and sacrifice thereof) and the U.S.S.R. who won the Second World War. Granted, America helped more in the Second World War but they did not save us, nor the French, nor the Dutch, nor the Germans, nor the Italians.

5. Did you even read my post? Look at the numbers that the US provided the Soviets in WWII in my above post and tell me how well the USSR would've done without US support.

You seem to believe that the Brits did a lot in WWII, no offense to British vets but other than helping out America early on, they really didn't accomplish much.

But then again, the Supreme Allied Commander wasn't British was he? Tell me, if the Brits did so much in WWII why didn't they, instead of the US, emerge as the most powerful nation in the world?

I mean, if it weren’t for Great Britain, the Frogs and Yanks (French and Americans) would never speak to one another again

LoL, whatever makes you happy.

And yes, the Brits could have never freed France, that was a Yankee effort.



In reply:

[1] I have no doubt that Britons were, and are, all of those things - in fact, I know we are. I was merely stating that, from my own experience, it's worse in the U.S. I did point out that it was my own experience and that I was generalising. I know there are nice Americans out there in the same way there are nice Britons, nice Frenchman and nice Germans.

[2] Two points here: I have seen Anti-Chirac posters and "We hate France" posters throughout the United States. Francophobia - and general hatred of anyone who didn't jump on the war wagon - are common through the U.S. Americans insult our leaders and we insult your leader. Plus, I wouldn't put it past Bush to have an I.Q. lower than 30. You have watched him speak and such, right?
Secondly, President Bush was not democratically elected. To begin with, the American system of Presidential Election is undemocratic. A simple counting of votes would make the system far more democratic and fair. Furthermore, if Bush had been democratically elected, then over half of the votes cast would have been for him, and not for Al Gore. Having friends and relatives in high places to secure office doesn't make for a democracy.

[3] I wasn't name-calling there, I was merely pointing out how the world sees it. Furthermore, what's wrong with having a monarch, exactly? There's no need to have such an Americanised view of the world - republics aren't the only thing to achieve democracy. We manage just fine here in Britain, with the mother of all parliaments, to have a democratic system. The same goes for many European nations - a lot of which have their own monarchs and, yet, remain democratic.

[4] Study history. America joined the war and her troops had barely enough time to engage. We won the war because, basically, Britain - and France - had a stronger economy and ability to mobilise said economy during the war. Germany was starved of resources and, as the Second Reich was politically and socially unstable (i.e. failed revolutions of 1848 and such sort), the Reich collapsed. We would have won the war with or without American support.

[5] I did read your post, and I acknowledged American support and power in the Second World War. I wasn't arguing the fact that America helped Britain and the U.S.S.R.; what I was arguing was the 'we saved you' comments that we so often hear from Americans. Russia, Britain and the British Empire would have had the resources - and, vitally, the manpower - to take on Occupied Europe and win. It may have taken longer and cost far more, but Hitler's Third Reich would not have lasted.
As for your comment on Britain not achieving much, I have to laugh. First off, Britain stood - alone - against all of Occupied Europe until the attack on Pearl Harbour and then had to wait for America to mobilise. We won the wars in Africa - against the infamous Afrika Corps - and, lest we forget, we were very heavily involved in Asia. If America had taken Asia back, she wouldn't have allowed Britain to keep the colonies. Instead, Britain fought through Asia and kept her old colonies. In Europe, British troops worked northwards from Africa through Italy. We provided the first front in Europe, and we - with Americans and Canadians (as well as many others) opened the second on D-Day. Britain made a huge commitment on D-Day; it wasn't all American. Finally, concerning the Home Front, while America basked in the booming economy war brought, Britons - and Europeans - suffered from rationing and aerial bombardment killing thousands. A fact that most Americans seem to have forgot after 11 September: America isn't the only place where aeroplanes have caused such destruction and death.
With regards to your comment on America emerging as the post-war power, that was almost a foregone conclusion. America, with its vast manpower and resources, could outstrip British production after the First World War. Britain, remember, is a relatively small country - about the size of the state of Texas, I believe - with, now, a population of just under some 60 million. In addition, after the war, Britain focused more on improving itself socially (i.e. creation of the N.H.S and of the social welfare state) instead of trying to play catch-up with the U.S. and U.S.S.R. Also, as I already mentioned, America's basic betrayal of Britain after the war did nothing to help our position. America enforced the removal of the Sterling Bloc, suddenly removed lend-lease and worked to ensure American dominance over markets, instead of working to help rebuild and re-stabalise the world market. Then, we were plunged - by no small part - into the Cold War by the Truman Doctrine. God bless America.

No, I don't believe that Bush=America, threw the Clinton years I remained a staunch American nationalist.

As I said earlier, the French have opposed just about anything, they don't just hate Bush you know.

In June 2000, during President Clinton's last year in office, France was the only one of 107 countries to refuse to sign a U.S. initiative aimed at encouraging democracy around the world.

France hates the US, plain and simple, why? The world may never know...


france doesn't hate the us. france happens to be a country which chooses to exercise its national sovereignty... their interests just don't happen to coincide with the us all the time. get over it. we don't rule the world.

Ok First, Shinoxia how old are you? You really need to learn how to spell some words, I have seen so many grammar and spelling errors in your posts its sad.

Now first off I must say the European people in general do not hate the Americans, but rather their government, and I must say sadly quite a few of the people I know are like "Yeah Europeans are a bunch of idiots and I hate them". Then again I and several others I know actually know whats going on and know that Europeans don't ahte us but rather our government, and we ussually tend to agree with them on our government issues. (Note: Most of the people I know are in between the ages of 13-19, I myself am 14) The problem is our people don't have a big choice in our governments elections because of the slim choices we have. It's pretty much the candidate with more money wins.

About the WWI and WWII things, ok in World War one the Europeans played a larger role then the Americans did, Shinoxia it's not just because of us that they won. The reason we had so many casualties in World War one was because of the lack of training that our soilders had. Our men were young teenagers who were eager to join the army and go fight for the right thing. The trench warfare and harsh environments were brutual to our inexperienced men. We lost a lot fewer in World War Two because we knew a little better and we had some battle-hardened men to teach our soilders that time, unlike in World War One. Yes we did donate a lot of resources to the warfund, but do you know how much the Europeans put into it? You can't say that we put in a lot without know how much the other side had to waste too.

Oh and Empire in World War One it wasn't the Second Reich ;). It was just a group trying to take over europe.

American hatred in France is a sport.

That's odd...all the French people that I met were extremely nice. Maybe because I wasn't under the impression that they should all speak English to make it easier for me. If anyone thinks the French are rude, try being polite to them first.

That's odd...all the French people that I met were extremely nice. Maybe because I wasn't under the impression that they should all speak English to make it easier for me. If anyone thinks the French are rude, try being polite to them first.

Have you been to Paris? ;)

In reply:

[1] I have no doubt that Britons were, and are, all of those things - in fact, I know we are. I was merely stating that, from my own experience, it's worse in the U.S. I did point out that it was my own experience and that I was generalising. I know there are nice Americans out there in the same way there are nice Britons, nice Frenchman and nice Germans.

[2] Two points here: I have seen Anti-Chirac posters and "We hate France" posters throughout the United States. Francophobia - and general hatred of anyone who didn't jump on the war wagon - are common through the U.S. Americans insult our leaders and we insult your leader. Plus, I wouldn't put it past Bush to have an I.Q. lower than 30. You have watched him speak and such, right?
Secondly, President Bush was not democratically elected. To begin with, the American system of Presidential Election is undemocratic. A simple counting of votes would make the system far more democratic and fair. Furthermore, if Bush had been democratically elected, then over half of the votes cast would have been for him, and not for Al Gore. Having friends and relatives in high places to secure office doesn't make for a democracy.

[3] I wasn't name-calling there, I was merely pointing out how the world sees it. Furthermore, what's wrong with having a monarch, exactly? There's no need to have such an Americanised view of the world - republics aren't the only thing to achieve democracy. We manage just fine here in Britain, with the mother of all parliaments, to have a democratic system. The same goes for many European nations - a lot of which have their own monarchs and, yet, remain democratic.

[4] Study history. America joined the war and her troops had barely enough time to engage. We won the war because, basically, Britain - and France - had a stronger economy and ability to mobilise said economy during the war. Germany was starved of resources and, as the Second Reich was politically and socially unstable (i.e. failed revolutions of 1848 and such sort), the Reich collapsed. We would have won the war with or without American support.

[5] I did read your post, and I acknowledged American support and power in the Second World War. I wasn't arguing the fact that America helped Britain and the U.S.S.R.; what I was arguing was the 'we saved you' comments that we so often hear from Americans. Russia, Britain and the British Empire would have had the resources - and, vitally, the manpower - to take on Occupied Europe and win. It may have taken longer and cost far more, but Hitler's Third Reich would not have lasted.
As for your comment on Britain not achieving much, I have to laugh. First off, Britain stood - alone - against all of Occupied Europe until the attack on Pearl Harbour and then had to wait for America to mobilise. We won the wars in Africa - against the infamous Afrika Corps - and, lest we forget, we were very heavily involved in Asia. If America had taken Asia back, she wouldn't have allowed Britain to keep the colonies. Instead, Britain fought through Asia and kept her old colonies. In Europe, British troops worked northwards from Africa through Italy. We provided the first front in Europe, and we - with Americans and Canadians (as well as many others) opened the second on D-Day. Britain made a huge commitment on D-Day; it wasn't all American. Finally, concerning the Home Front, while America basked in the booming economy war brought, Britons - and Europeans - suffered from rationing and aerial bombardment killing thousands. A fact that most Americans seem to have forgot after 11 September: America isn't the only place where aeroplanes have caused such destruction and death.
With regards to your comment on America emerging as the post-war power, that was almost a foregone conclusion. America, with its vast manpower and resources, could outstrip British production after the First World War. Britain, remember, is a relatively small country - about the size of the state of Texas, I believe - with, now, a population of just under some 60 million. In addition, after the war, Britain focused more on improving itself socially (i.e. creation of the N.H.S and of the social welfare state) instead of trying to play catch-up with the U.S. and U.S.S.R. Also, as I already mentioned, America's basic betrayal of Britain after the war did nothing to help our position. America enforced the removal of the Sterling Bloc, suddenly removed lend-lease and worked to ensure American dominance over markets, instead of working to help rebuild and re-stabalise the world market. Then, we were plunged - by no small part - into the Cold War by the Truman Doctrine. God bless America.


Very nice, a well thought out and organized post. Great for only your second post, well done.

1. True, but I was mainly saying the Brits were very arrogant at the height of the British Empire, so were the French in their time, now is America's time can we not be arrogant?

2. You can argue that all you want, according to our own Constitution, he won fair and square.

3. I think you misunderstood. I was being stereotypical becuase you were stereotypical when you called the US arrogant and warmongers.

4. We joined with enough time to lose 125,000 troops and have the Marines win international renown for their valor in combat. When America joined the war was as it was since it began, a stalemate.

Fresh American troops made the difference, it's a known fact.

5. Are you so sure that Britian and the USSR would have won? Before it had American support financialy the Red Army used obselete equipment, after Lend Lease the Red Army made a full recovery and went on to defeat Germany.

Could they have done that without American dollars?

I have no doubt that Britain would have survived without US support but the 30.8 billion the US gave them bought a lot of planes...

Britain could have made it threw WWII but they never could have helped to free France and Africa without the US.

The British won the wars in Africa? If I remember correctly Rommel considered US General Patton his greatest threat in that theatre.

Your closing statement "God Bless America" is far different from what you said earlier, and I thank you for it...good post.

1. True, but I was mainly saying the Brits were very arrogant at the height of the British Empire, so were the French in their time, now is America's time can we not be arrogant?

Just because others have done the same is not reason to do the same.

2. You can argue that all you want, according to our own Constitution, he won fair and square.

Granted, but when more people vote the other way, then it is undemocratic (bear in mind though, a similar thing has happened twice in Britain in the past 50 years).

4. We joined with enough time to lose 125,000 troops and have the Marines win international renown for their valor in combat. When America joined the war was as it was since it began, a stalemate.

You are ignoring the naval blockade, the critical shortages, the flu epidemic and the over extending of German supply lines.

5. Are you so sure that Britian and the USSR would have won? Before it had American support financialy the Red Army used obselete equipment, after Lend Lease the Red Army made a full recovery and went on to defeat Germany.

Could they have done that without American dollars?

I have no doubt that Britain would have survived without US support but the 30.8 billion the US gave them bought a lot of planes...

Britain could have made it threw WWII but they never could have helped to free France and Africa without the US.

The British won the wars in Africa? If I remember correctly Rommel considered US General Patton his greatest threat in that theatre.

Your closing statement "God Bless America" is far different from what you said earlier, and I thank you for it...good post.
Personallyn I don't think Europe, inc. Britain, could have survived WWII. WWI though, we could have.

Ok First, Shinoxia how old are you? You really need to learn how to spell some words, I have seen so many grammar and spelling errors in your posts its sad.

Now first off I must say the European people in general do not hate the Americans, but rather their government, and I must say sadly quite a few of the people I know are like "Yeah Europeans are a bunch of idiots and I hate them". Then again I and several others I know actually know whats going on and know that Europeans don't ahte us but rather our government, and we ussually tend to agree with them on our government issues. (Note: Most of the people I know are in between the ages of 13-19, I myself am 14) The problem is our people don't have a big choice in our governments elections because of the slim choices we have. It's pretty much the candidate with more money wins.

About the WWI and WWII things, ok in World War one the Europeans played a larger role then the Americans did, Shinoxia it's not just because of us that they won. The reason we had so many casualties in World War one was because of the lack of training that our soilders had. Our men were young teenagers who were eager to join the army and go fight for the right thing. The trench warfare and harsh environments were brutual to our inexperienced men. We lost a lot fewer in World War Two because we knew a little better and we had some battle-hardened men to teach our soilders that time, unlike in World War One. Yes we did donate a lot of resources to the warfund, but do you know how much the Europeans put into it? You can't say that we put in a lot without know how much the other side had to waste too.

Oh and Empire in World War One it wasn't the Second Reich ;). It was just a group trying to take over europe.


Ok First, Shinoxia how old are you? You really need to learn how to spell some words, I have seen so many grammar and spelling errors in your posts its sad.

LoL! I'm from the South and English isn't our best subject here, to answer your question, 15.

Now first off I must say the European people in general do not hate the Americans, but rather their government,...

1. Hmmm, forgive me if I'm wrong but are the members of our government not also citizens of the US?

The government pretty well represents the people as they are elected through a democratic process, so hating them means you would probably hate a large majority of Americans.

Keep in mind that the French hated us before Bush too.

...now that Europeans don't ahte us but rather our government, and we ussually tend to agree with them on our government issues.

2. You already said that, for someone who insults my grammar you seem to make a lot of mistakes yourself.

The problem is our people don't have a big choice in our governments elections because of the slim choices we have. It's pretty much the candidate with more money wins.

3. What does that have to do with Europeans hating us?

. The reason we had so many casualties in World War one was because of the lack of training that our soilders had. Our men were young teenagers who were eager to join the army and go fight for the right thing. The trench warfare and harsh environments were brutual to our inexperienced men.

4. Yes, our troops were rushed into combat but I don't think any amount of training could teach them what to expect from trench warfare?

Yes, our troops, like everyone else's, thought they were doing the right thing.

Yes, warfare is brutal.

You never gave proof on how the Europeans did more in WWI. They were in it longer, but they never really accomplished anything. When America entered, the war was a stalemate, not long after our troops landed, the war was over.

I don't think that was a quiencidence.

Yes we did donate a lot of resources to the warfund, but do you know how much the Europeans put into it?

5. How much did the Euros put in it? Most European countries got conquered, only a handful really did anything?

americans are digging their own grave

buy weapons -- muders -- buy more weapons-- more murders

you know
they are doing it to themself practicly

You never gave proof on how the Europeans did more in WWI. They were in it longer, but they never really accomplished anything. When America entered, the war was a stalemate, not long after our troops landed, the war was over.

I don't think that was a quiencidence.

You are ignoring the epidemic, naval blockade, over extention of German supply lines, social strife and shortages.

You never gave proof on how the Europeans did more in WWI. They were in it longer, but they never really accomplished anything. When America entered, the war was a stalemate, not long after our troops landed, the war was over.

I don't think that was a quiencidence.

Yes we did donate a lot of resources to the warfund, but do you know how much the Europeans put into it?

5. How much did the Euros put in it? Most European countries got conquered, only a handful really did anything?


omg you idiot
if europe hadn't fought back the germans would have landed in america by the time you guys were waking up

and hell
they did fought back you little sh*t

they never conquered our country because we just fought back
altough we were like 10 times smaller and didn't even come close to their army they never won

http://www.geocities.com/~worldwar1/mccrae.html

In Flanders Fields

In Flanders fields the poppies blow
Between the crosses, row on row,
That mark our place; and in the sky
The larks, still bravely singing, fly
Scarce heard amid the guns below.

We are the Dead. Short days ago
We lived, felt dawn, saw sunset glow,
Loved, and were loved, and now we lie
In Flanders fields.

Take up our quarrel with the foe:
To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

I think that a lot of Americans have this idea that different countries in Europe (not going to name names) dislike the American people.

I'm a little confused because I have heard a lot of different things...
Is it that many of you dislike the American people? or the American Government?

I thought i would repost the original idea of the thread.

I have read the entire thread and i notice that a couple of Americans... (a 15 year old in particular)... have taken it upon themselves to 'prove' why the portrayal of Americans is bad throughout Europe.

I am English and i have many American friends. I have a great fondness for the American people. However, if you want the truth and if i may be permitted to generalise momentarily, Americans tend to be seen as Arrogant, Rude and Self-Obsessed. The U.S is known as a nation of hatred, violence, law-suits and lies that tends to think itself better than anyone else.
The whole 'free speech' thing, that America is so proud of (IMHO is not a bad thing but...) tends to offend more 'reserved' nations. Again, I will state that this is purely generalising, and i personally have some very dear friends born and raised in the U.S. who show none of those stereo-types.

BUT...

To say Europe dislikes America is going too far. Europe probably laughs at it more than dislikes it. There is too much internal conflict within Europe itself for us to really be concerned with what you think we think.

However, we Americans like to think of ourselves as the international police force, so it is our job to keep our noses in other peoples business.
And little gems like this, just prove WHY people think the way they do.

It is our job to be nosey you know.
Lol Don't we know it.

[5] I did read your post, and I acknowledged American support and power in the Second World War. I wasn't arguing the fact that America helped Britain and the U.S.S.R.; what I was arguing was the 'we saved you' comments that we so often hear from Americans. Russia, Britain and the British Empire would have had the resources - and, vitally, the manpower - to take on Occupied Europe and win. It may have taken longer and cost far more, but Hitler's Third Reich would not have lasted.
Without America there would never have been a viable British-led western front in Europe. Britain simply did not have enough people to simultaneously defend the home islands and take on the continent. And Empire resources and manpower could not be shipped into Europe without the North Atlantic being first cleared of U-boats by the Americans. That leaves western Europe to be "liberated" by Russia. But I find it extremely laughable that you Europeans would think of Soviets marching from Moscow to the Atlantic coast of France as "liberators." Re-enslavement would be much more appropriate for this trading of Hitler for Stalin. Thus you should be thankful that it was America, not Russia, that liberated Western Europe.

But I am aware and disappointed that the American general Eisenhower betrayed the East Germans when he decided to not march any further than West Germany and let the Soviets occupy and oppress the East.


As for your comment on Britain not achieving much, I have to laugh. First off, Britain stood - alone - against all of Occupied Europe until the attack on Pearl Harbour and then had to wait for America to mobilise.

Britain had just enough strength to survive, but not nearly enough to attack Hitler in the continent. You are right, Britain had to wait (what else could it do, given its limited population and resources?) while the real brunt of the offensive against Germany was prepared by Americans.

Also, it is highly logical that the US waited until Pearl Harbor. Most Americans were simply sick of the Europeans playing their warmongering games for centuries and thought that since your fool Neville Chamberlain willingly got you guys in this mess, why should we involve ourselves in another bloody disaster? This attitude may seem strange in retrospect, but it is highly probable and reasonable given what the Americans knew at the time, having seen the unprecedented slaughter of WWI.

We won the wars in Africa - against the infamous Afrika Corps - and, lest we forget, we were very heavily involved in Asia. If America had taken Asia back, she wouldn't have allowed Britain to keep the colonies. Instead, Britain fought through Asia and kept her old colonies.
That is laughable. The British 11th army in Southeast Asia was nearly annihilated by the Japanese advance into Malaysia and Burma. There was a huge retreat by Britain into India in the early 1940s, and repeated attempts to reconquer Burma were miserable failures. Only because Japan had to relocate its Southeast Asia garrisons to the Japanese home islands to fight off America did Britain finally retake its land. And in the end the Japanese evacuated Singapore and other British colonies without a fight in order to move troops to fight the US, so the British got off easy.

Europeans tend to forget that WWII encompass the whole world, and not just two land fronts in the second smallest continent. You bicker about how America had little to do with winning WWII but America nearly singlehandedly won WWII in the Pacific. The Chinese partisans and British soldiers, though valiant, were mostly ineffective against Japan's huge and well-equipped armies. Only the US could wage the sort of war to take down Japan - island by island, at huge losses. Without the US involved in WWII, China would probably be a colony of Japan and Britain would never see her Asian colonies again.

And if you are trying to place Britain on a higher moral ground than the US then why are you bothered by losing colonies? British colonies by any account were places for rich British imperialists to plunder and destroy native cultures. You forget that thousands of Indian troops switched sides in WWII to fight for the Japanese due to Britain's oppression.


In Europe, British troops worked northwards from Africa through Italy. We provided the first front in Europe, and we - with Americans and Canadians (as well as many others) opened the second on D-Day. Britain made a huge commitment on D-Day; it wasn't all American.
It wasn't all American, but it was mostly American, and without America D-Day would have been an utter impossibility.


With regards to your comment on America emerging as the post-war power, that was almost a foregone conclusion. America, with its vast manpower and resources, could outstrip British production after the First World War. Britain, remember, is a relatively small country - about the size of the state of Texas, I believe - with, now, a population of just under some 60 million. In addition, after the war, Britain focused more on improving itself socially (i.e. creation of the N.H.S and of the social welfare state) instead of trying to play catch-up with the U.S. and U.S.S.R. Also, as I already mentioned, America's basic betrayal of Britain after the war did nothing to help our position. America enforced the removal of the Sterling Bloc, suddenly removed lend-lease and worked to ensure American dominance over markets, instead of working to help rebuild and re-stabalise the world market. Then, we were plunged - by no small part - into the Cold War by the Truman Doctrine. God bless America.
You forget the Marshall Plan and the US' huge investments in Japan to assure stable political and economic systems in Europe and East Asia. Maybe we shot ourselves in the foot, given the popularity of German and Japanese cars here in the US. And concerning the Cold War - your Winston Churchill surely didn't help with his "iron curtain" rhetoric. After WWII Britain rightfully recognized Stalinism's threat and wasn't dragged into the Cold War - it willfully partnered with the US to combat Stalinism in Europe.

You know, if I had to pick a favorite cultural group in Europe, it would have to be the Dutch, you guys are just so darn nice.

However, we Americans like to think of ourselves as the international police force, so it is our job to keep our noses in other peoples business.

Without us being nosey, South Korea would be communist, Japan would rule the Pacific, Afghanistan would be run by the Taliban, and Saddam would be having his fun torturing his people in Iraq.

It is our job to be nosey you know. ;)

But because of us, Afghanistan was run by the Taliban, and Saddam was having his fun torturing his people in Iraq. Each time we had to go in and undo our mistakes. And postwar Japan was ruled for a long time by convicted WWII war criminals, because of our policies. The US should be a lot more careful about what it gets itself into.

Not long ago the French spat on Lance Armstrong in the Tour de France,

Don't you hate it when people bring up examples such as this to back up thier argument. Its like saying - 'When I was in Washington a guy overcharged me for a souvenir - I bet all Americans are like that.'

As for Lance Armstrong - Well I would have paid to see that moment of somebody spitting in that dopers face. Because its pretty evident now from testimony that he is a doper.

You never gave proof on how the Europeans did more in WWI. They were in it longer, but they never really accomplished anything. When America entered, the war was a stalemate, not long after our troops landed, the war was over.

Ok, now if you believe that America was the deciding factor in WWI, you will believe anything - even all that rubbish about America winning WWII (The Glorius USSR destroyed 80% of the German Army!)

American casualties were low in WWI largely because they didn't play that much of a role in turning the tide. By the time they were there The Germans were already on the backfoot.

Ok, now if you believe that America was the deciding factor in WWI, you will believe anything - even all that rubbish about America winning WWII (The Glorius USSR destroyed 80% of the German Army!)

American casualties were low in WWI largely because they didn't play that much of a role in turning the tide. By the time they were there The Germans were already on the backfoot.

You consider over 100,000 dead soldiers low?

Please, please read my posts when you join in a discussion. Yes, the USSR destroyed a great deal of the German Army.

However, the USSR could have never fought Germany successfuly without technology and money donations from the US, look at the stats I posted!

It seems that you will go against the US in anyway you can so I can help but feel I'm wasting my time with you.

But because of us, Afghanistan was run by the Taliban, and Saddam was having his fun torturing his people in Iraq. Each time we had to go in and undo our mistakes. And postwar Japan was ruled for a long time by convicted WWII war criminals, because of our policies. The US should be a lot more careful about what it gets itself into.

Good point, you seem to know what you are talking about but I'm sure you also know how and why these two evil regimes came to power.

You know that the Soviet Union invaded Afghanistan in the 1980s and that we funded Islamic militants so that they could fight back the communists.

Same situation with Saddam.

But yes, our policies could use a tweaking...

Yes we did donate a lot of resources to the warfund, but do you know how much the Europeans put into it?[/i]

5. How much did the Euros put in it? Most European countries got conquered, only a handful really did anything?


omg you idiot
if europe hadn't fought back the germans would have landed in america by the time you guys were waking up

and hell
they did fought back you little sh*t

they never conquered our country because we just fought back
altough we were like 10 times smaller and didn't even come close to their army they never won

http://www.geocities.com/~worldwar1/mccrae.html

In Flanders Fields

In Flanders fields the poppies blow
Between the crosses, row on row,
That mark our place; and in the sky
The larks, still bravely singing, fly
Scarce heard amid the guns below.

We are the Dead. Short days ago
We lived, felt dawn, saw sunset glow,
Loved, and were loved, and now we lie
In Flanders fields.

Take up our quarrel with the foe:
To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

Could someone please tell me what this post means?

You consider over 100,000 dead soldiers low?

Please, please read my posts when you join in a discussion. Yes, the USSR destroyed a great deal of the German Army.

However, the USSR could have never fought Germany successfuly without technology and money donations from the US, look at the stats I posted!

It seems that you will go against the US in anyway you can so I can help but feel I'm wasting my time with you.


yes
100k soldiers is low compared to the us army who were with around 4 mil orso?
compared to belgium a tiny country with (now in 2004) as many inhabitants as newyork

Military Casualties in World War I
1914-1918

Belgium 45,550
British Empire 942,135
France 1,368,000
Greece 23,098
Italy 680,000
Japan 1,344
Montenegro 3,000
Portugal 8,145
Romania 300,000
Russia 1,700,000
Serbia 45,000
United States 116,516
Austria-Hungary 1,200,000
Bulgaria 87,495
Germany 1,935,000
Ottoman Empire 725,000

However, the USSR could have never fought Germany successfuly without technology and money donations from the US, look at the stats I posted!


Excuse me for a minute - I wish to laugh at an American Patriot.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!

100,000 dead soldiers IS low compared to the rest of the nations casualties.

Secondly of the total amount of equipment Russia used during the War, about 1.8% of it was from American and British aid. The rest was produced mostly in the industrial centres beyond the Ural Mountains.

Thirdly all the important mass produced equipment that had an effect upon the Russian War was Russian made.
The T34 for example, or the IL2's, or perhaps the JS1's (and later the JS2's). I'd also like you to name a piece of equipment that was provided en masse by the allies to the Russians, and that actually had an effect.

American History Teacher: RIGHT KIDS WE MUST NOW PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG! IF YOU DON'T, AND IF YOU DON'T AGREE WITH EVERYTHING I SAY I WILL HAND YOU OVER TO THE SODOMIZING AMERICAN MILITARY AT GUANTANAMO BAY!!!!

Children: (montone) We agree!

hahahaha, cant help but laugh at Americans.

Excuse me for a minute - I wish to laugh at an American Patriot.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!

100,000 dead soldiers IS low compared to the rest of the nations casualties.

Secondly of the total amount of equipment Russia used during the War, about 1.8% of it was from American and British aid. The rest was produced mostly in the industrial centres beyond the Ural Mountains.

Thirdly all the important mass produced equipment that had an effect upon the Russian War was Russian made.
The T34 for example, or the IL2's, or perhaps the JS1's (and later the JS2's). I'd also like you to name a piece of equipment that was provided en masse by the allies to the Russians, and that actually had an effect.

American History Teacher: RIGHT KIDS WE MUST NOW PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG! IF YOU DON'T, AND IF YOU DON'T AGREE WITH EVERYTHING I SAY I WILL HAND YOU OVER TO THE SODOMIZING AMERICAN MILITARY AT GUANTANAMO BAY!!!!

Children: (montone) We agree!

hahahaha, cant help but laugh at Americans.

That's quite all right!

You give me a good laugh as well.

Excuse me for a minute - I wish to laugh at an American Patriot.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!

100,000 dead soldiers IS low compared to the rest of the nations casualties.

Secondly of the total amount of equipment Russia used during the War, about 1.8% of it was from American and British aid. The rest was produced mostly in the industrial centres beyond the Ural Mountains.

Thirdly all the important mass produced equipment that had an effect upon the Russian War was Russian made.
The T34 for example, or the IL2's, or perhaps the JS1's (and later the JS2's). I'd also like you to name a piece of equipment that was provided en masse by the allies to the Russians, and that actually had an effect.

American History Teacher: RIGHT KIDS WE MUST NOW PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG! IF YOU DON'T, AND IF YOU DON'T AGREE WITH EVERYTHING I SAY I WILL HAND YOU OVER TO THE SODOMIZING AMERICAN MILITARY AT GUANTANAMO BAY!!!!

Children: (montone) We agree!

hahahaha, cant help but laugh at Americans.


Wow, I guess Socialism doesn't produce well-educated children after all.

For those that have read the entire thread and say Americans are the ones being ignorant take a look at this guy.

I have been told that Europeans are nice and only hate the American government, however Europeans continue to flame me, only proving my point.

Europeans hate Americans.

I would have responded to your posts but your pure American hatred shows your not worth my time.

Wow, I guess Socialism doesn't produce well-educated children after all.

For those that have read the entire thread and say Americans are the ones being ignorant take a look at this guy.

I have been told that Europeans are nice and only hate the American government, however Europeans continue to flame me, only proving my point.

Europeans hate Americans.

I would have responded to your posts but your pure American hatred shows your not worth my time.


No worries!

We can tell he just needs attention. ;)

No worries!

We can tell he just needs attention. ;)

Yes, I think he could use some attention by the sodomizing American military at Guantanamo Bay, if you know what I mean...

Europeans hate Americans.

Maybe if you wouldn't partake in illegal Wars, propping up of dictatorships to your liking, while demolishing those who have fallen out of favour and constantly trying to get involved in European affairs we would like you.

But until such time as you elect a liberal Government, stop fuelling your own patriotic ego by claiming every War in history was won by you, and that every other nation on earth hates you because they are either a) Jealous or b) Hate Freedom, we will continue to hate you. You further the stereotype that has been generated, so naturally we will hate you.

Maybe if you wouldn't partake in illegal Wars, propping up of dictatorships to your liking, while demolishing those who have fallen out of favour and constantly trying to get involved in European affairs we would like you.

But until such time as you elect a liberal Government, stop fuelling your own patriotic ego by claiming every War in history was won by you, and that every other nation on earth hates you because they are either a) Jealous or b) Hate Freedom, we will continue to hate you. You further the stereotype that has been generated, so naturally we will hate you.

Wow, by telling me to elect a government that matches your beliefs, telling me not to love my country, and change my country's beliefs, you sound a lot like a fascist.

Ahh the irony!

(Oh wait, American's don't get Irony!)

Ahh the irony!

(Oh wait, American's don't get Irony!)

If you mean Iraq you are mistaken.

We didn't change Iraq to match our ideals, the Iraqi people want a democracy.

The soldiers shooting at Americans on the street don't represent the majority of the Iraqis. They are a very small percentage, most Iraqis want democracy they would just like to see the American troops leave soon, according to a recent poll.

If you mean Iraq you are mistaken.

We didn't change Iraq to match our ideals, the Iraqi people want a democracy.


WARNING!

THIS THREAD CONTAINS HIGH LEVELS OF RHETORIC!

WARNING!

THIS THREAD CONTAINS HIGH LEVELS OF RHETORIC!

Well, I'd say you pretty well killed this thread.

Sorry Krome.

By injecting large amount of rhetoric into this thread - you effectively killed it off to anyone but American Bush Lovers.

relax relax ...
i am a european (i won't say from which country since i think here are enough people which wouldn't like me just because i live in this country) .. and i definitely don't hate americans ... not at all .. they are human beings like everyone else .. influenced by their culture (particularly tv) and so on ...
you can't just hate a whole nation ... at least i thought we had finished with this bullshit off generalizing and this stuff

i dislike the whole american culture of individualism. nothing has ever been acheived by one man alone. they may have the idea but they need the help of others to acheive it.

I think that a lot of Americans have this idea that different countries in Europe (not going to name names) dislike the American people.

I'm a little confused because I have heard a lot of different things...
Is it that many of you dislike the American people? or the American Government?

I would say, almost 100% of the people I know are against the American government. The stupid thing is, that one judges the people by what its government does... Anyhow, the people I know aren't in some sort of anti america group, most of them don't know each other, a rather random group of ppl. We can really apreciate the things the US produces, music, movies, even some foods, but ...

Its the line of stupid ignorent presidents and the wars the US gets into or starts for obvious capitalistic reasons that does it I guess, combined with some sort of, "we know what is best for the rest of the world" arrogance (policing the world) and the fact the US calls himself the land of the free, while the majority uses the word "liberal" as an insult and the whole government is extreme right wing wether you chose democratic or republican.

In short: the US blows its own horn to often, while it really has no reason to do so.

It sounds very negative, but hm its just the image the US has as a country, with many people.

I hate European government and European people...

Do you even know the European government and what it has done so far?

Americans should realize, that America is thriving because of mostly foreigners, that come into US.

You know, if I had to pick a favorite cultural group in Europe, it would have to be the Dutch, you guys are just so darn nice.

However, we Americans like to think of ourselves as the international police force, so it is our job to keep our noses in other peoples business.

Without us being nosey, South Korea would be communist, Japan would rule the Pacific, Afghanistan would be run by the Taliban, and Saddam would be having his fun torturing his people in Iraq.

It is our job to be nosey you know. ;)

...who gives a damn if South Korea is communist or not. Who would give a damn if Japan ruled the pacific? Afghanistan wouldn't have been run down by the Taliban if the US didn't stop supporting Afghanistan after it had been totally destroyed by the Russian/Afghan war. And Saddam, well the US put him into place and supported him, why? just like with Afghanistan, but only then the "enemy" was Iran instead of the USSR.

Yeah, I hate America because of their foreign policy. But you shouldn't take it personally. I hate Europe just as much because they have no respect for Britain's independence. In fact I hate everyone equally, irrespective of stuff like nationality, race, ect.

omg you idiot
if europe hadn't fought back the germans would have landed in america by the time you guys were waking up

and hell
they did fought back you little sh*t

they never conquered our country because we just fought back
altough we were like 10 times smaller and didn't even come close to their army they never won

http://www.geocities.com/~worldwar1/mccrae.html

In Flanders Fields

In Flanders fields the poppies blow
Between the crosses, row on row,
That mark our place; and in the sky
The larks, still bravely singing, fly
Scarce heard amid the guns below.

We are the Dead. Short days ago
We lived, felt dawn, saw sunset glow,
Loved, and were loved, and now we lie
In Flanders fields.

Take up our quarrel with the foe:
To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

Could someone please tell me what this post means?

Oh lord, she doesn't know "In Flanders fields..." Damn...damn... This makes me so sad. We remember the American soldiers, the Canadian and Australian soldiers, the British troops, our own soldiers and the French, even the German kid soldiers, here in Flanders fields. But "In Flanders fields" was written by a British soldier. A Briton could tell more about this poem.

Some of my family members died in the trenches in WWI and WWII. I recently met an old man that was recruited by the colaborating church (before the germans invaded our country) to fight the "red danger" the commies. Eventually he arrived at the eastern front fighting for the very country that invaded his country. Fighting against something he didn't believe in, it was the fucking church that had too much power back then. He and his fellow man were surrounded, it was very cold and it snowed. He was and three others were the only men who could escape. He cried when he stopped telling me this. I barely knew him, the only thing I said, was that I was studying my history and that I learned about the WWs. War sucks and before it is totally over, you don't know who are the bad guys and who isn't. My grandmother always said, that most of the germans she met were nice young boys fighting for something they didn't really believe in. And then of course you had the hard core officers who were executing people randomly.

I think that a lot of Americans have this idea that different countries in Europe (not going to name names) dislike the American people.

I'm a little confused because I have heard a lot of different things...
Is it that many of you dislike the American people?
I dislike some of them. The majority of them seem fine though.
or the American Government?
I have to admit, I'm not too happy about your current government.
Then again, it's not like you had great leaders to pick from during the last elections

*opinions expressed are those of the author. They may not be representative for all of europe as europe, like the US, is made up out of individuals*

Europeans hate Americans.


Maybe if you wouldn't partake in illegal Wars, propping up of dictatorships to your liking, while demolishing those who have fallen out of favour and constantly trying to get involved in European affairs we would like you.

But until such time as you elect a liberal Government, stop fuelling your own patriotic ego by claiming every War in history was won by you, and that every other nation on earth hates you because they are either a) Jealous or b) Hate Freedom, we will continue to hate you. You further the stereotype that has been generated, so naturally we will hate you.µ

Now now, Shinoxia didn't partake in illegal wars and propped up dictatorships to her liking, etc. Don't target specific persons, its shows bad social intelligence...or maybe you just want to hurt people?

Anyhow, I found your info on the Russian suplies during the WW interesting, what are your sources?

I think that a lot of Americans have this idea that different countries in Europe (not going to name names) dislike the American people.

I'm a little confused because I have heard a lot of different things...
Is it that many of you dislike the American people? or the American Government?

The government and it's ability to manipulate the people. I don't think a western country have suffered as much propaganda since WWII as the US current do. The worst part is that they don't even need plausible lies anymore - people are mostly just completely ignorant to current issues.
I say this based on my personal first hand experience visiting the US. And with that said, I must admit that I am also greatly impressed at many things about the country. When you look beyond the hypocratic and superficial you meet nice and hardworking people. Euro-sarcarsm was often taken literally much to my embarrassment. It is refreshing to meet people who believe in integrity and honesty. Sometimes I just wish they would question the workings of their own government a bit more.

I think that "hate" is far, far too strong a word to use. I'm sure there are a few pea-brained Europeans who do "hate" America and Americans, but they are hardly representative. I think the problem is often one of expectation.

From the American side: in my experience, a hell of a lot of Americans seem to think that everyone wants to live in America and be American. Probably this is a result of being descended from recent immigrants. Your central national myth (we all have at least one) is coloured by the memories of parents or grandparents or great-grandparents who told tales of suffering and privation and the desperate struggle to reach the Land of Opportunity: therefore you perceive the USA as somewhere people -- ALL people -- are desperate to get to and delighted to reach. However, this national myth was created by the self-selecting group of immigrants who a) wanted to go to America in the first place, and b) stayed in America after they got there. It's seldom acknowledged that a great many immigrants to the USA -- sometimes up to 70% in any one year in the late 19th century -- went home again shortly after finding themselves stuck in some hellhole like Five Points. The point of all this in this context, though, is this: because Americans are brought up with the notion that the USA is God's Own Country and that everyone on earth is dying to get there, it comes as a jolt to find that a great many non-Americans often have critical attitudes towards some aspects of American life. It's my opinion that this dissonance between initial expectation (everyone loves us and wants to be us) and reality (lots of people don't like many aspects of US culture and DON'T want to live in the USA) that exaggerates this less-than-100%-positive-in-every-respect view into "they hate us!". We don't hate you: we just see some aspects of your culture that we don't like. Feel free to return the compliment. Constructive criticism is useful.

From the European side: partly as a result of WWII, in which the American troops played a major, not to say central, role in supporting the UK and in the liberation of Continental Europe, and partly as a result of the continued dominance of American film, previous European generations from the 1940s to the 1960s -- baby boomers, making up most of the current adult population -- grew up seeing America as a sort of fantasy land of wide open spaces, action, excitement, coolness and heroism. The protracted Cold War fears, Vietnam, and its aftermath, did kind of put the tin lid on that. Our heroes turned out to have great big feet of clay. In many ways the ambivalent attitude of Europe to America stems from disappointment: we expected better of you, and it's always a let-down when your heroes turn out to be merely human and prone to the same stupidities and greed as the rest of us. All the bad aspects of American life -- violence, endemic poverty on a shocking scale, racism, media prudery and hypocrisy (none of which are exclusively or even particularly American) -- stand out in sharp relief against the comic-book gloss and tinsel of the America of our dreams and expectations. Combine that with the pre-existing European bourgeois snobbery towards American culture, and the inevitable antipathy that the biggest superpower on the block will draw (especially from has-been global titans like France and, later, Britain) and you have a ready-made breeding ground for jealousy, suspicion and hyper-criticism. There may also be the beginnings of niggle between the USA as one economic superpower and a nearly-economically-united Europe as another.

There are differences between the USA and Europe. However, as developed democracies, we have far more in common than we have apart. Vive la difference. And stop electing pea-brained neo-conservative chickenhawks. :)

I hate USA, EU, rascist and nazis.
Without this I like everyone.

There are differences between the USA and Europe. However, as developed democracies, we have far more in common than we have apart. Vive la difference. And stop electing pea-brained neo-conservative chickenhawks. :)

A nice and constructive answer. I wish I had the time to elaborate further on the issue. Lets just add that Europeans often feel we are not treated as equals and taken seriously by the Americans. Perhaps there is also a pinch of truth in that given the Americans enormous (and justified) pride in their own country.
I purposely left the last paragraph, because I fully vouch for that. I see the current European discontent in American foreign politics as a direct result of the triggerhappy Bush administration. We have too much to benefit from one another. Let us not turn the Atlantic into a trench.

I was pretty sure Madmaartens figueres about WWI casualties was quite correct, but since there was that many discussion in how far the US saved our asses, here are more accurate figueres. I looked them up because I wondered why there weren't any Ausies or Canadians mentioned.

Australia: 58,150
Austria-Hungary: 922,000
Belgium: 44,000
Britain: 658,700
Bulgaria: 87,500
Canada: 56,500
France: 1,359,000
Germany: 1,600,000
Greece: 5,000
India: 43,200
Italy: 689,000
Japan: 300
Montenegro: 3,000
New Zealand: 16,130
Portugal: 7,222
Romania: 335,706
Russia: 1,700,000
Serbia: 45,000
Turkey: 250,000
USA: 58,480
Totals: 7,996,888

Now UK and US before you start shouting, "WE LOST FAR MORE SOLDIERS IN WWI!!!" Aparently the 100 000 american soldiers included about 50 000 canadian soldiers. And the many British soldiers included Indians, Kiwis and Ausies, being part of the British empire.

Don't forget there were many civilians killed too. I know only of belgian civilian casualties, about 23 000 extra and 500 000 in total.

Damn sucky all those numbers, but sometimes hard proof is necesary. I got my sources from the folowing site: http://www.firstworldwar.com/features/casualties.htm

The fact that the US eventually joined the allied forces in WWI was because when the German subs targetted the famous British navy, they also hit US trading ships. Anyhow, thats what my history professor taught me. Anyhow, the US joined WWI in 1917.. for the record: WWI 1914 - 1918. There wasn't much ass saving done there. But I'm pretty sure the US helped us a lot in WWII. But I detest the term ass saving. I'm pretty sure the US wouldn't have come to help if it weren't for Pearl Harbor.

I'm sorry about my previous post, "In Flanders Fields" was a poem of a Canadian medical-officer named John MacCrae, it wasn't written by a briton. I made this mistake because usually the britons use this poem to remember their dearly departed soldiers.