NationStates Jolt Archive

Do you think so??
Many families have "fun" with one another, what do you think about this subject??

Do you think so??
Many families have "fun" with one another, what do you think about this subject??

Well, all I know is that the children made from such unions are born with MANY defects. That alone should make one wary of such a relationship.

Yes that does tend to happen.

Does anyone know someone who commits incest or if you have commited it? Don't be shy, argue your case!

Why do you even have to ask? :rolleyes:

Unless...you're planning something.

No i am not planning anything, It just might be a good topic to discuss like the one on mastrubation.

Why do you even have to ask? :rolleyes:

Unless...you're planning something.

lol.

Why do you even have to ask? :rolleyes:

Unless...you're planning something.
Are u planning something then??

No i am not planning anything, It just might be a good topic to discuss like the one on mastrubation.

I'm very glad to hear that. Incest is disgusting, mmkay?


But heres one for ya- Is sleeping with your stepsister immoral and why?

(My parents aren't divorced so it doesn't apply to me)

Are u planning something then??

I don't have any sisters.

And i'm not going to do a Oedipus.

Do you think so??
Many families have "fun" with one another, what do you think about this subject??

I think you're a moron.

I'm very glad to hear that. Incest is disgusting, mmkay?


But heres one for ya- Is sleeping with your stepsister immoral and why?

(My parents aren't divorced so it doesn't apply to me)

Is that saying u have? or is that saying that this dosnt apply to u at all?

why should you sleep with relatives. there are enough other people in the world. anyways, inbreed causes a lot of inheritable illness. I believe that not much people are jumping for this form of sexuality. By the way, father daughter sexual relationsships ,mother son relations ships and other pedosexualrelationships become optional that way. That is not the wright way to go.
Incest is for this reason is immoral.

I think it is wrong 2. I have heard it can cause inheritable diseases like u have mentioned.

Maybe I'm a goody two shoes, but I think anything against the law is immoral. And trust me, this is against the law.

I agree. Incest is sick and should NOT be encouraged or done. Period. People who do that are definately strange in the head and are a menace to their families. What does this kind of behavior do to the children? And the members of the family? It can scar them, making them unstable or distrustful (for good reason) or it can encourage them to do the same thing, and where will their children be? The family members may stop trusting one another and the whole thing breaks down. I repeat, incest is a sick choice with deadly results and should be prevented at all costs, along with any other kinds of sexual perversions.

Yes it is very sickening, and can cause a huge problems, and if you get your partner pregnat.......oh god.......

Maybe I'm a goody two shoes, but I think anything against the law is immoral. And trust me, this is against the law.

*snorts* Laws differ from country to country, and region to region. Explain that. Not that this issue really explains that... but, still.

Plus, I think there's different types of incest as well. I mean, there's inter-generational ones, which involve parents and children, then siblings, and then even so far as cousins. I'm squicked by inter-generational ones, but the rest of it doesn't bother me. Doesn't really intrigue me either, but there's a lot worse things people could be doing then boinking their brothers. Like heroin, or being involved in gangs and murders. People get all up in arms about stupid little things like this and gay marriage, and then refuse to acknowledge the major problems, like murders, serial killers, drug trafficking, and theft. I think those cause much bigger problems and threats to society than little things like this.

What does this kind of behavior do to the children? And the members of the family? It can scar them, making them unstable or distrustful (for good reason) or it can encourage them to do the same thing, and where will their children be? The family members may stop trusting one another and the whole thing breaks down. I repeat, incest is a sick choice with deadly results and should be prevented at all costs, along with any other kinds of sexual perversions.

But what about other families where the two parents fight, or are even divorced? Won't that cause the same problems often? I think deadly results might be a little strong. I'm not really an advocate of incest, but I think its amusing to argue the other side of things occasionally. And highly doubt that you can explain that other kinds of sexual preversion will also break down family structures. Well, granted, some of them will, but other things that stay behind closed doors won't often affect the children or other such things. I mean, if there's pedophilia and child rape going on, that's a different story, and will obviously screw everything up to heck and back, but if the husband and wife like a little s/m now and then, I highly doubt that is going to cause 'deadly results'.

Incest is morally indistinguishable from bestiality, pedophilia, or homosexuality. All are redirections of romantic attraction from a partner who would be suitable for procreation to someone or something tthat merely serves as a convenient receptacle.

I think they're all sick, and practicioners should be cured or failing that kept in the closet, but apparently many people seem to believe they should be allowed to get "married". :rolleyes:

Is that saying u have? or is that saying that this dosnt apply to u at all?

See, this is what happens in issues like this and gay marriage and other touchy things. If someone asks good questions, or argues from a different perspective, people jump on them, and assume that they have done it and like it, or that they're a filthy incest lover or something. This shouldn't be about individual experience. It's about the overall mechanics of such things. I'm not looking to prove incest is right. I just want to force someone into making good arguments about why it's wrong.

Genetic defects apparent in children is a good reason. Straining family ties is a good reason. "OMGzorz it Is sO wRoNggGz!11!1one" is not a good reason.

But what about other families where the two parents fight, or are even divorced? Won't that cause the same problems often? I think deadly results might be a little strong. I'm not really an advocate of incest, but I think its amusing to argue the other side of things occasionally. And highly doubt that you can explain that other kinds of sexual preversion will also break down family structures. Well, granted, some of them will, but other things that stay behind closed doors won't often affect the children or other such things. I mean, if there's pedophilia and child rape going on, that's a different story, and will obviously screw everything up to heck and back, but if the husband and wife like a little s/m now and then, I highly doubt that is going to cause 'deadly results'.
s/m???

s/m???

Sado masochism. Bondage. Pain. Restraint. Leather. Things like that.

Immoral and sick.

See, this is what happens in issues like this and gay marriage and other touchy things. If someone asks good questions, or argues from a different perspective, people jump on them, and assume that they have done it and like it, or that they're a filthy incest lover or something. This shouldn't be about individual experience. It's about the overall mechanics of such things. I'm not looking to prove incest is right. I just want to force someone into making good arguments about why it's wrong.

Genetic defects apparent in children is a good reason. Straining family ties is a good reason. "OMGzorz it Is sO wRoNggGz!11!1one" is not a good reason.

Heh, thanks.

The reason it doesn't apply to me is because I cannot possibly sleep with my step-sister, as I don't have one in the first place.

So, is sleeping with a step-sibling immoral and why?

Hmmm...interesting. I'm surprised that this thread is filled with so many knee-jerk reactions.

Let me start off by saying this: the idea of incest disgusts me. However, a large part of that is because that's how I was raised. It's passed down in society as an inviolable taboo...one that can't even be questioned. That's where we get into trouble: everything should be open to examination and questioning.

So, let's discuss this issue in a logical fashion, shall we?

1) It's just sick and wrong. Wow. Hard to argue with that one, isn't it? If this is your argument, please tell me why it's "sick and wrong." Who knows, I might agree with you. But "it's just wrong," with no reasoning behind it, is the rhetoric of mindless sheep.

2) Parent-child relationships are wrong. I agree. The power dynamic is far too unequal...it's an abuse of trust. The same holds true for any adult family member with a much younger family member who were in frequent contact throughout the younger relative's youth. The power differential is just too great.

3) The kids have birth defects. There's truth to this one. Family members are more likely to share recessive genes that then would be expressed in offspring. However, if this is your sole argument, does that mean that incest is okay if childbearing isn't an issue? Would you have a problem if relatives had a sexual relationship if one or both of them were incapable of childbearing? After all, surgical sterilization (particularly for males) is quite routine. Would that remove your objections to the practice?

4) Where's the line? If "incest is just wrong," then how do you define "incest"? Is a relationship with a first cousin incest? First cousin once removed? Second cousins? Adopted family members? If something is "just wrong," then the situation is black and white, with no shades of grey. Tell me, then...where does the boundary between "acceptable" and "sick and wrong" lie?

5) Incest has not been universally decried as "wrong". The pharoahs of Ancient Egypt were not only permitted, but required to marry their sisters. A genetically sound practice? Nope. But evidence that the incest taboo is cultural, not a universal law set in stone from above.

So, let's explore this issue more closely. Does the idea of incest make me go, "ewwwwww"? You betcha. But "ewwwww" isn't a rational discussion, nor a means of intellectual exploration. I know the people of NS can do better than that.

EDIT: In the time it took me to write this, some intelligent, thoughtful posts were made. Hurrah! I love you guys!

I think the government should keep it's nose out of ANY consensual sex between ANY two adults. Sure, it's sick and immoral but if they want to express their love for each other in that way...sure. I'll just shut my eyes, put my fingers in my ears and pretend it isn't happening.

Incest can cause genetic defects in children born from it, but it doesn't ALWAYS happen. Its still pretty rare, but quite a bit more common than children born from non-incestous relationships.

I think the people who do it do have problems which need to be addressed by a psychiatrist. Not being able to differentiate between the love felt for family and the love between two people in a sexual relationship is a problem which needs addressing, but to criminalise it (unless it is involving a minor) is, in my opinion, just as wrong as the act itself.

Incest is morally indistinguishable from bestiality, pedophilia, or homosexuality. All are redirections of romantic attraction from a partner who would be suitable for procreation to someone or something tthat merely serves as a convenient receptacle.

I think they're all sick, and practicioners should be cured or failing that kept in the closet, but apparently many people seem to believe they should be allowed to get "married". :rolleyes:

But sex and love aren't always about procreation. Look at animals. When dogs get horny, they'll hump anyones legs. Look at dolphins, they practice incest. Often, a young dolphin's first intercourse comes with his mother, before he is old enough to inpregnate her. Don't believe me? Look it up. It's documented.

And seriously, homosexuality on the same level as beastiality? I highly doubt that two human beings sharing a caring relationship together can be compared to someone deeply in love with a horse or something. Those aren't even on the same level.

Heh, thanks.

The reason it doesn't apply to me is because I cannot possibly sleep with my step-sister, as I don't have one in the first place.

So, is sleeping with a step-sibling immoral and why?

I don't see why it would be. You're not related in blood, so there's no genetic problems. You're only related in name and nothing else.

I heard this once...Why go to the mall when you can just walk down the hall?
It made me barf.

I heard this once...Why go to the mall when you can just walk down the hall?
It made me barf.
It made u barf?? I don't get the phrase about the hall thing???

Hmmm...interesting. I'm surprised that this thread is filled with so many knee-jerk reactions.

Let me start off by saying this: the idea of incest disgusts me. However, a large part of that is because that's how I was raised. It's passed down in society as an inviolable taboo...one that can't even be questioned. That's where we get into trouble: everything should be open to examination and questioning.

So, let's discuss this issue in a logical fashion, shall we?
I <3 you. Exactly my thoughts... everything should be constantly looked at and reevaluated. People often bring up the ideas of tradition and how it means stuff... but its just mindless stupidity. Doing something for the sake of "It's always been done." is just a silly idea. We're not progressing then... we're regressing.

2) Parent-child relationships are wrong. I agree. The power dynamic is far too unequal...it's an abuse of trust. The same holds true for any adult family member with a much younger family member who were in frequent contact throughout the younger relative's youth. The power differential is just too great.Agreed. The partners aren't on an equal level, so it can't work. There's too much baggage.

5) Incest has not been universally decried as "wrong". The pharoahs of Ancient Egypt were not only permitted, but required to marry their sisters. A genetically sound practice? Nope. But evidence that the incest taboo is cultural, not a universal law set in stone from above.I didn't even think to bring the familial histories of royalty in the past. How many times in the past millenia do you think European monarchs have married closely in the family. Quite a few times. It was originally seen as a way of keeping the bloodlines "pure." Quite a different way of thinking than now.

Thanks for this long post.. really well thought out.

Incest is odd. :eek: I could never imagine any I know actually taking part in something like this. There are too many other people in the world. I'm not going to deny that things like this happen, it's true. But I don't support it. Birth Defects are one reason. And that's a big reason.
The role family members play are for family. They are to be treated as a mother/father/sister/brother/ect. Not a lover. I'm hardly a religious man, but if there is a god, or in the bible, does it mention something about incest?



Oh, and as for step-kids. I still think it's wrong, because....well, just, not something I could imagine

Guys, animals do. We are animals. Ok, we're the most intelligent among the animals, but still that's what we are. Ok, it can cause ill children (and even if the baby would be ok, what a monstruosity having a children from your sister, that's for sure). But "technically", there shouldn't be really anything wrong.

I heard this once...Why go to the mall when you can just walk down the hall?
It made me barf.
That's a lot like "Incest is best. Put your sister to the test." It's a stupid line, and just meant to get a reaction out of the listeners. If it made you barf, you seriously need to get your emotional reactions in line. If you go to the movies and watch people getting shot or bloodily killed and you're fine, but this idea makes you barf, then maybe you're the one with problems.

I agree with those who say that sex between different generation is wrong though.
I consider "immoral" only that kind of incest, that is sex exploitation.

If you divided every family in the world's ancestors into different 'branches', and assume that every family member had procreated with a member of a diferent family, you'd soon arrive at the conclusion that there would had to have existed a much greater number (something like 10,000 times) of people who have ever lived in throughout the entirity of history. So, whether you like it or not, somewhere down the line there was a lot if intra-familial ding-donging.

Now, in this day and age it isn't necessary, we've all got a theoretical 2,999,999,990 partners to choose. (Subtracted 10, 1 you and 9 female family members). But I haven't subtracted post-menopausal women, or pre-pubescent girls. That would probably make it 2,500,000,000 as a rough final figure. From a genetic point of view, we now know that genes are best spread apart, the healthiest genes are made up of great diversity. I'm not saying that if I procreate with a Maori girl the child will be super-fit, but will statistically be less at risk to many hereditary diseases, enjoy a longer lifespan and be more intelligent.

Take pedigree dogs for example. Thoroughbreds are notably short-tempered, sickly, and shorter-lived. Mongrels on the other hand are docile, intelligent and healthier. (Although I can't say the same for my dog, she's got cataracts, poor thing. But she's very well-tempered.)

The popular taboo of incest is a possible reflection of that fact. The thing is: is it so repulsive because of a hard-wired sentiment, or is it conditioning? Our ancestors obviously did it without a second thought, and they still do in some parts of the world. And is that where all these psychological complications arose, the Oedipus Complex and others? The Oedipus phase is common in boys, as is the Elektra phase in girls. But now we're conditioned against it.

And that's for the better. It has serious health problems attatched, and I personally find it repugnant. We're a lot better off with it behind us.

Did anyone ever see the issue: "Is Incest Intrinsicly Icky"? It was posted a while ago but I think Max or a mod overruled it. I thought NationStates was all about challenging taboos etc? And I can't see any legal problems with minors using the site if all it does is talk about the subject... it's not like it's giving us graphical illustrations.

I'm hardly a religious man, but if there is a god, or in the bible, does it mention something about incest?*laughs* I don't see how there could be. According to Christian beliefs, god created one man, Adam, and one woman, Eve. If they were the first two people on earth, there would have to have been some HEAVY incestin' going on to populate things.

And not only that, remember when he got ticked off and flooded the earth and made noah build that ark thingy again? Yeah, well, since he took only 2 of every animal, and only a few humans. EVERY species would have to be a product of incest. Lovely, no?

Guys, animals do. We are animals. Ok, we're the most intelligent among the animals, but still that's what we are. Ok, it can cause ill children (and even if the baby would be ok, what a monstruosity having a children from your sister, that's for sure). But "technically", there shouldn't be really anything wrong.

First things first i have to disagree that we are among the most intelligent animals. But i do agree by laws of nature, not from personal opinion or n e thing else, it is theoriticaly ok. Think of it this way we wouldn't be having this discussion if it never happened. :) (personaly i disagree with it, but if it is mutual then i will turn a blind eye and pretend it isnt happening)

What if you didnt want children if your sister or mom took birth control, and you jsut fucked her hard just because you wanted to have sex with her??You may have started this thread, but you're not helping it. You acting like a perverted school kid. Grow up a little.

Guys, animals do. We are animals. Ok, we're the most intelligent among the animals, but still that's what we are.That is, until the dolphins build their amazing robotic suits and storm the land with their cybernetic assisted tuna lackeys.... >.> <.< x.x;;;;

And don't even get me started about the penguins.... @.@

*ahem*

Sorry about that.

What if you didnt want children if your sister or mom took birth control, and you jsut fucked her hard just because you wanted to have sex with her??

Jimmy, watch your language. There is no excuse for such language. Stop it!

That is, until the dolphins build their amazing robotic suits and storm the land with their cybernetic assisted tuna lackeys.... >.> <.< x.x;;;;

And don't even get me started about the penguins.... @.@

*ahem*

Sorry about that.


Don't fear the dolphins fear the sharks when they build space craft.

(sry I just couldn't let dolphins get more attention than sharks which are the best animals alive)

Well, unfortunatly things between siblings and parents/children happen every day throughout the world. I myself was molested by my half-sister. My mother was raped by her Uncle. My first boyfriend was molested by his dad and his dads best friend when he was 6. *shrug* And another thing, who's morals? Your morals aren't my morals... so *shrug*

Don't fear the dolphins fear the sharks when they build space craft.

(sry I just couldn't let dolphins get more attention than sharks which are the best animals alive)Psh, the dolphins could easily build a laser ray to quickly dismantle a shark space craft. There's no comparison... :P

But I'm telling you.. those penguins... >.>; they've got shifty eyes. I don't trust 'em one bit.

This thread made me think about how hard it would be if say, you had a single mother, and you met a girl with a single father, and you really hit it off, but so did the parents, and the parents ended up getting married. Technically you would be going out with your sister, which is OK before the fact, but after the wedding it is not.

Incest is just revolting. Who would actually do that willingly? First of all yeah its sick but second of all if children ever came out of that they could have defects. When you do that with a close faimly member you have pretty much the same allergies or bad liver or whatever so then the child could recieve those but at a worse level..

I think that if there are no children from it, it's none of my business, even if I do not think it's right.

Incest is just revolting. Who would actually do that willingly? First of all yeah its sick but second of all if children ever came out of that they could have defects. When you do that with a close faimly member you have pretty much the same allergies or bad liver or whatever so then the child could recieve those but at a worse level..Defects aren't guaranteed, but the chance of them occurring is increased, yes. And about the bad traits, so what? I mean, what if you ended up with someone else who had those bad traits too? And wouldn't that mean all your good traits would be doubled too? *shrugs*

Oh my Gods....why on earth has this thread stayed up for so long?...It's just so wrong on so many friggin levels....I can't even understand why it's being discussed rationally?

OK, the day we let incest into our society is the day when all fellowship and pure, disinterested love disappears from the face of the Earth. The family should be a place where you can go for unconditional, pure-minded love and simple friendship. Are we, by changing the role of the family, saying that there is no need for such things if they can be replaced by sick sexual urges?

Oh my Gods....why on earth has this thread stayed up for so long?...It's just so wrong on so many friggin levels....I can't even understand why it's being discussed rationally?Because there's no reason to let it die. Right now, you have not provided sufficient evidence to even EXPLAIN why it is so "friggin" wrong. As the thread stays now, it looks like incest has more reasons for it than against.

Not discussing it rationally leads to sheep thought and blind following of principles that may or may not be correct or appropriate to our lives. If you can rationally discuss this issue AND explain why it is wrong, then you're doing your part to convince other people and explain what you believe. I can't believe that incest is actually having better reasons FOR it than against. Don't complain, just explain.

That rhymed... horribly. ^_^;;;

I just want to add. There really HAS NEVER been one Proven case that insest has caused defects or deseases. :p It is a very high possability because of how close the genenome structrue is. All i know is that the two (broher,sister) people that i know, have one wodnerfull child who is perfectly healthy. This 8yo child also has excelent hearing. :eek:

I just want to add. There really HAS NEVER been one Proven case that insest has caused defects or deseases. :p It is a very high possability because of how close the genenome structrue is. All i know is that the two (broher,sister) people that i know, have one wodnerfull child who is perfectly healthy. This 8yo child also has excelent hearing. :eek:
That's all fine and good.
But right now, it boils down to personal opinion.

I for one, don't care! If you want to screw your sibling, it's none of my business, even though I don't like the idea - cousins maybe (j/k)

Fear not the dolphins they are inferior to sharks even with the lazers. (Yeah those pengines are scary they going to overtake us) Sry again for posting this doesn't quite go along with the discusion.

OK, the day we let incest into our society is the day when all fellowship and pure, disinterested love disappears from the face of the Earth. The family should be a place where you can go for unconditional, pure-minded love and simple friendship. Are we, by changing the role of the family, saying that there is no need for such things if they can be replaced by sick sexual urges?You have a good point about the family structure. However, the family structure as is, is rapidly deteriorating and degenerating into something that cause hurt and hate already. Abusive relationships, quarrels between siblings and parents... all of that strains stuff. What the family IS and what it should be are two different things. You can complain all you want about incest hurting the family setting, but it's not actually making the family setting better. I can liken this to the gay marriage argument of it weakening family structures. Lashing out at something that hurts the family structure is not productive unless you're willing to do something to improve the currently destructive family structures that are being formed in society, even without the influence of supposedly bad things like incest.

I'm not freaking for incest, I'm just trying to prove to people that in order to be rationally against something, you should have good reasons as to why it's wrong first.

Oh my Gods....why on earth has this thread stayed up for so long?...It's just so wrong on so many friggin levels....I can't even understand why it's being discussed rationally?

Some things don't deserve to be discussed rationally. Some things are just plainly WRONG!!! Next thing you know, we'll have a calm thread going about the human being's inalienable right to rape and murder!

When a brother and sister mate, there is about a 5% risk of a defect.


Anybody 2nd cousins or farther apart may legally marry in the USA.


I think going by current US law is fine. Because 2nd cousins or farther apart aren't really blood relatives.

I've never thought of it, but I think it's not two bad when the two 'doing it' are not geneticly related, (Step-sister- step-brother) but other than that...

I dont thinkmorality comes into play. Nor does ones personally reaction. No to answer someones question I have never engaged in incest but I am not opposed to it in theory. The problem lay in two areas one was mention potential medical complications of offspring. So as long as no babies are made then no worries right. The second though is abuse of power. It is too easy for abuse to occur for one to outright condone incest. Now little kids playing doctor and stuff that does not even come into it, they are kids and have no ability to procreate and no real concept of power. With older siblings one has to watch out because one of the siblings is going to be older and who knows what interplay is going on. But when we refer to incest we must include not just siblings but cousins, parent/child, grandparent/child, aunts/unlces etc. To my mind let's say a Parent and a child were genuinely attracted to each other and wanted some sport sex. To me the rules would need be that first no pregnancy, second the child must not live at home, the child must be an adult who has moved away from home and has lived independantly (no financial support from parents) for at least a couple of years and be financially stable. Otherwise there is no certainty that the child is not doing it just to keep the parent happy or because they feel indebted. Even then it is iffy. Therein is the problem there is no certainty, no certainty of nonpregnancy no certainty of no abuse. Which makes it sticky on the flip said homosexual incest gets rid of the pregnancy possibility but still leaves the abuse of power. For now I am willing to accept but not necessarily endorse incest in theory but in practice it seems unlikely that a situation will arise where it is cool. As for relations by marriage heck if you are conseting adults go to town, heck video tape it and use it as a christmas present for all I care.

everything deserves rational discussion.

"Is it immoral" is not the right question.
A better one could be: "should that people look for a good psychiatrist?"
My answer: YES, DEFINITELY!!!"

British Jimmy and others, please keep in mind that there are minors that use this forum. Keep all conversation at least reasonably family-friendly.

I have removed the most offensive content and will now lock this thread.


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