NationStates Jolt Archive

Do you think that there should be US and UK Military Intervention in Darfur, Sudan?

For those of you who don't know, there is a terrible humanitarian crisis there. The Sudanese government is sponsoring militia groups to carry out ethnic cleanisng against black people there. So far, 30,000 people have been killed and over a million have been displaced. This is another Rwanda genocide.

Tony Blair has said that "we have a moral reponsibility to deal with this by any means that we can." He wasn't ruling out military intervention. Blair is drawing up plans for military intervention in Sudan, which could involve troops distributing aid and lending logistical support to the African Union protection force, or protecting refugee camps from marauding militia forces.

(Reuters)

The UN should get involved. They have screwed up a countless number of times, this could be their chance to save their reputation.

And we dont want another Iraq on our hands with the US and UK going in alone.

The UK has just announced its plans to slash the infantry. Funky spy planes aren't going to stop the genocide - we know what's going on! There should be a UN force. If there isn't, then the UK can not afford to go in in any significant way while making defence cuts.

Either we accept the responsibility of global police, and fund our services accordingly, or we keep out of other countries business and allow genocide to continue.

The government in Khartoum is like a house of cards. They rely oof the resource wealth there to fund a two fronted civil war. If the UN slaps a few sanctions on, and if a multinational division secures Darfur and Khartoum, then the government will fall, and the proper partition of Sudan can resume. It'd also be another chance to introduce liberal institutions in Sudan, and create a democracy in North Africa.
As another symbollic move, I want most of the troops to be from the African Union. They have been a great force in showing African unity, to the point of sending peacekeepers to Sao Toame and Principe. A show of force in a large country like Sudan shows that they are serious in their goals of a united Africa.

I say we move in with four tank divisions and turn the place into a casino. Of course we should get involved.

I say we move in with four tank divisions and turn the place into a casino. Of course we should get involved.


De we even have 4 active Armoured Divisions?

De we even have 4 active Armoured Divisions?
Who cares? Send a fucking royal pheasant hunting party in there if it'll help. But for gods sakes don't just sit on our asses while this happens AGAIN.

I say we move in with four tank divisions and turn the place into a casino. Of course we should get involved.
Four tank divisions is overkill. The entire country is a desert with no place to hide, and the military equipment dates from WWII.

The UN gets most of its troops from the bigger powers anyway, with US/UK/oz tied down in Iraq, I doubt they'll be able to get together a UN force in a hurry. A lot of smaller countries have sent their only crack troops to Iraq to keep america's money flowing too, so I doubt they'll be able to contribute to a UN force. Perhaps we should encourage China to do it?

I probably need to rethink the uk/us/oz thing. when was the last time the us had troops under the UN flag? I know the ozzies were in Timor but Im not sure about the other 2. But if not, who usually does contribute to UN peace keeping forces?

Four tank divisions is overkill. The entire country is a desert with no place to hide, and the military equipment dates from WWII.
Off Topic: isn't that exactly what was said about Iraq?

Again, I really don't care exactly what you send, and not knowing anything about the military its not my job to decide that. But I'd like some hardware on the ground, and something between the militias and the displaced women and children. I don't care who or what it is, but it should be there soon and it should be a serious fucking deterrant.

Off Topic: isn't that exactly what was said about Iraq?

Again, I really don't care exactly what you send, and not knowing anything about the military its not my job to decide that. But I'd like some hardware on the ground, and something between the militias and the displaced women and children. I don't care who or what it is, but it should be there soon and it should be a serious fucking deterrant.
Tanks are as great of a detterrant to infantry as a rotting carcas is a detterant to flies.

Tanks are as great of a detterrant to infantry as a rotting carcas is a detterant to flies.
*pulls hair out*

I'm not a millitary strategist. Tanks...airforce... SAS... put the minutemen there if you want.

The UN gets most of its troops from the bigger powers anyway, with US/UK/oz tied down in Iraq, I doubt they'll be able to get together a UN force in a hurry. A lot of smaller countries have sent their only crack troops to Iraq to keep america's money flowing too, so I doubt they'll be able to contribute to a UN force. Perhaps we should encourage China to do it?

I probably need to rethink the uk/us/oz thing. when was the last time the us had troops under the UN flag? I know the ozzies were in Timor but Im not sure about the other 2. But if not, who usually does contribute to UN peace keeping forces?

I guess to figure that out you should look at the countries that have contributed to Monuc in DR Congo and KFOR in Kosovo. Although I'm not sure whether KFOR is under the UN flag.

EDIT: http://www.monuc.org/ContribMilit.aspx?lang=en

Maybe they should, but they won't.

No oil.

I guess to figure that out you should look at the countries that have contributed to Monuc in DR Congo and KFOR in Kosovo. Although I'm not sure whether KFOR is under the UN flag.

EDIT: http://www.monuc.org/ContribMilit.aspx?lang=en

cheers, that was interesting to see.

Hum several quesion, first nit picking, both the US and the UK and even australlia have troop operation under UN flags in mulptiple nation from bosinia to afganistan to many other places.

As for the get people asses into an unfortunate situation, i fail to see the problem here, people are being killed the goverment is unable/unwilling to act?

no threat to any of the nation that could help, what better time to send help?

if you want a battle for heart and minds to win this not iraq is a good place to help, remember aid allways comes with a national flag attached.

As for the timescale on troops, in the UK the army anouced it is able to send 1000 troops more or less now, most european armys can probably do the same.

Most euorpean armies ours included have reconised the unlikley hood of a world war and placed emphaisis on rapid reaction forces, look at the speed the french have managed to deploy troops to many aficran trouble spots.

the real question is once the TV pictures of hungry people disapear will the fickle populations of our nation continue to support our troops being thier?

*pulls hair out*

I'm not a millitary strategist. Tanks...airforce... SAS... put the minutemen there if you want.
I'm not one either, but from what I've seen from tanks recently, they've preformed poorly. It's part of the reason why defense spending is so much: the military must make the transition from a tank based military to an infantry based one, because today, it's far more effective.

I guess to figure that out you should look at the countries that have contributed to Monuc in DR Congo and KFOR in Kosovo. Although I'm not sure whether KFOR is under the UN flag.

EDIT: http://www.monuc.org/ContribMilit.aspx?lang=en
Technically, KFOR is, but it started purely as a NATO action.

I'm not one either, but from what I've seen from tanks recently, they've preformed poorly. It's part of the reason why defense spending is so much: the military must make the transition from a tank based military to an infantry based one, because today, it's far more effective.

They may aswell become a more tooled up version of a police force.

I say we move in with four tank divisions and turn the place into a casino. Of course we should get involved.
Just send 4000 tons of tea. Tea is said to have a calming effect.

They may aswell become a more tooled up version of a police force.
Deary, have you ever heard of the Non Posse Comitatus act?