NationStates Jolt Archive

Ever since I was a kid I wanted to be in politics however sadly I was born in america where being a socialist is seen as evil and if you are an atheist you have no chance in hell to elected at all. (Not ONE atheist has ever been voted into public office at any goverment level in the U.S.).

So I plan on moving to either france or germany, I have lots of family in germany however my heart is pulling me towards france.


My question is this. If I lived there for 15 or 20 years or so and became a very well established member of society, opened charities and such... Would I have a chance? or would they never vote for somebody who happened to be born in america? I was planning on perhapse trying to ride anti-american sentiment by bashing the hell out of the U.S. which hopefully would prevent my american heritage to cause me too much damage.


Would you vote for somebody who happened to live the first 19 years of his life or so in the U.S. but lived say 15 or 20 years in your nation? Or would you never vote for somebody who was born american, even if you agreed with their beliefs?

Anyways was just curious...

i live in Lithuania (former republic of soviet union) and our president is Valdas Adamkus and he is former citizen of USA and now he is elected to second tenure . but i cant say nothing about germany or france.

Ever since I was a kid I wanted to be in politics however sadly I was born in america where being a socialist is seen as evil and if you are an atheist you have no chance in hell to elected at all. (Not ONE atheist has ever been voted into public office at any goverment level in the U.S.).

So I plan on moving to either france or germany, I have lots of family in germany however my heart is pulling me towards france.


My question is this. If I lived there for 15 or 20 years or so and became a very well established member of society, opened charities and such... Would I have a chance? or would they never vote for somebody who happened to be born in america? I was planning on perhapse trying to ride anti-american sentiment by bashing the hell out of the U.S. which hopefully would prevent my american heritage to cause me too much damage.


Would you vote for somebody who happened to live the first 19 years of his life or so in the U.S. but lived say 15 or 20 years in your nation? Or would you never vote for somebody who was born american, even if you agreed with their beliefs?

Anyways was just curious...

Abolutely!

European model of democracy isn't based as much around how much money each of the candidates can raise for thier campaign trails. Anyone can stand as an independant at an election to become an MP, as for representing a party like the Lib Dems, you should just do work for them, voluntary, and after a while you will probably get your name put down on a shortlist for a prospective parliamentary candidate. If you are chosen you can then go on to stand for election.

And I can totally sympathise with your points about being a socialist in America, we in Europe are a socialist continent! So you should have no problems here, atheism isn't really an issue, I'm a Christian and despise some of the radical 'Christian' movements in America, in fact I'm not going to call them Christian anymore, I'm going to call them 'So-Called Christians'.

Would you vote for somebody who happened to live the first 19 years of his life or so in the U.S. but lived say 15 or 20 years in your nation? Or would you never vote for somebody who was born american, even if you agreed with their beliefs?

Anyways was just curious...
I can't speak for any other Germans - and much less the French- but I don't give shit where a candidate is from as long as I agree with his political position. I guess a lot of other people here see it the same way. Also, you wouldn't have to bash the US to get my vote- riding anti-*anything* sentiment would actually count against you, in my book.

Is great to hear some great attitudes like that.

I do not hate america however it has alot of problems... and as much as I'd like to do something about it(or well atleast something more, I do alot of volunteer work as it is) in the current political and social atmosphere... it seems damn near impossible.


I find nothing more sickening then when I travel to a big city near me and see the slums. See the people on the sidewalk who need help, who if given the right help could be incredible citizens. I see people spit on them, hell some people I know even show them violence. It sickens me so much how a nation such as the united states can have so much money yet care so little for the people who truly need them.


My dream is to make a difference, to cause change for the good. However I would not even be given the chance due to the fact that most americans assuming that simply because I'm an atheist that I'm automatically evil and have no morals.


I do not believe in a god, however that in no way means I have less morals. To me god can be found in a babys smile, it can be found in a playfull new born kitten crawling around and exploring for the first time. To me god is seeing a couple celebrate their 50th anniversary. I do not believe in a personal god however I do believe in the overall goodness of mankind. It just seems so wrong to me that people would label me an evil athestic socialist when all I want is to look out and take care of the people who truly need it.

It seems to me that european people are overall more accepting. Also how can one not fall in love with the incredible culture and history of europe? I was just worried that people there would look at my heritage rather than my values.

When it comes to Europe, I pride myself on being an accepting European, somebody who tolerates everyone, even those who hate my ethnicity, so long as they don't incite violence. Europe in my opinion is the real land of the free and I can really relate to your comments about the slums in American inner cities. I went with my dad once to Washington and New York as he is a spokesperson for the Greek Lobby Group, and we and other members of the lobby had a Private Jet and Limosuines and 5* Hotel Suites all paid for, then when you are in your hotel room you turn on the TV and see the slums of that same city on the news, you can't help but feel guilty and question yourself about whether you really deserve to be in such a pampered position.

And you know what the worst part is? Modern American Culture has dehumanized people so much that most of them don't even give a shit about people who can't even recieve the most basic care from their Government.

Is great to hear some great attitudes like that.

I do not hate america however it has alot of problems... and as much as I'd like to do something about it(or well atleast something more, I do alot of volunteer work as it is) in the current political and social atmosphere... it seems damn near impossible.


I find nothing more sickening then when I travel to a big city near me and see the slums. See the people on the sidewalk who need help, who if given the right help could be incredible citizens. I see people spit on them, hell some people I know even show them violence. It sickens me so much how a nation such as the united states can have so much money yet care so little for the people who truly need them.


My dream is to make a difference, to cause change for the good. However I would not even be given the chance due to the fact that most americans assuming that simply because I'm an atheist that I'm automatically evil and have no morals.


I do not believe in a god, however that in no way means I have less morals. To me god can be found in a babys smile, it can be found in a playfull new born kitten crawling around and exploring for the first time. To me god is seeing a couple celebrate their 50th anniversary. I do not believe in a personal god however I do believe in the overall goodness of mankind. It just seems so wrong to me that people would label me an evil athestic socialist when all I want is to look out and take care of the people who truly need it.

It seems to me that european people are overall more accepting. Also how can one not fall in love with the incredible culture and history of europe? I was just worried that people there would look at my heritage rather than my values.


I would vote for you. Although I am a devote Christian that does infact live in America, I agree with many of your ideals. America does to help the homeless. Once I turn 21 I plan to move to Africa and help Humanitarian Aide out there. And just because you are atheist, certainly does not make you evil. You are (from what I know) are a caring person who hates watching the lower of the population get stepped on and not having a chance to be usful the way they were ment to be. I guess I feel this way because I am what you would consider "low class" in the US. I will not go into it any more because it is a painful subject for me, but I have found that the lower-class give the most...

I have discovered that alot of people who are considered "low class" are actually some of the most genuine, sincere, honest, hard working people you will ever meet. Crime is usually a last resort, alot of people who get involved in gangs/drug dealing ect, ect are not bad people at their core. They merely want to survive. They are angry and feel that the world does not care for them, so why should they care for it?


If the angry poverty struck youth felt as if their nation actually DOES care for them then I believe they will in turn start caring for it.


One big controversial stance I have is higher education. I believe the goverment should have their own universities that give anyone who truly wants to go to college, tries hard to learn, and has the ambition and drive to better themselves... I believe they should be given that higher education. I think it is a true pitty that very bright minds lose all kinds of possibilities to better society as a whole simply because they cant afford to attend college.

britan is like an island we are facing a rising gun culture in the inner citys and alsorts of weird stuff and race immagrent stuff

ha, i am much like you, i am trying to make a difference and i am trying (in, i am not sure where i am right now) to get into politics with the greens in australia
right now i am helping a battle, andrew wilkie (fomer Senior Strategic Issues Analyst) against john howard (pime minister), tough i know
http://www.andrewwilkie.org.au/

I find nothing more sickening then when I travel to a big city near me and see the slums. See the people on the sidewalk who need help, who if given the right help could be incredible citizens. I see people spit on them, hell some people I know even show them violence. It sickens me so much how a nation such as the united states can have so much money yet care so little for the people who truly need them.
Wow... what I find sickening is your absolute certainty that nothing can be changed in your country, and therefore it's useless to try. The entire point of our system is that the ordinary, regular, uninfluential person can make a difference. I don't know where in the US you live, but it is not impossible to get involved in your community, in the politics and the running of it. I too am an athiest, and I'd like to see the opponent who runs against someone for any political seat who uses that as an argument against something - that'd get shot down so fast it'd leave their head spinning. Sure there's a bias, more in some places than others, but being religious is so not a prerequisite for running for any office.

I find it laughable that you believe Europe is so much better than the US. I mean, hello?? the european city I'm currently in has more than its share of homeless people sleeping on the streets. Trust me, people spit on them here too. Things are far from perfect here, and the fact that you think you should move somewhere else to get involved in their politics because their system is somehow superior or better or easier is also laughable.

I wish you wouldn't write off your own country so quickly. Globalization means that you can't run very far from it, anyway. Whatever political make-up we have affects the rest of the world. Stay here and stop throwing up your hands in the air saying it's "damn near impossible" and you might actually find that this place isn't so bad, after all.

If you feel so bad about the social conditions in your country, you should try to change them. Don't expect to get elected to Congress immediately, but don't give up all hope simply because you are atheist. If you don't mention religion at all are your chances really all that slim? We have enough socialist politicians here in Europe; America need more of people like you, not less of them.

Ever since I was a kid I wanted to be in politics however sadly I was born in america where being a socialist is seen as evil and if you are an atheist you have no chance in hell to elected at all. (Not ONE atheist has ever been voted into public office at any goverment level in the U.S.).

So I plan on moving to either france or germany, I have lots of family in germany however my heart is pulling me towards france.

My question is this. If I lived there for 15 or 20 years or so and became a very well established member of society, opened charities and such... Would I have a chance? or would they never vote for somebody who happened to be born in america? I was planning on perhaps trying to ride anti-american sentiment by bashing the hell out of the U.S. which hopefully would prevent my american heritage to cause me too much damage.

Would you vote for somebody who happened to live the first 19 years of his life or so in the U.S. but lived say 15 or 20 years in your nation? Or would you never vote for somebody who was born american, even if you agreed with their beliefs?

Anyways was just curious...
Europe is not all socialist. Most countries are either moderately liberal right-wing (Ireland, UK, Italy, Austria, Estonia) or moderately liberal left-wing (Germany, Sweden, Finland, Norway, Denmark, France, The Netherlands).

The religion of a politician is usually a non-issue in European politics.

Your ethnic German background would get you much more credibility as an American there than anywhere else.

If you are socialist and a well-established member of society, then being charitable and activist would help. The left-wing environmental Green parties in Europe are growing in influence, particularly in Germany. If you have and interest there, you could join them. You should earn citizenship of the country.

Europeans are not as anti-American as you think. We may dislike US foreign policy and mock aspects of your culture, but fundamentally, most of us like Americans. If you knew the language and society of your adopted country, your American nationality should not be a problem.

If you agreed with your beliefs, I would vote for you.

I don't know where in the US you live, but it is not impossible to get involved in your community, in the politics and the running of it.

Raising a people's army and seizing control of the state shouldn't be ignored as another option either.

ha, i am much like you, i am trying to make a difference and i am trying (in, i am not sure where i am right now) to get into politics with the greens in australia
right now i am helping a battle, andrew wilkie (fomer Senior Strategic Issues Analyst) against john howard (pime minister), tough i know
http://www.andrewwilkie.org.au/

Go the Greens :) I'm the same, torn between joining labor,being pushed around and possibily get somewhere, and joining the Greens and probably going nowhere. Oh, theres the Democrats too. Heh- I'll definitely go nowhere then.

Thinking about moving to France, also. I don't have any visions of it being a utopia though.

problem is that america has like only 2 parties
the republicen and the democrates

i don't get it how a country that calls themself the land of freedom can only have 2 different parties
if your not for the one you have automaticly have to be for the other...

i'm from belgium and we have many different parties
we even got a party AEL that is made out of radical Arabians
lucky they don't get foot in the parlement since most moslims don't agree with their idea's

Would you vote for somebody who happened to live the first 19 years of his life or so in the U.S. but lived say 15 or 20 years in your nation? Or would you never vote for somebody who was born american, even if you agreed with their beliefs?
Anyways was just curious...

I wouldn´t vote for any socialists.
Anyway: I don´t think you would have a big chance, neither in Germany or in France.
But what position are you interested in by the way????
To become MP in France you would need to win a constituancy (like in the US - principaly the same voting system - majority voting - however two rounds of voting if noone reaches 50% in the constituency). So I think you chances would be pretty low.
In Germany there are constiuancies as well: 50% are elected in constiuancies, the other 50% are on a party lists, which is decided only by the party itself. People have two votes (constituancy, party lists), however the second vote (for the party lists) is more important since it determins how many seats the party gets.
You could get a place on that party lists ticket though. However it is difficult for anybody to get to such a high position. The parties are loosing members but they are still very big, especially compared to the US and to the population of the country. The socialists are still having almost 700.000 members also with a heavily declining tendency (they are in power at the moment). The greens have more than 50.000.
The best chances for success do you have if you work in the public sector. One unfortunate thing actually since it leads to wrong thinking in the political class because of the under-representation of the private sector. If you are socialists you should also engage yourself for the unions - as almost all MP of the SPD are members of an union. If you joining the greens you should engage yourself for multi-culti, environment (Amnesty, Greenpeace, BUND, or others). If you are a lawyer you have also good chances of success actually. Teachers, unionists, lawyers - that are the main people of the political class. There are only a few economists - one reasons for the problems of the country which was once the economic locomotive of Europe and is now the sick man of Europe.

I feel really sad for you HumanismManifesto. I can tell you do not appreciate the freedoms you enjoy in this country, especially if you're willing to move to Europe to bash the country that allows you to be the person you are. Try moving to the Middle East, with the exception of Israel, or anyplace in southeast Asia and express your views like you are able to do in America. You would be thrown in jail in a heartbeat. I think I can speak for all Americans when I say, You're Welcome. (Please note the sarcasm)
On the other hand you're taking my offer that I silently make to any who complain about this country, you're more than welcome to leave.

I feel really sad for you HumanismManifesto. I can tell you do not appreciate the freedoms you enjoy in this country, especially if you're willing to move to Europe to bash the country that allows you to be the person you are. Try moving to the Middle East, with the exception of Israel, or anyplace in southeast Asia and express your views like you are able to do in America. You would be thrown in jail in a heartbeat. I think I can speak for all Americans when I say, You're Welcome. (Please note the sarcasm)
On the other hand you're taking my offer that I silently make to any who complain about this country, you're more than welcome to leave.Then if the Religious Right want a conservative religous state so much, why don't you go live in Iran?

Then if the Religious Right want a conservative religous state so much, why don't you go live in Iran?
That´s the wrong religion.
I don´t want a religious state but I would rather prefer a christian religious state than a fanatic islamic theocracy.

Since when have I ever stated that I wanted a "conservative religious state"? As I can recall I never have. Unless you want to call defending the traditional meaning of marriage as we have know it since Creation and as Jesus stated in Matthew 19:4-5

4"And He answered and said, "Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE,
5 and said, ' FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH'?"

Let me just note that I did not capitalize the words in the quote of my own accord, they are quotes from Genesis, the second longer set of capitilized words is from Genesis 2:24.

i'm from belgium and we have many different parties
we even got a party AEL that is made out of radical Arabians
lucky they don't get foot in the parlement since most moslims don't agree with their idea's

Hasn't your country's 'supreme court' just banned that Flemish Blok party, as it is "racist"?

I can tell you do not appreciate the freedoms you enjoy in this country, especially if you're willing to move to Europe to bash the country that allows you to be the person you are.
....
On the other hand you're taking my offer that I silently make to any who complain about this country, you're more than welcome to leave.
Heh, that's a bit extreme. I take exception to this thread too, but you're just contradicting yourself. In this country, you can say anything you like, but please leave it now because you're saying the wrong thing?


Since when have I ever stated that I wanted a "conservative religious state"? As I can recall I never have. Unless you want to call defending the traditional meaning of marriage as we have know it since Creation and as Jesus stated in Matthew 19:4-5
Yes, indeed, that's exactly what it means. Leave the stupid Bible out of politics already!!!

I don't know a great deal about France or Germany, but in Britain you would be very welcome, just avoid certain areas. In Britain any member of the commonwealth or the EU can stand for election and many do, there are many councillors who don't hold British citizenship, running local governments. I know of at least one Latvian MP and am sure there are other foreign nationals in the parliament. I believe however that as an American you would have to be awarded British citizenship in order to stand for election. I expect this is the same in other European countries.

My point is, Britain does elect non-Brits to its parliament, I expect other Europeans would too.

I never said that the thread starter said the "wrong thing" and because of that he can leave this country. What I meant was that if you want to complain about the conditions or the leaders of this country, then you may leave if you don't want to work through the system to change the conditions. I'll put another caveat on top of that, don't complain to me about the conditions or the leaders of the USA if you didn't vote.

I didn't vote and I still think I'm fully entitled to complain about Dubya. I do have to live under him if I stay in this country and do not have to like it.

Then again, I was 15 when he was elected. :P