NationStates Jolt Archive

I didn't think someone could get that low. I mean, I know that the presidential race is tough, but come on! Making a movie to slam one of the two candidates that has a serious chance during an election year? That's below the belt, if you ask me.

I'm not against free speech; he could say we went to Iraq because Saddam was smoking a WMD lite when he played poker with Bush at Camp David, if he wanted. I just think it's a very dirty tactic.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if Kerry funded it, or distributed it, or did something to help spread this bilk. My hopes that Moore hadn't survived being stomped by the oliphant at the last Oscars were crushed hearing about the release of yet another doc(tered)umentary.

Suffice to say, I hope it tanks, but I know it won't, because there are people whose lives are so empty that they feel like wasting two hours of them watching a movie telling them what they want to hear.

On a final note, I might go to heckle.

Out of interest, have you seen it yourself?

Thank you for yet another informative and completely unbiased review of a topic. How's that job at FOX news coming?

As much as I hate michael Moore, he can say what he wants. It is a free country. We may not like it but he can produce this filth.

As much as I hope it tanks too, I doubt it will. People will go and check it out and form their own opinions. Most of what Bush Said about Iraq is in the public record anyway. People can go and look it up for themselves.

Out of interest, have you seen it yourself?Did you read my last sentence?

Thank you for yet another informative and completely unbiased review of a topic. How's that job at FOX news coming?Hy-Vee, actually. How's MoveOn.org coming?

I don't like Bush OR Moorse, so...

I had no plans to see it but after reading a few comments here; now I have too.....

Thank you for yet another informative and completely unbiased review of a topic. How's that job at FOX news coming?

I don't get it, EVERYTHING is biased in some way. All you're saying is that your bias is better than his. Which is stupid.

Thank you for yet another informative and completely unbiased review of a topic. How's that job at FOX news coming?

I don't get it, EVERYTHING is biased in some way. All you're saying is that your bias is better than his. Which is stupid.

Sure everybody has a bias about something.

What is more stupid is making claims about a film you have not seen.

Reynes would have more credibility if he had seen the film.

What is eve more funny is that all this complaining is only making people(like me) go see the film when they had no plans to do so.....

Thank you for yet another informative and completely unbiased review of a topic. How's that job at FOX news coming?

I don't get it, EVERYTHING is biased in some way. All you're saying is that your bias is better than his. Which is stupid.

Sure everybody has a bias about something.

What is more stupid is making claims about a film you have not seen.

Reynes would have more credibility if he had seen the film.

What is eve more funny is that all this complaining is only making people(like me) go see the film when they had no plans to do so.....

I'm just tired of people so eager to bash the opposition that they don't think arguments through. Republican or Democrat it doesn't matter. I hate it all.

I hope everybody sees it and votes Bush out.

Is your life really that dull that you have to resort to complaining about Moore's film? If you are not going to see it, then do not pass judgement on it.

I have an idea why don't you guys tell me the following things:
"You are an idiot liberal!"
"You are un-american!"
"If a Democrat was president our country would have 43765 terrorist attacks!"
"WMD's are in Syria!"
"You hate Freedom and Liberty!"
There is nothing you can say that I have not heard before.

I didn't think someone could get that low. I mean, I know that the presidential race is tough, but come on! Making a movie to slam one of the two candidates that has a serious chance during an election year? That's below the belt, if you ask me.

I'm not against free speech; he could say we went to Iraq because Saddam was smoking a WMD lite when he played poker with Bush at Camp David, if he wanted. I just think it's a very dirty tactic.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if Kerry funded it, or distributed it, or did something to help spread this bilk. My hopes that Moore hadn't survived being stomped by the oliphant at the last Oscars were crushed hearing about the release of yet another doc(tered)umentary.

Suffice to say, I hope it tanks, but I know it won't, because there are people whose lives are so empty that they feel like wasting two hours of them watching a movie telling them what they want to hear.

On a final note, I might go to heckle.

You my friend are an idiot!

there are people whose lives are so empty that they feel like wasting two hours of them watching a movie telling them what they want to hear

you spent two hours watching it. Are you so empty that you must see it?

I didn't think someone could get that low. I mean, I know that the presidential race is tough, but come on! Making a movie to slam one of the two candidates that has a serious chance during an election year? That's below the belt, if you ask me.
......................... I just think it's a very dirty tactic.
:roll: Have you watched some of the campaign adds the GOP is putting out? Those things are popping up on national TV, slamming unsuspecting viewers with Kerry bashing in the middle of the evening news. With Moore's movie the viewer has to make a concious decision to want to see it and pay to do so. As far as dirty tactics, Moore is spanking clean compared to the Bush camp.

I love Michael Moore. Next to Josef Mengele, Stalin, and Marilyn Manson, he is my greatest hero!

I don't "hope" his movie tanks, I just hope the FEC bands it, because it's propaganda, not a proper Hollywood movie during an election year.

When Michael Moore was interviewed by Jon Stewart last night, he brought up an interesting point. Every time the GOP tries another tactic to block or discredit this movie, more people hear about it, and more are convinced to see it simply because of the controversy it generates. So you're essentially marketing his movie for him by railing against it. If you want it to tank, just treat it as if it's unimportant.

Besides, 'methinks the conservatives doth protest too much'.

I don't "hope" his movie tanks, I just hope the FEC bands it, because it's propaganda, not a proper Hollywood movie during an election year.

Tuesday...

Normally your intelligence, for an apparent conservative, impresses me. But I have to ask you, which is it...

1) did you not think through that post? or

2) do you support a repeal of the First Amendment?

If (1), I would like to point out that there is no "propaganda exception" to the First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America. There is a slander exception, a false report of crime/emergency exception, a lying to police/under oath exception, a fraud for personal gain exception, and a national security/state secrets exception, but propaganda remains, to this day, protected.

If (2) then I must ask: why do you hate America?

Of course the movie is biased, but with good reason.

2) do you support a repeal of the First Amendment?Nice arguement. You libs really like to pull that one. If we disagree with you, it must be because we're repressing you, but if you disagree with us, it's free speech :roll:
We are not against free speech, but free speech doesn't mean you have the right to shout "Fire" in a crowded building. Not everything is free speech. This film is propaganda. On NBC about an hour ago I saw a report on Moore's film where he stalks congressmen and tries to get them to enlist their children. Several said that their children were already enlisted and either in or on their way to the middle east, but Moore conveniently edited them out of the film.

This is not free speech. This is not about limiting free speech. This is propaganda, which in this case is about trying to slander one person and change people's votes by feeding them a line of crap.

2) do you support a repeal of the First Amendment?Nice arguement. You libs really like to pull that one. If we disagree with you, it must be because we're repressing you, but if you disagree with us, it's free speech :roll:
We are not against free speech, but free speech doesn't mean you have the right to shout "Fire" in a crowded building.


Problem slick. You can't shout fire because it will get people hurt especially if they panic.

Moores film is allowed since Freedom of Speech also inlcudes the ability to say stupid hateful things(well even that is under attack with the race speech laws....).


Not everything is free speech. This film is propaganda.

Propganda falls under free speech.


On NBC about an hour ago I saw a report on Moore's film where he stalks congressmen and tries to get them to enlist their children. Several said that their children were already enlisted and either in or on their way to the middle east, but Moore conveniently edited them out of the film.

So? Moore says he has an agenda. He has never denied it.

BTW: Whose children are they and what capacity?

Are they on the line or are they Press like dear ol' Al, or where they AWOL like a certain somebody!


This is not free speech. This is not about limiting free speech. This is propaganda, which in this case is about trying to slander one person and change people's votes by feeding them a line of crap.

Hmm then what do you call the shrubs political people doing to Kerry?

Propaganda is part of politics and stretching the "facts" is older then the country itself.

Don't forget the famous ad(which never aired) for Goldwater......

Actually, it's only considered slander if its a lie. Which, of course, Michael's movie is not. All the facts he presents are indeed factual. His opinions are just that: opinion. All of it is protected by the 1st amendment...and if Ann Coulter is allowed to write books calling us liberals "traitors," then Moore should rightly be allowed to make a pretty accurate, though admittedly biased, move about Bush. (He has openly stated that his movie is biased. He's not trying to hide it.)

I hope the movie breaks records, and Bush loses the election.

I hope the movie breaks records, and Bush loses the election.
Amen to that!

I gotta say, all of the furor raised by right-wing bashing of this movie is what got me interested. If they had just ignored it, I might have waited until it came out on video. I don't watch a lot of movies in theaters, but after all the fuss and counter-fuss I've heard, I just have to see this one--probably tomorrow.

2) do you support a repeal of the First Amendment?Nice arguement. You libs really like to pull that one. If we disagree with you, it must be because we're repressing you, but if you disagree with us, it's free speech :roll:
We are not against free speech, but free speech doesn't mean you have the right to shout "Fire" in a crowded building. Not everything is free speech. This film is propaganda. On NBC about an hour ago I saw a report on Moore's film where he stalks congressmen and tries to get them to enlist their children. Several said that their children were already enlisted and either in or on their way to the middle east, but Moore conveniently edited them out of the film.

This is not free speech. This is not about limiting free speech. This is propaganda, which in this case is about trying to slander one person and change people's votes by feeding them a line of crap.

Listen here.

This film is not propoganda.
This is about the president that you voted for, and the very real corruption and lies that people like you dont understand.
Moore has every right to make this movie and I have every right to go and see it.

Lets put it this way...

The only difference between this Movie, and Fox News, is that you dont like what it says.

Too bad.

Secondly, have you even seen this movie?

No?

Then by what right do you have to bitch about it?
Your making an assumption about a movie that you havent even seen.

Away with you.

Thank you for yet another informative and completely unbiased review of a topic. How's that job at FOX news coming?

:P

Fox news is fair and balanced, concludes new study by Fox news.

Well, Reynes, I'd say the left has thoroughly hijacked this topic. Let it die a peaceful death.

Well, Reynes, I'd say the left has thoroughly hijacked this topic. Let it die a peaceful death.

Thats probably for the best, since the right cant usually keep thier lies straight.

Well, Reynes, I'd say the left has thoroughly hijacked this topic. Let it die a peaceful death.

I have to agree! They did hijack it as usual. Let it die!

Hmph!

It's kind of like my niece and her friends

"You are not going to play the way I want so I am not going to play with you!"

:wink:

Hmph!

It's kind of like my niece and her friends

"You are not going to play the way I want so I am not going to play with you!"

:wink:

Of course...

The right is famous for "taking their ball, and going home."

I'm just tired of people so eager to bash the opposition that they don't think arguments through. Republican or Democrat it doesn't matter. I hate it all.

Finally some sense... thank you. I couldn't agree more.

2) do you support a repeal of the First Amendment?Nice arguement. You libs really like to pull that one. If we disagree with you, it must be because we're repressing you, but if you disagree with us, it's free speech :roll:
We are not against free speech, but free speech doesn't mean you have the right to shout "Fire" in a crowded building. Not everything is free speech. This film is propaganda. On NBC about an hour ago I saw a report on Moore's film where he stalks congressmen and tries to get them to enlist their children. Several said that their children were already enlisted and either in or on their way to the middle east, but Moore conveniently edited them out of the film.

This is not free speech. This is not about limiting free speech. This is propaganda, which in this case is about trying to slander one person and change people's votes by feeding them a line of crap.

Did you read what Tuesday wrote? She wants the FCC to ban the film. Yeah... we "libs" do tend to trot out that tired old First Amendment crap when you "cons" start talking about censorship. If it's really slander, a word you throw around at the end, it would already be being prosecuted. If it's a declaration of false emergency... well... how?

No really... how? Obviously you've seen the whole thing by now... what does it say that's false? Not spun... false? There is a fire... a bush-fire, and it's burning down the Fifth and Sixth Amendments as we speak.

I just walked in from seeing Moore's film and it's fantastic! My one complaint was that it wasn't harsh enough against the current American regime. Go see it!

Why can't it be all of the above it IS a biased movie, that incorporates three things 1 the facts 2 Moores interpretation of the facts and 3 artistic liscence because no one want to see the news when they go to the movie theatre. But it can be 100% true as well, the general scope of the movie is something he agrees with. One of the ideas of freedom of speech is that you get to see everything an make your own choice on the manner.

On NBC about an hour ago I saw a report on Moore's film where he stalks congressmen and tries to get them to enlist their children. Several said that their children were already enlisted and either in or on their way to the middle east, but Moore conveniently edited them out of the film.

Ummm, in the movie Moore said that only one congressman had a son in the armed forces....

This is not free speech. This is not about limiting free speech. This is propaganda, which in this case is about trying to slander one person and change people's votes by feeding them a line of crap.

As said before, propaganda is free speech.

free speech doesn't mean you have the right to shout "Fire" in a crowded building. Not everything is free speech. This film is propaganda.
If (1), I would like to point out that there is no "propaganda exception" to the First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America. There is a slander exception, a false report of crime/emergency exception, a lying to police/under oath exception, a fraud for personal gain exception, and a national security/state secrets exception, but propaganda remains, to this day, protected.

Your analogy doesn't work, and even if this were propaganda (and so what if it is? Election campaigns are all propaganda, and if this guy wants to give Kerry a little help against Bush's dirty tricks, let him) it's protected by your first amendment - quite unlike shouting 'Fire' in a crowded building. Personally I'd rather see anyone leader of the 'Most Powerful Nation on Earth'(tm) but Bush, as his warmongering in the middle east is like a kid poking a hornet's nest - The man's likely to get a lot of people killed through sheer inflammation of the situation, and I don't want to give him another four years to do it.

I just walked in from seeing Moore's film and it's fantastic! My one complaint was that it wasn't harsh enough against the current American regime. Go see it!

Absolutely. I feel sorry for people who's hometown theatures (sp?) won't show it. Pity.

I just got back from F-9/11 as well. I was expecting an awesome movie. I was definitely not disappointed. It was informative and entertaining at the same time (even my Republican friend who I brought along said he was amused by it). This movie will make some serious bank, and hopefully will get the truth out to the People!

I just got back from F-9/11 as well. I was expecting an awesome movie. I was definitely not disappointed. It was informative and entertaining at the same time (even my Republican friend who I brought along said he was amused by it). This movie will make some serious bank, and hopefully will get the truth out to the People!The truth that Moore is a liar? The truth that Moore misreprents everything in his movies?

The truth that it was *gasp* ENTERTAINMENT?
Everyone has a bias. Everyone's just not so up-front about it.
Also: have you actually seen any of his movies, or are you just going on hearsay and propaganda?

I was thinking more along the lines of the truth about Bush & the Saudis, the truth about Iraq, etc. But I suppose if you want to bitch and moan about the movie, that's OK too. Just see it first so you have something legitimate to bitch about, as opposed to talking points from Bill O'Reilly.

I was thinking more along the lines of the truth about Bush & the Saudis, the truth about Iraq, etc. But I suppose if you want to bitch and moan about the movie, that's OK too. Just see it first so you have something legitimate to bitch about, as opposed to talking points from Bill O'Reilly. Thank you. My temporary hero.

Is your life really that dull that you have to resort to complaining about Moore's film? If you are not going to see it, then do not pass judgement on it.

I have an idea why don't you guys tell me the following things:
"You are an idiot liberal!"
"You are un-american!"
"If a Democrat was president our country would have 43765 terrorist attacks!"
"WMD's are in Syria!"
"You hate Freedom and Liberty!"
There is nothing you can say that I have not heard before.

Really? I will try to quote George Carlin correctly (no I don't agree with his political mumbo-jumbo, but he's funny so I gotta): "Fuck Mickey Mouse with a big rubber dick, then break it off and beat him with it!"

I was thinking more along the lines of the truth about Bush & the Saudis, the truth about Iraq, etc. But I suppose if you want to bitch and moan about the movie, that's OK too. Just see it first so you have something legitimate to bitch about, as opposed to talking points from Bill O'Reilly.Bill O'rielly sucks, stop taking your talking points from Franken.

For everyone hoping the movie will tank, all I can say is, you're shit out of luck. It's easily the most powerful movie I've seen this year, and perhaps the most powerful in the last ten. My attention never dragged, even though there was nothing I didn't already know from keeping up with the news in the movie. You cannot watch this movie and not be affected emotionally.

For everyone hoping the movie will tank, all I can say is, you're shit out of luck. It's easily the most powerful movie I've seen this year, and perhaps the most powerful in the last ten. My attention never dragged, even though there was nothing I didn't already know from keeping up with the news in the movie. You cannot watch this movie and not be affected emotionally.We know what you think of it, you have been saying it for months. Now tell us, what did your daughter think?

1. You didn't spell O'Reilly correctly. Don't your conservative demigods strike you down for something like that?

2. No I don't get talking points from Franken (though I love his work).

3. You're confusing me. How can you hate both O'Reilly and Franken? How can you say O'Reilly sucks while still having George Bush's hand up your @$$ so far he could brush your teeth?

this is, of course, referring to FoB

1. You didn't spell O'Reilly correctly. Don't your conservative demigods strike you down for something like that?

2. No I don't get talking points from Franken (though I love his work).

3. You're confusing me. How can you hate both O'Reilly and Franken? How can you say O'Reilly sucks while still having George Bush's hand up your ass so far he could brush your teeth?well, the witty have struck. O'rielly is a tool, he is a hack. Much like yourself.

A tool. Who, specifically, am I a tool of? am I a tool of the Left any more than you are a mouthpiece of the Right? I don't think so.

For everyone hoping the movie will tank, all I can say is, you're shit out of luck. It's easily the most powerful movie I've seen this year, and perhaps the most powerful in the last ten. My attention never dragged, even though there was nothing I didn't already know from keeping up with the news in the movie. You cannot watch this movie and not be affected emotionally.We know what you think of it, you have been saying it for months. Now tell us, what did your daughter think?She wants the dvd for her birthday. Happy?

A tool. Who, specifically, am I a tool of? am I a tool of the Left any more than you are a mouthpiece of the Right? I don't think so.Your just a hack.

in the mediocre sense, or in the "I'm-getting-beat-down-by-the-Dems-so-I-should-start-making-ad-hominem-attacks" sense?

For everyone hoping the movie will tank, all I can say is, you're shit out of luck. It's easily the most powerful movie I've seen this year, and perhaps the most powerful in the last ten. My attention never dragged, even though there was nothing I didn't already know from keeping up with the news in the movie. You cannot watch this movie and not be affected emotionally.We know what you think of it, you have been saying it for months. Now tell us, what did your daughter think?She wants the dvd for her birthday. Happy?Imsomnia? My sons have that too, just turn on Air America Radio. Knocks them right out with the soothing tones of that Facist Rhandi Rhodes.

Last time I checked, Fascists were usually on the rightward side of things. They were always out to kill the Socialists (who, we can all agree, are left-wingers)

Fascist believe in the murder of leaders and ad hominem attacks, just a rhodes advocated the execution of Bush.

Hmmm...but when Ann Coulter advocates the murder of all leaders of Arab nations, she's not a fascist? Interesting.

Hmmm...but when Ann Coulter advocates the murder of all leaders of Arab nations, she's not a fascist? Interesting.Who said anything about Coulter? You. Rhodes is the Facist, advocating the murder of her president.

I've never heard her advocate the murder of President-in-Exile Gore
:twisted:

Hmm...are you SURE you know what you're talking about? No? Didn't think so.

But I'm done for tonight. So, big hugs to all the libs out there, and for you, FoB...

*SLAP*
and a hug

As manly of a pimp-daddy as I am, I must admit that, after watching it tonight, I almost cried during part of the movie. The 7pm was sold out before 4pm and the 9:30 before 6pm. (All this because in NW Arkansas, one of the fastest, if not the fastest growing region in the nation, only showed it 5 times, on only 1 screen, in only 1 theatre, which just happens to be the worst theatre in the area...) It was kind of scary watching it though. A bunch of freak shows in there...plus an old hippy wearing a shirt that said "Nader 2000" and had a pot leaf on it...

As manly of a pimp-daddy as I am, I must admit that, after watching it tonight, I almost cried during part of the movie. The 7pm was sold out before 4pm and the 9:30 before 6pm. (All this because in NW Arkansas, one of the fastest, if not the fastest growing region in the nation, only showed it 5 times, on only 1 screen, in only 1 theatre, which just happens to be the worst theatre in the area...) It was kind of scary watching it though. A bunch of freak shows in there...plus an old hippy wearing a shirt that said "Nader 2000" and had a pot leaf on it...You're in NW Arkansas? My condolences--I lived there until last June after doing 4 years of grad school at the U of A. I'll never go back to live there.

And I know what you mean about being overwhelmed emotionally by the film.

i saw dogeball at the local mega-plex then punched some filthty hippy that walked out of the farenheight 911 room thingy (ok, i cant spell to save my life) while screaming, "im rick james bitch!!!"

You're in NW Arkansas? My condolences--I lived there until last June after doing 4 years of grad school at the U of A. I'll never go back to live there.

Yea...and the only place they played the movie was in the mall. Icky, nasty. They didn't even sweep it between playings. (I work at the theatre in Fiesta; it is much better indeed.) What's wrong with NWA?

i saw dogeball at the local mega-plex then punched some filthty hippy that walked out of the farenheight 911 room thingy (ok, i cant spell to save my life) while screaming, "im rick james bitch!!!"

This is why I half-way agree with GWBush, there really ought to be limits to freedom...

You're in NW Arkansas? My condolences--I lived there until last June after doing 4 years of grad school at the U of A. I'll never go back to live there.

Yea...and the only place they played the movie was in the mall. Icky, nasty. They didn't even sweep it between playings. (I work at the theatre in Fiesta; it is much better indeed.) What's wrong with NWA?Mostly it's landlocked, and I grew up close to shores. Just never got used to being without inexpensive seafood. And it was way too conservative, too Bible-belt for my taste. But they did have some of the best steak I ever ate at Doe's, and there was a great Cajun place named Cafe Rue Orleans--Maudie was a godsend. And Wal-Mart just has a stranglehold on the area--cant handle it. It is certainly beautiful there, and I have some good friends in the U of A English department, so I'll go back for a visit, but I'll never live there again. I've got to be near an ocean.

Mostly it's landlocked, and I grew up close to shores. Just never got used to being without inexpensive seafood. And it was way too conservative, too Bible-belt for my taste. But they did have some of the best steak I ever ate at Doe's, and there was a great Cajun place named Cafe Rue Orleans--Maudie was a godsend. And Wal-Mart just has a stranglehold on the area--cant handle it. It is certainly beautiful there, and I have some good friends in the U of A English department, so I'll go back for a visit, but I'll never live there again. I've got to be near an ocean.

Ah, I see. Well, I was born in Memphis, lived shortly in Nebraska, and then all over Arkansas, so it's just what I'm used to I guess. I am going to the U of A next year to start work on my bachelors, but I assume your masters is in English?

I didn't think someone could get that low. I mean, I know that the presidential race is tough, but come on! Making a movie to slam one of the two candidates that has a serious chance during an election year? That's below the belt, if you ask me.

I'm not against free speech; he could say we went to Iraq because Saddam was smoking a WMD lite when he played poker with Bush at Camp David, if he wanted. I just think it's a very dirty tactic.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if Kerry funded it, or distributed it, or did something to help spread this bilk. My hopes that Moore hadn't survived being stomped by the oliphant at the last Oscars were crushed hearing about the release of yet another doc(tered)umentary.

Suffice to say, I hope it tanks, but I know it won't, because there are people whose lives are so empty that they feel like wasting two hours of them watching a movie telling them what they want to hear.

On a final note, I might go to heckle.
Why is a movie low? I understand that Bush has spent over $60 Million attacking Kerry right on TV and you don't even need to buy tickets.

Speaking of empty lives........

Ah, I see. Well, I was born in Memphis, lived shortly in Nebraska, and then all over Arkansas, so it's just what I'm used to I guess. I am going to the U of A next year to start work on my bachelors, but I assume your masters is in English?Master of Fine Arts in Creative Writing--and you work at the Fiesta? I lived close to the elementary school at the end of Rolling Hills (is that the name? the street next to the KFC and the gas station).

I don't live in Fayetteville, so I don't know most of the names and such, but yea, I work at the movie theatre in Fiesta. Best in Fayetteville.

For everyone hoping the movie will tank, all I can say is, you're shit out of luck. It's easily the most powerful movie I've seen this year, and perhaps the most powerful in the last ten. My attention never dragged, even though there was nothing I didn't already know from keeping up with the news in the movie. You cannot watch this movie and not be affected emotionally.
I am glad to hear that the movie is good. I am planning on seeing it tonight (Sat. night).

Here is a link to the trailer:

http://cinemaclock.sympatico.msn.ca/aw/trailer.aw?p=sympaticomsn&j=e&mv=Fahrenheit+9/11&i=20042

Thank you for yet another informative and completely unbiased review of a topic. How's that job at FOX news coming?

I don't get it, EVERYTHING is biased in some way. All you're saying is that your bias is better than his. Which is stupid.

Sure everybody has a bias about something.

What is more stupid is making claims about a film you have not seen.

Reynes would have more credibility if he had seen the film.

What is eve more funny is that all this complaining is only making people(like me) go see the film when they had no plans to do so.....

I'm just tired of people so eager to bash the opposition that they don't think arguments through. Republican or Democrat it doesn't matter. I hate it all.

I Agree! Green Pa... what the...*volley of democratic rocks Pummel The Green Partiest To Death* I Mean... Go Kerry!

prop·a·gan·da (n)
The systematic propagation of a doctrine or cause or of information reflecting the views and interests of those advocating such a doctrine or cause.

Technically, every post in this topic is propaganda as it is reflecting the views of the poster.

As far as the movie goes, I have not yet seen it so I shall not comment on it. All I can say is the Republicans must see some threat in it judging from how rashly they're reacting towards it (I.E: Banning it in cities such as mine, where the closest theatre showing it is about 75 miles south.) I think it's rather rediculous how they're reacting, because they're just generating more hype for it and more people will therefore want to see it. If they were just like "Eh, whatever," there wouldn't be as much controversy and not as much people will have heard about it. Again, I won't comment on it, but I've only seen this kind of reaction when someone says a truth that one doesn't to hear or want others to hear. 8)

Oh, and BTW: What does it matter if it's released on an election year? Bush's record speaks for itself, and if the people truely want him in office, he will be elected regardless of what anyone says.

Out of interest, have you seen it yourself?Did you read my last sentence?

I did and just wanted to clarrify that you were condemning something you hadn't even seen yrself.

Personally, I haven't seen it and while I do have sympathies for Moore's views I find his hysterical views have to be taken with a pinch of salt.

...views have to be taken with a pinch of salt.

Everything from everyone does. No one has any sort of absolute unbiased truth on any subject.

...views have to be taken with a pinch of salt.

Everything from everyone does. No one has any sort of absolute unbiased truth on any subject.

Exactly... but unfortunately too many people on both sides of the political divide take everthing from their favoured media source as read

I am going to see Dodgeball tomorrow. Its going to be awesome!

Listen if we keep moaning and whiining about it we just let more of moores followers know about the movie and he will get more money then origonal. I mean look at the passions. Some Jewish orginizations got angry at that movie and complanied publickly and know what that did. It made Mel millons so what I say is we just shut up about Moore. The thing is people are going to see the movie to see what all the hype is about.

Listen if we keep moaning and whiining about it we just let more of moores followers know about the movie and he will get more money then origonal. I mean look at the passions. Some Jewish orginizations got angry at that movie and complanied publickly and know what that did. It made Mel millons so what I say is we just shut up about Moore. The thing is people are going to see the movie to see what all the hype is about.

I believe, Moore is quite a gifted person when it comes to movies. And he could make documentaries and other movies that would get him way more money. Really. I haven't seen "Fahrenheit 9/11" yet, however "Bowling for Columbine" pointed out a bunch of aspects one should think about. And it's not like he can be refuted easily. There is no good reason to own a whole set of rifles. And if you can refute arguements given in 9/11 just go ahead. I'd for instance love to see how you defend Bush's view on gay marriage, in a country that claims to have seperation of state and church. The whole gay-issue is caused my Christian/monotheistic religions. Take the Japanese. They've never accepted Christianity or Freud. They are aware of their body and its lusts. If they feel like being kinky, they just do it, rather than making a fuss about it.

Back on topic again: Noone prevents you people from making a pro-Bush movie. And I don't think a lot of Kerry either. It's just that you people have this really "brilliant" two-party system that prevents you from having less radical people in your Government.

Back on topic again: Noone prevents you people from making a pro-Bush movie. And I don't think a lot of Kerry either. It's just that you people have this really "brilliant" two-party system that prevents you from having less radical people in your Government.

Actually there is a movie coming out sometime soon that is pro-Bush, but none of the right-wingers know anything about it because none of the left-wingers are making any fuss about it. People know that the truth is out there, and in fact, I think that left-wingers realize that these silly movies are not going to sway a whole lot of people. The only people who will be swayed are the ones who already are leaning in that direction for the most part.

Back on topic again: Noone prevents you people from making a pro-Bush movie. And I don't think a lot of Kerry either. It's just that you people have this really "brilliant" two-party system that prevents you from having less radical people in your Government.

Actually there is a movie coming out sometime soon that is pro-Bush, but none of the right-wingers know anything about it because none of the left-wingers are making any fuss about it. People know that the truth is out there, and in fact, I think that left-wingers realize that these silly movies are not going to sway a whole lot of people. The only people who will be swayed are the ones who already are leaning in that direction for the most part.Actually, the hope that political activists have for F 9/11 is that it will sway young voters, those who are most likely to see the film and potentially still undecided--also the demographic group with the lowest turnout percentage of any group of voters.

Hmm, yea. It'll probably sway undecideds and potential non-voters, but it's not going to steal any votes that the Republicans already have.

Hmm, yea. It'll probably sway undecideds and potential non-voters, but it's not going to steal any votes that the Republicans already have.And I imagine that's largely because they won't go see the film, having been warned away from it by moveamericaforward and Newsmax.

I'm hoping for two things here--the first is a big first weekend, which looks like it's going to happen. It made about $8.6 million last night on about 600 screens (the record for top grossing documentary ever is $22 million for Bowling for Columbine) and could break that record in the opening weekend. And I'm hoping it can hold on to an audience and continue to grow that audience through the upcoming blockbuster openings like Spiderman 2 that are going to follow. If it can make it through that minefield, it'll be the biggest moneymaker, dollar for dollar, for the year, and it'll tempt some of those who are refusing to see it because Limbaugh told them to to go out and see it.

Listen if we keep moaning and whiining about it we just let more of moores followers know about the movie and he will get more money then origonaly. I mean look at the passions. Some Jewish orginizations got angry at that movie and complanied publickly and know what that did. It made Mel millons so what I say is we just shut up about Moore. The thing is people are going to see the movie to see what all the hype is about.

Hmm, yea. It'll probably sway undecideds and potential non-voters, but it's not going to steal any votes that the Republicans already have.And I imagine that's largely because they won't go see the film, having been warned away from it by moveamericaforward and Newsmax.

I'm hoping for two things here--the first is a big first weekend, which looks like it's going to happen. It made about $8.6 million last night on about 600 screens (the record for top grossing documentary ever is $22 million for Bowling for Columbine) and could break that record in the opening weekend. And I'm hoping it can hold on to an audience and continue to grow that audience through the upcoming blockbuster openings like Spiderman 2 that are going to follow. If it can make it through that minefield, it'll be the biggest moneymaker, dollar for dollar, for the year, and it'll tempt some of those who are refusing to see it because Limbaugh told them to to go out and see it.
Alright, this is something I should know, but I don't. I was trying to find the opening numbers for this film because the local shows sold out and friends in the east bay and sacramento told me that the day sold out as well. At 600 screens, not only did Moore overcome the attempt to silence the film, he overcame documentary standards by opening larger than most (if any documentary). So my question is where were you able to find those figures.

*feelin' bad for not knowing....*

Alright, this is something I should know, but I don't. I was trying to find the opening numbers for this film because the local shows sold out and friends in the east bay and sacramento told me that the day sold out as well. At 600 screens, not only did Moore overcome the attempt to silence the film, he overcame documentary standards by opening larger than most (if any documentary). So my question is where were you able to find those figures.

*feelin' bad for not knowing....*This isn't where I originally found the info, but I couldn't remember where that citation was, so I found this one. (http://boxofficemojo.com/daily/chart/) It was the largest grossing movie yesterday, nosing out "White Chicks" (can't understand why :roll: ) and Dodgeball (actually pretty funny), both of which are on 2 to 3 times the number of screens.

Alright, this is something I should know, but I don't. I was trying to find the opening numbers for this film because the local shows sold out and friends in the east bay and sacramento told me that the day sold out as well. At 600 screens, not only did Moore overcome the attempt to silence the film, he overcame documentary standards by opening larger than most (if any documentary). So my question is where were you able to find those figures.

*feelin' bad for not knowing....*This isn't where I originally found the info, but I couldn't remember where that citation was, so I found this one. (http://boxofficemojo.com/daily/chart/) It was the largest grossing movie yesterday, nosing out "White Chicks" (can't understand why :roll: ) and Dodgeball (actually pretty funny), both of which are on 2 to 3 times the number of screens.
Want to know something extra embaracing? I actually knew about Box Office Mojo and for some reason skipped it thinking it wouldn't post daily numbers....i'm a jackass.....

an interesting note on that site, F. 9/11 is already the fourth highest grossing documentary-after day one.

It will likely be the highest grossing film of the weekend, but this is a vacuum weekend before a holiday weekend. Spiderman 2 will trounce it as expected, but no one would expect a documentary to do this well. Look for more screens next week.

What will be interesting is the fall out. Look at the top grossers and a lot of them come from the last 12 months. Step into Liquid, Control Room, The Corporation, Touching the Void, Super Size Me, Fog of War. We may, I dare say we are, on the precipice of the rise of the documentary. (on a personal level, I couldn't be more pleased.......if only I wasn't just starting out.....) I'm looking forward to the fare at the theaters for a time to come.

Thank you for yet another informative and completely unbiased review of a topic. How's that job at FOX news coming?

Aw. Be nice to the homophobic nazi supporter. He's only doing what he's been indocrtined to do since birth: hate all things rational, fear all things unknown, cling to the past like oil and slavery were the only thigns that keep the dollar afloat.

Does anyone else think that Moore might be a reincarnation of Herman Goring? Or, that the devil may have kicked him out again, depending on your religous belief system.

I say this because his film was more or less an attack on the rule of law. Trust me, if your a liberal you really like the rule of law. If your a ultra conservative, it's what the liberals have been using to get there way for the past 50 years. And if your a conservative, the rule of law is how it should be and should stay. Just for that I hated the film.

We may, I dare say we are, on the precipice of the rise of the documentary. (on a personal level, I couldn't be more pleased.......if only I wasn't just starting out.....) I'm looking forward to the fare at the theaters for a time to come.

When I went to see F9/11 I noticed that a documentary on Metallica is coming out this summer. Now that is a documentary that will most likely suck. (But I work at a movie theatre and will go see it just because I don't have to pay.)

We may, I dare say we are, on the precipice of the rise of the documentary. (on a personal level, I couldn't be more pleased.......if only I wasn't just starting out.....) I'm looking forward to the fare at the theaters for a time to come.

When I went to see F9/11 I noticed that a documentary on Metallica is coming out this summer. Now that is a documentary that will most likely suck. (But I work at a movie theatre and will go see it just because I don't have to pay.)
I saw a trailer for that. I don't like metal, rock, or metallica-BUT, that seemed like a compelling story and therefore might be a pretty good documentary. I'm actually looking forward to seeing it.

Thank you for yet another informative and completely unbiased review of a topic. How's that job at FOX news coming?

I don't get it, EVERYTHING is biased in some way. All you're saying is that your bias is better than his. Which is stupid.

You're right. It is. That's why I'm going to see Moore's film before I critique it and I'm not going to attack the film maker to draw attention away from the film itself. Michael Moore is not my favorite person on the planet and I completely admit that, while he may start with facts, what he usually ends up with is more like a rant. However, the attacks on this film so far have been less about where Moore's facts are incorrect and more about him as a person. Rey gave a very eloquent example of this in posting this thread. I reject that.

And incidentally, Rey, I currently work for the American Cancer Society, but would love to investigate employment opportunities with MoveOn.org.

Just a little update--top box office for the weekend even though it was on less than a third of the screens the other major contenders were on and broke the record for all time grossing documentary in its opening weekend. Guess it didn't tank.

Forgive me (if it's within your corazon) if this isn't timely ....

By E & P Staff

Published: June 27, 2004
NEW YORK They like Mike. While the country as a whole appears split, along political lines, over the controversial Michael Moore documentary, "Fahrenheit 9/11," movie reviewers at U.S. daily newspapers are not.

An E & P survey of 63 daily papers that ran reviews, in "red" and "blue" states alike, finds that 56 gave the film a positive nod, with only 7 abstaining, an almost 90% favorable rating.

The seven in the "anti" camp were: Detroit Free Press, Denver Rocky Mountain News, San Jose Mercury-News, New York Post, South Florida Sun-Sentinel, Philadelphia Daily News and the Charlotte Observer.

Among the "pro" crowd were reviewers from moderate to conservative papers such as the Boston Herald, Los Angeles Daily News, San Diego Union-Tribune and Las Vegas Review-Journal.

Many of the positive reviews expressed reservations but overall weighed in on the plus side.

The rest of the article is there, if you want opinions of some of the op folks at various publications, + and -.
Spin it however you want.

...views have to be taken with a pinch of salt.

Everything from everyone does. No one has any sort of absolute unbiased truth on any subject.

You know thats propaganda spread by salt-distributors you know?

I am going to see Dodgeball tomorrow. Its going to be awesome!
Just to update yall, Dodgeball kicked ass.

Very funny movie in a Starsky and Hutch way