NationStates Jolt Archive

Nick Berg
The second American
and now the poor Southern Korean dude?

Man WTF...? Do they think that this barbaric type of murder is popular amongst the Middle East? Do they think going around chopping off heads makes up for Abu Gahrib? If they want revenge, they should kidnap the ****ers that ****ed up in the prison. Not innocents that had nothing to do with the incident.

Damn...and these were the same people that launched one of the top 3 biggest attacks on American soil...

1. British burning the White House
2. Japanese bombing of Pearl Harbor
3. Terrorists destroying the WTC and slamming into the Pentagon

Yeah it is pretty F'ed up. But maybe the whitehouse thingy should be number three and the other moved up?

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.



It is a sin, What they are doing is sick and against the religion of Islam.

They're not very friendly, are they?

Or maybe instead of limiting that first one to the British burning the White House, you should say "The American Revoluion." And I guess we'll just completely ignore the American conquest of the Western Frontier as well as the Civil War...

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.



It is a sin, What they are doing is sick and against the religion of Islam.

Not really. Jihad is written into the Koran, I think.

It is a part of thier culture. I've heard tales that the Saudi government has public executions :shock:. And the terrorists are evil....

2. Japanese bombing of Pearl Harbor

Oh, missed this.. Pearl Harbor wasn't on American soil...

Hawaii didn't become a state till -August 21, 1959

It was on an American base, not American soil. ;)

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.



It is a sin, What they are doing is sick and against the religion of Islam.

Elecrocution is promoted in the Bible? Only think I remember hearing anything about in the Bible was crucifixion and stoning...and beheading is closer to that than electrocution.

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.



It is a sin, What they are doing is sick and against the religion of Islam.

Not really. Jihad is written into the Koran, I think.


Maybe you should read the Koran, Jihad is the pain you have to go tru to be a Muslim, It doesn't grant you the right to kill people.

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.



It is a sin, What they are doing is sick and against the religion of Islam.

Not really. Jihad is written into the Koran, I think.


Maybe you should read the Koran, Jihad is the pain you have to go tru to be a Muslim, It doesn't grant you the right to kill people.

Actually, depending on what part you read.. all religions do.

2. Japanese bombing of Pearl Harbor

Oh, missed this.. Pearl Harbor wasn't on American soil...

Hawaii didn't become a state till -August 21, 1959

It was on an American base, not American soil. ;)

That Island in the Carribbean, what's it called...well, whatever it is, I can't think of the name right now, but it is American soil even though it isn't a state. I mean...if you have to be a state to be American soil then Washington DC is not on American soil...

Or maybe instead of limiting that first one to the British burning the White House, you should say "The American Revoluion." And I guess we'll just completely ignore the American conquest of the Western Frontier as well as the Civil War...

The civil war was different. It really wasnt as much of an attack as it was "Americans" or confederates or whatever attacking. So either it was just Americans fighting each, which dosent really count, or those few battles that took place in the north, which, though most were horrific, just dont make the cut.

Okay, this is degenerating into a flame war soon....so I'm pulling out now.

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.



It is a sin, What they are doing is sick and against the religion of Islam.

Not really. Jihad is written into the Koran, I think.


Maybe you should read the Koran, Jihad is the pain you have to go tru to be a Muslim, It doesn't grant you the right to kill people.

Actually, depending on what part you read.. all religions do.


Then you misunderstand what parts you are reading.

It's absolutely terrifying and heartbreaking, all these beheadings.

Also, you can't forget Daniel Pearl.

Their families and loved ones must really be suffering right now.

How awful... :cry:

The civil war was different. It really wasnt as much of an attack as it was "Americans" or confederates or whatever attacking. So either it was just Americans fighting each, which dosent really count, or those few battles that took place in the north, which, though most were horrific, just dont make the cut.

WHAT?! How much do you know about American history?!? The Battles of the Civil War are the absolute worst battles America has seen.

2. Japanese bombing of Pearl Harbor

Oh, missed this.. Pearl Harbor wasn't on American soil...

Hawaii didn't become a state till -August 21, 1959

It was on an American base, not American soil. ;)

That Island in the Carribbean, what's it called...well, whatever it is, I can't think of the name right now, but it is American soil even though it isn't a state. I mean...if you have to be a state to be American soil then Washington DC is not on American soil...

You're speaking of Puerto Rico. And you're quite right in saying that the military base of Pearl Harbor was American soil even though Hawaii was not an American state. Its akin to embassies being considered part of the territory of the government it represents.

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.



It is a sin, What they are doing is sick and against the religion of Islam.

Not really. Jihad is written into the Koran, I think.


Maybe you should read the Koran, Jihad is the pain you have to go tru to be a Muslim, It doesn't grant you the right to kill people.

Actually, depending on what part you read.. all religions do.


Then you misunderstand what parts you are reading.

selective interpretation on your part?

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.

Steph, there is a huge HUGE difference between punishment and kidnapping/murder.

Perhaps you do not understand that yet, but I hope you will someday.

For a second there I thought the mods must really be getting out of control here. :P

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.



It is a sin, What they are doing is sick and against the religion of Islam.

Not really. Jihad is written into the Koran, I think.


Maybe you should read the Koran, Jihad is the pain you have to go tru to be a Muslim, It doesn't grant you the right to kill people.

Actually, depending on what part you read.. all religions do.


Then you misunderstand what parts you are reading.

Jihad is the Muslim version of The Christian's Crusades. So....eh...it's not like they're really doing anything that Christian's haven't done.

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.



It is a sin, What they are doing is sick and against the religion of Islam.

Not really. Jihad is written into the Koran, I think.


Maybe you should read the Koran, Jihad is the pain you have to go tru to be a Muslim, It doesn't grant you the right to kill people.
are you confusing Jihad with our journey to Mecca?

Because I've never been told to go on a Jihad

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.

Steph, there is a huge HUGE difference between punishment and kidnapping/murder.

Perhaps you do not understand that yet, but I hope you will someday.

The electric chair is not murder?
Woah...I don't understand that either.

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.



It is a sin, What they are doing is sick and against the religion of Islam.

Not really. Jihad is written into the Koran, I think.


Maybe you should read the Koran, Jihad is the pain you have to go tru to be a Muslim, It doesn't grant you the right to kill people.
are you confusing Jihad with our journey to Mecca?

Because I've never been told to go on a Jihad

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.The electric chair is rarely used, anymore. Even when it was used there was a trial beforehand. It is barbaric and an attempt at intimidation. If you look at that word, imtimidation, it is obviously an attempt to make all of those who oppose Islamic fundamentalism timid. It is not working. The South Koreans will continue in thier efforts to bring freedom and democracy to the people of Iraq. Steph, I know you hate Americans but I didn't think you would be so callous toward the unjustfied execution of anyone. It hardly seems in keeping with your Liberal doctorine.

They do it for shock value, and it seems to be working.

Btw, just to clarify - these people are maniacs, not Muslims. I find it ironic that while cutting off innocents heads they're shouting "Allah ackbar" (God is great)- when one of Allah's 99 names is 'Peace!' (Al Salaam)

Jihad means struggle, not "Holy War". (http://www.islamonline.net/fatwaapplication/english/display.asp?hFatwaID=51346) It relates to the struggle in the soul to conform Allah's will.

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.



It is a sin, What they are doing is sick and against the religion of Islam.

Not really. Jihad is written into the Koran, I think.


Maybe you should read the Koran, Jihad is the pain you have to go tru to be a Muslim, It doesn't grant you the right to kill people.

Jihad is also the struggle to create Ummah, or the idealistic Muslim society as seen in Medina and then Mecca during the time of Mohammed.
It's not always violent, and it comes in varying forms of personal jihad and communal jihad.
Whereas jihad doesn't mean to go and kill people, it could be as simple as really devoting yourself to your prayers five times a day, or treating your annoying neighbor with kindness, in the Quran it points out that if a Muslim or the Muslim ideals or Ummah is attacked by another, fighting back is called for. If they persist, then you can keep attacking them until they stop, or until there is no more of the enemy left.
Attacking those things doesn't neccisarily mean physically either, it could be with ideals, policies, emotions. The list goes on.

They do it for shock value, and it seems to be working.

Btw, just to clarify - these people are maniacs, not Muslims. I find it ironic that while cutting off innocents heads they're shouting "Allah ackbar" (God is great)- when one of Allah's 99 names is 'Peace!'

Jihad means struggle, not "Holy War". (http://www.islamonline.net/fatwaapplication/english/display.asp?hFatwaID=51346) It relates to the struggle in the soul to conform Allah's will.That is ypur interpretation of jihad, please try explaining thast to the Arabs of the world.

They do it for shock value, and it seems to be working.

Btw, just to clarify - these people are maniacs, not Muslims. I find it ironic that while cutting off innocents heads they're shouting "Allah ackbar" (God is great)- when one of Allah's 99 names is 'Peace!'

Jihad means struggle, not "Holy War". (http://www.islamonline.net/fatwaapplication/english/display.asp?hFatwaID=51346) It relates to the struggle in the soul to conform Allah's will.That is ypur interpretation of jihad, please try explaining thast to the Arabs of the world.

They'll find any excuse to use violence. Calling it 'Jihad' is convinient and a recruiting tactic among extremists.

They do it for shock value, and it seems to be working.

Btw, just to clarify - these people are maniacs, not Muslims. I find it ironic that while cutting off innocents heads they're shouting "Allah ackbar" (God is great)- when one of Allah's 99 names is 'Peace!'

Jihad means struggle, not "Holy War". (http://www.islamonline.net/fatwaapplication/english/display.asp?hFatwaID=51346) It relates to the struggle in the soul to conform Allah's will.That is ypur interpretation of jihad, please try explaining thast to the Arabs of the world.

They'll find any excuse to use violence. Calling it 'Jihad' is convinient and a recruiting tactic among extremists.

I don't approve of what they're doing at all and it's sick and twisted, but it has to be remembered that this happens in almost all religions...
I think it was good of you to point out that it is a tactic used by extremists. We see that in Christianity (and other religions too) how the more radical and extreme people often use the Bible as a sword, bending the words to their will.
Sacred text often has a lot of room for interpretation, and when in some hands, it gets bent in unfortunate ways...

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.

Steph, there is a huge HUGE difference between punishment and kidnapping/murder.

Perhaps you do not understand that yet, but I hope you will someday.

The electric chair is not murder?
Woah...I don't understand that either.

punishment by law =/= murder

THANK YOU, Come again!

They do it for shock value, and it seems to be working.

Btw, just to clarify - these people are maniacs, not Muslims. I find it ironic that while cutting off innocents heads they're shouting "Allah ackbar" (God is great)- when one of Allah's 99 names is 'Peace!'

Jihad means struggle, not "Holy War". (http://www.islamonline.net/fatwaapplication/english/display.asp?hFatwaID=51346) It relates to the struggle in the soul to conform Allah's will.That is ypur interpretation of jihad, please try explaining thast to the Arabs of the world.

They'll find any excuse to use violence. Calling it 'Jihad' is convinient and a recruiting tactic among extremists.

I don't approve of what they're doing at all and it's sick and twisted, but it has to be remembered that this happens in almost all religions...
I think it was good of you to point out that it is a tactic used by extremists. We see that in Christianity (and other religions too) how the more radical and extreme people often use the Bible as a sword, bending the words to their will.
Sacred text often has a lot of room for interpretation, and when in some hands, it gets bent in unfortunate ways...Extremist is a loose term, many Muslim, not few sopprt these sorts of actions.

They do it for shock value, and it seems to be working.

Btw, just to clarify - these people are maniacs, not Muslims. I find it ironic that while cutting off innocents heads they're shouting "Allah ackbar" (God is great)- when one of Allah's 99 names is 'Peace!'

Jihad means struggle, not "Holy War". (http://www.islamonline.net/fatwaapplication/english/display.asp?hFatwaID=51346) It relates to the struggle in the soul to conform Allah's will.That is ypur interpretation of jihad, please try explaining thast to the Arabs of the world.

They'll find any excuse to use violence. Calling it 'Jihad' is convinient and a recruiting tactic among extremists.

I don't approve of what they're doing at all and it's sick and twisted, but it has to be remembered that this happens in almost all religions...
I think it was good of you to point out that it is a tactic used by extremists. We see that in Christianity (and other religions too) how the more radical and extreme people often use the Bible as a sword, bending the words to their will.
Sacred text often has a lot of room for interpretation, and when in some hands, it gets bent in unfortunate ways...Extremist is a loose term, many Muslim, not few sopprt these sorts of actions.

Extremist is a loose term, yes, but what would you like to call them instead? I think extremist fits quite nicely... but none of us have one thing that we fit into anyway.

But about the last part of that... I don't believe it for a second. From my viewpoint and what I've heard and seen and known, very few Muslims support these violent actions. At least American Muslims, to generalize slightly...
I don't know where in the world you are or what situations you are seeing that might influence those that way, but from what I see... yeah.

I hate picking sides on arguments. So I just play both sides and point out stupidities...
The electric chair is rarely used, anymore.
Whether or not the electric chair is used much any more is not the point. The point is that Americans execute people as well.

Even when it was used there was a trial beforehand.
How do you know that these beheaded people didn't have a trial?
trial - Law - Examination of evidence and applicable law by a competent tribunal to determine the issue of specified charges or claims. www.yourdictionary.com (http://www.yourdictionary.com/ahd/t/t0343500.html) Trial doesn't have to be in court, and the fact that the people executed were in Iraq means they are subject to Iraq's system of law, and they knew that before they went there.

It is barbaric and an attempt at intimidation.
So is capital punishment.

If you look at that word, imtimidation, it is obviously an attempt to make all of those who oppose Islamic fundamentalism timid.
What do you think the color-coded terrorist threat chart is?

It is not working.
If Iraqi propaganda doesn't work as good as American propaganda, why was it necessary for us to go to war?

The South Koreans will continue in thier efforts to bring freedom and democracy to the people of Iraq.
Because Bush is going to help them out with North Korea if he is re-elected.

Steph, I know you hate Americans but I didn't think you would be so callous toward the unjustfied execution of anyone.
How about your attitude toward the war in Iraq? That's unjustified.

It hardly seems in keeping with your Liberal doctorine.
Is that a complete sentence?

DP

They do it for shock value, and it seems to be working.

Btw, just to clarify - these people are maniacs, not Muslims. I find it ironic that while cutting off innocents heads they're shouting "Allah ackbar" (God is great)- when one of Allah's 99 names is 'Peace!'

Jihad means struggle, not "Holy War". (http://www.islamonline.net/fatwaapplication/english/display.asp?hFatwaID=51346) It relates to the struggle in the soul to conform Allah's will.That is ypur interpretation of jihad, please try explaining thast to the Arabs of the world.

They'll find any excuse to use violence. Calling it 'Jihad' is convinient and a recruiting tactic among extremists.

I don't approve of what they're doing at all and it's sick and twisted, but it has to be remembered that this happens in almost all religions...
I think it was good of you to point out that it is a tactic used by extremists. We see that in Christianity (and other religions too) how the more radical and extreme people often use the Bible as a sword, bending the words to their will.
Sacred text often has a lot of room for interpretation, and when in some hands, it gets bent in unfortunate ways...Extremist is a loose term, many Muslim, not few sopprt these sorts of actions.

I'm taking the word 'extremist' in this sense to mean one who is willing to use violence to further their goals - sorry if this wasn't clear to you.

I think you're greatly mistaken saying the majority of Muslims support these actions. IIRC, there are about 1.5 billion Muslims (?) in the world. If the majority were willing to use violence the US would be in big trouble.

The trip Muslims take once in their lifetime to Mecca is called the Hajj. Jihad means struggle and is usually used in terms of everyday life and is peaceful. For example, if there is a high rate of theft in an area, they might go on a jihad against theft by trying to teach youth that stealing is against Allah's will. But when extremists gain power in anything... every part of the movement gets really distorted into propaganda.

So what Islam needs to do is to change itself from the inside. But it seems that leaders are not willing to change. Then again, I just read in the paper that at some Islamic nation summit in Turkey, a prominent leader condemned terrorism and gave a speech on how the countries need to wage a jihad within themselves to get rid of extremist violence by getting rid of poverty and repairing economies.

I'm not a Muslim myself.

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.
Steph, there is a huge HUGE difference between punishment and kidnapping/murder.
Perhaps you do not understand that yet, but I hope you will someday.
The electric chair is not murder?
Woah...I don't understand that either.

punishment by law =/=murder

...=/=? I still don't see why you consider frying someone on the electric chair isn't murder.

Deeloleo wrote:
It is barbaric and an attempt at intimidation.

So is capital punishment.

Who the hell are you to define what is barbaric?

I think drinking cow blood is barbaric. But to someone in that culture, it isn't.

If the executioners in Iraq were using an electric chair would that make it better for you? Or how about those poison injections like the US uses today...or what if the form of execution in America was beheading...

Barbaric (http://www.yourdictionary.com/ahd/b/b0068900.html)

:?

Who the hell is anyone to define anything? This all a matter of a difference of opinions and cultures. Why are you getting on to these people for their way of doing things? Who the hell are you to say it's any worse than the way we do things? When did whatever supersitious diety you believe in deem you Earth-God and Definer of Right and Wrong?

Deeloleo wrote:
It is barbaric and an attempt at intimidation.

So is capital punishment.

Who the hell are you to define what is barbaric?

I think drinking cow blood is barbaric. But to someone in that culture, it isn't.

Its all a matter of perspective... almost everything is. I can't think of anything right now that isn't based on culture and perspective....

They do it for shock value, and it seems to be working.

Btw, just to clarify - these people are maniacs, not Muslims. I find it ironic that while cutting off innocents heads they're shouting "Allah ackbar" (God is great)- when one of Allah's 99 names is 'Peace!'

Jihad means struggle, not "Holy War". (http://www.islamonline.net/fatwaapplication/english/display.asp?hFatwaID=51346) It relates to the struggle in the soul to conform Allah's will.That is ypur interpretation of jihad, please try explaining thast to the Arabs of the world.

They'll find any excuse to use violence. Calling it 'Jihad' is convinient and a recruiting tactic among extremists.

I don't approve of what they're doing at all and it's sick and twisted, but it has to be remembered that this happens in almost all religions...
I think it was good of you to point out that it is a tactic used by extremists. We see that in Christianity (and other religions too) how the more radical and extreme people often use the Bible as a sword, bending the words to their will.
Sacred text often has a lot of room for interpretation, and when in some hands, it gets bent in unfortunate ways...Extremist is a loose term, many Muslim, not few sopprt these sorts of actions.

I'm taking the word 'extremist' in this sense to mean one who is willing to use violence to further their goals - sorry if this wasn't clear to you.

I think you're greatly mistaken saying the majority of Muslims support these actions. IIRC, there are about 1.5 billion Muslims (?) in the world. If the majority were willing to use violence the US would be in big trouble.If you would read headlines you would see that those things are not only done to Americans or Israelis, but any Westerner, meaning white people or anyone they mistake for white or of European ancestory, and Asians. And I would direct your to a poll taken in < I think, 1995 about Suicide bombings that was conducted in many Muslim nations, at leaste those who would allow the question to be asked, and upwards of 65% answered that they were justfied.

If the executioners in Iraq were using an electric chair would that make it better for you? Or how about those poison injections like the US uses today...or what if the form of execution in America was beheading...
If the man had a fair trial, the permission of the U.S. government, a REAL reason to be executed, and a jury...THEN it would be acceptable.

But kidnapping, saying that this man will pay for Abu Gharib, and painfully beheading this man is NOT acceptable

For me, it's not so much how they killed them but the fact that they killed innocent people... you can put any form of killing them in, it would still be murder to my viewpoint. Those induviduals didn't go after the Muslims in question (that we know of at least), they just represented a larger group that isn't liked...

If the executioners in Iraq were using an electric chair would that make it better for you? Or how about those poison injections like the US uses today...or what if the form of execution in America was beheading...

Barbaric (http://www.yourdictionary.com/ahd/b/b0068900.html)

:?

Who the hell is anyone to define anything? This all a matter of a difference of opinions and cultures. Why are you getting on to these people for their way of doing things? Who the hell are you to say it's any worse than the way we do things? When did whatever supersitious diety you believe in deem you Earth-God and Definer of Right and Wrong?
what? is all of this acceptable now because it is "their way of doing things"?

I agree opinions are based on perspective however.

the man has no connection with

They do it for shock value, and it seems to be working.

Btw, just to clarify - these people are maniacs, not Muslims. I find it ironic that while cutting off innocents heads they're shouting "Allah ackbar" (God is great)- when one of Allah's 99 names is 'Peace!'

Jihad means struggle, not "Holy War". (http://www.islamonline.net/fatwaapplication/english/display.asp?hFatwaID=51346) It relates to the struggle in the soul to conform Allah's will.That is ypur interpretation of jihad, please try explaining thast to the Arabs of the world.

They'll find any excuse to use violence. Calling it 'Jihad' is convinient and a recruiting tactic among extremists.

I don't approve of what they're doing at all and it's sick and twisted, but it has to be remembered that this happens in almost all religions...
I think it was good of you to point out that it is a tactic used by extremists. We see that in Christianity (and other religions too) how the more radical and extreme people often use the Bible as a sword, bending the words to their will.
Sacred text often has a lot of room for interpretation, and when in some hands, it gets bent in unfortunate ways...Extremist is a loose term, many Muslim, not few sopprt these sorts of actions.

I'm taking the word 'extremist' in this sense to mean one who is willing to use violence to further their goals - sorry if this wasn't clear to you.

I think you're greatly mistaken saying the majority of Muslims support these actions. IIRC, there are about 1.5 billion Muslims (?) in the world. If the majority were willing to use violence the US would be in big trouble.If you would read headlines you would see that those things are not only done to Americans or Israelis, but any Westerner, meaning white people or anyone they mistake for white or of European ancestory, and Asians. And I would direct your to a poll taken in < I think, 1995 about Suicide bombings that was conducted in many Muslim nations, at leaste those who would allow the question to be asked, and upwards of 65% answered that they were justfied.

Cite?
It's all context. If the US suddenly went to hell extremist Christians would spring up sprouting rubbish from Numbers and Deuteronomy.

Anyway, I think you are doing a great discredit to the Muslim faith by tarring it with the same brush as Al'Quaeda and the like.

EDIT: This interview (http://www.islamfortoday.com/60minutes.htm) in the wake of 9/11 explains it a lot better than I can.

If the man had a fair trial, the permission of the U.S. government, a REAL reason to be executed, and a jury...THEN it would be acceptable.

But kidnapping, saying that this man will pay for Abu Gharib, and painfully beheading this man is NOT acceptable

Why can you define what is and is not acceptable for people of completely different cultures to do but I can not interpret my own definition for the word barbaric? Why are you so hypocritical? American laws are not international laws. American laws don't apply over there. It's a different culture, a different justice system. And like I posted before, the people who were beheaded knew (or should have know) they would be subject to Iraqi laws while they were there. I say it's their own stupid fault for being in Iraq during Bush's psychotic war. Whether or not you agree that the beheading is right or wrong, it's still stupid to even be in that area at this time...

what? is all of this acceptable now because it is "their way of doing things"?

I agree opinions are based on perspective however.

the man has no connection with

Morals, law, justice are all based off religion. Religion is not proven. No one is in a position to say what is right and what is wrong. I am not saying that what they are doing is necessarily right, all I'm saying is that you are most definitely not in a position to say what they are doing is wrong. What is "right" and "wrong" any way? They are intangibles. They are undefinable out of context. And you can't define them using a different context then what they are being applied too. If you could garuntee that you had the exact same set or morals as these people, then you might be in position to define their acts as "right" or "wrong" according to their morals. But it is wrong for you to apply someone else's morals to them.

Thing is, though that thing about "killing infidels" is in the koran, there is also a little thing saying basically that jews and christians don't count, since they all worship the same god, making them believers in God/Ala/what have you. Also, these muslim extremists are just that, saying that the religion itself condones this acts is like saying the Pope is a card carrying member of the KKK (if i recall, they do a lot of bible quoting). And not to be petty, but Christianity started it, remember a little something called the "Crusades", we basically gave them the idea of wars in the name of god. I might be wrong but that is the first time that religion was cited as the primary cause for war.

Edit: Also, that first one wasn't a murder so much as it was corpse mutilation, he was already dead when they cut off his head, you want proof, watch the tape, there is NO bloodspray (don't know about the other 2). Btw, why the h*ll did they behead a south korean... I thought they were just mad at us...

Deeloleo wrote:
It is barbaric and an attempt at intimidation.

So is capital punishment.

Who the hell are you to define what is barbaric?

I think drinking cow blood is barbaric. But to someone in that culture, it isn't.Who am I? To borrow a phrase that I heard a younger brother of one of my friends say to Mr. Jackson, his father, befrore being smacked and dragge into his house, I'm a grown ass man Mother-fucker! I'll decide what I think and what I say, thanks. Drink anything you feel is appropriate or don't, but don't tell me what to think!

Edit: Also, that first one wasn't a murder so much as it was corpse mutilation, he was already dead when they cut off his head, you want proof, watch the tape, there is NO bloodspray (don't know about the other 2). Btw, why the h*ll did they behead a south korean... I thought they were just mad at us...

Because South Korea is beginning to enter the war now and if they started picking on them early, they thought the could convince South Korea to stay out. Finally though, someone who isn't taking much of an extreme side (I don't think my side is too extreme in either direction, more of a critical thinking type side, like this guy). So, thanks for the post Leetonia, and thanks for thinking critically. Oh, by the way...Deeloleo, did you know your name contains "LOL" in it? I dunno if you noticed that or not, but that's what I've had the urge to type in response to some of your posts.

I mean...if you have to be a state to be American soil then Washington DC is not on American soil...
You are more right than you realise.

DC is a baaaaaad chunk of land. I wouldn't go there at night. Even crime riddled Maryland is 10 times safter than DC, and Virginia is 10 times safer than Maryland.

Stay away from DC if you can, it's Federal Property and many things you can have in the States, you can't have in DC. You can't vote (except for President, and DC local joke Congressmen) or defend yourself in DC (all guns, even in your DC residence, are illegal, ditto for knives, sharp objects or even live and/or used bullets. Stay away from DC.

Haha, I'll keep that in mind.

i think it goes-

1. pearl harbor
2. sept. 11
3. mexican dude raids texan town
4. brits burn ze white house.

Edit: Also, that first one wasn't a murder so much as it was corpse mutilation, he was already dead when they cut off his head, you want proof, watch the tape, there is NO bloodspray (don't know about the other 2). Btw, why the h*ll did they behead a south korean... I thought they were just mad at us...

Because South Korea is beginning to enter the war now and if they started picking on them early, they thought the could convince South Korea to stay out. Finally though, someone who isn't taking much of an extreme side (I don't think my side is too extreme in either direction, more of a critical thinking type side, like this guy). So, thanks for the post Leetonia, and thanks for thinking critically. Oh, by the way...Deeloleo, did you know your name contains "LOL" in it? I dunno if you noticed that or not, but that's what I've had the urge to type in response to some of your posts.

Some Islamists are going after France, and Germany. Two nations who didn't fight a war in Iraq, but DID get rich off the suffering of Iraqis.

It doesn't matter if a nation is in Iraq or not, the Islamists want all non-Islamists dead. Be they Westerners, Asians, French, Germany, British, America, other Muslims, and especially Jews. But a death, is a death is a death for their corrupt view of God...

You cannot reason with someone who wants you dead. You MUST kill him once you realise he's after you. The Islamist of today is the Kamikaze Pilot of the 1940's. We cannot leave Iraq and the Mid East until we take out the Islamists and bring peace to the region and let the other 90% of Muslims breathe free, starting with Iraq and Afganistan.

Edit: Also, that first one wasn't a murder so much as it was corpse mutilation, he was already dead when they cut off his head, you want proof, watch the tape, there is NO bloodspray (don't know about the other 2). Btw, why the h*ll did they behead a south korean... I thought they were just mad at us...

Because South Korea is beginning to enter the war now and if they started picking on them early, they thought the could convince South Korea to stay out. Finally though, someone who isn't taking much of an extreme side (I don't think my side is too extreme in either direction, more of a critical thinking type side, like this guy). So, thanks for the post Leetonia, and thanks for thinking critically. Oh, by the way...Deeloleo, did you know your name contains "LOL" in it? I dunno if you noticed that or not, but that's what I've had the urge to type in response to some of your posts.

Some Islamists are going after France, and Germany. Two nations who didn't fight a war in Iraq, but DID get rich off the suffering of Iraqis.

It doesn't matter if a nation is in Iraq or not, the Islamists want all non-Islamists dead. Be they Westerners, Asians, French, Germany, British, America, other Muslims, and especially Jews. But a death, is a death is a death for their corrupt view of God...

You cannot reason with someone who wants you dead. You MUST kill him once you realise he's after you. The Islamist of today is the Kamikaze Pilot of the 1940's. We cannot leave Iraq and the Mid East until we take out the Islamists and bring peace to the region and let the other 90% of Muslims breathe free, starting with Iraq and Afganistan.

You know...the only thing I really hate about September 11th is the fact that bin Laden said he attacked a civilian target because America is a Democracy and therefore, the acts of our troops and our country as a whole in the world are all the responsibility of the citizens. Well we didn't have a direct say in what goes on with our nation, we really should let people like Bush piss off extremist terrorist organizations if they are going to target civilians and make them responsible for things that in reality they really are responsible for...

I think it's funny that people keep quoting the Crusades as "radical Christian intolerance." The Crusades were political.

We cannot leave Iraq and the Mid East until we take out the Islamists and bring peace to the region and let the other 90% of Muslims breathe free, starting with Iraq and Afganistan.

Uhm...taking all the Islamists out of the Middle East is possibly the best idea I've ever heard. I mean, it'd surely bring peace to that area as Israelis would have all the room for expansion they need...I'm not sure that'll fly with many people though....I mean, completely relocating that many people...where you going to put them? Mexico?

I think it's funny that people keep quoting the Crusades as "radical Christian intolerance." The Crusades were political.

I'm a little fuzzy about the Crusades. Please give me a history lesson. How was it political? And I'm not being sarcastic.

They do it for shock value, and it seems to be working.

Btw, just to clarify - these people are maniacs, not Muslims. I find it ironic that while cutting off innocents heads they're shouting "Allah ackbar" (God is great)- when one of Allah's 99 names is 'Peace!'

Jihad means struggle, not "Holy War". (http://www.islamonline.net/fatwaapplication/english/display.asp?hFatwaID=51346) It relates to the struggle in the soul to conform Allah's will.That is ypur interpretation of jihad, please try explaining thast to the Arabs of the world.

They'll find any excuse to use violence. Calling it 'Jihad' is convinient and a recruiting tactic among extremists.

I don't approve of what they're doing at all and it's sick and twisted, but it has to be remembered that this happens in almost all religions...
I think it was good of you to point out that it is a tactic used by extremists. We see that in Christianity (and other religions too) how the more radical and extreme people often use the Bible as a sword, bending the words to their will.
Sacred text often has a lot of room for interpretation, and when in some hands, it gets bent in unfortunate ways...Extremist is a loose term, many Muslim, not few sopprt these sorts of actions.

I'm taking the word 'extremist' in this sense to mean one who is willing to use violence to further their goals - sorry if this wasn't clear to you.

I think you're greatly mistaken saying the majority of Muslims support these actions. IIRC, there are about 1.5 billion Muslims (?) in the world. If the majority were willing to use violence the US would be in big trouble.If you would read headlines you would see that those things are not only done to Americans or Israelis, but any Westerner, meaning white people or anyone they mistake for white or of European ancestory, and Asians. And I would direct your to a poll taken in < I think, 1995 about Suicide bombings that was conducted in many Muslim nations, at leaste those who would allow the question to be asked, and upwards of 65% answered that they were justfied.

Cite?
It's all context. If the US suddenly went to hell extremist Christians would spring up sprouting rubbish from Numbers and Deuteronomy.

Anyway, I think you are doing a great discredit to the Muslim faith by tarring it with the same brush as Al'Quaeda and the like.

EDIT: This interview (http://www.islamfortoday.com/60minutes.htm) in the wake of 9/11 explains it a lot better than I can.It was a Pew Reasearch study.http://people-press.org/reports/display.php3?ReportID=165 You mifgt notice that the farther west that the question was asked the fewer responded posittively, if it had been asked in the entire Middle East what do you think the percentages would be?

That Island in the Carribbean, what's it called...well, whatever it is, I can't think of the name right now, but it is American soil even though it isn't a state. ...
There is American bases around the éworld...
Take any base...like the ones in Irak or Germany....
no they are not American soil

What's with all this beheading? Cuz the terrorists think it's fun and they think it enpowers them. They think that they can win with this strategy and so they do it.

What's with all this beheading? Cuz the terrorists think it's fun and they think it enpowers them. They think that they can win with this strategy and so they do it.

But they have no alternative strategy.

There is American bases around the éworld...
Take any base...like the ones in Irak or Germany....
no they are not American soil

Uhm...I'm not sure but I think you said:
There are American bases around the world.
Take any base, like the ones in Iraq or Germany.
No, they are not American soil.

Yes, they are American soil, an attack on an American base any where would be grounds for American to declare war on you (and the UN would back it...)
I wasn't talking about military bases. I was talking about non-states that are part of American territory. All of America today as we know it started off as American territory, American soil...but it wasn't always a state. For instance, when we made the Louisiana purchase, all that land became American territory, American soil. Were there states there immediately? No...there were very few Americans there even. But it was American soil, and by attacking that land, a country would effectively declare war on America...

What's with all this beheading? Cuz the terrorists think it's fun and they think it enpowers them. They think that they can win with this strategy and so they do it.

But they have no alternative strategy.They presue an alternative strategy as well, that is no excuse!

What's with all this beheading? Cuz the terrorists think it's fun and they think it enpowers them. They think that they can win with this strategy and so they do it.

But they have no alternative strategy.They presue an alternative strategy as well, that is no excuse!

presue = ?

Their strategy is terrorism and it has been that way since 09-11-2001 (actually...way before that), what did you expect?

What's with all this beheading? Cuz the terrorists think it's fun and they think it enpowers them. They think that they can win with this strategy and so they do it.

But they have no alternative strategy.They presue an alternative strategy as well, that is no excuse!

presue = ?

Their strategy is terrorism and it has been that way since 09-11-2001 (actually...way before that), what did you expect?Would you please excuse my spelling mistakes(cough, jerk, cough). Yes they pursue other means than the beheading of innocent and often defensless people.

What's with all this beheading? Cuz the terrorists think it's fun and they think it enpowers them. They think that they can win with this strategy and so they do it.

But they have no alternative strategy.They presue an alternative strategy as well, that is no excuse!

presue = ?

Their strategy is terrorism and it has been that way since 09-11-2001 (actually...way before that), what did you expect?
Well, if they didn't resort to terrorism, how do you expect them to be heard?

What's with all this beheading? Cuz the terrorists think it's fun and they think it enpowers them. They think that they can win with this strategy and so they do it.

But they have no alternative strategy.They presue an alternative strategy as well, that is no excuse!

presue = ?

Their strategy is terrorism and it has been that way since 09-11-2001 (actually...way before that), what did you expect?
Well, if they didn't resort to terrorism, how do you expect them to be heard?Wow, that is exactly the justification for the war in Iraq and others that will bring political rights to the Middle East!

Wow, that is exactly the justification for the war in Iraq and others that will bring political rights to the Middle East!

well, some don't like democracy / American imperialism. they have no other way to be heard, so they must resort to terrorism. like a baby throwing tantrums when it is ignored.

Wow, that is exactly the justification for the war in Iraq and others that will bring political rights to the Middle East!

well, some don't like democracy / American imperialism. they have no other way to be heard, so they must resort to terrorism. like a baby throwing tantrums when it is ignored.Exactly! Give them an actual political means to aire thier grievances and terrorism will disappear.

Wow, that is exactly the justification for the war in Iraq and others that will bring political rights to the Middle East!

well, some don't like democracy / American imperialism. they have no other way to be heard, so they must resort to terrorism. like a baby throwing tantrums when it is ignored.Exactly! Give them an actual political means to aire thier grievances and terrorism will disappear.

What makes you think that the U.S. is going to allow complete free speech in Iraq? Bush will install a puppet and claim that he is democratically elected. You think Bush will allow Muslim radicals to be elected into power? I don't think so.

Wow, that is exactly the justification for the war in Iraq and others that will bring political rights to the Middle East!

well, some don't like democracy / American imperialism. they have no other way to be heard, so they must resort to terrorism. like a baby throwing tantrums when it is ignored.Exactly! Give them an actual political means to aire thier grievances and terrorism will disappear.

What makes you think that the U.S. is going to allow complete free speech in Iraq? Bush will install a puppet and claim that he is democratically elected. You think Bush will allow Muslim radicals to be elected into power? I don't think so.Do you think that the average Iraqi wants radical Islamists in power, I don't think so. Bush can't install a puppet, everyone, Iraqis included, are watching too closely. Anyone that respesnts the views of Iraqis is fine with me, if it leads to the same in the rest of the Middle East, it would eliminate the need for terrorism.

It's part of their culture, like Americans are known for the electric chair. I'spose.



It is a sin, What they are doing is sick and against the religion of Islam.

It's also a common method of execution in the Middle East.

Do you think that the average Iraqi wants radical Islamists in power, I don't think so. Bush can't install a puppet, everyone, Iraqis included, are watching too closely. Anyone that respesnts the views of Iraqis is fine with me, if it leads to the same in the rest of the Middle East, it would eliminate the need for terrorism.

Uhm...Afghanistan, the first time Saddam came to power, and the original time Castro came to power all are ringing bells in my mind...

i think you have a point. but the terrorist are trying to say that if the americans don't stop killing the terrorist they will continue killing people this way.

i think you have a point. but the terrorist are trying to say that if the americans don't stop killing the terrorist they will continue killing people this way.

Because it's the 'in' thing in terrorism these days. Next it'll be belly-button rings.

Crazy kids.

Do you think that the average Iraqi wants radical Islamists in power, I don't think so. Bush can't install a puppet, everyone, Iraqis included, are watching too closely. Anyone that respesnts the views of Iraqis is fine with me, if it leads to the same in the rest of the Middle East, it would eliminate the need for terrorism.

Uhm...Afghanistan, the first time Saddam came to power, and the original time Castro came to power all are ringing bells in my mind...I've heard many make the claim that the US had something to do with those, but I've never seen any proof. The Taliban and Castro were products of US non-involvement, Saddam was not backed by the US until he brought a halt to the thoecratic revolution the the Iranian zealots had planned, when the world, west and east, united beind him.