NationStates Jolt Archive

This is a documentary that will released at around the same time as Farenheit 911.

http://www.michaelmoorehatesamerica.com/

No prizes for what it's going to be about.

anyone who thinks that has never read his books, or seen his movies.

He loves this country, he's just hates the man whos ruining it.

Guess who THAT is?

"You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life."- Winston Churchill

It occured to me when browsing that site what a massive and profound impact Moore is having on america. As far as I know, america is not used to having such a well known figure be as unapologetically left wing.
The conservatives are shocked and, as this site shows, they feel threatened now.

hell yes. its about goddamn time someone did something like that. (and yes that fat piece of shit does hate america)

Any one who would want to silence a person exercising their 1st Amendment right of free speech in my mind would be the real person who hates America.. because isn't that what freedom is about! You don't have to agree with him. Yet you do have to respect his right to say whatever he wishes even if you don't agree, that's respect for freedom. Or have some Americans forgot that?

hell yes. its about goddamn time someone did something like that. (and yes that fat piece of shit does hate america)

I have always found conservative argument and thinking to be too far-fetched and extreme. You just backed up that assessment.

Any one who would want to silence a person exercising their 1st Amendment right of free speech in my mind would be the real person who hates America.. because isn't that what freedom is about! You don't have to agree with him. Yet you do have to respect his right to say whatever he wishes even if you don't agree, that's respect for freedom. Or have some Americans forgot that?

free speech is a big mistake, but lets not get too far into that....*is not american*

hell yes. its about goddamn time someone did something like that. (and yes that fat piece of shit does hate america)

I have always found conservative argument and thinking to be too far-fetched and extreme. You just backed up that assessment.

im sure if i gave a damn that would have had some profound affect on my views on society as a whole.... but i gave up on caring about what other people thought of me or my opinions long ago

hell yes. its about goddamn time someone did something like that. (and yes that fat piece of shit does hate america)

I have always found conservative argument and thinking to be too far-fetched and extreme. You just backed up that assessment.

im sure if i gave a damn that would have had some profound affect on my views on society as a whole.... but i gave up on caring about what other people thought of me or my opinions long ago

And that is why conservative politics will never be mainstream.

Any one who would want to silence a person exercising their 1st Amendment right of free speech in my mind would be the real person who hates America.. because isn't that what freedom is about! You don't have to agree with him. Yet you do have to respect his right to say whatever he wishes even if you don't agree, that's respect for freedom. Or have some Americans forgot that?

but when major conservatives start speaking out its okay for them to be laughed at and such? and what do you care anyway, you're not even american

hell yes. its about goddamn time someone did something like that. (and yes that fat piece of shit does hate america)

I have always found conservative argument and thinking to be too far-fetched and extreme. You just backed up that assessment.

im sure if i gave a damn that would have had some profound affect on my views on society as a whole.... but i gave up on caring about what other people thought of me or my opinions long ago

Well, I respect THAT at least

Any one who would want to silence a person exercising their 1st Amendment right of free speech in my mind would be the real person who hates America.. because isn't that what freedom is about! You don't have to agree with him. Yet you do have to respect his right to say whatever he wishes even if you don't agree, that's respect for freedom. Or have some Americans forgot that?

but when major conservatives start speaking out its okay for them to be laughed at and such? and what do you care anyway, you're not even american

A) I am American.. I too live in North America.

B) I believe in free speech

C) Just like they have a right to free speech, so do you. and I have a right to disagree with it.

D) Get it?

Any one who would want to silence a person exercising their 1st Amendment right of free speech in my mind would be the real person who hates America.. because isn't that what freedom is about! You don't have to agree with him. Yet you do have to respect his right to say whatever he wishes even if you don't agree, that's respect for freedom. Or have some Americans forgot that?

but when major conservatives start speaking out its okay for them to be laughed at and such? and what do you care anyway, you're not even american

A) I am American.. I too live in North America.

B) I believe in free speech

C) Just like they have a right to free speech, so do you. and I have a right to disagree with it.

D) Get it?

cute

Any one who would want to silence a person exercising their 1st Amendment right of free speech in my mind would be the real person who hates America.. because isn't that what freedom is about! You don't have to agree with him. Yet you do have to respect his right to say whatever he wishes even if you don't agree, that's respect for freedom. Or have some Americans forgot that?

but when major conservatives start speaking out its okay for them to be laughed at and such? and what do you care anyway, you're not even american

A) I am American.. I too live in North America.

B) I believe in free speech

C) Just like they have a right to free speech, so do you. and I have a right to disagree with it.

D) Get it?

aww to hell with it. free speech is a mistake because people are allowed to say potentially damaging things, although i have no qualms with speaking out against a government

Here we see the usual conservative approach to free speech - passionately defending it, except in those cases where someone excercising it disagrees with them about something.

At least liberals accept that free speech can bite them on the a*se, while conservatives remain in denial.

Any one who would want to silence a person exercising their 1st Amendment right of free speech in my mind would be the real person who hates America.. because isn't that what freedom is about! You don't have to agree with him. Yet you do have to respect his right to say whatever he wishes even if you don't agree, that's respect for freedom. Or have some Americans forgot that?:Gives a hearty hug: "Well said!" Shortly after the "war" in Afganistan (sp?) began, my stepmother was fussing about the protesters being unamerican. Frankly, protest is American. If we just go along with whatever the government tells us, then we are disrespecting all the people who fought and died to protect our right to speak out against corruption.

hell yes. its about goddamn time someone did something like that. (and yes that fat piece of shit does hate america)

I have always found conservative argument and thinking to be too far-fetched and extreme. You just backed up that assessment.

im sure if i gave a damn that would have had some profound affect on my views on society as a whole.... but i gave up on caring about what other people thought of me or my opinions long ago

If you truly didn't care what other people thought of your opinions I really doubt you would be wasting yoyr time sharing them with us.

hell yes. its about goddamn time someone did something like that. (and yes that fat piece of shit does hate america)

I have always found conservative argument and thinking to be too far-fetched and extreme. You just backed up that assessment.

im sure if i gave a damn that would have had some profound affect on my views on society as a whole.... but i gave up on caring about what other people thought of me or my opinions long ago

If you truly didn't care what other people thought of your opinions I really doubt you would be wasting yoyr time sharing them with us.

hey, im an asshole. what can i do? :D

Shut up?

Micheal Moore LOVES AMERICA so much that he spends his life defending it from the right wing who care only about how much money they have in the bank. If he hated it he has enough money to go somewhere else to live.

Micheal Moore LOVES AMERICA so much that he spends his life defending it from the right wing who care only about how much money they have in the bank. If he hated it he has enough money to go somewhere else to live.

"A true patriot defends his country from his government."

My impression was that:-

He loves what it should stand for

He Hates what it appear and does stand for




Hum interesting side question, do people think america is a liberal or conservative nation (compared to other deomcarcys)

Historicallys its been and i think still is a conservative nation

I'll simply repeat what has already been said because it's an intellengent statement: Moore loves the country, hates the person running it.

As hard as this might be to believe, being the president of the United States doesn't make you the god of the United States. Shocking, I know.

I'll simply repeat what has already been said because it's an intellengent statement: Moore loves the country, hates the person running it.

As hard as this might be to believe, being the president of the United States doesn't make you the god of the United States. Shocking, I know.

Or it's King.

Yeah, I remember we fought some war or something about that. DOn't remember much else. I know it was certainly revolutionary ;)

(feel free to throw tomatoes at me for that horrible, HORRIBLE play on words :p)

---Post deleted by NationStates Moderators---

You know, that's actually kinda funny, in a cheesy way :p

Michael Moore doesn't hate America, and while I don't agree with him, I will defend his right to "hate" America if he chooses.

Did anyone read anything more on that webpage than the title of the movie (libs and cons alike)?
"I’m a passionate guy with a camera who has a different perspective. Who the F&!% was Michael Moore to take on GM? I mean, really people, let’s be a little more tolerant of others’ opinions… Just because I disagree with Moore doesn’t mean my opinion isn’t valid, does it? Of course, I’ve noticed that Moore’s fans may be some of the least tolerant people in the world. I’ve actually received death threats from people who claim that it’s important to be heard, but demand that I shut up… I guess the 1st Amendment only applies when we’re at a protest or are demanding redistribution of wealth…"
I really recommend hitting up the news (http://www.michaelmoorehatesamerica.com/news.html)
He is in no way trying to say Michael Moore isn't allowed freedom of speech. From the trailer it seems as though he's actually doing a "Roger and Me" style documentary (though he wants it to be as unbiased as possible) with him chasing down Michael Moore....but guess who just doesn't have time to see him? Tee hee....
I don't get why so many of you keep insulting Mike Wilson saying "Doesn't he believe in freedom of speech?" Of course he does...but don't you?
(of course you're allowed to say whatever you want...blah blah blah...It just doesn't seem the best policy to attack what someone says with "But what about free speech?" especially if they aren't saying "You shouldn't be able to say this")

All I said was what I believed Moore was :p

I've said nothing about the other guy. :P

Man, I seen something like this on dead ringers. Dubya makes his own "Dokumentry". It's hilarious. He's in the oval office pretending to be "Michael More", with a baseball cap on, and he gets a phone call. he says "Why do I make fun of our great president? Because I'm a weiner... heh heh heh heh"

I hope it's like that.

He is in no way trying to say Michael Moore isn't allowed freedom of speech. From the trailer it seems as though he's actually doing a "Roger and Me" style documentary (though he wants it to be as unbiased as possible) with him chasing down Michael Moore....but guess who just doesn't have time to see him?

Er, how can it be "unbiased" with a title like "(insert person here) Hates America"?

Frankly, I think he should be able to make his little film and it probably will show that MM is a jerk. However, that doesn't make his points about the connection between Bush and the Saudi royal family any less relevant. If he's looking to run a little character assasination, that's fine, go right ahead. Hell, our born-again, incredibly moral President "approves" that sort of thing so it must be okay. It doesn't make me feel any differently about MM having a right to say his piece as well.

<Activate Liberal Killer>
<System Activated>
<Weapons System Loaded>
<Liberal Neutralized>
<Mission Accomplished>So how many threads are you going to post this on?

And more importantly--how loudly would you be calling liberals hypocrites if they posted something similar? Pretty loudly, I'd say.

Man, I seen something like this on dead ringers. Dubya makes his own "Dokumentry". It's hilarious. He's in the oval office pretending to be "Michael More", with a baseball cap on, and he gets a phone call. he says "Why do I make fun of our great president? Because I'm a weiner... heh heh heh heh"

I hope it's like that.

Dead Ringers is pure genius.

im sure if i gave a damn that would have had some profound affect on my views on society as a whole.... but i gave up on caring about what other people thought of me or my opinions long ago

umm so why post immaterial inflamatory statements? I thought you enjoyed pissing people off, if not, boy are you on the wrong track...

C) Just like they have a right to free speech, so do you. and I have a right to disagree with it.

Reminds me of something:

"I disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." Voltaire

C) Just like they have a right to free speech, so do you. and I have a right to disagree with it.

Reminds me of something:

"I disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." Voltaire

If conservatives want to waste their time smearing a filmmaker instead of making actual arguments, that's fine by me. It's their loss.

If conservatives want to waste their time smearing a filmmaker instead of making actual arguments, that's fine by me. It's their loss.
I think the idea is to show the other side of the arguments MM makes in his movies- I mean, Moore has admitted that he's movies aren't factual, but are actually his representations of what's going on. I mean, I think that Michael Moore's movies are funny (although the show "The Awful Truth" could be best summed up as "just awful") but I don't think that they should be taken as fact and therefore anyone who disagrees is defaming and lying etc...

And as for people saying that all Michael Moore hates is George Bush...you might like to know that he did have several things out before this newest movie. Bowling for Columbine was not about Bush and neither is Roger and Me, or The Awful Truth. I think there are plenty of things he dislikes- and sure, go change the things you dislike, that is the whole point of being American. I do the same thing :wink: But it's a weak argument to say that the only thing he hates is the president

He is in no way trying to say Michael Moore isn't allowed freedom of speech. From the trailer it seems as though he's actually doing a "Roger and Me" style documentary (though he wants it to be as unbiased as possible) with him chasing down Michael Moore....but guess who just doesn't have time to see him?

Er, how can it be "unbiased" with a title like "(insert person here) Hates America"?
Well it can't be unbiased- that was the main point I got from the trailer. But he did have someone saying that he liked Michael Moore in the preview, and didn't portray him as a complete idiot just because he held a different belief. And yes, while the title might bias someone who is planning on going to see the movie, until you do see it, for all you know it might actually be disputing that claim. I just don't think the title in and of itself can make the movie biased or not.

This is a documentary that will released at around the same time as Farenheit 911.

http://www.michaelmoorehatesamerica.com/

No prizes for what it's going to be about.

A typical conservative response to someone that disagrees with them.

http://files.blog-city.com/files/aa/6190/b/liberal%20poster%203.png

Here is a typical conservative flag waving poster

Sad. He is something of a fool, but I doubt seriously he "hates" america. What a crock. I can't stand the fact the Moore feels the need to lie to "prove" his points, the truth is enough.

The right-wing response to Moore has been utterly disgusting. I've seen their commentators spew bile about his personal wealth- which he made himself. They actually said the phrase "class warfare" on fox news. I find it pathetic; and unworthy of anyone who seeks power.

You know Niccolo Medici, I've found the right-wing's "debunking" of Moore's previous films less than convincing in the past, but I have yet to see any attempt to "debunk" his latest film. Do you know if there's a reason for that?

Now I am a very liberal american, and agree with almost every stance micheal moore has taken publicly, but I must say, that if you research at all into SOME (not most) of the claims he makes, you will find that a few of them are nearly baseless. Now I understand that his right to free speach also give him the right to produce movies containing information presented as fact, that may or may not be true. But in my oppinion, he should stick stick to relaying proven facts to people in the interest of journalistic integrity. Even other liberal truth seeking websites and publications have chastised him for diminishing the credibility of us all (the conservatives lump us all together) with his half-truths and personal assertions put on film as fact. I still love his work and think he's one of the better film-makers out there today, but if the conservatives are going to be beated, it won't be by underhanded tactics and shady dealings. If we just stick to the high minded underlying principles that are the basis of our views as liberals, the thinking peoples will come aroumd.

I look at Michael Moore, with his offbeat look on life, then I look at the fascists spewing crap on FOX, and I think to myself, he is so much more witty, and funny. Hey, that's showbusiness. :P

You know Niccolo Medici, I've found the right-wing's "debunking" of Moore's previous films less than convincing in the past, but I have yet to see any attempt to "debunk" his latest film. Do you know if there's a reason for that?
It hasn't been released yet? (To the general Public)

The right must really be worried about Moore's film and the effect it will have on the American people, especially since they are coming up with a film of their own to try and kill it.

They want to squeeze another ultra-thin layer of usefulness out of their puppet, George W. Bush!

You know Niccolo Medici, I've found the right-wing's "debunking" of Moore's previous films less than convincing in the past, but I have yet to see any attempt to "debunk" his latest film. Do you know if there's a reason for that?
It hasn't been released yet? (To the general Public)But it's been out--it was shown in Cannes, and if it's not available online I'd really be surprised. It has certainly been screened enough times that someone with an agenda would be on the job by now.

I'm not saying it won't happen--I'm just surprised it hasn't happened yet.

I equate Moore with O'Reily on the BSometer, but he at least presents it in a funnier manner, and isn't a racist

You know Niccolo Medici, I've found the right-wing's "debunking" of Moore's previous films less than convincing in the past, but I have yet to see any attempt to "debunk" his latest film. Do you know if there's a reason for that?
It hasn't been released yet? (To the general Public)But it's been out--it was shown in Cannes, and if it's not available online I'd really be surprised. It has certainly been screened enough times that someone with an agenda would be on the job by now.

I'm not saying it won't happen--I'm just surprised it hasn't happened yet.
Downloading it online and writing an article about it would be nothing less than an admission of piracy and violating copyright laws. Which is why someone wouldn't do that.

Not sure about Cannes.

The right must really be worried about Moore's film and the effect it will have on the American people, especially since they are coming up with a film of their own to try and kill it.

They want to squeeze another ultra-thin layer of usefulness out of their puppet, George W. Bush!
I dont think you can equate this one person with "the right" unless you can equate Michael Moore with "the left" While you might agree with everything he says, many (leftist) people know that many of the claims he makes are baseless...and they wouldn't want to be equated with a liar, I'm sure.

You know Niccolo Medici, I've found the right-wing's "debunking" of Moore's previous films less than convincing in the past, but I have yet to see any attempt to "debunk" his latest film. Do you know if there's a reason for that?
It hasn't been released yet? (To the general Public)But it's been out--it was shown in Cannes, and if it's not available online I'd really be surprised. It has certainly been screened enough times that someone with an agenda would be on the job by now.

I'm not saying it won't happen--I'm just surprised it hasn't happened yet.
Downloading it online and writing an article about it would be nothing less than an admission of piracy and violating copyright laws. Which is why someone wouldn't do that.

Not sure about Cannes.

It won the Palm d'Or at Cannes, so it is available for viewing. The problem is the right is giving it free publicity and making it a hot viewing flick. If they really didn't want people to see it, they'd just ignore it and it would languish on the huge pile of documentaries that the average movie-going public isn't interested in seeing.

Another point, the fact that it isn't available for viewing in the US yet is a strike against the sudden upswell in right-wing denouncement of the film. You're right. They can't refute it because they haven't seen it, but instead of waiting for it to launch their campaign, they've pre-emptively started attacking Moore himself and not the movie. This is silly and weakens their stance in the long run.

That site is actually rather good, I am far from conservative but I think 'taking on Michael Moore' is an interesting position worthy of at least a little look into, rather than an off hand dismissal.

its not available online as of yet. apperantly no one at cannes thought to sneak a camera in, micheal moore has publically stated that he doesn't mind internet piracy of his films, and its the fact that people want to watch them that makes them important to him. the studios that produce his films, on the other hand, have taken a stance diametrically aposed to his personal one.

The right must really be worried about Moore's film and the effect it will have on the American people, especially since they are coming up with a film of their own to try and kill it.

They want to squeeze another ultra-thin layer of usefulness out of their puppet, George W. Bush!
Actually they are probably in it for the money? They are even selling T-shirts, and other paraphenalia. They know they will have an instant market that they can cash in on?

As far as Michael Moore is concerned, I truly believe that he loves America. He is touching all the nerves, hoping that they are connected to the heartstrings of Americans.

If anyone has done harm to the US, I would say that would be the Bush administration. The war on Iraq and the resultant sleaze has done far more damage than Michael Moore could ever accomplish. Then again, I don't believe that Moore is doing any damage at all. His films say......here is the problem, and he offers ways to fix those problems, at the same time he is challenging Americans to make America the best country in the world.

You know Niccolo Medici, I've found the right-wing's "debunking" of Moore's previous films less than convincing in the past, but I have yet to see any attempt to "debunk" his latest film. Do you know if there's a reason for that?

Well, I have seen right wing "debunking" of his previous films on fox news...they didn't argue any points at all; they just called him less than flattering names. However, in his previous books and films (the few I've bothered to see or read myself) he would take a reasonable stance on an issue, then running amok with his 'facts'.

Which is to say the premise of many of his books and films are more or less truthful, but then much of his supporting facts are mere conjecture or rhetoric. Too little hard data and too much frothing at the mouth anger over the subject. I have not seen much of his new film, but from what I understand its much more of a normal documentary than his previous films. I anticipate its release, because I want to see how far he's come as a filmaker and how much is still just BS.

As for any possible reasons to the "lack" of response, from what I've seen of Fox, they're trying to learn from their lesson with Al Franken.

Michael Moore is radical by your standards, but compared to any anarchist, he's authoritarian.

-----------------------------------------
"Beside him is a beautiful androgyne called SWITCH, aiming a large gun at Neo."--Script of The Matrix (I love The Matrix, but that is still funny.)
Free your mind! (http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/berkman/comanarchism/whatis_toc.html)
I like big butts!
http://img63.photobucket.com/albums/v193/eddy_the_great/steatopygia.jpg

This is a documentary that will released at around the same time as Farenheit 911.

http://www.michaelmoorehatesamerica.com/

No prizes for what it's going to be about.

A typical conservative response to someone that disagrees with them.

http://files.blog-city.com/files/aa/6190/b/liberal%20poster%203.png

Here is a typical conservative flag waving poster

That's quite ignorant of you to suggest that anyone who hates Michael Moore is a conservative. Both liberals and conservatives alike hate Michael Moore. I'm a libertarian myself and I agree with some the things Moore has to say.

anyone who thinks that has never read his books, or seen his movies.

He loves this country, he's just hates the man whos ruining it.

Guess who THAT is?

SPOT ON!