NationStates Jolt Archive

*why isnt Kissinger being tried for war crimes before an international body and beheaded on world TV?

Declassified Docs Point to U.S. Role in Chilean Coup
Newly declassified transcripts provide new evidence that the U.S. helped orchestrate the 1973 coup in Chile where Augusto Pinochet seized power from the democratically elected president Salvador Allende. Shortly after the coup Secretary of State Henry Kissinger told President Nixon "The newspapers are bleeding because a pro-Communist government has been overthrown." Kissinger then added that he and Nixon would have been heroes in "the Eisenhower period." Nixon replied "Our hand doesn't show on this one, though." Then Kissinger said "We didn't do it. I mean we helped them."

i didnt know this was a secret. seems to me that its been common knowlege since it happened in '73 and only the most naive doubted it

kissinger has done way worse things than that. look him up, its very eye opening

i didnt know this was a secret. seems to me that its been common knowlege since it happened in '73 and only the most naive doubted it

kissinger has done way worse things than that. look him up, its very eye openingwhy isnt he put on trial for crimes against humanity?

This is the freedom that the US claims to support.

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"Beside him is a beautiful androgyne called SWITCH, aiming a large gun at Neo."--Script of The Matrix (I love The Matrix, but that is still funny.)
Free your mind! (http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/berkman/comanarchism/whatis_toc.html)
I like big butts!
http://img63.photobucket.com/albums/v193/eddy_the_great/steatopygia.jpg

This is the freedom that the US claims to support.

-----------------------------------------
"Beside him is a beautiful androgyne called SWITCH, aiming a large gun at Neo."--Script of The Matrix (I love The Matrix, but that is still funny.)
Free your mind! (http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/berkman/comanarchism/whatis_toc.html)
I like big butts!
http://img63.photobucket.com/albums/v193/eddy_the_great/steatopygia.jpgwhen you look at US foreign policy--then you realize that abroad America really is The Great Satan

Are you an anarchist MK?

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"Beside him is a beautiful androgyne called SWITCH, aiming a large gun at Neo."--Script of The Matrix (I love The Matrix, but that is still funny.)
Free your mind! (http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/berkman/comanarchism/whatis_toc.html)
I like big butts!
http://img63.photobucket.com/albums/v193/eddy_the_great/steatopygia.jpg

:x Did you even research before you made this post?

While I feel very bad about this, I understand the paranoia behind their decisions. The Soviets were creating a Latin America hydra that, in the past, had threatened the US homeland. However, it turned out to be a disaster for us, and especially the Chileans.

if you look at it THAT way, well yeah
but it was all for the greater good
for example, when nixon wanted to go to china, he couldnt just GO, it had to be negotiated. SOOOO pakistan was a friend of china but unfortunately they had this wicked bad dictator at the time, his name isnt springing to my mind. SOO kissinger has the head of pakistan arrange the meeting in return for us selling them arms or something and turning a blind eye to him killing a couple million pakistanis
(im pretty sure that i got this wrong in spots but its basically true)

is this BAD? i guess you could say so , but its gotten us cheap electronics made by slave labor, thats good right>??

Are you an anarchist MK?

-----------------------------------------
"Beside him is a beautiful androgyne called SWITCH, aiming a large gun at Neo."--Script of The Matrix (I love The Matrix, but that is still funny.)
Free your mind! (http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/berkman/comanarchism/whatis_toc.html)
I like big butts!
http://img63.photobucket.com/albums/v193/eddy_the_great/steatopygia.jpgI hate authority of any kind

:x Did you even research before you made this post?I do as little work in my life that I can possibly get away with

if you look at it THAT way, well yeah
but it was all for the greater good
for example, when nixon wanted to go to china, he couldnt just GO, it had to be negotiated. SOOOO pakistan was a friend of china but unfortunately they had this wicked bad dictator at the time, his name isnt springing to my mind. SOO kissinger has the head of pakistan arrange the meeting in return for us selling them arms or something and turning a blind eye to him killing a couple million pakistanis
(im pretty sure that i got this wrong in spots but its basically true)

is this BAD? i guess you could say so , but its gotten us cheap electronics made by slave labor, thats good right>??actually the threat of communism was a big lie just like they use terrorism nowadays as an excuse to commit all kinds of evil

I hate authority of any kind

So that would make you an anarchist.

-----------------------------------------
"Beside him is a beautiful androgyne called SWITCH, aiming a large gun at Neo."--Script of The Matrix (I love The Matrix, but that is still funny.)
Free your mind! (http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/berkman/comanarchism/whatis_toc.html)
I like big butts!
http://img63.photobucket.com/albums/v193/eddy_the_great/steatopygia.jpg

I hate authority of any kind

Must be because no one in their right mind would give you any. Now, stop with these ridiculous slurs on the part of one of the truly great politicians of our age. Number 1, Pinochet was not a Nazi, he was just an ordinary Military Dictator.

Number 2, and this may have escaped your notice, but not only was Salvador Allende pro-communist, but he was also an incompetent fool, as most of his admittedly few decisions prior to the coup demonstrate..

if you look at it THAT way, well yeah
but it was all for the greater good
for example, when nixon wanted to go to china, he couldnt just GO, it had to be negotiated. SOOOO pakistan was a friend of china but unfortunately they had this wicked bad dictator at the time, his name isnt springing to my mind. SOO kissinger has the head of pakistan arrange the meeting in return for us selling them arms or something and turning a blind eye to him killing a couple million pakistanis
(im pretty sure that i got this wrong in spots but its basically true)

is this BAD? i guess you could say so , but its gotten us cheap electronics made by slave labor, thats good right>??actually the threat of communism was a big lie just like they use terrorism nowadays as an excuse to commit all kinds of evil
*sigh*
It's what happens when someone is stuck in academia for too long.

*why isnt Kissinger being tried for war crimes before an international body and beheaded on world TV?

Declassified Docs Point to U.S. Role in Chilean Coup
Newly declassified transcripts provide new evidence that the U.S. helped orchestrate the 1973 coup in Chile where Augusto Pinochet seized power from the democratically elected president Salvador Allende. Shortly after the coup Secretary of State Henry Kissinger told President Nixon "The newspapers are bleeding because a pro-Communist government has been overthrown." Kissinger then added that he and Nixon would have been heroes in "the Eisenhower period." Nixon replied "Our hand doesn't show on this one, though." Then Kissinger said "We didn't do it. I mean we helped them."

this is retarded

Must be because no one in their right mind would give you any. Now, stop with these ridiculous slurs on the part of one of the truly great politicians of our age. Number 1, Pinochet was not a Nazi, he was just an ordinary Military Dictator.

Pinochet is the paradign of evil! He is in no way great.

-----------------------------------------
"Beside him is a beautiful androgyne called SWITCH, aiming a large gun at Neo."--Script of The Matrix (I love The Matrix, but that is still funny.)
Free your mind! (http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/berkman/comanarchism/whatis_toc.html)
I like big butts!
http://img63.photobucket.com/albums/v193/eddy_the_great/steatopygia.jpg

[quote="Roania

Must be because no one in their right mind would give you any. Now, stop with these ridiculous slurs on the part of one of the truly great politicians of our age. Number 1, Pinochet was not a Nazi, he was just an ordinary Military Dictator.

Number 2, and this may have escaped your notice, but not only was Salvador Allende pro-communist, but he was also an incompetent fool, as most of his admittedly few decisions prior to the coup demonstrate..[/quote]

Dear oh dear, you do seem to be throwing out some big words Roainia. I agree that Pinochet was not a Nazi because that is a very specific sort of totalitarianism but to say that he was an 'ordinary military dictator' is certainly pretty offensive. After all, he killed more ordinary people in Chile than Osama did in New York and we dont call him ordinary. Calling Allende pro communist is a gross simplification of the issue as well. Perhaps if you said he was a social democrat you might come closer to the truth.

Anyway, the point remains that Kissinger actively supported the overthrow of a democratic government by a military dictator (ordinary or not). I would hardly call that the act of a 'great' man.

Allende himself wasn't too radical. His allies were.

Who cares?

We do this stuff everyday.

I feel that Pinochet acted completely in the right. Communist or not, Allende was an incompetent fool, surrounded by a multitude of incompetent fools. Also, Pinochet had a right to protect his rule, and if that meant killing traitors and supporters of the afore-said incompetent fool, than so be it.

You may condemn his actions, you can not claim he was in the wrong in performing them.

MK are you the old RA?

Nice post BTW :wink:

I feel that Pinochet acted completely in the right. Communist or not, Allende was an incompetent fool, surrounded by a multitude of incompetent fools. Also, Pinochet had a right to protect his rule, and if that meant killing traitors and supporters of the afore-said incompetent fool, than so be it.

You may condemn his actions, you can not claim he was in the wrong in performing them.Ummm--Pinochet had a right to protect what? Allende was legally elected by the people of Chile and the US had more than a hand in his execution. As far as you conclusions about Allende's incompetence are concerned, I think it's notable that Chile wallowed in economic disarray for years until Pinochet adopted many of Allende's suggested reforms years long after Allende was dead. For someone who attacks others for not doing their research, you might want to check your own ass--you got some little drippies hanging out there.

They weren't his ideas, though. And the econonomic problems were the fault primarily of events outside of his control. Elections are a nicety.

Pinochet was in power, and he had every right to protect that power, democratically elected or not.

you really dont have a clue about pinochet do you?
the best thing chile ever did was to vote NO on the plebicite asking to keep him in power

Yeah I know that Kissinger did this. Thank you Mark Fiore

Clicky (http://www.markfiore.com/animation/staffing.html)

They weren't his ideas, though. And the econonomic problems were the fault primarily of events outside of his control. Elections are a nicety.

Pinochet was in power, and he had every right to protect that power, democratically elected or not.

You are a grade A fascist. Power is evil and it is the duty of everyone to oppose those with it. Pinochet is up there with Hitler, Nietzsche, Norman, and Rand as the most evil person to live.

-----------------------------------------
"Beside him is a beautiful androgyne called SWITCH, aiming a large gun at Neo."--Script of The Matrix (I love The Matrix, but that is still funny.)
Free your mind! (http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/berkman/comanarchism/whatis_toc.html)
I like big butts!
http://img63.photobucket.com/albums/v193/eddy_the_great/steatopygia.jpg

They weren't his ideas, though. And the econonomic problems were the fault primarily of events outside of his control. Elections are a nicety.

Pinochet was in power, and he had every right to protect that power, democratically elected or not.
While emotionally I don't agree with you, I do see your point. According to you, Pinochet was following the advice of Niccolo Machievalli. While Machievalli's advice sounds bleak, I sometimes think that it's needed to maintain order. After all, Latin American communism sounds, to me, a bit like mob rule. Chile may have been close to descending into chaos under both Allende and Pinochet, but at least Pinochet did keep order before it got out of hand.

They weren't his ideas, though. And the econonomic problems were the fault primarily of events outside of his control. Elections are a nicety.

Pinochet was in power, and he had every right to protect that power, democratically elected or not.

You are a grade A fascist. Power is evil and it is the duty of everyone to oppose those with it. Pinochet is up there with Hitler, Nietzsche, Norman, and Rand as the most evil person to live.

-----------------------------------------
"Beside him is a beautiful androgyne called SWITCH, aiming a large gun at Neo."--Script of The Matrix (I love The Matrix, but that is still funny.)
Free your mind! (http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/berkman/comanarchism/whatis_toc.html)
I like big butts!
http://img63.photobucket.com/albums/v193/eddy_the_great/steatopygia.jpg

And once I've seized it, I intend to abuse it massively, oppressing everyone equally. Especially women with big butts. They scare me. And... how was Nietzsche evil? That's going a bit far.

Pinochet was in power, and he had every right to protect that power, democratically elected or not.So if George W. Bush loses the election this November, are you going to argue that he has every right to take over the country in a military coup in order to retain power? Because that's what you're arguing for Pinochet.

Pinochet was in power, and he had every right to protect that power, democratically elected or not.So if George W. Bush loses the election this November, are you going to argue that he has every right to take over the country in a military coup in order to retain power? Because that's what you're arguing for Pinochet.

Well, I would prefer him to do so than have Kerry in charge of the US. However, you have to look at differing cultural backgrounds, and it's all hypothetical because Bush doesn't have the loyalty of the military. The American military is loyal to the country, not to the man on top.

And once I've seized it, I intend to abuse it massively, oppressing everyone equally. Especially women with big butts. They scare me. And... how was Nietzsche evil? That's going a bit far.

He advocated übermenschen (supermen) and was extremely misogynistic. I would kill an übermensch if they actually existed to defend my freedom.

-----------------------------------------
"Beside him is a beautiful androgyne called SWITCH, aiming a large gun at Neo."--Script of The Matrix (I love The Matrix, but that is still funny.)
Free your mind! (http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/berkman/comanarchism/whatis_toc.html)
I like big butts!
http://img63.photobucket.com/albums/v193/eddy_the_great/steatopygia.jpg

And once I've seized it, I intend to abuse it massively, oppressing everyone equally. Especially women with big butts. They scare me. And... how was Nietzsche evil? That's going a bit far.

He advocated übermenschen (supermen) and was extremely misogynistic. I would kill an übermensch if they actually existed to defend my freedom.

He was rejected in marriage, twice. That'd make anyone a misogynist.

And he advocated the ideal of an ubermenschen (pretend it's the u with two dots over it, I'm too lazy to copy it). His philosophy was twisted by Hitler.

And once I've seized it, I intend to abuse it massively, oppressing everyone equally. Especially women with big butts. They scare me. And... how was Nietzsche evil? That's going a bit far.

He advocated übermenschen (supermen) and was extremely misogynistic. I would kill an übermensch if they actually existed to defend my freedom.

-----------------------------------------
"Beside him is a beautiful androgyne called SWITCH, aiming a large gun at Neo."--Script of The Matrix (I love The Matrix, but that is still funny.)
Free your mind! (http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/berkman/comanarchism/whatis_toc.html)
I like big butts!
http://img63.photobucket.com/albums/v193/eddy_the_great/steatopygia.jpg
But Neitzche was still a good philosopher. A little weird, but good. After all, I think everyone should adopt his philosophy on suffering. If it doesn't kill you, it makes you stronger.

Pinochet was in power, and he had every right to protect that power, democratically elected or not.So if George W. Bush loses the election this November, are you going to argue that he has every right to take over the country in a military coup in order to retain power? Because that's what you're arguing for Pinochet.

Well, I would prefer him to do so than have Kerry in charge of the US. However, you have to look at differing cultural backgrounds, and it's all hypothetical because Bush doesn't have the loyalty of the military. The American military is loyal to the country, not to the man on top.No no no--you can't back out of this so easily. You are actually arguing that regardless of what the people in a country want--people who legitimately have a say in who governs them--that a ruler in power has the right--your word, right--to protect that power regardless of the means he uses.

Don't hide behind bullshit hypotheticals here--are you arguing that George Bush, like Pinochet in Chile, has the right to use force to stay in power regardless of the outcome of the election? And if so, what the hell does our Constitution mean to you? Is it a piece of toilet paper to be discarded after you've shat all over it? Because that's exactly what you're arguing.

And he advocated the ideal of an ubermenschen (pretend it's the u with two dots over it, I'm too lazy to copy it). His philosophy was twisted by Hitler.

What's the difference between advocating the ideal of something and advocating something itself? I'm glad übermenschen don't exist.

-----------------------------------------
"Beside him is a beautiful androgyne called SWITCH, aiming a large gun at Neo."--Script of The Matrix (I love The Matrix, but that is still funny.)
Free your mind! (http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/berkman/comanarchism/whatis_toc.html)
I like big butts!
http://img63.photobucket.com/albums/v193/eddy_the_great/steatopygia.jpg

No no no--you can't back out of this so easily. You are actually arguing that regardless of what the people in a country want--people who legitimately have a say in who governs them--that a ruler in power has the right--your word, right--to protect that power regardless of the means he uses.

Yes, I am. And no, they obviously don't have the right to a say in who governs them.

Don't hide behind bullshit hypotheticals here--are you arguing that George Bush, like Pinochet in Chile, has the right to use force to stay in power regardless of the outcome of the election? And if so, what the hell does our Constitution mean to you? Is it a piece of toilet paper to be discarded after you've shat all over it? Because that's exactly what you're arguing.

You brought it up, I'm saying it's a hypothetical situation which will never happen. There are differing cultural backgrounds at play. At the time of Pinochet's coup, he had the support, and personal loyalty, of the military. If he had not had that support, he wouldn't have tried to launch the coup.

There is no such situation in the USA. The American army is loyal to the country, not the government in power at the time. If Bush wants to, he can certainly try to overthrow Kerry's government with the support of the military, but he'll fail. And that's what matters. Pinochet succesfully attained power, and thus he had the right to take the action neccessary to keep it. If Bush fails to win the election, he can try to order the army out to stop himself from losing power, but he'd fail.

It's not my constitution, it's yours. Since I'm not an American, your constitution is meaningless to me, and I would quite happily rip it up and throw it away.

Roania, you've got a seriously skewed idea of what a right is, that's for certain. And man am I glad you're not a US citizen.

Roania, you've got a seriously skewed idea of what a right is, that's for certain. And man am I glad you're not a US citizen.

And you and Letila both are hapless idealists, I'm sorry to say.

You brought it up, I'm saying it's a hypothetical situation which will never happen. There are differing cultural backgrounds at play. At the time of Pinochet's coup, he had the support, and personal loyalty, of the military. If he had not had that support, he wouldn't have tried to launch the coup.

There is no such situation in the USA. The American army is loyal to the country, not the government in power at the time. If Bush wants to, he can certainly try to overthrow Kerry's government with the support of the military, but he'll fail. And that's what matters. Pinochet succesfully attained power, and thus he had the right to take the action neccessary to keep it. If Bush fails to win the election, he can try to order the army out to stop himself from losing power, but he'd fail.

Might makes right, uh. :roll:

-----------------------------------------
"Beside him is a beautiful androgyne called SWITCH, aiming a large gun at Neo."--Script of The Matrix (I love The Matrix, but that is still funny.)
Free your mind! (http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/berkman/comanarchism/whatis_toc.html)
I like big butts!
http://img63.photobucket.com/albums/v193/eddy_the_great/steatopygia.jpg

Might makes right, uh. :roll:

Better than anarchy... 'whoever can, may'.

Roania, you've got a seriously skewed idea of what a right is, that's for certain. And man am I glad you're not a US citizen.

And you and Letila both are hapless idealists, I'm sorry to say.Better an idealist than a evil sonofabitch, I always say--and no, I'm not calling you that, just those who believe that might makes right.

Is it just me or do other people think that Roania is just playing Devils advocate for fun. Noone could seriously believe the **** coming out in his/her posts.

Is it just me or do other people think that Roania is just playing Devils advocate for fun. Noone could seriously believe the **** coming out in his/her posts.

I'll never tell. Incertonia, btw, I meant no offense to either you or Letila. Idealism is something that makes the world a better place, and I never intended to mock your political or historical beliefs.

Is it just me or do other people think that Roania is just playing Devils advocate for fun. Noone could seriously believe the **** coming out in his/her posts.

I'll never tell.
Well, no one should care if you tell or not. Even if you believe in this, you are making a valid point, I feel. If you are playing devil's advocate, you're also making a valid point that Communists can't realize.

*why isnt Kissinger being tried for war crimes before an international body and beheaded on world TV?

Declassified Docs Point to U.S. Role in Chilean Coup
Newly declassified transcripts provide new evidence that the U.S. helped orchestrate the 1973 coup in Chile where Augusto Pinochet seized power from the democratically elected president Salvador Allende. Shortly after the coup Secretary of State Henry Kissinger told President Nixon "The newspapers are bleeding because a pro-Communist government has been overthrown." Kissinger then added that he and Nixon would have been heroes in "the Eisenhower period." Nixon replied "Our hand doesn't show on this one, though." Then Kissinger said "We didn't do it. I mean we helped them."

this is retardedstill defending holocausts?

I feel that Pinochet acted completely in the right. Communist or not, Allende was an incompetent fool, surrounded by a multitude of incompetent fools. Also, Pinochet had a right to protect his rule, and if that meant killing traitors and supporters of the afore-said incompetent fool, than so be it.

You may condemn his actions, you can not claim he was in the wrong in performing them.you should visit a mass grave one day and say this to the people buried there--Im sure theyll all applaud you

MK are you the old RA?

Nice post BTW :wink:aye