NationStates Jolt Archive

Feminist Reform in Nations

I have noticed that feminists tend to cluster around in America and clamor for reforms. While I'm not saying that the situation for females in America is ideal, i do feel that females in other nations are a lot worse off.

Especially in the MidEast...stories have been circulated of religious police who forced girls back into a burning building because they didnt have their veils on. NEedless to say, the girls died.

There was even this one show that made fun of the religious police...it was in Saudi Arabia i think... they made puns and tried to ease the strictness of all of the radical scholars, but i suppose the scholars didnt have a sense of humor...they got the show closed down, or are trying to.

Nonetheless, tangents aside, my point is that American feminists should start diversifying. The fact of the matter is that AMerica is a haven for liberal ideals, and female rights are one of the strongest. While it is true that abuses of hte law do occur and injustice is carried against females in America, at least they have a chance to correct the injustices. Females in other nations dont have that sort of chance.

potential targets would be teh MidEast, Asia, and probably South America or mayb Africa... i dunno

What say you to that Feminists and progressives?

What's your point?

It sounds like you are saying that American feminists should stop whining becuase of what happens to women in the Mid-East. And should start directing their vitriol towards the Mid-East.

Well, many already do that. But it is possible to clamour for reform in their own country, whilst at the same time denounce the Mid-East female oppression.

In all honesty, US feminist groups have been in the forefront of publicizing the plight of women in third world countries and under repressive regimes. Feminist groups were criticizing the Taliban long before the Clinton or either of the Bush administrations were looking at them as a national security threat. They've brought attention to women's issues in Africa, in other parts of the Middle East and in Asia. Just because the media ignores them doesn't mean they aren't working hard on the issues.

As a guywho's been involved wtih women's issues, i definetly feel that yoru statement couldn't be farther from the truth. When we mobilized for international women's day, we had booths about women here as well as in Birundi, columbia, chechnya, saudia arabia and the sweatshops along the mexican border.

Feminist Reform in Nations

I have noticed that feminists tend to cluster around in America and clamor for reforms.

Then it must be true.

What say you to that Feminists and progressives?

I've never seen someone use the word 'progressive' so pejoratively.

Here's an idea!

Let's let them duke it out!

The fact of the matter is that AMerica is a haven for liberal ideals, and female rights are one of the strongest.

America isn't liberal. They have some of the most harsh anti-crime laws and by far the greatest prison population.

The fact of the matter is that AMerica is a haven for liberal ideals, and female rights are one of the strongest.

America isn't liberal. They have some of the most harsh anti-crime laws and by far the greatest prison population.
If the government isn't liberal enough for you, then go to the Ivory Towers. I just came out of one, and though it was nice, farther-left-than-liberals type of people dominated the place.

Or go to San Fransisco. They're so liberal the Republicans don't even run there - Just Democrats and Greens. And Greens have a good shot at winning. :wink:

Or go to San Fransisco. They're so liberal the Republicans don't even run there - Just Democrats and Greens. And Greens have a good shot at winning. :wink:
Harvard would be wise to move there from Cambridge.

Feminists need to DIE!!!!!!!!!!

DIE FEMINISTS DIE!!!!!

Feminists need to DIE!!!!!!!!!!

DIE FEMINISTS DIE!!!!!
lay off the caffeine, or the crack.

Feminists need to DIE!!!!!!!!!!

DIE FEMINISTS DIE!!!!!

You were deleted once before for comments like this, it is going to happen again.

But I HATE feminists. I hate them, I hate them, I hate them.

I'm going to be the next Marc Lepine.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

But I HATE feminists. I hate them, I hate them, I hate them.

I'm going to be the next Marc Lepine.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

I don't like them either, but I don't wish death upon them...slow, hilarious insanity maybe, but not death.

But I HATE feminists. I hate them, I hate them, I hate them.

I'm going to be the next Marc Lepine.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

What's with the hate of feminists?
Yeah, those uppity women demanding equal rights at work and to not being raped, what the fuck :roll:

Great Yarmouth delights in making imflammatory statements with little rationale given. It's done to spark off reciprocal flames and you should probably ignore him.

See also "troll"

But I HATE feminists. I hate them, I hate them, I hate them.

I'm going to be the next Marc Lepine.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

What's with the hate of feminists?
Yeah, those uppity women demanding equal rights at work and to not being raped, what the f--- :roll:

They hate men!

But I HATE feminists. I hate them, I hate them, I hate them.

I'm going to be the next Marc Lepine.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

HE RIGHT!!!

WE ARE ALL EVIL AND WE WANT TO DESTROY MANKIND!

( i know this is trolling, but why not talk feminism)
I think there is a huge misconception, primarily due to media as well as our own prejudices, of what a feminist is.
There is no one type of feminst. There are liberal feminists, radical feminists and marxist feminist (those are the ones i've studied). There are also eco-feminists.
Most feminists are not lesbians, most feminists do not hate men. Most feminists are not seeking the destruction of all that is holy. Most feminists want equality, they are differentiated by their analysis and how they define equality. Don't paint them all in teh same picture.

( i know this is trolling, but why not talk feminism)
I think there is a huge misconception, primarily due to media as well as our own prejudices, of what a feminist is.
There is no one type of feminst. There are liberal feminists, radical feminists and marxist feminist (those are the ones i've studied). There are also eco-feminists.
Most feminists are not lesbians, most feminists do not hate men. Most feminists are not seeking the destruction of all that is holy. Most feminists want equality, they are differentiated by their analysis and how they define equality. Don't paint them all in teh same picture.

I don't care. Feminists must be slaughtered like pigs.

Personally, I think the ideals of feminism are good. However, some women carry it to the extreme. You know, the militant, radical feminists that get mad when men try to open doors, seat them, etc. Some of it is just ingrained culture, and I think it should be left there, for the sake of tradition.

I think they're kind of like PETA and Greenpeace. Good ideas and intention, but sometimes... their actions don't directly help achive them. Getting mad at men who are trying to be nice to women, isn't the way to get women to be equal. It's the men who are trying to be mean to women that you should be yelling at. Because, admittedly, men and women will never be equal. It's really that simple, we're just too different. It's not even cultural there, it's instinctual. The hunter vs. the gatherer. The fighter vs. the mother. You know, our race has evolved that way.

Personally, I think the ideals of feminism are good. However, some women carry it to the extreme. You know, the militant, radical feminists that get mad when men try to open doors, seat them, etc. Some of it is just ingrained culture, and I think it should be left there, for the sake of tradition.

I think they're kind of like PETA and Greenpeace. Good ideas and intention, but sometimes... their actions don't directly help achive them. Getting mad at men who are trying to be nice to women, isn't the way to get women to be equal. It's the men who are trying to be mean to women that you should be yelling at. Because, admittedly, men and women will never be equal. It's really that simple, we're just too different. It's not even cultural there, it's instinctual. The hunter vs. the gatherer. The fighter vs. the mother. You know, our race has evolved that way.

There's evidence pointing both ways that it's nature and nurture in terms of fighter/mother

And once again, i wouldn't paint all feminists in the same light. Not all feminists (i proudly consider myself one) are the radical "peta" like feminists with shaved heads who hate men.


and what's with the greenpeace dis, they've done alot of good.

My definition of a feminist is a woman who support's women's rights.

Anything more radical than that drops into my 'radical' or 'fanatic' bin, next to religious zealots, Greenpeace (the more extreme ones) and far left or far right wingers.

But anyway, I think y'all have me wrong. I'm just asking why feminists, especially American feminists, dont concentrate more on the world, since the rest of the world is a lot worse off.

Like Madrigals said, there are sweatshops, instances of rape, forced marriages, molestation, kidnapping, etc...

They take place in many countries, not just those Madrigals mentioned. But what i wanted to say is that perhaps feminists should join forces with progressive reformers in such nations to break down the walls of reactionary tradition and bring about a new era. While I understand it is hard to dislodge tradition, perhaps we can work with tradition instead of fighting against it (i.e. creating moderate adaptations of Mohammed's sayings on women, getting leading scholars to issue new versions, etc.)

My definition of a feminist is a woman who support's women's rights.

Anything more radical than that drops into my 'radical' or 'fanatic' bin, next to religious zealots, Greenpeace (the more extreme ones) and far left or far right wingers.

But anyway, I think y'all have me wrong. I'm just asking why feminists, especially American feminists, dont concentrate more on the world, since the rest of the world is a lot worse off.

Like Madrigals said, there are sweatshops, instances of rape, forced marriages, molestation, kidnapping, etc...

They take place in many countries, not just those Madrigals mentioned. But what i wanted to say is that perhaps feminists should join forces with progressive reformers in such nations to break down the walls of reactionary tradition and bring about a new era. While I understand it is hard to dislodge tradition, perhaps we can work with tradition instead of fighting against it (i.e. creating moderate adaptations of Mohammed's sayings on women, getting leading scholars to issue new versions, etc.)
I actually took a high school mini course this week at the most prestigious big liberal colledge of them all (the University of Rochester). I heard from in there that there's this African women (forgot her name). She says the same thing you do: the world's feminists live in the only place their ideas can even be heard, in academia. They are mostly, however, in Harvard, Princeton, and Oxford. They live cloistered lives, and, according to her, see feminism as a means of female dominance of society, not sexual equality. She says that they live far from the realities of other women across the globe, unless it's to bash at their "parochial" governments they so covet.

My definition of a feminist is a woman who support's women's rights.

Anything more radical than that drops into my 'radical' or 'fanatic' bin, next to religious zealots, Greenpeace (the more extreme ones) and far left or far right wingers.

But anyway, I think y'all have me wrong. I'm just asking why feminists, especially American feminists, dont concentrate more on the world, since the rest of the world is a lot worse off.

Like Madrigals said, there are sweatshops, instances of rape, forced marriages, molestation, kidnapping, etc...

They take place in many countries, not just those Madrigals mentioned. But what i wanted to say is that perhaps feminists should join forces with progressive reformers in such nations to break down the walls of reactionary tradition and bring about a new era. While I understand it is hard to dislodge tradition, perhaps we can work with tradition instead of fighting against it (i.e. creating moderate adaptations of Mohammed's sayings on women, getting leading scholars to issue new versions, etc.)
I actually took a high school mini course this week at the most prestigious big liberal colledge of them all (the University of Rochester). I heard from in there that there's this African women (forgot her name). She says the same thing you do: the world's feminists live in the only place their ideas can even be heard, in academia. They are mostly, however, in Harvard, Princeton, and Oxford. They live cloistered lives, and, according to her, see feminism as a means of female dominance of society, not sexual equality. She says that they live far from the realities of other women across the globe, unless it's to bash at their "parochial" governments they so covet.

You're thinking, i believe, of Mary Wollstencraft.

And PE, my point was that feminists are active in issues outside of the western world. The media tends to ignore it.

My definition of a feminist is a woman who support's women's rights.

Anything more radical than that drops into my 'radical' or 'fanatic' bin, next to religious zealots, Greenpeace (the more extreme ones) and far left or far right wingers.

But anyway, I think y'all have me wrong. I'm just asking why feminists, especially American feminists, dont concentrate more on the world, since the rest of the world is a lot worse off.

Like Madrigals said, there are sweatshops, instances of rape, forced marriages, molestation, kidnapping, etc...

They take place in many countries, not just those Madrigals mentioned. But what i wanted to say is that perhaps feminists should join forces with progressive reformers in such nations to break down the walls of reactionary tradition and bring about a new era. While I understand it is hard to dislodge tradition, perhaps we can work with tradition instead of fighting against it (i.e. creating moderate adaptations of Mohammed's sayings on women, getting leading scholars to issue new versions, etc.)
I actually took a high school mini course this week at the most prestigious big liberal colledge of them all (the University of Rochester). I heard from in there that there's this African women (forgot her name). She says the same thing you do: the world's feminists live in the only place their ideas can even be heard, in academia. They are mostly, however, in Harvard, Princeton, and Oxford. They live cloistered lives, and, according to her, see feminism as a means of female dominance of society, not sexual equality. She says that they live far from the realities of other women across the globe, unless it's to bash at their "parochial" governments they so covet.

You're thinking, i believe, of Mary Wollstencraft.

And PE, my point was that feminists are active in issues outside of the western world. The media tends to ignore it.

I think the problem is that parents treat kids gender specific. Treating them like stereotypes. I know alot of it is gender related but gender roles are growing apart you know. I think when the next draft comes out for a war and women are included, thats equality. 8)


Human instincts aren't exactly growing stronger with time since we never use them anymore, eventually the instincts will just lead to evolutionary dead ends.

My definition of a feminist is a woman who support's women's rights.

what does being female have to do with being a feminist?

*is a feminist*

My definition of a feminist is a woman who support's women's rights.

Anything more radical than that drops into my 'radical' or 'fanatic' bin, next to religious zealots, Greenpeace (the more extreme ones) and far left or far right wingers.

But anyway, I think y'all have me wrong. I'm just asking why feminists, especially American feminists, dont concentrate more on the world, since the rest of the world is a lot worse off.

Like Madrigals said, there are sweatshops, instances of rape, forced marriages, molestation, kidnapping, etc...

They take place in many countries, not just those Madrigals mentioned. But what i wanted to say is that perhaps feminists should join forces with progressive reformers in such nations to break down the walls of reactionary tradition and bring about a new era. While I understand it is hard to dislodge tradition, perhaps we can work with tradition instead of fighting against it (i.e. creating moderate adaptations of Mohammed's sayings on women, getting leading scholars to issue new versions, etc.)
I actually took a high school mini course this week at the most prestigious big liberal colledge of them all (the University of Rochester). I heard from in there that there's this African women (forgot her name). She says the same thing you do: the world's feminists live in the only place their ideas can even be heard, in academia. They are mostly, however, in Harvard, Princeton, and Oxford. They live cloistered lives, and, according to her, see feminism as a means of female dominance of society, not sexual equality. She says that they live far from the realities of other women across the globe, unless it's to bash at their "parochial" governments they so covet.

You're thinking, i believe, of Mary Wollstencraft.

And PE, my point was that feminists are active in issues outside of the western world. The media tends to ignore it.
The media tends to ignore feminism in general, except when it's something that involves Gloria Steinberg. Anyhow, feminism is, I guess one could say, dead. And thanks for telling me who Ms. Wollstencraft is.

Feminism is a good thing, particularly anarcha-feminism.

-----------------------
Free your mind!

well i suppose i should say
"a PERSON who supports woman's rights."

Does that work better?

well i suppose i should say
"a PERSON who supports woman's rights."

Does that work better?

indeed it does

The media tends to ignore feminism in general, except when it's something that involves Gloria Steinberg. Anyhow, feminism is, I guess one could say, dead. And thanks for telling me who Ms. Wollstencraft is.
I'd argue whether or not feminism is dead. It has been extremely successful within the western world; rape is viewed as a crime, women (while not having completely equal opp't) have a good shot at succeeding but there still is a lot to be done.

Sexism is stupid. I get into debates on another forum all the time over it.

-----------------------------------------
"But by an equality, that now at this time your abundance may be a supply for their want, that their abundance also may be a supply for your want: that there may be equality."
Free your mind! (http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/bright/berkman/comanarchism/whatis_toc.html)
I like big butts!

http://www.angelfire.com/mo3/terrapvlchra/images/steatopygia.jpg