NationStates Jolt Archive

http://www.physics.otago.ac.nz/space/spinning_globe_48.gif

As if things weren't bad enough already.
America starts an illegal war, wins (with substantial help) as it should being a super-power, fucks the whole thing up after the deaths of 500+ servicemen and thousands of innocent Iraqis, creates ten times more terrorism than existed before the invasion, and some now want to murder whole neighbourhoods of Iraq to save American lives. It's called stupidity on a global scale, it's called murder. I will not believe that the majority of Americans support American terror, just as I am proud to say that the vast majority of Brits do not support more killing.

"It is better for a B-52 to flatten an Iraqi neighborhood than it is for one United States Marine to die. It is better to roll tanks down a foreign street than it is to put an American soldier in his grave".

http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/18538.htm
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"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."
-- John Lennon

creates ten times more terrorism than existed before the invasion

Regarding this statement, that's really not true.

we outnumber them, so if one US soldier KIA = 1000 dead insurgants we will win eventually.

creates ten times more terrorism than existed before the invasion

Regarding this statement, that's really not true.
http://www.physics.otago.ac.nz/space/spinning_globe_48.gif

Correct. But terrorism is on the increase, witness the hostage taking of a Brit, three Japanese, ten chinese. Iraq is now the worlds leader in terror. Before the war it was negligable.


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"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."
-- John Lennon

we outnumber them, so if one US soldier KIA = 1000 dead insurgants we will win eventually.
http://www.physics.otago.ac.nz/space/spinning_globe_48.gif

And that's the attitude that will lead to the 'loss' of Iraq and terrorism never before seen in this poor, blighted world.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."
-- John Lennon

http://www.physics.otago.ac.nz/space/spinning_globe_48.gif

As if things weren't bad enough already.
America starts an illegal war, wins (with substantial help) as it should being a super-power, f--- the whole thing up after the deaths of 500+ servicemen and thousands of innocent Iraqis, creates ten times more terrorism than existed before the invasion, and some now want to murder whole neighbourhoods of Iraq to save American lives. It's called stupidity on a global scale, it's called murder. I will not believe that the majority of Americans support American terror, just as I am proud to say that the vast majority of Brits do not support more killing.

"It is better for a B-52 to flatten an Iraqi neighborhood than it is for one United States Marine to die. It is better to roll tanks down a foreign street than it is to put an American soldier in his grave".

http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/18538.htm
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"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."
-- John Lennon


couldn't ahve said it better

Ah--the NY Post--that bastion of enlightened thought. Did they come right out and call the Iraqis towel-heads this time? I wouldn't be surprised.

P.S. I know you don't agree with them SO, just in case you think I was equating your opinion with the Post's ideas.

we outnumber them, so if one US soldier KIA = 1000 dead insurgants we will win eventually.
http://www.physics.otago.ac.nz/space/spinning_globe_48.gif

And that's the attitude that will lead to the 'loss' of Iraq and terrorism never before seen in this poor, blighted world.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."
-- John Lennon
military victory is handled with numbers, not ideals.

we outnumber them, so if one US soldier KIA = 1000 dead insurgants we will win eventually.
http://www.physics.otago.ac.nz/space/spinning_globe_48.gif

And that's the attitude that will lead to the 'loss' of Iraq and terrorism never before seen in this poor, blighted world.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."
-- John Lennon
military victory is handled with numbers, not ideals.

The point of the post is that one nation believes (sorry, some people in one nation) that they are worth more than people of another nation. I thought that was easy to grasp. Or perhaps you agree with that?

The point of the post is that one nation believes (sorry, some people in one nation) that they are worth more than people of another nation. I thought that was easy to grasp. Or perhaps you agree with that?
Great point!

But I would hope my life is worth more than just 1,000 Iraqis.

More like 50,000

The point of the post is that one nation believes (sorry, some people in one nation) that they are worth more than people of another nation. I thought that was easy to grasp. Or perhaps you agree with that?
Great point!

But I would hope my life is worth more than just 1,000 Iraqis.

More like 50,000

Obviously not based on your I.Q.

I doubt whether anyone would take you on if a one for one basis.

The point of the post is that one nation believes (sorry, some people in one nation) that they are worth more than people of another nation. I thought that was easy to grasp. Or perhaps you agree with that?
Great point!

But I would hope my life is worth more than just 1,000 Iraqis.

More like 50,000

Obviously not based on yout I.Q.
oh how little you know...

oh how little you know...Please don't feed the troll.

The point of the post is that one nation believes (sorry, some people in one nation) that they are worth more than people of another nation. I thought that was easy to grasp. Or perhaps you agree with that?
Great point!

But I would hope my life is worth more than just 1,000 Iraqis.

More like 50,000
http://www.physics.otago.ac.nz/space/spinning_globe_48.gif

If egos were valuable, I'd agree but as a person you're not worth a particle of the soil that buries any innocent person.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."
-- John Lennon

The point of the post is that one nation believes (sorry, some people in one nation) that they are worth more than people of another nation. I thought that was easy to grasp. Or perhaps you agree with that?
Great point!

But I would hope my life is worth more than just 1,000 Iraqis.

More like 50,000

Obviously not based on yout I.Q.
oh how little you know...

Oh how much you think you know.
How very easy it is to post a smarta** comment rating your own life against others.
What have you every contributed to the world which would rank you so highly. Any fool can have a large ego.

If egos were valuable, I'd agree but as a person you're not worth a particle of the soil that buries any innocent person.

1. My ego isn't that big, i just have strong beliefs.
2. I am the most valuable person this world will ever see.

(yes, I do see the irony in my two points)

Articles like this one help pushing anti-USA moods in the hearts of not-US-Americans.

It is so typical, only the USA and its citizens are worthful and the rest of the world is pure shit. :evil:

The USA mostly make plans for big wars but is not able to think about the regions they are going into. Peoples do have different mentalities and especially the arabic (i mean esp. the moslem) one thinks in long periods. So they remember injustice for centuries and combined with poverty there is no wonder that some fundamentalistic *** are able to reach the hearts.

However, the stuff what Bush is talking, is fundamentalistic, too. It helps heating up the whole situation. How long may the war takes? Till the USA goes out, the arabs will never surrender to them, and I can understand them well.

Instead of exploiting the country, the USA has to fight against poverty, diseases and for a better education. When people are literate, they can read for themselves what the political or religious leaders based their theories on. And when these people have enough to eat and also hope, they won't believe them.

(sorry for my bad style, i'm too tired ;))

Articles like this one help pushing anti-USA moods in the hearts of not-US-Americans.

It is so typical, only the USA and its citizens are worthful and the rest of the world is pure shit.

you got it right guy!

you must be in fuck ing MENSA or something!

Articles like this one help pushing anti-USA moods in the hearts of not-US-Americans.

It is so typical, only the USA and its citizens are worthful and the rest of the world is pure shit.

you got it right guy!

you must be in f--- ing MENSA or something!

I dont like MENSAs.............

Articles like this one help pushing anti-USA moods in the hearts of not-US-Americans.

It is so typical, only the USA and its citizens are worthful and the rest of the world is pure shit.

you got it right guy!

you must be in f--- ing MENSA or something!
http://www.physics.otago.ac.nz/space/spinning_globe_48.gif

He means only in America are some people so arrogant to think they're worth more than other people. Only in America are some people so selfish as to be unconcerned about anybody but their corpulant selves. Go and stuff some more lard down your throat and make room for someone worthwhile please.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."
-- John Lennon

we outnumber them, so if one US soldier KIA = 1000 dead insurgants we will win eventually.
http://www.physics.otago.ac.nz/space/spinning_globe_48.gif

And that's the attitude that will lead to the 'loss' of Iraq and terrorism never before seen in this poor, blighted world.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."
-- John Lennon
military victory is handled with numbers, not ideals.
I thought this was about "liberating Iraq", not turning it into a crematorium?

BTW, that story demonstrates the twisted morality that puts this world in jeopardy.

The only REAL threat that Iraq was to America, occurred when Americans set foot on Iraqi soil. Otherwise, those "boys" might have had a chance to grow up in the relative safety of THEIR own country.

He means only in America are some people so arrogant to think they're worth more than other people. Only in America are some people so selfish as to be unconcerned about anybody but their corpulant selves. Go and stuff some more lard down your throat and make room for someone worthwhile please.
sorry dude, I can't do that.

God has me here for a reason, and going by as many close calls I have had, it must be a damn good reason. Its not my fault if I happen to be born in the greatest nation this planet has, and will ever see.

Make fun of me today
Cuz you'll be working for me someday

HIGHWAY30 4 LIFE!

He means only in America are some people so arrogant to think they're worth more than other people. Only in America are some people so selfish as to be unconcerned about anybody but their corpulant selves. Go and stuff some more lard down your throat and make room for someone worthwhile please.
sorry dude, I can't do that.

God has me here for a reason, and going by as many close calls I have had, it must be a damn good reason. Its not my fault if I happen to be born in the greatest nation this planet has, and will ever see.

Make fun of me today
Cuz you'll be working for me someday

HIGHWAY30 4 LIFE!


Somehow I envy your arrogance and you unrelenting optimism. Keep it real.

http://www.physics.otago.ac.nz/space/spinning_globe_48.gif

As if things weren't bad enough already.
America starts an illegal war, wins (with substantial help) as it should being a super-power, f--- the whole thing up after the deaths of 500+ servicemen and thousands of innocent Iraqis, creates ten times more terrorism than existed before the invasion, and some now want to murder whole neighbourhoods of Iraq to save American lives. It's called stupidity on a global scale, it's called murder. I will not believe that the majority of Americans support American terror, just as I am proud to say that the vast majority of Brits do not support more killing.

"It is better for a B-52 to flatten an Iraqi neighborhood than it is for one United States Marine to die. It is better to roll tanks down a foreign street than it is to put an American soldier in his grave".

http://www.nypost.com/postopinion/opedcolumnists/18538.htm
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."
-- John Lennon

You're right to be angered by the quote; it is a callous one, and is an opinion that, I would think, few of us have. However, whether you *want* to believe it or not, most people in this country still support the war, by a good margin. The rest of your rant is just solidly bats--t crazy, sorry. :wink:

He means only in America are some people so arrogant to think they're worth more than other people. Only in America are some people so selfish as to be unconcerned about anybody but their corpulant selves. Go and stuff some more lard down your throat and make room for someone worthwhile please.
sorry dude, I can't do that.

God has me here for a reason, and going by as many close calls I have had, it must be a damn good reason. Its not my fault if I happen to be born in the greatest nation this planet has, and will ever see.

Make fun of me today
Cuz you'll be working for me someday

HIGHWAY30 4 LIFE!

I'm not surprised you have had so many close calls. Its not God, its Darwinism in action, you will be collected soon enough.

I thought this was about "liberating Iraq", not turning it into a crematorium?

how can you liberate with out total victory?

its impossible

you either have to win the hearts and minds (thats not happening) or grab them by their balls (seems to be the new plan, and it will work, just ask GEN Sherman).

However, whether you *want* to believe it or not, most people in this country still support the war, by a good margin. The rest of your rant is just solidly bats--t crazy, sorry. :wink:
Where do you get your facts from?

Latest from Gallup:

http://www.gallup.com/content/?ci=11260

"At the same time, more people are questioning whether the war should have been launched at all. The poll shows close to an evenly divided public, with 50% saying that "all in all" it was worth going to war in Iraq, and 47% saying it was not."

You're right to be angered by the quote; it is a callous one, and is an opinion that, I would think, few of us have. However, whether you *want* to believe it or not, most people in this country still support the war, by a good margin. The rest of your rant is just solidly bats--t crazy, sorry. :wink:You might want to check the latest polls on that, Roy. It's not so cut and dried as you might think. A poll released today by Newsweek has Bush's approve/disapprove specifically on Iraq at 44%/51% but also has people supporting more troop involvement in response to recent attacks by 63% to 31%.

There are a lot of mixed feelings out there right now, and I would fall into the majority in both categories of that poll, even though I opposed the war from the very start. The country doesn't necessarily support this war, although they almost unquestioningly support the troops--those are not one and the same, though, and it's important to remember that.

Withdrawal of troops:

Perhaps the most significant change in the public's attitudes is on the question of withdrawal of troops. The poll shows that 46% of Americans would prefer to begin withdrawing U.S. troops from Iraq, including 28% who want to withdraw all of them -- up from 16% who expressed that view in a Jan. 2-5 poll. Another 18% want to withdraw "some" troops, while 29% want to keep the same number in Iraq that are there now, and 20% want more troops.

Or increase?

Given recent fighting in Iraq, some liberal and conservative commentators have suggested that the United States must either increase the number of troops to provide more security, or withdraw. The public is more disposed to withdrawing (46%) than increasing troops (20%), though public sentiment could become more supportive if the president decides to make the case for additional forces.

http://www.gallup.com/content/?ci=11260

I'm not surprised you have had so many close calls. Its not God, its Darwinism in action, you will be collected soon enough.
wrong, its called drunk driving that has provided those close calls.

and God, not Darwin, looked after me in those situations.

we outnumber them, so if one US soldier KIA = 1000 dead insurgants we will win eventually.
http://www.physics.otago.ac.nz/space/spinning_globe_48.gif

And that's the attitude that will lead to the 'loss' of Iraq and terrorism never before seen in this poor, blighted world.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."
-- John Lennon
military victory is handled with numbers, not ideals.
I thought this was about "liberating Iraq", not turning it into a crematorium?

BTW, that story demonstrates the twisted morality that puts this world in jeopardy.

The only REAL threat that Iraq was to America, occurred when Americans set foot on Iraqi soil. Otherwise, those "boys" might have had a chance to grow up in the relative safety of THEIR own country.

If you want destroy other cultures you have to destroy the present and their history. Only destroying this culture opens the door for installing the wonderful American Way of Life.

However, whether you *want* to believe it or not, most people in this country still support the war, by a good margin. The rest of your rant is just solidly bats--t crazy, sorry. :wink:
Where do you get your facts from?

Latest from Gallup:

http://www.gallup.com/content/?ci=11260

"At the same time, more people are questioning whether the war should have been launched at all. The poll shows close to an evenly divided public, with 50% saying that "all in all" it was worth going to war in Iraq, and 47% saying it was not."

The last poll I've seen put support at 67%. Still, even if we accept your poll, 50% in favor, 47% opposed is still a majority. Any numbers from the last few days will hardly be representative, mind you.

I'm not surprised you have had so many close calls. Its not God, its Darwinism in action, you will be collected soon enough.
wrong, its called drunk driving that has provided those close calls.

and God, not Darwin, looked after me in those situations.So let me get this straight--God looked out for you because you deliberately chose to impair yourself and then operate a machine that was capable of killing not only yourself, but other innocents as well? What God do you worship exactly? Is there a patron saint of fuck-wits?

I'm not surprised you have had so many close calls. Its not God, its Darwinism in action, you will be collected soon enough.
wrong, its called drunk driving that has provided those close calls.

and God, not Darwin, looked after me in those situations.

I hope you die. Literally. I hope you have a heart attack. I have no tolerance for people who drive drunk, and even less for those who proudly admit it. I hope you get hit by a train.

I'm not surprised you have had so many close calls. Its not God, its Darwinism in action, you will be collected soon enough.
wrong, its called drunk driving that has provided those close calls.

and God, not Darwin, looked after me in those situations.So let me get this straight--God looked out for you because you deliberately chose to impair yourself and then operate a machine that was capable of killing not only yourself, but other innocents as well? What God do you worship exactly? Is there a patron saint of f----wits?
who the fuck said I was the one drinking and driving?
people who drink and drive have put my ass in the hospitial where the doctor has told me "son, we don't think you were wearing a seat belt. you are lucky to be on this bed alive right now."

I'm not surprised you have had so many close calls. Its not God, its Darwinism in action, you will be collected soon enough.
wrong, its called drunk driving that has provided those close calls.

and God, not Darwin, looked after me in those situations.So let me get this straight--God looked out for you because you deliberately chose to impair yourself and then operate a machine that was capable of killing not only yourself, but other innocents as well? What God do you worship exactly? Is there a patron saint of f----wits?
who the f--- said I was the one drinking and driving?
people who drink and drive have put my ass in the hospitial where the doctor has told me "son, we don't think you were wearing a seat belt. you are lucky to be on this bed alive right now."My apologies--your statement was ambiguous.

I'm not surprised you have had so many close calls. Its not God, its Darwinism in action, you will be collected soon enough.
wrong, its called drunk driving that has provided those close calls.

and God, not Darwin, looked after me in those situations.So let me get this straight--God looked out for you because you deliberately chose to impair yourself and then operate a machine that was capable of killing not only yourself, but other innocents as well? What God do you worship exactly? Is there a patron saint of f----wits?
who the f--- said I was the one drinking and driving?
people who drink and drive have put my ass in the hospitial where the doctor has told me "son, we don't think you were wearing a seat belt. you are lucky to be on this bed alive right now."

Ah. Allow me to apologize. The way you said it sounded like you were the one driving while drunk. Please forgive me for my comments.

quote="New Auburnland"]I'm not surprised you have had so many close calls. Its not God, its Darwinism in action, you will be collected soon enough.
wrong, its called drunk driving that has provided those close calls.

and God, not Darwin, looked after me in those situations.[/quote]

Don't waste your time with this guy, he's just stirring. I've encounted him before and I fell for it, I'm ashamed to admit. I hope just is, anyway.

US lives vs. Iraqi lives - I think the whole 4 killed Us citizens and the response it illictated proves that the US considers the life of its own citizens as much, much, much more important as those of foriegners. There is a better example of this though. When the Bali bombing happened, how well was it was covered in the US? Not very well from what I heard, why? Because most of the casualties weren't Americans.

"Thou shalt not kill . . . . Americans"

Don't take it personally, no offence intended, this is just the image we get of the US.

i apologize for not making my original statement clear to you all.

on that note, i am out of here like a fat kid in dodgeball.

good night

i apologize for not making my original statement clear to you all.

on that note, i am out of here like a fat kid in dodgeball.

good night

Off like a prom dress?

double post -- weird...

The last poll I've seen put support at 67%. Still, even if we accept your poll, 50% in favor, 47% opposed is still a majority. Any numbers from the last few days will hardly be representative, mind you.Why won't they? They could certainly be representative of a growing trend. Plus--a lot depends on the questions asked and who was asked.

The last poll I've seen put support at 67%. Still, even if we accept your poll, 50% in favor, 47% opposed is still a majority. Any numbers from the last few days will hardly be representative, mind you.Why won't they? They could certainly be representative of a growing trend.

Same reason Bush *had* a 91% approval rating, and why the war *had* 70+% support. A.) Things change, and B.) the last few days have been chaotic in Iraq.

I understand that--but what I'm saying is that the polls over time show a trend toward disapproval with the war in Iraq. These polls aren't necessarily outliers--they could easily be the next step in a trend that has been steadily building againt suppost. The last high point was back in December, after all, with the capture of Saddam. They've been going steadily downhill ever since.

I understand that--but what I'm saying is that the polls over time show a trend toward disapproval with the war in Iraq. These polls aren't necessarily outliers--they could easily be the next step in a trend that has been steadily building againt suppost. The last high point was back in December, after all, with the capture of Saddam. They've been going steadily downhill ever since.

Yeh, I'm too lazy to dig up that thread from a few days ago. The numbers have been bouncing up and down for the last 6 months. In fact, Saddam's capture had a delayed effect on the polls, if I remember correctly. Still, I think that a successful handover in June will change the numbers radically, provided things go reasonably well until then.

<I>When the Bali bombing happened, how well was it was covered in the US?</i>

It got a bit more coverage then the chechnyians taking hold of whatever theatre it was in Moscow. I actually heard something about that in the local news, and CNN actually gave it more then 5 seconds in a single day. It's a well known fact, already established in this thread, that if it doesnt involve the US, it doesnt mean jack to the news media. We hear very little about hotspots of the world, heard nothing when Pakistan and India, picked up their nagging a little, when China threatened invasion if one of the Taiwanese candidates had won the national elections. Tis one of the good things about the internet though, it opens people up to new stuff. Then again, I could've just written that and it be somewhat unrelated to the topic. If so, I apologize, tis 4.09 in the morning here so...yub.

Although they surrounded Bin Laden, they don't get him. Why? Bush waits till the elections come.

While the few good people in this world toil and work to make things better- people liek Bush, Bin Laden, Hussein, half a dozen religious fanatics of christian, jewish and islamic faiths (and the rest too but those are the three most relevant) all work to make the world greater too... for them and those they favour.

Pray tell me why the coalition of the willing usurped hussein out? was it for the common good?... I would believe so if they also planned to liberate Zimbabwe and a few other countries under brutal dictorship governments..

<I>When the Bali bombing happened, how well was it was covered in the US?</i>

It got a bit more coverage then the chechnyians taking hold of whatever theatre it was in Moscow. I actually heard something about that in the local news, and CNN actually gave it more then 5 seconds in a single day. It's a well known fact, already established in this thread, that if it doesnt involve the US, it doesnt mean jack to the news media. We hear very little about hotspots of the world, heard nothing when Pakistan and India, picked up their nagging a little, when China threatened invasion if one of the Taiwanese candidates had won the national elections. Tis one of the good things about the internet though, it opens people up to new stuff. Then again, I could've just written that and it be somewhat unrelated to the topic. If so, I apologize, tis 4.09 in the morning here so...yub.It got decent coverage for a couple of days, but only because there was an al-Qaeda link. Otherwise, it wouldn't have gotten jack--and even with the al-Qaeda link it was quickly bumped, no doubt for a story on Lacey Petersen or Michael Jackson's penis or the like.

Atlas?World Press magazine, which excerpts articles from leading English language publications around the world, does a yearly survey of contributing editors of their magazines' top stories for the year.

American magazine stories are almost all US related, even if they occur overseas (such as Iraq).


Editors in London, Beirut, Hong Kong, Lagos, Rio, Calcutta, all choose a global variety of stories, natural disasters, international policymaking, conflicts, politics, science breakthroughs, all more interesting than our ingrown narcissism.

Articles like this one help pushing anti-USA moods in the hearts of not-US-Americans.

It is so typical, only the USA and its citizens are worthful and the rest of the world is pure shit.

you got it right guy!

you must be in f--- ing MENSA or something!
http://www.physics.otago.ac.nz/space/spinning_globe_48.gif

He means only in America are some people so arrogant to think they're worth more than other people. Only in America are some people so selfish as to be unconcerned about anybody but their corpulant selves. Go and stuff some more lard down your throat and make room for someone worthwhile please.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."
-- John Lennon

I love how you just make generalizations...you're telling me no other nation's people put their own interests above the "world's"??...that no Irishman would insists his nation's prohibition on abortion stand in contrast to England's having that procedure available....that no Saudi would take his country's interests above the world?..that no Chilean wouldn't take his country's interests over that of Argentina?

I'm an American citizen..not a World Citizen..my nation is governed by the US Constitution..not the UN Charter....I served in the United States Marine Corps under an American officer not the United Nations Armed Forces..etc..etc...you get my gist...No..I am not concerned with the loss of a textile plant in Italy...or a loss of a political race in Thailand...let those's nation's people look to their own affairs.

And ya damn right..that not a 1000 insurgents is worth the life of one of my brothers-in-arms...and caring bout my former comrades makes me a bad citizen?...no doubt if the United Nations was my government I would feel bad...but since it's not....no..I don't care.

Atlas?World Press magazine, which excerpts articles from leading English language publications around the world, does a yearly survey of contributing editors of their magazines' top stories for the year.

American magazine stories are almost all US related, even if they occur overseas (such as Iraq).


Editors in London, Beirut, Hong Kong, Lagos, Rio, Calcutta, all choose a global variety of stories, natural disasters, international policymaking, conflicts, politics, science breakthroughs, all more interesting than our ingrown narcissism.

That's what I thought the US media was like. I think this has an impact on the American collective pysche (I know I'm generalising here, so don't be offended) - "If it ain't American, why should I care?" what in turn comes out when dealing with 'foriegners' lives.

off topic -
If you want a good international news source, check out www.9sbs.org.au, this is the news I watch when I'm in Australia.

Salishe - I think you're kind of proving the point others are trying to make. But it is a fact, the US is one of the most inward looking countries there is in terms of media covereage. Ofcourse everyone cares more about their own country, but I don't think it's worth killing a thousand Iraqi's for one Australian (who I don't should be there in the first place, but Iraq has been done to death so lets not get into it).

Salishe, your standpoint is acceptable as long as you do not want your country to be the chief of the whole world.

Salishe, your standpoint is acceptable as long as you do not want your country to be the chief of the whole world.

I'm perfectly content in the status of my country..and I don't think we desire the status of "Chief of the whole world"...I do think that by pressing for a stable democratic society in Iraq our interests will coincide...if it could be managed....we would have a buffer against Syrian and Iranian interests in the region.

From CNN: Three U.S. Marines were killed Sunday in fighting west of Baghdad, bringing the total number of U.S. troops killed in three days to 23, coalition officials said today. Thirteen of the Americans were killed Friday. Meanwhile, the rash of civilian kidnappings continued Sunday night, when seven Chinese men were abducted in central Iraq.

Does anybody but me believe that it is both idiotic and totally arrogant to try to impose democracy on people against their will? I believe that democracy is the best system around, but the folks in the middle east simply don't want it. The governments that work there are either dictatorships (even if given the appearance of democracy), kingdoms or religious theocracies. So, is it really surprising that they are fighting our attempt at imposing democracy from the outside?

Irish, no, you are somehow right because democracy in general is based on the wishes of the majority.

But we should not forget that those countries where the riots are, now undergo a special phase. They are develloping from middle age countries to modern states, and most countries who underwent this phase had those problems. In Germany, it was the Hitler regime, in Russia 1917 revolution, and so on. The problem is that the weapons are getting more advanced and therefore those extremists are more dangerous. However, they will not beat Hitler, I think.

From CNN: Three U.S. Marines were killed Sunday in fighting west of Baghdad, bringing the total number of U.S. troops killed in three days to 23, coalition officials said today. Thirteen of the Americans were killed Friday. Meanwhile, the rash of civilian kidnappings continued Sunday night, when seven Chinese men were abducted in central Iraq.

Does anybody but me believe that it is both idiotic and totally arrogant to try to impose democracy on people against their will? I believe that democracy is the best system around, but the folks in the middle east simply don't want it. The governments that work there are either dictatorships (even if given the appearance of democracy), kingdoms or religious theocracies. So, is it really surprising that they are fighting our attempt at imposing democracy from the outside?

off topic -
They were actually quite a fan of democratic socalist governments, such as Nasser in Eygpt and whoever it was in Iran before the CIA decided to get rid of him (which destablised the country allowing the Ayatollah to get supprt and take control, nice work boys!), but the White House decided at the time in the context of the Cold War that was 'too damn commie' so it set about supporting dictators, such as Saddam Hussien (who was still a bit socalist though).

But I agree, who are we (I'm including coalition partners here) to force things down their throat if they don't want it? Dictatorships normally fall from within anyway, such as in the case of Chile and Romania.