NationStates Jolt Archive

Having been attempting to aquire a copy of JG for a good while I was elated when my girlfriend bought me a copy as an early christmas present.

So, i waited till college was finished and my first day of holidays sat down to work on conquering the novel.

Now, firstly i would like to say that it was relatively entertaining, it is a read, but not the sort of book to read if your hoping to be challenged at all, i was hoping for some groundbreaking material that would really make me take a step back and ponder our own society. Instead I was left with a feeling of discontentment, and had to go and read 1984 again just to get the sort of messages I was hoping for.

All in all, Max Barry the hat is off to you, you kept me entertained for the best part of a day, though I was a little dissapointed.

I have to admit, perhaps it's worst feature was the fact that it is not a long book at all.

Have you read Syrup - that is Max's first novel.

I have to admit, perhaps it's worst feature was the fact that it is not a long book at all.

Have you read Syrup - that is Max's first novel.

Agreed, you can see it off in one dedicated sitting, no I've not read the first novel, I'd like to, because i do think JG showed a lot of potential to be awesome, it just missed that, edge.

Agreed, you can see it off in one dedicated sitting, no I've not read the first novel, I'd like to, because i do think JG showed a lot of potential to be awesome, it just missed that, edge.

I see where you are coming from and highly recommend that you read Syrup, however, it is like JG in that it too is not a long book.

How many pages is it? I once read 120 pages in one hour.

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Kûk‡xenisi n!ok‡x'osi xno-k‡xek‡emi.
The state only exists to serve itself.
Racism-the other stupid ideology
Peace, love, and girls with small waists and really big butts!
http://www.sulucas.com/images/steatopygia.jpg
I'm male. Note the pic
of attractive women.

How many pages is it? I once read 120 pages in one hour.

It is certainely over 120 pages. I can't remember the exact amount but it's over 120 pages.

Jennifer Government: 336 pages.
Syrup: 304 pages.

Jennifer Government: 336 pages.
Syrup: 304 pages.

Yeah, I knew it was about 300 pages long.

Were you expecting LOTR?

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Kûk‡xenisi n!ok‡x'osi xno-k‡xek‡emi.
The state only exists to serve itself.
Racism-the other stupid ideology
Peace, love, and girls with small waists and really big butts!
http://www.sulucas.com/images/steatopygia.jpg
I'm male. Note the pic
of attractive women.

Were you expecting LOTR?

Lord of the Capitalizts? ;)

I suppose. From what I've heard, the book is essentially the opposite of anarchism(government and corporations both very powerful rather than nonexistant.)

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kûk‡xenisi n!ok‡x'osi xno-k‡xek‡emi.
The state only exists to serve itself.
Racism-the other stupid ideology
Peace, love, and girls with small waists and really big butts!
http://www.sulucas.com/images/steatopygia.jpg
I'm male. Note the pic
of attractive women.

I suppose. From what I've heard, the book is essentially the opposite of anarchism(government and corporations both very powerful rather than nonexistant.

Government isn't very powerful at all...in fact, the police have been privatized (part of Team Advantage, specifically). Basically the Police and the NRA are similar in the book, but in different corporate alliances.

So it's a libertarian world. Sounds horrifying.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kûk‡xenisi n!ok‡x'osi xno-k‡xek‡emi.
The state only exists to serve itself.
Racism-the other stupid ideology
Peace, love, and girls with small waists and really big butts!
http://www.sulucas.com/images/steatopygia.jpg
I'm male. Note the pic
of attractive women.

Were you expecting LOTR?

.

That pages don't have that much on either, the words are really spread out and in a larger font.

That pages don't have that much on either, the words are really spread out and in a larger font.

Too true, that was JG's letdown.

That pages don't have that much on either, the words are really spread out and in a larger font.

Too true, that was JG's letdown.

Yeah, I only count 34 lines/page.

Yeah, I only count 34 lines/page.

I'm not sure whether that was sarcasm or not. :?

lol, I don't think it was sarcasm

I'll keep that in mind when I read the book.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kûk‡xenisi n!ok‡x'osi xno-k‡xek‡emi.-The state only exists to serve itself.
"Oppose excessive military spending, yet believe in excessive spending on junk food and plastic surgery to make all your women look like LARDASSES!"-Sino, when I criticized excessive military spending.
http://www.sulucas.com/images/steatopygia.jpg
I'm male. Note the pic of attractive women.

That pages don't have that much on either, the words are really spread out and in a larger font.

Too true, that was JG's letdown.

Funny... I judge a book on it's content, not its word-count.

Funny... I judge a book on it's content, not its word-count.

Yeah, but, if it's too short, then it's a let-down. We're not saying the content is bad, infact we wish there was more of the content which is why we are complaining about the small size of the book.

All in all, Max Barry the hat is off to you, you kept me entertained for the best part of a day, though I was a little dissapointed.
Not exactly "wholly" disappointing, then. ;)

I have not found it an easy read. I have had to digest it in small portions because its vision is so unsettling to me.

It's my favorite Christmas present this year. :)

I have not found it an easy read. I have had to digest it in small portions because its vision is so unsettling to me.

It's my favorite Christmas present this year. :)

Hm. What's it say about me that I breezed through it then?

I suppose. From what I've heard, the book is essentially the opposite of anarchism(government and corporations both very powerful rather than nonexistant.)


Oh no, it is very similar to anarchy. The anarchy you are thinkin of is Anarcho-Syndicalism, whereas JG is like Anarcho-Capitalizm (the "z" gives it teenage rebel appeal). The difference being corporations running things are powerful, instead of collective communes or what have you.

I have not found it an easy read. I have had to digest it in small portions because its vision is so unsettling to me.

It's my favorite Christmas present this year. :)

Hm. What's it say about me that I breezed through it then?

That it's your style of book?!

Funny... I judge a book on it's content, not its word-count.

Yeah, but, if it's too short, then it's a let-down. We're not saying the content is bad, infact we wish there was more of the content which is why we are complaining about the small size of the book.

I concur.

I concur.

Thanks! :D

I mean, it's a very good book, well written and all, but I would have liked a substantial amount more of it.

Having been attempting to aquire a copy of JG for a good while I was elated when my girlfriend bought me a copy as an early christmas present.

So, i waited till college was finished and my first day of holidays sat down to work on conquering the novel.

Now, firstly i would like to say that it was relatively entertaining, it is a read, but not the sort of book to read if your hoping to be challenged at all, i was hoping for some groundbreaking material that would really make me take a step back and ponder our own society. Instead I was left with a feeling of discontentment, and had to go and read 1984 again just to get the sort of messages I was hoping for.

All in all, Max Barry the hat is off to you, you kept me entertained for the best part of a day, though I was a little dissapointed.

I don't think we need another 1984 or another Brave New World or another Fahrenheit 451...we have something new here. Something fresh on the negative direction the world is taking. Instead of a dark and dreary future we have seen done over and over, in JG we have something brighter, newer, shinier, flashier, and an equally negative (or positive?) near future. I want more Jennifer...we need a sequel. I guess that will be required after the movie is a big hit. JG will be the Jack Ryan of the new alternate millenium.

I want more Jennifer...we need a sequel. I guess that will be required after the movie is a big hit. JG will be the Jack Ryan of the new alternate millenium.

There's ideas for sequels in another thread. :D

After playing NationStates for a while I finally got Jennifer Government and finished it just now. I feel like such a sucker falling for a cheap marketing gimmick like this one. hehe :wink:

But I still loved the book! Very entertaining. I actually liked that it was a little short and was broken up into even shorter segments inside each section. That's a great format for readers with ADD. :)

It's scary to think the US has a man in the White House who truly feels that the private sector is suprerior in every way and would bring our world close to the one in the book. He's taking away government's ability to do anything at all to corporations, putting CEO's and corporate lobbyists in most positions of power, and privatizing everything he can. It's not hard to envision the police and ambulances operating like they do in the book when Bush has already proposed to privatize the Naitonal Park Service, the Postal Service, Social Security, Medicaire, and three or four other things I'm forgetting. There isn't one part of the government Bush wouldn't like to hand over to his corporate sponsors for their benefit.
Argh!!!

Anyway, good book. I'm going to reccomend it to my liberal and conservative friends alike.

But I still loved the book! Very entertaining. I actually liked that it was a little short and was broken up into even shorter segments inside each section. That's a great format for readers with ADD. :)

I'm glad you liked the book, although I have to disagree with you over the shortness of it.

BTW, what is ADD?

Attention Deficit Disorder. You have a very short attention span and get bored with things very rapid...

*Gets bored and wanders off.* :lol:

Attention Deficit Disorder. You have a very short attention span and get bored with things very rapid...

*Gets bored and wanders off.* :lol:

Is that different to ADHD or is ADD just the American form of ADD?

Attention Deficit Disorder. You have a very short attention span and get bored with things very rapid...

*Gets bored and wanders off.* :lol:

Is that different to ADHD or is ADD just the American form of ADD?

People use both terms interchangeably, so you've got the idea. Technically someone with ADHD but without the hyperactivity part can be said to have ADD.

For example, someone could read a little bit, go make a post on the NationStates board, put some music on the stereo, then come back to the book and know exactly where they left off. Very nice.

People use both terms interchangeably, so you've got the idea. Technically someone with ADHD but without the hyperactivity part can be said to have ADD.

Oh...you learn something new everyday (not meaning any offence of course).

People use both terms interchangeably, so you've got the idea. Technically someone with ADHD but without the hyperactivity part can be said to have ADD.

Oh...you learn something new everyday (not meaning any offence of course).

Still looking for the sequel thred, but the longer this one goes on, I have yet to hear anything negative, except:
1. JG was too short, boo hoo -- why waste time, very enjoyable and to the point.
2. Not 1984 enough, huh? -- why stray from the reality of the futue, Orwell was wrong.

Catholic Europe, you're mighty nice.

Catholic Europe, you're mighty nice.

Hmm, thankyou....I think.....if you weren't being sarcastic. :?

Hmm, thankyou....I think.....if you weren't being sarcastic. :?

no sarcasm, a few too many beers :oops:

Having read all of Max's stuff, figure his booklist should be a good place to find some more good stuff. Enjoying The Gun Seller...another thred for another time.

Hmm, thankyou....I think.....if you weren't being sarcastic. :?

no sarcasm, a few too many beers :oops:

Oh well, that's understandable! :wink:

OK, now that i have bought the book, read it. Enjoyed it, can't wait to pressure Max for another book. Can Max Please come and see CE and me? :D

OK, now that i have bought the book, read it. Enjoyed it, can't wait to pressure Max for another book. Can Max Please come and see CE and me? :D

You could get Syrup!

You could get Syrup!

:D i had to search high and low for JG, finally found a SciFi/RPG/Fantasy book store in stockholm that had it. But Syrup is no where to be seen

:D i had to search high and low for JG, finally found a SciFi/RPG/Fantasy book store in stockholm that had it. But Syrup is no where to be seen

Order it online at Amazon.com.

I just finished JG as well. I thought it was great and it added a lot more demention to how I play this game.

As for the complaints that its too short ... well, I wasn't ready to stop reading when I hit the last page, either. But, isn't it better to be left wanting more than to be done with the whole thing 3 chapters before the author wraps it up? I thought the book was very fast paced and burned through the book in one afternoon.

And for those of you wishing it was more 1984, why do something that's already been done? If you want the message 1984 has to offer, read Orwell. Personally, I think how fast, slick and not so obvious it was is just another extent in which the novel reflects our society. How long do you stand around and wait inline for your dose of commercialism?

I just finished JG as well. I thought it was great and it added a lot more demention to how I play this game.

I'm intrigued as to how the bokk added more 'demention' to the game.

It made me understand some of the nation classifications more, at least, from the stance that Max was coming from. It also made me want to "experiement" a little more with how I respond to issues to see which ways I can push my nation. Overall, it just made me more aware of what I was doing and why the game plays the way it does.

I didn't mean to make it sound like it profoundly affected the way I behave on NS and apologize if it came across that way.

BTW, what is ADD?


Sometimes spelled "MTV".


Still looking for the sequel thred, but the longer this one goes on, I have yet to hear anything negative, except:
1. JG was too short, boo hoo -- why waste time, very enjoyable and to the point.
2. Not 1984 enough, huh? -- why stray from the reality of the futue, Orwell was wrong.


JG was a decent length, and it raced along at a nioce fast pace. Very easy to read, funny, and peppered with interesting characters. Maybe a little cinematic rather than literary is the only accusation I would level at it, but all in all one of the most enjoyable books I read last year. I would have to be honest and say that it didn't quite blow me away the way Neal Stephenson's "Snowcrash" or "The Diamond Age" did (both contain fascinating future possibilities concerning government, corporations etc...) but that's probably an unfair comparison and puts the bar too high.

Taking JG and Syrup together (which is also an excellent read) will certainly mean I'll be looking out for Max's next book with some anticipation.


And while 1984 has been mentioned, I couldn't disagree more on Yuengling Lager's comment. 1984 was and remains visionary, and one of the most important post war novels written in english.

In fact, it baffles me that anyone could claim it was irrelevant when easy identification with the present day can be made.

1984 - A population who have surrendered their rights to a government which promises to protect them from an external threat whom they are at war with. A war that cannot be won, which is eternal. A war that does not threaten the homeland with invasion. A war in which sides are changed, but the leadership continues as though everything is as it always was.....


It's not that hard to see the similarities really-

2004 - rights are eroded in the name of fighting The War on Terror. The War on Terror may well last forever. The effect of the "war" will be felt through limited attacks and not invasions. The CIA train Al Quaeda and the west arms Iraq...reverse situation...don't even consider the implications of the past...


1984 has nothing to say about the world? Not in my opinion.

BTW, what is ADD?

Sometimes spelled "MTV".

Was that meant to be funny?

ADD is Attention Deficit Disorder

ADD is Attention Deficit Disorder

Yeah, I know.

BTW, what is ADD?

Sometimes spelled "MTV".

Was that meant to be funny?

Hey...if you don't like the jokes just sit quietly. No heckling at the back.

Hey...if you don't like the jokes just sit quietly. No heckling at the back.

Well, I don't see how it was a joke. :?

I do. Celdonia's referring to the short-attention-span-channel-surfing-
reality-TV-watching-never-go-outside-to-play "MTV Generation."

I myself loved Jennifer Government, and every page of it. This coming from a sometimes hard-to-please English major (hence my wincing at my own run-on sentence above, but 'twas necessary to get the point across). 8)

I do. Celdonia's referring to the short-attention-span-channel-surfing-
reality-TV-watching-never-go-outside-to-play "MTV Generation."

I watch MTV but I'm not like that.....I think.

Pope Hope is correct. Keep it a secret though, but I've been known to watch MTV myself once in a while (though I've really got to the age where I'm more likely to tune into VH1).

I think there's alot of ADD here, have we forgotten that this is the JG is Wholly disappointing. or are we not ADD and have all come to realize that Max is great and this book will be on every high school literature curriculum, and we are all jealous because what we had to read was the crappy, boing, "yeah, this might happen...unless I live in the USSR" 1984 -- Orwell is overated -- although he may have caught some of the the future by accident in "The Island of Dr. Moreu (spelling dont count)" which I see happening before anything that resembles 1984. not to say the government doesn't want to know what we are doing.

(can some one correct that grammatically to see if it works as a single sentence).

Cheers to Mr. Welch the greatest English teacher ever.

"Me no speak good English, unpossible." (the Simpsons)

Keep it a secret though, but I've been known to watch MTV myself once in a while (though I've really got to the age where I'm more likely to tune into VH1).

MTV is more my age....and thing.

Keep it a secret though, but I've been known to watch MTV myself once in a while (though I've really got to the age where I'm more likely to tune into VH1).

MTV is more my age....and thing.

JG was on my Xmas list more out of a sense of obligation than because I expected to enjoy it. But I've just read it and I did - very much.

From comments, I'd thought it was a lightweight "action thriller" but it was nearer my favourite genre - thoughtful SF. And I rather liked the little tip of the cap to C M Kornbluth's The Space Merchants!

A quarter of the way in I was feeling a bit depressed about MB's vision of the future. But then I realized there's a thread running through the book: children are what's important. Nearly every time someone actually does something decent there's a kid involved: from JG's decision to change careers, to the passer-by who can't save a gunned-down child, and the despair makes him rethink his priorities. (I won't spoil with more examples.)

All of which made me think: Max is either a brilliant dad, or had great parent(s) - or both? :)

and we are all jealous because what we had to read was the crappy, boing, "yeah, this might happen...unless I live in the USSR" 1984 -- Orwell is overated -- although he may have caught some of the the future by accident in "The Island of Dr. Moreu (spelling dont count)" which I see happening before anything that resembles 1984. not to say the government doesn't want to know what we are doing.


I already posted why I thought 1984 was important and very relevant today. Maybe we'll just have to aggree to disagree.

Oh, and it is H.G. Wells who wrote The Island of Dr. Moreau.

Orwell's '1984' was a warning not a prophecy. He was a strong socialist with comunist leanings (having fought in the Anti-Franco International Brigade in the Spanish Civil War) until he realised the truth about 'Uncle Joe' Stalin's regime in the former CCCP. '1984' was a warning of what *could* happen if totalitarianism was not resisted. Having said that, many of the things put forward in that novel have come to pass, the continuing coalecence of blocs of nations, the increasing omnipresence of CCTV/WebCams, the creeping simplification of Language to disguise and/or control meaning (think 'sound-bites' and 'spin'), etc, etc, etc.

A closer comparison, I would have though, would be with Neal Stephenson's 'Snow Crash'. Despite, as I already said, not having read JG yet, I can see major similarities in basic social structures. In 'Snow Crash' the USA has fragmented into 'franchulettes' eg each 'shop', office/campus or housing estate is the sovereign territory of the owning entity eg. 'Mr. Lee's Greater Hong Kong', 'Fly'n'Buy', 'The HooseGow' and 'The Mafia' (with it's own laws, enforced by contracted in private Police forces, of which there are several competing forms).
It will be interesting to see how JG differs when Amazon get round to deliverging my copy (ordered 2 days ago and itching to start).

[BTW I also though it was HGW that wrote Dr. Moreau, certainly not Orwell]

Hm.

Interesting take on things. There are similarities, but there is still something of the government left. It has a little more teeth than the government in Snow Crash, and there's no hyperinflation. Of course, Jennifer Government isn't as far in the future as Crash.

Actually, the Snow Crash world is sort of an extropolation of what would happen about 20 years of Jennifer Government level capitalizm.