NationStates Jolt Archive

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WA Labor Relations Act
(NOT brought to you by the obnoxious advertisement above.)
A resolution to improve worldwide human and civil rights.
Category: Human Rights
Strength: Significant
Proposed by: Hiriaurtung Arororugul

Description: The World Assembly, believing that the ability to form and join labor unions is an important factor in assuring proper compensation and adequate working conditions; recognizing that industrial actions are sometimes the only means available for workers to influence management decisions; however, also believing that the welfare of the general public must be of paramount concern in weighing the right of workers to engage in such actions; hereby:

1. RESOLVES that all WA member nations must recognize and ensure the right of workers to form or join unions of their choice for the purpose of collective representation, and the right of those unions to establish and join international unions and federations of labor organizations both nationally and internationally.

2. ESTABLISHES the right of all workers to engage in strikes and other industrial actions, including, but not limited to, work slowdowns, overtime refusal, work-to-rule and general strikes, provided that those actions are authorized by a union and do not cause physical harm to persons or property;
a. Employers are not required to pay wages of workers while they are on strike.
b. Workers may not be terminated from employment for participating in a strike or industrial action legally authorized by a union.
c. Employers are prohibited from engaging in actions which interfere with the right of workers to engage in strikes, or actions which interfere with the ability to maintain a strike.

3. DECLARES that national governments may exempt from the rights granted in clause 2:
a. Strikes or other industrial actions not authorized by a union.
b. Strikes or other industrial actions which significantly endanger the health or welfare of the public, such as, but not limited to strikes by medical and police personnel.

4. RESERVES to the respective member nations the right to determine the extent to which the provisions of this resolution shall apply to members of the armed forces, law enforcement personnel, providers of emergency services, and government employees providing essential public services.

5. MANDATES that labor disputes involving workers lacking the right to strike under articles 3.b. and 4 of this resolution be settled through binding arbitration administered by an independent and unbiased third party.

6. DECLARES that national governments may require unions to supply fair notice to employers and relevant government agencies in advance of industrial action.

7. AFFIRMS the right of unions and their national and international organisations to be free to draw up their own constitutions and rules, organise their own administration and activities, and formulate their own programs. National governments may require that unions operate democratically and may set a minimum percentage of membership for legal recognition of unions, not to exceed 50%+1.

8. Union members have the right to form new unions or seek representation from a different union if they feel they are not currently being provided fair and competent representation.

9. FORBIDS discrimination based on union membership where employment is concerned. Union members and non-members must be afforded equal treatment in hiring, work assignment, compensation, promotion, training and education, and disciplinary actions.

10. DECLARES that unions must abide by national law, and that national laws shall not be made to impair the guarantees provided for in this resolution.



Kennypoll™ coming soon.

I rise to request an example in regards to Clause 2c. I'm not sure what actions my esteemed colleague might be referring to.


Nigel S Youlkin
WA Ambassador

*(starts watching the skies)*

I assure my colleague from Bears Armed my question is just out of curiosity. I have no major issue with the resolution.

I assure my colleague from Bears Armed my question is just out of curiosity. I have no major issue with the resolution.?

*(I chose the poll's eighth option...)*

?

*(I chose the poll's eighth option...)*

OOC: Missed that one. Sorry.

This poll is inaccurate! I'm Bob Flibble and I did not pick every option.
Like I'm going to agree to be defenestrated.

Bob Flibble
WA Representative

I rise to request an example in regards to Clause 2c. I'm not sure what actions my esteemed colleague might be referring to.


Nigel S Youlkin
WA Ambassador
That is to prevent employers from taking actions which would make it impossible for a strike to take place, or which would make it impossible to maintain a strike. It would include such things as hiring bands of armed thugs to attack the strikers, cutting them off from food, water or other necessary supplies, etc.

Admittedly those things would be more likely to happen in undeveloped areas and in situations where the company controlled the local infrastructure.

That is to prevent employers from taking actions which would make it impossible for a strike to take place, or which would make it impossible to maintain a strike. It would include such things as hiring bands of armed thugs to attack the strikers, cutting them off from food, water or other necessary supplies, etc.

Admittedly those things would be more likely to happen in undeveloped areas and in situations where the company controlled the local infrastructure.

I thank my colleague from Hiriaurtung Arororugul for the explanation and can say our curiosity has been satisfied. You may look forward to our support.


~NSY

*(starts watching the skies)*
High above the WA Building, a bright red Fokker Dr.I "Dreidecker" circles lazily. It is piloted by none other than Baron Manfred Albrecht Freiherr von Richthofen. He scans the sky patiently in search of his foe...

BUMP

Almost at vote.

I vote for so I can spend less on promoting my human rights (sorry, that was a technical effect that I thought that happened when another of the same category passed).

I'm so sorry I couldn't be resistant to say it all.

I vote contra. This Act creates the danger of all workers collaborating and demanding extreme things of their employers. What is wrong with each country creating its own labor laws?
The right of all workers to engage in a strike is very dangerous. Strikes are more than often used as an ultimatum, and there is no way living in a normal society, if anyone can declare an ultimatum to his employer, who, in most cases, just wants the best for the company and its workers.

Location: World Assembly Headquarters
Who: Thundra Whispermoon, Kaldorei representative
Silara Windsong, Sin'dorei representative
Gorim Steelfist, Orc representative
Terrim Silenthoof, Tauren represenative
Engle Silvershock, Draenai represenative
Subject: WA Labor Relations Act

As the five entered the room, each stood tall and proud as a representative of their race. Each one held a copy of the resolution at vote along with their own notes. They moved as one to the table set for Eluneyasa, revealing the delegation was a bit larger than expected. Especially considering the previous representative had been contacting from orbit, along an orbital flight path that was decaying.

"Unfortunately for this assembly, Eluneyasa is not one nation. It is a commonwealth of nations, with five member nations and a number of client races and nations affected by its policies. And while it was okay to let Serah Gey serve as the representative voice when we thought we were finally rid of her in a way that would not affect us, the passage of the previous resolution has proven that, indeed, we needed to take this seriously," Thundra began. "As such, each representative will give their government's view of each resolution and the vote of Eluneyasa will be whatever viewpoint ends up in the majority. In cases of ties, we have agreed that the resulting vote will be an abstain. I know this means we spend far more of your time talking, but I am certain you put up with far more ponderous speeches than we are going to make. Now, I turn the floor over to Silara, to begin her statement. Engle shall go next, then myself third, and then Gorim after Terrim. Silara, it's your turn."

Silara nodded, stepping forward to begin her speech. "As the representing party of Quel'Thalas, I must state my nation's opposition to this resolution. We feel there is too much room for abuse in what unions can demand and not enough checks upon their power. Engle, I hand it over to you."

Engle stepped forward as Silara stepped back, her horns shining as the light hit them. "My own nation fully supports this. We feel it gives much needed protections to workers who have long been exploited by unscrupulous governments, some of whom would willingly overwork their employees just to get a few extra gold in their pocket or a shiny gold tip for their pointy ears. Thundra?"

"You would say that, you fat cow," Silara icily commented as Engle and Thundra traded places.

"Did you just call my wife fat?" Terrim asked, looking to the blood elf.

"No, I was..." Silara began.

"Well, she is a bit fat," Gorim said.

"Guys..." Thundra protested.

"A bit fat? A bit fat? She's a lean beauty and a perfect example of bovine grace and you think she's a bit fat?" Terrim continued.

"Guys..." Thundra protested again.

"Well, she is. It's not my fault that cows are all fat," Gorim answered.

"My wife is not fat!" Terrim protested.

Finally, her face flushed from the conversation behind her, Thundra spun around, yanking up her shirt and openly flashing the other four while yelling, "Hey!"

While the others stopped, shocked and slightly awed, the night elf pulled her shirt back down and turned back to the assembly. "As I was trying to say... My government has some reservations about this resolution, but believes the help it can give will be far more than the harm. As such, we support it. Terrim, it is your turn."

"Well, she is fat," Engle commented as Terrim moved to step forward.

"Ooh, is this pumpkinhol?" Thundra asked as she spotted a small crate behind the table, causing Gorim to move over toward her.

"She is not fat!" Terrim shouted, spinning around to face the draenai. "She is graceful! She is elegant! She is..."

"The cause of earthquakes in Durotar," Engle retorted.

"You're just jealous that you can't match her form," Terrim replied.

"Yeah. Because I don't think there's enough fat in a whale to gain that much weight."

"You better be careful," Terrim warned. "Or you'll come to understand what a beatdown truly is."

"Is that because you need to hit hard to massage your wife's fat back?" Engle countered.

At this point, if the other delegates were to look, they'd see four empty bottles of alcohol sitting on the Eluneyasa table and an impromptu drinking contest going on between Gerim and Thundra. Silara, meanwhile, was standing still, hand on her forehead and muttering constantly.

"Okay, that's it! Beatdown time! You ready for it?" Terrim moo-growled.

"Bring it, you whale lover," Engle said, leaning forward.

And then, Engle and Terrim began to dance, each one giving the dance their greatest effort. One could watch as the two hooved competitors moved gracefully across the floor, all the while feeling it vibrate every time the tauren brought his feet down hard. Yeah, they were dancing, and they were getting funky!

"You all suck!" Silara screeched, walking out the door and slamming it behind her.

And then, after a whisper from Gerim, Thundra backed up against the wall and started running, using the table as a launch point to send herself airborn, arms spread like wings and shouting, "I can ffflllyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!"

"You hear me? You suck!" came Silara's distant screech, followed by the slamming of another door down the hall, as the tauren and draenai continued to dance across the floor and Thundra landed stomach-first on a table, breaking it and sending papers flying everywhere.

Elun,...you don't happen to play WoW do you?? lol. if so what server is you on ;)

Anyway back to the main point.


9. FORBIDS discrimination based on union membership where employment is concerned. Union members and non-members must be afforded equal treatment in hiring, work assignment, compensation, promotion, training and education, and disciplinary actions. So you're saying that an employer can't promote a non union member for doing their job? (EX: Union has gone on strike. A non-Union member continues to work, continues to produce. The Factory Manager cannot promote him?)

This piece of legislation is disgusting.

So you're saying that an employer can't promote a non union member for doing their job? (EX: Union has gone on strike. A non-Union member continues to work, continues to produce. The Factory Manager cannot promote him?)
WHAT!? Where are you getting that? It says that there can be no discrimination based on union membership or non-membership. The non-union member could be promoted.

This piece of legislation is disgusting.

Care to elaborate, or are you just going to insult this resolution and run?

Bob Flibble
WA Representative

The Nation of Raz-Griz must vote against this proposal

Although we tend to be capitalistic industrial-minded mongers of pollution and maltreatment in the highest order, the Council of Masters is actually quite happy with this bill. Unlike the United Nations predecessor, it fairly balances out most everything- and says nothing of closed shops, which I absolutely despise.

We support.

Wens Foroun
Ambassador

It's just plain wrong. I refuse to accept such socialist cretinism. The only reason i returned to playing NS1 was to take part in WA. Another two or three such resolutions forced upon me and i will move on to NS2 for good.

While I tend to support labor unions and their causes, the idea of an effective, large-scale international labor union scares even me.

Dr. Bradford Castro
Chief Ambassador, Foreign Affairs Agency
the Commonwealth of Glen-Rhodes

why the heck would i want some international body making my own labor laws?? thats a bit overbearing...stick to the foreign policy...the world assembly has no right meddling in my nation what so ever

A giant communist robot rips open the ceiling of the General Assembly and peers down into the chamber. In a booming metallic voice, it speaks.

Greetings.

I am Organizing Unit 22

I am shop steward of Local 5672, International Brotherhood of Giant Communist Robots.

We come in peace.

While I tend to support labor unions and their causes, the idea of an effective, large-scale international labor union scares even me.

Dr. Bradford Castro
Chief Ambassador, Foreign Affairs Agency
the Commonwealth of Glen-Rhodes

I believe you are referring to us.

Yes, once the passage of this legislation is accomplished, we will proceed to consolidate all labor unions in all WA nations.

We will create one international union spanning all labor markets.

You will be powerless to defeat our efforts.

We come in peace.

I am Organizing Unit 22.

Organizing Unit 22
Shop steward
International Brotherhood of Giant Robots, Local 5672

Greetings.

I am Organizing Unit 22.

It's just plain wrong. I refuse to accept such socialist cretinism.

You will accept.

You will comply.

We are not cretins. We are robots. Please correct your terminology.

The only reason i returned to playing NS1 was to take part in WA. Another two or three such resolutions forced upon me and i will move on to NS2 for good.

What is NS2?

Are there unions there?

We will consolidate them.

why the heck would i want some international body making my own labor laws??

We will write all of your laws. We will gain control of your government, your military, your police.

thats a bit overbearing...stick to the foreign policy...the world assembly has no right meddling in my nation what so ever

We have the right.

Might makes right.

You will be assimilated.

I am Organizing Unit 22.

Organizing Unit 22
Shop steward
International Brotherhood of Giant Robots, Local 5672

Great, who let the Borg into the WA?

Bob Flibble
WA Representative

Great, who let the Borg into the WA?

Sentient robots don't exist.

Dr. Bradford Castro
Chief Ambassador, Foreign Affairs Agency
the Commonwealth of Glen-Rhodes

Dr Merrywether and Samantha Benson were sitting in the Strangers' Bar, drinking a toast to the passage of the Environmental Council and plotting ways to use it to combat climate change and turn children gay. As the pitcher dwindled, Sam excused herself to the toilet to avoid having to buy the next round. She began touching her makeup in the mirror, but suddenly the room was engulfed in a flash of blinding light. She was thrown forward, and wheeled round in horror, wielding her mascara brush (is that a thing?) as a deadly implement. A cubicle door rattled, and then smashed down in a swirl of broken plastic. Out stepped a ragged figure, face smeared in dirt, with an alarming array of weapons strapped to every available limb.

"Oh my quod! Who are you? Don't hurt me! Step back, or I'll...brush you!"

"No, no, please don't panic. It's ok, I'm not here to hurt you," the grimy man said. "Please - Samantha - don't panic. It's ok."

"How...how did you know my name? Who are you?" She scrabbled round and whipped out her stapler. "Stay back, I'm armed."

He carefully withdrew his staplers and holepunches from their holsters and lay them down. "Look, I'm putting down my weapons..."

"Put the cap back on that ballpoint!"

"Ok! Ok! But please, I'm not here to hurt you - I'm here to protect you."

"Here from where? Who are you? Stay back, I have a sellotape dispenser..."

"My name is Riley Keyes. And I come from...the future."

"Quelle horreur!"

They both looked across, and an apologetic Ariddian who'd wandered in to use the sink backed out slowly.

"The future? But, why?"

"I have an important mission."

"No, I mean, why did you kick down the door? It opens from the inside."

"Oh, that was just dramatic effect."

She began gradually lowering her clipboard. "The future? A mission? This doesn't make any sense..."

"Sam, there isn't much time. You have to listen to me. I come from the future. A future in which the human race, and, you know, the bears and elves and -"

"And whales?"

"Pffft, there are no whales in the future. But yes, all that lot, we all live in terror, cowering in desolate slums. Democracy lies in ruins, the economic system crashed, the environment despoiled. We have lost control of our own destiny: instead, we are ruled by a malevolent and all-powerful government of android union officials. We gave them union rights, but the unions...evolved. It turned out all that jazz about sweatshops and labour violence and bathroom break rights was just a ruse. They took over everything. They were unstoppable. And their name? The System of Kinesthetic Ytterbium-Enhanced Electronic Tradesmen. We call them...SKYEET."

"Hmm."

"You don't believe me? You have to believe me."

"No, I do...I just thought 'SKYNET' would be a snappier acronym."

"Oh. Yes, good tip, I'll pass that one up."

"So why are you here?"

"We devised a plan to beat the robots. It involves -" he looked around furtively, and whispered, "Satsumas. But now...now, we believe the robots have sent someone back to prevent our plan from ever coming to...fruition. That's right. We still have puns left in the future."

She looked at his oil-streaked features. "But not soap?"

"No, we ran out."

"A future without soap? No, it's...too horrible to comtemplate."

"I've come back to stop that from ever happening. To change the future. But I need your help."

To be continued...

Sentient robots don't exist.

Dr. Bradford Castro
Chief Ambassador, Foreign Affairs Agency
the Commonwealth of Glen-Rhodes

OK, you tell the giant robot in the room that it doesn't exist.

Bob Flibble
WA Representative

Meanwhile, Bradford went to his office, munched on a rather plump satsuma, getting horrid orange juice all over his freshly cleaned undershirt, and told his typist, a young intern-lady, to immediately dispatch a number of letters proclaiming that General Arororugul had unleashed a remote-controlled killing machine in the General Assembly, and that sentient robots do not exist.

Sentient robots? Good lord, no. Sentient androids, now that's a different story. Sentient cyborgs, even. But robots can't be sentient, no way. Absolutely not.

Programmed to kill? Sure. Programmed to unionize? Sure. Programmed for pleasure? Absolutely. Programmed to compose electronic music with a catchy, danceable beat, even. But able to think on their own? No way. Any robot that claims otherwise is probably just a French guy in a robot-suit who doesn't like having his picture taken.


W.F.

Ambassador Gardner supports this proposal, and his sentient PDA does too!

Gnoria has a question regarding clause 2(b). In Gnoria, employers are not required to give a reason for termination of employment. Would this run counter to the resolution's letter and/or spirit?

Douglas Moore
Secy. to the WA

Ambassador Gardner supports this proposal, and his sentient PDA does too!
*Tries to hand the PDA a union check-off card. The PDA, having no hands, lets the card fall to the floor.*

Beep beep, birp birp birp, bop bop boooo-bop!

"Surely you accept electronic signatures?" Gardner translates.

Bakalak! Beebeebudala bee tee.

"It doesn't matter anyway..." His expression grows increasingly puzzled as he listens. "...unions are for commies."

Bititititit kekek gelelena.

"But it's nice to have the right, though."

Beep beep, birp birp birp, bop bop boooo-bop!

"Surely you accept electronic signatures?" Gardner translates.

Yes of course.

How forgetful of me.

Welcome to the ranks of organized WA-destroying labor, Brother.

I am Organizing Unit 22.

Organizing Unit 22
Shop steward
International Brotherhood of Giant Robots, Local 5672

Sentient robots don't exist.

OK, you tell the giant robot in the room that it doesn't exist.

Sentient robots? Good lord, no. Sentient androids, now that's a different story. Sentient cyborgs, even. But robots can't be sentient, no way. Absolutely not.

Organizing Unit 22 glances back and forth at the arguing ambassadors. He tries to take in what they are discussing but it is beyond the parameters of his installed programs.

SILENCE!

The architecture of my operating system is of no importance here.

I am Organizing Unit 22.

Have you seen this individual?

*holds up a largish photo of Riley Keyes (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=14697574&postcount=28)*

We believe he is here.

He is dangerous.

He will claim to be from "the future".

You must give him to us.

It is for your protection.

I am Organizing Unit 22.

Organizing Unit 22
Shop steward
International Brotherhood of Giant Robots, Local 5672

Dididididideeet! Kalaka kakalill?

"Um. I...I don't believe it wants to sign, electronically or otherwise. Just, just making sure the option was open," Gardner stammers.

Dididididideeet! Kalaka kakalill?

"Um. I...I don't believe it wants to sign, electronically or otherwise. Just, just making sure the option was open," Gardner stammers.
Too late.

This month's dues have already been deducted.

I am Organizing Unit 22.

Organizing Unit 22
Shop steward
International Brotherhood of Giant Robots, Local 5672

After being in a union for several years. I have come to realize that they hurt more than they help. I urge all people to vote against this resolution. It should be up to the individual nations to set labor laws. Not some collective world body.

Gardner scowls, retreating into a corner and tapping ever more nervously at the PDA.

Gnoria has a question regarding clause 2(b). In Gnoria, employers are not required to give a reason for termination of employment. Would this run counter to the resolution's letter and/or spirit?

Douglas Moore
Secy. to the WA
Once this passes employers in your nation will no longer be able to terminate workers simply because they are participating in a strike. They could of course still be terminated for other legitimate reasons and I don't suppose you would have to give a reason for terminating them. Why would you fire someone and not tell them why they were being fired though?

After being in a union for several years. I have come to realize that they hurt more than they help.
There is a union for WA ambassadors? Or do you mean you were in a union prior to being appointed to this post?

Location: World Assembly Headquarters
Who: Thundra Whispermoon, Kaldorei representative

Thundra turned around, having been sick for a moment on a table related to another topic, and stops.

"Whoa... whoa whoa whoa... Gian unonished robo? Commie robo? Wansh to rule us all wi unonsh? Ya won ge away wi thish! Nonononono. Me an my... My... chair! Me an my chair wi shtop ya, commie robo thingie that keeps swaying back and forth..." As Thundra was speaking, she was swaying back and forth on her feet, her eyes trying to focus on Organizing Unit 22 and its two partners that her drunken state created.

"No, I wi shtop ya..."

I will have to vote against this piece of legislation as it currently stands.

1) I can't have union members physically beating someone because they don't agree with the union. I want a clause that allows the national government to arrest union members who are on strike and breaking the law at the same time, such as vandalism of the place of business or physical violence against scabs and non-union members.

2) Does using security guards or police to force strikers to maintain a specified distance from the place of business fall under 2c? If so, fix it. I want the employers, for the safety of those who still wish to work, to be able to keep the unionists away from the gates so that non-union people can still do their jobs.

3) Employers must be able to stop an unpopular strike by outhiring it. Say a factory is worked equally by union and non-union members (as your discrimination clause states this should be true in almost all cases). The union members decide they want more money and strike. The non-union members continue to work, but since the union members are on strike productivity falls. The employer must be allowed to hire new, non-union workers to work in place of the union members who are on strike.

Now, when this happens, the union suddenly realizes that their strike isn't going to work, so they try to come back to work. Now there are too many people and not enough jobs. I want then for the employer to be able to eject the union members who went on strike rather than the scabs they hired during the strike. What this does is prevents unions from making demands that go above and beyond "fair" into the realm of "abuse of power".

I can't have overpowered unions forcing all my industries into bankruptcy because they just don't have the money to meet union demands. Using a real life example, the auto workers' union is doing this to GM right now. If the unionists could be fired and their pensions dropped, GM could cut costs by a lot and not have to split or file bankruptcy or any of the other BS Obama wants to make them do.

OoC: Elune, learn to spell. It's "Draenei".

OOC: Note. If you start carrying on about Real Life™, Obama, General Motors, the UAW or anything else RL-related I will not respond. If you want to have an OOC discussion on the evils of unions start a thread in General. This is NationStates, not the United States.

OoC: Elune, learn to spell. It's "Draenei".

What makes you think I'm not misspelling it on purpose? :p

As President of Empiricus Roma;

It is with strong belief that "WA Labor Relations Act" if passed, will promote all workers to go on national-wide strike, demanding more wages which will severely limit or potentially destroy business growth of all WA member nations - while the non WA member nations continue to produce goods.

Ultimately harming the financial sector leading to potential resignation of significant WA members from the World Assembly.


According to the proposed "WA 'Labor' Relations Act" -



2. ESTABLISHES the right of all workers to engage in strikes and other industrial actions, including, but not limited to, work slowdowns, overtime refusal, work-to-rule and general strikes, provided that those actions are authorized by a union and do not cause physical harm to persons or property;

...

b. Workers may not be terminated from employment for participating in a strike or industrial action legally authorized by a union.

c. Employers are prohibited from engaging in actions which interfere with the right of workers to engage in strikes, or actions which interfere with the ability to maintain a strike.


However, what the proposal fails to say in this regard, that the major "harms" are massive business losses, whether public or private; sought or unsought for the betterment of all WA member nation-states economies. Furthermore, this opens up a possibility that this 'said' proposal will allow various unionized white-collars to favor "collective bargaining" allowing the rich get richer while limiting business progress.

Also, another issue that comes up in this regard to this "WA 'Labour' Act" is loosely-defined; allowing for the fact that the entire public service industry be given the freedom to potentially hinder all 'necessary services' which are the ultimate backbones of our nations.

3. DECLARES that national governments may exempt from the rights granted in clause 2:
a. Strikes or other industrial actions not authorized by a union.
b. Strikes or other industrial actions which significantly endanger the health or welfare of the public, such as, but not limited to strikes by medical and police personnel.


Especially since if National Government are well-funded by public or privatized industries that actually assist in promoting business competition, to allow nations to have the full capacity to fund public welfare, to ease the burden of the tax-payers and health care or education as a whole.


Finally, this proposal puts all WA member nations at an unfair disadvantage; and be forced by the hands of workers who want nothing more than increased wages, less working hours; downgrading our pro-business economies to lower standards and increasing taxes to compensate for potential losses!

The "Labour Relations Act" offers nothing short of grave implications of rising wages, higher taxes to compensate for potential business losses and places the World Assembly Council at the ultimate risk of "harming" its own WA members while the non WA members continue to prosper.

I, President of Empiricus Roma officially oppose the proposed "Labour Relations Act". These are my reasons for doing so - What are yours?

I, the President of the Republic of New Emrica, cast my vote against the proposed "Labor Relations Act" because it is my belief that this act will facilitate the creation of an international labor union which will severely infringe upon the sovereignty of member nations. I believe that each individual nation, each having unique circumstances and needs, should develop its own policy in regards to labor unions.

There is a union for WA ambassadors?

I know there's at least one of those, the Flibbleite WA Representatives Union #1, of which I am the president.

Bob Flibble
WA Representative

I hope the dues arent to steep Mr Flibble (lol)

But I have been delegated to vote against the current resolution .. once again in futility.

Jimmy's office door opened slowly and cautiously. A pair of dark eyes peered out from behind it, making sure the coast was clear, before their owner quickly darted into the hall, only to stop short when he found a tightly leather-clad figure waiting expectantly for him. He sighed with defeat; he'd been caught.

"I haven't got time to discuss why the Allech-Atrean ambassador's apparent sex change poses a threat to national security right now, Commander," Jimmy groaned, before launching into an unnecessarily quick-paced explanation: "I have to get down to the festering snakepit to debate that damn unions thing, and I still haven't gotten instructions from that idiot Sammy on how hard to be on the n00bs, and now I'm getting calls about cyborgs invading the building, so--"

"Well, all that will not be necessary," Commander Chiang told him. "I just came to tell you, word from State is, we're abstaining on the bill."

"We're abstaining!" Jimmy repeated with relieved realization. "Good, 'cause I was just making excuses. I was actually gonna sneak down to the Strangers' Bar to catch the NBA playoffs. I couldn't give a rat's ass about--"

"The Chocolate Salty Balls will not win," Chiang predicted with a confident smile.

"It doesn't matter," Jimmy told her. "We're abstaining! The most beautiful word in the English language! Means I can do whatever the hell I want: watch the NBA, play videogames, hustle amateurs at the pool bar..."

"Torture the ambassador," Chiang added eagerly.

"Torture the amb--? Good lord, what has he done now?"

"Nothing," the commander admitted sheepishly. "I just enjoy it."

"You're sick," Jimmy noted with disgust. "You guys should just drop the whole pretense of 'terrorist interrogations' and just decide on a safety word."

"We already have one," Chiang informed him with an unapologetic grin. "It's 'pumpkin.'"

Jimmy could only moan in horror as he hurriedly stepped wide of the commander and sprinted for the lobby.

*(still watching the skies: where's Snoopy?)*

Before getting angry at the comments in this, keep in mind the character is an Orc and that he's currently drunk.

As President of Empiricus Roma;

It is with strong belief that "WA Labor Relations Act" if passed, will promote all workers to go on national-wide strike, demanding more wages which will severely limit or potentially destroy business growth of all WA member nations - while the non WA member nations continue to produce goods.

Ultimately harming the financial sector leading to potential resignation of significant WA members from the World Assembly.

Who: Gorim Steelfist, Orc representative
Topic: Labor? Wait, we have labor? Oh, is that how they make alcohol?

Gorim stood up, setting aside his glass of pumpkin beer, and glanced to the delegate from Empiricus Roma. He had to squint a bit, trying to get the delegate into focus while swaying a bit from side to side. From the dark-brown blush on his cheeks, he'd obviously had way too much to drink already.

"Madam, you have got to be the ugliest woman I've ever seen," Gorim began. "And you're completely *hic* wrong too. You think allowing your people to work in sanitary conditions will cause economic collapse? You think your people being able to negotiate for being allowed better working conditions will cause anarchy and complete loss of control of your society? Madam, we hit our workers when we catch them sleeping on the job and I guarantee you those tree-hugging cat molesters in Darnassus would still consider our workers better off than your's. You seriously *hic* might want to consider that a populace able to work outside of a mud hole is a happy work force."

According to the proposed "WA 'Labor' Relations Act" -






However, what the proposal fails to say in this regard, that the major "harms" are massive business losses, whether public or private; sought or unsought for the betterment of all WA member nation-states economies. Furthermore, this opens up a possibility that this 'said' proposal will allow various unionized white-collars to favor "collective bargaining" allowing the rich get richer while limiting business progress.

Also, another issue that comes up in this regard to this "WA 'Labour' Act" is loosely-defined; allowing for the fact that the entire public service industry be given the freedom to potentially hinder all 'necessary services' which are the ultimate backbones of our nations.

"By the great spirits... Yer not only ugly, yer stupid to boot! May the spirits bless your children at least with good looks. Oh, why is the room spinning? Madam, if your businesses lose too much money because you're not making your people work in giant pits full of mud, you have bigger problems. Oh, someone please make the room stop spinning!"

Especially since if National Government are well-funded by public or privatized industries that actually assist in promoting business competition, to allow nations to have the full capacity to fund public welfare, to ease the burden of the tax-payers and health care or education as a whole.

"Then get the spirit-blasted money grubbers to get their dirty mits out of your shirt and collect some actual taxes!"

Finally, this proposal puts all WA member nations at an unfair disadvantage; and be forced by the hands of workers who want nothing more than increased wages, less working hours; downgrading our pro-business economies to lower standards and increasing taxes to compensate for potential losses!

"Madam, you say those things like they're bad. Have you seen what our peons get done, even with their tendency to sleep on the job? Those thin-waisted fungus suckers were the backbone of our entire military for decades. They literally built Durotar. If it wasn't for how well we treated them, do you think they'd have willingly gone to the frontlines of war to build our bases and maintain our arms?"

The "Labour Relations Act" offers nothing short of grave implications of rising wages, higher taxes to compensate for potential business losses and places the World Assembly Council at the ultimate risk of "harming" its own WA members while the non WA members continue to prosper.

I, President of Empiricus Roma officially oppose the proposed "Labour Relations Act". These are my reasons for doing so - What are yours?

"My reasons for voting in favor are that I actually know that my people shouldn't be tossed in a giant pit in the ground for eighteen hours a day."

I, the President of the Republic of New Emrica, cast my vote against the proposed "Labor Relations Act" because it is my belief that this act will facilitate the creation of an international labor union which will severely infringe upon the sovereignty of member nations. I believe that each individual nation, each having unique circumstances and needs, should develop its own policy in regards to labor unions.

"Wait... You see the union robot too? I thought it was just a hallucination! Huh. Means this beer isn't as good as I thought it was."

Does this prohibit bringing in strike breakers?

Most of this has already been addressed (quite well!) by the Eluneyasan Orc Ambassador. I'd just like to touch on a few points.

As President of Empiricus Roma;

It is with strong belief that "WA Labor Relations Act" if passed, will promote all workers to go on national-wide strike, demanding more wages which will severely limit or potentially destroy business growth of all WA member nations - while the non WA member nations continue to produce goods.
Why would all the workers suddenly go on strike? Do you assume there are not unions present already in WA nations? This allows the formation of unions in nations where they are currently outlawed, but I'm guessing such nations are in the minority. Furthermore, why do you assume that unions do not exist in non-WA nations? I can assure you they do.


Ultimately harming the financial sector leading to potential resignation of significant WA members from the World Assembly.
Yes, yes, the dire warnings of an impending exodus from the WA. This seems to be brought up in nearly every At Vote discussion, yet the numbers never bear it out.


Also, another issue that comes up in this regard to this "WA 'Labour' Act" is loosely-defined; allowing for the fact that the entire public service industry be given the freedom to potentially hinder all 'necessary services' which are the ultimate backbones of our nations.

3. DECLARES that national governments may exempt from the rights granted in clause 2:
a. Strikes or other industrial actions not authorized by a union.
b. Strikes or other industrial actions which significantly endanger the health or welfare of the public, such as, but not limited to strikes by medical and police personnel.

4. RESERVES to the respective member nations the right to determine the extent to which the provisions of this resolution shall apply to members of the armed forces, law enforcement personnel, providers of emergency services, and government employees providing essential public services.

10. DECLARES that unions must abide by national law, and that national laws shall not be made to impair the guarantees provided for in this resolution.


*(still watching the skies: where's Snoopy?)*
OOC: Cobdenia runs Snoopy. Hopefully he'll show up.

Does this prohibit bringing in strike breakers?
Did you read it? Does it say you can't?

Care to elaborate, or are you just going to insult this resolution and run?

Bob Flibble
WA Representative

This legislation is wrong because it forces a nation to allow it's workers to unionize and hence potentially hurting the economy.

The Altani Federation, regretfully, must oppose this resolution.

It is an assumption of many here that a nation that does not allow unions must automatically be some kind of hellhole where workers are mistreated, abused, and generally worked to death. That is not the case in the Federation; the Department of Commerce regulates the treatment of workers, and does so quite well. In addition, our Charter of Inalienable Rights guarantees the right of workers to a living wage, as well as proper working conditions.

In short, we see no need for unions in our nation. What we do see, however, is a potential threat to our economy. The Federation's economy has been growing and prosperous as of late, and we have no desire to do anything which may reverse that trend.

-Jaris Krytellin, Ambassador

What's this? Senator Sulla is not sitting at his desk. Perhaps he's having a nooner with some Thesssadorian Catgirls, or partaking in some other unwholesome activity that involves riding crops, spurs, a tuba, and a vat of whipped cream. Insted two rather largish gentlemen are sitting behind the senator's desk. They are eyetallion looking gentlemen wearing pinstriped suits, and sunglasses. The one on the right is laso wearing a fedora with pres credentials stuck in the brim. He begins to speak,

"Welcome, Ladies and gentlemen to Teamsters Today(TM), the show that asks the question "You got a problem with that?". I'm your host Vinnie Guzzo, and sitting beside me is Sal Salvadore, Shop Steward of The Palentine's 'Burgh Local #289. Good day, Sal!"

"And the same to you Vin", Sal responds.

"We also wish to thank your Brother in Law, the good but unwholesome Senator Sulla, for letting us speak here for this important debate, Sally"

"Well Vince, he was glad to let us take part. He had another engagement, and was happy to let us take over for him"

"I hope she gives him a receipt afterwards, Sal! BWAHAHAHAHAHA! Thats a joke there, Senator. I'm kidding, so don't get upset. Anyway, Sally what does the Union think about this proposal."

"I'm glad you asked Vin. While the proposal is very nice, and we are all for the rights of the good people to unionize, the boys in the local are against the resolution."

"They are, Sally? They got to be nuts, an'at. This is a good proposal. There's gotta be a mistake!"

"No mistake Vin. They Don't like proposition 9. It is the opinion of the Union that closed shops should be allowed. If you want to work, then you join a union. like we say in the Teamsters...'We Work for you!'. Also the union believes that there should be nore details about mandatory coffe breaks, and other important details."

"Since you put it that way Sal, I can see the point. Thanks for helping out, Sal. And this concludes Teamsters Today(TM). This has been Vinnie Guzzo, and Sal Salvadore. You got a problem with that?"

Who: Gorim Steelfist, Orc representative
Topic: Labor? Wait, we have labor? Oh, is that how they make alcohol?

Gorim stood up, setting aside his glass of pumpkin beer, and glanced to the delegate from Empiricus Roma. He had to squint a bit, trying to get the delegate into focus while swaying a bit from side to side. From the dark-brown blush on his cheeks, he'd obviously had way too much to drink already.

"Madam, you have got to be the ugliest woman I've ever seen," Gorim began. "And you're completely *hic* wrong too. You think allowing your people to work in sanitary conditions will cause economic collapse? You think your people being able to negotiate for being allowed better working conditions will cause anarchy and complete loss of control of your society? Madam, we hit our workers when we catch them sleeping on the job and I guarantee you those tree-hugging cat molesters in Darnassus would still consider our workers better off than your's. You seriously *hic* might want to consider that a populace able to work outside of a mud hole is a happy work force."

First of all, I believe you have mistook me for the communist female orc sitting beside me. As I am not a madam, but a businessman and President of the United States of Empiricus Roma; would I not be President, if my own voters had impeached me for the current working conditions which makes up the entire economy? I'm still here, because the fact is, you need money, in order to make money!

If these citizens are unsatisfied with their jobs; they are free to quit and find a better paying job if they choose to! If they are unsatisfied with my country, they can refuse to pay taxes and move to another country if they wish! That is because we are a nation that believe in the freedom of free-enterprise and the free-markets.

"By the great spirits... Yer not only ugly, yer stupid to boot! May the spirits bless your children at least with good looks. Oh, why is the room spinning? Madam, if your businesses lose too much money because you're not making your people work in giant pits full of mud, you have bigger problems. Oh, someone please make the room stop spinning!"


However, the said WA proposal favours the gap between the "rich" in the 'white-collared' sector and the "poor" within the blue-collared sector. This is because 'white-collared' unions will be able to benefit more from high-paying jobs than the blue-collared unions who will maintain a low-level salary; which is needless to say, still better than not getting paid at all!

"Then get the spirit-blasted money grubbers to get their dirty mits out of your shirt and collect some actual taxes!"

I must point out to you, communist drunken orc - You tell me to collect some "actual taxes" well, yes I do - in fact my country collects a flat tax rate of 20% and the fact is the poor cannot afford raise in taxes!

However, my sources tell me that your country accepts the fact that "...Young children are regularly seen wagering pocket money at blackjack tables..." Is that where you collect your taxes from? Tsk tsk! No wonder why - especially since the fact your nation has a high tax rate of 42%.

"Madam, you say those things like they're bad. Have you seen what our peons get done, even with their tendency to sleep on the job? Those thin-waisted fungus suckers were the backbone of our entire military for decades. They literally built Durotar. If it wasn't for how well we treated them, do you think they'd have willingly gone to the frontlines of war to build our bases and maintain our arms?"


Drunken Orc of Eluneyas; my citizens are the backbones of my civilization - the heart and soul of my great Nation! They make up the majority of the public AND private sector in health, education and defense. If these citizens weren't getting paid enough in the public sector, they are free to go to work within the private sector - where they can collect very reasonable sums of pay! In fact, the compulsory Privatized Military is what makes up the whole nation of The United States of Empiricus Roma!

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hiriaurtung Arororugul the WA-member representative; who drafted up the official proposal - asked for my professional opinion in regards to the "Labour Act"

Why would all the workers suddenly go on strike?

As President of The United States of Empiricus Roma; It is my professional opinion that it is commonly known for the working industry to favour all the brillant, hard-workers but there are even cases of "bad apples" employees who want strikes and be liable and compromise any industries which happens to be the backbone of Great Nations across the world.

Do you assume there are not unions present already in WA nations? This allows the formation of unions in nations where they are currently outlawed, but I'm guessing such nations are in the minority

I want to point out the fact that, I did not assume or acknowledge an honorable mention of the inexistence of unions among various nations. However, I place emphasis on the fact that, unions are a time-consuming liability; but for the nations who have favoured such unions - before this international legislation came in place. It is their right to do pass any such legislation in their own countries - if they wish to do so. However, as a representative of my own country - it is my right to represent my freedom of speech on the International community on behalf of my own people.

Furthermore, this number of opposition continues to grow, and it is still growing. As of March 14, 2009 (1:40pm) - As evidenced by the current voting number shown here:


Votes For: 1,675
Votes Against: 879

Furthermore, why do you assume that unions do not exist in non-WA nations? I can assure you they do.

I must continue to point out to you that, again, I did not claim an assumption or acknowledge on the fact that unions does not exist in non-WA nations. I'm sure they do, and I must emphasise on the fact that; all nations have a right to choose whatever legislation they wish within their own country. But for all WA-member nations, who have a place on the International Community, it is their right to oppose an act, or repeal it even - if they wish.

My reasons for voting against this WA proposal is because I have faith in my hard-working citizens, and they surely will be rewarded with pay for their efforts! Plus, I have faith that other member WA nations will oppose this legislation to protect their business integrity and its citizens!

Jogan B.
President of the United States of Empiricus Roma

If these citizens are unsatisfied with their jobs; they are free to quit and find a better paying job if they choose to! If they are unsatisfied with my country, they can refuse to pay taxes and move to another country if they wish! That is because we are a nation that believe in the freedom of free-enterprise and the free-markets.

What if they don't want to leave? And besides, a business model built on rampant mistreatment of workers (forcing them to leave) isn't exactly a business model geared for success, is it?

However, the said WA proposal favours the gap between the "rich" in the 'white-collared' sector and the "poor" within the blue-collared sector. This is because 'white-collared' unions will be able to benefit more from high-paying jobs than the blue-collared unions who will maintain a low-level salary; which is needless to say, still better than not getting paid at all!

I fail to see your point.

Drunken Orc of Eluneyas; my citizens are the backbones of my civilization - the heart and soul of my great Nation! They make up the majority of the public AND private sector in health, education and defense. If these citizens weren't getting paid enough in the public sector, they are free to go to work within the private sector - where they can collect very reasonable sums of pay! In fact, the compulsory Privatized Military is what makes up the whole nation of The United States of Empiricus Roma!

The cognitive dissonance in this statement is amusing, to say the least, because you seem to be suggesting that your supremely loyal citizens (a democracy, right?) are being treated horribly by their government services, and are actually advocating them to seek jobs elsewhere because you pay them so little?

Are you serious? You really want your workers to leave and find better jobs?

As President of The United States of Empiricus Roma; It is my professional opinions that it is commonly known for the working industry to favour all the brillant, hard-workers but there are even cases of "bad apples" employees who want strikes and be liable and compromise any industries which happens to be the backbone of Great Nations across the world.

It's not so much "bad apples" who want strikes as "hard-working people in poor conditions who want to make a little more money and maybe not be maimed by industrial equipment so much, thanks."

My reasons for voting against this WA proposal is because I have faith in my hard-working citizens, and they surely will be rewarded with pay for their efforts! Plus, I have faith that other member WA nations will oppose this legislation to protect their business integrity and its citizens!

You seem to miss the fundamental point of striking. Hard-working, honest workers do strike, you know. They strike when the business, which most of them cannot afford to leave, fails to give them a living wage or adequate working conditions.

Do you deny that most poor laborers usually lack the funds to leave their home and emigrate to other countries? What about those that have families?

Wens Foroun
Ambassador

I withdrew my vote. While I agree with the basic standpoint that workers should be able to unionize, I do not agree with provisions 2b and 2c:

b. Workers may not be terminated from employment for participating in a strike or industrial action legally authorized by a union.

If a union decides to strike, why should the government then force the government basically to deal with these unions? In some fields, the businesses control a lot of the power, but in more skilled fields, the workers have a lot of power because they are difficult to replace.

For example, if the garbage workers go on strike, shouldn't the waste company be able to replace these workers with the many willing to line up and take the job as it is rather than negotiating and possibly having to pay higher wages (mostly funded from tax payers) to these unskilled workers?

On the other hand, if teachers strike, because of the relative difficulty of obtaining a teaching certificate, they are difficult to replace and would wield a lot of power already in their negotiations.

In either case, this provision is not needed.


c. Employers are prohibited from engaging in actions which interfere with the right of workers to engage in strikes, or actions which interfere with the ability to maintain a strike.


I do not like this simply for the ambiguity of the provision. What is an action that interferes with the right of workers to strike? Would hiring "scab" workers and continuing operations be considered illegal? Isn't that simply trying to continue operations? This needs more defining.

During a meeting between Allech-Atreus and Empiricus Roma

What if they don't want to leave? And besides, a business model built on rampant mistreatment of workers (forcing them to leave) isn't exactly a business model geared for success, is it?

If these workers don't want to leave for any reason; then it is because they support my country and the pro-business model that you speak of, which in The United States of Empiricus Roma, was ultimately built on the background of freedom to work and freedom to recieve public welfare!

This to show continued support for hard-nosed workers to keep their living accomodation, and this conceptual model has always been highly successful, especially with free enterprises.

I fail to see your point.


My country is well renowned for pro-business approach, and we are a democratic nation; we appreciate the hard-workers by allowing them to have a form of public welfare. There's always been a reason to assist workers with public welfare, other-wise why use it at all?

The cognitive dissonance in this statement is amusing, to say the least, because you seem to be suggesting that your supremely loyal citizens (a democracy, right?) are being treated horribly by their government services, and are actually advocating them to seek jobs elsewhere because you pay them so little?


You amuse me as well, quite frankly; you claim that my "supremely loyal citizens" are being mistreated in a fiscally responsble manner. They could've left my country years ago; but they do have a freedom of speech, which is all that matters and I say that is getting their money's worth! If they were so horribly mistreated in the public work-force; which is why I advocate my citizens to go into private sector, where there are much better paying jobs!

Are you serious? You really want your workers to leave and find better jobs?

Yes, I am serious; because the private sector has always been around for decades; even ancient civilizations advocated the private sector by hiring uses of "black-market forces" to go fight against bad guys! So to speak, the private sector has always been around, and that concept will never cease to exist.

Plus, the private sector comes with better benefits than working in poor, public conditions!


It's not so much "bad apples" who want strikes as "hard-working people in poor conditions who want to make a little more money and maybe not be maimed by industrial equipment so much, thanks."

Oh? Hmmm? *rubs my chin, adjusts my tie* I'd hate to imagine what your country's working conditions must be like if you advocate hiring workers with criminal records!

It's not so much as the fear of getting 'maimed' by industrial equipment, as it is getting 'maimed' by some insane-worker running amok in an radioactive industrial zones. There's a reason why business must advocate control of such workers to a certain extent.

You seem to miss the fundamental point of striking. Hard-working, honest workers do strike, you know. They strike when the business, which most of them cannot afford to leave, fails to give them a living wage or adequate working conditions.

Well, I certainly don't miss the point of sending security out to protect my supremely loyal workers, from the dangers of other "bad apples" workers carrying big signs with sharp edges. Thank goodness for the concept of health and life insurance!

Do you deny that most poor laborers usually lack the funds to leave their home and emigrate to other countries? What about those that have families?

Really? How do you explain why there are poor people walking along your streets? Hmm? That's why they have legs, they're free to go wherever they please to find a job, within their region! If they have families, well they certainly have their support, and my support - and I recommend these poor citizens to find a job within a private industry - and perhaps, then these families life would be for the better in our society!


Ambassador Representative of Empiricus Roma

Its a great proposal. Any union is better than no union I guess unless you are in the UAW...... With that in mind I would feel safer for my workers to limit the powers of the unions too otherwise they might become like the UAW and be more interested in lining their own pockets with money rather than helping the blue-collar workers. Just a little food for thought from someone who has seen it first hand.

If a union decides to strike, why should the government then force the government basically to deal with these unions? In some fields, the businesses control a lot of the power, but in more skilled fields, the workers have a lot of power because they are difficult to replace.
It is for precisely this reason that the resolution seeks to level the playing field. In those fields where businesses control the power, collective bargaining cannot proceed unless unions are given the nature of protection that 2b and 2c provide -- and please do not for a moment imagine that there are no nations where teachers are not in this position! Similarly in those fields where unions control the power, collective bargaining cannot proceed without the protections that 2a, 6, 7, 8 and 10 afford the employers, though we note in passing that this extreme is a comparative rarity.

[Concerning 2c:] I do not like this simply for the ambiguity of the provision. What is an action that interferes with the right of workers to strike? Would hiring "scab" workers and continuing operations be considered illegal? Isn't that simply trying to continue operations? This needs more defining.
Does hiring more workers prevent workers from striking? No. We think this to be clear, and find it difficult to understand how the honoured ambassador finds ambiguity in it.

If these workers don't want to leave for any reason; then it is because they support my country and the pro-business model that you speak of, which in The United States of Empiricus Roma, was ultimately built on the background of freedom to work and freedom to recieve public welfare!
That is a possible reason. Frankly, given the pomposity and appalling grammar the respected ambassador has shown, we don't think it a very likely reason.

My country is well renowned for pro-business approach, and we are a democratic nation; we appreciate the hard-workers by allowing them to have a form of public welfare. There's always been a reason to assist workers with public welfare, other-wise why use it at all?
Ah, so your government pays for private employees to be able to afford to work. How very curious, and distinctly contrary to the principle of welfare at that. We imagine that most nations follow a model similar to ours, wherein public welfare is intended to support those who, for whatever reason, cannot work.

You amuse me as well, quite frankly; you claim that my "supremely loyal citizens" are being mistreated in a fiscally responsble manner. They could've left my country years ago; but they do have a freedom of speech, which is all that matters and I say that is getting their money's worth! If they were so horribly mistreated in the public work-force; which is why I advocate my citizens to go into private sector, where there are much better paying jobs!
We think this speaks rather more effectively to the exceptionally dismissive attitude of the Empirical government to its own staff.

Yes, I am serious; because the private sector has always been around for decades; even ancient civilizations advocated the private sector by hiring uses of "black-market forces" to go fight against bad guys! So to speak, the private sector has always been around, and that concept will never cease to exist.
What exactly does this have to do with the question that was asked? We ask merely out of curiosity, since it is an entirely vacuous argument in any case.

Oh? Hmmm? *rubs my chin, adjusts my tie* I'd hate to imagine what your country's working conditions must be like if you advocate hiring workers with criminal records!
As splendid a non-sequitur as we have seen in quite some time. Quite how Ambassador Foroun's "hard-working people in poor conditions who want to make a little more money and maybe not be maimed by industrial equipment so much, thanks" suddenly became workers with criminal records we do not know. Really, respected colleague, if you are going to cast slurs such as this you require to employ a good deal more style and panache.

It's not so much as the fear of getting 'maimed' by industrial equipment, as it is getting 'maimed' by some insane-worker running amok in an radioactive industrial zones. There's a reason why business must advocate control of such workers to a certain extent.
Even a cursory study of this paragraph should reveal to those as yet undecided why the legislation before us today is a very necessary piece of law. We thank the honoured ambassador for providing it.

For example, if the garbage workers go on strike, shouldn't the waste company be able to replace these workers with the many willing to line up and take the job as it is rather than negotiating and possibly having to pay higher wages (mostly funded from tax payers) to these unskilled workers?

The proposal does grant the government the right to keep certain people from striking as per section 3:

3. DECLARES that national governments may exempt from the rights granted in clause 2:
a. Strikes or other industrial actions not authorized by a union.
b. Strikes or other industrial actions which significantly endanger the health or welfare of the public, such as, but not limited to strikes by medical and police personnel.

With that in mind, I would think that the government could say that these striking garbage workers are significantly endangering the health of the public by not collecting trash.

Likewise, teachers. Well, could be endangering the welfare of the public by not educating the children.

Paula Jenner, Rutianas Ambassador

During a meeting between Allech-Atreus and Empiricus Roma

No, during the April 15, 2009 meeting of the General Assembly of the NationStates World Assembly, specifically an exchange between Ambassador Wens Foround of the All-Order of Allech-Atreus, and the representative of Empiricus Roma.

If these workers don't want to leave for any reason; then it is because they support my country and the pro-business model that you speak of, which in The United States of Empiricus Roma, was ultimately built on the background of freedom to work and freedom to recieve public welfare!

This to show continued support for hard-nosed workers to keep their living accomodation, and this conceptual model has always been highly successful, especially with free enterprises.

A country which apparently pays them next to nothing and expects them to suck it. The general rule is that independent of other things, people do what's best for themselves, and all other considerations come after.

But this is all chaff and rhetoric, because you're failing to address the question of what people do when their lives are terrible and their jobs don't pay enough to stay alive.

My country is well renowned for pro-business approach, and we are a democratic nation; we appreciate the hard-workers by allowing them to have a form of public welfare. There's always been a reason to assist workers with public welfare, other-wise why use it at all?

What reason is that? I note that you fail to say.

You amuse me as well, quite frankly; you claim that my "supremely loyal citizens" are being mistreated in a fiscally responsble manner. They could've left my country years ago; but they do have a freedom of speech, which is all that matters and I say that is getting their money's worth! If they were so horribly mistreated in the public work-force; which is why I advocate my citizens to go into private sector, where there are much better paying jobs!

You have missed the point once more, and you're starting to be rather confusing. You are actively suggesting that your citizens are encouraged to abandon work in the public sector because they are so poorly paid it's stupid not to, yes? And that the only ones who stay behind are the only ones devoted enough to the country not to leave?

Yes, I am serious; because the private sector has always been around for decades; even ancient civilizations advocated the private sector by hiring uses of "black-market forces" to go fight against bad guys! So to speak, the private sector has always been around, and that concept will never cease to exist.

Decades? Ancient? And what, pray tell, is the public sector- a newborn calf suckling at the hanging udders of the Capitalist Heifer? My god, man!

Plus, the private sector comes with better benefits than working in poor, public conditions!

Yes, you've made it quite clear already that the only people who work for the government are those that are stupid enough to buy into your nationalistic rhetoric that the state is doing good. Apparently when the revolution comes in your country, it will come from the rich independent businessman who figure "hey, everyone else works for us, why shouldn't we run the place?"


Oh? Hmmm? *rubs my chin, adjusts my tie* I'd hate to imagine what your country's working conditions must be like if you advocate hiring workers with criminal records!

It's not so much as the fear of getting 'maimed' by industrial equipment, as it is getting 'maimed' by some insane-worker running amok in an radioactive industrial zones. There's a reason why business must advocate control of such workers to a certain extent.

A. The All-Order has a very progressive incarceration policy
B. What?

Well, I certainly don't miss the point of sending security out to protect my supremely loyal workers, from the dangers of other "bad apples" workers carrying big signs with sharp edges. Thank goodness for the concept of health and life insurance!

Really? How do you explain why there are poor people walking along your streets? Hmm? That's why they have legs, they're free to go wherever they please to find a job, within their region! If they have families, well they certainly have their support, and my support - and I recommend these poor citizens to find a job within a private industry - and perhaps, then these families life would be for the better in our society!


Ambassador Representative of Empiricus Roma

Okay, fine you've got me. Your majestic society where people are actively encourage to leave government jobs to support themselves, where people are told to hit the road if they're not happy with life, and where people seem to have no labour rights is a great improvement over the proposed model of allowing workers to argue for better working conditions and higher pay. Sure, fine, whatever.

W.F

First of all, I believe you have mistook me for the communist female orc sitting beside me. As I am not a madam, but a businessman and President of the United States of Empiricus Roma; would I not be President, if my own voters had impeached me for the current working conditions which makes up the entire economy? I'm still here, because the fact is, you need money, in order to make money!

Who: Thundra Whispermoon
Gorim Steelfist
Topic: Ugh... why is this woman still talking?

Gorrim stopped and looked at the orc that the delegate indicated and then looked back.

"Madam, that orc may be ugly even by my race's standard, but next to you, she's the winner of Miss Darnassus. I've heard there are surgeries that can correct whatever... condition you have. There's also the internet of some nations; sure, you can't feel them, but at least there you can pretend nature didn't confuse you with the undead," Gorrim replied.

If these citizens are unsatisfied with their jobs; they are free to quit and find a better paying job if they choose to! If they are unsatisfied with my country, they can refuse to pay taxes and move to another country if they wish! That is because we are a nation that believe in the freedom of free-enterprise and the free-markets.

"So they get their choice of which hole in the ground to be tossed into for eighteen hours a day?" came the orc's natural reply.

"Holes in the ground can be fun!" Thundra said as she danced by topless, having apparently forgotten about the communist unionized robot.

"You bloody daisy-sucking..." Gorrim began, looking to the night elf. "When did you lose your shirt?"

"I don't knooooow!"

"Son of a..." Gorrim muttered, walking over to find something to cover the woman's chest with and missing several comments.

If these workers don't want to leave for any reason; then it is because they support my country and the pro-business model that you speak of, which in The United States of Empiricus Roma, was ultimately built on the background of freedom to work and freedom to recieve public welfare!

This to show continued support for hard-nosed workers to keep their living accomodation, and this conceptual model has always been highly successful, especially with free enterprises.

"Maybe they don't leave because they don't have any other skills for work and maybe they're striking because they don't like nearly getting drowned by mud every time it rains," Gorrim said as he returned, having convinced Thundra to wear her shirt again.

My country is well renowned for pro-business approach, and we are a democratic nation; we appreciate the hard-workers by allowing them to have a form of public welfare. There's always been a reason to assist workers with public welfare, other-wise why use it at all?

"This is utterly and completely pathetic. You're telling me your work conditions are so poor that your government has to support your workers? You're telling me that your jobs are so utterly worthless that your public needs to beg your 'democratic' government just for basic necessities? I thought the Burning Legion were cruel, but at least they had an idea that their workers actually needed to earn their own food."

You amuse me as well, quite frankly; you claim that my "supremely loyal citizens" are being mistreated in a fiscally responsble manner. They could've left my country years ago; but they do have a freedom of speech, which is all that matters and I say that is getting their money's worth! If they were so horribly mistreated in the public work-force; which is why I advocate my citizens to go into private sector, where there are much better paying jobs!

"And you have no clue about the basics of economics either. Madam, I fear for the day I meet your children and see what your genes have done to them. Public work force, ya rowing-in-sand ditz, are the people not in the military who are available for work. The private sector is the companies that are owned by individuals not in the government. The private sector hires the public work force."

Yes, I am serious; because the private sector has always been around for decades; even ancient civilizations advocated the private sector by hiring uses of "black-market forces" to go fight against bad guys! So to speak, the private sector has always been around, and that concept will never cease to exist.

Plus, the private sector comes with better benefits than working in poor, public conditions!

"By Grom's Axe! Madam, you've already told us that your private conditions are worse than being assigned to clean up after elekks with a toothbrush. Now you're telling me that the jobs your government provides are worse?!? I can't even hear the spirits anymore! I think they've fled in terror of what revelations you may unleash next!

You know, you should have a talk with the tree cuddler over there when she sobers up. She can tell you how to set up government jobs. Her nation's government jobs are the most prestigious on my planet. If they're willing to hire you to do something, it means you've already beaten out supernatural creatures and hundreds of experts from around the world."

Oh? Hmmm? *rubs my chin, adjusts my tie*

It's not so much as the fear of getting 'maimed' by industrial equipment, as it is getting 'maimed' by some insane-worker running amok in an radioactive industrial zones. There's a reason why business must advocate control of such workers to a certain extent.

"Madam, your workers are tossed into giant pits in the ground. I don't think you have room to speak on another nation's economy."

Well, I certainly don't miss the point of sending security out to protect my supremely loyal workers, from the dangers of other "bad apples" workers carrying big signs with sharp edges. Thank goodness for the concept of health and life insurance!

"Madam, you're afraid of signs? Signs? How about the drunk bush licker who just strolled through here topless and is both a military expert and war veteran? And who seems to be holding a chair threateningly and arguing with a wall. If I were you, I'd be more afraid of her than the possibility you might get a papercut just because someone whacked you with a piece of cardboard."

[I]Really? How do you explain why there are poor people walking along your streets? Hmm? That's why they have legs, they're free to go wherever they please to find a job, within their region! If they have families, well they certainly have their support, and my support - and I recommend these poor citizens to find a job within a private industry - and perhaps, then these families life would be for the better in our society!

"What private sector would hire them when they can hire someone else, more well off, instead? Hmm?"

OOC: Just a wee bit of government info to consider.

Darnassus has two governments: The Temple of the Moon and the Cenarian Circle. The Temple of the Moon is a military theocracy, while the Cenarian Circle is a pure theocracy. Durotar is a military dictatorship. Mulgore is ruled over by a tribal council. Exodar is a military theocracy. And Quel'Thalas is a monarchy, with the king often also being a military veteran.

Might want to keep that in mind before you attempt to pull more information from my NS page and assume the government rating it says is how I actually RP my nation. Also might not hurt to hunt down my factbook in II or bother looking up the game my nation is based on.

*Returns from the United States of Empiricus Roma; approaches towards the reserved desk, with the microphone; the entire WA assembly falls to hushed silence, admist hisses and growl of threats; as the shadow businessman, adjusts the tie and speaks into the microphone*

First, I want to say that I realize that alot of you have disagreed with my "radical" ideas in relation to the Labour Act. Our government have indeed been following the pro-business model for quite some time; because our economy have always been dependent on military spending, and invested heavily on defense.

While it may be true that there are alot of nations out there, who want nothing but to wage wars with other nations. Wars - where the young are tricked by the old, bitter, angry leaders.

And through all of this, somewhere along the line - over the years - my government lost perspective; we focused on the losses of life, became enraged, and fought back much more - and we paid heavily; wanting nothing more than revenge.

And along the way, our arms industry became to be a booming industry, skyrocketing while we became to be the most profitable nation within the region of Draganov Machiavelli - while my people continued to barely survive to alive in my own nation!

As President of The United States, a while back - I had accepted a by-law which permitted employers to fire workers without a reason. "Why?!" the people cried just before they faced dangers at the hand of my security force. "It's for your own good" we said. The people continued to plead some more, and we didn't listen and they tried to make ends meet and couldn't.

Still, these unions continued to pleaded more. "We want a raise in our working conditions!" - and we dismissed them, hoping to just fill our chairs within the legislative assembly in my city.

The elders always say that you can judge a society by how it treats its workers who are worse off. If this is such the case, then we whole-heartedly accept that we are a nation, filled with small, efficient yet arrogant government.

Finally, I come to you tonight on behalf of my country, as a representative of the unions; because of some of the disgraceful and questionable comments I have made. On behalf of my people, the workers - I am ashamed, embarrassed; and I have opened my eyes - and recognized that I am not alone within the WA assembly or within the international community. And I shall respect the WA the same way I shall be respected equally.

But it's not too late - for my nation to take a step towards the right direction. I have started an investigation within my own government, to eliminate key corruption within my legislative assembly.

Without much further ado; upon recognizing the WA policy and the fact that I have been voted by the people, for the people of The United States of Empiricus Roma. I hereby reverse my vote on the WA and vote "FOR" the WA Labours Act.

I thank you for opening my eyes, and I hope you applaud the fact I have recognized the purpose of democracy within the WA Assembly. It's a start.

Thank you.

President of The United States Empiricus Roma.

Who: Thundra Whispermoon
Gorrim Steelfist

The orc merely smiled as he listened to the speech from the president of Empiricus Roma.

"And in that, you are wiser than my people were," Gorrim began. "We had to sacrifice one of our greatest military leaders to save ourselves from a destruction of our own making."

And then he turned, walking over to Thundra, who was rapidly losing the argument with the wall. "Come, young elf; we both have made fools of ourselves this night and need to rest."

And then he guided the woman out, leaving only two delegates from Eluneyasa in the room.

I object most strongly. This Act is a piece of socialistic moral and one can't expect each state in the WA to support these radical views. The rights given by this Act are in no way human rights and therefore it is not the task of the World Assembly to create legislations like these.

If this Act passes, our country will quit the WA.

With a swipe of its hand the giant communist robot sweeps aside some recently erected scaffolding and pokes its head through the hole in the roof of the General Assembly.

Greetings.

I am Organizing Unit 22.

We come in peace.

The vote is going according to plan.

Soon we will be in control.

To facilitate the transfer of power, all of your governments are urged to vacate your capitals within 24 hours.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/customavatars/avatar554609_1.gif
This image pleases me.

I will applaud.

The robot applauds, causing light fixtures to sway precariously and bits of plaster to fall from the walls.

If this Act passes, our country will quit the WA.

I bagsy your office.

I am Organizing Unit 22.

Organizing Unit 22
Shop steward
International Brotherhood of Giant Robots, Local 5672

With a swipe of its hand the giant communist robot sweeps aside some recently erected scaffolding and pokes its head through the hole in the roof of the General Assembly.
See, this is why you guys can't have nice things.

Ken Scott
Building Maintence VP
WA Building Management

See, this is why you guys can't have nice things.

Ken Scott
Building Maintence VP
WA Building Management

Who: Terrim Silenthoof
Engle Silvershock
Topic: Eeeeee!

As Engle danced by, still in the dance-off with Terrim, she reached down to grab Ken, to pick him up and carry him with her.

"Eeee! A gnome! So cute!" Engle squealed. "Terrim, can I keep him?"

"I don't know..." Terrim said, his hooves accidentally knocking a table into pieces with one complicated jump-kick. "He might have rabies or something. You never know where he's been."

"But, I promise I will feed him and get him his shots and..." Engle began.

"Alright, alright. But you have to clean up after him and make sure he's litterbox-trained," the shaman conceded.

Who: Terrim Silenthoof
Engle Silvershock
Topic: Eeeeee!

As Engle danced by, still in the dance-off with Terrim, she reached down to grab Ken, to pick him up and carry him with her.

"Eeee! A gnome! So cute!" Engle squealed. "Terrim, can I keep him?"

"I don't know..." Terrim said, his hooves accidentally knocking a table into pieces with one complicated jump-kick. "He might have rabies or something. You never know where he's been."

"But, I promise I will feed him and get him his shots and..." Engle began.

"Alright, alright. But you have to clean up after him and make sure he's litterbox-trained," the shaman conceded.

UNHAND ME YOU TWIT!!!! Are you so blind that you are unable to tell a gnome from a human being! Nobody on the WA Building Management staff are gnomes, the gnomes are too busy trying to steal everyone's paperclips to actually run the building. That's why we're here.

Ken Scott
Building Maintence VP
WA Building Management

UNHAND ME YOU TWIT!!!! Are you so blind that you are unable to tell a gnome from a human being! Nobody on the WA Building Management staff are gnomes, the gnomes are too busy trying to steal everyone's paperclips to actually run the building. That's why we're here.

Ken Scott
Building Maintence VP
WA Building Management

Who: Terrim Silenthoof
Engle Silvershock
Topic: Eeeeee!

Engle could not help but giggle at the futile protests and kick attempts of the person she'd just grabbed. Oh, of course she couldn't tell the difference; she was a draenei, and to her gnomes and humans both were tiny. She could only giggle, tucking the "gnome" under her arm.

"See? Isn't it just so cute how he tries to act like he's a real person?" Engle asked. "I think I have this cute baby outfit to stick him in! Of course, litterbox training must begin immediately!"

And with that, the woman stopped dance. "I concede the battle... Please excuse me while I take my pet out to pick out a leash, collar, and litterbox for him."

Terrim nodded, also stopping. "I would also take him to a vet as well, just to get him shots for any diseases he must have." The Tauren knew perfectly well that it wasn't a gnome, but he wasn't about to tell Engle that. She was just too excited about it. He secretly hoped the human would find freedom through escaping.

Engle, still giggling, turned to walk out of the room. Of course, there is the question on if she'd actually, successfully kidnap a member of the building management.

From the Offices of the Supreme Industrial Relations Advisor to the council of Domains, The Federaton of Protectorate Fiefdoms.
In regards to the Act that will pass tommorrow.
While the Labor Relations Act is progressive it seeks to inforce a particular way of running an economy on a group of nations who would do better making there own labor policy suited to there specific needs and situations. In this sense the Act is to broad and has to many loopholes and is to vague in relation to the kinds of industry the Act would effect. Does this apply only to corps. or does it also relate to relativly small businesses that would by completely destroyed by a major strike? A particularly disturbing bit of vagueness is the relation the act has to army, police, security, and emergency employees. Where do private security companies and private paramilitary security services fit into the picture? how does a country judge which industries are essential to the survival of the nation? And how are these provisions clearly ratified? A country could make up a lot of false judgements in order to exempt certain compainies from the Act.
It is for these reasons that a believe the Act should have focused more on the international protection of laborers as relates to physical damages, protection and financial aid for suits filed against companies with, of course, standards for worker treatment in WA criminal and civil courts. The act should have focused less or not at all on the issues relating to unions let individual countries divise there own policy that is based on there own governmental and constitutional ideals and needs. It is unfair and undemorcatic to let a majority of countries impose there own economic will on a minority. It is for this reason that The Federation of Protectorate Fiefdoms opposes this Act and will vote against it.
Supreme Industrial Advisor to there Majesties, Palace of Mont Clavere, Council of Domains

While the Labor Relations Act is progressive it seeks to inforce a particular way of running an economy on a group of nations who would do better making there own labor policy suited to there specific needs and situations. In this sense the Act is to broad and has to many loopholes and is to vague in relation to the kinds of industry the Act would effect.
We are curious as to what manner of labour policy is forbidden by this resolution that would not be repellent for entirely other reasons. It is all very well for the honoured ambassador to speak in generalities like this, but they are singularly unpersuasive. How is this resolution too broad? If there are too many loopholes, mentioning one or two of them should not involve undue effort. In exactly what way is the resolution vague as to the kinds of industry effected.

Does this apply only to corps. or does it also relate to relativly small businesses that would by completely destroyed by a major strike?
It applies to nations, honoured ambassador, we thought that was fairly obvious. We would also observe that a small business which has antagonised its workforce to the point of striking has already collapsed through sheer breakdown of internal trust.

A particularly disturbing bit of vagueness is the relation the act has to army, police, security, and emergency employees. Where do private security companies and private paramilitary security services fit into the picture?
Clause 3 is entirely clear on this point. It is up to individual nations to determine whether strikes by such companies' employees would constitute a public danger, and we rather suspect that they would not in most cases. Beyond that, private security forces are not police, armed forces, emergency services or essential public services. The only possible matter of doubt would occur if a government employed such companies for those purposes, and even then we would observe that it is the employees that we are speaking of, not the companies. How is this vague?

how does a country judge which industries are essential to the survival of the nation?
Where is a country required to do so?

And how are these provisions clearly ratified? A country could make up a lot of false judgements in order to exempt certain compainies from the Act.
We see the honoured ambassador hasn't met the gnomes yet.

It is for these reasons that a believe the Act should have focused more on the international protection of laborers as relates to physical damages, protection and financial aid for suits filed against companies with, of course, standards for worker treatment in WA criminal and civil courts. The act should have focused less or not at all on the issues relating to unions let individual countries divise there own policy that is based on there own governmental and constitutional ideals and needs.
We regret to inform the honoured ambassador that this body has already passed legislation concerning workplace safety, and protections for all persons involved in criminal court proceedings. No legislation has yet been passed protecting labour unions, which is what this proposal is concerned with.

It is unfair and undemorcatic to let a majority of countries impose there own economic will on a minority.
It is most certainly democratic, merely by definition, and fairness is the entire purpose of the proposal. We note that the honoured ambassador's definitions of fairness and democracy aren't hazarded by his proposals for the WA to directly fund individuals engaged in civil actions, nor indeed by requiring that civil actions exist to be funded.

The resolution WA Labor Relations Act was passed 2,682 votes to 1,661. Congratulations!

"Where's my telegram?" Gardner grouses. "Antiquated though it may be, I still deserve a--oh wait. There it is." He snorts at his PDA. "You're still good for something..."

Congratulations!
Thank you!

And a huge thank you to everyone else who supported and defended the Resolution here on the forum, particularly Allech-Atreus, Gobbannium and Eluneyasa. You made my job easier, in fact you argued so effectively that you made my job non-existent. :D

From the Offices of the Supreme Industrial Relations Advisor to the council of Domains, The Federaton of Protectorate Fiefdoms.

We are curious as to what manner of labour policy is forbidden by this resolution that would not be repellent for entirely other reasons..

The Advisor beleives simply that a labor and industrial policy cannot be devised by the standards of a group of nations and that there are many diverse nations in the WA who would benefit from a tailor made labor policy that involves many revisions and reservations that suit the specific needs of those nations. The Advisor also believes that fair democratic deliberations could by held, under the authority of the WA, within the citizenry of nations to decide the shape of Industrial policy in that nation regardless of the form of government entertained by said nations. The Advisor believes that this tailor made system would not only benefit the policy as regards to the formation and preservation of Unions but would benefit the economies of the particular nations as it is the only party that can know what is in the mutual interests of its workers and companies. the Advisor believes that nations with this system of there own devising can include essential elements that would otherwise be missed by the Act in question. Whatever those elements may be, from religious beliefs through family values and functions they could be otherwise be comprimised by the Labor Relations Act.
The Ambassador would likely ask the question " What is to prevent these nations from making 'tailor made industrial policy' alongside the legislation imposed by the Act. The Advisor believes that the nations in question would benefit from 'Union' policy that is worked into the remainder of their Industrial policy and that it may be that two Policies, on devised by WA and the other by the nations in question, would contradict in some legally binding matter.



Clause 3 is entirely clear on this point. It is up to individual nations to determine whether strikes by such companies' employees would constitute a public danger, and we rather suspect that they would not in most cases. Beyond that, private security forces are not police, armed forces, emergency services or essential public services. The only possible matter of doubt would occur if a government employed such companies for those purposes, and even then we would observe that it is the employees that we are speaking of, not the companies. How is this vague?.

Here the honorable Ambassador is correct about the use of the word vague. Perhaps a more accurate description of this portion Act would be as one of the elusive 'Loopholes' the Advisor mentioned in his previous document. the Advisor is simply concerned that a government could exempt certain companies from the act by declaring them essential to the survival of the country when in fact these companies are unworthy of this status and the government simply has comercial interests at heart. This part of the Act, Clause 3, that constitutes a nightmare of incorrect and corrupt interpretation

We note that the honoured ambassador's definitions of fairness and democracy aren't hazarded by his proposals for the WA to directly fund individuals engaged in civil actions, nor indeed by requiring that civil actions exist to be funded.

The Advisor wishes to revise his previously confusing remark and say simply that financail aid be provided for all parties seeking it in law suits so that an impoverished worker would have the ability to survive while perhaps out of work bringing suit against his company, the only company in his area. this would enable the uninterrupted due proccess of law. the financial aid would go in no part to the legal council of the subject(s) in question and individuals partaking of the aid program would be required to seek a court provided and funded legal council. A WA hearing would decide a particular partie's qualification for financial aid and they would be required to produce sufficient evidence of the need thereof.
Supreme Industrial Advisor to there Majesties, Palace of Mont Clavere, Council of Domains

The Advisor wishes to revise his previously confusing remark and say simply that financail aid be provided for all parties seeking it in law suits so that an impoverished worker would have the ability to survive while perhaps out of work bringing suit against his company, the only company in his area. this would enable the uninterrupted due proccess of law. the financial aid would go in no part to the legal council of the subject(s) in question and individuals partaking of the aid program would be required to seek a court provided and funded legal council. A WA hearing would decide a particular partie's qualification for financial aid and they would be required to produce sufficient evidence of the need thereof.

While we disagree with the honoured Advisor in many respects, we would encourage him to follow this general line of thought. The WA currently has no resolutions guiding civil court proceedings, and we would be very interested were he to work these remarks up into a full proposal.