NationStates Jolt Archive

Well just thought of maybe submitting a law that would have that all UN nations should provide their people with welfare. In the nation I represent,
The Most Serene Republic of Vashnoria, the President has had recently signed a bill that creates national welfare. It was call the National Vashnoria Welfare bill. It created in the Ministry of Finance a welfare department. So far there has been a great applause for it in the population. Many of the unemployed have been receiving money in order to ensure that their families don't suffer while they find work. In the coming days as well, the President just recently announce that the National Republican Party and himself to be included will be holding elections, to where Parliament and the President itself will be available since the suspension of the Constitution doing the rebellion. Thank you\

Aemon Rian
UN Ambassador
Minister of External Affairs

If you feel people living in your nation should be given everything then go on and do it for them. However we believe in working for what we need and want not having it handed to us. Welfare programs breed deadbeats and reduce production as citizens become lazy with everything so easy for them to get in life. Government is here to protect citizens and make available to citizens those things they need, but they must work for them or the government fails to meet it's duties since it derives all from the citizens..

Lady Eisabella Newbratotight,
Minister of Education Cavirra,
Chief Justice Royal Court of Faith

i agree...In fact i should say welfare should be slashed and cut...or just plain canceled...Thats the problem with nations these days...people should work for their money..welfare just breeds lazy people. And lazy people are a dent in a nation's economy being just another waste of money. The UGL does not have pensions or any sort of welfare for we believe hard work is the only reason you should get money. Hell even stealing from our banks and internet scams are considered as work in the UGL. The word "retirement" is not mentioned in the UGL for a long time. Nor the word pension. Really i think this petition will be just a major waste of resources. Might as well go communist while your at it.

Alan D. Myerds
UGL United Nation delegate

In both St Edmund and the St Edmundan Antarctic, as in the rest of the Godwinnian Commonwealth, such matters (to the limited extent that they arise, bearing in mind our general prosperity) are dealt with perfectly well by privately-funded charities with no need for government intervention or for funding through compulsory taxation. This is because the historically strong influence of the Godwinnian Catholic Church here has left a strong belief in its doctrine of 'Salvation through Good Works' engrained in the national way of thought...

Aphra Daniels,
First Cnicht, (former) St Edmundan Antarctic mission to the UN.
(just passing through this chamber...)

Attempting to impose a system of welfare upon nations that do not desire one, such as Altanar, is patently unfair and we would have no choice but to oppose it. While our government does maintain an Emergency Assistance Program to help our citizens in times of personal or family crisis, it's intended to be just that: an emergency program to help people regain stability and get back on their own two feet. Welfare programs, from what we have seen in nations that maintain them, often become a way of life, rather than the helping hand they should be. We have absolutely no desire to see Altanar reduced to that; we've flirted with a welfare state before, and have no desire to do so again.

Jaris Krytellin, Ambassador Emeritus

I rise to echo the sentiment of my colleague from Altanar. We have several aide programs currently in place which help the less advantaged citizens. We will not be subject to an imposed welfare system.

Nigel S Youlkin
USoP Ambassador at Large.

I agree completely with Altanar - an attempt by the UN to force nations to implement welfare would not only be unfair, it would be a blatant intrusion into the domestic policies of sovereign nations.

That said, however, I wonder whether Vashnoria was thinking of open-ended welfare or something that would be more of an emergency-type basis, similar to the ones referenced by Altanar and Philimbesi.

We must entirely disagree with the sentiments expressed by the Altanari delegation, for once; there are many times when brief emergency cover is utterly insufficient for emergencies that will stretch for the remainder of a person's lifetime.

Consider for example the case of a working person of modest savings who is, through no fault of anyone's, crippled in an accident and rendered unfit to continue any form of work. Such a person, and the family that they previously supported, will need some form of support to avoid destitution, and we regard it as the duty of a responsible government to be able to step in and provide that support where no one else can or will. That, honoured ambassadors, is what a welfare system is; a safety net, if you will. And while some nations may never have to use such a net if their citizens' charity is so all-encompassing, we still cannot regard any safety net as truly safe unless it has governmental backing.

Well just thought of maybe submitting a law that would have that all UN nations should provide their people with welfare. In the nation I represent,
The Most Serene Republic of Vashnoria, the President has had recently signed a bill that creates national welfare. It was call the National Vashnoria Welfare bill. It created in the Ministry of Finance a welfare department. So far there has been a great applause for it in the population. Many of the unemployed have been receiving money in order to ensure that their families don't suffer while they find work. In the coming days as well, the President just recently announce that the National Republican Party and himself to be included will be holding elections, to where Parliament and the President itself will be available since the suspension of the Constitution doing the rebellion. Thank you\

Aemon Rian
UN Ambassador
Minister of External Affairs

We of the Constitutional Republic do not see this as an international issue. NSUN member states economics situations and structure vary in too much of degreed for any reasonable welfare program to be initiated at an international level... It is much better to leave said concerns up to individual member states for implementation.

Consider for example the case of a working person of modest savings who is, through no fault of anyone's, crippled in an accident and rendered unfit to continue any form of work. Such a person, and the family that they previously supported, will need some form of support to avoid destitution, and we regard it as the duty of a responsible government to be able to step in and provide that support where no one else can or will. That, honoured ambassadors, is what a welfare system is; a safety net, if you will. And while some nations may never have to use such a net if their citizens' charity is so all-encompassing, we still cannot regard any safety net as truly safe unless it has governmental backing.

While we respect the stance of our honorable Gobbannean colleagues, this is something where we would differ, and it may well be due to cultural differences. The role of providing support for more long-term needs does not fall to the government in Altanar, but to the friends, family, and often the church of the person in need. Our culture has a long tradition of the extended family coming together to help family members in need, and typically that is where such support would come from for the scenario that was outlined. Our people don't expect the government to provide for them long-term, or even short-term very often, for that matter. We simply have a different conception of what the role of government should be. This is why we hope that no resolution mandating national welfare ever comes to pass. We would rather see the UN respect the choices that nations and their governments may make when it comes to such matters.

Jaris Krytellin, Ambassador Emeritus

With all due respect to the esteemed representative of Vashnoria, the people of the Eternal Kawaii (mtCObp) would find such a proposal offensive. Why would someone dishonor their hard-working parents by begging from the government? If a man must beg, let him beg from his family to keep the shame from reflecting poorly upon them.

Considering all that has been said on this topic by previous speakers, I thought it wise to explain our position on the issue of welfare. In Sanctus Aequitas, it is the duty of everyone to provide justice and mercy for the weak, poor and destitute. The government has the means and the will to pick up the slack if any exists.

That said, I believe this to be of national (not international) concern and attempting to regulate welfare on an international level is simply not practical. However, Santus Aequitas will continue to have a policy of providing support to those outside its borders who need it, and of course are prepared to welcome any of your excess "lazy" government-dependent citizens to our shores.

Araneus,
Ambassador to the UN
Sanctus Aequitas

The Holy Empire of Imota soundly opposes the proposal putforth by the Most Serene Republic of Vashnoria. Our own fairly generous welfare system not withstanding, we hold that every country has the right to establish whatever social welfare system it deems most appropriate, or none at all.

Consider for example the case of a working person of modest savings who is, through no fault of anyone's, crippled in an accident and rendered unfit to continue any form of work.Unless a person is dead they can serve some function here and be productive so this is mute. We find a place for them here don't push them aside to die but encourage them to live.

Such a person, and the family that they previously supported,Here the next elder in the family steps up to support the family not leave them alone helpless.
will need some form of support to avoid destitution, and we regard it as the duty of a responsible government to be able to step in and provide that support where no one else can or will.Citizens are the government here if they fail then it fails each has a part to build it in strenght no matter how small so they are supported but by themselves as that government.

That, honoured ambassadors, is what a welfare system is; a safety net, if you will. And while some nations may never have to use such a net if their citizens' charity is so all-encompassing, we still cannot regard any safety net as truly safe unless it has governmental backing.Well said and here we do have that.. thus have no need for outsides coming in and draining it and not giving back to it. This is were we see welfare as weak in that many programs hand out things without any requirement for those getting them to ever put back... In time there is nothing to hand out thus it fails... Each nation needs to address the needs of their citizens first and maintain programs to help better thier lives. There is no need for any nation not to be able to do what any nation might do to improve the life of it's citizens nor drain the resources of that nation out of lazyness and greed which many welfare programs have become in other nations.

The more hands in a pie the less edible the pie becomes.. thus bringing in the full membership of the UN leaves a bad taste in ones mouth eating from the welfare pie.. besides what works for one may not work for all.

Unless a person is dead they can serve some function here and be productive so this is mute. We find a place for them here don't push them aside to die but encourage them to live.

Here the next elder in the family steps up to support the family not leave them alone helpless.
Citizens are the government here if they fail then it fails each has a part to build it in strenght no matter how small so they are supported but by themselves as that government.

Well said and here we do have that.. thus have no need for outsides coming in and draining it and not giving back to it. This is were we see welfare as weak in that many programs hand out things without any requirement for those getting them to ever put back... In time there is nothing to hand out thus it fails... Each nation needs to address the needs of their citizens first and maintain programs to help better thier lives. There is no need for any nation not to be able to do what any nation might do to improve the life of it's citizens nor drain the resources of that nation out of lazyness and greed which many welfare programs have become in other nations.

The more hands in a pie the less edible the pie becomes.. thus bringing in the full membership of the UN leaves a bad taste in ones mouth eating from the welfare pie.. besides what works for one may not work for all.


I couldn't have said it better my self.

That, honoured ambassadors, is what a welfare system is; a safety net, if you will. And while some nations may never have to use such a net if their citizens' charity is so all-encompassing, we still cannot regard any safety net as truly safe unless it has governmental backing.

We agree, governmental backing, not worldwide decree.

There is a difference between using welfare as a safety net and using welfare as a crutch. Our system takes that into account the difference and we will not have it obscured by red tape.

Nigel S Youlkin
United Nations Ambassador At Large

While we respect the stance of our honorable Gobbannean colleagues, this is something where we would differ, and it may well be due to cultural differences. The role of providing support for more long-term needs does not fall to the government in Altanar, but to the friends, family, and often the church of the person in need. Our culture has a long tradition of the extended family coming together to help family members in need, and typically that is where such support would come from for the scenario that was outlined.
We find the Altanari familial spirit highly admirable, but can the honoured ambassador be certain that there are no individuals who lack family or friends to support them? That there never will be such? That, in short, there can be no holes in this charitable structure? We would be very surprised to find that to be true, and those cases, rare or common as they may be, are where we would hope to find a governmental welfare system, however named, operating in loco familiae as it were.

We find the Altanari familial spirit highly admirable, but can the honoured ambassador be certain that there are no individuals who lack family or friends to support them? That there never will be such? That, in short, there can be no holes in this charitable structure? We would be very surprised to find that to be true, and those cases, rare or common as they may be, are where we would hope to find a governmental welfare system, however named, operating in loco familiae as it were.

There are admittedly opportunities for individuals to fall through the cracks, as it were, for example in the case of someone who has no living family members. This is a situation where the church, or other charities, might step in and assist. Our government does also offer the aforementioned short-term assistance aimed at helping such individuals regain their stability. Is it possible that people in need can be missed with such a structure? Absolutely. However, our society has decided that maintaining a massive, costly welfare system is not desirable for us in order to prevent that. It is our hope that the combination of government and private assistance, coupled with a strong economy and educational system, will make up for the lack. That is not to say that our way is the best; other nations might have a better way of addressing these needs. We just don't find it desirable to impose a universal system upon nations.

Jaris Krytellin, Ambassador Emeritus

No. Qwertyuilanders believe that the it is not the job of the government to give everyone a job. We believe that the market, when left alone, will be able to provide for all citizens.