NationStates Jolt Archive

Please go to proposal list and indicate your support

Description:
Observing that Colony Collapse Disorder has spread to all continents on the Globe and caused a sharp decline in bee populations.

Noting that bees are an integral part of global agriculture

Concerned that further decline in the bee population could result in massive crop failures and famine:

1. Promotes scintists in all nations to work cooperatively in seeking the cause of CCD

2. Establishes the CCD Information Archive Group (CCD-IAG) to collect and archive information on CCD from scientists around the globe, and make the results freely available to all research universites in member states.

3. Notes that all submissions of research to the CCD-IAG are of a voluntary nature.

4. Encourages that all research findings on CCD or on bee populations be submitted to the CCD-IAG for the use of other researchers.

OOC: Oh my god, I do apologise; I had no idea a thread had been started on this.

I'd suggest this would be better suited to the Educational than Environmental category. Also, in clause 1 you misspelled 'scientists'.

But - grew up in a town, live in a city, closest thing I've ever come to agriculture is buying free range eggs at the supermarket - bees, 'integral to global agriculture'? Really?

But - grew up in a town, live in a city, closest thing I've ever come to agriculture is buying free range eggs at the supermarket - bees, 'integral to global agriculture'? Really?

Without bees, there is no pollination. No pollination, no flowers and fruit. No flowers or fruit? No new generations, and subsequent extinction of possibly multiple species.

Yeah. They're pretty integral.

Without bees, there is no pollination. No pollination, no flowers and fruit. No flowers or fruit? No new generations, and subsequent extinction of possibly multiple species.

Yeah. They're pretty integral.
Duh. You're quite right. I hadn't considered that at all.

(And thus, it might be useful to mention this in the proposal, because I assume there are others almost as scientifically illiterate as me.)

OOC: The disappearance of honey bees would have a devastating effect on the plants that are pollinated by honey bees exclusively. It would not have any impact on plant species such as wheat though, which doesn't require bees to pollinate. Also, the effect would mainly be on old world species as honey bees are not native to North America and North American flowering plants were presumably pollinated by something else before honey bees were imported.

It's unclear what would happen to those plant species of North American origin which are now mainly pollinated by honey bees if the bees disappeared. Would they go back to being pollinated by the native insects? Or are they now so dependent on honey bee pollination that they could no longer reproduce? It really is troubling.

For flowering plants, Bees account for eighty five percent of the pollination, butterflies account for between twelve and fourteen percent. I'm not sure if it would eventually be possible for butterflies to pick up the slack, but in the short term we would have to expect drastic crop failures for most fruits and vegetables. and possible extincion of several fruit and vegetable species.

New Leicestershire is correct that grain crops are wind pollinated and would not be affected by the falling bee population. We could still have oatmeal and toast for breakfast every morning (and for dinner every evening) even if the bees became extinct.

OOC It never occured to me that city folk wouldn't know why bees are integral to agriculture. I wish I would have waited for peer review before I submitted the proposal, but I submitted this thread and several hours passed before it appeared. I'm afraid I got impatient. The misspelling bothers me, as many times as I read over the proposal perfecting the "UN speak" I can't believe I missed it. Oh well, you live and learn I guess

OOC: You can always ask a moderator to delete it for you, though it's probably just as well to let it run through this time. The odds are that unless you run a serious telegram campaign, it won't reach quorum anyway. Pretty much nothing ever does without a lot of effort.

As a general principle real life does not equal nation states. Just because we have a crisis in the real world doesn't mean we have one in the game. There are exceptions to this of course.

Don't we already have a resolution that has measures in case a species population significantly declines? This seems to be mostly a committee to study a problem without providing answers on how to solve it.

To the representative of The Will of Gaea:

Patience is a virtue. (People tell us that. We don't have any, so we don't know much about it. ;) ) You have to remember that not all members of the Assembly visit here every day. We've always advised leaving a week for comments after a draft has been posted.

To the representative of Retired Werepenguins:

As a general principle real life does not equal nation states. Just because we have a crisis in the real world doesn't mean we have one in the game. There are exceptions to this of course.

Don't we already have a resolution that has measures in case a species population significantly declines? This seems to be mostly a committee to study a problem without providing answers on how to solve it.

Would the representative prefer we go about imposing "solutions" before understanding the problem? Or, as he suggests, knowing if the problem exists at all in the world of NationStates? There's certainly precedent for doing that. We've done it with solar panels and hydrogen-powered vehicles, to cite two examples.

Travilia E. Thwerdock
Ambassador to the United Nations

Would the representative prefer we go about imposing "solutions" before understanding the problem? Or, as he suggests, knowing if the problem exists at all in the world of NationStates? There's certainly precedent for doing that. We've done it with solar panels and hydrogen-powered vehicles, to cite two examples.


I'm new but here's something to say. I don't think solar panels and hydrogen fuel have anything to do with the real world as it is not a real situation happening. Its not like they where put up there to combat global warming in Alaska or some other real life reason for alternative fuel cells. Nope CCD isn't something that is common enough for it not to be based on a real world setting. Thus ending my post, the rules are pretty straight forward even for a newbie like myself.

I'm new but here's something to say. I don't think solar panels and hydrogen fuel have anything to do with the real world as it is not a real situation happening. Its not like they where put up there to combat global warming in Alaska or some other real life reason for alternative fuel cells. Nope CCD isn't something that is common enough for it not to be based on a real world setting. Thus ending my post, the rules are pretty straight forward even for a newbie like myself.

Welcome to the UN. Doesn't matter if you're new. Your comments are welcome. Our point using the solar panels and hydrogen-powered vehicles was that these were subjects on which the UN passed resolutions without the consequences being properly considered. We'd rather have a committee established to research and study a problem than have some resolution written that force-feeds a supposed and perhaps dangerous solution to a problem that we don't understand.

I'm afraid we don't get your point about the "real world". Many resolutions are based on knowledge of issues gained from the mythical world of RL. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that, as long as those issues are compatible with the setting of the NS world.

Travilia E. Thwerdock
Ambassador to the United Nations

[QUOTE=Ausserland;12658660
I'm afraid we don't get your point about the "real world". Many resolutions are based on knowledge of issues gained from the mythical world of RL. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that, as long as those issues are compatible with the setting of the NS world.
[/QUOTE]

Allow me to explain then. Real world violations. CCD is a crisis happening in the real world not on NS. Its basically like passing a reolution to get rid of the demilitirized zone between north and south korea. That's in real life, not NS. CCD is a very real life problem that the real UN should deal with. Not the fake UN on NS where we RP a fake world. A little clearer?

Edit: Sorry about the mess up in my quote.

Here is the exact copied and pasted text from the rules os the game

Real World Violations

George Bush, Hammas, France, The Michigan Compiled Laws (Annotated), and Smith & Wesson do not exist in the NationStates world. Don't bring them up in Proposals. This includes references to real world documents, movies, and books. This is really easy to grasp and is a "bright line" violation. A Proposal that is wonderfully written, but mentions "the Great Wall of China" will be deleted.


Now come on. Seriously CCD is something real I don't know if anyone's keeping up with the real world news but there you go.

We have proposals on AIDS. Should those be banned? CCD is not a real-world violation because, well, we have bees in NS.

...We could still have oatmeal and toast for breakfast every morning (and for dinner every evening) even if the bees became extinct.Alas, beer (at least good beer) would be right out. And that would make us very sad. ;)

Herbites, what you seem to be missing is that real world violations involve entities unique to the real world. Smith & Wesson may not exist in NationStates, but guns do. George Bush is a myth here, but we do have presidents. Will of Gaea would have violated the RW rule, if he (she?) had included a provision for the U.S.Dept. of Agriculture (or any of its named equivalents in other countries) to be involved some way, but not by reference to a biological occurrence such as CCD.

Leetha Talone
Ambassador and beer fan.

Alas, beer (at least good beer) would be right out. And that would make us very sad. ;)
Er, actually barley and hops are both wind pollinated. We'd still have good beer, but that's hardly a substitute for fruits and vegetables.

Er, actually barley and hops are both wind pollinated. We prefer our beer with honey in it :D , but admit it was hops we were thinking of. We'd still have good beer, but that's hardly a substitute for fruits and vegetables.Sacrilege. ;)

We have proposals on AIDS. Should those be banned? CCD is not a real-world violation because, well, we have bees in NS.

Well I would say that in general daily issues trumps the real world and in the daily issues we have this AIDS clone called VODAS. So I would say that we probably should have issues about VODAS and not AIDS.

To the representative of Retired Werepenguins:

Would the representative prefer we go about imposing "solutions" before understanding the problem? Or, as he suggests, knowing if the problem exists at all in the world of NationStates? There's certainly precedent for doing that. We've done it with solar panels and hydrogen-powered vehicles, to cite two examples.

No, but what I am suggesting is that in Nation States there are a number of agencies that simply don't exist in the real world. The declining population (should this happen in the NS world) would already be a concern of UNCoESB. Particularly Article 6 would be invoked which would start the agency to create breeding farms for the bees which in turn would require the study of the problem in order to have a successful breeding program. The import of similiar species - assuming that gnomes don't intorduce killer bees everywhere - would also be done. Note even before this was a problem the RW Califorina had been importing bees from other states for decades.

If local populations decrease to a worrying level then local Zoological and Marine specialists shall step in to capture and breed, in an attempt to reverse the decrease in numbers. Also, if larger populations of the same animal exist in another part of the NS world steps should be taken to introduce new blood lines to the endangered species.

Please note that I am not strongly opposed. I'm really borderline on this. The idea is you can't assume that a disaster in the RW has happened. You can ssume a disaster in the real world might happen. Then you have to think how the NS world would deal with it with the current resolutions in place and what additional resolutions would be needed to address the problem in the NS world, not in the RW world. That's my point.

At the risk of turning this entire thread into an argument here goes. Alright whatever then. Just seems to me even if their are bees in NS it don't mean they all of a sudden have CCD in NS. I'm saying the reason for this study of CCD is because of the current crisis going on in RL. Maybe I'm just cynical but I don't think it would have even been posted if it wasn't happening in RL. And to me that violates the RL rules. But hey leave it to a Mod to enforce the rules it ain't my job.

But hey leave it to a Mod to enforce the rules it ain't my job.

It IS my job. Rubina's explanation in post #16 can be taken as fact. There's nothing illegal about assuming that bees here have problems too.

I'm saying the reason for this study of CCD is because of the current crisis going on in RL. Maybe I'm just cynical but I don't think it would have even been posted if it wasn't happening in RL. And to me that violates the RL rules.

OOC: As Fris and others have stated, it is perfectly legal to take your proposal ideas from RL events. In fact, the idea for the Tsunami Warning System (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=8090096&postcount=91) resolution came from the RL Boxing Day Tsunami.

:headbang: I'm trying to be as diplomatic as possible about this Friz, but please read resolution #90 carefully.

DEEPLY REGRETTING the scale of the loss of life and property due to tsunamis;

AWARE that the some of causes of tsunamis include earthquakes, volcanic activity, landslides, and celestial impacts, but that the primary danger associated with a tsunami is related to the displacement of water (i.e. waves);

NOTING that these disasters can impact multiple nations at the same time;

EMPHASIZING that the citizens from non-coastal communities may be at risk while on vacation or business in coastal communities;

CONVINCED that by pooling resources to detect potential tsunamis, issuing warnings to the areas likely to be impacted, coordinating international aid efforts, and sharing research related to tsunamis, that nations can better prepare for these disasters;

The Tsunami Warning System does not assume that a Tsunami has taken place. It merely speculates on what may happen if a Tsumani had taken place. It is inspired by real life. It is not dependent on it.

If you look at the resolution in question it is clearly dependent on the real world situation.

Observing that Colony Collapse Disorder has spread to all continents on the Globe and caused a sharp decline in bee populations.

It states as a matter of fact that a real world event has happened in Nation States.

And that's all I'm going to say on the matter because frankly I'm fed up with the half ass decisions of people who are supposed to judge fairly.

If you look at the resolution in question it is clearly dependent on the real world situation.



It states as a matter of fact that a real world event has happened in Nation States.
It seems that there are others that either state directly or imply that a real world event has taken place in NS:
For too long humans have been emitting chlorofluorocarbons (CFCs) which effect the ozone that protects us.
NOTING: that using fossil fuel as an energy source cannot continue indefinitely, because of damage to the environment and finite supply.
REALIZING that no concerted effort has yet been mounted to address one of the world's oldest and deadliest contagions - variola (commonly known as "smallpox")
DECLARING that the level of HIV and AIDS infection across the world has grown to the point whereas it demands immediate action;
Acknowledging climate change and its adverse effects are a common concern of humankind,
* Overfishing is a serious problem which is depleting the marine environment by upsetting its natural ecosystem.
OBSERVING the continued health risk posed by injecting drug use (IDU), as reported by the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime (UNODC) in its June 25, 2004 report titled, "World Drug Report 2004";
NOTING with horror the enormous increase in the past decade in HIV infection rates throughout the world,
I'm sure there are others. Did you, by chance, happen to support any of these?

Personally, I see no reason why a real world event shouldn't also occur here and I certainly see no reason why it couldn't.

Perhaps the term "CCD" should be omitted since it was apparently coined by someone at the Colony Collapse Disorder Working Group at Penn State. That might be seen as a real world reference.

I think it's only natural for some of the things we do here to be influenced by real world events. Now obviously I wouldn't support a "Stop the Darfur Genocide" or "Stop Drilling in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge" resolution. But since honeybees almost certainly exist here I think it's reasonable that the factors affecting them in RL, whether it be parasites, cellphones or whatever, also exist here.

Sounds fair enough, but who is going to pay for this fancy research?

http://www.meninhats.com/images/aram.gif
Aram Koopman
Ambassador representing the Knootian UN Office

Ambassador Koopman raises an important point, you'll need to include some sort of provision to fund the study.

David Watts
Ambassador
The Dominion of New Leicestershire

Question, if honey bees are not native to North America or other countries. What implies that they are native to any NS country? I think at the least it sould be a regional roleplay if bees suffer from CCD and what actions to take, because fact is over half the world might not even have honey bees native to their country, so probably wouldn't be an affect on the whole world. The UN shouldn't get involved. On another note I'd like to say we don't even know what's causing CCD in RL so at least make up a fake reason we can blame for the cause in NS to make this more NS and less RL.

Question, if honey bees are not native to North America or other countries. What implies that they are native to any NS country? I think at the least it sould be a regional roleplay if bees suffer from CCD and what actions to take, because fact is over half the world might not even have honey bees native to their country, so probably wouldn't be an affect on the whole world. The UN shouldn't get involved.You're grasping at straws.
On another note I'd like to say we don't even know what's causing CCD in RL so at least make up a fake reason we can blame for the cause in NS to make this more NS and less RL.
Did you not read the proposal?
1. Promotes scintists in all nations to work cooperatively in seeking the cause of CCDWhy would a cause be included in a proposal where one of the aims is to identify the cause?

Bob Flibble
UN Representative

This fails because it's about a real-world event.

This fails because it's about a real-world event.

Read up a few posts next time.

It IS my job. Rubina's explanation in post #16 can be taken as fact. There's nothing illegal about assuming that bees here have problems too.