NationStates Jolt Archive

Care Certification Act

RECOGNIZING that many poorer nations are struggling, due to lack of funds, to provide health care services for their citizens;

NOTING that many richer nations would be willing to donate money for the purpose of helping to provide such care, but hesitate due to the possibility of corruption and misuse of the money, and

BELIEVING that nations willing to provide adequate health care services, but needing help from the international community to provide it, should receive that help, but must agree to measures that ensure the money is being spent in the appropriate area;

The United Nations

DEFINES health care services as any service provided to further the health and/or well being of citizens, including but not limited to hospitals, clinics, disabled care services, training of medical personnel, sanitary facilities, acquisition and/or distribution of medicine(s), public health education programs, vaccination programs, specialised medical and/or surgical services, purchase of equipment and the building and/or maintainence of necessary infrastructure.

ESTABLISHES the Care Certification Team, or CCT to collect donations from willing nations and private donors, distribute funds to nations who request it on an as needed basis, and monitor the use of the funds to ensure that the money is properly spent on the health care sector without redirection or abuse.

1. Negotiate an agreement with each potential receiving nation on basic standards for care, tailored to the nation's needs and ensuring that said nation receives enough money to achieve its goals. A receiving nation may negotiate an agreement to cover as much or as little of its health care activities as it wants and needs.

2. Work with each receiving nation to ensure that all aspects of the nation's own culture and religion are fully respected.

3. Inspect or evaluate the funded services in receiving nations 6 months after the initial donation to ensure that the agreed-upon standards are being met and that the funds are being properly spent to improve heath care services. If all standards are met, the receiving nation will be certified to receive further donations on a regular basis.

4. Carry out unannounced inspections at irregular intervals to ensure continuing compliance with the agreed-upon standards.

REQUIRES that, if a receiving nation fails or refuses to meet the standards agreed upon, the CCT shall suspend disbursement of funds to that nation. The CCT may, at its sole discretion, continue to disburse funds if the nation is making a good faith effort to comply with the standards.

AUTHORIZES the CCT to reduce or cancel disbursements to nations which become capable of funding their own health care activities. Receiving nations may voluntarily withdraw from this program if the contributed funds are no longer needed or wanted.

URGES all UN member nations to provide adequate health care facilities in their communities, and maintain them at an acceptable international standard, taking advantage of this program if needed.

ENCOURAGES nations and private donors to channel international donations through the CCT to promote proper expenditure of funds.

Co-authored by Ausserland

This proposal started life as the Disabled Care Accreditation Act. I've done some revamping, and expanded it to include the whole healthcare sector. It has been carefully examined on Reclamation, and is ready for submission, which is planned for tues after the evening update.

If anyone can see anything that has been missed, or needs fixing, please say so. I appreciate all input.

My eyes are glazing over a little, so perhaps you could do a spot of distillation for me... how is it affecting all nations? It seems to be that some people are giving and some are receiving. I'm sure I'm reading it wrong, which is why I'm asking for clarification.

My eyes are glazing over a little, so perhaps you could do a spot of distillation for me... how is it affecting all nations? It seems to be that some people are giving and some are receiving. I'm sure I'm reading it wrong, which is why I'm asking for clarification.

OOC:

I think my eyes must have glazed over some, too. I'm not sure I undertsand the question. The program (service, if you will) will be available to all NSUN member nations, as donors, recipients, or both. Sort of like the Microcredit Bazaars. Did that help?

URGES all UN member nations to provide adequate health care facilities in their communities, and maintain them at an acceptable international standard, taking advantage of this program if needed.

That clause does affect all member nations, albeit in a mild fashion.

The rest of the proposal does affect nations that wish to use the program, be they givers or receivers, but is open to all UN member nations to use if they want to, so, in my own opinion, that does affect all nations too.

If you are uneasy about the legality of this, let me know and I can do some changes. Won't be the first time with one of my efforts (OSSA).

Ahh... okay. I see. S'all cool.

Personally, I like this proposal. I congratulate the authors for a great job. However, I would just have one question... What effect shall it have for our nations (in the game, that is)?

Dr. Cestre l'E. Montòccegliano, M.D.
His Majesty's Government's Permanent Representative to the United Nations
Acting Assistant Foreign Minister for the United Nations
NP (MP) for Vilònordà Sordosta-Píarmognazzo-Sint'Angelo di l'Ollino (Norden)

A most excellent and well considered idea.

As a minor point of grammar, you need something to introduce that string of infinitives in the subclauses of the "ESTABLISHES" section.


Christelle Zyryanov (http://ns.goobergunch.net/wiki/index.php/Christelle_Zyryanov),
Ambassador to the United Nations,
PDSRA

We offer full support for this Resolution and would offer help with the string of infinitives mentioned by Ambassador Zyryanov, but since English is not our native language we will leave that to others who are more familiar with it.

Aüþgæþ Spøtyiú
Ambassador

Well, for example, if you wish to retain the infinitive form:


ESTABLISHES the Care Certification Team, or CCT to collect donations from willing nations and private donors, distribute funds to nations who request it on an as needed basis, and monitor the use of the funds to ensure that the money is properly spent on the health care sector without redirection or abuse. It will also be the CCT's function to:

1. Negotiate an agreement with each potential receiving nation on basic standards for care, tailored to the nation's needs and ensuring that said nation receives enough money to achieve its goals. A receiving nation may negotiate an agreement to cover as much or as little of its health care activities as it wants and needs.

The honorable ambassador from Ariddia is quite correct. Our thanks. The clause should be amended to read:

ESTABLISHES the Care Certification Team (CCT) to collect donations from willing nations and private donors, distribute funds to nations who request it on an as needed basis, and monitor the use of the funds to ensure that the money is properly spent on the health care sector without redirection or abuse. The CCT shall:

Lorelei M. Ahlmann
Ambassador-at-Large

Personally, I like this proposal. I congratulate the authors for a great job. However, I would just have one question... What effect shall it have for our nations (in the game, that is)?

Dr. Cestre l'E. Montòccegliano, M.D.
His Majesty's Government's Permanent Representative to the United Nations
Acting Assistant Foreign Minister for the United Nations
NP (MP) for Vilònordà Sordosta-Píarmognazzo-Sint'Angelo di l'Ollino (Norden)
If you mean the stat effect if the proposal passes, I can't answer that because I don't know. Whatever changes, if anything, should only be mild however because the strength of the legislation is mild.

A most excellent and well considered idea.

As a minor point of grammar, you need something to introduce that string of infinitives in the subclauses of the "ESTABLISHES" section.


Christelle Zyryanov (http://ns.goobergunch.net/wiki/index.php/Christelle_Zyryanov),
Ambassador to the United Nations,
PDSRA
Change to draft made as per Ausserlands edit. Thanks for bringing that up Ariddia, it does read much better.

LAE want to compliment the authors for this fine resolution and support it.

As we said on reclamation, there is just 1 thing we are really uneasy with: "unannounced inspections". We fuly agree with budget/bank account/accountancy permanent availability and "unannounced inspections", but not with physical "unannounced inspections". We really think that it's best for the UN to be the more transparent possible.

LAE want to compliment the authors for this fine resolution and support it.

As we said on reclamation, there is just 1 thing we are really uneasy with: "unannounced inspections". We fuly agree with budget/bank account/accountancy permanent availability and "unannounced inspections", but not with physical "unannounced inspections". We really think that it's best for the UN to be the more transparent possible.

We appreciate the honorable representative's support.

The intent is to insure that donated funds are being spent properly for the purpose for which they are intended -- in accordance with the agreed-upon standards. You cannot do that simply by examining the books of an organization. There are far too many ways for fraud, abuse, and simple incompetence to be happening that will not show up in any audit of accounts.

We also cannot see how unannounced inspections are in any way related to "transparency" of the NSUN. Perhaps the honorable representative is using that word differently than its accepted usage. We'd appreciate an explanation.

Lorelei M. Ahlmann
Ambassador-at-Large

This proposal has been submitted. Delegates, please endorse :).

Approval Link (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/page=UN_proposal1/match=certification)

Altanar has endorsed this resolution on behalf of the Balanced Scales region.

On behalf of the Great Star Empire, I am happy to add my Emperor's endorsement to this proposal.

Most courteousl,

We have added our approval to this proposal.


Dahlia Dioce
UN Representative
Queendom of Karmicaria

Approved.

-Roderick Spear

Thankyou, all of you, for your support

Actually I just realized that I didn't approve it. Well, NOW it has my approval.

I feel that a nation has a right to figure out theyre own ways of caring for their citizens. The American and British beliefs of care are completely different yet both are thriving countries.

We will be happy to vote in favor of this proposal. Great work.

Linda Anaris
UN-Office
GPRG

I feel that a nation has a right to figure out theyre own ways of caring for their citizens. The American and British beliefs of care are completely different yet both are thriving countries.

Welcome to the UN, Papaleo.

We respectfully point out that this resolution does not affect the right of nations to choose their own healthcare systems:

ESTABLISHES the Care Certification Team, or CCT to collect donations from willing nations and private donors, distribute funds to nations who request it on an as needed basis, and monitor the use of the funds to ensure that the money is properly spent on the health care sector without redirection or abuse.

Also:

1. Negotiate an agreement with each potential receiving nation on basic standards for care, tailored to the nation's needs and ensuring that said nation receives enough money to achieve its goals. A receiving nation may negotiate an agreement to cover as much or as little of its health care activities as it wants and needs.

2. Work with each receiving nation to ensure that all aspects of the nation's own culture and religion are fully respected.

This resolution, as we read it, is voluntary and works with individual nations that choose to participate to craft a fair and effective mechanism for funding that meets an individual nation's goals.

- Jaris Krytellin, Ambassador

I feel that a nation has a right to figure out theyre own ways of caring for their citizens. The American and British beliefs of care are completely different yet both are thriving countries.

Just to add onto what Altanar has already explained..

2. Work with each receiving nation to ensure that all aspects of the nation's own culture and religion are fully respected.
This proposal doesn't impose any sort of health care system on any nation. It is an international aid scheme that works within a nations own health care system.

Sorry to all for there not being a poll with this thread. I forgot to put it in again.

Since giving money is voluntary, I don't see any reason to oppose this resolution, even though my own nation would never participate in it.

Ya I will not pay for other countries health care.....

Greetings, from Waawaaweewa (also of Australia). I will be voting for this proposition, as I was very pleased to see that it (unlike many other UN inititatives) insists on side-stepping corruption and misappropriation of funds by corrupt governments, and ensures regular checks. Although I will be interested to see how the religious/cultural sensitivity is maintained, since that could prove to be a hurdle to effective monitoring.

This is not only humantarian, but will help the people of our glorious nation to help our less fortunate neighbors, thereby improving health of the entire region and keeping hordes of sick people flooding over our borders and into our hospitals.

We think you done good, boys!

I'm definitely for this, but sadly my region is tied up on its poll, with only myself supporting it at the moment. I cannot guarantee Charis's vote for this, though I hope this very worthy resolution passes.

Roderick Spear
Paradican UN Ambassador

The nation of Zelpharia is strongly against this resolution.

If it passes, I will definitely not donate any of our nation's funds, and I will be disappointed that the NSUN urges small influential nations to become socialist.

Yeah, I don't think this has anything whatsoever to do with socialism.

Don't mean to cynical on the whole issue,
and I certainly approve of this proposal
but I certainly hope there are no further provisos
upon WHY the receiving country is in a state of poverty.

Admittedly religious concerns will not be violated,
but what of trade regulations and certain ethical political stances which
overtly empoverish or are financially detrimental to the nation ?

The last thing we would wish to see is a form of healthcare "bribery" or "blackmail" for the country to become more "self-sustaining " by compromising their stances.

We for one, to quote Flaubert, would consider: "The price would be too high!"

The nation of Zelpharia is strongly against this resolution.

If it passes, I will definitely not donate any of our nation's funds, and I will be disappointed that the NSUN urges small influential nations to become socialist.

We have to admit we're dumbfounded. We can't see how this resolution urges socialism in any way, shape or form. Perhaps the representative would like to give the resolution another careful reading and then explain his statement.

Patrick T. Olembe
Minister for Foreign Affairs

Well it is, after all, co-authored by that well known socialist Ausserland.

This proposal very clearly reflects my nation's own stance regarding healthcare, and as such has received Lithoria's approval. As an added factor, the Lithorian National Assembly sees no particular issue with the passage of this proposal, as participation is strictly on a volunteer basis. The LNA has also begun allocating foreign relief funds for contribution to the CCT should this proposal come to pass.

The National Assembly has, however, expressed concern that there may be a derth of philanthropist nations when compared with a possible horde of relief applicants, forcing the proposed CCT to become little more than a gesture as a few tidvals or other national currencies are to be spread thin and rendered useless.

Still, Lithoria remains faithful that there will be many Good Samaritan nations in the international community who will be willing to supply aid.

Ferrard Carson,
Secretary of State,
Citizen's Republic of Lithoria

Well it is, after all, co-authored by that well known socialist Ausserland.

OOC: Let's see.... You are the one who called Pat Buchanan a flaming liberal, right? :D

The Nation of Hassanisabah has sent its UN monitor Pope Ulysses S. Underbottom to observe the proceedings for informational purposes.

Pope Underbottom: "Overall, The Nation of Hassanisabah supports the "intent" of the proposed legislation and salutes the "spirit" in which it was contrived. However, Researchers from our National Department of Litigious Lies and Loopholes have issued one concern regarding Section Establishes, Clause 4, word IRREGULAR. The word "irregular" is far to relative for our tastes. Irregular per day could mean hours 1, 5, and 16 on one day and hours 3 and 17 the next, but still per day. Irregular per week could mean Monday and Friday one week and Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday the next, but still weekly. The proposed Bill does not address the scope of its irregularity, and to that end we would prefer to see a limiter, such as, irregular and unannounced , but not more than say once every other month. That being said, and though we are currently still on the fence deciding, Hassanisabah will most likely support this Bill before time runs out due to its Voluntary nature. However, we will not contribute to or recieve benefits from such a notion should it result in a UN presence that we percieve to be more like a constant and less like an irregular appearance"

Firstly we’d like to take this opportunity to welcome the esteemed representative from Hassanisabah to the United Nations and to thank him for his contribution to the debate. We look forward to hearing his perspective on many other issues in the future.

However, with respect we would disagree that irregular requires definition and would suggest that defining it would make inspections merely semi-unannounced thus lowering effectiveness as an oversight tool. If the resolution were to stipulate that inspections could only occur “once every other month” then that would create one month out of every two in which nations receiving funding could be susceptible to temporary corruption knowing that within that set time period they are safe from examination.

While we note the representative's concerns about a "constant" presence we would suggest that those nations which are fearful of such oversight are those that need oversight most whilst those who are endeavouring to use the funds wisely will either have no objection to, or indeed welcome, CCT inspections.

In order to maintain the same consistent standard of co-operation with the CCT we believe it a necessity that inspections can take place at any point in time.

Anravelle Kramer,
UN Ambassador,
Ice Queendom of Ithania.

The Eastern Roman Empire of Modern Byzantium will not endorse any program that is not supported with some kind of required tax. While the idea is noble, the methods of collection are impractical at best.

When I read the provisions for collection of monies, I was reminded of the Articles of Confederation, the original government document of the United States. One of its gravest weaknesses was that it did not grant Congress the ability to impose taxes or collect any money through any means other than donations by the states. Needless to say, that system did not work then, so why should it work now?

God be with you,
Pseudo-Konstantinos of Chrysopolis
EMB Ambassador to the United Nations

We believe we are correct when we say that Resolution #4 prevents the United Nations from collecting tax directly from citizens and furthermore Resolution #128 declares it an “inviolable right of nations” to determine taxation imposed on their citizens, no outside force may compel the collection of tax. Nations retain the right to voluntarily relinquish that right to international effort but not by force as you seem to suggest.

We are also quite sure that your proposed amendments would make “Healthcare Certification” contradictory to those resolutions therefore illegal.

We’re afraid that we know not of this "United States" you speak of nor can our Sentient Intelligence link-up find any information pertaining to these “Articles of Confederation”.

Anravelle Kramer,
UN Ambassador,
Ice Queendom of Ithania.

We concur with the previous speaker that a limited form of progressive taxation may be beneficial to finance this proposal...

But at the moment people are dying...

let us worry more about the saving of life and leave other exigencies when those dying at the moment have a chance to remain alive and exact their democratic rights on the issue...

the more lives we save through this - immediately, the more chance we have of promoting a long term taxation proposal - even the richest country can be overwhelmed with a plague and be decimated and become impoverished overnight - anything which could help insure them against this devastation [however remote in possibility] could pull in the resources....

If empathy won't make them pay, let them be scared...

On behalf of Greater Seattle, I have approved this excellent resolution.

I have but two questions -- who does the CCT answer to and how are its members chosen?

I have but two questions -- who does the CCT answer to and how are its members chosen?
[OOC]

Officially, the CCT, like all UN committees, springs to life fully formed without any conscious effort on the part of anyone. The UN gnomes make sure that they stick to the letter of the law. They answer to the General Assembly in the sense that their jobs can be removed via a repeal.

If you want to roleplay something entirely different (and entirely non-binding), you are welcome to do so.

On behalf of the Great Star Empire, I vote in favor of this proposal.

Most courteously,

Another thing, what if the country getting the funds doesn't want to lower their amount just because they would have to pay more? If I were that country, I would keep the CCT funds and use the healthcare money elsewhere; isn't that what we don't want? That money can be going someplace the world as a whole wouldn't want it to go to.

The Eastern Roman Empire of Modern Byzantium will not endorse any program that is not supported with some kind of required tax. While the idea is noble, the methods of collection are impractical at best.

When I read the provisions for collection of monies, I was reminded of the Articles of Confederation, the original government document of the United States. One of its gravest weaknesses was that it did not grant Congress the ability to impose taxes or collect any money through any means other than donations by the states. Needless to say, that system did not work then, so why should it work now?

God be with you,
Pseudo-Konstantinos of Chrysopolis
EMB Ambassador to the United Nations

We think the honorable representative has misunderstood the scope and intent of the resolution. The funds collected by the CCT will be "donations from willing nations and private donors". This is charitable contributing we're talking about here, not any sort of required funding. The CCT will provide a way for those people, organizations, and nations donating the funds to have confidence that their money is being spent properly -- not embezzled, wasted, or turned to some unworthy purpose.

Patrick T. Olembe
Minister for Foreign Affairs

Another thing, what if the country getting the funds doesn't want to lower their amount just because they would have to pay more? If I were that country, I would keep the CCT funds and use the healthcare money elsewhere; isn't that what we don't want? That money can be going someplace the world as a whole wouldn't want it to go to.

We thank the honorable representative for expressing his concern. We'd call his attention to the provision in the resolution that states the CCT will "Inspect or evaluate the funded services in receiving nations 6 months after the initial donation to ensure that the agreed-upon standards are being met and that the funds are being properly spent to improve heath care services". If the nation is deliberately using the CCT-provided funds to replace its own health-care spending, no more CCT money. Also notice that the CCT can continue disbursements if the nation is making a "good faith effort" to comply. This would allow the CCT to give some leeway to nations that honestly couldn't maintain their original funding levels because of natural disaster, a tanked economy, etc.

Patrick T. Olembe
Minister for Foreign Affairs

OK thanks for clearing that up for me. As of now I changed my vote.

The New Irish UN delegate would firstly wish to say that he can proudly agree to the proposal. Also the new Irish President , P. Price, agrees with this. However i am in need of some further explanation.

You say that all countries are free to donate or recieve.....
My first question to you is: Do the recieving countries have to do anything for recieveing this help?

As Africa is a perfect example.. it is being kept in a third world state because of all the debts owed to the west because of their previous "help".
new Ireland , at the moment, agrees sincerely with youre proposal however will not vote untill further explanation is recieved. For we believe that the world is already split into a big enough devide between the west and the third worl and we do not need another plan that is just for pr- purposes but ACTUALLY helps countries in need of help!

yours,
-New Ireland UN delegate and ambassador for New Ireland posted in Dublin- (our motherlands capital)
P. O'Reirden

The thing I worry about is nations who can afford the Health Care for their citizens but spend their budget on other things...like maybe gold-plated guns for their armies. That kind of budgetary planning concerns me. Using donated dollars loopholed into unneeded expenses.

Edit: I just noticed this, don't know how I missed it the first time, but:

AUTHORIZES the CCT to reduce or cancel disbursements to nations which become capable of funding their own health care activities. Receiving nations may voluntarily withdraw from this program if the contributed funds are no longer needed or wanted

So, how will the CCT know? Especially how corrupt some Government can be, I'm sure it can be hidden.

OK thanks for clearing that up for me. As of now I changed my vote.

Thank you for keeping an open mind on the issue.

Balthasar H. von Aschenbach
Prime Minister

You say that all countries are free to donate or recieve.....
My first question to you is: Do the recieving countries have to do anything for recieveing this help?

As Africa is a perfect example.. it is being kept in a third world state because of all the debts owed to the west because of their previous "help".
new Ireland , at the moment, agrees sincerely with youre proposal however will not vote untill further explanation is recieved. For we believe that the world is already split into a big enough devide between the west and the third worl and we do not need another plan that is just for pr- purposes but ACTUALLY helps countries in need of help!


Please note that the money involved consists of donations, not loans. As we see it, a donation is money freely given. To continue receiving contributions, all a nation has to do is meet the agreed-upon standards and spend the money properly, for the purpose for which the donors intended it.

Patrick T. Olembe
Minister for Foreign Affairs

So, how will the CCT know? Especially how corrupt some Government can be, I'm sure it can be hidden.Have you ever tried hiding a gold plated gun? It's shiny and reflective, not easy to hide.

I have a hunch that the reason these needy countries who would be aided by this resolution are not in the poorhouse due to the high cost of healthcare these days. A survey of these nations should be taken to review the economic freedom or lack thereof that these nations possess. I do not see how the financial aid could eventually be removed and these countries' economic troubles be at an end (natural disasters excluded). The Hero of Haarlem did not remove his finger from the hole in the dike to find that the dike had fixed itself. I believe the vast majority of countries eligible for aid under this resolution have problems running deeper than a temporary dearth of funds (i.e. economically oppressive regimes) If this is the case, I believe a solution lies somewhere outside this resolution.

-Ambassador Rentz of The Confederacy of Philtris

The thing I worry about is nations who can afford the Health Care for their citizens but spend their budget on other things...like maybe gold-plated guns for their armies. That kind of budgetary planning concerns me. Using donated dollars loopholed into unneeded expenses.

Edit: I just noticed this, don't know how I missed it the first time, but:

AUTHORIZES the CCT to reduce or cancel disbursements to nations which become capable of funding their own health care activities. Receiving nations may voluntarily withdraw from this program if the contributed funds are no longer needed or wanted

So, how will the CCT know? Especially how corrupt some Government can be, I'm sure it can be hidden.

An improving economy is hard to hide. The CCT would notice that during the inspections, donating nations would be watching too no doubt. Plus increases in trade ect wouldn't go un-noticed. I'm not an expert in economics, but imagine if a RL nation, like Kenya for example, got to the stage finanically where it could afford to pay for a health care system itself, then that wealth would show in other areas and become all to obvious to any outside observers.

Part of the CCT's job is to decide when to lower or cancel donated funds to a nation that becomes capable of handling its own health care, so they will be trained to recognise when that happens.

We have to admit we're dumbfounded. We can't see how this resolution urges socialism in any way, shape or form. Perhaps the representative would like to give the resolution another careful reading and then explain his statement.

Patrick T. Olembe
Minister for Foreign Affairs

Urges an increase in bureaucracy, sure, but socialism? Don't think so. There's a huge difference mandated "donations" and willing contributions to a fund. This proposal calls for the latter, and, thus, does not urge socialism in the least.

Respectfully,
Sheik Nadnerb bin Cluich
Cluichstani Ambassador to the UN

Well it is, after all, co-authored by that well known socialist Ausserland.


OOC: Yeah, damn that pinko bastard! *shakes a fist* ;)

[OOC]

Officially, the CCT, like all UN committees, springs to life fully formed without any conscious effort on the part of anyone. The UN gnomes make sure that they stick to the letter of the law. They answer to the General Assembly in the sense that their jobs can be removed via a repeal.

If you want to roleplay something entirely different (and entirely non-binding), you are welcome to do so.

OOC: Ah, a Gnome issue. I should have surmised that due to the lack of specifics in other laws forming UN subcommittees and task forces and such. Thanks for the reminder.

IC: Sorry. I was distracted. We support the resolu-- what? We already did? Ah. Very well then, carry on.

I have a hunch that the reason these needy countries who would be aided by this resolution are not in the poorhouse due to the high cost of healthcare these days. A survey of these nations should be taken to review the economic freedom or lack thereof that these nations possess. I do not see how the financial aid could eventually be removed and these countries' economic troubles be at an end (natural disasters excluded). The Hero of Haarlem did not remove his finger from the hole in the dike to find that the dike had fixed itself. I believe the vast majority of countries eligible for aid under this resolution have problems running deeper than a temporary dearth of funds (i.e. economically oppressive regimes) If this is the case, I believe a solution lies somewhere outside this resolution.

-Ambassador Rentz of The Confederacy of Philtris

Our new colleague from Philtris raises an interesting point. And he's quite correct. This resolution will not solve the economic problems of the receiving nations. But we'd ask the Ambassador to consider that solving economic problems isn't the intent of the resolution at all. The solution does indeed lie "somewhere outside this resolution".

What does lie inside this resolution is an attempt to allow people, organizations, and nations who donate money so that others may have better health care to do so with confidence that their money will be spent properly. We hope that with that confidence will come a greater willingness to contribute. And more people will have quality health care available to them.

We'd ask the Ambassador to consider whether that, limited as it is, is a worthy goal. If he believes it is, we suggest a vote in favor of the resolution is appropriate.

Patrick T. Olembe
Minister for Foreign Affairs

Ladies and gentlemen of the United Nations. The Conch Republic of Retired Werepenguins would like to announce their support of the resolution. Unfortunately it seems that this resolution is so boring that Flash has fallen asleep on the general assembly floor. (Well actually in his chair not on the physical floor itself.) Perhaps it is because of the playoffs in Retired Werepenguins, he does love to watch his old team play. In any event I also find the whole thing boring. So I have decided to spice up the debate a little.

http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o18/tzor/bouncefaerie111x171.gif Retired Werepenguins votes AYE!

Sincerely, Red Hot Blonde.
You think I should dress up in a nurse's outfit for the debate?

Dress up? Why dress at all?

Respectfully,
Sheik Nadnerb bin Cluich
Cluichstani Ambassador to the UN

OOC: I love that gif. :D

Have you ever tried hiding a gold plated gun? It's shiny and reflective, not easy to hide.

OOC: Oh, I don't know, Scaramanga seemed to be able to keep his golden gun hidden easily enough.:D

Ladies and gentlemen of the United Nations. The Conch Republic of Retired Werepenguins would like to announce their support of the resolution. Unfortunately it seems that this resolution is so boring that Flash has fallen asleep on the general assembly floor. (Well actually in his chair not on the physical floor itself.) Perhaps it is because of the playoffs in Retired Werepenguins, he does love to watch his old team play. In any event I also find the whole thing boring. So I have decided to spice up the debate a little.

http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o18/tzor/bouncefaerie111x171.gif Retired Werepenguins votes AYE!

Sincerely, Red Hot Blonde.
You think I should dress up in a nurse's outfit for the debate?

[The Prime Minister turns to Ambassador Ahlmann]

PM: Did that br... er... young lady vote yet?

Ambassador: Yes, sir.

PM: Good. Then, if she wants to dress up, I think you oughta get some of those gnome people to dress her up in a straight jacket and cart her off to the rubber room.

Ambassador: You really have no sense of humor at all, do you sir?

PM: Nope. Not that I ever noticed.

Ambassador: Thought so.

:p

"A straight jacket? Rubber room?" Red Hot Blonde replied overhearing the Ausserland discussion. "I'm so mad I could just ..."

Suddenly, what little ribbon that was passing for a garment drops to the floor. It was only then that people realized that instead of a lady Godiva there was a 4' tall emperor penguin standing as obnoxiously stubborn as ever. The penguin walked past the Ausserland delegation beak raised high in what appeared to be a diplomatic snub if ever a penguin could give a diplomatic snub. Two smaller penguins (adelie penguins to be precise) follow Red Hot out the door.

While the citizens of my nation have more of a need for a mechanic then a doctor, we do approve of helping biological life forms improve their general health and vote yes, as well as submitting a bill to the counsel for a donation.

Lore the Second.

[The Prime Minister wakes groggily from one of his many, many naps]

PM: Did I just see Sister Frigidia walk by here?

Ahlmann [sighing]: No, sir. She's at our embassy in the Antarctic Oasis.

PM: Oh. Well, that's a relief.

Gallantaria sees the good intention and the work done for this resolution, nevertheless, it is creating unecessary bureaucracy. It is unlikely that any UN-lead bureaucracy would be better at judging the medical situation of a country than the local authorities.

Therefore, Gallantaria will abstain.

Gallantaria sees the good intention and the work done for this resolution, nevertheless, it is creating unecessary bureaucracy. It is unlikely that any UN-lead bureaucracy would be better at judging the medical situation of a country than the local authorities.

Therefore, Gallantaria will abstain.

The representative is correct about the relative abilities of local authorities and the CCT. But he misses the whole point of the resolution. The point is to have a body that will help ensure that donations are properly spent -- not siphoned off into building palaces for the "local authorities", diverted into beefing up the country's nuclear arsenal, paying for three-month-long vacations for corrupt agency managers, or sent down the drain by gross incompetence. If the local authorities are fattening their bank accounts with embezzled donations, their ability to judge the medical situation isn't going to help things much, is it?

Balthasar H. von Aschenbach
Prime Minister

Well, let me put it that way: If I want to donate money to someone, I will assure myself about what happens with the money I gave. Money donated for development purposes always also have the side effect of improving the own relatonships to others, it is therefore always checked by the national authorities. I think it is an illusion to think that countries will donate money to an UN-institution without receiving the thanks from the country that benefits from this donation. But as I can see the good intention behind this resolution, I will not vote against. It seems it will pass anyway...

Flash Blonde wakes up from his long sleep and asks his two remaining Adelie Penguin assistants what happened since he fell asleep. They apparently squawk something to him.

“You don’t say. He said what?”

“That’s silly, a straight jacket wouldn’t work. She could just turn into a penguin and …”

“Oh she gave a demonstration of that in front of him? And I slept through it?”

“You’re right, this is the most boring debate I’ve ever slept through.”

Bala, Cluichstan's deputy ambassador to the UN and vice president of marketing and public relations for Cluichstani Private Entertainment Services Ltd. (http://z8.invisionfree.com/Antarctic_Paradise/index.php?showtopic=23), decides to try alleviating the boredom with a performance for the representatives.

http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/9276/bala8if.jpg

Sen. Sulla looks up from his very important task of hobnailling his liver with some Rare Breed(TM), and says,

Ever since I have been a part of this festering snakepit some lovingly call the UN, I have taken pride in voting against almost every Social Justice resolution that has come up for vote. I also admit that usually I do it for the pettiest of reasons, or general principles no matter how well the resolution was written, or how much good it would do for the downtrodden masses. However today I must break with tradition. According to The Daily Flatulence, one of The 'Burgh's leading papers, the leadership of my favorite charity, The Society for the Promotion of Health And Welfare of Red-Headed Dames with Loose and Negotiable Virtue, has been embezzling millions of Greenbacks. That is an outrage of international proportions. So today I vote for this piece of legislation. Now I'm back to more important matters.

Sen. Sulla begins to drink again.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f235/HoratioSulla/dave-allen.jpg

This is a wonderfully written piece of legislation. Our regional delegate has voted in favour.

Lillith Cresil
UN Observer
The Dominion of Lady Deathstrike

Well, let me put it that way: If I want to donate money to someone, I will assure myself about what happens with the money I gave.

And private individuals and organizations in your nation are going to be able to reliably check out potential recipients in other countries, are they? They're able to make sure the money is properly spent as well as an international organization conducting on-site inspections? Sorry, we can't buy that.

Money donated for development purposes always also have the side effect of improving the own relatonships to others, it is therefore always checked by the national authorities. I think it is an illusion to think that countries will donate money to an UN-institution without receiving the thanks from the country that benefits from this donation. But as I can see the good intention behind this resolution, I will not vote against. It seems it will pass anyway...

Where in the resolution does it say that recipients won't be notified of the identity of the donors? It seems that would be a logical and obvious part of the operation.

If you want to keep on having your national authorities check out recipients, go right ahead and spend your nation's money doing it. The CCT will provide a service. You're under no obligation to use it.

Balthasar H. von Aschenbach
Prime Minister

I must say I oppose this measure more so than any other. The healthcare of a person is nobody's business but thier own. If anything, national healthcare is a national concern, not an international one. My great people will not fall for such lies that this socialist piece of literature propagates. I do not want my country destroyed by such legislation.
Reject it now!

Destroy your country? What are you rambling on about? Have you actually read the resolution?

Bah! This is going to pass, so it's not worth arguing at this point.

Lillith Cresil
UN Observer
The Dominion of Lady Deathstrike

I must say I oppose this measure more so than any other. The healthcare of a person is nobody's business but thier own. If anything, national healthcare is a national concern, not an international one. My great people will not fall for such lies that this socialist piece of literature propagates. I do not want my country destroyed by such legislation.
Reject it now!

You fail at the definition of "socialism."

Respectfully,
Sheik Nadnerb bin Cluich
Cluichstani Ambassador to the UN

I must say I oppose this measure more so than any other. The healthcare of a person is nobody's business but thier own. If anything, national healthcare is a national concern, not an international one. My great people will not fall for such lies that this socialist piece of literature propagates. I do not want my country destroyed by such legislation.
Reject it now!

If we'd wanted this resolution to push socialism, It would be mandating universal healthcare and making each nation pay for it themselves, not outlining a voluntary international aid program that works within whatever type of healthcare system that nation already has in place.

I'm getting so frustrated with people who are knee jerk screaming socialism, that if one more person comes out with that sort of misread of the resolution, I may go ahead and do a proposal that forces universal healthcare. At least with that one, your objections would be fact, not fiction.

Just out of curiousity right if this passes and I am a UN nation I will be entitled to claim money for my healthcare trust from other nations right?

so if I did in theory what would stop my nation from simply spending some other countrys money on whatever I liked would I be forced to pay it back or kicked out of the UN cos to me it looks like theres nothing to stop nations from doing that.

Just out of curiousity right if this passes and I am a UN nation I will be entitled to claim money for my healthcare trust from other nations right?

so if I did in theory what would stop my nation from simply spending some other countrys money on whatever I liked would I be forced to pay it back or kicked out of the UN cos to me it looks like theres nothing to stop nations from doing that.

You need to read the resolution carefully. It collects and distributes donations, freely given, to assist those nations whom need it with building/running a healthcare system.

The main thrust of it however, is to put measures in place, such as irregular inspections and negotiated agreements to greatly reduce, or even eliminate, the possibility of corruption and abuse of the money. The CCT does has the authority to reduce or stop funding to any receiving nations that do not honour their agreements. You won't be forced to give back the money, you just won't get anymore if your government does the wrong thing. You also won't be kicked out of the UN because no resolution can have the power to do that under the UN proposal rules.

Just out of curiousity right if this passes and I am a UN nation I will be entitled to claim money for my healthcare trust from other nations right?

so if I did in theory what would stop my nation from simply spending some other countrys money on whatever I liked would I be forced to pay it back or kicked out of the UN cos to me it looks like theres nothing to stop nations from doing that.

Sorry, but this resolution doesn't entitle anybody to anything. As to your second question, please take the time to read the resolution carefully. Once you've done that, if you still have questions or concerns, we'll be happy to try to give you an answer.

Lorelei M. Ahlmann
Ambassador-at-Large

This is not socialism, its paternalism. Where does the UN get off inspecting countries concerning healthcare delivery? Basically you are trying to buy a country's sovereignty. This fund will see no Bubs contributed.

From Representative Borat Sogadiev of Gilabad,

Hallaaao!! It is me again Borat Sogadiev!!! This proposal is a very bad! I would suppose that you wouldn't know the reason that the country is poor in the first place?!? It's because they are ridden with corruption and warefare, and donations would simply be siezed, either militarily or peacefully, by the local militias and used to kill innocent people. Those funds will only go to arm the local militias with more weapons, when a nation like...well MINE for example could be using those funds to be making our own wepa....hahem... I mean healthcare to be helping the peaceful citizens of Gilabad. I fear that rogue nations will only use this as an opportunity to grab more money for arms and what have you. Thus concluding my point..... This proposal is very bad!!!

-Rep. Borat Sogadiev

This is not socialism, its paternalism.

No, it's providing a service that nations can make their own decisions about participating in.

Where does the UN get off inspecting countries concerning healthcare delivery?

Comes down to this.... You want the money? You get inspected. You don't want to be inspected? Don't take the money. Completely up to your nation.

Basically you are trying to buy a country's sovereignty.

Couldn't help wondering when somebody was going to start slinging around the s-word. There is no intrusion whatever on national sovereignty, since nations retain the complete and unfettered right to decide whether or not to participate in the program. Period.

This fund will see no Bubs contributed.

OK. We'll do our very best to manage without them. See? It was completely up to you.

Balthasar H. von Aschenbach
Prime Minister

From Representative Borat Sogadiev of Gilabad,

Hallaaao!! It is me again Borat Sogadiev!!! This proposal is a very bad! I would suppose that you wouldn't know the reason that the country is poor in the first place?!? It's because they are ridden with corruption and warefare, and donations would simply be siezed, either militarily or peacefully, by the local militias and used to kill innocent people. Those funds will only go to arm the local militias with more weapons, when a nation like...well MINE for example could be using those funds to be making our own wepa....hahem... I mean healthcare to be helping the peaceful citizens of Gilabad. I fear that rogue nations will only use this as an opportunity to grab more money for arms and what have you. Thus concluding my point..... This proposal is very bad!!!

-Rep. Borat Sogadiev

We're glad Rep. Sogadiev chose to participate in the debate, even though he has his head up... er... Strike that last part. His remarks always liven up our day -- that is, if it's a really, really dull day. We'll make a note of his remarks so we can suggest the CCT add Gilabad to its "Certify Only After Hell Freezes Over" list.

Balthasar H. von Aschenbach
Prime Minister

:D

This is not socialism, its paternalism. Where does the UN get off inspecting countries concerning healthcare delivery? Basically you are trying to buy a country's sovereignty. This fund will see no Bubs contributed.

Altanar will be more than happy to contribute solaris to make up for the lack of "Bubs" (whatever those are). Because, unlike you, our delegation actually read the resolution.

- Jaris Krytellin, Ambassador

I'm getting so frustrated with people who are knee jerk screaming socialism, that if one more person comes out with that sort of misread of the resolution, I may go ahead and do a proposal that forces universal healthcare. At least with that one, your objections would be fact, not fiction.

*Sen. Sulla screams in terror and dives under his desk, while drawing his Colt 1911a*

"Socialism!!!!! Where???????????"

*peeks out from under desk, and sees it was a false alarm. So he holsters his Colt, and sits back down, and adresses the representative from Waterana*

"Sorry about that. My good lady, I must ask for you to please warn me before you make a threat like that. My nerves aren't what they used to be."

*adresses the naysayers in the festering snakep...err the debate hall*

"So the resolutions a bit fluffy. Its also not mandated for one to get involved with the program, so get over it!"

*resumes drinking*

*Sen. Sulla screams in terror and dives under his desk, while drawing his Colt 1911a*

"Socialism!!!!! Where???????????"

*peeks out from under desk, and sees it was a false alarm. So he holsters his Colt, and sits back down, and adresses the representative from Waterana*

"Sorry about that. My good lady, I must ask for you to please warn me before you make a threat like that. My nerves aren't what they used to be."

*adresses the naysayers in the festering snakep...err the debate hall*

"So the resolutions a bit fluffy. Its also not mandated for one to get involved with the program, so get over it!"

*resumes drinking*

Sorry about that, it was just the frustration talking, though I do very much like the idea of universal health care. May keep that idea on the back burner for a possible revisitation sometime in the future :p.

The resolution has passed 8,209 votes to 2,877. Thank you to everyone who supported it over the year or so it has grown from an idea, to the disabled care proposal, to the revamped healthcare effort, and on through the process of getting it to the floor and passed. Especially Ausserland who converted my original random scribblings into a polished document and never gave up hope we'd get it passed, someday.

*wanders off humming the theme song from Star Trek Enterprise*

Congrats to the author and co-author. Well written effort, and happy to see it pass.

The LAE's NSUN team would like to congrats the authors for the passage of this usefull resolution.

We’d also like to congratulate the authors of this wonderfully crafted piece of legislation. We are truly pleased to see such a defining example of work yielding result, the legislative efforts dedicated to this resolution and its flawlessness have given a very deserved mark in UN history to the delegations from Waterana and Ausserland.

Anravelle Kramer,
UN Ambassador,
Ice Queendom of Ithania.

OOC: *clicks exit on the window humming the Stargate tune* I’d like none of your egalitarian-ness thank you very much. Good old hegemonic monopoly of technology and power for me.:p

i comply

i comply

We know. You don't need to tell us every time.

I think we're seeing the start of a beautiful new tradition. Every time a proposal passes, PICKER comes out of his hole. If he sees and is scared by his shadow, he won't comply and we'll have a contentious, antagonistic debate.

If he isn't scared by his shadow and complies, then we'll have another peaceful debate.

Like with groundhogs, only with morons.

If he isn't scared by his shadow and complies, then we'll have another peaceful debate.



Anyone got a flashlight? I could use a good heated debate.

I like the "PICKER - i comply" tradition.

Oh and, congratulations to Waterana and Ausserland! We stand in solidarity with you, our Comrades.

Aüþgæþ Spøtyiú
Ambassador

Well, of course we knew all along that Waterana and Ausserland were fellow-travellers -- we have a system of secret signals by which we recognise
each other -- but surely it was obvious in their names?

I mean, Waterana. See, trying to stop socialism is like cutting water with a knife; there are so many of us, we flow around and the surface is unmarred.

And Ausserland; well, if Babelfish tells true and "ausser" means "except" in German, then are socialists not the exception to the capitalist mantra of greed, greed, greed?

Or if it comes from the base word for "outside", then is not the socialist always the Outsider, the shadowy Other who haunts the dreams of the tyrants?

(I just knew that Symbolism 101 course would come in handy some day.)

[/sarcasm]And congratulations to both on a compassionate and practical resolution.

Many thanks to all those who supported and voted for this resolution. And an extra measure of thanks to those who did yeoman service in arguing for the resolution in regional forums.

By Order of His Royal Highness, the Prince of Ausserland:

Balthasar H. von Aschenbach
Prime Minister

i comply

Sigged! :D

i complySigged! :D

Now that. That's funny.

Now that. That's funny.

OOC: I figured it might save him the trouble of posting it everytime something passed. ;)