NationStates Jolt Archive

Optischer

OOC: As this is a game mechanics thingie it should be brought up in the technical forum.

I'm not sure what you mean. If you eventually want to submit your ideas in the form of a proposal then I'd advise against it. Anything that changes how the UN works would require a change in game mechanics. Your proposal would be deleted by the mods.

It doesn't work that way, Sparky.

Max wrote the game, and he's asked us to look after it for him. If you have severe problems with the way it plays, write and host your own game. That's the way democracy works on the internet.

Still, the idea of UN diplomats being elected by their people seems good...but only for democratic nations. Non-democratic nations would not like people electing their diplomats. It also sounds silly:

VOTE FOR TOMMY FOR DIPLOMAT OF [INSERT HUGE NAME OF NATION]!

While it can't be done by a resolution, this can be done by RPing of any nations who want that to occur.

However, I won't do that. My nation isn't a democracy.

concidering that the UN has no influence over non-un nations, i see no point to this. in actual fact, if this was changed, we could see abuse of it in that people will create 100s of puppets in order to boost their endorsments/votes, thus becomming regional delegate

Which would also wreck havoc on the invade/defend aspect of the game.

well maybe UN delegates should be eliminated?
Just about every thread you have posted involves radical dismemberment of the game. Given that our 100,000+ nations seem to getting along just fine, why should we suddenly decide that everything is wrong?

This is your third day here. Give it a rest until you've learned a little more about the game.

I may be radical, but without radicalism, the real world would be different, increased crime, global epidemics, total armageddon, etc.
It may be my 3rd day but I just want to make the world a place where countries can do what they want, within reason, and not be challenged by countries it will not affect.
SO listen to what I've got to say, because little david beat big Goliath.

What you don't realize (since you've only been here 3 days) is that we've heard EVERY ONE of your arguments hundreds of times before. We get tired of posting the same old answers about balance, legality, and game mechanics.

Post all you want. But if you want to actually MAKE an impression, you'll spend more time reading the history of this place, and less time posting ideas that are guaranteed to get you a permanent 'ignore' from long-time readers.

What you don't realize (since you've only been here 3 days) is that we've heard EVERY ONE of your arguments hundreds of times before. We get tired of posting the same old answers about balance, legality, and game mechanics.

Post all you want. But if you want to actually MAKE an impression, you'll spend more time reading the history of this place, and less time posting ideas that are guaranteed to get you a permanent 'ignore' from long-time readers.

clap clap you are abosolutely right

I spend whatever time I can reading all that has come and gone, and still I don't change my position unless I have my fat wrong. I may be ignored and let people ignore me, but at least, unlike some, express my ideas, and let all of my critics criticize. It may be against tech rules? I may be placing myself on the execution line, but I retain my right of free speech to want no more UN only voting for delegates. At least post constructive criticism, and I will openly welcome oppositions.
Optischer

clap clap you are abosolutely right
Is Frisbeteeria really right?
Have you heard every one of my arguments?
I have only just peeled of the wrapper of my arguments.
I will try to show my position on any proposal publicy.
I will freely do what I think is right.
Wait until you have heard all of my arguments before moaning about them.
Unless of course, you don't want to show your radical side?
The never ending argumentative state of Optischer

You might want to bear in mind that little line under Fris's name. He's no humble Cabbage Patch Girl. He is a Game Mod. He is speaking authoritatively: your suggestions ARE games mechanics violations. Believe me, we've all get a thousand ideas for how we could change the UN to be better. We don't discuss them because it's pointless: they're not going to be adopted, so why bother? I suggest you move on, and concentrate on your repeal effort.

Is Frisbeteeria really right?Yes.
Have you heard every one of my arguments?All of them that you've used so far.
I have only just peeled of the wrapper of my arguments.There's a wastbasket in the corner for that wrapper.:D
I will try to show my position on any proposal publicy.That's what the rest of us do.
I will freely do what I think is right.AS long as it doesn't violate the rules I have no problem with that.
Wait until you have heard all of my arguments before moaning about them.You keep posting them and we'll keep "moaning about them.
Unless of course, you don't want to show your radical side?You want to see my radical side, I give you the UN Resplution I authored.
http://bak42.notworksafe.com/images/NationStates/UNCards/resolutionauthorcard.jpg (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/page=UN_past_resolutions/start=108)

Bob Flibble
UN Representative

That wastebasket is where I plan to put your childish response. If you cannot contain your childish attitude, at least wire it to me, before I display your ignorance to the public?!?!:D
For crying out loud, it was a joke. Do you think that we're all devoid of a sense of humor here in the UN?

No I don't think you haven't got a sense of humour, I just think the majority have no brain, with non-contsructive criticism and throwing themselves in the path of the bullet, just to protect some useless old resolution.
That's what I think you haven't got!
"Protect some useless old resolution" what resolution are you talking about? i was under the impression that this thread was about your idea to alter the mechanics of the game to allow nations that are not UN members a say in who their regional delegate is. An idea, which I can say with a fair amount of certanity, will not be implemented.

No I don't think you haven't got a sense of humour, I just think the majority have no brain, with non-contsructive criticism and throwing themselves in the path of the bullet, just to protect some useless old resolution.
That's what I think you haven't got!

I can see you've been making a lot of friends round here.

May the blessings of our otters be upon you.

Leonard Otterby
Ambassador for the Republic of Compadria to the U.N.

lets see, coming up with proposals that blatantly violate the rules... abusing the mods when they remind you of the rules... draging up old arguments over and over.... kinda makes me wonder why you joined the NSUN, because the way you are going, you will be quickly ejected.

Ok - here's some rules of the game that explain why this is a ridiculous idea:

1) You can have as many nations as you want and can play them in any fashion or manner you want.
2) Only ONE of those nations is allowed in the UN so that YOU can't attempt to do any ballot stuffing.
3) That nation has the option of endorsing any number of other UN members in his region for the position of UN delegate. If the UN delegate and this person agree on all resolutions, it will act as a second vote for the member. If not, well.....
4) UN resolutions have a mandatory and INSTANT effect upon other UN members, but have no direct effect upon non-members, unless the non-members choose to follow them AFTER they are passed.

Considering this, think these points through:
1) If you are not an American citizen, do you get to vote in the American elections? No! Why? Because the policies held by the American government are to be implemented for the American people, not the Canadian, British or Iraqi people. Certainly, those policies might affect those other people, but it is not MADE FOR them.
2) Are you allowed to have as many votes as you want? Why? Because we want a fairness in elections. If you want to suggest that delegates shouldn't have the bonus votes from their endorsements, I'd actually be willing to listen to your arguments (if I ever bothered to visit the technical thread). However, there is a definate concern of ballot stuffing and the normal policy to prevent that is ejection of all nations who attempted to "ballot stuff" the UN.
3) Multiple nations is really nice for those of us who love the RP aspect of the game. We can roleplay several different styles of nations and then see the advantages and disadvantages of each and have a better understanding of the world around us.
4) This point about multiple nations also allows you to do what many other long-time members do and have a puppet nation that's in the UN voting for you and endorsing a delegate for you.

Is Frisbeteeria really right?Yes. He's a mod.Have you heard every one of my arguments?Probably. I've not heard a new arguement in a very long time, so probably.I have only just peeled of the wrapper of my arguments.See above answer - I doubt you'll have anything new to say.Wait until you have heard all of my arguments before moaning about them.Honestly, you are not suprising anyone with anything new yet.The never ending argumentative state of OptischerAhhhh, so you are not here to be useful, you are here to troll. I understand now.
http://img435.imageshack.us/img435/5301/crad0iy.png

UN delegates represent the region (duh).
and therefor vote for those who are UN members (and sometimes those who aren't who feel they want a say).

Some of the members in my region are too involved in other activities to read through every resolution and feel that they are confident that I am capable of making a decision on their behalf to choose an appropriate decision for our vote. I always encourage in my region pm (or otherwise) conversation on current topics and I have been persuaded in the past to vote for what the region believes as opposed to what I beleive.

This example is only of my region, yet I beleive that most regions operate on a similar basis, and I know that many others use a voting mechanism.

Allowing UN delegates encourages those who are committed to the game to get involved on a deeper level, whilst leaving those who want a more superficial role to vote for those they trust to represent them.

It's a system that works well, not to mention the motive for those non-delegates to strive for delegate status!

Well, I think I've blabbed enough for this thread, bring on the discussion!

Optischer sounds good, but maybe some mods should give their positions.
Quadramos
Order of OP

Sorry but this is a terrible idea. It just wouldn't pass and to be honest doesn't make much sense anyway.

Sorry why should non UN nations, thus including puppets, be allowed to vote for UN delegates? UN nations(thus the ones being affected) can vote for a delegate and place thier own votes on UN stuff so why change that?

Too open to puppets altering the vote outcomes and breaking down a working system for one that I am unsure of, even if this was up for voting, I would be unable to do anything but vote no

Sun Loyalds, Grand Duke of of Manillenga province

Alright. I've read though this thread a few times over the past few days and from the perspective of a player who has been here for one year and 2 months, i myself have a few comments to make.


We have heard the whole "disband the deligate system" more than a dozen times. Your idea is no different from any of the others that were shot down before you ever found this game.
Non UN nations mostly don't give a rats ass about the UN, so why would they want to vote for the UN deligates to their region?
Non-UN nations are not affected by UN Resolutions. Thus is how the Game Mechanics are made and those will not be changed at all. No matter how much you moan and complain.
Most of your arguments are one liners are there is no "meat" behind your arguments.
UN Deligates represent the UNITED NATONS MEMBERSHIP within their region, not the Non-UN Nations.


Thank you very much for your time.

Optischer sounds good, but maybe some mods should give their positions.
Quadramos
Order of OP

Um - perhaps you failed to notice, but Frisbeeteria, one of the lead UN mods, has made his position well known.

Non UN nations mostly don't give a rats ass about the UN, so why would they want to vote for the UN deligates to their region?

you forgot to add "and quite a few absolutly hate the UN and would like to blow it to pieces". dont laugh, coz its true, its damn true