NationStates Jolt Archive

I'm relatively new to the UN. Is there such a thing as a proposed resolution NOT passing, or do most of you mindless drones simply vote 'yes' on everything that crosses your desk?

Speaking as the author of a failed resolution, I can say quite confidently that UN members do sometimes click on "no." Yet at the same time I do consider some UN decisions mindless: por ejemple #122 Promotion of Solar Panels (repealed 10 days later), #4 DVD region removal and (maybe this is just me) #106 Protection of Dolphins Act. The repeals of the former two demonstrate that the UN is capable of reconsidering its decisions, even if such decisions never should have been made in the first place. :p

Many resolutions have failed, but the game doesn't record them. Players have tried to record them on NSwiki at http://ns.goobergunch.net/wiki/index.php/Category:Failed_Resolutions , but this project was started when the game had been online for quite a long time, so some from the beginning of time may be missing.

I'm relatively new to the UN. do most of you mindless drones simply vote 'yes' on everything that crosses your desk?
You're also new enough to the game that you don't realize that this forum is anything BUT mindless. If we could get 20% of the voting members to visit this forum once a week, I think we'd have an entirely different UN. Most of the really stupid resolutions were vehemently opposed here, but a few of them passed despite reasoned and intelligent rebuttal.

Yes, there are 'mindless drones' in the game, but perhaps you should take a moment to look around before swinging that big "let's insult EVERYONE" stick about.

~ Frisbeeteria ~
NationStates Game Moderator
The One-Stop Rules Shop (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=416023)

I think a big reason that most resolutions pass is that in order to even be voted on a resolution has to get 150 odd approvals, which is a huge feat in itself.

I think the basic reason is that there seem to be a lot of stupid people out there. People who think that dolphins are more important than standardising world diplomatic protocols.

As the author of defining diplomatic immunity, I'm still pissed. Especially as it failed to pass by the smallest majority ever!(Votes For: 7,353; Votes Against: 7,998)

But DDI is being resurrected, don't you worry!

As the author of defining diplomatic immunity, I'm still pissed. Especially as it failed to pass by the smallest majority ever!(Votes For: 7,353; Votes Against: 7,998)Not the smallest margin anymore, I'm afraid. The Transgender Equality Act failed by just 309 votes (all of those votes, incidentally, belonging to the West Pacific).

You're also new enough to the game that you don't realize that this forum is anything BUT mindless. If we could get 20% of the voting members to visit this forum once a week, I think we'd have an entirely different UN. Most of the really stupid resolutions were vehemently opposed here, but a few of them passed despite reasoned and intelligent rebuttal.

So you guys aren't all just snorting lines of coke and coming up with ridiculous resolutions that you just repeal the next week, then? Alright, I can accept that. I completely thought this place had gone to hell in a hand basket, but I haven't hung out on the UN boards in ages, maybe its time I helped to form a proposal that might actually mean something to the international community.

You know, after we're done reinstating that DVD thing. :p

dare someone to propose heterosexuality be outlawed, then see how many vote for.

It won't get approved by the delegates in the first place.

I think the basic reason is that there seem to be a lot of stupid people out there. People who think that dolphins are more important than standardising world diplomatic protocols.From our perspective, ending the Human-Dolphin War was a necessary prerequisite to diplomacy.

We don't generally spend a great deal of time exchanging diplomatic niceties with a species that is trying to kill us.

First, there are a number of things to consider. I don't think the "mindless" drones come to the forum. I base this on the current resolution before the UN which seems to have a majrity of yea votes, but in the forum the majority of the posts are of the "we vote no" kind.

Solar panels doesn't constitute an example of a nay vote, rather of two consecutive yea votes, spaced 10 days apart, one for passage, and the other for repeal. If that doesn't put the Q.E.D. on the point of mindless deligates who will vote yea for anything, I don't know what will.

As for the deligates who come to the forum, I do not consider them mindless. I question their sanity, but not their minds. :p

There is a fundamental flaw in the NSUN, only no one wants to freely admit it. You see, technically NationStates doesn't exist. I don't mean that this is just a simulation, (although it is just that) but that there is no solid definition of the Nation States universe. Everyone thinks Nation States is something slightly different than everyone else. When it comes to issues that tends not to be a problem, people role play what they preceive to be the Nation States Universe. Different people also gravitate to dfferent areas of the message boards.

The NSUN is different. Here we all get together even though we practically live on different universes. It's not enough to simply not make real world references, you will get in trouble for making real world assumptions, because not everyone will assume those assumptions. Thus there really is no issue that can be properly presented before the NSUN because someone will object to it as an issue in the first place.

It wasn't always this way. The original resolutions had plenty of real world assumptions and also real world examples. Most of them have been crossed out. But today every resolution will find someone strongly objecting to it on the message boards.

Fortunately we have those mindless drones who never read the message boards. Or was that unfortunately.

First, there are a number of things to consider. I don't think the "mindless" drones come to the forum. I base this on the current resolution before the UN which seems to have a majrity of yea votes, but in the forum the majority of the posts are of the "we vote no" kind.

Solar panels doesn't constitute an example of a nay vote, rather of two consecutive yea votes, spaced 10 days apart, one for passage, and the other for repeal. If that doesn't put the Q.E.D. on the point of mindless deligates who will vote yea for anything, I don't know what will.

As for the deligates who come to the forum, I do not consider them mindless. I question their sanity, but not their minds. :p

There is a fundamental flaw in the NSUN, only no one wants to freely admit it. You see, technically NationStates doesn't exist. I don't mean that this is just a simulation, (although it is just that) but that there is no solid definition of the Nation States universe. Everyone thinks Nation States is something slightly different than everyone else. When it comes to issues that tends not to be a problem, people role play what they preceive to be the Nation States Universe. Different people also gravitate to dfferent areas of the message boards.

The NSUN is different. Here we all get together even though we practically live on different universes. It's not enough to simply not make real world references, you will get in trouble for making real world assumptions, because not everyone will assume those assumptions. Thus there really is no issue that can be properly presented before the NSUN because someone will object to it as an issue in the first place.

It wasn't always this way. The original resolutions had plenty of real world assumptions and also real world examples. Most of them have been crossed out. But today every resolution will find someone strongly objecting to it on the message boards.

Fortunately we have those mindless drones who never read the message boards. Or was that unfortunately.

I agree with you. It seems that they also submit resolutions that are badly written with a lot of typos. Not to say that everyone that doesn't come to the forum is not a good writer, but most of them are. I have be sending out telegrams to uthors of propsoals that look good bust are not well-written and are telling to to come to the forum so that they can get feedback so they they revise their proposals.

dare someone to propose heterosexuality be outlawed, then see how many vote for.

I tried to propose a resolution that forced people to hit seals over the head with shovels. It got a lot of support, but the Mods deleted it

I think most delegates give at least token consideration to their approvals. I believe WZ Forums approves every proposal that goes up, but whether that's because of an ideology that says the full U.N. should decide on things, a compulsion to legislate, or something else is outside my knowledge.

I still feel there is a good deal of snobbishness in prevailing attitudes to UN voters. Not everyone has the time to read through what are usually extensive debates. Furthermore, a good deal of off-site debating often happens: regional members discuss resolutions on their forums, sometimes considering the effects of resolutions on their individual regions, sometimes simply finding easier to debate in smaller settings.

Yes, it would be nice if more people contributed to UN debate. I hardly ever do - I got stuck into the repeal of PoDA, but haven't had so much time of late - but I do try to keep abreast of the major issues in the UN. Not everyone in my region can, however. I don't think any less of them for this.

There are some bloody stupid resolutions that get passed. Very often, these aren't just carried by the weight of 'drones', but rather backed up by - to my mind - equally bloody stupid debate. I don't think we should really get too snotty about people who don't come on the forums. We have no way of knowing how reasoned or well-founded their support or objection is and, without that, it seems at leats misguided and possibly quite arrogant to be too judgemental about it.

I think most delegates give at least token consideration to their approvals. I believe WZ Forums approves every proposal that goes up, but whether that's because of an ideology that says the full U.N. should decide on things, a compulsion to legislate, or something else is outside my knowledge.
Believe me, we've given up trying to figure out WZ Forums motives. :D

Bob Flibble
UN Representative

dare someone to propose heterosexuality be outlawed, then see how many vote for.

I tried to propose a resolution that forced people to hit seals over the head with shovels. It got a lot of support, but the Mods deleted it
I daresay that outlawing heterosexuality is probably a bit LESS cruel than enforcing seal-killings :rolleyes:

I'd be all over that hetero proposal, or maybe even talk our region's delegate (Diacritical Souls) into it, as we live together and all....but neither of us seem to have any time on our hands.

Speaking of, better get to bed, I'm up again in 5.25 hours....

If somebody picks up on that, though, TG me or Diacritical Souls.