Do we have to obey UN resolutions???
With regards to UN resolutions, how are they enforced?
Im mean Im thinking about joining the UN, yet my nations political system and laws go against EVERY UN resolution that I have seen passed.
My nation, Vorana, is a one party neo-fascist state.
Democracy does NOT exist in my nation.
The following are policies my nation has that go against the UN resolutions:
*Homosexuality is illegal and gays are executed.
*Pornography and prostitution are illegal and is again punishable by death.
*Political parties, trade unions, community groups, NGOs are all illegal and people in my nation who join/support them are executed.
*There is NO minimum wage, worker protection or health and safety standards in the workplace.
*There is NO free healthcare system, NO free education, NO welfare state/umeployment benfits and ALL industry and serives are run by the private sector for a profit.
*ALL drugs (not including cigs and alcohol) are illegal and people who sell them or use them are executed.
*There is NO free media or legal system.
*My nation has chemical and biological weapons and is lokking to build nuclear weapons in the future. My nation will use WMDs on civilians a lot!
*My nation OPPOSES and REJECTS ALL so-called envrionmental protection policies as they kill the free market system.
Could my nation join the UN as a sort of rogue member that does NOT abide by the UN resolutions that I do not like?
Can I ignore the UN resolutions that I do not like?
If this is not possible, then can you tell me how the UN actually enforces the UN resolutions on it's member states???
Texan Hotrodders
10-09-2005, 19:09
Can I ignore the UN resolutions that I do not like?
If this is not possible, then can you tell me how the UN actually enforces the UN resolutions on it's member states???
OOC:
Your question is answered in the Great Big Consolidated United Nations Sticky (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=412468), but the short answer is:
Every passed resolution affects your nation's stats via the game engine.
You can roleplay complete non-compliance, though it's considered bad form.
You can roleplay using dirty legal tricks to get around UN resolutions, which is considered more acceptable.
You can answer daily issues in a way that contradicts UN resolutions.
Since I can still pass proposel choices "Continuing" to ban prostitution, I assume not only have I been ignoring the U.N., but can continue to do so. So it does seem like the U.N. doesn't enforce much...
OOC:
Your question is answered in the [url=http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=412468]
You can roleplay complete non-compliance, though it's considered bad form.
Can you indeed roleplay non-compliance? I seem to recall that resolutions are always enforced by the U.N. gnomes and therefore unsurpassable except by the aforementioned dirty tricks.
Texan Hotrodders
10-09-2005, 22:08
Can you indeed roleplay non-compliance? I seem to recall that resolutions are always enforced by the U.N. gnomes and therefore unsurpassable except by the aforementioned dirty tricks.
Sure. Mods don't police roleplay except for the usual TOS violations. I've seen several instances of roleplayed non-compliance, including Sophista's infamous defiance of the Law of the Sea. People don't like it because they think it's godmoding, but the Mods won't punish you for it.
Forgottenlands
10-09-2005, 22:28
The mods don't care if you godmod, but players that RP with you may care - depending on the manner used to godmod. It arbitrarily claim that you're doing something as an aside is frowned upon in terms of godmodding (often because it shows rather that you aren't paying attention to resolutions than anything). If you are outright stating you refuse to comply, you may have an outcry, but it won't be dismissed as godmodding
Neo-Anarchists
10-09-2005, 22:29
Since I can still pass proposel choices "Continuing" to ban prostitution, I assume not only have I been ignoring the U.N., but can continue to do so. So it does seem like the U.N. doesn't enforce much...
OOC:
THis is because the UN resolutions do not affect youyr issue choices, as that isn't how the game is programmed. However, all UN resolutions affect your nation as they come into law, no matter what you choose for daily issues.
Sure. Mods don't police roleplay except for the usual TOS violations. I've seen several instances of roleplayed non-compliance, including Sophista's infamous defiance of the Law of the Sea. People don't like it because they think it's godmoding, but the Mods won't punish you for it.
Ah. So it's still technically illegal, but it's possible to roleplay it because there isn't enforcement on such a small issue. On the other hand, I'd say that saying you defy a resolution that is automatically enforced doesn't necessarily make it true - Gnomes, how do I love thee? Let me count the ways....
Texan Hotrodders
11-09-2005, 07:20
The mods don't care if you godmod, but players that RP with you may care - depending on the manner used to godmod. It arbitrarily claim that you're doing something as an aside is frowned upon in terms of godmodding (often because it shows rather that you aren't paying attention to resolutions than anything). If you are outright stating you refuse to comply, you may have an outcry, but it won't be dismissed as godmodding
It will be dismissed as such by me. I'm conservative like that. :p
GMC just calls it noncompliancewank, if I remember correctly.
Texan Hotrodders
11-09-2005, 07:26
Ah. So it's still technically illegal, but it's possible to roleplay it because there isn't enforcement on such a small issue. On the other hand, I'd say that saying you defy a resolution that is automatically enforced doesn't necessarily make it true - Gnomes, how do I love thee? Let me count the ways....
It's not technically illegal, as far as I know. We have free-form roleplay on this site. And that includes being able to RP complete non-compliance, should we choose to do so (as long as we don't violate the rules by being spammish or flambaiting or trolling while doing so), no matter how ridiculous it may seem. They also allow us to RP crazy future tech stuff (which certainly isn't drawn from national statistic changes) and stuff that's only marginally related to NS, so it sorta makes sense.
Greetings.
It is this non-compliance in clever ways, as alluded to by our friend of the Hotrodders, that makes the NSUN such a wonderful entity. We of Roathin observe that many make disparaging and denigrating commentary about the NSUN, while failing to realise that it is the one entity which can actually influence the laws of this world; in particular, the laws as they apply to other states.
There is nothing to prevent a coalition of all these wise and fiscally inclined states, all (to be sure) excellent engines of economic enormity, from taking the time and effort to join the NSUN and drag it kicking and screaming into the age of the prophets Smith, Keynes, Galbraith and even that vegetarian deity Green's Pan. We might debate the verity or veracity of these, but the material of their discourses (or lack thereof) has been as riddles to a sphinx and entertaining therewith.
Why then do states such as Krioval (with due respect) make such noises? The fact is that the economic powers of frightening strength are incapable of swinging a debate or of recruiting sufficient friends to form a coalition to reclaim the NSUN. The nature of economic obsession is that is breeds a competitive spirit which may not result in useful collaboration. It costs much less energy to moan about it and then withdraw.
Idealistic dendritic delphinophiles, on the other hand, find it amusing and even entertaining to gang up on these economic colossi and whale the excrement out of them in the one forum where they can. We of Roathin are sadly also amused at this.
Off to the Strangers' Bar for a Guinness we go now, to support both sides by shelling out for a natural product.
The Palentine
12-09-2005, 00:09
One of the best dirty tricks,of course, as my esteemed colleagues may attest to is the legalist approach. Or in layman terms...the loophole. Sometimes the way is in front of you, in the passed regulation section of the UN. All you need do is check out whatever you wish to violate and see if the author foolishly left an out to exploit. Since quite a few resolutions are poorly written, you should find success. Also check regulations that are similar for the same reason. Then roleplay to your hearts content with your loophole. A word of warning though, over flaunting said loophole can backfire and piss someone off enough to propose new regulations stopping you. But enjoy while you can.
I can give you a theoretical example. Before the Wildlife protection act was passed ,the ban on dolphin fishing hurt the Palentine, you see in RP the Palentine,before it was a member sold Non Dolphin safe Tuna. Once I became a member I had to stop, and technically comply. However reading the ban on dolphin fishing and the ban on whaling I found an out. Porpoises, are not technically dolphins, and Orcas are not technically whales. Furthermore Orcas eat pengiuns(a vital part of defence in the Antactic Oasis). If I decided to harvest porpoises and orcas then technically I would have abided by the letter, but not the spirit of the law. However the Conservation bill changed all that.( I still hunt Orcas that enter Palentine waters to protect my pengiun population.)
Anyway, Have at it, and have fun! :D
Excelsior,
Emperor Captain Spaulding I
The Evil Conservative Empire of the Palentine