NationStates Jolt Archive

Worldwide Minimum Wage Act

Catogory: Social Justice
Strength: Significant
Proposed by: The United Socialist States of Tcwnwat

Description:

ACKNOWLEDGING the reality of globalization, and the fact that many countries import products from third-world nations with developing economies.

ACKNOWLEDGING FURTHER that many of the people who work to produce these products work long hours and are paid next to nothing, barely enough to survive.

MANDATING that a minimum wage be set in all United Nations members.

REALIZING the fact that the various global currencies, fluxuating economies and exchange rates would make it impractical to set an exact number, minimum wage when working an eight-hour day shall be defined as:

1. Enough money to buy three decent meals, a decent meal being defined as one serving of each of the four food groups.

2. Enough money to buy ten litres of water

3. Enough money for heating or air-conditioning to keep the home between 15 and 30 degrees celsius (this will vary with the climates of different nations)

4. Double this amount (to spend on luxury items, bills, and other basic nessessities such as housing)

To find the minimum wage for an hour divide this amount by eight.

I was going through the past UN resolutions and was surprised that there was none that set minimum wage. A minimum wage will reduce the serious problem of poverty in the UN member countries. This is my proposal for a resolution to remedy the current situation, and implement a worldwide minimum wage.

If you have any suggestions or admendments to the proposal, please reply. Or just if you think idea or not.

Worldwide Minimum Wage Act

Catogory: Social Justice
Strength: Significant
Proposed by: The United Socialist States of Tcwnwat

Description:

ACKNOWLEDGING the reality of globalization, and the fact that many countries import products from third-world nations with developing economies.

ACKNOWLEDGING FURTHER that many of the people who work to produce these products work long hours and are paid next to nothing, barely enough to survive.

MANDATING that a minimum wage be set in all United Nations members.

REALIZING the fact that the various global currencies, fluxuating economies and exchange rates would make it impractical to set an exact number, minimum wage when working an eight-hour day shall be defined as:

1. Enough money to buy three decent meals, a decent meal being defined as one serving of each of the four food groups.

2. Enough money to buy ten litres of water

3. Enough money for heating or air-conditioning to keep the home between 15 and 30 degrees celsius (this will vary with the climates of different nations)

4. Double this amount (to spend on luxury items, bills, and other basic nessessities such as housing)

To find the minimum wage for an hour divide this amount by eight.Do all countries use cash and pay their people for their labour? What about pure Marxist regimes, where each contributes according to ability and takes according to need? Do such societies need to introduce cash in order to meet the mandates set by this Resolution?

REALIZING the fact that the various global currencies, fluxuating economies and exchange rates would make it impractical to set an exact number, minimum wage when working an eight-hour day shall be defined as:

1. Enough money to buy three decent meals, a decent meal being defined as one serving of each of the four food groups.

2. Enough money to buy ten litres of water

3. Enough money for heating or air-conditioning to keep the home between 15 and 30 degrees celsius (this will vary with the climates of different nations)

4. Double this amount (to spend on luxury items, bills, and other basic nessessities such as housing)

To find the minimum wage for an hour divide this amount by eight.

Leaving aside for the moment questions of what does or does not constitue an actual fair minumum wage and focusing just on presentation, we would suggest rewording that.

...minimum wage when working an eight-hour day shall be defined as double the money required to buy three decent meals (a decent meal being defined as one serving of each of the four food groups), ten litres of water and heating or air-conditioning to keep the home between 15 and 30 degrees celsius (this will vary with the climates of different nations).

There's considerably less room for misinterpretation that way. The way it's currently presented it could be argued that fulfilling any ONE of the four listed requirements qualifed as meeting the minimum wage.

Of course you're going to run into other problems. What is a "serving" for example? Why the need to keep a house below 30C? Etc...

hmm that's true. Alright, I could make an exception for Marxist regimes. Or maybe just require them to give their workers the basic nesessities mentioned in the act. So it all works out the same. So, yeah, I'll add something for that.

Woah, people are replying faster than I can keep up with them. Okay. In answer to Reformentia:

Leaving aside for the moment questions of what does or does not constitue an actual fair minumum wage and focusing just on presentation, we would suggest rewording that.


Quote:
...minimum wage when working an eight-hour day shall be defined as double the money required to buy three decent meals (a decent meal being defined as one serving of each of the four food groups), ten litres of water and heating or air-conditioning to keep the home between 15 and 30 degrees celsius (this will vary with the climates of different nations).



There's considerably less room for misinterpretation that way. The way it's currently presented it could be argued that fulfilling any ONE of the four listed requirements qualifed as meeting the minimum wage.

Of course you're going to run into other problems. What is a "serving" for example? Why the need to keep a house below 30C? Etc...

Thanks, yeah that's a lot better wording. I'm not sure what's defined as a serving, I need help with that, maybe I'll reword the food part. As for the need to keep a house a certian temperature, I think it's kind of pointless to give the workers enough food and water, only to have them burn or freeze to death, which is why I included it on the proposal

Thanks, yeah that's a lot better wording. I'm not sure what's defined as a serving, I need help with that, maybe I'll reword the food part.

It's going to be difficult to properly define. Also, you're going to need to clarify what you mean by the "four food groups". You can't just assume everyone knows what you're talking about there. (OOC: especially when even in RL there aren't just four of them anymore, at least in the U.S.)

As for the need to keep a house a certian temperature, I think it's kind of pointless to give the workers enough food and water, only to have them burn or freeze to death, which is why I included it on the proposal

Yes.... but nobody is going to burn to death just because the temperature goes over 30C. They might sweat a lot, but that's about it unless they have some kind of medical condition.

There's certainly the potential for a great proposal here; this subject has a lot of promise. However, for a proposal of this nature to be acceptable, an incredible amount of fine-tuning is required.

This proposal is one of the better efforts, but isn't quite there. I hope that this will trigger debate as to how exactly such legislation should be manifested.

Mathieu Vergniaud
Deputy Speaker to the UN

OOC: Apologies, this isn't one of my clearer posts. I'm drunk, you see...

There's certainly the potential for a great proposal here; this subject has a lot of promise. However, for a proposal of this nature to be acceptable, an incredible amount of fine-tuning is required.

This proposal is one of the better efforts, but isn't quite there. I hope that this will trigger debate as to how exactly such legislation should be manifested.

Mathieu Vergniaud
Deputy Speaker to the UN

OOC: Apologies, this isn't one of my clearer posts. I'm drunk, you see...

Wow, we ought to get you liquered up more often, you make sense to me.

;D

Anyhow, maybe something to the effect of:


Resolved that all nations that have their workers paid in currency wages are strongly recommended by this body to impliment a minimum wage, and that all other nations are strongly recommended by this body to assure their citizens the basic needs of housing and food for their poor working class.

hmm, that makes it a lot less specific and would make it a weak strength instead, but it might be easier to implament. Plus it makes the editing a lot easier.

Last thing I do before I go to sleep:

The key words there are 'strongly recommend'. For every UN resolution that would tell members how to run their nation or violate soverignity, those two words are important.

I'd go with a guarantee of housing before a guarantee of cooling. I may find it frustrating being in too warm of a house, but I can survive in it - though I have difficulty arguing the opposite.

I would rather be cold than hot, but I would rather guarantee protection from cold than protection from hot

Worldwide Minimum Wage Act


3. Enough money for heating or air-conditioning to keep the home between 15 and 30 degrees celsius (this will vary with the climates of different nations)

4. Double this amount (to spend on luxury items, bills, and other basic nessessities such as housing)

To find the minimum wage for an hour divide this amount by eight.


This is a disturbing proposal indeed, In the great People´s Republic Of Nordmalmo there is no need for such extravaganze as airconditioning in the citizens private dwellings. In the summer it is not uncommon with high temperatures, but the people will find other ways of keeping themselves comfortable. If there is one thing we do NOT need it is power gulping, capitalist minded, unhealthy luxury items of decadense.

It is my duty to oppose this proposal on the behalf of the people of Nordmalmo, and it´s exalted leader and President, Lt. General Gin Max.

Best Regards, U.N Ambassador Col. Wim Vankel

Alright, the heating and air-conditioning clause seems very unpopular. I will get rid of it. You're right, it doesn't need to be included. And my apologies for offending the People's Republic of Nordmalmo.

Alright - now all you need to do is define serving and we're good.

Also - maybe make a clause that says "Nations are welcome to set their minimum wage at an even higher rate than this one" or similar

Greetings.

We of Roathin suggest that instead of playing around with 'food groups' and 'servings', which are ill-defined and would require yet another committee to define clearly enough, the proposal should set wage limits as follows:

"Defining a wage unit as sufficient purchasing power per unit time to acquire:

1. sustenance,

2. environmental protection, and

3. environmental support

for organic viability for that period of time;

Declaring a reasonable minimal wage to be this wage unit multiplied by a factor of no less than 120%, that every entity should have a reasonable chance at life and continued successful and satisfying existence within its context;

Acknowledging the sovereignty of states, that the three factors incorporated in the calculation of a wage unit should be determined by the unique circumstances of each state;

The NSUN hereby resolves that each member state should take measures to ensure this minimal wage is granted, and distributed within a reasonable time which does not endanger aforementioned viability, to any of its workers engaged in endeavour which is lawful within that state, and for which a wage of any kind is granted."

Greetings.

We of Roathin suggest that instead of playing around with 'food groups' and 'servings', which are ill-defined and would require yet another committee to define clearly enough, the proposal should set wage limits as follows:

"Defining a wage unit as sufficient purchasing power per unit time to acquire:

1. sustenance,

2. environmental protection, and

3. environmental support

for organic viability for that period of time;

Declaring a reasonable minimal wage to be this wage unit multiplied by a factor of no less than 120%, that every entity should have a reasonable chance at life and continued successful and satisfying existence within its context;

Acknowledging the sovereignty of states, that the three factors incorporated in the calculation of a wage unit should be determined by the unique circumstances of each state;

The NSUN hereby resolves that each member state should take measures to ensure this minimal wage is granted, and distributed within a reasonable time which does not endanger aforementioned viability, to any of its workers engaged in endeavour which is lawful within that state, and for which a wage of any kind is granted."

That is an excellent revision, good sir. My office will not be supporting a minimum wage law of any kind by the United Nations, but if we were to do so we would agree with our esteemed colleague from Roathin on what such a law should be.

Deputy Minister of UN Affairs
Thomas Smith

My region would most certainly be willing to offer support to any proposal of this nature, but a clearer definition is required- in the case of marxist states for instance, how do you intend to word these requirements? The guarantee to the provision of the living conditions, food, water, etc by each nation?

My region would most certainly be willing to offer support to any proposal of this nature, but a clearer definition is required- in the case of marxist states for instance, how do you intend to word these requirements? The guarantee to the provision of the living conditions, food, water, etc by each nation?
Greetings.

We of Roathin do not see a difficulty. It is a fact that in Marxist states the allocation of labour is measured and distributed by the state, which uses its own criteria to determine how this should be done. It can similarly determine how much energy, material sustenance, and environmental protection and support can be given to each worker according to that worker's needs.

As long as such a state provides 120% of the absolute minimum according to their own determinations, it will be in compliance of the regulation. How such a state provides for dependants of workers or for non-workers of other kinds does not fall within the ambit of this resolution.

We believe that our revision caters for almost every NSUN member state, respecting their individual sovereignty and yet raising the overall social provision for some who might have 'slipped through the cracks'.

That is an excellent revision, good sir. My office will not be supporting a minimum wage law of any kind by the United Nations, but if we were to do so we would agree with our esteemed colleague from Roathin on what such a law should be.
Greetings.

The oddity is that neither would we of Roathin support a minimum wage law on its own. What we would support is the right to earn such a wage; i.e. that a state cannot make it impossible for any of its members to stay alive and have a surplus for growth and development.

We have crudely estimated that the minimum of 20% over and above survival would allow for some culture, some education, some luxuries etc but not so much as to make it an unnecessary burden to anyone.

Worldwide Minimum Wage Act

Catogory: Social Justice
Strength: Significant
Proposed by: The United Socialist States of Tcwnwat

Description:

ACKNOWLEDGING the reality of globalization, and the fact that many countries import products from third-world nations with developing economies.


1. Enough money to buy three decent meals, a decent meal being defined as one serving of each of the four food groups.

2. Enough money to buy ten litres of water.



Acknowledging globalization is the same as recognizing the defeat for world socialism. Who is in the position to enforce their "reality" on anyone else? For some nation´s globalization may be a reality, for others not. This is not relevant for The People´s Republic.

1. A serving can not be defined in general, there must in that case be a definiton of gender, age and weight/height. Naturally a small woman does not require as much food as a large man, therefore you need different serving standards for different people.

2. Most people in the world pay for water in one way or another, as in our nation by taxes. Unless you collect it from the source yourself you must pay for it. 10 litres of water is sufficient? per day? for what? drinking, cooking, washing yourself, washing clothes? Impossible to answer, the definition can most likely not be a predefined amount.
People need different amounts of water depending on where they live and how they live.

This is a good point, but as you can see far too incomplete. I will be happy to follow modifications on this matter.

Col. Wim Vankel, U.N Ambassador, Peoples Republic Of Nordmalmo

It would be good if this was passed

Excellent points from the Roathin delegation. We would support a proposal structured in such a manner.

Defining a wage unit as sufficient purchasing power per unit time to acquire:

1. sustenance,

2. environmental protection, and

3. environmental support

for organic viability for that period of time;

This is a definite improvement for the definition. However, _Myopia_ is inclined to say that this endeavour should be extended. We feel that no-one, employed or unemployed, should be left without these essentials if it is possible to provide them with them. Therefore, rather than insisting on a minimum wage, I would like to create an obligation for governments to ensure that their citizens are not left without the bare essentials for subsistence. This might be achieved in a number of ways that would be open for governments to choose - e.g. via a combination of minimum wage laws and provisions for the unemployed, or by a "citizen's wage" paid by the government, or by the direct provision by government of the material objects necessary for subsistence. So - how's this as a rough suggestion (and Roathin, would you be happy with the use of your definition in such a text?):

"Defining means of subsistence as the

1. sustenance,

2. environmental protection, and

3. environmental support

needed for organic viability for a citizen;

Declares that all residents of UN nations have the right to be provided throughout life with either means of subsistence or sufficient means to obtain them, be it by government, private organisations/individuals such as employers, or both. In the case of dependents, it is permissible for this to be provided to those responsible for their care.

Acknowledging the differences between nations, the amounts provided should be determined by the unique circumstances of each state, and as far as is reasonable each individual, such that at minimum, the above are provided;

The NSUN hereby resolves that each member state should take measures to ensure that at least the above requirements are provided, and distributed within a reasonable time which does not endanger aforementioned viability. This may be achieved in a number of ways, including but not limited to the enforcement of appropriate minimum wage laws and implementation of appropriate welfare provisions."

It does need allowances for situations where it is not possible to provide means of subsistence, and possibly some kind of system of international aid to enable poor countries to implement this.

Greetings.

We of Roathin have no serious objections to the Myopic use of our terminology. However, we are philosophically opposed to the idea that the state should be under obligation to provide for all its citizens (despite the utopian sentiment which we appreciate is behind this), on three related grounds:

1) this frees citizens to choose not to contribute in any way, thus becoming parasites on the body politic (and economic);

2) this encourages states to develop more stringent definitions of citizenhood and the requirements for citizenship;

3) this encourages the rise of states that are effectively slave-based economies, as slaves are not citizens.

This is the reason why we of Roathin prefer to think of the basic wage unit as a quid pro quo. We are not in favour of dispensing largesse with over-open hands, as we find this can lead to over-empty pockets.

Tcwnwat agrees with Myopia, in that in an ideal world, a nation should provide all their citizen's needs (we are a socialist society, after all) however, we fear that adding such a provision to the bill would make it too unpopular. As the representitive from Roathin pointed out, this would make people free to not contribute to the economy in any way, and although we might not want to think so, people are lazy.

I believe we should stay with the general idea of the origional draft, as a good middle ground. So here is the second draft of the bill, I've added a lot of the provisions proposed by Roathin and Myopia.

Worldwide Minimum Wage Act
Catagory: Social Justice
Strength: Significant
Proposed by: Tcwnwat

Be it resolved that all nations that have their workers paid in currency wages are strongly encouraged to impliment a minimum wage.

The minimum wage should be 120% of the purchasing power per unit time to acquire

1. sustenance,

2. environmental protection, and

3. environmental support

for organic viability for that period of time.

Declares that all residents of UN nations have the right to be provided throughout life with either means of subsistence or sufficient means to obtain them, be it by government, private organisations/individuals such as employers, or both. In the case of dependents, it is permissible for this to be provided to those responsible for their care.

Acknowledging the differences between nations, the amounts provided should be determined by the unique circumstances of each state, and as far as is reasonable each individual, such that at minimum, the above are provided.

For Marxist states, be it resolved that the nation gives their workers the above requirements.

Nations are free to set their minimum wage higher than the above requirements.

There, I've tried to include everyone's ideas in there, if I've missed one, let me know. Also, I'm not sure if the strength should be mild or significant, becuase it seems slightly weaker than the resolution I first proposed.

The last two lines sound a bit awkward (especially considering the wording of the rest of it), but otherwise, looks good.

Cool, yeah you can tell the last two lines were written by me. If I add the words "at least" before 120% it will eliminate the need for the last line, and I'll put the second-last line in the first paragraph like so:

Worldwide Minimum Wage Act
Catagory: Social Justice
Strength: Significant
Proposed by: Tcwnwat

Be it resolved that all nations that have their workers paid in currency wages are strongly encouraged to impliment a minimum wage, and for Marxist states, be it resolved that the nation is strongly encouraged to give their workers access to the following requirements.

The minimum wage should be at least 120% of the purchasing power per unit time to acquire

1. sustenance,

2. environmental protection, and

3. environmental support

for organic viability for that period of time.

Declares that all residents of UN nations have the right to be provided throughout life with either means of subsistence or sufficient means to obtain them, be it by government, private organisations/individuals such as employers, or both. In the case of dependents, it is permissible for this to be provided to those responsible for their care.

Acknowledging the differences between nations, the amounts provided should be determined by the unique circumstances of each state, and as far as is reasonable each individual, such that at minimum, the above are provided.

There I think that clears up everything nicely. I will submit the proposal now.

Cool, yeah you can tell the last two lines were written by me. If I add the words "at least" before 120% it will eliminate the need for the last line, and I'll put the second-last line in the first paragraph like so:

Worldwide Minimum Wage Act
Catagory: Social Justice
Strength: Significant
Proposed by: Tcwnwat

Be it resolved that all nations that have their workers paid in currency wages are strongly encouraged to impliment a minimum wage, and for Marxist states, be it resolved that the nation is strongly encouraged to give their workers access to the following requirements.

The minimum wage should be at least 120% of the purchasing power per unit time to acquire

1. sustenance,

2. environmental protection, and

3. environmental support

for organic viability for that period of time.

Declares that all residents of UN nations have the right to be provided throughout life with either means of subsistence or sufficient means to obtain them, be it by government, private organisations/individuals such as employers, or both. In the case of dependents, it is permissible for this to be provided to those responsible for their care.

Acknowledging the differences between nations, the amounts provided should be determined by the unique circumstances of each state, and as far as is reasonable each individual, such that at minimum, the above are provided.

There I think that clears up everything nicely. I will submit the proposal now.

That doesn't really fit together. At first, you say that it is only "strongly encouraged" (not obligatory) to implement a minimum wage (and the provision through means other than employers is not limited to Marxist states, so that needs changing). Then you go on to say that everyone has the right to means of subsistence regardless of the source (which doesn't match with the first bit), plus the bit above that was changed so that within your proposal, means of subsistence is undefined.

EDIT: And what we proposed was NOT the provision of everything for the citizen without working. We suggested that everyone be provided with at least the bare minimum for survival, because we don't believe that anyone should be left homeless or starving. There would still be ample cause to contribute to society, because very few people just want to subsist.

That doesn't really fit together. At first, you say that it is only "strongly encouraged" (not obligatory) to implement a minimum wage (and the provision through means other than employers is not limited to Marxist states, so that needs changing). Then you go on to say that everyone has the right to means of subsistence regardless of the source (which doesn't match with the first bit), plus the bit above that was changed so that within your proposal, means of subsistence is undefined.

EDIT: And what we proposed was NOT the provision of everything for the citizen without working. We suggested that everyone be provided with at least the bare minimum for survival, because we don't believe that anyone should be left homeless or starving. There would still be ample cause to contribute to society, because very few people just want to subsist.

Yeah - but then you're mandating welfare - which is not what is trying to be supplied and makes the battle just that much more difficult.

BTW - I disagree with the use of the words "Strongly Encourages"....as that really doesn't make a minimum wage, it just sets a UN belief that minimum wages should exist (doesn't mean they will - especially since most nations that have minimum wages right now don't need this legislation and those that don't have minimum wages....don't really care).

But hey - that's a soverignty vs basic rights argument

My god! What started out as a proposal to provide a minimum wage for the workers has morphed into a cradle to grave handout to all residents(Not citizens mind you. Residents)of all UN nations.

And what about non-UN-members?It's sounds nice...but not every nation is member of the UN...world poverty won't be that less...it only solves problems in UN.I think we should be considerd about the whole world,how to make life better for nonUNmembers.

And what about non-UN-members?
What about them? UN resolutions only affect UN members.

Yeah - but then you're mandating welfare - which is not what is trying to be supplied and makes the battle just that much more difficult.

BTW - I disagree with the use of the words "Strongly Encourages"....as that really doesn't make a minimum wage, it just sets a UN belief that minimum wages should exist (doesn't mean they will - especially since most nations that have minimum wages right now don't need this legislation and those that don't have minimum wages....don't really care).

But hey - that's a soverignty vs basic rights argument

It is a soverignty vs basic rights arguement, and I suggested implimenting "Strongly Encourages" because I believe forcing all UN Member nations to have a minimum wage law of 120% of the minimum work credits for what workers need to survive is a violation of soverign economies.

Sure, economies are intertwined worldwide, but the Lanquassian Minimum Wage Law, across all of Lanquassia, is 100% of the minimum - it would be less if we could work out the economy of 95% minimum wage, something that the Ministry of State is currently investigating, as it would give more incentive to earn raises, promotions, and such.

I'm mostly in agreement with _Myopia_ on this. I think the term 'Marxist' needs to be removed, since there are a multitude of non-Marxist states that the proposal seeks to address in this clause, plus a multitude of self-professed Marxist states for whom the clause is irrelevant. One could make the case that capitalist states are Marxist; they're simply at an earlier stage of the journey.

Personally, I still like my version - although I'll try to word it better.

"Resolved that this body Strongly Suggests that all member nations provide their citizens with the minimum neccessities needed for life through a minimum wage or equivalent for all economies."

Something like that.

Greetings.

We are sorely disappointed at the unprompted evolution of our suggestion into something poor but strange. Although we are not an aggressive nation, were we such an entity, we would be mobilising our fleet of draco coruscans iridescens by now. We are strongly opposed to the wholesale adoption of our text with curious appendages grafted on.

It would be nobler to the mind to suffer the slings and arrow of outrageous fortune, or perhaps the UNSA.

This body strongly suggests that in future, a more consultative approach be adopted with the authors of significant sections of any legislation before re-release of said legislation. Not that we are a dog in the manger, but should you propose the use of our text and not wait for a reply, it would be egregious indeed.

I am totally with the proposed act.

Greetings.

We are sorely disappointed at the unprompted evolution of our suggestion into something poor but strange. Although we are not an aggressive nation, were we such an entity, we would be mobilising our fleet of draco coruscans iridescens by now. We are strongly opposed to the wholesale adoption of our text with curious appendages grafted on.

It would be nobler to the mind to suffer the slings and arrow of outrageous fortune, or perhaps the UNSA.

This body strongly suggests that in future, a more consultative approach be adopted with the authors of significant sections of any legislation before re-release of said legislation. Not that we are a dog in the manger, but should you propose the use of our text and not wait for a reply, it would be egregious indeed.

For what it's worth, I apologise for my part in the appropriation of your ideas. I did not realise that Tcwnwat would almost immediately take my version of your suggestion, alter it and submit it without waiting for more than one response.

Yelda - by mandating provision for residents, I was trying to prevent governments dodging their responsibilities by making requirements for citizens more stringent. Perhaps something in between would be more appropriate.

I would not think this would be a good future resoulution for the U.N. because it would drive the whole game for U.N. member nations in to reverse for them.

Thoe i feel the hole thing is not a horrible idea, we must realize that develiping countries in the first place have little money to begin with (hence developing).

second the developed countries that buy and import these products could not afford to pay more for the product and if they could as it goes down the line us the consumer would have such a high price that we would ant be able to afford it. so in a sad unfortunate way slave labour and sweatshops keep our prices down, as horrible as it my sound it's true.

Thoe i feel the hole thing is not a horrible idea, we must realize that develiping countries in the first place have little money to begin with (hence developing).

The countries actually have a fair bit of money (they just hide it) and the corporations are the ones that have to pay people.

second the developed countries that buy and import these products could not afford to pay more for the product and if they could as it goes down the line us the consumer would have such a high price that we would ant be able to afford it. so in a sad unfortunate way slave labour and sweatshops keep our prices down, as horrible as it my sound it's true.

Actually - slave labour (outlawed BTW - resolution #4?) and sweatshops exist to minimize the cost - because you can't get the same numbers for that low of a cost outside those nations. Not to mention, the lowest value of substinance is very low in third world nations (thus the minimum wage would be low). Add on that even in prices went up slightly, they ALL would be going up slightly - and those produced in first world are generally more expensive to begin with - but for the benefit of "made HERE".