NationStates Jolt Archive

Seeing all those "single currency" proposals in the "silly proposal" thread has got me thinking: could the UN pass a Resolution that would allow "currency equalization"? It's not the same as having a single currency- each nation would still have the ability to call their currency whatever they want, it's just that it would all have the same value. I think this would be legal, since I think the only game mechanics violation the "single currency" proposal violates is the fact that it would force every nation to change the name of their currency, and this violation would be removed.

Thoughts?

Thoughts?
I'unno...

*is mostly clueless about things like this*

it is an interesting idea, but i dont think some of the more economically sound nations want to have their currency to be worth the same, ie as little, as some of the more poorer nations

We would say "because Vastiva makes tankerloads of money in currency trading" but that's a bit simplistic.

Here's a better reason.

We have a Frightening economy. Our Polar Crown is worth (last we checked) 1.9138 USD.

RomeW has a Strong economy, but it's coin is weak against the USD - it takes 1.9863 coins to equal the value of 1 USD.

So, 1 PC = 1.9138 USD = 3.801 Roman Coins.

My citizens take their VCU Visa to a foreign country (RomeW), we have nearly four times the purchasing power of your citizens.

On the other hand, your citizens have about a quarter of their purchasing power.

So you come to Vastiva, where a hotel room runs at 10 PC per night. That is 38.01 coins. Still a deal you can afford long term? If your hotel room runs at 10 coins, thats about 2.63 PC.

A currency equalization reduces my economic power when visiting you by nearly four times. Now, this sounds reasonable - but realisticly, that means an extreme punative measure against Vastiva, and encourages one to have a worse economy.

Consider, if my nation's currency is worth 1/100th of 1 USD before the equalization, afterwards I have 100x the purchasing power - with nothing to back up my currency. So I can print off all the money I want, and its just as valuable as everyone else's. Why not make that my main industry?

See the potential for abuse here?

I don't usually delete "universal currency" Proposal on Game Mechanics grounds. I tend to assume they intend to create a "UN Credit" that will be used for international trade, but nations can keep their own currencies for internal affairs and trade with non-UN nations.

I don't usually delete "universal currency" Proposal on Game Mechanics grounds. I tend to assume they intend to create a "UN Credit" that will be used for international trade, but nations can keep their own currencies for internal affairs and trade with non-UN nations.

Oh. I see. Though I thought "calling for a single currency" was a game mechanics violation since it would force every nation to change the name of their currency. Thanks for clearing that up.

We would say "because Vastiva makes tankerloads of money in currency trading" but that's a bit simplistic.

Here's a better reason.

We have a Frightening economy. Our Polar Crown is worth (last we checked) 1.9138 USD.

RomeW has a Strong economy, but it's coin is weak against the USD - it takes 1.9863 coins to equal the value of 1 USD.

So, 1 PC = 1.9138 USD = 3.801 Roman Coins.

My citizens take their VCU Visa to a foreign country (RomeW), we have nearly four times the purchasing power of your citizens.

On the other hand, your citizens have about a quarter of their purchasing power.

So you come to Vastiva, where a hotel room runs at 10 PC per night. That is 38.01 coins. Still a deal you can afford long term? If your hotel room runs at 10 coins, thats about 2.63 PC.

A currency equalization reduces my economic power when visiting you by nearly four times. Now, this sounds reasonable - but realisticly, that means an extreme punative measure against Vastiva, and encourages one to have a worse economy.

Consider, if my nation's currency is worth 1/100th of 1 USD before the equalization, afterwards I have 100x the purchasing power - with nothing to back up my currency. So I can print off all the money I want, and its just as valuable as everyone else's. Why not make that my main industry?

See the potential for abuse here?

I should note that I don't use what the NS Calculators tell me for what my currency's value is- I've set it at 1 coin (short form: C) equals $10 US. I also don't use the NS stats for my nation since they're maddeningly unreal- how could any nation really live off a 90% tax rate. That's why I made the Roman Economic Factbook- the link is in my signature.

However, you're also assuming that you're producing the exact same amount of currency as I do, which wouldn't be possible, or that prices in Vastiva wouldn't be the same in Rome after the currency conversions. The former isn't true since if you were to mass produce your currency it would lose its value immensely, and the latter isn't true since products of an international scale (like weapons and food exports) would most likely have the same (relative) cost because the sellers would want to make sure that they'd get the same amount of money from everyone. While it may be true that, in Vastiva, hotels are more costly than in Rome (which we dispute- our hotels right near the Circus Maximus and Flavian Amphitheatre are among the costliest in the world, and for good reason), that fact cannot be left to currency alone. Perhaps your building materials are costlier than that in Rome, or your hotel labour wages are higher, or your hotel offers lots of exotic or exclusively Vastivan food. The point is, your products are not necessarily more expensive than mine are because of your currency. Cost has a lot of factors involved in it which cannot be discredited.

Oh. I see. Though I thought "calling for a single currency" was a game mechanics violation since it would force every nation to change the name of their currency. Thanks for clearing that up.

Personally, I wish one would pass so we can stop having the USD in Proposals. It would allow people to put actual figures in without dragging in the buck.

I should note that I don't use what the NS Calculators tell me for what my currency's value is- I've set it at 1 coin (short form: C) equals $10 US. I also don't use the NS stats for my nation since they're maddeningly unreal- how could any nation really live off a 90% tax rate.

Well, that's one of the things we have to deal with when we play NS. It's not supposed to be perfectly realistic. The other end is just as unrealitic. A nation with 0% tax isn't very likely either.

Personally, I wish one would pass so we can stop having the USD in Proposals. It would allow people to put actual figures in without dragging in the buck.

True...the USD would be considered a "real world reference" right? Though if someone wanted to create a proposal that would require everyone to adopt the same name for their currency it would be against the rules.

Well, that's one of the things we have to deal with when we play NS. It's not supposed to be perfectly realistic. The other end is just as unrealitic. A nation with 0% tax isn't very likely either.

Oh, I understand that NS-wise that those are my figures. I just don't RP with them- that's why I created the factbook so people know what I RP with.

Originally Posted by Vastiva
We would say "because Vastiva makes tankerloads of money in currency trading" but that's a bit simplistic.

Here's a better reason.

We have a Frightening economy. Our Polar Crown is worth (last we checked) 1.9138 USD.

RomeW has a Strong economy, but it's coin is weak against the USD - it takes 1.9863 coins to equal the value of 1 USD.

So, 1 PC = 1.9138 USD = 3.801 Roman Coins.

My citizens take their VCU Visa to a foreign country (RomeW), we have nearly four times the purchasing power of your citizens.

On the other hand, your citizens have about a quarter of their purchasing power.

So you come to Vastiva, where a hotel room runs at 10 PC per night. That is 38.01 coins. Still a deal you can afford long term? If your hotel room runs at 10 coins, thats about 2.63 PC.

A currency equalization reduces my economic power when visiting you by nearly four times. Now, this sounds reasonable - but realisticly, that means an extreme punative measure against Vastiva, and encourages one to have a worse economy.

Consider, if my nation's currency is worth 1/100th of 1 USD before the equalization, afterwards I have 100x the purchasing power - with nothing to back up my currency. So I can print off all the money I want, and its just as valuable as everyone else's. Why not make that my main industry?

See the potential for abuse here?

I should note that I don't use what the NS Calculators tell me for what my currency's value is- I've set it at 1 coin (short form: C) equals $10 US. I also don't use the NS stats for my nation since they're maddeningly unreal- how could any nation really live off a 90% tax rate. That's why I made the Roman Economic Factbook- the link is in my signature.

Not really relevant as the discussion is in currency conversion, but alright... yes, there are ways of "disordinately" pricing currency (Switzerland is particularly good at this). However, this assumes a tight control over the money supply - which a "standard currency" would lack.



However, you're also assuming that you're producing the exact same amount of currency as I do, which wouldn't be possible, or that prices in Vastiva wouldn't be the same in Rome after the currency conversions. The former isn't true since if you were to mass produce your currency it would lose its value immensely, and the latter isn't true since products of an international scale (like weapons and food exports) would most likely have the same (relative) cost because the sellers would want to make sure that they'd get the same amount of money from everyone. While it may be true that, in Vastiva, hotels are more costly than in Rome (which we dispute- our hotels right near the Circus Maximus and Flavian Amphitheatre are among the costliest in the world, and for good reason), that fact cannot be left to currency alone. Perhaps your building materials are costlier than that in Rome, or your hotel labour wages are higher, or your hotel offers lots of exotic or exclusively Vastivan food. The point is, your products are not necessarily more expensive than mine are because of your currency. Cost has a lot of factors involved in it which cannot be discredited.

Well, frick me for being simple in my example. Now, before I post something that will make everyone's eyes glaze over, do you really want to get into the nuances of Macro and Microeconomics?

Neither do I.

How about focusing on this paragraph set?


Consider, if my nation's currency is worth 1/100th of 1 USD before the equalization, afterwards I have 100x the purchasing power - with nothing to back up my currency. So I can print off all the money I want, and its just as valuable as everyone else's. Why not make that my main industry?

See the potential for abuse here?

See the problem with "if you mass produce your currency, you devalue it" is you are not talking about a national currency anymore, but a worldwide currency. The controls on the Euro are significant (and already counterfeiting is a major concern), and that's just Europe. Consider the problem expanded to the NS world with it's Quadrillions of population.

Not really relevant as the discussion is in currency conversion, but alright... yes, there are ways of "disordinately" pricing currency (Switzerland is particularly good at this). However, this assumes a tight control over the money supply - which a "standard currency" would lack.

Well, that paragraph was just there to state that "what I RP with and what NS gives me are not true". It's not that relevant for the discussion.

Well, frick me for being simple in my example. Now, before I post something that will make everyone's eyes glaze over, do you really want to get into the nuances of Macro and Microeconomics?

Neither do I.

How about focusing on this paragraph set?


Consider, if my nation's currency is worth 1/100th of 1 USD before the equalization, afterwards I have 100x the purchasing power - with nothing to back up my currency. So I can print off all the money I want, and its just as valuable as everyone else's. Why not make that my main industry?

See the potential for abuse here?

See the problem with "if you mass produce your currency, you devalue it" is you are not talking about a national currency anymore, but a worldwide currency. The controls on the Euro are significant (and already counterfeiting is a major concern), and that's just Europe. Consider the problem expanded to the NS world with it's Quadrillions of population.

Ah. I see what you mean. I understand that a control-less single currency would lead to abuse- so we could put a single currency on the gold standard then. That way it's always constant.

Ah. I see what you mean. I understand that a control-less single currency would lead to abuse- so we could put a single currency on the gold standard then. That way it's always constant.

And pointless, considering the amount of gold, the possibility of hoarding, the removal of gold itself - considering Vastiva produces gold, does mean we get more money? How about gold hordes? Nations which don't produce gold, but produce something else?

Who is going to keep track of all the money - and how?

True...the USD would be considered a "real world reference" right? Though if someone wanted to create a proposal that would require everyone to adopt the same name for their currency it would be against the rules.

Technically, yes. But a proposal with something like "...will impose a fine of $1,000,000 should stoats not be protected..." would probably be allowed, just because I don't want to go all insane with it.

And anything saying something to the effect of "All members will adopt the Severed Finger as their currency", would be deleted for a Game Mechanics/Meta Game violation.

Well, yes, there's that too...

RomeW, consider - two nations join the UN at the same time. One has massive gold reserves and a Frightening economy. The other has an Imploded economy. Who gets how much money? How is this determined? How about if the Frightening economy has no gold, and the Imploded has significant available for mining? Doesn't their addition reduce the value of every other UN nations available currency? How about leaving nations - as that increases the relative value, aren't you causing war on a massive scale?

Good point. Hmmmnnn...I'm going to have to ponder this a little more.

RIDICULOUS.

The competition and *surprise* if you will of such a sudden change will ruin international trade and the economies of many nations.

The idea is a good one, but not a logical one. If we change the entire world currency, then it would all have to have the same value... This would devistate smaller countries and larger countries, as currency of different countries values different



Utrogoth

The problem with a global currency is that some of us are better at managing our economy than others. Or maybe it's just more important to some and less important to others.

All currencies start out at the same value; the choices each government makes then affects the value of their currency.

The idea of having a UN currency fails to make sense to me because the UN has no taxing authority and therefore nothing to stand behind the notes it issues.

Currency Value is based on your Nation's GDP. Since the United Nations is not a nation and therefore does not have a GDP, it cannot issue currency, or if it did, it would be worthless.

Armand Duvall
Belluelle Nuncio to the United Nations

As of now, Thirdgeek has Vastiva's Polar Crown at 1 PC = 2.7183 USD.

We so rock.

Strangely, the UN is not listed as having a currency... perhaps it is better left this way?