NationStates Jolt Archive

Seeing the debate in other threads over the issue of a central physical structure as part of the New Global Library, I've decided that it would be useful to get some sort of public opinion.

Note: The above poll does not concern the suggestion of a global library museum.

Well, we all know Krioval's official position on this by now, but I might as well show it here too. Krioval believes that the physical library should be abandoned so as to present the strongest proposal possible.

Well, we all know Krioval's official position on this by now, but I might as well show it here too. Krioval believes that the physical library should be abandoned so as to present the strongest proposal possible.
As does Nargopia, as we have stated time and time again.

I'm not sure this is productive if we skew the early results with our own voting.

Not all nations use technology to record their information, and the origional copies of this information has to be stored somewhere.

I think that the central library for all nations should maintain electronic records, and provide it to each nation who can use that technology (average tech here, people, not holographic wrist watch doo hickies - even my people have a basic computer) and the nations who do not have such technology should build a national building that will store the most important documents/artifacts, as well as any other librarys in other parts of the nation, if they choose.

Since this is in the interest of sharing, nations who do not have the technology to share with the central library would allow people to study what they have to put into the central library.

I think that would work... obviously with some more specifics and things...

I don't know that this is the greatest poll for determining anything. I never said that the physical structure should be THE driving force behind a resolution, I said it should be A driving force.

However, a Global Library resolution cannot be created without actual libraries. If you abandon the physical concept, you don't have a "library" anymore.

Don't expect accurate results from a forum poll. They won't tell you anything worthwhile.

"A good library is a place, a palace where the lofty spirits of all nations and generations meet."
— Samuel Niger

I don't know that this is the greatest poll for determining anything. I never said that the physical structure should be THE driving force behind a resolution, I said it should be A driving force.
Seeing as the original resolution was repealed partially because of the costs involved, and that the physical library would incur far greater costs than the virtual library, I see a physical library as the driving force behind the resolution.
However, a Global Library resolution cannot be created without actual libraries. If you abandon the physical concept, you don't have a "library" anymore.
Why?
Don't expect accurate results from a forum poll. They won't tell you anything worthwhile.
Really? I think they'll give me a sample of the opinions of nations who post in this forum. Seeing as those are the nations who propose resolutions that make it to the floor, I'm quite interested in their responses.
"A good library is a place, a palace where the lofty spirits of all nations and generations meet."
— Samuel Niger
The only library in which all nations and generations could meet would be a virtual one, not a physical one. I don't see how this quote of a person who doesn't exist in NationStates helps your argument.

I would like to take the opportunity to say a couple (or more) things. First, I find that this poll is not a "set in stone" command as to how any new proposal or proposals are to be written. But I do consider it to be one guide out of the many that will be considered.

Second, emotions are going to run high over this. Idealism and pragmatism are very seldom aligned naturally, and our goal is to force them into place. Too idealistic a resolution gets us Resolution Eighty-Six, which is extremely well-intentioned but poorly explained. Too pragmatic a resolution gets us a P2P network with half-transcripts of books and a ninety-to-one pornography-to-other literature ratio (and popup ads). As with most things, the optimum lies somewhere toward the center.

Third, remember that this is not a life or death decision. While I consider time to be of the essence for several reasons (wanting the matter to be fresh in people's minds is one), the issue can be delayed. Proposals can be split into more manageable bits. Failed proposals can be resubmitted. Passed resolutions that fall out of favor can be reversed. This is a fluid process, and we need to keep in mind that nothing we do is absolutely one thing or another, and just about anything can be changed in very short order.

Fourth, keep those ideas coming! We're not fully done brainstorming yet.

Not all nations use technology to record their information, and the origional copies of this information has to be stored somewhere.

I think that the central library for all nations should maintain electronic records, and provide it to each nation who can use that technology (average tech here, people, not holographic wrist watch doo hickies - even my people have a basic computer) and the nations who do not have such technology should build a national building that will store the most important documents/artifacts, as well as any other librarys in other parts of the nation, if they choose.

Since this is in the interest of sharing, nations who do not have the technology to share with the central library would allow people to study what they have to put into the central library.

I think that would work... obviously with some more specifics and things...


My government is inclined to actually favour the construction of a physical library. In addition to serving as archives, libraries can serve as meeting places as well as forums for exchanging ideas, both of which are consistent with my government's position on the mission of the UN.

[Excellent poll BTW]

My region has been working on a Global Library proposal (Global Library Coalition) in which the global library would be internet-based, with each member nation having the option of building a physical library if they'd like. A library is still a library if people have access to the written word and the needed information. Yes, having physical copies of the essential texts is important, but it's hardly feasible for a central global library to created and the to have individuals or citizens travel to said library just to read a particular book. If a nation has the money and the desire, they can build a physical library to house said texts/computers for access. Otherwise, the citizens should be able to access the information via another method.

But that's just my two-cents ...

We also like the idea of a physical library being an option for nations, as, if nothing else, it could provide a place to store rare and valuable books and documents.

Mousebumples, I adore you. You say everything I think but am too lazy to put into a long post.

My region has been working on a Global Library proposal (Global Library Coalition) in which the global library would be internet-based, with each member nation having the option of building a physical library if they'd like. A library is still a library if people have access to the written word and the needed information. Yes, having physical copies of the essential texts is important, but it's hardly feasible for a central global library to created and the to have individuals or citizens travel to said library just to read a particular book. If a nation has the money and the desire, they can build a physical library to house said texts/computers for access. Otherwise, the citizens should be able to access the information via another method..

I think that these are wise words. Make the physical structure optional, but focus on the *infrastructure*. In the discussion around the new Global Library it seems that people confuse the need of a library-building with the need to exchange information. If you make the exchange of information the main goal, then you can start considering how to do that. But think practical: travel distances, cost (I mean, 35.000 UN nations, how many books is that going to be? And they need caring, restoration, librarians...paper is expensive).

If we decide now to put a digital infrastructure in place, to which all local libraries in the world can connect, and share data, together with a digitalisation programme to make the information accessible, we have something we can agree on. The physical structure (then the local libraries that already exist) can always be added later with a new resolution, as adding that won't violate anything.

We consider that at least one hard copy of every book produced in a nation should be held physically in that nation. The nation should decide whether they are together or in several libraries. Other nations can either hold a purchased hard copy if they wish or have availible free access to digital copy from a central internet library for on screen viewing only (read only document).

Whenever the digital copy is reproduced as a hard copy there would be a small fee to pay the author or nation before the copy could be made.

Only copies of carefully selected books should be held in any central physical library probably around 0.0000001% of those produced these would be the finest each nation has produced and on loan from that nation. This can also be considered as an Exhibition so could be mobile.

Now i get to explain. I voted for "A physical structure is necessary, but not the ultimate solution"

Yes. There does need to be a physical structure for this Global Library. It's not the ultimate solution, though. Many historical texts get fragile as they age on the shelf. Handling these texts makes them even more so, and actually speeds up the aging process. These texts are valuable. There will have to be electronic/holographic copies, so that when they finally disintegrate, they will not be lost forever.

Also, relying solely on physical structure creates problems regarding location and size of land plots the Global library gets to be built on. Let each nation have it's own, small physical structures, where each nation gets to keep its most valuable texts, virtual copies of which can be made widely available the world over. In these smaller structures, a limited amount of resources and works of fiction could be stored. They will also process local memberships.

Another point I'd like to make is that a purely virtual library would not be the way to go. People still need to have these works in print. I certainly cannot stand to sit down for hours in front of a computer reading a 200-page e-book, having to scroll down every few seconds. You know what I mean?

These are my reasons for voting "Physical structure is necessary, but not the ultimate solution".

Thanks for allowing me to take the podium.

Signed

Lord Lestat de Lioncourt

Pontifex Maximus and Political Leader of The Incorporated States of Marius and Lestat

oh, wait.

90% porn would be a bad thing?

hmmm. i'll go finish this thought in the other thread.

Yes. There does need to be a physical structure for this Global Library. It's not the ultimate solution, though. Many historical texts get fragile as they age on the shelf. Handling these texts makes them even more so, and actually speeds up the aging process. These texts are valuable. There will have to be electronic/holographic copies, so that when they finally disintegrate, they will not be lost forever.

Don't you think nations take care of their own texts and relics? And if they don't, then why should the UN care? If Bobtopia (sorry if that's an actual nation) doesn't care about preserving their own physical historical texts, then why should the rest of us, who would have to pay for it? And if Bobtopia does care, shouldn't they pay for it themselves?