NationStates Jolt Archive

*not touching this with a ten meter cattle prod*


Repeal "Outlaw Pedophilia"
A proposal to repeal a previously passed resolution


Category: Repeal
Resolution: #22
Proposed by: HadleysHope

Description: UN Resolution #22: Outlaw Pedophilia (Category: Moral Decency; Strength: Mild) shall be struck out and rendered null and void.

Argument: Sexual molestation of *anyone* should be forbidden. Why just children? Besides, most nations likely have laws against it already.

Approvals: 0

Status: Lacking Support (requires 141 more approvals)

Voting Ends: Sat Dec 4 2004

And the problem with this is...?

Exactly why would you want to repeal a law forbidding sex with children?

What your proposal would want to do is pass another law, making it more severe.

All removing this protection would do is.... make it legal to have sex with children.

:headbang:

Exactly why would you want to repeal a law forbidding sex with children?

What your proposal would want to do is pass another law, making it more severe.

All removing this protection would do is.... make it legal to have sex with children.

:headbang:

I didn't think of the resolution as "outlawing sex with children" - the wording it used was "sexual molestation" not just "having sex".

So why do you want it repealed? What problem do you have with the outlawing of the sexual molestation of children?

I didn't think of the resolution as "outlawing sex with children" - the wording it used was "sexual molestation" not just "having sex".

And this should be apparent in the wording I used in my repeal - "Sexual molestation of *anyone* should be forbidden". Perhaps I was just confused as to the exact definition, in which case it should still be repealed and replaced by something more specific. If you want to outlaw all sex with anyone under a certain age, then make a resolution for that. I don't believe that is what resolution 22 does.

So why do you want it repealed? What problem do you have with the outlawing of the sexual molestation of children?

I do not have a problem with it. However, and I pretty clearly stated this in my repeal argument, sexual molestation of *anyone* should be outlawed, therefore there should be no need for an *additional* resolution for children.

Personally, I'd like to eliminate virtually every "age limit" law - remove age limits for smoking, drinking, getting a driver's license...you may notice that the other resolution I submitted is also a repeal for a "minor" law (having to do with employment).

As short-sighted as this proposal seems, I can see where they might be coming from to an extent... I mean, if this nation was repealing "Outlaw Pedophilia" to write a new law outlawing all types of what we consider illegal sexual activity, then, it might be a valid avenue to explore.

But, by the description of this repeal, I highly doubt my above statement is what the author had in mind.

As short-sighted as this proposal seems, I can see where they might be coming from to an extent... I mean, if this nation was repealing "Outlaw Pedophilia" to write a new law outlawing all types of what we consider illegal sexual activity, then, it might be a valid avenue to explore.

But, by the description of this repeal, I highly doubt my above statement is what the author had in mind.

I don't believe a "replacement" proposal is necessary because I would think (although I could be wrong) that any sexual activity in which one member is not consenting (ie rape) is probably already illegal in every nation just like virtually anything else that one person might do to harm another person.

Also, in any other case (2 consenting people but still questionable, like an adult and a child) it would likely be covered under Resolution 53, 5-a and 5-b...

5) Declares and enshrines in law the freedom of all people to make choices according to their own conscience, particularly with regard to their philosophy of life, social/cultural development and awareness of the world, without unreasonable interference from the State, subject to the following limitations:

a) The decisions taken do not directly inflict physical harm on the individual making them or physical or psychological harm on others; where this is the case, normal criminal law of the country in question applies,

b) The legal guardian of any minor or physically or mentally incapable individual, the latter as defined in the Resolution "Fair Treatment of Mentally-Ill", remains responsible to make informed choices and decisions on their behalf, in accordance with any applicable rights and health and safety legislation laid down by the State

I don't believe a "replacement" proposal is necessary because I would think (although I could be wrong) that any sexual activity in which one member is not consenting (ie rape) is probably already illegal in every nation just like virtually anything else that one person might do to harm another person.

While you may not think a replacement resolution is necessary, other nations - like the one in question - may think so. That's the point I was outlining, that's all.

While you may not think a replacement resolution is necessary, other nations - like the one in question - may think so. That's the point I was outlining, that's all.

Then other nations can propose a replacement resolution. However, as I pointed out, I believe the existing resolution is redundant and therefore useless anyway. Do you disagree with this?

Do you disagree with this?

Well, let's consider the resolution itself:

Outlaw Pedophilia

A resolution to restrict civil freedoms in the interest of moral decency.

Category: Moral Decency
Strength: Mild
Proposed by: Goobergunchia

Description: RESOLVED, That the act of sexual molestation of a pre-pubescent minor is hereby outlawed in all UN member nations.

Votes For: 11739

Votes Against: 1363

Implemented: Fri Jul 18 2003

This is quite a simple resolution and as such, very effective in it's simplicity.

Your proposal seeks to outlaw all sexual molestation without reason; mostly because "you say so" and assume that all nations already outlaw most of it. You cannot assume anything and to do so in a repeal or resolution. I highly suggest that you read my repeal guide, located in my signature, and if you're serious about this perhaps try to write a repeal that actually fights against this resolution rather than just assuming the NS UN wants a revote.

Well, let's consider the resolution itself:



This is quite a simple resolution and as such, very effective in it's simplicity.

Your proposal seeks to outlaw all sexual molestation without reason; mostly because "you say so" and assume that all nations already outlaw most of it. You cannot assume anything and to do so in a repeal or resolution. I highly suggest that you read my repeal guide, located in my signature, and if you're serious about this perhaps try to write a repeal that actually fights against this resolution rather than just assuming the NS UN wants a revote.

How far do we take "cannot assume anything"? I can't assume that other nations have existing laws against murder, theft, and generally harming other people for no reason?

Scratch that - doesn't res. 53 section 5-a (quoted above) already apply to sexual assualts? Perhaps I just need a new repeal proposal basically saying that Res. 53 section 5 makes res. 22 redundant.

OK, I just read through the Repeal Writing Guide (well, re-read, just more carefully this time) and will create a new forum thread for an attempt at a rewrite.

Scratch that - doesn't res. 53 section 5-a (quoted above) already apply to sexual assualts? Perhaps I just need a new repeal proposal basically saying that Res. 53 section 5 makes res. 22 redundant.

I'm sure someone would've spotted that with how closely we scrutinize most proposals in this forum and in the proposal list if that was truly the case prior to it making it into the queue.

OK, I just read through the Repeal Writing Guide (well, re-read, just more carefully this time) and will create a new forum thread for an attempt at a rewrite.

Good luck with it! If you'd like, I can look over it before you post it if you send it to me via telegram and give you some preliminary feedback, OOC, just based on the writing of it and what-not.

So why do you want it repealed? What problem do you have with the outlawing of the sexual molestation of children?

Perhaps to put a better resolution in its place.

No offense, but that particular resolution reads a bit more like an ultimatium than an international resolution.

There is *a* region that is working on a new abortion resolution to place on the floor the minute the legalized abortion resolution is repealed. In fact, they might soon flex their muscle and make the repeal a reality as well.

Repeals are sometimes a way to improve something. Even if somebody is trying to clean something away, there is no reason you can't resubmit whatever was repealed with a few minor improvements and try again.

Despite the pedophilia resolution's poor construction, it has enough support that I suspect that a repeal would probably fail unless a better resolution was on hand and promoted as part of the repeal process. But then that is me assuming that people don't just have knee-jerk reactions, which based on many UN forum posts from all experience levels of nations, it obviously me being an optimist. ::sigh::