NationStates Jolt Archive

Is it against the rules to submit a proposal to the UN that tries to create an official animal, flower, plant, insect, fish, or any of the other odd proposals that normally come up in a real democratic governing body?

Is it against the rules to submit a proposal to the UN that tries to create a national animal, flower, plant, insect, fish, or any of the other odd proposals that normally come up in a real democratic governing body?

If you're creating a national icon, you do not need to go through the UN. It would be considered "wasting the UNs time".

If a UN proposal is trying to create a UN sponsored animal, currency, etc, it would be considered a game mechanics proposal and as such, violates the rules of submission.

Is it against the rules to submit a proposal to the UN that tries to create a national animal, flower, plant, insect, fish, or any of the other odd proposals that normally come up in a real democratic governing body?
The other responses are correct. Basically, yes, it's against the rules.

Is it against the rules to submit a proposal to the UN that tries to create a national animal, flower, plant, insect, fish, or any of the other odd proposals that normally come up in a real democratic governing body?


NationState's UN is a simulation of the real UN, therefore proposals that might be passed in the real UN, ie: things that would affect the way a country is run, would only be considered here, not changing the game's mechanics.

Sorry.

NationState's UN is a simulation of the real UN, therefore proposals that might be passed in the real UN, ie: things that would affect the way a country is run, would only be considered here, not changing the game's mechanics.

Sorry.

Easy, Myotis. He said national animal, which means "in his nation". I think there is some confusion involved.

He can pass a law accepting as national fruit salad or anything else, within his nation, whenever he likes.

He said national animal, which means "in his nation". I think there is some confusion involved.

UltimateEnd cleary said:

Is it against the rules to submit a proposal to the UN that tries to create a national animal, flower, plant, insect, fish, or any of the other odd proposals that normally come up in a real democratic governing body?

Thus, UE wanted to know if he/she could submit a proposal that made a single animal for every nation in the UN... at least, that's what the language would suggest.

my apologies, yes I did say national. but I meant international. Is it possible to create a single animal, flower, plant, insect, fish, etc... that would be the official symbol or whatever for the UN?

If a UN proposal is trying to create a UN sponsored animal, currency, etc, it would be considered a game mechanics proposal and as such, violates the rules of submission.

Why?

If the motion were to say, "The UNEC shall have a logo with a book worm on it." I honestly don't see how this is a violation of game mechanics. No forum activity is mandated, no game code is being changed.

I think it is very dangerous to simply wave hands and declare everything game mechanics violations, when in reality I believe part of the question really wasn't "is this illegal", but more of a "how can I keep this within the rules".

Why?

If the motion were to say, "The UNEC shall have a logo with a book worm on it." I honestly don't see how this is a violation of game mechanics. No forum activity is mandated, no game code is being changed.

I think it is very dangerous to simply wave hands and declare everything game mechanics violations, when in reality I believe part of the question really wasn't "is this illegal", but more of a "how can I keep this within the rules".
Exactly my question, i'm not trying to cause chaos.

Exactly my question, i'm not trying to cause chaos.

:) Been there done that.

Part of the issue is that the game has "modists" (people who aren't mods, but still like to behave like them -- just like I'm doing right now). Anyways, the easiest answer is always no. Five years ago when I was a wet behind my ears engineer my soon to be ex-boss said that it is easier to ask for forgiveness than permission.

While I'm not advocating that anybody run and do things first, sometimes having a concrete example or "draft" worked out first can allow thoe modists amongst us to actually give more constructive advice than a blanket "no". Consider it like a programming "proof of concept" approach, but I'm pretty sure that if you went ahead and showed us in more detail that we might be able to work around whatever "hard rules" supposedly exist.

;) Good luck.

BTW: I'm hoping you'll make owls the mascot of the UNEC. Hersfold and others might disagree, but my nation has two soft spots for borrowing owls, one in the heart, and the other in the tummy! :9

The other responses are correct. Basically, yes, it's against the rules.


Yo, Mik - Last I checked, Unfree People is a Moderator. Any other questions?

Yo, Mik - Last I checked, Unfree People is a Moderator. Any other questions?

A forum moderator, not a game moderator.

But yo daddy -- *waves hands in the air* -- you are right, I have a single question that perhaps you can answer:

Does the Unfree People search the UN proposal queue and delete inappropriate proposals?


My original point stands. The "judgement" passed by a forum moderator or a modist (i.e. player who acts like a moderator) isn't set in stone. There are plenty of easy examples where a resolution could include a clause where an international "symbol" is suggested.

Hold off for another second ... this doesn't mean that the idea is a good one nor one that many players will like. Naturally, being an owl fan, my government has instructed me to vote NO on any animal that doesn't have feathers that is nominated as an international symbol ... especially snakes and rats, they are food for food. ;)

We've got wiggle room here, because the reality is I've seen NOTHING to suggest a game mechanics change or mandate for forum activity ... not even a straight jacket on roleplaying.

BTW: the real UN does have an official logo, an official color, and even *gasp* official headquarters. I think the game has assumed the first two by using the real UN's flag / logo on the web page, so we shouldn't change that (that would be changing the code), but the headquarters ... Frisbeeteria once suggested that the UN forum is hosted in Stephanistan (which actually might sadly mean that the building is going to have to be flown to Cogitation or the Most Glorious Hack) if the Stephanistan ambassador allows her nation to slip into obscurity -- right, this is called roleplaying, and ain't really real, but hey, I like to encourage it.

Frisbeeteria once suggested that the UN forum is hosted in Stephanistan (which actually might sadly mean that the building is going to have to be flown to Cogitation or the Most Glorious Hack)
That was Goobergunchia, actually. And yes, I hear those black helicopters outside as we speak.

It's not Game Mechanics you should be worried about, it's "not worthy of the UN's consideration", an open-ended argument if ever there was one. Thank Enodia for that.

In the real-world UN (US Congress / House of Commons / probably any lawmaking body), it's possible to add silly laws creating "National 'Be Kind To Ragweed' Days" by adding them to the official record and having a daily or weekly consensus vote to accept all of them. Nobody cares. It's a political gimmick, freely used for purposes of highlighting an issue or awarding cheap patronage.

In the NSUN, we have no such mechanism. EVERY proposal that makes it to quorum legally will be voted on by the General Assembly for a four day vote. THAT is what I take to mean, "Not worthy of notice". If somebody wants to waste the time promoting and telegramming delegates over a piece of fluff, more power to them. I don't think Cogitation or Hack or GMC will be amused, and they are the troika that must be courted. Pretty much nobody else counts, because pretty much nobody else cares.

That was Goobergunchia, actually. And yes, I hear those black helicopters outside as we speak.


In the NSUN, we have no such mechanism. EVERY proposal that makes it to quorum legally will be voted on by the General Assembly for a four day vote. THAT is what I take to mean, "Not worthy of notice". If somebody wants to waste the time promoting and telegramming delegates over a piece of fluff, more power to them. I don't think Cogitation or Hack or GMC will be amused, and they are the troika that must be courted. Pretty much nobody else counts, because pretty much nobody else cares.

Now this is a sincere question:
Don't resolutions sit on the UN floor for closer to 4.5 days? I've noticed that they seem to come up sometime between 1 am and 6 am PST and then close closer to 12 pm PST on the fifth day of debate. For example, didn't the current resolution hit the floor on Friday early AM?

It might help to know exactly when, so we can tell the proponents to get their first shot readied.


And now my own silly suggestion. Stephanistan has 27 days, right? Maybe we can start constructing a new UN Headquarters in Cogitation, Hack, or the Military place, but perhaps we should just have a poll where we'll plop the next headquarters. (BTW, Goober's original suggestion was a nice one, so I'm actually serious about having a somewhat democratic way of deciding the new unofficial headquarters location.)

Ok well, I guess that answers my question... So will any one here vote for a resolution creating Caffeine day? How about Septemper Third?

Stephanistan has 27 days, right?
Ummm ... the podium is vibrating, Mik. We're in flight even now. The nation of Stephistan is gone, pulled beneath the waves like Atlantis, as if a mighty hand pulled the flush lever and then suddenly left the stall.

Stephistan and the Role-Play University region have been the official hosts for some time now. I have no idea how it was decided, but it was decided and has been there ever since. If we had a historical record (forum purge and mods leaving have cost us dearly), it would be in the historical record. As it stands, you just have to take the word of the old-timers.

As for a new location, I'm sure Kandarin could find us a nice empty island in the Rejected Realms. Given the popularity of the UN at this point, can you think of a more appropriate location?

Ummm ... the podium is vibrating, Mik. We're in flight even now. The nation of Stephistan is gone, pulled beneath the waves like Atlantis, as if a mighty hand pulled the flush lever and then suddenly left the stall.

As for a new location, I'm sure Kandarin could find us a nice empty island in the Rejected Realms. Given the popularity of the UN at this point, can you think of a more appropriate location?

Actually ... that probably is the best solution.

p.s. does this mean they are now testing NS2?

p.s. does this mean they are now testing NS2?

No, it means that Stephistan quit the game and deleted her nation.

As for why RPU was the unofficial home of the UN, well... that would be because Steph used to be very active in here during her pre-mod days and during her early FM days. She gradually migrated more and more to General and eventually pretty much just hung out in General.