NationStates Jolt Archive

This is addressed to all the delegates who tell new members from fundamentalist Christian, Islamic or otherwise homophobic nations that they legalized same-sex marriage immediatly upon joining all the only way to get out of it is to resign from the U.N.

I reccommend you review the NSUN sticky here (http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=282176)

Players may voluntarily incorporate UN resolutions into their roleplays, if they wish, but must remember that doing so is technically outside the scope of the UN resolution. In freeform roleplay, one can pretend that a nation blatantly ignores the effects of a UN resolution. When writing UN proposals, though, the author has to assume that no UN member nation may ignore the effects of the UN resolutions because, really, no UN member nation is able to ignore the effects of the UN resolution. The effects are programmed into the NationStates game engine.

That means that a nation cannot ignore the effects of the resolutions but it explicitly states that if you are roleplaying say, The Vatican, you can continue to forbid homosexuality as a member of the UN. The only thing it says is that compliance enforcement should not be written into resolutions and nations are automatically affected statistically by all passed resolutions.

*shakes head and rolls eyes*

That clause means you can roleplay non-compliance if you like (though you're taken as a poor RPer in most cases if you do). Your nation still has the set of laws created by the UN, like it or not.

Good grief, you people need a primer on what "role playing games" means. Also "playing fair".

Okay, roleplayers rejoice, I guess.

However, the UN does not force Member Nations to implement a system of civil joinings, or require NS to bestow benefits to citizens who are joined under civil law.

So, same sex marriage has not been legalized in any UN NS through the use of current resolutions, if the NS has no such civil system to begin with.

I have an idea, Adam.

Why not approve all proposals, regardless of content, as they don't affect anything? After all, they don't connect at all to anything...

Gee, wait, that blows the reason for "role playing". You know, where it's "accept conditions that may be contrary to your own beliefs for the consistancy of the game being played".

*click*

I never said it was a good idea. I just showed what the rules actually are, instead of the pretend version being described to many players. And just imagine... roleplaying a nation that doesn't follow every UN mandate... I'm not sure where the inspiration for that idea would come from...

There are obviously ways to go about it. If you're going to blatantly ignore a resolution, you ought to be prepared to roleplay your nation undergoing sanctions and possibly an invasion or visit from a neo-conservative enforcement squad.

The idea that everyone in every nation automatically follows every rule to a T is unrealistic and quite frankly, silly and ridiculous. Conflicts between regional and interegional autonomy have driven most of the major civil and cultural wars in the rl US, UN, EU, etc., and it only makes sense that most nations would fudge on minor issues, and a few would become outright rouge states.

The moderators apparently see this as legitimate roleplay, since they took the time to explicitly say that it is allowed, and even italicized the voluntary use of the resolutions in roleplay. Not everyone wants to rp the UN as though it were an overriding world government (hence all the national soveriegnty topics)- it can be viewed as a massive alliance among many other things.

I want to hear all about these "rouge" states. Then all about the mascara states, and the lipstick states. :rolleyes:

In this post, you're talking about "realistic gaming". In the first, you're not, you're simply being disruptive to role play here.

Do consider the results of your actions. It would appear the "new crop of gamers" has never played "let's pretend" and has no idea what role playing is. This is obvious by the blurring of OOC and IC considerations, among other blaringly evident signs.

The Fuscia NS of Anti Pharisaism is interested in why roleplaying is so important. And if it is required to roleplay.

What's the point of joining the UN if all you're going to do is ignore the outcomes of the resolutions?

OOC: T'ain't none. It's called "being a spoilsport".

Why not approve all proposals, regardless of content, as they don't affect anything? After all, they don't connect at all to anything...


Sure they do. They adjust your nation's stats.

OOC: I touched on this in 'what the UN does and what it does for you'

'I'm role playing so I can role play not following them' As valid as the argument as it might seam is some people consider it Godmodding and as such they will fire I.G.N.O.R.E cannons. Of course some don't and we enter into one of the more confusing aspects of The UN forums. Exploiting a loop hole is considered valid by most people although I wouldn't go too far with it.

The RP issue is one of the Incidents and other RP forums...

This forum (United Nations) is not strictly RP. So raising an RP issue of non-compliance in here is most certainly invalid, and ignorant (and as the Black New World has said, it is likely to have you looking down the wrong end of an I.G.N.O.R.E. cannon).

Within here, all NSUN Laws passed are enforced in your nation; and we all act like it does, because it, in fact, does. (This is called dealing with 'realty' [though reality in this instance is governed by the mechanics of this game, and not firm reality]).

This does raise an interesting point. While I'd look down on some n00b who just blindly ignores every Resolution put forth, there could be some respectable RP situations where a Resolution is ignored, in which case I wouldn't ignore the nation. Generally, though, I treat every Resolution as if it were implemented, and if a nation does decide to ignore a Resolution they'd have to have a pretty compelling story for me not to ignore tha nation- but in that case I'd call in the UN to denounce the nation and impose sanctions against the offender.

Right. My concern is that instead of explaining this to new members, not all of whom are new to roleplaying (although it is usually pretty obvious when they are) they are given misinformation and half-truths instead.

I concider that this subject needs a new resolution as there has been such large growth since this resolution. As I am not homophobic but my scientists have pointed out that homosexuality is holistic state of sickness where normal human urges are replaced by these homosexual urges.

Sure they do. They adjust your nation's stats.I'll chalk this up as an example of sarcasm being lost on you because the MOD part of the brain takes over some other functions, :p

* Reads post by " Combat Engineers " and ponders amature genetic manipulation of future global population, with some kind of solid wood working tool. I did say " amature " after all.

*shakes head and rolls eyes*

That clause means you can roleplay non-compliance if you like (though you're taken as a poor RPer in most cases if you do). Your nation still has the set of laws created by the UN, like it or not.

Good grief, you people need a primer on what "role playing games" means. Also "playing fair".

Playing fair in this situation, assumes that everyone has a representative in the form of a delegate to the UN...and the single nation regions DON'T. So, oh yeah...if I don't agree with laws made FOR me without any representation FOR me...I'm going to ignore the damned things if I want to.

This does raise an interesting point. While I'd look down on some n00b who just blindly ignores every Resolution put forth, there could be some respectable RP situations where a Resolution is ignored, in which case I wouldn't ignore the nation. Generally, though, I treat every Resolution as if it were implemented, and if a nation does decide to ignore a Resolution they'd have to have a pretty compelling story for me not to ignore tha nation- but in that case I'd call in the UN to denounce the nation and impose sanctions against the offender.

I'm in a single nation region and therefore have no representative to the UN until NS corrects this oversight, well...no legislation w/o representation. If you don't live in my region, you don't SPEAK for my region. And I'm damned if I'll abide by the decisions of a body wherein I don't have a voice.

You don't have a fucking CLUE what you're talking about. So just shut up about it.

I'm in a single nation region and therefore have no representative to the UN until NS corrects this oversight, well...no legislation w/o representation. If you don't live in my region, you don't SPEAK for my region. And I'm damned if I'll abide by the decisions of a body wherein I don't have a voice.

If you have a vote, you have a voice. And regardless of region size; you have a vote if you are a member. You may not be able to make proposals because you lack endorsement, and you may not have power of approval of proposals because you lack a delegate; but that should be encouragement to bring more states into your region...

The Rules and operations of this body were available to you at application; and became your responsibility at membership... You have no authority to refuse abidement later, as long as a member, to play by the rules and procedured to which you agreed to at membership.

I'm in a single nation region and therefore have no representative to the UN until NS corrects this oversight, well...no legislation w/o representation. If you don't live in my region, you don't SPEAK for my region. And I'm damned if I'll abide by the decisions of a body wherein I don't have a voice.

Alright, so why did you join if it is so oppressive to be here? And why don't you leave if its so oppressive to be here? Remember - membership is voluntary and UN Resolutions only affect UN Nations. If you don't like - well, go your own merry way.