NationStates Jolt Archive

Okay, many of you will have seen this many times before. I've been working on this (drafting, getting help, getting support and campaigning) for about the past 7 weeks. Unfortunatly, this proposal has not reached quorum yet, though it has come close on several occassions.

I am considering giving up on this proposal. Many people have given their support and their help in drafting and campaigning for this proposal. I am going to submit it one more time, this Saturday Sydney time. I hope that it reaches quorum this time. So here it is.

Habeas Corpus

Category: Human Rights Strength: Significant

Habeas Corpus; by the passing of this resolution instituting the legal principle of Habeas Corpus by the voting members, Habeas Corpus will thus be affirmed by the United Nations as a set and irrefutable legal principle to which all member nations and all associated internal agencies are subject.

Recognising that Habeas Corpus is a founding principle of law in many nations, the UN formally adopts Habeas Corpus across all member states.

To clearly define Habeas Corpus:

Habeas Corpus is the legal principle that gives a person the right to not be held without charge. A charge must be filed with the judicial authorities of the country in which the suspected crime is committed within 24 hours of the person being held by police, or any other body charged with the upholding of the nation's laws. Habeas Corpus also declares accordingly that once a charge is filed, then the person should be treated as per the Definition of Fair Trial resolution.

Further noting,

If the captured or detained person is a prisoner of war or is captured or detained in an area of military conflict by forces of whom may be recognised as the opposition, then he or she must be held as per the previously recognised and enforced Wolfish Convention on PoWs.
I am asking one last time for your support of this proposal which I have been told on many occassions is worthwhile.

I'm not a delegate, but will be asking my delegate to endorse this.

Enn,

“A large part of history is replete with the struggle for human rights, an eternal struggle in which final victory can never be won. But to tire in that struggle would mean the ruin of society.” - Albert Einstein.

- The Rep of Komokom, RMoS.

We think this is suffering from Absolutely Essential But Kinda Boring Legislation Syndrome. Maybe if you put in some more pretty trees and wide-eyed schoolkids.

Nonetheless, full support.

* Looks doubtful,

... I don't know, last time I tried cramming wide eyed school kids into something the police were involved, thank-fully they too enjoy a good casserole, :wink:

- The Rep of Komokom, RMoS.

Horrified Crowd : " Think of the children ! "

Me : "I did ! BURP "

:D

( Go Enn's proposal, ra ra ra ! )

As you have now added the rider regarding POW's ..... we will now endorse it.

the mere metion of children being used as a cheap alternative to chicken is enough to get me to support.

*Swift rolls in grave*

It's funny that silly proposals that ban woodchipping and ensure freedom of choice come to vote, but serious proposals like this struggle to come to a vote. I hope that more delegates will support this resolution or at least make it clear why they are not supporting it.

One thing that I think it is lacking, however, is a requirement that the person in custody is informed of the charges against him.

The Clan Council of the Republic of Brogona Wishes to offer its support to this proposal.

Where do we sign?

Trollax Kinora
Clan Founder, Republic of Brogona.

(OOC: No seriously, is there a proposal up for vetting yet?)

The Clan Council of the Republic of Brogona Wishes to offer its support to this proposal.

Where do we sign?

Trollax Kinora
Clan Founder, Republic of Brogona.

(OOC: No seriously, is there a proposal up for vetting yet?)

I didn't see it on the proposal page yet...... so My guess is that Enn is being very careful in his wording before he submits it. When he does submit the proposal, only the delegates will be allowed to enorse it. So if you are not a delegate and you do agree with this proposal... please do contact your regional delegate and ask them to support it.

The reason for his taking time in writing it is because of delegates like myself who will not endorse a proposal unless it does not interfere with national sovregity or basic human freedoms that we, the Church of Psychotropics, hold dear. :D

I am a regional delegate... although Zweeeong is also up for delegateship. Either way we'll be voting for it. The DAE is fairly uniform politically.

I whole heartedly endorse this!

~President Harrison Romanostof
~Prime minister Glenn Lustenzoleren

I have already submitted some 5 times, but will do so again in 2 days time, on Saturday morning Sydney time. That is simply to give myself enough time to campaign fully.

Psychotropics: This is the exact same form as every other time it has been submitted. The rider referring to PoWs was there at the start.

Bootai-Bootai: I was informed at the time of the first draft that a person was required to have a list of what they are charged with because of a previous UN resolution. I'll have a look through the past UN resolutions to try and find that particular article. I didn't see any need to re-state what another resolution had already said.

Change of plan. I'll submit Sunday evening, and if it doesn't get through I'll go again next Friday. I've just got a heck of a lot on this weekend.

Has now been submitted. Any help campaigning for this would definitely be appreciated.

I've approved most of the proposal versions of this, including the current one, and wish you luck with it, however - sorry - I won't be able to help you campaign. I do think you should keep trying. I was once advised by somebody to try submitting proposals on monday mornings just after the update - hope that helps if this attempt fails and you decide to re-submit.

Good luck.
I agree with Einstein.

If you read the past UN Resoltuions, Habeas Corpus is already UN law. Several times, in fact. Just a little information.

Lindim: could you be more specific? Apart from going through the past UN resolution list myself, several others did so, and we couldn't find anything that resembled Habeas Corpus. I believe one person located a reference to having a list of charges given to the defendant, but that is not the same thing. I also sent this to Enodia, and he said it would be fine as far as the game rules are concerned.

Right now my internet is having trouble, so I'll take your word for it. Maybe I mixed it up with something else.

Good luck with the proposal!

I am supporting this again, Enn, and good luck getting it through this time.

Thank you for your support. I'm in the middle of half-yearlys at the moment, so I'll submit again on Friday - I've got a day off.

His Holiness the Governor-General wishes to extend a mixed-blessing to this proposed resolution.

Within The Dominion of North East Cathanistan, and indeed within the United States of America and The Federation of Russia, the term `Habeas Corpus', which translates from latin `have the body', to mean a practice of *proving* a crime was actually committed before any person may be charged by police of commitence of a crime. His Holiness asserts police lacking guidance become criminals themselves.

While His Holiness extends pleasure on viewing such United Nations legislation, His Holiness, on the grounds of Good Governence, must object to this proposal until and unless said mention is included within the articles of the proposal in question. His Holiness recognizes that even within the constraints of United Nations Resolutions there are many nations which arbitrarily charge citizens with non-existent crimes, and this proposal, as written, will not protect said victims.

His Holiness looks forward to the next revision where he may offer unflagging support, but at this time must object to this legislation in such that it, as written, will only empower despots and tyrants and therefore facilitate atrocities under the auspices of the United Nations.

[signed]
The Bishop Fred al-Rubei of The Directorate of Foreign Relations of The Dominion of North East Cathanistan

North East Cathanistan: I have chosen to utilise the term Habeas Corpus in the definition that is used by the (real-world) Australian law system: a person who has been arrested must stand trial. To stand trial requires a charge. Thus, this proposal is intended to protect the right to not be held without charge. Yes, Habeas Corpus literally means "you have the body", as it was written at the top of a legal writ requiring a person to stand trial.

I am utilising this term as I understand it. In my thinking, if a crime can be proved to have not occurred, then the person charged with said crime must be set free. However, I have chosen to leave this open to national jurisdiction.

Keeping this topic open before I submit (again) tomorrow morning.

Submitted: Go you good thing go!

I am all for Habeas Corpus. But this resolution allows member states to legislate to allow 23 hour detention followed by release followed by 23 hour detention. There is nothing to stop this vicious cycle of release and rearrests.

Well, I've just spent several hours TGing all the people who supported the last 4 submissions. If they all endorse this, then it will reach quorum fine.

Eruland: I admit, you've got a point there. If this passes, then a later amendment may be in order fix this. If this doesn't pass, then you are free to do whatever you want with the proposal, because I won't be submitting again.

Also, many may regard what you are saying as being part of national sovereignty, rather than international human rights.

Has 65, needs 87 in the next 24 hours (or so).

This is a great proposal, and it has our full support. It's too bad we aren't the regional delegate.

This proposal will always have my support, and I would gladly assist it in any way Enn suggests to me. Yes Enn, an open invitation there, lol.

- The Rep of Komokom, RMoS.
http://www.nationstates.net/images/flags/uploads/komokom.jpg (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/24401/page=display_nation)

Has 103, needs 49. Gah! I think I will submit again, because it's come so close so many times.

( Applause )

Go Enn ! Go Habeas Corpus !

...

- Whip Crack -

Approve harder delegates, approve now !

:wink:

- The Rep of Komokom, RMoS.
http://www.nationstates.net/images/flags/uploads/komokom.jpg (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/24401/page=display_nation)
Continuous Modernisation and Competence Developing

While we are strong supporter of human rights and allow our citizens as many rights as possible with very little government intervention, we find that the resolution which you have drafted unacceptable. The reason we find it unnacceptable is because we do not believe that the United Nations should be forcing issues upon us and we should be allowed to make policy decisions on our own. If this resolution does make it to a vote, we will strongly oppose this and ask our delegate to vote against it.

While we are strong supporter of human rights and allow our citizens as many rights as possible with very little government intervention, we find that the resolution which you have drafted unacceptable. The reason we find it unnacceptable is because we do not believe that the United Nations should be forcing issues upon us and we should be allowed to make policy decisions on our own. If this resolution does make it to a vote, we will strongly oppose this and ask our delegate to vote against it.

If you don't believe that the UN should be forcing issues upon us - and I interpret your statement as meaning any issues - what do you think it is for? It has a legislative powers and should use it (hopefully in an appropriate manner). If you feel this strongly about your inviolable sovereignty then I recommend you give serious thought to your continuing membership of the UN.

agreed. You have the support of my people.

There is not such thing as Habeas Corpus in the United Fascist Empire or the Fascist White States. None at all. I therefore thoroughly reject the notion of such a resolution.

There is not such thing as Habeas Corpus in the United Fascist Empire or the Fascist White States. None at all. I therefore thoroughly reject the notion of such a resolution.

So? You are not even a member of the UN!

There is not such thing as Habeas Corpus in the United Fascist Empire or the Fascist White States. None at all. I therefore thoroughly reject the notion of such a resolution.

So? You are not even a member of the UN!

I have applied to join.