NationStates Jolt Archive

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While I understand you frustration and share your faith in Christ, the expression of ideas, religious or otherwise is too precious to risk censorship. For when we decide to blot out certain views, who will it be that makes that decision? I certainly do not belive myself of sufficient moral rectitude to make that determination for others.

Again, please accept my sympathy for what you perceive as faith-bashing. The Catholic tradition is a beautiful one that deserves far more admiration than it gets.

if people are saying things about catholicism which you believe to be based on ignorance of the religion, take it as an opportunity to educate them. as many as 5% of the people on this forum may be willing to take your words seriously, and consider what you teach them in future judgements of catholicism, or christianity in general (just keep in mind that this is a far cry from getting them to agree with you, it just means they'll understand your end of things a bit better).

Agreed, freedom of speech dictates that I am allowed the ability to profess that I believe that there is no god. I'm sorry if you children are too sensitive to hear such things, but that just tells me you have no resilience when it comes to religion. In addition, you just proclaimed your faith and such... what right do you have to demand something when you just violated what you just demanded? No Moral Highground there buddy. If you don't like it, simply don't read it.

Vivelo, I approach religion from the opposite perspective -- from that of an atheist -- but I share your fustration. I, too, am told that my ethical and philosophical beliefs are wrong and quite often hear that I'm "immoral" because I do not subscribe to Judeo-Christian ethics. However, I don't think that we should stilfe discussion of this topic because one of us might be offended. One of my favorite topics is actually which parts of religions are good and which parts are not so good. I think everyone benefits from critical analysis and debate of ideas. In fact, I've even increased the faith of one of my friends through our discussion-arguments about religion. I hope that instead of seeing an attack on your religion by critics or by worrying about being misrepresented by extremists from within your religion that you will see even atheists working along side you just trying to make sense of the world. The best way, it seems, is often through debate. I dream of a day when we will all be tolerant and open about our religious or philosophical beliefs and can discuss them in a civil manner.

I would not and do not insult peoples religions. But I have the right to state my beliefs just as you do (and I don't believe there is a god).

The best thing to do is to leave religion out of debates. It cannot be verified and is not an acceptable argument to a lot of people. You can express that you feel a certain way about something because of your religious beliefs, but don't expect anyone to agree with your argument from that. And don't be surprised when someone judges you in terms of a stereotypical idea of your religion if you only use religion to justify your position. Religion is not logic or logical in most instances, don't try to use it as such.

If someone is attacking your religion without provocation then you should point out how that offends you and perhaps correct their potential misunderstanding. However, if someone is using a quote from a person they are most often commenting on that particular opinion, if it is from some influential religious leader it will most likely reflect on that religions adherents. There are overly conservative religious zealots, not all catholics are of course, but there are some that are. Using the example of one doesn't mean that person thinks that all people of that religion are, and if you disagree with the points of someone who is a catholic then another persons response to that person has nothing to do with you.

Do not take things so personally, the majority of us are aware that not all catholics are fundamentalist zealots. We also know that there are some that are and we have the right to comment on those mislead beliefs.

Well spoken, Filderhaden.

Vivelo,
None of us are attacking Catholicism. We are debating in these threads (abortion and gay rights) varied positions as taken by the Pope in his encyclacals.

Your freedom of religion is not derived from me. In fact I don't have to give it to you. You're free to have your religion and I'm free not to have one. The GOVERNMENT can't intervene on that. However, if you (and or the governing body of your religion) decides to tell me that I'm going to hell, then I can certainly say that I think your religion is the stupidist thing I've ever heard. And I can certainly say that it's causing me some degree of problems.

One thing that all people must realize, that applies to both the religion bashers, and the stereotypical catholics, is that while it is right to have an opinion, it is not right to impose it on others.