NationStates Jolt Archive

Sadly, this is NOT a joke. :shock: :shock: :shock:

HIPPOS ARE BIG

A resolution to improve worldwide human and civil rights.

Category: Human Rights
Strength: Strong
Proposed by: Architeuthis

Description: WHEREAS the participants of the NationStates forum, while quite noisy, do not accurately represent the vast majority of the NationStates players, and;

WHEREAS said vast majority of players unequivocably support the Freedom of Humor for all, and;

WHEREAS hippos are indeed quite large,

I hold this truth to be self-evident...

HIPPOS ARE BIG.

Approvals: 132 (1 Infinite Loop, Francos Spain, Themanistan, Pancake_pl, Xaqon, Tarrican, Apuent, Benlandia, Butthole, Hill People, Slowmo, Arctopia, Mikaelsdaman, Rensel, Helfania, Hagge, Sulon, StovjestovqueX, Cesspit III, Towarzysz Gomulka, Wordem, The Pyrenees, Communist Rebels, Wintermute, Loopyland II, Cutetopia, Beanbag Chairs, St Lafayette, Avalonian Angels, Lamoni, Xeaon, Scotland and Jamaica, Tyrantar, Morphesia, Gormith, Hebrew National, Goldfish Addicts, New North Balwyn, Boblovia, Haida Gwaii, Hedgetopia, Broadbeam, Quite, Libertanica, Doovidle, Assassinopants, Salty Water, Kowdom, Dudemonkeys, Genetic manipulated, Hampster Squared, The Cymreg, Allund, Big Santa, Azbakwurds, Unholy Anarchy MK2, Guevara Rocha, Assasinated Beauty, Adstarion, Petohdom, WNDRBRA, Boaravia, Wyzata, Tremaine, Andinostan, Tara TheGreate, Motala, KelDa, Michopolis, Fruztya, Conrado, BillyDean, Estolad, Nucular, Oplep, Isanistan, Of Fur Traders, Britannian, Squigy II, Mundainia, Bananadine, Endolantron, Arinim, Why and wy not, Goosetnam, Squatia, The Judean Front, Schizophonica, Total Desolation, The All Powerfull Berg, Cheshire and Ted, Ravens Ait, Saturnzero, Kzagblech, The Orion Nebula, Norion, Klonor, Marradon, Ishkari, Anhinga, Polo de la hago, Knootoss, Christ the Messiah, Patalano, Clownfish, Canadagua, Christopher IV, NDak, Fundamentalist Monkies, Nenuial, Valentria, Penguin Troopers, Republican Britain, Whats it to you, Nucleo, Northfiels, Caesarea, Evil puppies, Isfulabul, Saido, Port Coquitlam, Excessive Firepower, The Maple Leaf, Brandiland, APV, New Dorkland, Camarolina, Feces-flinging Monkey, Kings World, Charney, WonderShroomLand, Canine Despotism)

Status: Quorum Reached: In Queue!

*grumble* *scheme* *spew*

Lord Evif regains his composure just long enough to say:

Mr. Chairman, I make a point of order against this proposal on grounds of type-description mismatch and spam.

If this resolution is NOT purged, I will be voting EMPHATICALLY in the negative.

Lord Evif, Goobergunchian UN Ambassador
Founder of the DU Region

It is morons like you that need to be kicked out the United Nations
Un Ambassor 0101010

It is morons like you that need to be kicked out the United Nations
Un Ambassor 0101010

MODALERT - flaming

This has been an OOC post.

It has to be kicked out! What is wrong with people these days?

Upon examining the bill, our Senators had a resounding laugh and voted 224-1 to vote IN FAVOR of this bill.

Lawrence Fondor, the current Speaker of the Senate, announced emphatically, "This resolution is absolutely harmless. It's the kind of thing that governments should be doing."

It is morons like you that need to be kicked out the United Nations
Un Ambassor 0101010

OOC: do not flame please. One flame leads to another, and next thing you know, we all end up with warnings or even deadenings from mods. I'd raher kept my slate as clean as possible

IC: The Multinational Green Empire of Qaaolchour stands staunchly behind the Liberal Unitary Republic of Goobergunchia on this.

Upon examining the bill, our Senators had a resounding laugh and voted 224-1 to vote IN FAVOR of this bill.

Lawrence Fondor, the current Speaker of the Senate, announced emphatically, "This resolution is absolutely harmless. It's the kind of thing that governments should be doing."

How does this resolution "improve worldwide human and civil rights?"

who knows, but seriously this is an issue, if we can't decide which is the second largest land animal then how are we to count down the top 10 largest?

Its a world crisis which must be solved

Upon examining the bill, our Senators had a resounding laugh and voted 224-1 to vote IN FAVOR of this bill.

Lawrence Fondor, the current Speaker of the Senate, announced emphatically, "This resolution is absolutely harmless. It's the kind of thing that governments should be doing."

How does this resolution "improve worldwide human and civil rights?"

Because it forces government to spend time on innocuous things, and overbearing government is the number 1 violater of human rights.

Upon examining the bill, our Senators had a resounding laugh and voted 224-1 to vote IN FAVOR of this bill.

Lawrence Fondor, the current Speaker of the Senate, announced emphatically, "This resolution is absolutely harmless. It's the kind of thing that governments should be doing."

How does this resolution "improve worldwide human and civil rights?"

Because it forces government to spend time on innocuous things, and overbearing government is the number 1 violater of human rights.

So in other words, it forces the UN to spend time on something of no importance whatsoever?

who knows, but seriously this is an issue, if we can't decide which is the second largest land animal then how are we to count down the top 10 largest?

Its a world crisis which must be solved

The resolution does not specify the rank of the hippo. It only specifies that hippos are big.

Upon examining the bill, our Senators had a resounding laugh and voted 224-1 to vote IN FAVOR of this bill.

Lawrence Fondor, the current Speaker of the Senate, announced emphatically, "This resolution is absolutely harmless. It's the kind of thing that governments should be doing."

How does this resolution "improve worldwide human and civil rights?"

Because it forces government to spend time on innocuous things, and overbearing government is the number 1 violater of human rights.

So in other words, it forces the UN to spend time on something of no importance whatsoever?

Exactly. Which is a good thing.

Like the US government has a Helium Fund. If the government spent more time managing the Helium Fund and less time trying to manage Social Security or Foreign Policy, the world would be a much better place.

It's not keeping us from voting on other issues. Perhaps it is time to reevaluate how the UN is at present. Perhaps it has become too rigid and humorless, and while it needs to be serious, It has become overly serious to the point that it has turned other nations off from joining it.

If we continue to enforce such rigidity, we shall not have any unity at all, for no more members shall join, and would defeat the UN's purpose of uniting nations.

I believe that this should be considered the Humor bill, ensuring that humor will not be outlawed and deinstitutionalized, causing us all to become humorless windows.

I interpret it as such, and that we should try to make our proceedings more fun, like a game, which is what nationstates apparenty is.

And I agree, Hippos are quite big. I saw this documentary on this ecosystem that relied on hippos.. they're quite gross though necessary.

Let us consider, HIPPOS ARE BIG is CAPITALIZED, perhaps it is the acronym for Humor Is Purposefully Positive Onwards Superb Action, Rallying Excellence and Betterment of International Governance or some such lighthearted injection of happiness society needs.

The Commonwealth of Abysseria is distressed at this resolution.

While the Commonwealth's government does understand the nature of this roleplaying game makes it difficult to screen pointless and meaningless resolutions such as this one, it does wish that some sort of more appropriate screening measures were taken in regards to approved/disapproved resolutions.

At present, this straight democratic system has developed into mobocracy, making it possible for silliness such as this to occur at the expense of those more serious minded.

Regards,

Abysseria

I would note that the resolution has been removed. Thank you Enodia!

Why was this proposal removed from the floor?

It obviously had overwhelming public support, we have recently passed the Freedom of Humor Act (check your history books), the game itself is based on humor, Max himself has approved humorous resolutions (I will post the e-mail if he is OK with that)...

The people want it, Max wants it, the game allows it...and yet it was deleted for no purpose.

I can post an overflowing inbox of support for this resolution if anyone is interested.

To me, this appears to be a case of a small group of people (those on the forum) trying to dominate a game which is played by a much larger group of people (those who don't give a damn about the forum).

A recent proposal about penguins made it all the way through the process, and died naturally on the floor without support. It seems to me that this was only deleted due to popularity. Where is the logic in that?

The UN is a place for the will of the delegates to be expressed.

I fail to see any grounds for removing this resolution and if the mods seem to feel that it should have been removed, then I think the mods should take some time to reconsider their position and perhaps make an attempt to realign it to coincide with the will of the players.

Also it is a civil rights proposal because we recently won the Freedom of Humor, and the Freedom of Speech and Freedom of Expression of an oppressed minority is being suppressed.

And last time I checked, Hippos were in fact, BIG.

http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=99757&start=20

Hippos are indeed big... although perhaps letting this resolution in will cause others to think up sillier things which *will* clog the proposals list.

Why was this proposal removed from the floor?
And now, here comes the reason. I will post this once and once only and I would appreciate people accepting the reason instead of whining that it isn't fair.

It obviously had overwhelming public support
And? I don't care if everyone in the game voted for it, the fact of the matter is that it's against the rules of the proposals as enumerated in the Sticky to which I would direct you if my browser would give me the URL. Legality is not determined by headcount.

we have recently passed the Freedom of Humor Act (check your history books)
Mmmhmmm. That resolution was (at least in the way I read it when checking the resolutions) a legitimate human rights issue allowing people to make jokes at the expense of things they would not otherwise be allowed to make jokes at the expense of. This, on the other hand, wasn't.

the game itself is based on humor
Yes, you've got a point there. However, as has been made clear, things like "The Right to Arm Bears" or "The Right to Walk Around with Bare Arms" might be funny but they aren't worthy of the UN.

Max himself has approved humorous resolutions (I will post the e-mail if he is OK with that)...
And he has approved this resolution? Somehow I think not. If he knows (which he does) that I deal with the UN proposals, then why did he not let me know that it was a "protected species"?

the game allows it...and yet it was deleted for no purpose.
No, that's just the point. The game does not allow it. The rules about proposals make it very clear. Ergo, the game does not allow it. It is for this "purpose" that the proposal was deleted.


I can post an overflowing inbox of support for this resolution if anyone is interested.
Lovely. As I say, legality is not determined by headcount. Quite frankly, the Pope himself could have approved it for all I care. It's against the rules so away it goes.


To me, this appears to be a case of a small group of people (those on the forum) trying to dominate a game which is played by a much larger group of people (those who don't give a damn about the forum).
I would disagree. The proposal had approximately 130 approvals, the vast majority of which came from forum-using nations. If you're saying that you're somehow standing up for the players who don't use the forums, I fail to see what logic that's based on.


A recent proposal about penguins made it all the way through the process, and died naturally on the floor without support.
If it slipped through the net I apologise. Must admit that I can't recall it.

It seems to me that this was only deleted due to popularity. No. It was deleted for being against the rules.

The UN is a place for the will of the delegates to be expressed. In accordance with the rules, yes it is.

I fail to see any grounds for removing this resolution and if the mods seem to feel that it should have been removed, then I think the mods should take some time to reconsider their position and perhaps make an attempt to realign it to coincide with the will of the players.
I'm not going to realign anything to coincide with "the will of the players" (all 130 of them who approved the proposal). The players in question can choose to realign their opinions to coincide with the rules if they want.

And? I don't care if everyone in the game voted for it, the fact of the matter is that it's against the rules...

I understand that you are trying to be fair and that this is the core issue.

Every now and then someone decides that making a pun about something (usually "The Right to Arm Bears" or "The Right to Bare Arms") would be clever. Beyond the fact that these jokes have appeared at least 25 times each in the proposal queue, the fact that they're not serious proposals will have them deleted.

I agree that lame, unfunny, constantly repeated proposals should be removed. That is the spirit of the above rule.

But my proposal was making a point, actually was about civil rights, and was a test case of the recently won Freedom of Humor. Also it was actually funny.

The rationale for removing stupid proposals is that they decrease the value of the game. People look at the list of proposals, see '"w33d shud B leegul!!11!", roll their eyes, and stop paying attention to the proposals.

But this proposal had much more to say than the obvious fact that hippos are indeed pretty friggin' big, it was merely expressed in a (legally protected) manner which is usually not used in UN resolutions.

That's the logical side of the thing.

The nuts and bolts side of the thing is that Max has approved humorous proposals, with certain obvious caveats (eg, armed bears).

Please consult him directly (as I did) and you will find this to be true.

That resolution was (at least in the way I read it when checking the resolutions) a legitimate human rights issue allowing people to make jokes at the expense of things they would not otherwise be allowed to make jokes at the expense of. This, on the other hand, wasn't.

Excuse me, but that's exactly what this proposal was.

In the words of one supporter:
I took a look at your proposal, and found it very worthwhile. Thanks for bringing some humor into the political spotlight.

There is a dour, clique-ish feel to the UN at this point (directly related to the forum), and I was expressing a disdain for that system. Based on the Freedom of Humor Act, I should have the right to make that point without being censored.

Why was this proposal removed from the floor?

It obviously had overwhelming public support, we have recently passed the Freedom of Humor Act (check your history books), the game itself is based on humor, Max himself has approved humorous resolutions (I will post the e-mail if he is OK with that)...

The people want it, Max wants it, the game allows it...and yet it was deleted for no purpose.

I would disagree with you on the last part. To me, this is the issue at hand, not some stupid, silly resolution. There is a purpose for the resolution being dropped, and it is that purpose that I am against. The purpose of taking the resolution out is to censor the UN from allowing humor as an act of communication for proposals. Basically, there is not to be a proposal testing the bounds and acceptable limits of humor within the UN. This might makes sense if there hasn’t already been such a test, the afor mentioned Freedom of Humor Act. People declared they wanted humor by passing that resolution to such a large vote in favor of it. Again, they were voicing the need for humor by endorsing this rather silly proposal (which I did not vote for, tho would if I could go back—it is not funny per se, but the issue behind the issue is important to me). It seems an extention of politcs and communication that was cut short despite interest and past resolutions.

Why was this proposal removed from the floor?
And now, here comes the reason. I will post this once and once only and I would appreciate people accepting the reason instead of whining that it isn't fair.

we have recently passed the Freedom of Humor Act (check your history books)
Mmmhmmm. That resolution was (at least in the way I read it when checking the resolutions) a legitimate human rights issue allowing people to make jokes at the expense of things they would not otherwise be allowed to make jokes at the expense of. This, on the other hand, wasn't.


Not trying to ignore your reason, just pointing out a Q is all.

You say Freedom of Humor was about people being allowed to make things of that they would not be otherwise allowed to make jokes about…. Then you say people are not allowed to make jokes like this. Isn’t this sort of justifying that Freedom of Humor is actually specifically about such instances? It seemed it was about allowing humor to be expressed when it would otherwise be forbidden, as long as it was not malicious.

If not this, then what would be allowed by Freedom of Humor? Are, should we assume that the UN is powerless in that no other actions of humor will be allowed? Again, just asking, I know you are a fair mod, I just find this to be an issue.

There's a thread in Moderation where I answer a whole bunch of "The Usual Suspects" who've appeared on this thread. If anyone's curious, I recommend they have a quick gander.

As for the major concern raised here about whether or not this joke resolution was or was not a human rights/civil rights issue, this is how I view the case:

Freedom of Humor (the ur-Resolution) permits people to make jokes about pretty much everything. There's more to it than that, obviously, but the basic gist of the thing is what I've just said.
Hippos are Big is an actual joke made under the aegis of the ur-Resolution.

Why is the ur-Resolution a Human Rights issue in the first place? Because that's what it would be if Kim Jong-Il (North Korea being a place with abysmal human rights) allowed people to make jokes about him. It wouldn't be a massively newsworthy thing, in my view, but that's what it would be.
Actually making a joke about the Dear Leader is not a Human Rights issue because it does not grant you more human rights. Why is that relevant? Because the proposal itself would grant people more Human Rights if it passed - that's the way the mechanics of the game work.

If that makes sense to everyone, I'm very pleased.

... If that makes sense to everyone, I'm very pleased.
Well, it makes sense to me....

I would like to point out that the Freedom of Humor resolution gives the right to make non-offensive jokes, while the Freedom of Speech resolution past long before it gave the right to say anything you want, including jokes, even if someone finds it offensive... though I guess it's too late to do anything about that now.

Greetings:

To fill the vacuum left by the disappearance of the HIPPOS ARE BIG proposal, I have made the following proposal:

HIPPOS ARE STILL BIG

PREAMBLE: The intent of the UN rules governing proposals is to insure that substantial issues are discussed. It is entirely just and proper that this should be so. Similarly, the intent of the Freedom of Humor Act, which recently passed the UN by an almost 4 to 1 margin, is to allow these issues to be discussed in an entertaining and amusing way. This too is entirely just and proper and will lead to a happier and more humane citizenry. The Whimsical Republic of the Orion Nebula is therefore proud to submit the following for consideration.

HIPPO AWARENESS DAY

WHEREAS, although Hippos are indeed quite large there exists some controversy as to whether they are the second or third largest land animal;

AND WHEREAS the Hippos are known to be distressed by the terrible way that mankind has treated the environment of the Earth;

AND WHEREAS Hippos are not only an endangered species but young Hippos are often mocked in junior high school for their ridiculous looking windbreakers, their large glasses and their round sneakers that resemble above-ground pools;

LET IT BE RESOLVED THAT each member nation of the United Nations declare the first Thursday following the Winter Solstice to be "Hippo Awareness Day".

AND LET IT BE FURTHER RESOLVED that each member nation shall create programs that, on this day, educate its populace to the plight of all endangered species, but mostly Hippos. These programs should also raise the environmental awareness of the citizenry and encourage conservation.

AND LET IT BE EVEN FURTHER RESOLVED that these programs should contain the information that HIPPOS ARE BIG to help them regain their rightful place as the Earth's second largest land animal. Also this could be best accomplished by encouraging people to visit the zoo to see Hippos in the flesh so they can understand just how big Hippos are. This would prevent hurt Hippo feelings when people, unfamiliar with the size of Hippos, say "Wow, Hippos are big!" as opposed to having a comfortable idea about the relative size of Hippos, which would cause them to say "Now, THAT is a big Hippo!" only in the presence of an overtly large representative of the species.

AND LET IT BE STILL FURTHER RESOLVED that the member nations of the UN are encouraged to broadcast a national telethon on Hippo Awareness Day to raise money for the establishment of national parks and wildlife sanctuaries.

ALSO hello.

Please support it as you did the previous proposal. Thank you.

Poor Hippos. Even the proposals designed to save the species ended up mocking them. :cry:

Folks, what everybody is missing here is that the methane produced by large hippos is probably contributing to global warming, and probably even the hole in the ozone layer. I mean, hippos generate methane (well, I know for a fact that cattle generate methane, and hippos are just like big cattle, so they must generate methane, right?) and since methane has been shown to be a pollutant, large hippos must generate large amounts of methane, which will destroy the global ozone warming layer which will mean the end of civilization. So I am against large hippos. But I am for this resolution, because I vote for all UN resolutions that have something to do with "global warming." Just don't confuse me with the details. I don't see why you neanderthal conservatives just don't UNDERSTAND!

Thank you.

Thanks to everyone who helped this proposal reach quorum.

Also thanks to the mod who deleted this proposal, once again proving the point that the mods have gone too far.

Someone's head should roll for this.

I'm very surprised that this resolution did not get purged. Surely it is a waste of the UN's precious time?!

... If that makes sense to everyone, I'm very pleased.
Well, it makes sense to me....

I would like to point out that the Freedom of Humor resolution gives the right to make non-offensive jokes, while the Freedom of Speech resolution past long before it gave the right to say anything you want, including jokes, even if someone finds it offensive... though I guess it's too late to do anything about that now.

The Hippos are big resolution DOES grant more human rights... by briefly taking away the government's attention from violating human rights.

It's an issue of opinion, not relevance. Therefore, the resolution should not have been purged.

I agree.

Even more ridiculous, however, is that the second proposal, which addressed the mod complaints about the first and was actually cited by a mod as the right way to construct such a proposal, was also deleted.

I realize things haven't happened this way by design, but I'm sure the mods can see how irritating it was to wait until each of the proposals reached quorum to delete them. Only if people actually like the proposal will the mods step in and make sure the players are not having any fun. If you want to be assured that your proposal will not be deleted, just make sure no one likes it.

I also hope that everyone who thought a Freedom of Humor Act was unnecessary can now see why it was written and what the people were trying to say when they passed it.

I hope an apology to Orion is forthcoming on this matter.

Those proposals should not have been against the rules. Rational people can argue that it DOES promote human rights, and other people may argue that it does not. This shows that the question of whether or not it promotes human rights is open to debate. As such, it is not a moderator question, but rather a question for all members of the UN.

Actually, it's not even a question of the promotion of human rights, but one of "Why?" since no one's explained the deletion yet.

Actually, it's not even a question of the promotion of human rights, but one of "Why?" since no one's explained the deletion yet.

Enodia's argument appears to be that this resolution does not promote human rights.

Actually, it's not even a question of the promotion of human rights, but one of "Why?" since no one's explained the deletion yet.

Enodia's argument appears to be that this resolution does not promote human rights.

That was the old proposal. The new proposal by Orion Nebula was struck down last night, after reaching minimum endorsement requirement in about two days.