NationStates Jolt Archive


Make resoolution repealing legal!

Randomocitia
09-06-2004, 04:44
Currently, proposals to repeal resolutions are considered game mechanics proposlas, and are illegal. In the interest of democracy, I believe that proposals to repeal resolutions should be allowed. Who else feels this way?
Myrth
09-06-2004, 04:52
It's not a matter of 'making it legal,' it's a matter of 'making it possible.'
Hence why they are banned for being 'Game Mechanics' proposals.
Hirota
09-06-2004, 08:54
Currently, proposals to repeal resolutions are considered game mechanics proposlas, and are illegal. In the interest of democracy, I believe that proposals to repeal resolutions should be allowed. Who else feels this way?

gosh, we have never heard this before...... :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

<yawn>
Randomocitia
12-06-2004, 17:28
Well, what's wrong with the idea?
Spoffin
12-06-2004, 17:53
Well, what's wrong with the idea?Well, UN resolutions have a certain effect on your nation, but only if you were in the UN when the resolution passes. So, you could say that if a resoluton reduces your Civil Rights by one, then the repeal will increase it by one. But, what if you weren't in the UN when the resolution passed? Then you'd get +1 to civil rights for repealing a resolution you never honoured. It wouldn't work.
Peacy and Unity
13-06-2004, 00:30
Then you'd get +1 to civil rights for repealing a resolution you never honoured. It wouldn't work.

This really isn't big enough to worry about. And it's not even that unrealistic. Removing the overburden of global regulation will help everyone even if your nation wasn't around when it passed.
_______

The big technical problem is the built in assumption, "All Nations in the UN, fully implement ALL resolutions that pass." Which is completely unreasonable. My nation is in the UN and is keeping its nukes :twisted:.

Modelling defiance of UN Resolutions really can't happen until NS2.

Tracking complience would require a nation menu where you could mark "accept" or "refuse" for each resolution. Not too hard.

There would have to be a game mechanic for nations to react to nations who don't follow along. Currently there are no game mechanics for economic interaction (Trade and Trade Embargos), or military intervention (War, Blockades, etc.). NS1 War is role-played.

For this to be realistic, there would need to be another grouping mechanism beyond nations in regions, perhaps regional groups for alliances. For example:
----- 1st World "capitalist" group of nations [NATO] with strong economies that routinely tell the UN to go stuff itself 8) .
----- 2nd World "socialist" group of nations [Warsaw Pact] which follow most to all of the UN resolutions, and accept the burden on thier economies :( .
----- 3rd, 4th, 5th, etc. Worlds that accept some sub-group of UN actions while rejecting others :?:.
The only nations that would get in massive trouble would be those that defiy the UN by themselves. (i.e. the NS equivelent of Iraq, Libya, or North Korea).
The Most Glorious Hack
13-06-2004, 10:10
It's on the to-do list. Be patient.
Komokom
13-06-2004, 11:13
BANG !

( The sound of some-one with too much free time zooming in ... :wink: )

Uh-huh, is this the nice safe,

" not until N.S. 2 " to-do list, or perhaps the slightly more deadly :

" When we move to Jolt it changes " to-do list or the pure evil :

" Violet is getting down to it right this moment " to-do list ?

I've already sent a email to the N.S. Administration email regarding this, but figure this might just get me a quicker reply. Maybe. Just maybe. No great expectations.

:wink:

- T.R. Kom
Le Repr├ęsentant de Komokom.
Ministre R├ęgional de Substance.
http://www.nationstates.net/images/flags/uploads/komokom.jpg (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/target=display_nation/nation=komokom)
<- Not A Moderator, Just A Know It All.
" Clowns To The Left of Me ... Jokers To The Right, Here I am ... "
The Most Glorious Hack
13-06-2004, 11:40
Uh-huh, is this the nice safe,

" not until N.S. 2 " to-do list, or perhaps the slightly more deadly :

" When we move to Jolt it changes " to-do list or the pure evil :

" Violet is getting down to it right this moment " to-do list ?


Sort of the second. It won't be done until after the Jolt move, but it hasn't really been started yet, either.
Emperor Matthuis
13-06-2004, 12:35
Uh-huh, is this the nice safe,

" not until N.S. 2 " to-do list, or perhaps the slightly more deadly :

" When we move to Jolt it changes " to-do list or the pure evil :

" Violet is getting down to it right this moment " to-do list ?


Sort of the second. It won't be done until after the Jolt move, but it hasn't really been started yet, either.

When will we move to Jolt?

I mean has the move broken down because the news board said it would be in April then it got delayed and it is currently Late June!

:)
Peacy and Unity
21-06-2004, 04:00
Uh-huh, is this the nice safe,

" not until N.S. 2 " to-do list, or perhaps the slightly more deadly :

" When we move to Jolt it changes " to-do list or the pure evil :

" Violet is getting down to it right this moment " to-do list ?


Sort of the second. It won't be done until after the Jolt move, but it hasn't really been started yet, either.

A Better UN system? Definely not until NS2.

Speaking of the infamous: "When we move to Jolt",
Are we going to a search system actually works?
Or am I just being greedy? Check for lightning bolt. :shock: Ow.....
The Most Glorious Hack
21-06-2004, 06:55
A Better UN system? Definely not until NS2.

Well, my sources say that there are plans to have make it possible to repeal UN resolutions after the move. If your sources are better, well...

Speaking of the infamous: "When we move to Jolt",
Are we going to a search system actually works?

After the move.
Neo England
22-06-2004, 04:34
When will we move to Jolt?

Theres a whole article on the News Page about it now :)
Peacy and Unity
25-06-2004, 02:08
A Better UN system? Definely not until NS2.

Well, my sources say that there are plans to have make it possible to repeal UN resolutions after the move. If your sources are better, well...


Sorry, I mis-understood the question.

--- Defying UN resolutions will require significant changes to the underlying Sim. I don't see how this could possibly happen before NS2.

--- Repealing Resolutions doesn't require major changes to the system. I have no inside info about post-Jolt changes. If you have the inside scoop, I'll believe you.


==================================

Are only explicit, "clean", repeals going to be allowed?
--- Resolution #100, Purpose to Repeal #99.

Or, can new resolutions implicity modify older ones?
--- #125 News organizations cannot be expected to provide unbiased coverage of government if they receive government payments. To ensure the Freedom of the Press government payments to news related institutions are prohibited.

#125 doesn't specificially mention the recent Freedom of the Press resolution. However it would modify Section 4 of that resolution where it calls for government, "... to expand their news capabilities with needed funds, government assistance, ..."
The Most Glorious Hack
25-06-2004, 06:24
--- Defying UN resolutions will require significant changes to the underlying Sim. I don't see how this could possibly happen before NS2.

Well, that or an issue that overlaps existing resolutions. I believe the Admins are considering a method to keep UN nations from receiving issues that allow for UN contradictions, but that is still in the brainstorming stage.

--- Repealing Resolutions doesn't require major changes to the system.

There's a couple ways of doing this, but I believe the favored plan (I don't keep up on UN stuffs like I should, actually) is to have "anti" categories. Social Injustice to repeal a Social Justice resolution, as it were. Of course, I'd prefer a "Repeal" category that would automatically reverse stat changes of the resolution its repealing.

Or, can new resolutions implicity modify older ones?
--- #125 News organizations cannot be expected to provide unbiased coverage of government if they receive government payments. To ensure the Freedom of the Press government payments to news related institutions are prohibited.

#125 doesn't specificially mention the recent Freedom of the Press resolution. However it would modify Section 4 of that resolution where it calls for government, "... to expand their news capabilities with needed funds, government assistance, ..."

I would have to defer to someone like GMC, who has started to slide into Enodia's old role in scanning/cleaning the UN lists. I tend to only handle blantent violations that I notice. You know, things like "Social Justice: KILL ALL HOMOSEXUALS!!!!1" and other such clearly illegal proposals.