NationStates Jolt Archive

In principio erat Verbum et Verbum erat apud Deum et Deus erat Verbum

I write in obedience to God, who commands me, to do so through his holiness the supreme pontiff and through our most Holy Mother.

There is a great question the Catholic Church has yet to come to a conclusive answer about….
Is the metahuman endowed with the same spirit as man, is the metahuman created in the image of God in the same way as man is.
The lack of conclusive authority magisterial teaching on this question has caused dire disunity within the believing community. Within the universal Church teaching doctrine in regards to this question differ wildly from area to area….this cannot go on…
It is the will of the Holy Father and in accordance with the apostolic constitutions and norms of the Church that a council be held to discuss, examine and somehow resolve this theological dilemma that confronts the church.
Thus it is my joy to invite you my brother cardinals and bishops to Iesus Christi, let the darkness of night be extinguished by the light of Christ.

Yours in Christ
+ Archbishop of Augustine. Cardinal Patrick McCullum DD



OOC: This council/debate assumes that there is no major doctrinal magesterium teaching about the nature of metahumans..it is held with full understanding, and knowledge of papal authority according to canon 343
It will we held in IESUS CHRISTI as a Vatican sign of hope (and a way to assure that the conclusions of the council will be known world wide), there is an OOC assurance that no molestation of cardinals/theologians will occur.
This is a catholic synod....so while no catholics are welcome to arrive and watch, they have no voice in the debate....
This is a chance to get some actual theological(catholic) debate on the issue...so...if you dont have a clue please dont come along:P please tgram if confused or unsure.

IC: The ‘Star of the Sea’ abbey on the outskirts of St Augustine(Iesus capital) has been chosen to house the council. Over the ancient archway into the abbey the words ‘Fiat volvntas tva’- Let Thy will be done- were carved in massive letters.
The abbey itself dated back to the early 1200s, where it had been founded by the ‘Poor Brothers of the cross’, over the years it had seen many varied uses apart from those the brothers had intended. Close inspection of the stonework by visitors would show up the occasional bullet hole….
The grounds and the building itself was massive and ancient, but the accommodation itself was simple…any arriving dignitaries who excepted lavish accommodation were in for a nasty surprise. The rooms provided hadnt changed little in the last 700 years…Spartan but functional.
In the grand entrance hall a massive mural welcomed all. Painted by Brother Johann Dew some 500 years ago, the mural depicted the legend of St Fenris and the victory of the cross. It was just one of the artistic displays within the abbey…..Iesus hadn’t always been barren of culture…..

I'm an aethist (forgive the spelling) through and through (but i have nothing against religion) so am i allowed to follow this thread as it develops?

The Syskeyian delegation was among the first to arrive.

Flying into the country in a Cessna Citation X on loan from one of Syskeyia's larger book publishing magnates, the delegation consisted of Theophilius Cardinal Sanghorn, Archbishop of Syskeyiapolis and Primate of Syskeyia, John Cardinal Ekaluck, Archbishop of New Nicaea, Joan Kieu, professor of systematic theology at St. Anselm Williamshire University in Syskeyiapolis, and Fr. Thomas Agoume, professor of Biblical Studies at the University of New Nicaea.

The journey had been long, but not uncomfortable, given the facilites of the private jet. The delegates had brought along a considerable amount of material, both for theological debate and for their own edification. Theological works, decrees and decisions of ecumenical councils, and several Bibles, not the least of which was Fr. Agoume's Hebrew/Greek critical edition of the Old and New Testaments. The cleric had heard of the "adjustments" that the Reich had made to its translations of the Bible, and looked forward to ... discussing them.

Several army staff cars awaited the arrivals…but little in the way of pomp and ceremony greeted the visitors. Iesus troopers provided a tight cordon of security around the airbase, while in the distance Iesus news crews filmed the landing. The government had allowed this event, but it wasnt about to expose the average citizen to just anyone...
A young captain wearing the cross of the chaplaincy corp welcomed the delegation.
“Your graces, holy fathers. On behalf of the Bishops and the glorious peoples government, I welcome you to Iesus Christi. Your drivers have been instructed to take you directly to the abbey. If you have any questions, please feel free to ask them….I am Father Johnson, and am government liaison for this event”


The Iesus theological divide
The Iesus theological camp was basically dived in two.
A staunch and vocal group proclaimed the animal nature of the non-humans, and these views would be expounded at the conference by Bishop Hans King. He and his ‘camp’ had long written on the impossibility of the ‘metahuman’ being ontologically a free creation. Treatise written by him, and leading ‘humanity’ theologians were generally well researched and steeped in catholic doctrine. This ‘camp’ also was well supported by the existing Iesus government….

Cardinal Patrick McCullum was perhaps the most outspoken of the ‘inclusive doctrine’ teachers in Iesus Christi. Inspired by the works of John Paul II and Blessed John XXIII Patrick had written greatly on the issue. Many priests and religious in Iesus Christi support the view of ‘nonhuman dignity and ‘universal brotherhood’ ….but keep silence or and the status quo.


OOC: feel free to follow, again noncatholics welcome in observor roles. Just dont expect fair treatment by the government:P

OOC: Well, I'll be sending two folks, a human cardinal and an elven bishop... posting later

Clarification: There have been several questions about our treatment of representatives who are of non-human blood……
As long as they are respectful, hold rank in the church and are here legitimately to take part in the conference, the government of Iesus Christi will treat them as honourary humans....

God Is great.
Bridgette Iesus. Ministry of social order

Christac are bound to the DINONIAN CHURCH, but we would ask that you allow Cardinal Bennett to attend this meeting and report back to Pope George I.

OOC - In real life I am an Anglican, but I am studying Theology and know a few things about the Catholic Church

Bishop Neville Riviere sat quietly on the flight over, doing some theological reading. Also on the plane were several other people with the Church who were to help him make his case.

Father Bertrand Clemenceau was there to speak of his experience as priest to Prince Gregory and as one of the first priests to bring Catholicism to the Resurgent Dream. Clemeneau felt like a man who believed something but was unable to share his evidence. As confessor to His Highness, Clemeneau was privy to the most intimate struggles of the sidhe royal's soul and its immense love for God. And yet that experience was not something he could speak of. He would have to use less compelling experiences to make his case.

Sister Melanie Jaillet and Brother Hortil Treantspatience, a Boggan, were both there to give a cloistered, monastic perspective, one much more reflective than that normally given by the priests.

Ravakain Onyxarm, as rather pretty Trollish woman, was there to provide the perspective of a non-human lay Catholic living the family life. Lord Vicril ap Liam, a Sidhe lord, was there as a prominent Catholic theologian.

After arriving and stepping from the plane, the non-human members of the party quietly but confidently declined to receive the honorary non-human status offered by the government. The entire party looked somber as they headed for the cars.

From the Catholic church in Knootoss came but a short message, declining to take part in the synod called by the Archbishop of Augustine. As the message drew to a close, the Bishop charge with the affair concluded: "We cannot, in good faith, attend a synod in such a place of cruelty and suffering, hosted by a church responsible for sanctifying the murder of millions.

That the Iesus church refers to itself as being in the Roman Catholic tradition has always pained our hearts. Such perversions of the faith as practiced in the Reich cannot be reasoned with for the very core of faith required for a synod is absent in the hearts and souls of those behind the Iesus religious order."

The small faction of Catholic Goblins sends the following message:
We are DEEPLY offended that we are considered no better than animals by our fellow Christians in Iesus Christi. We have spent years attempting to save our fellow Goblins from the paganism which is historically prevelent in our nation.
While we do not expect equal treatment from all humans, and often dont get it, they usualy DO consider us better than beasts.

Attached was a note informing Iesus Christi that two Goblin bishops would be attending the confrence

What blasphemous discussion , on the very soil of the Reich. may the heavens open and cast fire onto those infidel who turn their faces to God.
honor to God, not man.

~Mullar Omar

Bishop Miranith and Cardinal Paulson sat quietly on the plane, both of them absorbed in their reading. Miranith was an elf, and didn’t make an illusions to his ancestry; he wore his long black hair back, behind his ears, he didn’t hide his face, or stoop in public, in his mind, if the enemies of god were to single him out, he would gladly be arrested. It was written to now hide your candle under a bushel—to not hide your beliefs in front of others.

Paulson was a human, an older man in his sixties, and had chosen to volunteer to this conference simply because his young protégé had volunteered. He was not looking forward to this conference, because of the potential for violence. Not being a soldier, Paulson had no combat training, and doubted that Miranith, a pacifist, had any either.

But nothing could be done about that, the Thelasi government was not interested in creating a stir by sending armed troops to escort the two ministers. At any rate, Miranith and Paulson were well equipped, each of their laptops had an entire version of the King James Bible, and three or four other translations—including the Latin, Greek, and Ancient Hebrew versions of the Bible.

As the Thelasi flight landed in Iesus Christi, the two passengers prepared to disembark, and no doubt go through intense customs.

OOC: Short post… just to get involved.

“Sir…but they didn’t accept their status…”
The voice on the other end of the phone was calm, and simply repeated his first statement.
“Captain, let them through, no molestation of visitors. Understand Captain?”
The Captain watched as the Resurgent Dream cars rolled past…he fought to control his temper “Yes Sir”

As others arrived at the military airstrip, they found themselves not exposed to the usual intense Iesus examinations. Thelan bishops like all others were simply escorted from their aircraft to the awaiting cars. Waiting Military personal even saluted the bishops, and greeted them with warm smiles.

At the abbey, everything was prepared for the honoured guests.


Cardinal Patrick McCullum was horrified by some of negative and hostile comments he received from his brother clergy…His reply was directed not only to the knootian bishops but all who had worries…
My Brothers in Jesus Christ.
I read your concerns, and understand your position…but I do not understand your lack of hope…your cynicism that rejects the hope of the cross.
You speak justify about this land being ruled by cruelty and injustice…and that is why we must gather and be a beacon of hope in such a land. We do not meet to justify the horrors , but we meet to challenge them! We are a people of the gospel, let us meet and proclaim its universal truth…let the darkness vanish at the light of truth!
I am a Priest of Christ, By his grace I have become Shepherd and cardinal of his flock in St Augustine. I am loyal to Christ and his Church above all things, I have be witness to those horrors you speak of, I have been a victim of them. It is exactly for that reason why we must meet and end the culture of persecution that lack of doctrinal teaching on non-humans has caused.
Your silence only gives consent to those who would uphold the status quo….
In hope of your arrival.
AMDG
+ Cardinal Patrick McCullum

OOC: and yes, we welcome noncatholics to observe the 'synod'

OOC: These are Shadowrun metahumans then? Trolls, dwarves, orks and the lot? If so, what about Ghouls and others infected with HMHVV?

Taggy

The Imperial Faith Union's plane touched down gently, the two observers - both men of very high standing within the Church of Christ Imperator - climbed down the stairs calmly, head held high as they observed the other visitors - whether Catholic or not.

His Grace, Simon Iscariot, Patriarch of the House of Iscariot, Chaplain-General of the Theo-Imperium, High Interrogator of the Church, Lord Inquisitor of the Imperial Faith Union, Member of the Hierarchy of Isam, Guardian of the Third Nail and bearer of the Lesser Stigmata walked beside Christopher Jyrellen, Archbishop of Education, Member of the Hierarchy of Isam, Instructor of the Faith, Educator of the Imperial Faith Union, Teacher of the True Faith.

The two were both adherants of the Imperial Faith, and as such not eligible to speak at the synod, but both were well versed in the Catholic doctrines and followed the standard procedures and pleasantries along with the demands of their own etiquette - the Church of Christ Imperator was similar in many ways to the Catholic Faith, but differed in certain key areas - notably its replacement of Papal authority with the Isamite Holy Father, the adaption of certain areas to assist in control of a nation and empire, and its elevation of Judas Iscariot to the same status as the other Disciples.

Chaplain-General Simon Iscariot was dressed in the traditional black-and-silver of the Chaplaincy of Isam, a severe uniform not unlike a priest's garment, but with careful ornamentation down the sleeves and across the shoulders to denote his rank. A black cloak was fastened to his epaulets, bearing the Isamite Cross - a Crucifix with the Orthodox cross emblazoned upon it. The same design was tattooed across his face, the crossbar across his eyes, as was custom for the Chaplain-Generals of Isam, a mark of faith and devotion to Mother Church. Black gloves hid his wounded hands, marked from his time on the cross - another test of the faith compulsory for would-be Chaplain-Generals.

Archbishop Christopher Jyrellen was dressed in the White-And-Gold cassock of the Archbishops, crimson clashes carefully placed to denote certain specific things within the Isamite Church. His face was significantly kinder than that of the Chaplain-General, and not bearing the tattoos of the Chaplaincy.

Accompanying the pair, to give the opinions of the Isamite Catholics, was Cardinal Kerylin, one of the four percent of the Isamite population that followed Papal authority rather than the words of the Great Cathedral of Isam. He walked after the two Isamite Clergymen dressed in his traditional garb. The only Cardinal of Isam, still he tendered to many millions of followers. The Imperial Faith Union was large, with a population in the billions.

[[OOC: I'll try and get some actual things done when I return after my exam this afternoon]]

The Roman Catholic Church of Etaros, though representing a small ten percent of the population of the Erasat, decided to send a delegation to the meeting in order to provide an open and fair setting. Though no elves would attend with the delegation, the clergy in the Erasat are extremely open and accepting of non-human races that show a dedication to traditional human values of peace, communication, and harmony. They knew that people at the extreme opposite end of the spectrum would attend, though this fact gave them more reason to go to the event.

Bishop Karl Massat of New Itaros and Cardinal Josef Krukow of Lians-Poreé were attending the meeting, preparing to fly to their final destination immediately. They declined guards, saying that the will of Christ would protect them from harm. Following strict guidelines of the Separation of Church and State in the Erasat, the government will provide no special treatment or care for the delegation, though any mistreatment or unfair imprisonment will be promptly dealt with by the Consulacör of Foreign Affairs as with all civilian matters.

Bishop Massat, a tall middle-aged man of Arabic descent, sat upright in the jet, flying about 130 passengers to Iesus Christi. Beside him sat Cardinal Krukow, an elderly Lietuv-born hermit. He was short and the least threatening person in the world, though his power was not to be underestimated. The Cardinal sat sleeping upon a soft pillow as the two flew across the ocean to reach Iesus Christi.

The new arrivals of non-catholic traditions were still greeted warmly, rigid officials carried baggage to the waiting cars and troopers looked on in total silence.
All arrivals couldn’t help but feel their arrival was being watched closely….even as soldiers saluted passing convoys, somewhere in the background the perpetual paranoid eye of Iesus security monitored the arrivals.

Along the route to the abbey, soldiers lined the way along with curious citizens. Children pointed at cars that flew flags from countries they were taught to hate and fear. Terms like 'apostate' and 'heretic' were common phrases from the watching citizens, as the cars from nations like Etaros and Thelas rolled onto the abbey.

Each room within the Abbey itself had been assigned to Bishops, and cardinals.’ Lesser ranked’ clerics and staff were assigned to surrounding staff hostels and facilities. Every lodging was Iesus stlye - spartan.

Awaiting each of the groups was Cardinal McCollum’s opening letter…
My Brothers in Christ.
With Joy I welcome you to Iesus Christi. Sadly I was unable to greet each of you upon your arrival but I hope my staff have made you welcome. I eagerly await the time when we can all be together in person.
I rejoice that we have gathered together to continue the mission of the holy spirit- the salvation of all humanity. Together I pray we may truly remove any anthropocentrism from our church, and make humanity a term that encompasses all of Creation that God endowed with free will.
I Place this meeting into the hands of the blessed virgin,
We are fallen but redeemed.
Yours in Christ.
+Cardinal Patrick McCullum. DD.

OOC:Metahuman is the Iesus government term for ALL nonhumans like elves etc. It is a more expanisve term than its shadowrun original.
Meta is used in the Change ,transformation or Alternation sense of the term.

To all my dear brothers in the Episcopate,

I write to you all to humbly plead that you boycott the council presently being assembled in the state of Iesus Christi. To attend would merely lend credibility to a church in schism to the Apostolic See, and would play into the hands of evil men, who would see the God of love recast in the mould of a god of hate, and who would see the Universal Church set aside its role as humanity's holy and compassionate mother in order to take up a role of brutal oppression. These are not baseless allegations, and I do not make them lightly - I do not make them at all. I merely mention allegations already made, my brothers in Christ, in the hope that you will recall their source - that being an Apostolic letter on the topic of the Iesian church entitled No Deeper Pain, issued by the Holy Father himself. (OOC: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=333220)

While I commend those faithful Catholics who hold to the true faith who still exist, we pray in great numbers, within Iesus Christi, I cannot in good faith attend this council for fear that it will be used by those same wicked men referred to by the Holy Father to support their oppressive, heretical regime. The organisers of this council are anathema, and there can therefore be no question as to whether or not this council is a true ecumenical council of the Catholic Church. I urge you in the name of the Lamb of God, to beware of these false prophets, I urge you to refer this matter instead to the See of Rome directly, or failing that, a council sanctioned by the Apostolic See.

Yours in Christ,

Jacques Cardinal Conomos
Archbishop of New Rome
Presiding Bishop of the Pantocratorian Council of Bishops

In principio erat Verbum et Verbum erat apud Deum et Deus erat Verbum

To my Brothers in valid protest, especially to Cardinal Jacques Conomos.
I read your words, and while understanding them I cannot help but feel pain...
Oh Lord save us from Schism.... No Deeper Pain is a document I have read and love with my entire soul. I love it because it is based on truth, In its truth No deeper pain does not seperate us from Rome, it does not place us in schism...no! it draws us to the father....
We turn to you, and through you, the Iesian Catholics, who, like all suffering and afflicted children, are nearer to their Father's heart. At a time when your faith, like gold, is being tested in the fire of tribulation and persecution, when your religious freedom is beset on all sides, when the lack of religious teaching and of normal defense is heavily weighing on you, you have every right to words of truth and spiritual comfort from him whose first predecessor heard these words from the Lord: "I have prayed for thee that thy faith fail not: and thou being once converted, confirm thy brethren" (Luke xxii. 32).
Those words from his holyness have comforted me, and my fellow clergy in the darkest hours of our lives.
My brothers....Yes evil is in our land, a real presence of evil....but it is because of that you must be with us, you must support those who struggle....It is inspite of evil you are invited to meet! it is to lift high the cross and bring the saviour to all people that I have invited you here! what good a faith that only deconstructs? Here is a real chance for the Church to once and for all bury its supposed tolerance of radical racialism. Let us speak as a united body and let our words shatter the darkest night of evil!
I ask you as brothers in the truth to attend , and remind you of the words in No deeper Pain and hope they will turn you to the assistance of your opressed family in Iesus Christi. No deeper pain is a document of action! let it move you , as it moved us...
With this prayer in Our heart and on Our lips We grant to you, as a pledge of Divine help, as a support in your difficult resolutions, as a comfort in the struggle, as a consolation in all trials, to You, Bishops and Pastors of the Faithful, priests, Religious, lay apostles of Catholic Action, to all your diocesans, and specially to the sick and the prisoners, in paternal love

Yours in Christ, yours in Hope.
+Cardinal Patrick McCullum.

To whom it concerns.
God created the gjinn, as he crated all things. But the Gjinn are elementarily of the devil, their minds are constructs of destruction, like then wild animal.
To sit and discuss their ‘free will’ is dishonorable and stupid. does any animal control its mind? to say so is a attack on tradition.
those who discuss this heinous perversion should be aware of Gods punishment – he whom deals destruction unto all liars and ill doers.
be so warned

~Mular Omar

Cardinal Patrick read the news slowly, he reread every word. His hands were unsteady and a subtle tremble gripped his body. His eyed began to cloud with tears…
“Is anything wrong?” The young curate asked gently, unsure what terrible news had now fallen upon his Cardinal and nation.
“Nothing at all. God be praised at last we have action! Glory to God! Hosanna!” The cardinal handed his young aid the piece of paper. The words hastily written upon it by a government insider outlined the move by the Vatican to start procedure...
“So no conference Cardinal?”
Patrick beamed “No! Glory to God there is no need! This I pray will end this long night. It at least explains why the government has again placed a media ban upon us…” Patrick paused, subtle implications he had known all along began to stir in his mind “But let us remember, it is darkest before dawn…”




From the pen of Cardinal Patrick McCullum to those who have arrived by courier….

My brothers in Christ.
Glory to Christ the king of ages.
With great joy I have received news of the intention of the Vatican to hold dialogue and council on the issues of metahumans, and the theology of their salvation.
I praise the holy spirit that Eternal Rome has been moved to at last answer these questions. I thank God I have lived to know that such things will happen.
Sadly I have been unable to meet with you whom have arrived, and I fear we shall never meet in this world. All actions have a consequences,Government forces will escort you to your aircraft shortly.
I thank you for your time, your actions and your prayers. You have been a catalyst for the holy spirit…..you have been the spark….
In entrust you to the care of the almighty

In Love of Christ
+Patrick McCullum.


OOC: and a OOC thanks for time, thought and action!