NationStates Jolt Archive

Okay, here's the basic idea: to combat such things as space piracy and criminals fleeing into space, a group of nations and/or corporations would fund the formation of a sort of Interpol-in-space, to keep space in order. This organizaton would serve the needs of everyone in space, but would focus explicitly on helping out the nations that help it. It would of course start small, as just a one-system thing, but with proper funding and donations it could expand beyond the Sol system to other prominent systems, such as the Alpha Centauri area.

Organizations could donate anything of use, but some of the cheif things this police force would need would be money, vehicles, weapons, medical supplies, and technology. Nations can donate technological concepts so that the police force can make its own hybrid vehicles. Please note that technology donated to the police force is not shared with any nation but the police force.

Those are just my basic ideas on the subject. Is anyone interested, or (big one) does anyone have any more ideas?

A couple of questions will inevitably come up.

Who controls the police force?

and

Who's laws do the police enforce?

What is smuggling for one nation may be legal (even prised) in another.

Oh, third question. Say someone is caught. Who's court do they go to?

I'm not sure it is practical...a lot of nations will resist it.

When I tried it a while ago it didn't go very far (it was never formally closed, but we all eventually just stopped posting in the thread and never used it) but I think that with more effort (we never really tried) it would really work.

Here was my old thread http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=301486

Try not to make the same mistakes I did.

Who controls the police force?
It controls itself. It'd be very much like a military organization.

Who's laws do the police enforce?
I'm guessing that a councel of its patrons would decide that.

Oh, third question. Say someone is caught. Who's court do they go to?Probably an international one. Or they're extradited back to their home country. One of the two.

I'm not sure it is practical...a lot of nations will resist it.I'm not entirely sure they'd have all that much of a reason to. Most likely those who don't want to be a part of it will simply ignore its power, rather than openly resist it.

I think it's a great idea but what about diplomatic immunity or if a ogvernment refuses to give up a convicted criminal?

I think it's a great idea but what about diplomatic immunity or if a ogvernment refuses to give up a convicted criminal?
Diplomatic immunity most likely wouldn't concern the space police, but if it did, then extradition would be the answer.

As for the second one, the police would just have to wait until he or she left the confines of that government. Until then, the person would be considered living in exile.

Alright. I will doante ships and funding to this police force if you can convince more people.

Hmm it is interesting though I already have my own Space Police besides my miltary space forces with its own classes of ships for police work.

Don't trust it.

Hmm it is interesting though I already have my own Space Police besides my miltary space forces with its own classes of ships for police work.
Yes, but that's only national. This would be international.
Don't trust it.
Care to elaborate?

I don't paticularly trust a big military organisation overseeing everything in space. It can be good, like the UN, or it can be bad, like some sort of Big Brother.

I don't paticularly trust a big military organisation overseeing everything in space. It can be good, like the UN, or it can be bad, like some sort of Big Brother.
Well, this one is ment to be based off of Interpol, so it'd lean very strongly toward being like the UN.

It would be good to have an larger organization for my Space Police to work with espically with dealing with pirates. Maybe it could finally track down the main base for the Zoir Warlords, those pirates are about do to be ending fleets to raid the space lanes again.

I'm not sure what New Genoa's problem is, but maybe its similar to mine. I would find an uncontrolled, unregulated and undoubtably sizeable (space is pretty big) war fleet running willy-nilly about the galaxy arresting people who they think is wrong hard to swallow.

Secondly, how would such an organization support itself? Governments are historically penny-penching when it comes to some Grand Overseering organization (LoN, UN). Aside from a few morally-minded governments who are probably already spiralling towards destruction, no ones going to contribue major amounts of resources. Sure, we could grant them a few planets to rule over, but then your effectively creating a whole new country with militaristic authority over you. I think the Galactic Police would quickly become corrupt or piratical as means of supporting itself or, more likely, the people who control it.

Officially, the police would protect everyone. In reality, they'd only protect everyone when one of its benefactors didn't need protection.
Also, it wouldn't technically be a nation, it'd maybe have a few space stations devoted to it, and a handful of planetary bases.

It's not really a war fleet, just a collection of patrol ships stationed apart from each other by a few hundred thousand miles at the least. And they'd only arrest who their benefactors think are doing wrong, not who THEY think are doing wrong. There'd be some democracy in it all.

If the Galactic Police is going to be composed soley of "a collection of patrol ships" I hope for your sake you don't buy much stock in it. Space Criminal Organizations aren't some gang-bangers with switch blade; most are well armed, well organized, and quite capable of murdering a station's entire population (which they will undoubtably attempt).

Let's take the pirate nation of Far Tortuga, located within the Gamma Quadrant, for an example. While most of their fleet is escort-sized vessels (typically of Skeelzanian origin), they posses at least 7, possibily nine Corpsacian-built Ravanos heavy cruisers. These can whipe the floor with anything short of a battlecruiser, and the pirates aren't afraid to deploy them. You send a fleet of "patrol vessels" in to arrest one of their lords, they'll be massacred.

Soooo, basically an international privatized police force.....in space. Hmph, enforcing other peoples' interests, and quite possible over mine.....sounds like competition. I envision mounds of paperwork and very little actual "law" enforcement.

Alright, Idea=Scrapped.

More trouble than it's worth, and I'd be the wrong person to run it, too.
Oh well, it was worth a shot.

Alright, Idea=Scrapped.

More trouble than it's worth, and I'd be the wrong person to run it, too.
Oh well, it was worth a shot.

OOC: Maybe if you got the thing to be backed by some large, powerful organization with a decent reputation, like the UN, it might have some success. Right now it sounds more like a private military corporation (the concept behind MS) in space.

You might also want to have various 'sectors', patrolled by special international divisions of this force, yet based out of some larger, future-tech nation. That would eliminate the problem of it being controlled by one nation, and possibly the threat of being wiped out by a larger pirate fleet.

Just a thought, but most likely wasted since this thing's been scrapped...

Alright, Idea=Scrapped.

More trouble than it's worth, and I'd be the wrong person to run it, too.
Oh well, it was worth a shot.

No, it could work, you'd just have to limit operations to space controled by the suporting nations(ie enforcing local laws), or anti-piracy operations in unclaimed/international space.

Rather than a generic 'galactic police force', it would be a joint police and patrol orgination designed to provide better protection to those from or within supporting nations.

That way you avoid pissing off any major powers.

As for going after heavily armed pirates, well, I'm sure the supporting nations could joint-op a battlecruiser squadren or three when needed, tho police outposts would need fairly heavy static defences to ward off retaliatory strikes from organised crime(tho that in and of itself could make for a decent RP).

Id go with it, as long as you stay away from my Yautjans and me...

I already have the SBITG, although they certainly don't go around protecting just anybody. But they're privatized, and in space, and more than capable of handling piracy so far.

So I at least would need more reasons than the existence of piracy to join something like this. Maybe really bad pirates. But even then, I'd just whip out the actual military. No need for international collaboration.
:sniper:

Just a thought, not that this affects me, because I am a fantasy nation...perhaps this force would hear/locate such pirate groups and call upon those around them to assist.

Allow me to explain better.

Just say there are travelling space pirates, fairly strong. Now, they attack a trade ship, and the force responds accordingly depending on who's area it is. What I am suggesting is that there is not a force which patrols everywhere, but each system or area (I don't know my terms here) looks after those around it. If a pirate attacks a neighbor, they can warn others and group up with other members of the galactic task force.

That way, there is a serious advantage to joining up. If you aint a member, you won't get help if you get attacked in sneaky ways, and cannot really fight them effectively (thinking about how awkuad it could be to guard every convey more etc). By remaining in communication with other members, colllaborating forces to remove a pirate force etc, that may work better.

Also, about whose law to obey. Lets just say that an area's ruler does not allow warp-torpedos (I know there is no such thing, or if there is, I have no idea what it is, just for therotical reasons)....well, you comprimise on that one. Either those who would help does not use certain weapons in a fight, or they both come to some sort of agreement. And when pirates are captured, those who participated in assisting (those with more actions have more influence on decision) the capture discuss what is to be done, through comprimise.

Or, another alternative to the law part of this problem, is to allow the nation or area which was attacked to decide, or the area in which it was captured. Again, this has problems....but it is a start.

In (kinda) short, the galactic force would not be a space wide thing....more of a neighborhood watch, the neighborhood's reaction depending on the severity of the event. If it will affect a considerable number of people on many systems, the neighborhood increases.

It would pay to help one another if your neighbor is suffering from pirates, because if they attack you, they will help you too. Plus, it will boost politcal relations, and you can form stronger alliances built more on obvious memorable actions, not just words.

Just my humble thoughts...what do you think?

Even thoguh I'm really new and ignorant to all the goings on in the forum, why not look at the present INTERPOL...


International Criminal Police Organization or Interpol, intergovernmental body established to promote mutual cooperation between police authorities around the world and to develop means of effectively preventing crime. Founded in Vienna in 1923 and reconstituted in 1946, Interpol, is strictly nonpolitical and is forbidden to undertake any activities of a religious, racial, or military nature. The majority of countries (177 in 1997) belong to Interpol, and only government-approved police bodies may hold membership. The general assembly meets annually to decide policy and to elect the executive committee, consisting of a president, three vice presidents, and nine delegates, all of different nationalities. The general secretariat, based in Lyons, France, is the permanent administrative headquarters. It coordinates the international activities of member countries, holds a library of international criminal records, and organizes regular meetings at which delegates can exchange information on police work. Interpol is financed by contributions from member countries; its budget in 1997 was $28 million
Microsoft Corporation

As you can see from the Microsoft Encata Excerpt, Interpol is privately funded, and IS strictly nonpolitical and is forbidden to undertake any activities of a religious, racial, or military nature..... The space police should have a leash though, in case of an emergency, and I was thinking the UN should hold the leash and make sure that the Space Police wouldn't get too far ahead of itself....

The UN in nationstates is little more than a machine idiots used to force their beliefs on other countries. You'd be better off getting one of the Alliances to control it, over a central-command Board.

Damn, how come all the good ideas come after I've scrapped it?

/me is considering un-scrapping it now, but I'm still pretty sure I'm not the right person to run this... ICly, at any rate. My people have no real motivation for something like this.

I am willing to "lead" both OOC and ICly. I think this is a good idea, no, a great idea.. A wide police force that is able to act allmost everywhere to capture and punish criminals.
I think that if this organisation would become real, there would have to be a "general law" that everyone accepts and can be convicted by, and that it would only deal with crimes against this "general law". Crimes that have been done against national laws should be dealt with the local police, however, if a national law says one thing, and the "general law" says another, the "general law" should be applied.

Again, I think this is a good idea :)

I think if we have time, we should forge an actual list of laws. It might take a while and it's definitely not going to be a full list, but it might be worth it, because this is the sort of thing we'll be arguing about at the time of these role-plays, and it'll be much less of a hassle now when no one knows it'll eventually turn against 'em.

A big question, however; what do we do with nations that do not support the space police?

this organisation, if it gains enough power, could also inflict a big war...

this organisation, if it gains enough power, could also inflict a big war...
So could any major organization. Like, say, a nation.

As for what we would do with countries that ignore the Space Police, I guess we would just ignore them. If they had a problem in space and had openly denounced the space police, then they're screwed.

Well, I still think the idea is a good one, but again, there are some dilemmas.


First of all, if it is an international force, will the crews be staffed according to nation (each nation staffing individual ships, etc) or will all space crews be mixed? Each have their flaws, the first one in abuse of power, the second one in bureaucracy and ill-will between nations which may not see eye to eye. Its folly to assume each nation wil be concordiant with one another, and foolish to assume the crews will not carry the same prejudices.

The second problem I see is again, the international law. It would imply we need to create the police force in ADDITION to some interstellar ruling council that would oversee such things, the the Space Police only one of its branches. That way it would be a bit more "legitimate" policing organization with actual political backing beyond the contributions of members.

After al is said and done, Crownguard would be willing to contrbute, assuming all the kinks were worked out. Out nation is space-tech, and claim no planets but exists as only a Fleet in space. Hence, wouldnt be that hard for us to staff it.

*Ignore the typos...this keyboard is atrocious*

Here's an idea. It isn't completely related, though you could consider it...

How 'bout we turn it into a mercenary service?

It's not the most honourable line of work, but hey, if people HIRE us to do something, then we don't have to question anything.

Here's an idea. It isn't completely related, though you could consider it...

How 'bout we turn it into a mercenary service?

It's not the most honourable line of work, but hey, if people HIRE us to do something, then we don't have to question anything.
There are plenty of those already. Besides, the point of this is to make this service socially acceptable in the mainstream.

i would be glad to help, i know in my system of Thetis we could provide a base with parasites and some small warships. there are a lot of plances in the Raumreich that need policing.

i would be glad to help, i know in my system of Thetis we could provide a base with parasites and some small warships. there are a lot of plances in the Raumreich that need policing.

I thought Thetis was currently in the process of getting obliterated by Valinon and New Ortega. But I haven't really been keeping up, so the crisis may have passed.

I am willing to "lead" both OOC and ICly. I think this is a good idea, no, a great idea.. A wide police force that is able to act allmost everywhere to capture and punish criminals.
I think that if this organisation would become real, there would have to be a "general law" that everyone accepts and can be convicted by, and that it would only deal with crimes against this "general law". Crimes that have been done against national laws should be dealt with the local police, however, if a national law says one thing, and the "general law" says another, the "general law" should be applied.

Again, I think this is a good idea :)


No, no 'general law' to be applied everywhere; that is exactly what will doom any galactic police force. Many nations would object to you 'harrasing' their shipping with military force.

Enforce local laws, and possibly an agreed upon code of laws, but only within space controled by nations that support the force; say, signitories of a treaty. Going after blaintent piracy outside these teratories would probally be ok, but more than that is decidedly unwise.


What I would sugest, is drawing up a code of general laws and outlining the police force's powers in a treaty, as well as the obligations that supporting nations have; eneryone who signs helps support the force, and in turn recive protection/services within their space, and protection/enforcment for their shipping in international space. General laws should be few and fairly simple, so that they're easy to agree upon, or can be excluded altogether, with local laws being enforced within a nation's space, and upon a nation's shipping outside of their own space.

The most important aspect is that the force has no jurisdiction over forgine shipping, except within space controled by a supporting nation; this keeps them from pissing off forgine powers.

I agree with Kanuckistan's proposal. A universal code of conduct with regards to policing activities within one's territories is probably the best solution to the problem, rather than the usage of an galactic police force.

However, there are problems with this proposal. The issue of universal conduct will be heavily negotiated. For some nations, an action that seems symbolic and peaceable may seem hostile and belligerent to another. Take for instance, one of the backstories of Bablyon 5 with regards to the Minbari-Human War, begun by a mistake of a human warship of hostile Minbaris.

Another example is with regards to my nation. Usually, I have frigates, gunships, corvettes, and other what not patrolling throughout my territories. Occasionally they venture away from my territories into either unclaimed or territories controlled by other nations. The issue with this is that how would you allow the police forces to work together?

What I sugested would be more like replacing/augmenting existing domestic police/partol services with a unifyed one, kinda like how in Canada, some cities have replaced local police forces with the RCMP; you get a centeralised information database allowing better communication and information sharing, typicly better training and technology, expensive assets(equpiment, specialists, etc) that aren't needed too often by individual departments are shared to save budget costs, more equipment and manpower can be called in when needed localy, etc.

As for laws, well, 'universal' laws are nice, but unnecessary; I imagine everyone will want their own laws enforced first and foremost, and the basics are fairly universal already.

Well, if such a police force operated in Five Civilized Nations space, it will face considerable opposition from the Combined Five Civilized Nations Navy and its plethora of warships, who do not take kindly to having their jurisdiction superseded by some "wack" intergalactic organization.

However, the Five Civilized Nations is in agreement with a organization with a central database and staff, but operated separately by each different nation. We're just a little worried about implementation.

Well, if such a police force operated in Five Civilized Nations space, it will face considerable opposition from the Combined Five Civilized Nations Navy and its plethora of warships, who do not take kindly to having their jurisdiction superseded by some "wack" intergalactic organization.

However, the Five Civilized Nations is in agreement with a organization with a central database and staff, but operated separately by each different nation. We're just a little worried about implementation.

Naturally; like I already said several times, they would only operate within the teratories of supportive nations. That is the most fundamentally important part about any such endevor.

No, no 'general law' to be applied everywhere; that is exactly what will doom any galactic police force. Many nations would object to you 'harrasing' their shipping with military force.

Enforce local laws, and possibly an agreed upon code of laws, but only within space controled by nations that support the force; say, signitories of a treaty. Going after blaintent piracy outside these teratories would probally be ok, but more than that is decidedly unwise.


What I would sugest, is drawing up a code of general laws and outlining the police force's powers in a treaty, as well as the obligations that supporting nations have; eneryone who signs helps support the force, and in turn recive protection/services within their space, and protection/enforcment for their shipping in international space. General laws should be few and fairly simple, so that they're easy to agree upon, or can be excluded altogether, with local laws being enforced within a nation's space, and upon a nation's shipping outside of their own space.

The most important aspect is that the force has no jurisdiction over forgine shipping, except within space controled by a supporting nation; this keeps them from pissing off forgine powers.

Ofcourse the Galactic Police would only operate within supporting nations territory. But what I meant was that the Galactic Police have their "own" law to work with. I.e they dont bother with a minor crime on a space station in a supporting nations territory, since that crime might not be a crime in another nations territory and should therefore be dealt with by the local police. However, if a crime is done that the Galactic Police does should deal with, but is not a crime in another nation, then the Galactic Police still have the right to bring in, and sentence that person for the crime.
I think this is rather logical and wont happend mutch, since if a nation agrees and supports the Galactic Police, they would sure have agreed the Galactic Police laws and apply those laws to their own.

I dont think that its a good idea that the Galactic Police would replace the allready existing once in the different nations that supports it. Then we would have to agree on all laws. I think it should be an own ogranisation that Nations can turn to in the search for "internationall criminals".

Well, I still think the idea is a good one, but again, there are some dilemmas.


First of all, if it is an international force, will the crews be staffed according to nation (each nation staffing individual ships, etc) or will all space crews be mixed? Each have their flaws, the first one in abuse of power, the second one in bureaucracy and ill-will between nations which may not see eye to eye. Its folly to assume each nation wil be concordiant with one another, and foolish to assume the crews will not carry the same prejudices.

The second problem I see is again, the international law. It would imply we need to create the police force in ADDITION to some interstellar ruling council that would oversee such things, the the Space Police only one of its branches. That way it would be a bit more "legitimate" policing organization with actual political backing beyond the contributions of members.

After al is said and done, Crownguard would be willing to contrbute, assuming all the kinks were worked out. Out nation is space-tech, and claim no planets but exists as only a Fleet in space. Hence, wouldnt be that hard for us to staff it.

Since the Galactic Police would be a private organisation, it would most likley have their own recruiting offices in the supporting nations where anyone can apply, they get a background check and then if they are aprooved. Shipped of to boot camp.

And instead of nations contribute various ships, it would be better if they gave resources (raw materials, food, money) to build ships for the galactic police. And well, the most fun part of this would probably be to agree with a single design on the Galactic Police's space ships ;)


Okay so far we have the following ideas:

1)GP (Galactic Police) should have a general law that all supporting nations agrees with and applies to their own allready existing laws.

2)GP should replacing/augmenting existing domestic police/partol services with a unifyed one.

3)GP should only operate withing supporting nations territory (I dont think there is anything do discuss here)

4)What I would sugest, is drawing up a code of general laws and outlining the police force's powers in a treaty, as well as the obligations that supporting nations have; eneryone who signs helps support the force, and in turn recive protection/services within their space, and protection/enforcment for their shipping in international space. General laws should be few and fairly simple, so that they're easy to agree upon, or can be excluded altogether, with local laws being enforced within a nation's space, and upon a nation's shipping outside of their own space. Made by Kanuckistan

I think these are the four general ideas that are discussed at the moment.

Who shall lead GP? My suggestion would be that it is a ruled by a councill, concisting of one memeber from each supporting nation. The councill then votes for a "President" who will lead GP for X years. The "President" would also have the power to give out orders without the councills aprooval (if GP HQ gets under attack or any other extreeme situation. And should only be allowed to do this under extreeme situations).
The president should also have a veto in all discussions, however, the councill can ignore this veto if everyone agrees on an idea.

What I sugested would be more like replacing/augmenting existing domestic police/partol services with a unifyed one, kinda like how in Canada, some cities have replaced local police forces with the RCMP; you get a centeralised information database allowing better communication and information sharing, typicly better training and technology, expensive assets(equpiment, specialists, etc) that aren't needed too often by individual departments are shared to save budget costs, more equipment and manpower can be called in when needed localy, etc.

As for laws, well, 'universal' laws are nice, but unnecessary; I imagine everyone will want their own laws enforced first and foremost, and the basics are fairly universal already.
Yeah, but some cities have individual police forces. Toronto does, and there's one for most of the rest of Ontario.

The problem with electing a single president is that now, the council has no power if it does not agree. Instead, we should propose a resolution, discuss it and then put the resolution to a vote. Another problem with a single president is that soon, a council member who wishes to become president will be able to simply "buy" the other council members' votes, either with money or a hand in the decision-making process. If the president has a single member on the outside to constantly agree with him, the president has absolute authority.

Yeah, but some cities have individual police forces. Toronto does, and there's one for most of the rest of Ontario.

The problem with electing a single president is that now, the council has no power if it does not agree. Instead, we should propose a resolution, discuss it and then put the resolution to a vote. Another problem with a single president is that soon, a council member who wishes to become president will be able to simply "buy" the other council members' votes, either with money or a hand in the decision-making process. If the president has a single member on the outside to constantly agree with him, the president has absolute authority.


Hm, you're right. The council and the "president" should have equal ammount of power. Lets say that the councill have to have 3/4 of the votes for the resolution to get through. Ofc there should, and will be discussions. Just like in any other Police Organisation vast investigations before any decition is made.

I know what ya'll want, and Im going to give it to you. a BUMP!

I thought Thetis was currently in the process of getting obliterated by Valinon and New Ortega. But I haven't really been keeping up, so the crisis may have passed.

Well not obliterated but it wasnt pretty...