NationStates Jolt Archive

OOC: OK, after yet another hilarious mass nuclear war.. I've come to the opinion that most people in here don't have a clue regarding the logistics, strategic issues, doctrine and political factors concerning nuclear weapons...

Soo... isn't about time a 'Nuclear club' was formed... members would have to show an understanding of the concept of MAD, how it maintained an uneasy peace for the best part of 40 years, how the development of nuclear weapons and delivery systems is not an overnight happening... and also the development of a nuclear doctrine.. i.e no first strike etc..

Fine it might poo-poo some nation's aspirations but it would make the world a saner place in my opinion... (given that my nation has recently unveiled ICBM tech and also has SLBMs... yet strangely I have absolutely no desire to use the damn things...)

anyhow.. it's just an idea.. shoot me down in flames if you want..

(PS.. I reckon, being a child of the Cold War gives me a more serious perspective towards nukes... kids these days don't know what its like to live in constant awareness of the possibility of nuclear holocaust..)

Heh. You mean the Cold War that WE started? Oh, and nice quote. It reminds me of how America treats it's own citizens. Egads I hate this place. Nuclear Club? Only if we get punch and pie and a yacht for joining.

Nice idea. Either that or you could design a FYI thread teaching people about nuclear weaponry etc.

Or not.

I'm well behind it myself. Heaven knows the confrontation over Sevaris was tense enough, and that was merely with terribly beweaponed Naval forces, no nuclear weapons involved. Also, I agree that most people here seem to consider nuclear weapons to be a perfectly sensible and "safe" weapon, something which urgently needs addressing. How would you establish their credentials?

Nice idea. Either that or you could design a FYI thread teaching people about nuclear weaponry etc.

I think something linked to one of the Stickies is a good plan. Also we should mention that there are other forms of nuclear delivery as well ballistic missiles and that developing nuclear weapons is seperate to developing delivery systems, I.e when most nations first develop weapons, they will have air dropped bombs or primitive SRBMs as opposed to ICBMs which take years and years to design and produce.

Also we should make clear thr differance in types of nuclear warheads, i.e a new proliferator will have fission bombs as opposed to thermonuclear.

Useful Link:

http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/Science/Nuke.html

Thank god someone is finally doing something about it....I dont know what effect it will have...but its something. TAGged, anyway.

so... this little nuke club is just a bunch of guys who like nukes and seeing em go off? kind of disturbing...

kids these days don't know what its like to live in constant awareness of the possibility of nuclear holocaust..)

You're not implying that i'm stupid, are you? :D j/k

so... this little nuke club is just a bunch of guys who like nukes and seeing em go off? kind of disturbing...

OOC:I feel insulted... anyways I completely agree with you Lasatania
. I will never know what it was like too live at the sudden annhilation point(as I like too call it). BUT! I have read about it and have a medium idea about the implication of nuclear weapons...

so... this little nuke club is just a bunch of guys who like nukes and seeing em go off? kind of disturbing...


OOC: Heavens no.. the idea of the nuclear club is two fold - firstly to control the spread of nuclear weapons (A non-proliferation treaty would be useful) and b) to instill a better understanding of nuclear doctrine and the place of nuclear weapons within the framework of international relations...

Remember, a nuke going off is the last thing a nuclear power actually wants...

OOC: Anyhow, anyone interested in joining or contributing to a nuclear club should register their interest here.. membership will probably be open in the first instance to nuclear powers - i.e those that have a proven record (and a realistic record) of developing such weapons... one of the first aims will probably be a non-proliferation treaty, as well as drawing up guidelines for nations wishing to develop nuclear technology...

Is it only valid to nations who have nuclear weaponry?

My nation doesn't operate nuclear powerplants or weapons, but we do have a large nuclear research facility.

OOC: In the context of a non-proliferation treaty you would be more than welcome to join, especially if we can control the flow of nuclear technology (I mean this is rich coming from me - effectively a rogue nation with nuclear capability...).. one thing that baffles me is how new nations can suddenly turn round and go .. i've got 500 nukes... like.. hello!??? how did you go about developing them and who the hell gave you the materials... I've waited a good few NS year's before going nuclear...

OOC: Fair enough. I'd sign for it then...The reason I don't bother with nukes is because they are inherently useless anyway, they spoil RP's big time.

Meh, signing up. I think with my population and economy it can be reasonably said that I have a medium-sized nuclear arsenal, at least by NS standards.

OOC: OK over the coming week I'll get a brief history of nuclear tactics drawn up and also a summary of nuclear doctrine.. also a non-proliferation treaty will make an appearance soon.. so watch out for updates on this..

OOC: OK, after yet another hilarious mass nuclear war.. I've come to the opinion that most people in here don't have a clue regarding the logistics, strategic issues, doctrine and political factors concerning nuclear weapons...

Soo... isn't about time a 'Nuclear club' was formed... members would have to show an understanding of the concept of MAD, how it maintained an uneasy peace for the best part of 40 years, how the development of nuclear weapons and delivery systems is not an overnight happening... and also the development of a nuclear doctrine.. i.e no first strike etc..

Fine it might poo-poo some nation's aspirations but it would make the world a saner place in my opinion... (given that my nation has recently unveiled ICBM tech and also has SLBMs... yet strangely I have absolutely no desire to use the damn things...)

anyhow.. it's just an idea.. shoot me down in flames if you want..

(PS.. I reckon, being a child of the Cold War gives me a more serious perspective towards nukes... kids these days don't know what its like to live in constant awareness of the possibility of nuclear holocaust..)

OOC: Erm, I know this is a little off-topic, but if defence of some of the kids nowadays, some of us do know something about it, (I'm what my friends call the "nuclear weapons obsessive")

I myself have a fascination with the Cold War, in particular the effect that nuclear weapons had on the political situations that shape the world today. I recognise the way MAD kept the peace, and even have some understanding of CEP and the Counter Force/Counter Value strategies. "Threads" scared the hell out of me... (ever seen it?)

So don't paint us all with one brush, please. :)

I'll stop hijacking your thread now - I apoligise for doing it in the first place.

OOC: That's cool, it was a generalisation really..

OOC: Oh, okay - no problem then. :)

I'll REALLY stop hijacking your thread now. :)

Humans with sense, at last. We thought you were all insanely destroying each other with these 'warheads', regardless of the consequences to you and your planet. Ghargonia will ignore its isolationism and support this 100%. We do not have, use, or intend to have or use nuclear weapons of any kind, but we shall assist you in your non-proliferation attempts, if necessary.

Emperor Gorbgan IV

Ghargonia

I accept the invitation.

Vastiva began with six air-dropped nuclear devices, strangely enough abandoned here during the Cold War.

We have just brought three nuclear power plants online.

We have no interest in use of nuclear weapons of any sort - though we accept that the threat of use of nuclear weapons (ie- the MAD doctrine) is a firm deterrent to war, we also realize that the widespread USE of such weapons would mean death to all species on this planet.

We also remember "duck and cover" drills, which even then we considered stupid: desks are not able to stop hard radiation or blast waves.

Sultan Sinjin Lefkowitz, Ruler of Vastiva

Mattikistan abhores the use of weapons of mass destruction, be it accurately or not. We will assist you in any way you require, within our capabilities of course. A public referendum shall decide exactly how much money we can devote to this at a later date.

Minister for Foreign Affairs
The Confederacy of Mattikistan

OOC :
Ok, do tell me if this is normal here -

I read a thread where one nation threatened to drop 60,000 nuclear warheads on a country.

Sixty Thousand.

Assuming each was around 500 megatons, this would give 30,000,000 megatons of explosive power.

Uhm yeah. Ignoring the fact there would be third degree burns on people as far away as 13566.4 kilometers (the entire Earth is only 40,075.8 km around, so that's over a third), the entire planet would shortly after die from fallout, radiation, and secondary effects.

These people really do not understand what a nuclear bomb does in anything but a technical sense. This lack is dangerous.

I rather like this idea.

I have nuclear technology myself. If you wish to have a good person, ask Chardonay, he knows everything about nukes (he went through college or something that takes brains).

I would be interested in joinning since I am starting my missle defence network (I have only used nukes for offence once, and that was when I was in corrupt democracy, damn capitalists, and I say that becouse of your siggy, nice).

Why thanks truitt... I have a thread on our regional page devoted to nuclear weaponry... the technical end, more than the strategic, but I'm also facinated by the political ramifications of nuclear wars... I'd like to join, but I'm not sure if I would be allowed in concidering I have a comprehensive tactical nuclear doctrine (purely defencive) and am willing to sell tactical nuclear weapons (after a background check, of course). I also have a fairly large stratigic deterent force...

Chardonay has never used a nuclear device in anger, and hopes we never will.

Why thanks truitt... I have a thread on our regional page devoted to nuclear weaponry... the technical end, more than the strategic, but I'm also facinated by the political ramifications of nuclear wars... I'd like to join, but I'm not sure if I would be allowed in concidering I have a comprehensive tactical nuclear doctrine (purely defencive) and am willing to sell tactical nuclear weapons (after a background check, of course). I also have a fairly large stratigic deterent force...

Chardonay has never used a nuclear device in anger, and hopes we never will.

You do realize the use of nuclear weapons drasticly shortens the lifespan of everyone on the planet? So your actions could very well result in a massive upsurge of cancer and other forms of hazard for you and your people?

That's the point of MAD and nuclear limitation. Selling it means you give the ability for more to use - and each use causes more harm to the sum total population of the planet.

I was surprised you did not use my post for referance to that statement, which I will admit, I have in fact firred a 40 kiloton missle at an enemy nation, however, I regret it (but then agian, like I said, Courrpt Radical-Liberal Democracy).
Since then, Truitt's defencive network (what remains of the Socalist-Democrat Civil War) has been set for defence only, and however has not even have even thoguht of using it, even when our borders were breached. (That is big compairing these people around today who will nuke you for just saying bad to them).

However:
I would like to give tatical information on nuclear warfare, and its many alternitives (since I have researched this time and time agian) than nuclear/WMD based weaponry (which this is the mian purpose fo the Missle Defence Network's new construction, WMD, btu nto nuclear or biological/chemical, somehwta like a big balistic, as a great alternitive, other than no missles).
I would actually be glad to share my technologies I have developed for alternitives, like the Hullo Spread Missle (has the same effect as a Nuclear Bomb, but no radiation, Balistic based) and Ykalu (Like a sucessor of my FARBINI HELO Anti-Radiation Missle).

If you guys would like a forum or somethign of that nature, I could easily do that (invision of cource, but with a good skin).

Roycelandia has had Nuclear Weapons for quite some time now. We've never actually used them on anyone yet, but we've come very close several times.

Still, we'd be interested in joining a Nuclear Club, but we have a problem with the Non-proliferation issue. We're quite partial to Atomic Bombs, and don't plan on getting rid of any soon.

We're also well aware of the inherent destructiveness of an A-bomb, followed by the radiation and fallout, which is why we haven't used them yet.

We have, however, devised a Tactical Nuke with an effective radius of a few city blocks. We haven't used that yet either, but we're tempted...

How about not...

Nobody is stupid enough on NS to launch nuclear missiles indiscriminately anyways... He/she'll just be ignored...

Chardonayan tactica weapons are low yeild (about half a kiloton max), with lingering effects limited. We attempt not to use them, and never have yet. As for selling, I am providing allies with a stratigic deterent, and giving them protection against potential enemies with nuclear weaposn